Taking the Confusion out of ABLE: Learning about Savings Accounts for People with Disabilities

When a Dad wanted to save money for his daughter with a disability and realized things weren't fair, he set out to change the law. And thus the ABLE Act was born, giving people with disabilities the ability to save money without losing their Medicaid or Social Security eligibility. Today we talk to a Wisconsin Mom who has made it her life's work to answer your ABLE questions and take the confusion out of how to set up an account, while also helping you understand how ABLE can open up doors to a fantastic future! 

"As a Financial Advisor in Wisconsin who specializes in helping individuals with disabilities, and/or parents of those with special needs to plan, the ABLE Accounts have been a beneficial tool.   I have a personal connection to my professional specialty.  I have three girls, and my youngest Emily has Down syndrome.   I worked in the Financial Services industry for 10 years prior to her birth.  Although she was born in 2011, several years before the ABLE Accounts became available, I knew that I wanted to change the trajectory of my career as an Advisor to focus on families like mine. " - Kathleen Oberneder, ChSNC®

More about Kathleen: https://www.crescendowm.com/team/kathleen-oberneder
Reach Kathleen here: info@crescendowm.com 

The ABLE National Resource Center: https://www.ablenrc.org/

ABLE Resources in Wisconsin: https://arcwi.org/2018/03/12/learn-need-know-opening-able-account-special-needs-trust-wisconsin/

Kathleen's disclosure information: 
Securities offered through J.W. Cole Financial, Inc. (JWC) Member FINRA/SIPC..Advisory services offered through J.W. Cole Advisors, Inc. (JWCA). Crescendo Wealth Management, LLC and JWC/JWCA are unaffiliated entities. J.W. Cole Financial Representatives do not accept orders and /or instructions regarding your account by e-mail, voice mail, fax or any alternative method. 

For a copy of JWC’s Form CRS please visit HERE. For a copy of JWC’s Disclosure Supplement please visit HERE. By following the link, you consent to the receipt of the Form CRS electronically. For a copy of JWCA’s Form CRS please visit

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This podcast episode has been brought to you by Old National Bank - a Leading Disability Employer.

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Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:05

Welcome to the arc experience, featuring the stories of self advocates with disabilities and their families from around Wisconsin. Be inspired. Take action. And now for today's episode,

Speaker 2: 0:23

Hello and welcome to the arc experience podcast. I am your host, Lisa Pew, executive director of the arc Wisconsin. Today, we are discussing a topic that I certainly think a lot of people find confusing. I get a lot of questions about this. It's able accounts. In a nutshell, able accounts are special savings accounts for people with disabilities that can help them or their families not only save for the future, but build a pretty cool and independent life. I think able accounts are a fantastic tool and I know today's podcast guests, Kathleen overnighter. Thanks. So as well. Hello Kathleen.

Speaker 3: 1:05

Hi Lisa. Hey

Speaker 2: 1:08

Kathleen, can you get us started by telling us just a little bit about yourself and why? I certainly think, and I know a lot of other people do that. You are one of Wisconsin's leading Abel.

Speaker 3: 1:20

Oh, thanks so much, Lisa. First of all, I'm so excited to be here. This is like my first podcast I've been on and I listened to podcasts all the time. So what a fun time and thank you for inviting me. And yes, thanks for that little ALC accolade because I cannot believe it's 2021. Now I started discussing and educating folks about able accounts back in 2015. So I am a financial advisor. I work at a financial planning firm outside of Milwaukee. It's in the town of Grafton and I have been working for my firm, crescendo wealth management. It'll be seven years. This coming October, which is just crazy time, of course always flies, especially when you have kids. And you're not sure, sure what day it is and what year it is. But my focus has been on special needs, financial planning from a professional perspective because I am one of us. I have three daughters. My youngest, Emily has down syndrome. She is going to be 10 this year in April. And I was in the financial industry prior to Emily being born, not specifically as a financial advisor, but I was doing education to employees regarding saving for your 401k plan or your four Oh three B. So I was always very passionate about financial literacy and financial education and felt that no matter what your socioeconomic status was, your education folks are confused by managing investments and managing, saving, and just knowing all of the lingo of our business. And therefore, after Emily was born, I thought, okay, wait a minute. I know how to plan for families that have neuro-typical children cause I at the time to, but how does our industry help families like mine? Now I have this child who has something called a disability and is getting something called Katie Beckett and SSI S S D just the alphabet soup of our world that we live in when you're just inundated in the very beginning and therefore fast forward here I am seven years later, I really built my practice the way that I believe individuals and families need to be served from a special needs planning perspective.

