From Toxic Traits to True Masculinity (w/ Melissa Von Musser)

What does it mean to be a man in the 21st century? Join us on Wealthy AF as we welcome Melissa Von Musser, an expert in gender dynamics and societal norms, to unpack this complicated question. This episode promises to unravel the nuanced impact of societal movements like Me Too and feminism on modern masculinity. Melissa shares her compelling insights on the importance of emotional honesty, empathy, and self-respect, offering a comprehensive guide for men to navigate changing gender roles while maintaining their integrity.

We don't shy away from the tough topics. From the alarming rise in emotional suppression leading to rage and suicide to the cultural portrayal of toxic masculinity, Melissa and I dive deep into the pressures young men face today. We discuss the importance of fostering self-care, accountability, and reclaiming traditional gender roles, while also dissecting the divisive nature of societal norms that often vilify masculine traits. Melissa offers practical strategies for men to find balance, reconnect with their authentic selves, and seek out positive role models.

The journey doesn't stop there. We explore the intricate dance between masculine and feminine energies in relationships, emphasizing the need for mutual trust and respect. Melissa sheds light on how traditional gender roles can contribute to personal well-being and healthier relationships, helping men—and women—understand their true natures. From personal anecdotes to cultural critiques, this episode is packed with valuable advice and thought-provoking discussions that will leave you with a deeper understanding of healthy masculinity in today's world. Don't miss out on this enlightening conversation with Melissa Von Musser.

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Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:29

This is Wealthy AF your ultimate guide to understand what it truly means to be Wealthy AF. Today's guest is Melissa von Muser. And. Melissa was raised in the shadow of addiction by alcoholic parents. Melissa's journey took her through the heartbreak of two marriages torn apart by betrayal. Yet from these trials she forged a path of healing and empowerment, not just for herself, but for countless others across the globe. Now a certified master coach, previously a platinum coach for the Tony Robbins organization, and your guide to transformative journey, with over two decades of experience, 50,000 hours of training, melissa specializes in healing relationships, uncovering your true purpose and navigating the complex path of betrayal and trauma. And today's topic that Melissa and I will be discussing is masculinity in today's society. Melissa, welcome to the podcast. I am so excited to have this conversation with you, me too, I'm really excited.

Speaker 2: 1:38

It's a topic that's close to my heart, so I'm excited.

Speaker 1: 1:41

We were talking a little bit off air. You know I'm a big Tony guy as well. I'm big in the community, the Tony community, and so I'm glad to have you on, because you know we're a tribe, that's right. So tell me, what does it mean to be masculine in the 21st century, and how does this definition change over time?

Speaker 2: 2:07

Well, we're in such a strange time in society as men for men and I work a lot with men because I have two boys, one's 42 and one's 31. So I'm very much in touch with what's taking place for you guys out there. They've made it wrong. They've given it labels. The Me Too movement really did Granted, they did eliminate some of the things that needed to change societally, but at the same time, they did it at the divine masculine, because I believe God designed us to have both. So my current belief is that healthy masculine right now they're struggling to define it. It's been ripped out as far as what's good and what's not good, and so I think that to find a healthy man right now, to have a healthy masculine man, they're struggling to even identify what it is.

Speaker 2: 3:13

So the way I look at it is are they emotionally aware? Is a healthy male emotionally aware? Does he have the ability to be empathetic and compassionate for those around him, for his family, for those that are struggling? Does he have mutual respect with people around him? I don't know about you, but do you remember the days when the golden rule was part of the driving force behind us? Do unto others as you would have them do unto you. That's gone. That's completely eradicated from society right now, and as a result, we're not seeing and treating each other with mutual respect. There's also a thing around integrity. To be a man of integrity is now also a question mark. What is it to have integrity? What's it mean? It's murky. All the lines have gotten blurred, and then, if we add into that any of the gender conversation around it, it's just gotten completely destroyed as to the clear line of sight on what a healthy male looks like.

Speaker 1: 4:10

In my opinion, yeah, girl, talk about this, right? I'm so glad that we're having this conversation, because young men I see them all over on the internet they are struggling with this, and so I think that the feminist movement has a lot to do with this situation.

Speaker 1: 4:31

It the, the feminist movement, you know, and I want to remind women that the feminist movement started for equal, but equal equality for women was for women to vote and be able to work. That was all women wanted. And it's turned into this craziness now that it's like it's lost sight of what it really, what it was. Now it's about bashing men and all of this stuff. So I feel for young men. Young men have it really, really hard because, especially when you you're young, you're 15, 16, in your early 20s you don't know who you are yet you're trying to navigate and now society is telling you no, it's okay for you to be this way and it's not inside of us. It's not okay for a man to say these days, I want to provide and I want to protect my family and I want my wife to stay home and I want my wife to raise the children. It's not like it's wrong, like it's frowned upon in some circles and I'm like what is happening? In your opinion, what is the definition of a healthy masculine man?

Speaker 2: 5:36

Well, I think a healthy masculine man is someone that they have emotional honesty for themselves and with others, so they're in touch with how they feel, they know what they feel, and right now, a lot of men are afraid to emote, they're afraid to get connected to any form of emotion. So what you're witness to is a lot of men are afraid to emote, they're afraid to get connected to any form of emotion. So what you're witness to is a lot of rage. That's the only thing they're accessing is rage, because they don't have an EQ. Their EQ is so low and all of their emotions have been made wrong. So if they were raised by parents who taught them hey, big boys, don't cry, they learn to manage and stifle emotion them hey, big boys, don't cry, they learn to manage and stifle emotion Then the only way that that can go is through they have to have a release valve and typically it goes into rage or it goes into suicide, self-destruction, and that's why I believe we've seen such an increase in the amount of young men that are killing themselves. There's nowhere for them to go. They're backed into a corner.

Speaker 2: 6:31

So for me, a healthy male would be someone that has they really focus on how to build emotional honesty within themselves and then with others, and how can they express it in a good way. Empathy how do they feel about what's going on around them and around what's affecting others? Do they have that we talked about a little or just a few minutes ago, what's their self-respect and what's their respect for the world around them? And then it goes back to that integrity and accountability. I have the benefit of working with a program right now out of Utah. I've helped facilitate a lot of it. It's called we Are the they, and it's a men's mastermind and the whole intention is to help and assist men to, to reaccess their true identity as a healthy male, healthy masculinity, because there's toxic masculinity to do.

