Martyna from Poland

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This episode features a non-native speaker for the first time on the Real Exam English podcast.
 
 Martyna from Poland speaks about her English journey, including working for an international airline company, preparing for the Cambridge C1 exam and the benefits of watching TV in English. 
 
 As usual we pick out some nice bits of language, including some excellent use of substitution words and ellipsis. We also pick up on some common errors for Polish speakers.
 
Enjoy!

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Music: Wholesome by Kevin MacLeod
Link: https://incompetech.filmmusic.io/song/5050-wholesome
License: http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/

Transcript

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 Hello and welcome to the Real Exam English podcast. This episode is a little bit different to previous episodes in that it features a non-native speaker. I thought it would be useful to hear from someone who has prepared for a Cambridge exam to see if we can get some tips and maybe even a little inspiration!

So the speaker here, Martyna, is actually a student of mine, and last year passed her C1 exam. Well, she passed her C1 exam but in the speaking part she got a C2, which is the highest mark you can get in Cambridge English exams so as you will hear she speaks really well. 

She has the occasional little error but she’s an excellent communicator and her pronunciation is fantastic. Being from Poland, she has a bit of an accent when she speaks but that’s absolutely fine with me and when marking English exams, accents aren’t something that you are marked on.

So Martyna is a lawyer for an international airline company and therefore uses her English a lot on a daily basis so we hear about the challenges of using English in her workplace, we talk about the benefit of watching TV in English and we hear about her tips for preparing for the C1 exam.

As usual we’ll take a break every now and again and take a look at the language used. And the transcript for this episode can be purchased on the Real Exam English website, Realexamenglish.com

Ok here we go with the questions:

 So you're a lawyer, right, in an airline. UM, so I suppose you have to use English in your day-to-day.

That's true. I deal with a lot of English contracts, so this is my task to analyse them on a daily basis and I need to correspond with people to send people emails in English but the most challenging task I have in terms of English is to conduct negotiations in English like English language, so. Sometimes we, meet people face to face. They come to us, to our headquarter, to have these discussions. Sometimes it is…we use online tools like teams or zoom, but you need to be quite spontaneous and prepared for that and this is quite, this is quite this, this this the task is quite stressful and demanding I would say.

Yeah. Why? Just because, like, apart from the spontaneity, is it? I guess there's a lot of kind of subtleties to negotiation, you know, like the language you need to use is, uh, quite delicate.

It is, but it's not that difficult to me because I know the language and the specific words and and this is not a big challenge, but the challenge is to speak with native speakers who very often are not very used to speak with non-Native speakers and they use language which sometimes I do not understand and it might be quite tricky when you negotiate something. Yeah, because you need to be very accurate and you really need to know what the other people are trying to communicate.

Yeah, it's essential that you get it right, right. And do you sometimes have a translator like or is it just you or your and your colleagues?

Not. Not really, not really. We are…we work in teams. Uh. So sometimes when I don't, when I don't understand, I just ask to repeat or to rephrase it. And at the beginning it was very stressful for me, but now I see that the most important thing is to just uh, go with the flow and to find this common understanding and not, uh, not to worry that I don't understand everything from the beginning. Yeah. So I just, I just can't ask so many questions and this is the challenging for the other for the other people in fact because they need to think about how to explain these things so that I can understand them.

Yeah. Yeah, yeah, that that's the challenge. Always as a native speaker, right. How do you change your language a little bit so that you can be understood by everybody?

Yes. And it's sometimes it's quite a good negotiating technique because they cannot focus on the most important, most essential things, but they need to focus more about the language and they lose the focus on the essential you know, essential factors.

Can it buy you a little bit of time as well to ask them to repeat the question and you know you can kind of think how to plan your answer?

A little bit, yeah.

And does that happen in Polish as well, like when you speak Polish to non-native Polish speakers? Do you change your language? Your Polish language when you speak to them? Do you understand what I'm saying? So like if you're someone from Ireland trying to speak Polish to you, do you speak a more simplified version of Polish or?

