Ep 44: Being Vegan

We humans have been eating meat for thousands of years so why do some people choose to be vegan? Why do some people become so offended by a persons decision not to eat meat?
Ryno and Vegan Bel discuss why she made her decision to join a growing movement that refuses to use animals for food
Are they right??

#nohumbleopinions #straighttalk #sparkplugradio #rynosway #unpopularopinion  #unpopularopinions #podcast #podcastlife #podcastrecommendations #podcastseries #politicallyincorrect #politicalcorrectness #vegan #meat 

Transcript

0 (1s):
Hey there, Rano here from the podcast. No humble opinions. We talk to interesting people about interesting things. And today we're talking to the lovely bill about being a vegan

1 (13s):
<inaudible> Hey bill, how are you, buddy?

0 (27s):
Good, thanks. How are you? I'm well, thank you. As I said to you just before I walked in, I had to make pie and I had to confess that to you. Cause I sort of felt a bit like I was doing the wrong thing, but I'm sort of not too. So we'll discuss that. You okay with that? I'm okay with that. Good. Thanks for coming on mine. I really appreciated. We've only just met so we might end up scratching each other's eyes out, but I certainly do doubt that, but yeah, look veganism. It seems to be in my 47 years quite prevalent in the last 20 or so coming on a lot harder and a real wave of people having a different lifestyle choice by being a vegan. Tell me your story.

0 (1m 7s):
You've not always been a vegan heavy. No, I haven't. Okay. Give me some stories.

2 (1m 11s):
Sure. I went vegan May, 2019. And the reason why I went vegan is because I had something happen in my life that led me to want to do some more self-improvement and help others. So basically I went into a local not-for-profit organization and I'm liberation Queensland to volunteer. And from there I just wanted to help the animals. So I didn't really know anything about animal rights. So I was always an RSP CA girl and walking in there. I basically got an education around animal rights and also I started to see the real truth of what really goes on at, in animal agriculture.

2 (1m 53s):
Whereas RSPC seemed to kind of gloss over it a little bit. Animal liberation will give you the full details. So when I looked at the cruelty and I saw that there were people walking around, living, breathing still alive and they are vegans. Then what whole mind

0 (2m 9s):
Possibility to do that? Yes. And

2 (2m 10s):
I didn't ever, I think I knew one other vegan in my life, my niece, but I'd never sat down and had a conversation with her. I wasn't open to it that much at that point before that, but now in my life, I was like I said, I was looking to do something else. So then my mind was open to the idea of it and seeing these beautiful people walking around and they're still alive and they're not eating animals. I was like, what? So that's what made me change. And I haven't looked back

0 (2m 37s):
Well, just on the nice thing, the nice bane of vegan, my niece, Gracie is a vegan and recently came and stayed with us for a couple of weeks. So she had a two year Gracie. It was a bit of a pain in the ass trying to feed her, but that's okay. But so she made, she made, I was very proud of her. She made decisions based on she's still a school goer and she made decisions based on a project that she'd done and research that she'd done. And she decided she didn't want to be part of yeah. The, the animal industry as such for, for consumption by humans. So that's, that was her choices on things. So, so you hadn't really, had you ever thought about, you know, that eating meat was cruel or whatever before that?

0 (3m 19s):
Really?

2 (3m 19s):
No, I hadn't. I did hear about free range obviously. And I thought, Oh, cause literally two months before I went vegan, I actually had bought a whole bunch of pork products from a new South Wales pig farmer and had it delivered. I'd actually ended up when I went vegan. I had to give this maid away because I thought I was doing the right thing, buying free range. But then I didn't realize that the pigs diets six months of age and things like that. So for me, I thought I was doing the right thing going free range. But at when it's, when I sat down and looked at all the details, I'm not okay with a pig dying at six months of age, regardless of where they have been living.

2 (4m 0s):
Yes. It might be a step in the right direction out of the factory farming, but I'm still not okay with it. So I'd rather not touch them.

0 (4m 10s):
No, I know. And can I say up front too, that I appreciate your choice. I've got no issue with, you know, some people get it. We talked about before, it's like, Oh, some people get really wound up. Well, I'm not, I mean, go for it. I do find it weed, but I find that weeding anything. I've always said that if anyone's one OD about something or absolutely tunnel vision about their belief, geez, they're hard work. Like it's just, I don't get it. Like if I'm in a one odd calling would support her. It's there still decades. Like it's, it's not fun. And, and I guess vegans are very similar and people that hate vegans are very similar and you've had a bit of hate fan at UTA. You've had some interesting social experiences because of your choice.

0 (4m 52s):
Tell me about some of those.

2 (4m 54s):
Well, certainly when I went vegan, I think what it is, it's very confronting for people who already have a vision of you and especially people that would've have known you a long time in their life. So I've got some friends that, you know, I've grown up with and things like that. And they're sisters and one of them was okay with it, but the other one came out virtually swinging at me straight away and basically said I was in a cult. And on top of this with me going vegan, I actually at the same time became an atheist. So I questioned everything I'd ever known in my life. So

0 (5m 30s):
I was

2 (5m 30s):
Offended at that saying that I would, I, I was in a cult and I was like, well, who am I supposedly worshiping? Because I, you know, I now no longer believe in any God and I'm not worshiping some animal God. So yeah. Anyway, that has been an interesting journey with some of my friends and online. I think school friends that you might have online that you don't really catch up with that often because I'm always had always been posting on Facebook, very passionate things about and animal rights and welfare and all that. People just don't want to see it don't care about it. And they just either unfollow me. Don't be friends with me. And then at the same time, I try to not feel offended that they don't even want to hear what I'm saying.

2 (6m 14s):
So it, it, it turns into a big cycle of I'm frustrated at them. How could you not want to know this stuff and, and look into it more? And they just want to continue their lives. Like I was, you know, until two years ago I'm living my life thinking, you know, everything was okay with what I was eating. So I think it's a self-development experience I've been on. And my friends aren't necessarily okay with everything that I'm doing, but they're, they're coming around slowly.

0 (6m 47s):
Yeah. Well, I feel it bizarre that someone would ostracize you and not be your friend anymore because you decided not to eat a certain food. I just sent, I, sorry, I don't get that

2 (6m 57s):
Cut me off, but was just slinging things at me. And then anytime I would post that person, like take offense, thinking it was directly at them, but I would be making posts from a broad, broad perspective. Like I make a statement about something or whatever. And I think it's, they self reflect on themselves. Right. And they think you're judging them. And in a way you are, but it's not, I'm not trying to lose a friend. I'm, I'm trying to understand why you wouldn't want to look into it and basically validate what I'm saying. So my issue is I don't get validation. I feel that these people might be lacking some empathy and there's critical thinking that comes into play.