Speaker 1: 7:21

There is.

Speaker 2: 7:22

And there's toxic femininity.

Speaker 1: 7:23

And I want us to talk about that. I want you to contrast that, too, in a minute. But finish your thought, because I need you to.

Speaker 2: 7:29

Identify those what they are.

Speaker 1: 7:30

Let's give clear definition so that the young men and men listening can understand. Okay, that's what they mean. That's what true toxic masculinity means, and this is what it doesn't mean. So go ahead, I'm sorry.

Speaker 2: 7:43

No, that's okay, and there's a jump in because I'll get on a roll and I'll just keep going. You just interrupt me whenever you need. It's a really challenging time right now. For example, my younger son. He's in his 30s and in the last four years he's been spit on, he's been called a misogynist, he's been called a white privileged pig, he has been told that he deserves to die.

Speaker 2: 8:09

And in the state of that conversation, and now we're talking about a good looking, bright, hardworking kid who's getting nailed and beat up on by women, young women in his age bracket. And so when you're talking to someone like that, they don't even know how to mitigate that energy. They don't know the right way to address those attacks. So how are we encouraging them to get healthy self-care, self-integrity? How do they hold themselves accountable? How do they take care of themselves emotionally? How do they nurture the relationships that matter most to them? How do they have a growth mindset? Are they thinking? And how are they growing in their ability to think and produce and add value to the planet around them?

Speaker 2: 8:53

And then are they living authentically? Are they growing in their ability to think and produce and add value to the planet around them? And then, are they living authentically? Are they living someone else's message? All of those things undermine the healthy masculine. You can see there's so much uncertainty there, and so if we talk about the six human needs you know Tony talks about that and getting hammered in all aspects, and so there's a lot of it's a disservice to humanity. Right now is what's happened? We have lost the power to connect to the divine masculine, which is what men are created for, and, as a result, you're watching the collapse of society. That's what I see.

Speaker 1: 9:29

I agree. I agree. I love that you said that there's so much to unpack there. I want to go to my original question so that we can help men, young men, identify the difference with what toxic masculinity looks like. You know, some time ago I'm going to say maybe two or three years ago, okay, there was a post and maybe you've seen it roaming around there was a Calvin Klein post on. There was a Calvin Klein post. You know the brand, calvin Klein.

Speaker 2: 10:00

Right.

Speaker 1: 10:01

And in the nineties they had this picture of this model in the nineties with this girl. Two models right, they're modeling, and the guy was fit, strong, tall. Right, they're modeling, and the guy was fit, strong, tall, and that was the the image that calvin klein was portraying of a man at that time and then next to it I think it was 2020 or 2021 was a post of a man that you know, this is no shade to the community, right, that was.

Speaker 1: 10:33

I know you couldn't tell if it was a man or a woman. That was being portrayed as a. As a man Um, it was. He was kind of overweight and not looking, didn't look sharp, he just he just was was very confusing Right, was very confusing right. It looked almost like a man with a female, but it was clear, the emasculating men, clear in the contrast. And the post said something like men and Calvin Klein, what men was in the 90s versus 2020 or 2021.

Speaker 1: 11:11

And I posted this post because I agreed like, yeah, man, we have lost our ways. Guys, you, you need to wear a suit. You need to know when to wear a suit. It's okay to to look sharp. It's okay, right. So it's okay to to say, uh, you want to protect your family. It's okay to to stand for something. It's okay to say, no, I want my wife to be my children's mom and raise my children. It's okay for you to say that, and no one should guilt you for standing for something. That's part of being a man. That's right.

Speaker 1: 11:45

And I got so much shit online for, for, for posting this. How dare that's's? Yeah, how dare you? That's toxic masculinity.

Speaker 1: 11:56

I'm like, listen, and this is a woman telling me this toxic masculinity. I'm like, lady, like I'm 40 years old dude. Like, are you seriously? You are gonna you kid, you're a kid. You're gonna tell me what a man is like. Like, get the hell out of here. You are not gonna tell me what a man feels, what a man is like. Like, get the hell out of here. You are not going to tell me what a man feels, what a man thinks, how a man is supposed to get. Like I'm. How would she know? Yeah, how would she know? And I'm a grown-ass man, I'm a girl. She's calling me toxic. I've been mad at that point.

Speaker 1: 12:25

I was married for like 18 years, right, I got four kids, successfully, happily, successful man, like, what are you talking about? Ask my wife if I'm toxic. Why don't you go ask her how happy she is? Right, that's right. Like, like, like she's the only one that can gauge me in that area, not some stranger, because I of my belief system or what I'm putting what I think is a man in. So I just feel bad for young men that don't have that right or don't have men around them like that that can tell them like hey, man, you stand for something. This is what a man is. A man stands for something. A man has a set of values he lives by. Integrity is one of my top ones, right that's. You mentioned integrity. That's for me. I think that's that's huge. For a man to have integrity to do what he says and says what he does, and um, but again, I got a lot of shit for that and I was like there's toxic femininity too. What you're doing is toxic right now but they're got.

Speaker 2: 13:22

they get a pass. There's a pass for that. And that's the part that's so upsetting to me and that's why we are. The day is getting ahead of steam. We have over. We have five groups of 50 men. Each group is its own 50 pod and they do highly masculine things. They go dive with sharks, jump out of planes I mean, they did ran with the bulls of Petalona but they do that to re-engage and reconnect to what they're created for, and that masculinity is.

Speaker 2: 13:52

It needs to be in the space.

Speaker 2: 13:53

Without it, we become paralyzed as a society and we will atrophy and die, and that's where we're on the cusp of that right now. And so the feminine movement, the feminist movement, although it had great intentions in the beginning, has gotten so far over on the pendulum that they are so out of control, they are becoming so masculine that we are going to lose polarity and the ability to create a species to keep us going. That's where we're at, and so I think that, from a standpoint of being a man, it's learning and getting clear. So you kind of asked me what do they need to do? Well, first, I think they need to identify and understand what is toxic masculinity for them. They need to do the research. Don't take it off some TV show or some pushback from some woman who gets in your face because she thinks she's got no free reign to judge you, because I don't believe that's fair, I think that's really bad. And so, in the space of that, they have to identify what it is. They need to get clear on what the myths are.