This is not very common situation to me that as someone who is not Polish native speaker tries to speak Polish to be honest. So, I do not remember such situations. So basically either we are or Polish people and Polish participants and this is not the challenge or we are from all over the world and we speak English or other languages like sometimes German for example.

Yeah, well, it's so strange that it's not a, not a factor at all. Because, as an English speaker, it's always something that you're thinking like, you know when you're travelling or speaking to non natives or as an English teacher, In particular, you know to, you know, not use too advanced language.

Maybe this is a little bit similar when I speak about legal aspects of some contracts for example, to people who are not lawyers.

Right

And I need to rephrase it and to find some simple words, some simple sentences so that my colleagues from other departments understand what it is about why this is a problem, why I see the risk here and I try to avoid legalese.

Legalese, nice word. Legalese is the formal and technical language that is used when talking about legal matters. Usually, your average person on the street can’t understand that type of legal jargon so that’s why we get people like Martyna to simplify it for us. 

So, as you can see Martyna doesn´t always use that fancy grammar or vocabulary but almost everything she does say is correct. For instance, in the first answer I ask about her day-to-day, and she responds saying that she uses English on a daily basis, which is a really nice way of saying the same thing, but in a different way. And then her collocations are spot on after that, I deal with contracts, I correspond with clients, I conduct interviews. Great. Then she has some nice adjectives too, like spontaneous, stressful and demanding, all used absolutely correctly. 

She mentioned that when she doesn´t understand something she asks them to repeat it or to rephrase it. So to rephrase it means to say it in a different way, and we had a good example of that where I asked her about people speaking Polish and I sensed that she didn’t get what I was on about so I rephrased it and then she got it. 

Her answer to that then, had some well-used substitute words. These are words that you use so that you don´t have to repeat a whole phrase again. For instance, she said This is not a common situation for me, I don´t remember such situations, this is not the challenge. Again this doesn´t seem all that fancy but it´s actually something that is very important to master, especially when you are writing when the examiner will be looking out for it.

Yeah, great. OK, cool. And are there perks to working in the airline industry? I imagine there are.

Perks. What do you mean?

Like benefits that come with the job?

Yes, yes. So this is basically a little bit confidential, but on the other hand, everyone working for airlines know knows it. So if you work for an airline, it's quite a good opportunity to travel because you can have some benefits regarding airline tickets, not only within your airline, but also other airlines. So people who love travelling are very satisfied with their job because of that, yeah. So they have a good chance to have wonderful holidays.

Yeah, super. And do you get to use your English on your holidays?

Uh, yes, basically I do, quite often. Uh. Maybe not in every country because some countries are not very….people from some countries are not very used to speak English, but fortunately I have a husband who speaks French, for example very well. So we may use his skill in this area. But yes, when I have the opportunity, I try to speak English as much as I can when I'm on holidays. It's not only in the hotels but sometimes I try to meet some friends, for example.

Uh-huh. And outside of work and travel. Do you get any chance to speak English?

Uh, not really. I would say apart of uh taking a part in classes, but that's. But I, uh, maybe not speak, but I use my English skills when I watch TV series, I like watching them without this voice over, which is very popular in Poland. So I use English subtitles and I read English books whenever it is possible.

OK, so in Poland, do most people watch TV series with the voice over, like a dubbed voice?

Yes, yes, yes. So basically in television it's, uh, only voice over when, uh, when you have a film in a different language and when you watch a movie or a TV series on Netflix or other or using other streaming tools then it is possible to change, to select between voice over and subtitles. And especially older generations are rather used to have a voiceover.

Yeah, I suppose so. Do you recommend it for someone who's trying to improve their English?