2 (7m 40s):
So if you're presented with information and you, cause I've given lots of information on Facebook now, from, from my perspective with everything I've posted over the last 18 months, if you haven't at least decided to maybe start changing eating habits, I don't know what's going on in your brain with your critical thinking cap on, I guess. But again, they say it's a journey and apparently to go vegan, it's a hundred steps,

0 (8m 6s):
Right? There's only 12 and you're an alcoholic. That's what I've heard. I'm not interested in finding out by the way.

2 (8m 13s):
But for me, because I was always, always an animal person cared about animals from the CA perspective, I was probably already on a, on a much higher journey around animals. And then, like I said, I just was looking for something more and make a difference in, in the world. And I always think animals cause people help people all the time. I always felt like animals might be at more of a disadvantage than people.

0 (8m 37s):
No, I get that. Okay. Can I just have it? You said earlier that you want to get, you want validation, which isn't a human tendency to want to be validated for their beliefs, but does it matter if she defending on his case? What you think?

2 (8m 50s):
No, but it does for my friends, I guess. So it's like vice versa. So if it's your friends that you're close with, that you can find in that you've been through lots of things together. I would like validation from my friends, but then you're right. I actually, it's really interesting because I've always been told that my personality is being the way I am, that I want everyone to like me. But one of my favorite things I've loved to sling out lately is that obviously I've proven I don't need to be liked. Cause I went vegan and people just instantly change. If I walk into a room, people like me until generally I see change in them. When they find out at, by lunch that I'm vegan.

2 (9m 30s):
Then I see a shift in behavior and it's really fascinating to watch people's behaviors.

0 (9m 36s):
Be interesting to watch that from a fly on the wall point of view, but okay. Now, as I say something that I think hilarious, but I don't know if it leaves, but some people were scared of her. Well, I say sometimes about people's issues like, you know, the whole off, Hey, how are you mate? And then people are, Oh look, it's awful of, you know, I've got diabetes and lost my dog's not very well. And you know the rent's and, and, and that, wasn't what you're asking. What you're sort of ask is, Hey, how you doing, man? Oh, good, good, thanks. Cause it's a good way to kick off the conversation. And my comment for that sometimes is don't wear your hardships on, on like a t-shirt now bill you've rocked him with a tee shirt.

2 (10m 15s):
It's actually advertising someone's business,

0 (10m 18s):
Vegans rock. That's a kangaroo plain. I think it's a good town. I was going to start base, but, and, and I was going, I was just had a laugh cause you come in wearing it like a year-ish I'm vegan. What is it that makes it so volatile because it's, there's two and there's a few sides to being a vegan and how, you know, what level of vegan or lesbian places too. But it feels a little bit sometimes I think to people like it's a Jehovah's witness thing where you've got to, you've got to convert and you're sleeping nights, Sandy, your friend's doors gone, you know, cucumbers are really good too. You know, you don't have to have that burger or whatever it is. And do you feel that need to try and educate your friends and make them vegan as well?

0 (11m 4s):
Is that part of what you want to do?

2 (11m 6s):
It, it is yes. In a way, but in my journey in this, I've come to understand that what I thought people would behave, like how they would, like I said, validate what I'm saying and want to jump on board. I've learnt very, very hard that they will not necessarily do that. And so all I can do is lay seeds around the place. I've got stickers on the back of my BT 50, for example, that I drive around. So, and my partner has to cause on the back of his car and yes, we waste shirts because we not only are we wanting to say, you know, you know, we're proud to be vegan, but we also want other vegans to know, Hey, there's another vegan because it's actually really nice to meet others that are like-minded.

2 (11m 51s):
And we just feel like we were on a, on level with caring for the animals. And we, we, we feel like we're empathetic towards the animals. And so, yeah, I've actually had, it's probably taken a year. I've had a couple of people come to me directly and say, Oh, this is great to know you're vegan. I'm definitely keen to go vegan or what can I do to start my journey? And I'm, I don't think I really care if my friends don't go vegan. I just want to understand why you wouldn't want to look into it if there's a it's baby. Cause we've been socially conditioned to, to eat animals and all this.

2 (12m 33s):
So,

0 (12m 33s):
Oh, I, well, it's funny that if you consider most meals, it's steak and three veg. It's not, it's not carrot two vegetables and a bit of maintenance, but you know, it's not, that's, that's the prize piece. If you like, that's the part of the puzzle that everyone sort of considers the most? I guess, look, I hope I haven't missed a part in this, but can we just duck back a little bit? Like what, what is vegan? What is vegan to you? What is being added?

2 (12m 60s):
Being vegan is causing the most minimal amount of harm to an animal. So being vegan means I don't eat animals or their bodily functions. I guess I like their milk or their eggs. We don't consume any like honey anything, or we don't try not to harm bugs. We don't use animals for entertainment. So horse ride riding, we don't, you know, bet on horses or Greyhound racing or we don't like animals being used in say circuses or definitely not site aquariums and sea world and places like that.

2 (13m 41s):
And also we don't wear anything that comes from an animal. So right now in the human journey that we're all on. For example, we know that animals would eventually die if they were left in a paddock and that you might have their skin lift and maybe later on down the track, maybe that would be okay to wear that animal's skin. But right now we actually purposely breed animals into existence just to kill them for their, for their, for their bodies and their skin. And right. So we just try and remain from as much as we can. We understand even when you are like growing some plants or animals will die in that, but I've got so many arguments against like why you can't come at me around that because we just have never focused on improving that part of animal plant farming.

2 (14m 29s):
Sorry. So right now, you know, we're all focused on breeding animals into existence to kill them. There's no continuous improvement going on around, you know, how can we stop all the pests, getting to the plants when they're, you know, growing those with the farms and things like that. So there's, there's different levels to it and it can get quite into it. I I've done a lot of research, but I wouldn't say on the most articulate on the topic, but I think I'm, I'm pretty caring on it. I've had a pretty good go at it and people will ask me for advice and things like that. So when I was recommended to come on your show, I said to my friend, or I don't know, I think you could get someone from, you know, one of the, you know, the, the liberation groups to come in that actually no, but you know what I mean?

2 (15m 19s):
So I think that's why I was recommended because, and I, I was like, are you sure? She's like, yeah, absolutely. You'd be fine. Okay.