Speaker 2: 3:28

You know, and I we're really grateful to have you here in Wisconsin. I do think that your parent perspective perspective is super valuable and, you know, since Emily was born, now we have this really great and flexible tool called able accounts. And I'm wondering if you can't help our listeners just understand a little bit better about what they're intended for and how they're helping families.

Speaker 3: 3:51

Sure. This is it's simple but complex in the same manner in that individuals who have a disability and who are receiving benefits through the state or federal and whether that's Medicaid. So when I mentioned Katie back at that's health insurance from a Medicaid perspective, or if it's something, when they turn 18. So I always like, instead of saying, they, I always refer to Emily, okay, so Emily's 10. And when she's 18, she will be eligible to have a monthly cash inflow. And that is called supplemental security income or SSI. And in order for her to be eligible for that, she really needs to have no money. Essentially. She has to be at the poverty level. The goal is make sure that she has the least amount of assets and really the limit is defined as she can have no more than$2,000 set aside in her name for her future in order to maintain that Medicaid. Okay. Cause she'll have been on Medicaid or to obtain the SSI. And here comes able. And 2014 was when president Obama signed able accounts into law. And the irony is I started at crescendo in October of 2014 and it occurred in December of 2014. So just the chance that I was building this at the time when Abel was there, but these five to nine able savings accounts do not count as an asset in an individual's name to impact Medicaid or SSI because that's what the, the government or the state's going to do is say, how many assets are in an individual's name? Well, this is the special account. She can have money in the able account that exceeds$2,000. And that's really the magic sauce of it. And we'll get into the details, but it's helping people realize that the old school way of doing it, Lisa is parents set aside money on their own, set it in a bank account that they know mom knows her dad knows Emily's money. Or the flip side is if a parent passes away, they just don't. They disinherit that individual with disability because there really wasn't the easiest solution from a planning perspective or maybe a lower cost solution. And the able accounts fit really well into the, and they're special in that, Hey, I can save for my child's future and she can have more money to do whatever she might need to be doing to, to improve her quality of life.

Speaker 2: 6:23

Right. I agree with you. I get excited talking about able and tax law. Isn't really excite to many people, but parents of kids with disabilities, but also adults with disabilities themselves. I mean, a lot of people would say that those limits on, you know, for eligibility for SSI or Medicaid are really outdated that, and are a disincentive to people wanting to work and earn some of their own money so that they don't have to be at a poverty level. But until those things are fixed, we have able as, as a tool that can help people kind of live the life that they want. So I'm wondering with Abel, since April has passed, what are some of the things that people can do with that able account maybe that they couldn't do before Abel was passed?

Speaker 3: 7:13

Well, really setting aside money to build up, for example, the use of an able account. So we'll get deeper into kind of how the money goes in, what the dollar months are and then how the money comes out. But the able account, think of it as an enhanced savings account. It's just kind of moving money from one bucket to another, and this bucket is protected and therefore, so I contribute to an account and the money can be taken out for let's say, summer camp. Okay. And I might not have had the funds as a parent, but I needed to set aside those funds for Emily's future needs in three or four years. And it can sit there and tell that money is needed for something that is not covered maybe by Medicaid. Okay. Because Medicaid is so stringent and that it has to be a medical necessity, right? There has all the justification that you need to be able to use to obtain something through Medicaid. Abel, the goal was to make those cuties, okay. The IRS and the government loves alphabet soup. Another thing to remember is qualified distribution expenses when all of the individuals in government and in private agencies and parents like us, Lisa, who really were the ones to get able going, they said, let's make the usage of those funds as broad as possible to improve quality of life. For example, able accounts could be used to pay for an attorney to assist with helping mom or dad or that disabled individual make sure their estate planning is up in order. I say the example of toothpaste. So Emily has a heart defect and we, that plaque and issues from a dental perspective can impact her heart and therefore toothpaste. And if there's a special toothpaste, but getting into the detail of what those qualified disability expenses are, the goal is not to be too intimidating to individuals or family members to keep them from opening the able account thinking, well, how if I get it there, how can I get it out? Right.