Speaker 1: 15:03

If you want, I'll run through some of those if that helps, yeah, let's go through some of those.

Speaker 2: 15:07

Right. These are some of the myths I believe men in society have been hit with in a really big way that confuses their identity. The first one is real men don't cry. One of the things we've been witness to in the group that we've been working with, with the men's group, is that so many men are taught they should not cry and, as a result, because they've been taught it's a sign of weakness, they do not learn to process emotions, so they stifle it, it hides and sits in their body and it shows up in a lot of unhealthy traits. The second thing is masculinity. This is a myth.

Speaker 2: 15:41

Masculinity equals dominance. That's not true. That's toxic masculinity. If you are dominating, if you are making someone sit under your thumb, if you're thinking for them and making them have to ask you permission to do everything, that to me, is toxic. We're responsible, right, aren't we responsible for our own actions and how we show up. So it never works well for a man to push me into a corner because I kick back. But that's dominance. Now, true masculinity, healthy masculinity, is about balance and respect. It's about building a relationship with another human being where we can agree to disagree. It's not about control and power. It's about mutual respect, and if you don't have that, if you're in a need to control another human being, you need to check that and ask why. Where's it coming from? It's usually a learned behavior or it's out of fear.

Speaker 1: 16:37

It's interesting to say that my wife and I were watching a movie, a Lifetime movie. I don't know if you're familiar with Lifetime movies. They're pretty cool. We used to be addicted to those things when we were younger and we started watching. We were watching a Lifetime movie, which most of them are true stories.

Speaker 2: 16:52

I know they're pretty fascinating.

Speaker 1: 16:53

They're pretty cool, and this particular movie was about how I ran away was the title or something like that, or how I got away and it was about a woman that was with a like he is. That man on that movie was the perfect example of a toxic masculine dude. Right, guy, manipulated, she couldn't talk to men. The guy, the guy yeah, the lady was an artist. She got her opportunity to put her art and sell her art at some gallery and when he went there, the guy that was hosting the gallery was congratulating her your stuff is selling.

Speaker 1: 17:31

And the man made a whole big scene and my wife and I were like we're watching this thing and we're both getting aggravated, we're both getting upset. And she's like he's not doing that to me and I'm like man, dude, you don't, why are you? I'm talking to the TV Like dude, like that's freaking, like stop bro, like why are you doing that? Be supporting her and being there for her and you're supposed to be her friend and partner and encouraging her success and being there for her. That's what a man does is secure with himself. I'm not concerned that my wife is. You know, I'm here to support her and be there for her and encourage her. Right? That's right, because I'm confident enough You're supposed to be confident enough within yourself and who you are and what you stand for, that your wife. You're not competing with your wife or your spouse.

Speaker 1: 18:18

It's a partnership, you're blocking her to win yes.

Speaker 2: 18:20

It's a partnership.

Speaker 2: 18:22

Now, some and you know because you're in a marriage, you've been in a long-standing marriage there are times when your wife's going to soar and you're going to be down here and you're going to go okay, baby, go, Let me see how I can help happen, and then the change and she's going to do the same for you.

Speaker 2: 18:40

But nay, in society we've got this weird belief that's rolling around out there. There's two extremes. They're either so passive their wives are in charge, their wives are making the dominant choices, they're the ones that are controlling the narrative or they're so dominant, their wife can barely make a thought on her own. And so we have to eliminate those polar extremes. And, coming back into, when you come into your authentic identity, you have a better capacity to navigate that relationship with another human in a much better way, Because I think both of those polar opposites come from fear and mismanaged emotion, and so when we get healthy, we can have that engagement. That's a really great way, you know, to be in the balance and it's not going to be perfect, but we need that balance.

Speaker 1: 19:22

We absolutely do. I want you to talk from a woman's perspective. Now, you as a woman. I want I want the men to hear this right, what? How does a woman feel this? Right? How does a woman feel Really real talk. Right, let's be, let's just have real talk. Some guys don't. I want guys to hear this how does a woman feel when she's constantly in her mask? She's acting as that woman, making all of the decisions, driving the this and you're going to do that and we're going to do this, and we're going driving the this and you're going to do that and we're going to do this and we're going to do that and we're going to do that. And constantly, she's the main breadwinner and she's the one that's calling all the shots which she's acting in her masculine. How does a woman truly, truly feel? So that's one, and then the other thing is do women truly find that attractive the guy that just sits back and lets her ride? Please speak to the men, to this, please.

Speaker 2: 21:41

As a woman, one of the least attractive things in a man is passivity, for two reasons. One I don't think men recognize this, but in the spirit, in the nature of evolution, women are prey and it's like when you nature of evolution women are prey and it's like when you look at us we're prey when you come up against a male. It's very rare a woman can beat or dominate a man. Now, if she has special skills or a really great gun changes the narrative, but on her own we are prey. And so when there's a weak man, when a man does not take charge, when a man goes, when he hides, when he backs up and he lets her do it because he doesn't want the conflict, whatever his reason is One it is unsexy. As F man, there is nothing unsexier and repulsive to a woman than a passive, weak, soy boy male. Nothing is worse in my opinion. That's why women choose the bad guys, the bad boys. That's why they're appealing, because they have that nature, that ability to keep me safe. When you're passive, when you are weak, when you do not own your authentic masculine, I do not feel safe and I do not trust that you're going to take care of something. So I go into survival mode and I start doing it for myself.

Speaker 2: 23:01

Now, when I have to step into my masculine, it is exhausting, it is aggravating. It is and I can say that because I have had to be in my masculine a lot growing up and, as a result, I had a disconnect from my true divine feminine. And so there's a struggle in me to show up the way I want to show up in the absence of the healthy masculine. And so I have to move into a position I don't want to be in. But someone has to take charge, someone has to pay the bills, someone has to take care of the kids, whatever that is. But it is repulsive, it is aggravating, it makes me resent a passive male. I get very resentful and then also pushes me into an identity I don't want to be in. But somebody has to do it. And so I believe the way God designed it, the way that it's divinely created, is for both of us to own our strength.