0 (15m 26s):
Blue shed to Jean too. So I asked him to come on and she said, Oh no, no, no I can't. But bill got in a seat. So what I'm bill and hygiene, I haven't joined. I'm being nice. All right. And what y'all want to be, but all right, I'll be a pussy if I didn't sit here and have a discussion about some differing opinions on things. Okay. And as I said, I fully appreciate your life choices and I don't care. I don't answer you. That's entirely up to you with a, I find an interesting with people saying, Oh no, we're using animals. We're using animals for our entertainments and interesting one. Okay. Look, advertise are not pretty. Okay. And I've been a shooter in my life a lot. I used to do a lot. I used to hunt for myself in Tazzy where I live there and hunt for dog food and all those other bits and pieces as well.

0 (16m 11s):
So I've done, I've butchered my fair share of, of creatures for use, right. So I noticed though, all right, for entertainment, I think there are things that are, are done very badly. And I think you mentioned some of the SeaWorld and things like that. And obviously there's some serious issues there. I mean, I don't know that having orchids in a aquarium is the best way to go, but whatever. But I say a lot of creatures that seem to really enjoy their roles. They really do seem to live for doing what they bred for like there's issues with the way gray hands are traded. I entirely appreciate what Jesus, they love to run. And they're in a position where they do that.

0 (16m 53s):
I say, sorry, I know you get, since I got up, I see say horse racing, whatever that, I mean, we go to the, we go to the pay sway a bit, cause it's a crossroad from our house. And apart from the also I just want to support local. And those guys are there doing their thing and the whole happy, ready, because we see them in the stables all the time and all that sort of stuff. And they're doing that. And what I also think a lot of the time too, is those creatures would not exist if we, as humans didn't, as they are now would individually would not exist. If we, if humans didn't find them, if some use do or say, that's beautiful. Now what I say is that is accurate. Now there's a lot of creatures that are existing right now having their lives because humans believe that in the, for some way, shape or form, they're useful for people racing animals at design, you said a few times designed to be cured.

0 (17m 46s):
And what I sort of think of more designed to be eaten. I don't know if we just doing it so we kill them, but they they've got a purpose. And unfortunately they need to be killed to be so racy animals aren't like that. Yes, they are a product. I had a mate who was a Greyhound trainer and Jesus, he killed a lot of dogs. And I think that is a big drama into side. But even in doors, does everything serve a purpose maybe in any ecosystem? It does, but is it, is it true? Do you think that all animals that are subserving to humans are being treated poorly and shouldn't be there?

2 (18m 23s):
So that's probably a good, good question to ask because this comes back to the human ego. So we think as humans, we're at the top of the food chain, right? We think we are top shit and we can do whatever we like to anyone underneath us. So I'm here to challenge that maybe animals are equal to us on this planet. And maybe what we've been doing all along. Maybe hasn't been, maybe we've gotten off track and gone a bit crazy. So for example, getting back to like the Greyhound racing, horse racing and all that kind of thing. I think if, if this is what I wanted my friends to look into it more. So we're always sharing things online around, you know, what, you know, research redundant, done the industry behind the scenes.

2 (19m 9s):
You know, how many animals are purposely being bred and they, they get injured and die on the tracks and the horses. When they get their tongues tied, they get whips. There's an, as we grow as a society and mature around how we are treating our animals, there's more and more information coming out around. We are purposely breeding these things into existence just to use them how we want, and then they are dying earlier than they normally would. And yes, I do think some of these animals would exist in the world if we could just leave them alone, but we don't have to breed them in mass like we do. So, you know, you've got, you know, in horse races. So, you know, they're breeding thousands of horses into existence.

2 (19m 51s):
Not all of them are making it, making money. A lot of them are like, you know, if you looked into it, some of them are being killed for dog meat and sold the horses themselves. The meat is getting sold overseas for human consumption. This things like that going on, we don't have to eat animals like it. There are beautiful meals we can make that tastes just as good. So that brings me around to I'm a junk food vegan. I still go to McDonald's. I still go to KFC. There are places I won't go to. So for example, there's an app we can use that tells us we know what food chains we can go to. So for example, I'll go to Macca's and I will get hot chips and I will get frozen Coke. And I will go through there and ask them when I get vegan burgers coming, because I'm trying to lay a seed whenever I can.

2 (20m 36s):
And it turns out macros are about to start bringing in some plant-based burgers, mind you you're hungry. Jack's had been on it for two years or more now. So they're way ahead. That's because one of the big dogs that hungry jacks is invested in the, in the, in the, in the plant based meats and things like that, right. Or there's the cell-based

0 (20m 53s):
It's standard money and which is cool. Absolutely. But I guess some of what I was getting at before is the reason a lot of animals animals exist is because of money as good or bad as we are as humans. That tends to be their reason to be human ego. And I've got no doubt that we've got egos.

2 (21m 10s):
Yeah. And it's, and for me, I've now. So for example, yes, I work in the mining industry, right. For example. Yeah. And it is really good money, but what I'm caught on at the moment is for example, in the mining industry where I am a lot of animal farmers also work in the mining industry and it blows me away because I have come to realization in my journey that it's not always about money anymore. So I no longer want the big house. And you know, the massive, massive, you know, expensive car, like the Tesla or something like I no longer want that. I just want to make a difference in this world.

2 (21m 50s):
However, I'm not really, really to give up my current mining position, just to give it to say another meat eater. For example, I'm honest, we'll take the money and reinvest it in trying to help the animal rights movement or whatever I can do. And I do make a difference

0 (22m 5s):
Time. We talked about weed. I asked you that question. And sometimes we have a little briefing beforehand people. Cause I don't really love the shop job sort of a thing. And making people feel uncomfortable. But I mentioned the fact that you're in mining and modeling mining is a highly destructive industry and it destroys ecosystems and you know, Aboriginal sites and lots of other bits and pieces on that. So it's very easy to throw some stones and go, Oh, you can't do that. Then you explained to me that there's three basic types of Eagan as far as why they do it. So it gives us a run down on that. Yes.

2 (22m 37s):
Sure. So for example, I'm vegan for the animal cruelty. I don't want to cause any unnecessary harm to an animal. If I can help it, there are vegans out there that are also vegan for the cruelty, then they're vegan for their health. So there's many different organizations around the world that are heavily promoting. For example, how bad red meat is. So you've got bowel cancer, Australia that don't, you know, don't support anyone eating red meat. Then you, you can also be vegan for the environment and you can be vegan for all three. I just cannot come at it.

0 (23m 10s):
Geez, I'd be angry people. Wouldn't they? For all three, this is my way out.

2 (23m 14s):
And people would say, I am anyway. But we would say as vegans, that animal agriculture cause quite significant amount of environmental damage, just as much as farming does. So there's different stats and I don't want to roll it cause I'm not, I'm not an expert on it. But

0 (23m 30s):
So you're saying farming, the farm animal farming creates as much environmental damage as mining does.