Speaker 2: 9:21

You know, there are, there's so much more that we could be talking about today. And I want to make sure that we give people good information. We won't be able to tell them everything, but we're going to hear from our sponsor for a few minutes, and then we'll come back and talk more about how the money gets in and comes out. So stay tuned, everybody.

Speaker 4: 9:37

This podcast episode has been brought to you by old national bank. Old national bank has been recognized by the national organization on disability as a leading disability employer. And one of the best places to work for disability, inclusion, old national fostering, a welcoming workplace where people of all abilities, backgrounds, and skills can work together to accomplish great things.

Speaker 2: 10:01

Okay. We are back with our guests, Kathleen Ober, neater Wisconsin's resident expert on able accounts. So Kathleen, uh, without confusing people, what's the kind of the one Oh one about how able accounts

Speaker 3: 10:14

Work of able accounts, somewhat similar to maybe a retirement plan, a workplace retirement plan, like a 401k plan. The ability to set aside dollars in a tax advantage way five to nine people say, what does five to nine mean? Okay. Five to nine is just a tax code. The IRS in, in our tax system. It's a tax code that Alec that allows for the ability to put money in contribute to the able account after taxes. Okay. And the best way to take away the lingo is let's say you have a child and you want to save, you want to set up an able account it, and it comes from your savings as a parent. So you've gotten paid. This is you've paid your state and your federal taxes, and you've got$500 in your savings account. And you want to transfer$200 on a monthly basis to contribute to that ABL account. That's after taxes, after you've paid your taxes, then the money grows tax deferred. Okay. So that$200 you've put$2,400 annually. Next year, that money grows from 2,400 to 3,400. The growth or the increase in that balance is not something you report on your tax return. So you don't have to pay taxes on that$1,000 gain that you had in your account. The third part of the tax advantage vehicle is that when the funds come out, when you say, I want to take a$300 distribution from the able account to pay for a new iPad for my child, that comes out tax-free, which means you never had to report that gain, nor do you have to report it when you take the money out. And that is very important because again, kind of the example I used before, parents who would set aside their money on their own to be safe and make sure that they had money when you just saved money in a savings account, that's taxable, even though yields are, or the return on your savings account is so small because interest rates are there. But over time, that grows and that's taxable. Number one, it's taxable to growth. And then number two, when the money comes out, I mean the taxes have to be paid sometimes. So this able account is the multiple tax benefit. I compare it to a Roth IRA or Roth 401k Roth, R O T H is Roth. And that is just an individual that the tax code was named effort, which I wanted to mention, because I think people can relate to this. It was really parents and there was one particular parent, his name was Stephen Beck. And unfortunately he is no longer with us today. He was a parent of two, two adult children, one had special needs and the other was neuro-typical and it was sitting around the kitchen table probably 17 years ago now where he just said, why, why can I save in a tax beneficial way for my neuro-typical daughter's future? But I can't do it for my child with special needs. And that was the whole beginning of like, wait a minute here, things shouldn't be this way. And the able accounts are actually named after Stephen Beck and able stands for achieving a better life experience.

Speaker 2: 13:34

Thank you for sharing that. I think that's a really important part of the able story that, you know, parents like you, and I'm a parent myself, like they often are the generators of the best ideas that help to, um, make life better for our families and, and people with disabilities too, are really great advocates for changes in policy that can improve life. One question that I know I get every once in a while is about that the L the age eligibility for able, can you talk just a little bit about that?