Speaker 2: 23:59

Some women are strong, they are good providers, but the thing is is that if they want to step back, to be home with their kids, there shouldn't be a make wrong there. That doesn't mean she's weak, it doesn't mean that she's, you know, and there's a lot of mislabels on feminine, divine feminine. If I go to work, that doesn't mean I'm in my masculine, just so everybody knows you, to get a result. It's when I shame you, it's when I rub your nose in it, when I undermine you. That's toxic femininity, it's growth, really unattractive.

Speaker 1: 24:39

It's extremely unattractive for men.

Speaker 2: 24:42

It's really bad, it's disgusting, but it's the same for me as with you, if you are a weak male, so we both have that right.

Speaker 1: 25:14

The question is what's mine to own as a woman? It is mine to own to navigate and try and achieve my femininity as much as I can in a safe space with a healthy male. Now, if I don't have unattractive for a woman to have a man that's not making decisions as that dominant, I want to. I want to share a quick story with you of where I observed this not too long ago with my wife. What you were talking about prey and women being a prey, and when she's with a masculine man, that's in his masculine energy. They feel safe, women feel safe and she could be in her feminine energy.

Speaker 1: 25:39

So we were going, we were pulling into a CVS, we were picking something up I don't remember, and we were pulling into CVS and this guy comes and cuts in front of me and he looked like he was almost going to hit me. You know he was pulling into park and he just parked and I was like this guy, she kind of got pissed off, right, like babe, whatever. So we come out the car but I noticed something in her Right. We come, we all, all three of us come out the car and she's charging Right, so she's ahead of me In a role man she's hot Right, just kind of puffing her chest out Like and I'm like this little lady.

Speaker 1: 26:23

She knows I'm not going to let anything. She's five foot three. She knows I'm not going to let anything happen to her Right.

Speaker 1: 26:29

She knows I'm not going to let it go Right and she's like, oh, you know all loud and shit and I'm like, yeah, her Right, like that's her being in her feminine, feeling safe, that she knows that she's protected. She knows she knows without a doubt, that I will not let absolutely anything happen to her while she's with me. I will, I will get in front of it before anything happens to her. That's right. That's an example of of a woman feeling safe and secure when her man she knows she's got a man that's masculine, that's taking the lead in the role. I just that was an observation. I got home and I was meditating and I was like, yeah, I was like she did it unconsciously too.

Speaker 2: 27:10

Yeah, we do, it's our nature. It's our nature. And if we don't cultivate, if we don't, if we don't stay connected to it, then the nature of society wins. And right now the nature of society wins. And right now the nature of society is toxic.

Speaker 2: 27:25

The nature of society right now is to pit us against each other. They're pitting men against women, they're challenging in women's sports, they're putting men in the sports. That is, it's beyond. It is absolute insanity. And they're doing it to divide us, because when they divide us, they conquer. And so they've done that with gender. They've done that with our divine natures of masculine versus feminine. They've made us both wrong, on both sides. They've vilified us everywhere. No, they've made fun of toxic women and now we're toxic masculinity. It's all there, our toxic masculinity, it's all there.

Speaker 2: 28:05

But the only way we can get our country and our society back is to own who we are, is to get back into the true nature of what we were created to be and to do, and I think that's what's missing for our men. They don't know how to do that. We've robbed them of it and now we've made finding it wrong, so they're completely confused. If I show up in my masculine, somebody's going to get my face and say I'm toxic. If I stand up for a woman, another woman will come up and accuse him of being a misogynist. And so we've lost the ability for people to know and understand what it is to be in our healthy masculine or feminine. We've gotten so distorted we don't even know what it looks like.

Speaker 1: 28:48

Let's give some men some strategies here, because you're an elite coach, right, You're top to top right. You work with TR, with the platinum partners, with the best right, the best coaching, and I vouch for this. She's Tony Robbins coach, a platinum partner coach. She's the best of the best. She's been taught by the best. Let's talk about giving men some good strategies here. Let's give some men some good strategies. So what are some of the advice that we can give men that are like okay, I want to get in my masculine. How do I find that? How do I? Am I healthy masculine? What can I do to get connected with that? How do I do that?

Speaker 2: 29:36

So, from a coaching perspective, my first thing is we need to ask better questions in order to get better answers. That's just the rule of thumb. So if I want to find a better way, I need to ask a better question. So the first question is what is healthy masculine? They need to learn to do the research for themselves. So they're going to start with self-reflection and being aware of their own belief and behavior. So step one what do I believe and what do my behaviors support? So you want to look at where my influence is it positive or is it negative? In order to connect with my partner or with someone else, do I do it through being dominant or do I do it through being equal partner in a state of neutrality, or do I go passive? So typically, when we communicate, there are about three positions in communication one superior, one's neutral and one's inferior, and the goal to have healthy communication is to try and do it from a position of neutrality. So what is that for them? They need to know their baseline and one of the biggest tools that will help them and this is going to sound weird to a lot of guys out there, but they still can't tell you how valuable it is Start journaling, Start asking questions and writing it down. Get out of your head and start getting it on paper. Now, one of the things we have men do with our group with we Are the they. One of their first exercises is they need to write a badass list. Now, the badass list isn't about all the ways they're an asshole. The badass list is all the ways they've won in their life. Where have you done something amazing? It could have been fifth grade. You kicked the winning goal in soccer and it was a huge life moment for you. Maybe it was the first time your dad saw you win and he was cheering on the sidelines, but it had impact. Write it down Graduating high school. Maybe you got the 4.0, maybe you kicked the winning field goal in football Anything that you have in your life that is a remembrance or a way to identify something you've done right. So create your badass list. This is all your social proof. You're doing the right things. Okay, that's the first thing I would do.

Speaker 2: 31:48

The second thing is you need to educate yourself, and I know that sounds lame, but right now there's too much noise in the space. You need to get clear on what it is to be a healthy male and I have some book references I can make for that. The first one might be the Way of the Superior man by David Dida. If you're out there and you haven't read anything on what it is to be a healthy male, start there. The Way of the Superior man by David Dida Fantastic book on what it is to be a healthy male, how to know what the rules are to be in your healthy masculine. It also tells you how to navigate women, and a lot of you out there you don't know what that looks like because it's so all over the place. It'll help you identify what a healthy woman looks like, and you need to know that too, because we don't know what that looks like either.