2 (23m 36s):
Sorry. Yeah. I am vegan for the animal cruelty is where I'm going.

0 (23m 40s):
No, I get that. Okay. So as far as cruelty goes, let's get down to this little I've best three minutes since we got here and I didn't blink an eye about it. And I probably won't to be honest, like how far does it go? I mean, and I'll ask you questions too. Like, you know, is there necessary cruelty

2 (24m 1s):
Obviously for an animals in a lot of pain and needs to be put down? Oh yeah, absolutely.

0 (24m 6s):
I do that with people.

2 (24m 8s):
Yeah. And I was watching a show the other night on, on some of that has gone overseas to basically be allowed to die as an elderly person,

0 (24m 16s):
Tasmania just this week, legalized, voluntary euthanasia, which I applaud you Tylee. And I'll just find it funny. He goes, Oh my poor dog. I've put it down. Cause I love it so much. But you'll let grandma sit there and suffer for four years in miserable pain, even though she's begging. Yeah.

2 (24m 32s):
So you're right. There is different levels to the veganism. And would I squash an ant? Oh, we'll look accidentally or whatever, but I've changed. I've changed my view.

0 (24m 44s):
Do you have a can of payback in your arm? And you cap it

2 (24m 49s):
Natural ways to get rid of some of the, some of the pests. But if we go around being a perfect vegan is no point to that. We need millions of people being non-perfect vegan to change the world for animals rather than have 10,000 vegans doing it perfectly. We actually want imperfect people on this journey with us.

0 (25m 12s):
I think that's all you got just saying, not just in veganism, all of us.

2 (25m 17s):
We want flexitarians. We want people to start thinking or actually trying something different is no longer being vegan. Doesn't mean you have to go and eat a carrot. I am not a carrot eating person. And I, I love junk food. Just as much as anyone else. I love cakes. I've actually probably put on weight recently. I'm keen to stop. I think I'm a little bit immature when it comes to my eating. So I think I could do this vegan thing a lot more healthier than what I am. I've been doing this it's only probably 18 months for me, but yeah. So look spiders, for example, I would have never hesitated to squash one and kill one. Now I do think twice I won't, I probably just leave them alone.

0 (25m 57s):
My wife forces me to it's crew. Honestly, I don't want to do it. And she's, it's like, dude, it's not hurting you. It loves you. All right.

2 (26m 5s):
And I will say that I used to date a cattle farmer and I was actually just on his property on the weekend, dropping off a gravestone plaque for my dog. He allowed me to come and drop that back off. He wasn't even there that farm farm was, was empty. And also you sit diet, a whole racing syndicate owner from Dannon, new South Wales. And one of his horses was a gay Waterhouse trained horse. So I have had exposure. People will come at me all the time or you don't know what it's like, you know, you know, all you city folk. And it's like, well, hang on a minute. I used to date. I work in mining and I hang out with farmers all day. We'd get along. Well, all my family back in the day before I was born, used to have a sheep station down in central new South Wales.

2 (26m 50s):
So yeah, I've, it's not like I'm this perfect city dwelling person that doesn't know anything. And I haven't lived I'm 40 years old now. And I do feel like I'm coming from a place of experience and I've just seen the world different. I grew up a Mormon as a teenager. I left the Mormon church and like I said, now I've become atheist. And I'm all about social justice these days.

0 (27m 14s):
And you have a little midlife crisis. Not quite, I think it's a mid-life opportunity. I do seriously. Obviously there's so many other, like I said, it's not a crisis. It's a, it's a change. It's an opportunity. I think you get to think don't you when you're a bit older like that

2 (27m 30s):
And reflect. And I was just so I don't know. I think I was very immature.

0 (27m 34s):
Yeah. I'll look, I think the opportunity to, to look, everyone should examine their beliefs and everyone should examine how they feel about the world that they live in. If, if they feel strongly about something, do something about it. But John Gray areas and gray Harriet, I like how you said, you know, if perfect vegans are pioneers because they're out of status because once you think they are. So I'm hearing, we'll get to that in a second. But look, we're just going to let a bit of a break. We are going to run here shortly and we're going to do a bit of a different one because we have sort of a combined love and we love, I almost sponsors that don't anyone ride in, but we've got, we've got one in particular that you love as well. And it's what fusion cafe up in Scarborough.

0 (28m 14s):
Isn't it.

2 (28m 15s):
We love it. We love to go there for breakfast on the weekends. And one reason we really love it is as a cafe in the, in the community that actually offers an attack NATL X, which is like a managering that vegans would have in their fridges. They actually offer that vegan.

0 (28m 36s):
You guys so close stay here, but no, there you go. Okay.

2 (28m 39s):
Yeah. And that's ALEKS and they offer vegan banana bread and they're about to redo their menu and have a bit, few more vegan options. Other cafes aren't always as, as welcoming and open as that two vegans. So we really love going there and they've got the right attitudes and everything.

0 (28m 54s):
Look, I'm a huge fan of ratchet and Jimmy and Danny and Sue before that. But then they've gone to do other things. Now they say, boy, Dennis, but look, I love that, but I love their pork belly and the karate. I think we had there once and, and you know, all the other bits and pieces to say, you can certainly get a variety of stuff out there at wild fusion. And they're just awesome people too. And we actually shaved Jim and righteous hade recently for leukemia foundation and raising some money there and they raised a heap and it was a big day and it was great fun. So thanks for sponsoring me guys. I really appreciate it. Cause it's hard to do without a bit of help and look, bill, keep going there for your vegan stuff and I'll keep rocking for me, eggs, Benny, if that's cool with you.

0 (29m 38s):
Okay, look, I want to get onto, I'd like to ask you some questions about, we talked earlier about friends and things like that and having Craigie, but what I find it interesting that someone would be so offended at once again, I said this, but sell offended at the fact that you made a life choice to not take Nate. And you've said a couple times people come at me and say the snakes I attack, or they come at me. What, what sort of things do people suggest your wrongdoing? What, what is it that you're doing wrong

2 (30m 5s):
Because of their version of the world? So I have now have a different version of the world, but I used to have the same version as them. I just thought, what the hell are you eating? How are you even walking around? If you're a vegan, you need meat to live, you need your protein and your, and so often it's where do you get your protein from then? And plants feel pain and really offhanded, random comments that I couldn't believe when I first went vegan, that what I would get slammed with and

0 (30m 37s):
Was shocked at how much spot got thrown at you. Yes. Hmm. I think it's look, I referred to it earlier and it sort of feels like the new coming out as gay and you know, you can get a beating for science stuff. But I mean, when I was younger, it was like, if someone came out of this guy, it was just astonishing. And Avon had the, everyone felt like they had a right to say something about it, which I think is bizarre. Like who gives a shit? And it was a real cottage. And the first thing I said here, you know, the guy don't you and you sorta hear now, like, you know, the vegan doing. And like, it's like a big deal. And, but now it's funny, I'm saying I was a few years ago. I was really glad to say I went to my kid's sporting day and he's he's six foot, two young guy live in year 11 or something like walking around in high heels with full makeup on and got the whole dress going on with these team colors on.