Speaker 3: 14:06

Sure. In order to be eligible, to have an able account, the disability for the disabled individual has to occur before the age of 26, originally there, wasn't going to be an age limit, however, modifications in order to get the bill passed. And Lisa, you're very familiar with all the modifications that have to occur in order for the government to swallow that they limited the age. So an individual's disability needs to occur before the age of 26. And then from an eligibility standpoint, it's a given if somebody is on Medicaid and receiving SSI or already, right? So that's, it's kind of easy to say they're eligible when you go through the enrollment process. Most state programs will say, what disability category does yours fall, but let's just say nobody has been getting public benefits. And maybe the, the clarity of the diagnosis, you can go to your medical professional. Maybe it's a psychiatrist, a general practitioner, maybe a neurologist that doctors documentation of the disability will suffice for as long as it occurred before somebody turned or the age of 26, there is legislation out there to increase that age. But right now we're still at 26. Okay. That's all good to know.

Speaker 2: 15:19

You know, you talked about the tax benefits, which is a huge, um, uh, benefit of enable account, as well as the flexibility in getting the money in and out that is much different than other, you know, a special needs trust, or some other place that you might be putting your money. Um, I think one thing too, if you could explain that account is in the person with disabilities name, but anybody can contribute to it. Can you talk a little bit about that?

Speaker 3: 15:46

Sure, sure. So unlike a traditional five to nine education savings plan, and that is for setting aside dollars dollars for neuro-typical children. So for example, I have two daughters who are neuro-typical and I save for their future education needs. And I own that account. So my husband and I are the owners of the account. My daughter, Lily, is the beneficiary of that account. Now with an able savings account, Emily, my daughter was down syndrome. She actually owns the able account. Okay. She's both the owner and the beneficiary of it, but myself as her legal guardian right now pay. So she's under the age of 18, I'm her legal guardian. I can set up the account and make decisions on her behalf. If somebody is over the age of 18, as long as they are and they need assistance. So it's maybe somebody with an intellectual disability, and they're not able to go through the process of setting that account up on their own. If a parent is a authorized legal representative, I E legal guardian, they are able to go through the process of setting up that account, managing that account, implementing that account, because that can be scary to family members. Unfortunately, we've gone from, don't give your child with a disability, any money, right? Don't let them have access to anything to now, these able accounts, you can get a debit card, like directly attached to the account. And if Emily was of age to use a debit card, she could run around with a debit card. What's really panicked parents, but just take a step back. Whoa, horsey. It is owned by the disabled individual, but legal guardian authorized legal representative, still engaged.

Speaker 2: 17:33

So, and then grandma can contribute to that. An employer can contribute to a neighbor

Speaker 3: 17:39

And anybody can make a contribution into Emily's able account. So that stabled individuals able account it's just the limitation comes the amount each year. So there is an annual contribution limit, not a limit to 50. In fact, I have a client who uses an email for birthday parties. Okay. In lieu of a gift, if you're interested in contributing to my daughter's five to nine able account, here's how you do so yes, multiple people.

Speaker 2: 18:09

Oh, I like that. That's a really great idea. Yeah. And just to address the fear around debit cards, because I, I agree with you. I mean, I think some parents are like, Oh, well my son or daughter can't make these types of decisions. They can't really, you know, learn anything about money. I don't, I don't think that's ever going to be a possibility. I mean, I think there are so many different ways to, um, help to manage that. In fact, um, you can put limits on, uh, work with your bank to put limits on how much money can come out of an account at one time and things like that. And not to mention it's good practice. I know my daughter has enabled account and she has a debit card and that's something that she uses when she goes, um, with her, you know, job support staff to like the grocery store or maybe to, um, purchase something else that she needs as long as you're keeping good receipts. Right. You can do that.