Speaker 2: 32:38

So the second thing is educate yourself. Then you want to find role models and mentors. Tony talks about this a lot For a lot of males out there, and especially because of the breakdown in society of the family unit. If you didn't have a healthy example as a dad, or you didn't even have a dad, then find a mentor or someone you can model after. Tony talks about this at a really high level and it's all about finding someone who embodies the healthy masculine. Might be a grandfather, it could be a teacher, it could even be a character on TV, but the question goes back to what would they do? So you think about the what would Jesus do? You know, what would Jesus do? Bracelet it's what would this guy do to be a healthy male, to be a man you want to model after, who exemplifies the care qualities, the pure qualities of a good dude? Who is he and what does he do?

Speaker 1: 33:35

Yeah, there's a great book also by Jordan Peterson I would recommend. It's a 12 Rules for Life great book for men, because it really gives you structure, it gives you some value system, it gives you some great. I haven't read the Way of the Superior man, I don't know why. I've heard of the book before, but I'm adding that one to my list. Let's talk about finding a mentor, right, so I could tell you, as a Latino man, right, latino man there, latino man, there is some toxicity in the Latino culture as what it looks like to be a healthy man, right, healthy masculine. What if there's a young man listening to us right now and and they're like, okay, you talk about finding a mentor. How do I find that? Right? Where do I find a mentor?

Speaker 2: 34:30

where do you look?

Speaker 1: 34:31

where do I look? How do I find a mentor like that? I, I, everyone around me is a, it's a womanizer, it's a, it's a drunk, it's a lazy, it's this or I don't want to be that. But where do I find a mentor that I can emulate and model after?

Speaker 2: 34:54

Well, lucky for this generation, right now there is no lack of ability to find anything out there. So one I'd start with depends on your economic bracket, it depends on where you're at in your life path, but I'd start with the internet. I'd start Googling and looking for podcasts, youtube videos. I mean there's a ton out there, just right out of the gate. You can find videos of Tony talking about healthy masculinity. Gary Vaynerchuk's doing a lot on that right now. He's really pivoted his message. You've got Alex Hermosi that's out there. Ed Milet You've got all these guys that are out there that have enough content.

Speaker 2: 35:32

You could start with that. Behind that, I'd look for people in your community that are examples of healthy masculine. It might be people in your church, it could be at the Boys and Girls Club, it could be in sporting clubs. Look for people that are living a life that inspires you, and if you can't find one in your community, then go online and look Now, from there you can find coaches and you can find mentors. Now, there is a price involved in that, so if you can't find something you can afford, then go after the people you can see online for free.

Speaker 2: 36:06

I have a lot of clients that were broke when I was working for Tony Shit in India. I mean, one year's salary would equal one month to pay for coaching, so it was a very big disparity. But go online and watch all of Tony's videos for free. There are books out there. There are podcasts. There is no limit to the amount of availability that's out there, depending upon where you are. You just have to ask what am I looking for and what do I need to know to become a man of integrity and to be a man of healthy masculinity, and I will tell you. It'll start popping for you. There are books, podcasts, youtube videos and there are men in your community I know that are looking to mentor.

Speaker 1: 36:50

I'm going to share this with you. So I'm going to say, 15 years ago or 12, 22,. I think 12 to 15 years ago I was in my house in Pennsylvania and I was in my pool and my wife comes over to me. She's like I want to talk to you and I'm like, yeah, what's up, babe. I used to be the guy, alyssa, that used to be the pleaser. I used to be peace at all costs.

Speaker 2: 37:23

No conflict.

Speaker 1: 37:25

No conflict, no conflict and that so so. But I didn't have a healthy male role model in my life, right. So she's like I want to talk to you and I'm like what's up, babe? And she's like, you know, I'm not happy. This is like in our 10th year of marriage or something like that 8, 10 years of marriage. I'm not happy, yeah. And I'm like what are you talking about? Like we're so as men, a lot of times, we're so oblivious to what's happening, right, emotionally sometimes, and I'm like what's, what's? What are you, what are you talking about? She was like I'm like what are you talking about? She was like well, you always agree with everything that I want. It's not that we fight. This is what she's telling me. I was a younger guy. I was a younger man.

Speaker 1: 38:13

Right you're a little different. I'm like she's like you always, if I want this, you say this. If I want something, that's what you want. You never say what you want. Want something, that's what you want. You never say what you want. You never say what you want to do. She was like and I, that was so foreign to me, melissa, yeah, that was so foreign to me. I was like what are you saying to me? What do you mean? Like I, everything I do is to make you happy. I want you to be happy. I want us to be live peacefully and I think, happy wife, happy life bullshit that they feed us right, right and and it was a shock, it was a shock to my system. Like you probably felt slapped, I I did. It was a shock to my system. It was like what I felt? Dis, I felt disrespected, I felt dishonored, I felt unloved, I felt unappreciated, all the things that You're doing all this for you.

Speaker 2: 39:10

I've given up just to make it all good, and now you're not happy.

Speaker 1: 39:14

Yes, yes. And so I made a decision that I was going to go to a therapist. I said let's go to therapy. And then she was like she went like the first two sessions and then she was like I'm not going anymore. And I was like, okay, I kept going right on my own Cause. I was like I got to figure out me, right, I know I got to figure me out and I remember sitting there, right Sitting there with my therapist one day, melissa, and she tells me, right sitting there with my therapist one day, melissa, and she tells me she said something to me and I said my response to her was well, why wouldn't she love me?

Speaker 1: 39:52

Why wouldn't she be happy? Like, she lives in this beautiful house. I provide for her beautiful, I'm providing these great things for the kids and I'm doing all these things for her and she doesn. She has this great car and we live this great life. Like, why wouldn't she be happy? And my therapist looked at me and she said to me there's that nine-year-old boy that there's nothing masculine in what you just said.

Speaker 1: 40:20

And it was like boom, right there, breakthrough, breakthrough, slap to my face yeah and I remember thinking, as I was sitting in that couch, I said I'm not gonna come back to this lady. That's not what I thought it wasn't, lady.