0 (31m 30s):
And that was entirely cool. And I thought, Oh, thank goodness for that. I've got a scene. That's so cool that that's gone so far because in my day that never would. And so it just, it sort of feels like you guys are pushing the boundary a little bit, but do you, do you feel that carnivorous types like myself on numerous as the case may be, or they don't eat enough veggies or wait, and like, why do you feel that angry at us that we're not doing what you do?

2 (31m 57s):
It's frustration and it's, it's just asking you guys to put your critical thinking caps on and look into it more. And it's just basically, I don't know whether sometimes it's because I'm female and I'm just dismissed or what? I don't know. But my partner, for example, went vegan. Maybe, I don't know, five months after me, but we'd only just met. And he cops it a lot worse than me as a male vegan. And I won't, I

0 (32m 25s):
Won't no,

2 (32m 28s):
Well, no, but he will have some most disgusting random comments thrown at him from people he used to work with at another, another company and things like that because he's being vegan seems to be weak, but he's a, he's an actual, a Queensland AFL, umpire. And he does that. He gets paid to do that on, on weekends and things like that. And he's running around very fit. He looks amazing on the complete opposite, by the way, like I'm not fit, but he's yeah, he's vegan and looking wig and a protein and we're both still alive. And he also has a son who's eight and he's vegan with us when he stays with his mum. He's vegetarian.

2 (33m 9s):
So that little fellow will be getting a bit of an education over his life. And there'll be, it's always up to him. We don't force anything, but in our house he won't eat feed.

0 (33m 19s):
Yeah. Well our grade or the email, he sent me that his grandparents gave him.

2 (33m 25s):
Yeah. So growing up my partner eight, obviously whatever the parents would cook him. And therefore when, when the step son goes there, they'll just feed him whatever they're eating. But I noticed the other day, my partner is saying, I'm going to go to the grocery store and I'm going to buy some specific vegan meals. Cause you can get even, you know, quick two minute microwave vegan meals these days. Right. And I'm going to take that down to them for the heme to have for dinner. And I was actually quite surprised cause I thought he was a little bit more cruisy than that. He's like, no, I think it's time they start. Sorry. I see a shift in, even my partner around trying to keep the consistency going for his son around it, but at schools and at school and stuff like we can't control that.

2 (34m 7s):
And he just goes with the flow and kids are kids and I'm not gonna, we're not going to, you know, enforce it. But when he gets older, we've already had conversations or how are we going to handle this? If he comes home and he's brought home, you know, quarter pounder from Mackers or whatever.

0 (34m 24s):
Not that he's come home with a male partner. He's come home with him.

3 (34m 27s):
There you go. Oh my God, what have you done? We can talk about this. We can talk about it. What have we taught you?

2 (34m 37s):
It's it's and it's for us, it's a bit educating the cruelty side because once a vegan goes vegan for the cruelty, your never going to go back. If you go vegan for health or the environment often you'll hit a weak patch where you've missed something that you were eating and you will go back. It's proven. But for me, I just will not touch a thing. Cause I just can't. I automatically assume like, I think in my mind, which animal my hurting right now is I'm eating that. I even started dreaming that I was eating chicken the other night and I threw it up. Cause I didn't,

0 (35m 9s):
That's a pretty strong belief. Isn't it? That you've got going there with that.

2 (35m 12s):
As you go along as a vegan, you get more and more passionate. I think that's where you guys come up against is some of the real longer term vegans that are just sick of it. That we can't believe that others haven't wanted to look into it more. And it's just a maturity around society as a whole. And it's, we're seeing a change. We're seeing plant-based foods being introduced. The burger chains are starting to bring in more of it or many vegan options. We're seeing a slow trend. If we can get people on taste and we can, whatever you can eat, I can eat vegan. There's vegan sausages that you can get from Kohl's there's all the burgers and shit

0 (35m 49s):
And it's coming a long way. Okay. You do see the more hungry jacks would be the first ones. So I sort of thought of, and there's one at North Lake city when Gracie was here, we went and had a free burger and it was pretty good. It was really good. Do I like make one bit yes I do. And I look and all right, so I'll sit here now in front of funny self and say, look, why am I, what do I eat make? Cause I like it. And I really, I I've haven't met anything yet that got me on taste like God does. I think there's nice options. And I'm more than happy with say, I haven't told you about the difference between vegetarian and vegan yet.

0 (36m 29s):
Not. I'd like to surely because a lot of people get that a bit wound up as well. Like your vegetarian carry, your vegetarian past is not there Christ. Like I just think they're so delicious, but I like eating meat. I love eating eggs. I don't even start me on cheese. Like good Lord. And, and you know, all these other things and I'm interested like on, I don't know the misery that, what does a cow go through misery because of the fact it gets milked. I don't know. I just, but, and you can explain it to me by all means, but there's all these things that I really enjoy. And the truth is I understand the cruelty. I've seen it. I've watched plenty of the full <inaudible> sort of things.

0 (37m 12s):
I've watched some awful news documentaries, you know, private documentaries as well about the cruelty, especially. And this is some people are just cruel assholes and I mean, that's just horrific and I don't think, I certainly don't sit there and go, right, let's kill this thing with a stick or do whatever, but I'll just like me and I can't jump shot on Nikita. Ran that look, all right, sorry, I'm getting on a bit. But my, my foster dad had got drunk at his 18th or a beat drunk decided he didn't like it. And he's now 74 and the bug has never let up on me and say, why do you drink it stupid? And my dad, my actual father was an alcoholic and died due to it.

0 (37m 54s):
And my sister, I freaking love drinking. Like I just really enjoy having a drink. It's something I do for fun, for sociable to relax and all this stuff here. And he just cannot understand why I would do that. And I had to sit down and give him cause I like it. Yeah. And is that, is that shallow? I don't know.

2 (38m 11s):
From, from my perspective like before, and I was saying it's, it's the, the ego of the human race plus needing empathy for the animals. So for example, if you wouldn't eat your dog, the dog and the pigs and the other animals, they also feel pain and they suffer and whatever. I now don't want to eat a pig because I putting myself in the shoes of the animal and it's around how they've been bred, how they, how they are looked after and how they, how little they live and then they get killed. And it's just a complete cycle. They're just born to die for us to eat when you don't, you're just eating the middle man.