Speaker 3: 19:03

Yep. And, and, and that's a good point, Lisa keeping good receipts. So we'll get a little deeper into like, which program do you use and kind of those details. Do they offer a debit card, but most of what I'm going to call program administrators. Okay. So there's a state offers the able account, but there are companies that they have hired to really administrate administer those accounts and they're all online and they're really going to have a good, good record keeping. If you can see how advanced our banks have gotten with really identifying where you purchased a product and then kind of being able to categorize that. I don't know if you pay any attention to that, but you could, you could do food and identify your, your spending that way you could look at what's been for your auto what's bills and utilities. So yes, don't be afraid that, Oh my gosh, I can't keep track of this because especially if there's money coming in and out, pretty often, the systems are very advanced to allow that.

Speaker 2: 19:59

So what are, you know, we're not going to be able to talk about everything, but what are some other key things you think people need to know, or that you often get asked about in terms of how able works?

Speaker 3: 20:09

I think that that's important to address the fact that these are considered a state recovery accounts. And what that means is, let me give you an, I always give examples. Okay. I have a new client who reached out to me in a panic three weeks ago because her daughter was going from receiving SSI on a monthly basis to now getting social security, disability income on a monthly basis because her father had passed away. And when there is either a applying or receiving social security, or if there's a death of a parent that disabled adult moved up into a different type of income program, it's social security, disability income, and it's considered disabled adult child. Okay. Again for another podcast. But my point is her monthly income was increasing from$780 a month to$2,300 a month. Oh, wow. Boom. Right away, this happens to be an individual who also works. Right? So she was having the income. She received on a monthly basis from social security immediately put her over the$300.

Speaker 2: 21:17

Well met her choices before, where I've got to spend that money. I got to get rid of it.

Speaker 3: 21:22

Let's get it out of here. Mom helped me lift by things

Speaker 2: 21:25

Sure. By a great company,

Speaker 3: 21:28

Things you don't need. So therefore now the able account. So she caught me to panic because, Oh my gosh, I got to talk to a lawyer and I don't know what to do. And I have any having options, but I heard about you. And so I tried to calm her down to say, listen, here's an option we can do immediately. And I helped her now. She didn't have to call me. She called me because she didn't know what to do. I directed her that we've got to set up a five to nine. There's a fabulous website that I'm sure you'll put in the notes about. It's called the national disability resource center, the able national disability or the ABL, N as in Nancy R's and resource C center.org. And that's, uh, a repository for all things related to Abel. And I said, because this is her money. It cannot go into your third party, special needs trust because mom's like, well, I have a special needs trust. That's great. But this is the money for your daughter. And you can't co-mingle, you can't put the individual with a disability money with third-party money, meaning if grandma contributed to that trust. Okay. So we can't, we can't go to that trust rep. We can go to a first party, special needs trust, or we could first start by doing an able account and the able account from the time it's opened, then it becomes a state recovery. So this particular client is also receiving Medicaid, which is extremely important. Those job coaching services and the negative. And this is what I get questions is, Oh, I heard they're bad. Cause you have to pay back Medicaid. Well, you know, Medicaid provided and has provided a lot of great resources with the able account. It's not going back to when she received Medicaid 23 years ago, it's the clock starts ticking from the time the able account is opened. So that's kind of when the state is keeping track of the balance in that, in her able account, meaning when she passes away, when the owner of the able account, the individual with the disability passes away first, the money needs to go back to the state for what they are owed for the time period. The able account was open. Okay. If there's extra money left over, then that can pass to a family member with a disability. Tax-free if there's no family member with a disability and it needs to be passed on to family, that becomes a not tax-free distribution. There's a small penalty for that, but it's not as if the money goes away. Okay. The able account, it would still be there, but Medicaid, it's a state recovery, just like a first party, special needs trust is,

Speaker 2: 24:07

You know, um, yeah, I do think that's an important point for people to know about Abel. And it's just part of the way the law was written. And I, and I, sometimes I will, when people call me about this, I sometimes say this, and I'm curious if you agree like Abel, because it is a flexible tool is something that you might consider. Um, even though it has, what's the upward limit on able that the total lifetime limit that you can, well,

Speaker 3: 24:36

If you're on, if you're receiving supplemental security income SSI, the most, it is a hundred thousand dollars. Okay. But like in this example, she's not getting us as long as she's getting SSD. So it goes to the state limit, the aggregate limit for five 29 accounts, which last time I checked, it was like$450,000 for Wisconsin.