Speaker 1: 40:32

I didn't say late here I am paying this lady whatever 150 an hour and then she's gonna tell me this shit right out, there's all right here we go so I got in my beautiful I don't know I was driving an Audi or something at the time a beautiful car and and and, and then something in my unconscious mind said hmm, maybe she's there's something, something there. Maybe she's saying something of value. Yep, I'm gonna come back next week. And it was in that moment, really. It was really. That was the moment that I started to define my masculine and I started to create values for myself and I started to find my way. It was in that moment.

Speaker 1: 41:17

I always share with Dr Jane. I always stay connected on Facebook. I'm like doc, it was. You know, it was a woman that kind of helped me find my way as a man and helped me. It was you that called me on my own shit and you were like boom in my face and you called me on it and I was like shocked to the system. But she was right, she was right. She was right. It's like hey, man, that's not what a man does, a man. She looked at me and she said hey, isn't that what a man is supposed to do? Take care of his family, protect his family and provide the best life that they can. Does a real man have to go around saying it and shouting and I was like what the hell are you saying to me? Right, she was right. Real man doesn't have to. I don't have to go shout it.

Speaker 2: 42:02

It's what I do, it's what I'm supposed to do it's your confidence, it's your identity, it's your factor, it's who you are, but if the more you shout it, the less we believe it, yeah, it's like someone tells me that when they start bragging up their man and they're telling me all these really intimate things about how great he is in bed and all this stuff, I'm like my first thought is thought is that's not true. I don't need to know that. The only reason you're telling me that is to convince yourself. And so in that space, I'm glad you got to have someone who had the honest conversation, because think about your marriage have survived if you hadn't no no, no, because she was already at a brink time.

Speaker 1: 42:40

I mean, we're 22 years in now, yeah right, um, but she was at her, at her, at her, she was at her and I. It was a shock to me. But I said it was a shock to me. It was, it was out of the blue. It was like what are we talking about here? Like why are we even what?

Speaker 2: 42:55

I'm doing, how good your life is. How can you possibly be unhappy?

Speaker 1: 43:00

yeah, and it was because I wasn't playing. I wasn't in my masculine it.

Speaker 2: 43:04

It was. You were not in your masculine and Tony talks about this at Date with Destiny and I remember the first time I heard it I was like wow, that's genius. We need polarity. When I am in my feminine, I need a man in his masculine because it's like polarity like a battery. When you have a battery, you have a positive and a negative charge. If you have two positives, the battery doesn't work. There's no spark. So you need that for both parties to keep that spark.

Speaker 2: 43:30

That's where the attraction comes in. That's why feminine women typically choose bad boys. They're in their soft feminine. They go to the hard dark because they need that protection. They feel safe. This guy's so badass He'll kick somebody's ass if they get in my face. Now I feel safe and I can be in my feminine. But if I'm with a passive dude who I think is just going to always be looking to keep everybody happy, then I have to be on alert to make sure that I've got our back, we're protected. So there's a balance in it and I think that's the dance. Is that we've lost?

Speaker 1: 44:07

I was going to say that because you know, there is a time where I let my wife leave. There is a time and I'm confident in letting her leave. Hey, man, my wife is better at some things than I am. I know that I'm like, babe, I'm following your lead, which you're good at this stuff. So I have a joke. Whenever we travel, we're going overseas or we're, and it's like, hey, I don't hear as good as she does, so she, I have a hard. It's in my family, it's in my genetics. My hearing is not as great.

Speaker 1: 44:35

Right but her eyesight is not as great as mine. So I'm like, hey, babe, you're the ears, I'm the eyes and together. So, if I can hear, you got my back, you know, and that's how we. But there's a time that's how we kind of balance each other out, but there's a time where I'm like, hey, I'm taking the backseat on this. Babe, I need to communicate this to the kids. Can you help me, because I'm not as good as a communicator with the kids here. Can you coach me up on here? I want to have this conversation. You know how do I have it?

Speaker 1: 45:09

You know, I was in, I was in Pennsylvania and I think I shared this the other day and, um, my son, my oldest son, is there and I'm like, hey, I'm going to go to dinner. I'm going to dinner with Chris and his fiance, and so she calls me in the middle of the day. She's like okay, you're going to dinner, kid. Here's what you say, here's what you don't say. I know you Stay here, Do this, do that. Don't go down this lane. Don't go down this lane, don't start asking these questions. I know how you are, I know how you think, but there was no offense in that. She was coaching me genuine feedback and I was like, okay, babe got it, roger, that You're better communicating than I am with these things. So I got a lesson.

Speaker 2: 45:49

But the reason you could is because you have self-respect, you have a knowing, you have a confidence and there's trust that you know you are comfortable enough to tee it up for her and you trust her in that space. That's trust. But that comes from your own personal security, your own identity, and it takes a strong man to appreciate and allow a strong woman to embrace her gifts. Now I've had a lot of men say I'm very intimidating to them because I know my voice and I know who I am. It will take a very strong man to be able to allow me to be myself and my full feminine. A weak man would not navigate that well because in my strength I will make him feel minimized because he's chosen that position and so that repels me.

Speaker 2: 46:41

I mean, that just pisses me off so bad. I just get into it. I'm like, okay, now I can't do this, I gotta go because I'm gonna kill you. I can't navigate that, weak, whiny, impassive, paralyzed. Oh, I can't make a decision. Guy can't do it. It just because it pushes me into the place I don't want to live. I can go there, there, I can access it, but that's not where I want to live.

Speaker 1: 47:06

Not where women want to be.

Speaker 2: 47:07

They don't want to be in the masculine.

Speaker 1: 47:08

They don't want to be in their masculine. Let's talk to women really quick.

Speaker 2: 47:12

Go ahead.

Speaker 1: 47:13

Let's talk to women. What are we telling women that have been sold this? Look, I'm just going to go ahead and say it here Young ladies, young ladies that are listening to me, you've been sold feminist. You've been sold a bag of goods and again, the feminist movement started with a positive. It was positive, it was meant to be positive. You've been sold a bag of goods and what I want you to do is I want you to best thing to do is.