2 (38m 51s):
So what actually happens is we're eating, we vegans eat plants for protein. You guys are eating the animals for the protein that the animal already ate the plant to get the protein in the first place. And then there's all the other health aspects to it. Right? For example, you know, you get your soul, another poisoning with the eggs. And I was speaking to someone in WWI once who was a nurse. And she said, there's so many outbreaks of like killing people with salmonella poisoning minds. You can get that from plants too, but eggs adjust, you know, I don't know how graphic to be here, but we think about it. Okay. So an egg is a, is a chicken period. And so it's, it's from eight would normally be turned into a little animal.

2 (39m 34s):
And I just, I guess coming back to it is if you look into the cruelty and you actually analyze, so when I eat cheese, I'm addicted, there's something, I think it's called casein. That's in the cheese. You're addicted to that. You're not actually addicted to the full cheese product. And then if you look into love it, wasn't that. So if you start going, okay, why do the vegans not like cheese? And then you, you, you dig down into it and then you go down that rabbit hole of, well, for starters, the Derrick has been forcibly impregnated to give birth, to generate milk.

2 (40m 14s):
So they don't produce milk because they're eating grass. They generate any milk because they carried a baby for nine months. And then generally at the end, depending on whether they have a male or female baby, the males are actually genuinely killed for veal within, you know, a few weeks, a month, whatever. So I'm not okay with that. And vegans are not okay with that. And then if you look into, you know, chicken and stuff like that, they're only dying at five weeks of age, they've been pumped full of all kinds of crap to grow quickly. And so it's about putting yourself in the animal shoes. And that's, what is the difference between me as a vegan for cruelty versus Minga, Misa vegan for health?

0 (40m 53s):
I, as I said, I respect your opinion entirely. And I don't think that when I said, I know how cruel <inaudible> work and, and I know what you're saying about chickens and veal and all that sort of stuff there. And, and look, I think any sort of deliberate cruelty on something is horrific. I've been watching an interesting show lately with my wife and she just loves him. It's Australian country, cottage river cottage, Australian river cottage. It's called, there's a Pommy one that started at first. But anyway, it's a guy living off the land. It's I mean, it's, it's one of those, it's one of those, you know, reality. Well, I don't know how much is reality, you know, but there's a lot reality.

0 (41m 34s):
And the reality is he raises his pigs and the pigs get slaughtered and he brings them back and he cooks them and prepares them. And same with the chokes and Simon, KA and death and all that sort of stuff on there. And it's like, I think, I don't think you should feel comfy eating meat if you don't know where it comes from. I think that's a big grids having a nice little package of pork cutlets in your, in your supermarket. It looks really lovely, but that's not how they got there. And I think that is a big deal. And I think education on, you know, and they'd probably be a damn salt, more vegans. If that was a case, to be honest, I wouldn't be one, I'd be okay with it

2 (42m 12s):
As you've been probably exposed to it. We find when we show some graphic footage, for example, from the dominion documentary, which is what turned me vegan, and that was around the pigs for starters and they can't move around is if you showed, if the slaughterhouses had glass walls and if advertising did the right thing and actually showed the truth and stop painting cows as happy all the time, and animals is happy and got some real facts out there in the community. I think the public would be really shocked, but the public just don't want to seem to look into it, which is the frustrating part for us.

0 (42m 45s):
In our minds, we offer an amazing show to probably five, six, seven years ago, somebody now, and it was called something like paddock to plate, but what it was was a glass avatar in front of a whole long table, full of people sitting down in front of plights at a meal, they were sitting down for a meal and they bought the cattle in and I slaughtered the cattle in front of them, bled amounts, guarded them, did the whole thing, you know, bolt through all the stuff all through the head and honestly scan them, did the whole thing, butchered them. These guys are sitting here watching the entire thing. And then after a certain amount of time, they were bought out steaks or whatever it was.

0 (43m 26s):
And that was from that boost. And that was amazing and confronting and brilliant. Not all of them paramount. It's a bit, I just remember the, I remember the slaughterhouse part the most cause you do it's the most obvious, but yeah, but just, I thought it was a wonderful thing to be able to say to people, well, this is where it comes from. God, it ain't all priests. And I know pretty well somewhere there's a, slaughterman who's killed, you know, you know, a hundred base today or whatever the quota might be that he gets to do there. And then I do this and this in there chatting about what they're doing on the weekend the whole time. Cause it's a very normal part of their life to do that. So I thought it was, I think education is important thing. And, and the, and I will say again that if anyone decides that that's their way of life, they want to do because of the choices that they've made and what they've seen in giddy up, what it will ask is advertising new belief.

0 (44m 22s):
And I'm one of my brother and I struggle with region. One of the things I do on these shows a lot, if you haven't heard them before, is I think religions just pretty shoot. Definitely not into religion at all.

2 (44m 32s):
Yeah. But

0 (44m 33s):
You have a belief system now that you've created for yourself and you wanted to talk about it and push it forward as the belief system does that, does that make you, I mean, do you just sit there and watch people disagree with you and just not give a shit and decides their thing? Or do you feel the need to, to discuss it and say, no, no, no, no. Have you watched a minion, but have you done it

2 (44m 55s):
Based off the reaction from one of my really good friends, like I said, it scared the shit out of me, how that person reacted to me immediately. It was just a complete auto shutdown of may. And it upset me quite a bit. And I was basically told, do not contact me for anything to do about it. I don't want to hear it. And it was, and so

0 (45m 17s):
Now you can't talk about politics, religion, or what you eat,

2 (45m 21s):
Have that conversation at all, mind you, that person did end up buying me a vegan t-shirt once and stuff like that. And I I'm constantly trying to juggle the friendship because it is such a burning issue because her partner is a Hunter and I'm not against him. And he just does that for social. Right. And I'm not, I'm okay with some of it. And I'm a saying that not everyone is going to go vegan. All I'm saying is we now have proven there's another alternative way to leave. We don't have to breed all these animals for profit, just to slaughter, to kill because you like the taste. Some of it's proven to be not be healthy for you and things like what goes into a sausage and things like that.