Speaker 2: 24:55

And that a hundred thousand limit is, um, just when it starts impacting your, um,

Speaker 3: 25:02

SSMI your monthly income from SSI, not Medicaid, right? Medicaid.

Speaker 2: 25:08

Well, it doesn't kick you out of those programs. It's just you,

Speaker 3: 25:12

Right, dude, you don't have to read reply. It just it's a suspension. So you've got to watch that limit. Now, the first accounts opened in 2016, believe it. Now we're five years. This summer, it will be five years, but 15 times five, we still are not yet to a point where that limit has been reached. Okay. So it's eerie, but we'll start to see that being impacted. Now, at least at one point I wanted to make another question I get is, well, my child works and they love their job, but they can only work so many hours a week because they can only earn a certain amount of money each year. Oh, how I wish the able accounts solved that income problem, right? It doesn't, it does not the only benefit where income is impacted by utilizing the able account is something called able to work in 2018. Some enhancements were made if an individual is employed and has earned income, okay. SSI S S D I, those are all considered unearned income, but when you have a job and my client, who's got a job at Chili's and he's working, that's earned income, the amount let's say he earns$5,000 a year while he or anybody else, his contributions in his able account could be 15,000 plus an additional 5,000 because that's$5,000 of earned income does not mean he has to take his paycheck and put it all into the able account. But because there's$5,000 of her income, that maximum gets increased and they're called general contributions and then work contribution,

Speaker 2: 26:47

Which is better, a better choice for him to put it there, to accrue interest in growth than it would be to put it in a regular old savings account. Right?

Speaker 3: 26:56

Absolutely. The able account is twofold. Okay. I think it's a little confusing that they're called Abe or savings accounts because they are savings and that you could put the money in an seat back to savings account, but you can also invest that money. So they are investment accounts to, depending on what your purpose is. And Lisa, you were going to go down the road. I think of how able accounts are a good vehicle. If you're going to be putting money in and taking money out, you're kind of using it a little bit more. Yes. Because at first, any time you get a trust involved, there needs to be a trustee, right? So there's somebody else now the able account, again, don't panic parents. That's the disabled account owners account. They could take money when they want to. They don't have to go through a trustee and do a request for distribution in certain cases. That's great. Like your daughter, if she, she doesn't always have to ask mom for money, right? It's, it's promoting independence, financial literacy. And so that able account is really multifaceted and when it could fit and sometimes you need all three, you need the special supplement most well. I'll tell you this, the foundation is you need to trust. Okay. The able account is to work in collaboration with the trust, not one or the other. And I know attorneys got a little nervous years ago, there was going to replace our value in doing trust documents. Absolutely not. If you're using it appropriately, you're going to have the foundation being that special needs trust the third party. And in this example, if there's first party money, that accidentally happens. So let's say grandma out East that you didn't even know was going to give my daughter$50,000. And instead of giving it to her trust, it went right to Emily. Well, that's okay. We just have to put it in that first party trust to make sure that you still don't get your benefits taken away.

Speaker 2: 28:51

Right. Right. Uh, there is so much information. So w um, you mentioned back to Emily and your family, you mentioned toothpaste, but I'm assuming you have other kind of dreams and things that you're saving for, for Emily's future, that enable account is a good tool for what, what does that look like for your family?