Speaker 1: 47:40

Tony talks about a lot about modeling, modeling success. Right, model successful people. The fastest way to point A and point B is a straight line Go and ask those women, those hardline women, and examine their life, those women that live for 50, 60 years in this hardline feminist move, and go examine their life and just ask if I stay down this road, is that what I want? And if that's what you want, it's simple Just keep doing what they're, just tell them, go to them for advice and tell them hey, how do I get there? Right, but if you want to be in a relationship and most women do, most women, young women, do they want to have families. That's a woman's intuition, a lot of women's intuition. They women's intuition, a lot of women's intuition they want kids and this and that then go to a woman that's been married for 40 years and ask her that's right that you talk to, Not the one that's been divorced five times, not the one that hates men.

Speaker 2: 48:35

not the one that hates men. There's nothing worse than being around a group of women that they just trash. Talk men.

Speaker 1: 48:41

It is horrifying to me and it's like it's disgusting. I was, but it's one day I was. I used to be on a board of a YMCA and we were having this Christmas event. We were feeding the homeless. And one day we're I'm with my wife. It's Christmas Eve, christmas Eve, yes, it's Christmas Eve. And we're setting up the tables and and we're bringing stuff in. Right, I'm literally with my wife. We're we're putting setting things up.

Speaker 1: 49:08

One of the executives for the at the Y is coming in and she's bringing a table or a heavy box or something, and I asked her hey, can I let me grab that for you, or let me? I was opening the door for her and her response was ladies, pay attention to this, because this is the most ugly and most unattractive trait in a woman. I don't need help. I got it. I'm strong. Like what are you saying? Like this was a kind gesture, yeah, and you took it into a totally different. I'm strong enough, I can handle it. Bullshit. I got it. It was a kind gesture. It wasn't. Ain't no one trying to hit on you. Ain't no one trying to look you. Ain't no one trying to get like. My wife is literally right here. Like no one like this is just a kind gesture of me being a gentleman.

Speaker 2: 49:56

Yep.

Speaker 1: 49:57

And you just like, and I was like that's disgusting. I got in the car. I was like that's the most unattractive, ugliest trait in a woman, that is just you want to repel a man, do that.

Speaker 2: 50:09

Here's the thing. I had to look at that and I've had again. When you come out of survival, a lot of women go into their masculine because they're in survival mode. Oftentimes their family didn't protect them, their partner didn't protect them. They're struggling. If they're a single mom, they have to grind in order to stay safe, and so I think a lot of why we see so many masculine women right now is because of that. So, excuse me, in the scheme of that, when she pulled back, she robbed him of being a good guy. Back in the day, when I was little, the man walked on the outside of the street.

Speaker 1: 50:48

I still walk on the outside of the street when my wife and I are walking. There's an issue. Can we bring it back? Yeah, I still go down the stairs first. There's another great book, the Art of Manliness. Man, if you're a young man listening, I need you to read that book because it teaches you the art of chivalry, right, that's a great book, the Art of Manliness.

Speaker 1: 51:10

When a woman is going and I didn't know this one when a woman, when you're going up, you don't go behind the woman. When you're going up the stairs, you go ahead, you go first. When you're going down the stairs, you go first. Right, there's certain little, yeah, there's certain little things that, um, again, I I didn't know and I had to kind of learn and evolve and learn these things. But yeah, that stuff is lost, that this stuff is lost. And when you do it, women are like some women, not all women but like, oh, don't, you don't have to do that for me. I got it like hey, man, this is just, we're not used to it. This is, this is just what I do. This is to it, this is, this is just what I do. This is the type of man I am. This is just I hold. I opened the door for a woman, I let the woman go in first. This is just what I do. This is not necessarily about you. It's just who I am as a man.

Speaker 2: 51:55

But that's your character right. It speaks to your decision to be that kind of man, and that's kind of where I take my clients is at the end of this conversation. Who do you want to become? Do you want to be the guy that's an asshole that's out there that keeps blowing up relationships, or the passive guy that's too afraid to make a decision? Who do you really want to be? It starts with that. Who question the how will show itself. The more important piece is who do you want to be, as a man, as a husband, as a father, as a person in society, and who are you going to be to add value to those women and children around you that need your position? We need men to protect us, and the problem is is if all men go passive, if they all go feminine we are screwed, america is in trouble.

Speaker 1: 52:44

Oh, we are so screwed right now If men don't go back to the way God made us to be. That is correct. I want to see the feminists, if this country gets attacked, if we get attacked, get up. And I want to see you go fight the war. I want to see you go. They're not going to, they're not going to, they're not going to want to.

Speaker 1: 53:05

You know, one night I was in my bed, I was sleeping, just speaking to a woman. Just right, it's three o'clock in the morning. My son was 16 at the time. He started driving and he was working. He was working at an ice skating rink. Comes home, 16 year old kid, he got.

Speaker 1: 53:28

And so we, we, our bedroom was above the garage. Right, it's three o'clock in the morning. My wife wakes me up. She's like there's something in the garage. I was out cold. She's like, get up. It's three o'clock in the morning. Now, okay, three o'clock in the morning, get up. Get up, hon, there's someone, there's something in the garage. So I get up and I'm I'm like shit, there is something in the garage. So I go and I grab my gun and I go out to my balcony. I had a balcony and I had a balcony in my bedroom. I go out the balcony and I'm trying to see if I could see what's happening in the garage. I see a black bear coming out of my garage I was gonna say it's not a human I saw a black bear coming out of my garage with he took.

Speaker 1: 54:12

he had in his mouth a bag of garbage and he went in the woods. My point is, my point in the story is that in the middle of the night, when we are the most vulnerable, three o'clock in the morning, my wife woke up and her first instinct wasn't to go protect us, no, it's you. It was wake my ass up to go protect us. That was her instinct. That was her instinct. That was her instinct Was wake up, dude, and go find out what's going on. I'm not going down there, right. That was her instinct. That was her instinct. And that's the point, Women, when you rob a man, when you don't be in your feminine, when you're at your most vulnerable, you're going to wake up in the middle of the night and you're going to tell your passive husband to go. He's going. No, no, it's your job. No, it's your job. You're the man. Yeah, you do that and see how that plays for you. See how that plays out for you.