2 (46m 1s):
I just, I don't know how to deal with the people aspect of it around, like I said, not wanting to even look into it and then you can form an opinion. So let's get all the facts on the, on the table first. Then you tell me you're still happy to go ahead and do that. Now let's take you, for example, let's go to the slaughter houses and see some of these workers suffer mental health issues. Some of these places, people are comfortable with killing things, take this home to their families and there's domestic violence. And there's all sorts of social implications

0 (46m 39s):
Used to ending life. Daily use is probably not a healthy thing for your psyche. I wouldn't. Yeah,

2 (46m 43s):
No, but I worry for them in my mum, back in the early eighties, when we moved to Queensland, went to the doctor once, cause her face blew up from the sun and the doctor there was telling her then that there is people with random diseases coming in from the avatars regularly because they've caught something from the animals, which is leads us to COVID and the, all the different conspiracies around that. And vegans have a hundred percent agree that we believe it's come from animals. And there's COVID outbreaks, you know, all sorts of viruses coming from animals. You've got your SaaS viruses and you've got all sorts of pig chicken. You know, you got all these viruses coming from animals. They may, maybe it's the world trying to tell us something. But I, so what we're saying is you've got your early adopters to veganism.

2 (47m 27s):
That's what I was. And there others that might take a little bit longer and I'm not, it's just a term. Vegans are term because it's just what we've come up with. We just want cruelty free. We don't want an animal to suffer for anything for us. Just like, I wouldn't want my dog to suffer. I now no longer want any other creature to suffer and I'm not okay with it. I'm not going to have arguments with people, but generally people immediately, soon as they realize I'm vegan, I see their face change. I see their defensive mechanisms come up. They cross their arms. They like, Oh, she thinks she's good. Or, and they, and it actually plants a seed immediately. So you know that people are thinking as soon as I walk in a room and there's the vegan now, so it's not, Oh, there's bell.

2 (48m 12s):
She's cool. She loves, you know, crime shows. She loves game of Thrones, Vikings. She's you know, R and B she's that? No, it's no longer that they've identified me as the vegan

0 (48m 23s):
Grant. Can I ask you a question? All right. Apart from all this stuff, I said, I'm used to it on my K with hunting and skinning and cleaning. And also all I came in as well, UFC fighting. And you feel about that?

2 (48m 36s):
I like it, actually, my brother and I are up in Darwin last year when we were watching. Yeah. But I don't mind human humans beat the shit out of yourselves.

0 (48m 44s):
That's kind of what I was getting at. So you're not a pacifist at all.

2 (48m 48s):
Like I, I encourage any like sports that are not involving any animals. I don't give a shit. We can go beat the shit out of each other. If that's what you want to do, human to human, you know, go for it. But I don't think animal doesn't have a choice to be in that arena. An animal doesn't have a choice to be confined an animal. Doesn't have a choice to be shot at six months of age because we want to eat them. So yeah. I'm all for MMA.

0 (49m 14s):
Honestly. I just, it just came up. Then I thought, well, I've seen some pretty cruel faults in my time and I think maybe you should get back to that

2 (49m 20s):
To be there. And you're not being forced and all that shit. Like,

0 (49m 23s):
Yeah, we'll get that. That's cool. It was a weak question. I was gonna ask something. No, no, no, not at all. Okay. Vegetarian. Vegetarian is in versus vegans. Let's get the other way before we get to some good beats and start wrapping up and I've got, I want to make it nice at the end of the day. So vegetarians, they can have animal products,

2 (49m 42s):
They won't eat meat, but they'll still have like dairy milk and eggs and things like that. There's other, other types. There's ones that will not eat eggs or will eat eggs and all that. There's all different labels for all these different types there. So it's not just vegetarian and vegan, there's Octo something or other

0 (49m 58s):
<inaudible>.

2 (50m 4s):
I just go for the full vent. It's easier to pitch that because it's just, we just don't date animals or any animal products or any bugs or anything. Right. So for example, nail Polish, when you go and get your shellacked nails, that's actually Beatles in that. So I don't do that anymore. I just get normal nail hot nail Polish, or there's so much to this and testing on animals cannot stand. It cannot stand the thought of us. And we still test on in Australia is just atrocious. So when you start me off from the cruelty thing, I can get very passionate. And so I just have to turn it down, turn it down because I've got a lot of facts bouncing around like, you know, information I've learned in the last 18 months. And I just fully live it and breathe it.

2 (50m 45s):
And I can't, I can't stop because it's, there's a, there's, there's a lot of suffering going on out there. That's unnecessary. But that humans inflict on animals. I just don't want it. But vegetarians. Yeah. Okay. We just don't get why they're not vegan, but at the same time, I'm, I'm, I've toned down. I think in the past, I might've shared some memes on Facebook that would be paying out on vegetarians. Like what the hell, man? Why can't you just go the next step? But at the end of the day, what's the point so long as they're not, you know, they've gone one step at least is no point. I'm the vegan because I fully believe in it. Right. I am not going to judge you because you ate whatever today.

0 (51m 26s):
Well, you're not judging me. And I appreciate that entirely. And that's the whole idea is like, do your thing, girl. What's okay. So there's some parts in it about health. Now I have a lot. I'm going to get it. All right. Okay. Well I, I can try, but I'm a junk food vegan. Okay. Well look. Okay. So it brought there's arguments for and against with health. Oh, donate made. It's bad for you. All. We're meant to eat meat, look at our teeth structure and all these other bits of paper. And everyone's got a theory, which is pretty standard as long when you go to court right in the cops and you've got to get forensic evidence. You can buy a scientist. That'll tell you it's this way. And you can get another one that gives you another example on that. Well, they fully believe it or they're not sitting in a line.

0 (52m 9s):
They just they're in their ways. And they've got their thing here, but okay. If you just suddenly decide to eat celery, you're going to get sick, right? That's correct. Okay. We need a balanced diet. What? Now? I believe that mushrooms are a great source of protein. I dig mushrooms. I don't know if that's true or not, but I fricking love the funky man. It's great. Sorry. So, okay. What are some alternatives that in your journey you've gone from eating meat and having what someone would call a balanced diet to doing what you're doing here.

2 (52m 36s):
So that's really good question. Right? So when I first went vegan, being the V the junk food person that I was as a meat eater, and then basically on a junk food vegan, my first things were, what do you use as butter? What do you use as milk? What, you know, you want Vegemite toast? What the hell can I even have toast? His toast vegan? Why,

0 (52m 57s):
What were you most disappointed about?

2 (53m 0s):
I guess it's more the sweets. Cause I'm a sweet person. So it's finding someone to make you a cake or make you something that replicates the old, you know, cheesecake or something like that. So I hate cooking. Are we the first to tell you that I'd rather go eat out? So white fusion, I'm going to be at your restaurant.