Speaker 3: 29:13

Yeah. Well, it's hard to take the financial advisor out of a mom. Okay. It's hard for me to like, put my different hat on, but really I'm using this as a, as an accumulation, a savings vehicle. Okay. I'm putting money in, on a monthly basis and not planning to take anything out unless something bad occurs where I don't have any funds to maybe send her to camp. And maybe the waiver doesn't do that. But the goal just like her sisters is to be setting dollars for whatever her future may be at 18. Maybe it's post-secondary education. Maybe it's going right into the workforce and looking at housing, right. That there's so many opportunities for Emily. And my big joke is she's not going to want to live with us anyways. So we really need to plan for that. And maybe that is buying a condo and she's got three roommates, but it's truly an accumulation vehicle for helping supplement what public benefits won't provide for her to, let's say her sister lives in California and she needs to be a bridesmaid in a wedding, and she's got to fly out there and get a bridesmaid's dress. She's gonna, she's gonna need some extra money. And maybe she's only able to work 10 or 15 hours a week and can't earn enough. So those are the types of things, really planning for a future that I always say kind of the sky's the limit.

Speaker 2: 30:31

Yeah. And I think Abel couldn't have come at a better time because there are more post-secondary school options for young adults with intellectual disabilities. And, you know, families should be thinking about post-secondary education opportunities for their sons and daughters with disabilities and able can really help, you know, because public benefits, aren't going to pay for tuition, um, public benefits. Aren't going to pay to buy that condo. They'll pay for supports to, for somebody to maybe get what they need to live there, but they're not going to pay the mortgage. Right.

Speaker 3: 31:04

Right. Right. Yeah. And, and it's, it's similar to what I say to my younger clients who just are neuro-typical and their planning for their future. Do you believe social security in general will be there when you retire 40 years from now? And some people will say, you know what? I don't want to plan for that. Okay. So let's take that out of the equation. You've got a supplement that there is that fear. We don't know what the future holds. We really hope that the Medicaid benefits continue in the SSI and the SSD, but it really is parent's responsibility to be thinking just like they would maybe save for one of their neuro-typical children. You do have to think that you've got to set aside some funds for their future, whatever it may be, maybe it's post-secondary education. Maybe it's just having enough care providers and the care providers you really want there for your child versus the ones that you're limited to within it, within a program,

Speaker 2: 31:55

Right. Things that you can private pay for with able money to get the sort of quality or thing that you are hoping to find. So do you ha do you have some coolest success stories? Have you heard of people doing some really neat things with their able monies?

Speaker 3: 32:10

Well, for my clients, sometimes it's been a safeguard. It's been, Oh my gosh, there's too much money in this account. They're going to lose their benefits. And we don't want to spend them down. My younger, I love not that I don't love all of my clients, but I'm very successful in getting families to hire me when it's an adult child. Okay. When that child is transitioning from 17 to 20, because that's when their pressure points and you can't run away from those pressure points, but I've been able to also get parents who have younger children with a disability and to be thinking, because really time, the time value of money and so powerful. So families with younger children with intellectual disabilities, whether it's down syndrome autism, maybe it's physical disabilities with spina bifida, or cerebral palsy, getting them to think, look at all of the things your child could benefit from in the future. Let me help you understand why you need to be setting aside funds and let's look at the options to do so. Boom enable account. The other thing about enable account, you don't need me. Okay. I like to think I'm important. And I'm a financial advisor. You do not need to work with a financial professional to set up an able account. This national resource center is amazing. There are webinar webinars you can listen to for hours frequently asked questions. You can do compare the state program. There's so much great information for individuals, whether it's the disabled individual themselves, they do have advocates on that website. So talking about an individual who was blind and used it as a way to save for retirement because he was getting Medicaid. And didn't, couldn't save Eve as an attorney and worked in a law firm, but he couldn't have a 401k. So that able account became his way to save for his future because he's not going to work forever, just like neuro-typical people. So there are some really great reasons that the able account provides a solution to something when parents struggled so much, and we're doing hiding, hiding money and living in fear that, gosh, they've got to live in poverty, or we've got to spend down money, right.