Ohh definitely I think that I learned a lot uh uh while watching TV series and films without voice over and at the beginning I started with Polish subtitles and then when I get a little bit…. when I got a little bit better in English then I switched to English ones. And it's great for using, for learning typical English phrases or, just sentences we don't encounter, I don't know if it's the right word, but when you just speak during the classes, for example, because it's like a normal English used by English speakers.

Totally.                             

When you when you watch or watched TV series, did you stop and make notes or did you just watch them for fun and enjoy them?

Not really. Uh, I just watch them for fun, but uh. Very often when I read books and I am. And I, uh, when I find a phrase which I really like and I didn't know it. Uh, before then I check in the dictionary what it means and I write it down in my notebook. Or on my mobile phone for example.

Books are great for that, right? Like you have the time to actually stop and check it out, which, and that doesn't ruin the experience as much as with a TV program.

That's true, but on the other hand, it takes really long to read the whole book when we stop too much.

It's true. Yeah. Do you read on a Kindle or a real book?

Uhm, I did in the past, but I prefer let's say the original uh. Natural style. Yes, exactly. That makes me more fun to read to read typical books. Yeah, in a paper form.

I know, yeah, the Kindles are handy though. I know, I…. Well, I haven't done it in a while, but I've read some Spanish books on the Kindle. And you can just press the word on the screen and it translates, it translates it and gives you a definition.

Exactly. Dictionary is, uh, is somehow included that.

Yeah, it's like pre loaded there. It's brilliant. It's great for for learning. UM, wow. So you read in English, you watch series in English, so you really lots of different sources of vocabulary.

That's true, and I must say that it was something that, uh, that made a difference because when I was a kid, the methods of learning English were not that good because we were supposed to learn a lot of grammar without really understanding what it what it was about. And then when I was at the university, I went to Berlin. For one year and I participated in English classes there and they, uh showed me that learning English in actions learning in English in action is the key. And from that moment I started to make real progress, I  would say. So having contact to English on a daily basis.

That’s great advice, having contact with English on a daily basis. You might have picked up an error or two in these answers. One that Martyna made a few times here is to be used to doing something, so used to here should be following by ING. Martyna’s ones were I was used to speak, and older generations are rather used to have a voice over. Ok so, these should be I was used to speaking and the older generations are rather used to HAVING a voice over. She actually uses got used to a bit later and in this case she gets it right, she says I got used to speaking. So remember when used to refers to being accustomed to something then it needs a gerund, and ING verb.

Something else to point out is her nice organisation. So to focus on one answer - So this is basically a little bit confidential, but on the other hand, everyone working for airlines know knows it. So if you work for an airline, it's quite a good opportunity to travel because you can have some benefits regarding airline tickets, not only within your airline, but also other airlines. Ok, quite simple, but really effective, when you have an extended stretch of speech like this it’s important to organise it well.

And you did your C1 exam last year, right? And passed it. Congratulations.

Yes, exactly. Thank you. That was in. Yeah, in November. That's true.

Uh. And do you have any tips about preparation for that? What to do, what not to do?

I would say that doing exercises typical for the type of exam you want to take is crucial, and you need to do it quite frequently. Having some support for of a person who know how to deal with that exam would be also great to get some feedback on that, and as I said, uh, having contact with English on a daily basis, so read a lot of books. Uh, watch a lot of films and TV series, try to speak as much as possible so that you start thinking in English before the exam and that would be the most important thing in my opinion.

Uh, so did you consciously try to do something every day? Like to do a little bit of reading one day or a bit of listening another day? Or was it just?

I felt a little bit bad when I did nothing about English so even one episode of TV series a day is enough because we need to have a constant contact to the language and of course expanding your vocabulary and refreshing star grammar is also important, but that you can do when you practise some exercises.

Yeah, I think it's important to always do something. I know when I was going heavy, preparing for my B2 in Spanish. Some days you don't want to and you say OK, I'll watch an episode of something or play a game with a song or something a bit more light-hearted, but it's good to always do something kind of every day just to keep the rhythm going. You know, because once you stop, it's easy to not do it the next day again. You know.