0 (53m 20s):
Tiny, interesting thing. Not on this. My sons were my, my son now he's allergic Anna. Filactic allergic to eggs and peanuts and shellfish. And the eggs thing is a pain in the ass. Like, honestly, these guys, half the time, don't know if there's eggs in stuff, when you go to places and it is getting a lot better. I mean, it's a lot thing there, but also when you get to the back of the package and it says, may contain eggs, peanuts, shellfishing. Cause you just randomly put that on there. In case someone had a tuna sandwich that day and something sort of came out of it, but that was a really difficult themey. So for you trying to figure out what's what and what you can have based on what you want to eat.

0 (54m 1s):
Is that a bit of a nightmare

2 (54m 3s):
Only in, for example, central Queensland, when I fly away for work and I go into country town and there, yeah, there are vegans around and I am able to get some vegan food and their specific vegan item on one of the, one of the camp restaurant meals there. But I think over time more and more education will happen. And that's one thing I wanted to do. I was actually going to get some professional things done up so I can just fly as just a handout to some of the cafes around here going, Oh, wait, there's vegans around. We have money. We want to spend money in your shop. Did you know that if you just had nut to Lex as a butter, we would probably come and have breakfast there more often, we'd be able to get our jam on toast or whatever you want accurate.

2 (54m 44s):
I think it's aquafaba or something like that. Is it alternative for eggs? And that's what they make there.

0 (54m 50s):
Well, we should get, it was called egg, like in a package. It was powder and stuff like that, that, that the boys could have back then. So it's a while ago, but you can still get that sort of stuff

2 (54m 59s):
Again. I can't iterate enough. I am not a cook and I don't like it. So

0 (55m 4s):
To be honest, I just know it.

2 (55m 6s):
Yeah. So there is an app we have for called fussy vegan and it, you just scan it at the grocery store. It tells you something's vegan or not, which is fantastic. And that saved us. But for example, I catch a flight to, and from work at the moment and I haven't always done firefight, but I currently am. And I've got the shits on hard right now. I actually can not get anything to eat on these flights. Everyone else is sitting there having their ham or chicken sandwich and their packet of chips. I might be able to get a Coke, but the chips aren't even vegan because they have milk solids in them. A lot of the chip companies would be able to market their products as vegan. If they'd just take some of these milk solids out and replace them with other things like it's so easy to do a lot of things, a lot of places could do veganism food, much easier if they could just take a few things out and dairy farm is beyond happy rather than all they don't.

2 (55m 59s):
Yeah. So oat milk is something that's my favorite. Instead of, for example, when we went back to your question before and what foods, so oat milk is the, is the one to go to from dairy. You go to oat milk. I went to almond milk, hated it. Then I went, sorry,

0 (56m 12s):
Where has that image in a coffee? And it's just not milk. I'm sorry.

2 (56m 16s):
It just anyway, oat milk. So you have people you can go to. So I do get questions like that from friends. Oh, Hey, I want to, you know what I do for these? What should I eat for this? And I tell them, go eat milk. So coffee shops around the place at the moment seem to have soy, but they don't have, Oh. And it's like, Oh my God, try the oatmeal. It's way better. So there's, you know, those conversations to be had with a lot of places around. There's a really nice Italian restaurant just here, actually that does provide vegan meals. And there's West end is the Mecca in Brisbane, for example, for all the vegans to go to for food. But there is a good little one here that does do really good Italian vegan options. Yeah. I just can remember the night.

2 (56m 57s):
I just want to remember

0 (56m 58s):
Right. Just come and try it all the Italian restaurant, leaving choices. I mean, I get it. And, and I do entirely I'm, I'm cool with it. I will say this look on because I'm going to start wrapping up shortly if you've got nothing else, but it's been a great chat. I would say that if anyone is getting up you, cause if you decided to be vegan, they need to get their head red and just keep kiddo hobby guys, honestly like who gives a shit? If it doesn't worry, you that's fine. And I think also I saw something that really shoot me once from a vegan. It was an interesting thing. There was this guy who I was chamber of commerce president. This guy rang up and said, Oh, I'm running for a political party. And I'd like to be like, have a discussion with you and being funny you group, and also say, cool, man, like, we're always happy to help and have everyone there.

0 (57m 45s):
And I did my usual and stalked him a beat as you do. And he wrote this review on a restaurant that was renowned for its smoked meats. And it's it's, it was a steak house. That's what it was. Right. And he gave this one star review on this joint and float the hell out of it about the fact that there was only one vegan option. So it wasn't that there was none, there was one vegan option and how disgusting and how backwards this place was and all that. So stuff. And I just, I put a little we're entering the Nathan said, you know, it's a steakhouse, don't you buddy, look, I'm not rocking into Mo what is it? The new free burgers and demanding African T-bone. Like, I just there's this each way, like I said, early on in this extremism in any form is ridiculous.

0 (58m 31s):
I just don't get it. But it religion be it food, beer, football clubs, or I don't care, whatever, but it's been a real delight having a chat to you in a non <inaudible> hateful manner, which is fantastic. But is there anything else you wanna add,

2 (58m 45s):
I guess just in regards to change how we can get change happening for animals in the world. In, especially in Australia, there is a political party that is trying to create changes, animal justice party. They've actually got elected MPS down in new South Wales and Victoria, I'm a volunteer with them and I'm going to be volunteering here on the weekend, actually at a stall. So if anyone wants to come on down and say hello, we can make changes. And so it, it's not just, you know, obviously some members are vegan, but they just trying to help cruelty anything from, you know, what's going on with, you know, your domestic animals in housing and things like that. They're to create change. They they're helping with the duck shooting.

2 (59m 25s):
There's all sorts of things they're doing. They are campaigning against the down in new South Wales. For example, we just got the, the ruling come through, I think, or they've just pushing it through, around having breeding dolphins in, in, you know, at these waterparks, they're going to try and stop that. And we want to get that next into Queensland. They stopped breeding these dolphins in these parks. So they're just stuck there for however long they're alive for. We want to stop that breeding program. So there's little things like that, that they can make a change. I just think they're doing good things

0 (59m 55s):
Well, okay. On everything you just said, then what I'd say is do your research people like before you sit there and throw rocks of hate and say, everyone's an idiot, Hey, check it out. I mean, I have checked it out. I'm comfortable with the way in the way I leave. And that's my choice on that bill wasn't. So she went and did something about it. And for those that want to do something better, please feel free. I don't suggest you jam at anyone's right. Or anything like that. But the fact is, feel free to have a discussion about it because they're not too hard to do. Would you agree? Absolutely. Thanks for coming on board mate. I really appreciate it. And you guys are there. Thanks very much for listening to another episode of no humble opinions. We will catch you.

1 (1h 0m 32s):
<inaudible>.