Speaker 2: 34:19

That you'll make a mistake and in-house screw up your child's dis uh, you know, payments or eligibility. Yeah. Um, so you met, you've mentioned the able national resource website, and I will put that in the show notes. I also agree it's probably the best resource out there. I'm just going to give people the website name really quickly. Uh, like Kathleen said a, B L E N R c.org. So Abel and R c.org, Kathleen, where, where else, like how, how else would you advise, advise that people get started? What should they do next after they stop listening to this podcast and write a really awesome review? What are they going to do next?

Speaker 3: 35:02

Of course, they've got to get that review written because these podcasts need to continue. So, so important. Well, it's, it's really taking a look at, have you, as a parent thought about quote, unquote planning for your child with special needs, okay, whatever age they might be. It's parents come to me and say, I'm worried about when I'm no longer here, my husband and I, or myself, and what who's going to quote unquote, take care of my child. And so then this thinking about able accounts starts opening up the thought process of maybe there are things I need to put place. Maybe we set up a trust 15 years ago, and we haven't even thought about it yet. Maybe my child is working and I haven't even considered teaching them the concept that we could maybe put their money into this account. And it could actually be their money that they could go online and access. So it's starting to say to yourself, what are you as a parent or parents doing to as best as you can plan life. Doesn't go according to plan and planning can be a bit of a misnomer, but educate yourself and get to a comfort level where you don't have that fear of when I'm gone, what's going to happen. Whether it's the financial or the social, I always say parents want their children to be financially stable, but they also want their children to have a good quality of life. They want friends, they want employment. They want social. And as you know, raising that child into adulthood, you have to be a part of that process, even if they're 45 years old. Right. And that can be challenging if you're gone. And you're the one doing the annual renewal for Medicaid, but you know, a sibling is going to be taking things over, start having those conversations with that sibling about, Hey, when I'm gone, you've got to get an idea of what I do on a day-to-day basis for, for our child for years, sister. And don't be intimidated by it. The arc has that amazing future planning on your website, just going to the website and just educating yourself and doing small doses, whatever makes you feel comfortable, because anything related to money can be very can cause anxiety. But the resources through the arc, through the national resource center, my website, I've done recorded webinars that are out there on the website. I did a couple of webinars for the down syndrome association of Wisconsin that you can log in and get those recorded webinars. I'm doing a live webinar to Wednesday night for parents United, which within the Milwaukee areas and association of school districts. So there's good information out there. You just need to do a little digging in and you've got to kind of make that a priority.

Speaker 2: 37:39

That is such great advice. Kathleen. I know that people are going to want to hear from you more so how can people get ahold of you?

Speaker 3: 37:46

Sure you can visit me@crescendowealthmanagement.com. So my firm name is crescendo wealth management, www.crescendowm.com. Feel free to reach out by sending an email to info@crescendowm.com. I do complimentary introductory meetings. I've got one at four o'clock today, a parent called and has some concerns, just a quick meeting for me to help them understand how I deliver my services. I can understand what their needs are. Sometimes those people become clients. Sometimes I'm just a good connector, right? I might say, you know what? You just need to go to the arc, the arc and look at future planning, or you need to go to the April national resource center, or you need to go to your case manager. I'm a connector, but of course I'm always there for people who need true professional advice and want and want somebody

Speaker 2: 38:36

To hold their hand through the whole process. Sure. I'll thank you so much, Kathleen. I'll make sure I put all your contact information into the, the notes that people have that website in that email address, but thank you so much for joining us today. Oh my pleasure. Thanks for having me, Lisa. All right. And thank you to our listeners for listening to this episode of the arc experience podcast. Be sure to check out the show notes from today for more information, and also please leave us a review and share this episode with somebody else who you think might be interested. Join us next time.

Speaker 1: 39:11

Today's episode of the art experience was brought to you by the arc Wisconsin, the state's oldest advocacy organization for people with intellectual developmental disabilities and their families it's funded in part by the Wisconsin board for people with developmental disabilities. Our theme music called species is the property of[inaudible] and cannot be copied or distributed without permission. It was produced by Eleanor Cheetham, the composer and artist with autism.