Exactly. Uh, I can say it's uh, uh now that. And I don't know two or three months has have passed since I passed the exam and I do not have such an intense contact with English anymore and I forgot a lot of vocabulary of this, let's say this level of English is not that high as it was three months ago. I would say.

Yeah. You're not speaking in inversions anymore, no.

Not really.

And what about challenges learning English? What part of English in general do you find the trickiest?

I was really afraid before the exam I was afraid of taking use of English part because. I was not that good at grammar and in this type of exercises, but in the reality it was not that bad. I am pretty anxious when I need to speak with uh native speakers who are not used to speak to non-English speakers because I I feel that I should understand them and sometimes I struggle with that and yeah so. I would say that uh speaking with English native speakers is difficult.

Yeah, a lot of people struggle with speaking with and English speakers on the phone in particular. You know when you can't get any body language or you can't see their lips, that kind of stuff.

That was that was a big difficulty for me before the pandemic, but now it has changed a lot because most of people use online tools and not everyone likes to switch on the camera. Uh. In fact, it's very uncommon in Poland that people switch on cameras. They are rather shy. I don't know. So I got used to speaking with people without seeing them. And it's not that hard anymore to me.

Ah, OK, cool. That's good practise. All the Polish people in their pyjamas at work. 

Yeah. 

And what about a favourite English word or expression?

That's difficult question, but I think that I use quite often the phrase. You know what I mean? Or you know what I'm saying? I know that it's not elegant at all in English, but I have the impression that on the one hand it gives me some time to collect my thoughts and on the other hand, I try to make sure that the other person, my interlocutor, understands me so. So I know it's not elegant, but it's helpful for me so I don't care.

Yeah. And it's great and that's what native English speakers use the whole time as well. You know what I mean? Yeah, it's very common. Great. All right, cool. Martyna. That's it.

Wow, wasn´t she good. I love this expression at the end, it gives me time to collect my thoughts. This means it gives her time to get composed or to get control of her feelings or thoughts. We often use this expression after a shock or a surprise. Like when I saw the shark swimming towards me it took a few seconds to collect my thoughts and calmly swim out of the water. This phrase is listed as C2 level in the Cambridge dictionary, so is a really nice one to use. 

She did, however,  have a couple of little errors here and there with her articles. Like, she said in THE reality and that’s difficult question. Polish speakers often have errors with their articles, as do Russians and Ukrainians, so if you are from one of those countries make sure you do some extra practice on your articles. In this case, it should be in reality, with no articles, and that’s A difficult question. Ok, not big errors at all, and these wouldn´t really affect marks in an exam, unless there were a lot more examples of them. You just make sure your good language outweighs your bad language. 

One last thing I´d like to point out is her short responses to the questions, she had exactly, that’s true, not really, definitely, it is and I do. Ok, it´s really important to have a bunch of these responses for when you have to interact with someone, in an exam or in real life. These last two, it is and I do are good examples of what it called ellipsis, where in order to avoid repetition we just omit words. So I asked the question Do you get to use your English on your holidays? And she responded I do. It isn´t really necessary to repeat the whole sentence, I do get to use English on my holidays, so it is shortened to I do. Again, this is something that may seem easy but it needs a bit of practice to be able to use it as seamlessly as Martyna does here. Also, if you do Cambridge English exams then this use of ellipsis is tested sometimes in Use of English part 2, where you have to fill in the blanks with a word, so it’s a good thing to study.

Well guys, that´s all we have time for today. Hopefully, you enjoyed that chat and found Martyna’s story and her tips relatable and useful. 

As this is the first one of these interviews I’d really appreciate some feedback, just to know if this format is something you’d like to hear again or do you just prefer listening to native speakers, like in all of the previous episodes. Any feedback is welcome, so please feel free to send me a message on Instagram, or an email to realexamenglish at gmail.com

Thanks a million for listening!

Trevor