Speaker 2: 55:07

It's challenging. We're in a challenging time right now and it's funny because I raised my boys to have manners. I believe they matter. I believe manners indicate that I respect you and care about you more than I do my own comfort, because it's mutual respect. And that's that polarity piece again. If I'm with a man who treats the staff badly, doesn't respect me or want to like pull out my chair or doesn't know to open my door, he goes in first.

Speaker 2: 55:39

There's a piece of the feminine that just steps back and goes oh, that's who you are, okay, then I'm going to be this and that's where that friction starts. So women want and I'm painting with a broad stroke here, but most women still want the knight in shining armor. They still want a man that wants to see them as valuable and protect them. We still have women that need and want that behavior. The problem we have is we need mothers to raise their children to do that. The problem we have is we need mothers to raise their children to do that, and so in our society right now it starts with the little ones and these young men that are listening. You want to be a high value man. You want to be a man that commands and attracts high quality women. Step up, get into your character. You know what you value and elevate your behavior above the low level guys that are just out there being asked. It's easy too.

Speaker 1: 56:35

It's so easy. It's easy, guys. It's easy. It's easy because there's so much junk. It's just about getting clarity on who you are and who you want to be and what you stand for. That's it. This is who I am, this is what I stand for, and whether you think it's popular or not, or you stand by that, this is who I am, amen. So I have a question for you.

Speaker 2: 56:58

yeah, shoot it how does it feel when you're the hero for your wife when you do that thing, when you do, when you do that thing and you can see in her eyes, she's just like, oh my god, you're beautiful, thank you. What does that feel like for you when you're in your?

Speaker 1: 57:12

masculine. It feels amazing. There's, there's. I'll share this. So this is a good question for the young women to pay attention to, because I consider myself to be a high value man because of what I stand for. That's right. Who I am as a man and what it does is it gives me eyes only for her.

Speaker 2: 57:33

Yep.

Speaker 1: 57:35

I only have eyes for her when she does that. That's it. I mean, it's just that's it. I only have eyes for her. That's true, I only have eyes for her and I just, I feel, it feels amazing.

Speaker 2: 57:52

And there's nothing more powerful to a woman to have a man look at her like that. And that's the problem right now is, so many people have not gotten to that place and so they're looking everywhere else and there's no safety there. There's no safety for me as a woman If he's looking somewhere else. I know it instinctively. But it's also true for you. If you're not in the space of your masculine, she's looking for someone that will. So for us, as mutual human beings on the planet, if we want a better relationship, we have to be better in who we show up as, and that's how we all get our needs met. So for you, it's beautiful that you chose to be this high value man, because what you said is the most important know what you stand for 100 and even with her quality man know what you stand for.

Speaker 1: 58:39

And even with her right, there's times that she's in her crazy hormone feminine because it is what it is right and it's like okay, baby, yeah, that's where you are. Oh, we got it, it's it's, it's okay, that's where you are and this is what it is. Still, you're right and this is and this is, this is where you are. That's how we got here, it's okay, that's where you are and this is what it is. Still, you're right and this is where we are right and this is. You know, sometimes it got crazy and I'll say, hey, love you. I want you to know that I love you and I appreciate and respect what you said. And still I don't appreciate this, right, and still, yeah, yeah, and still, what you're saying, you know, doesn't make any sense because I didn't call you or forgot you know, it's just.

Speaker 1: 59:25

You know, women, it is what it is women, sometimes they go to that time of the month and they're off and it's like I just want to repeat to you what you just said to me I don't love you because I forgot to call you. Yeah, like, I just want to repeat that to you. I, I, I, you know, I'm running a business and you, you, you know I had all these meetings. I forgot to call you today because a woman needs attention all the time in order to feel loved. We both know that. I thought if the attention is off and she's in her, you know. Whatever, I just want you to know that. I just want to make some sense of that for me, right.

Speaker 2: 1:00:01

There may be a day no sense can come out of it. She won't understand it. We're oceans of emotion. That's the divine feminine. We bring to you the softness of life and you bring to us the protection so we can all cohabitate in a beautiful dance.

Speaker 1: 1:00:17

That's what it is I think the last time that was.

Speaker 1: 1:00:20

That's how we got into something you forgot to call me and you, she's making a big stink out of it. I said babe, look, you're making a big stink because I forgot to call you. I did. I own that. I'm not making excuses, I did, I was. I was with my mom and my sisters and we were hanging out. Yeah, I forgot to call you. I did my bad. It's on me, I own that. But dude for you to say that I forgot to call you and I don't love you because what are you crazy? Yeah, 22 years, where am I going, bro? Like, where am I going? You think I'm going somewhere. I was with my mom. How different.

Speaker 2: 1:00:52

Can I going, you think? I'm going somewhere I was with my mom. How different can I be?

Speaker 1: 1:00:58

It's a mom, it's a girl thing, it's okay and it's fine. But that's me just standing strong and saying, hey, man, I own your feelings, that's right, I'm not going anywhere. And I think that's biggest for men, for women. They just need to know they say emotionally hey, I'm not going anywhere, I see me in your craziness, I'm not going anywhere.

Speaker 2: 1:01:26

In that dialogue right there. The other thing, too, is that a lot of women and a lot of people in society right now there's a whole generation that believes it's your job to make me happy and it's not. It's not your job to make me happy. It's not your job to control my emotional state. It's not your job to make sure that everything's in alignment so my world is perfect. Not your job, man.

Speaker 2: 1:01:50

My happiness and my self-worth is my job, and so when I start expecting someone else to do it for me, that's where conflict arises. When expectations differ, we have a problem. So I have to get real clear when we go back to what would help these young guys and these young women. You have to get clear on who you are and who you want to be, and then you need to own that like it's your job, because it is, and then it's not as much disappointment if you don't call because you, you know, because you've been busy or because I haven't talked to you in six hours. I don't get to write a story that you don't love me and if I'm confident, I won't write that story.

Speaker 1: 1:02:46

So if I'm insecure, it's because I've had a moment of insecurity, or I'm focused on what you didn't do, or my expectations were wh. It needs to be had If folks wanted to connect with you. If there's some men out there that need they're like man. Gentlemen, here's what I will say to you. Remember that story I shared about therapists? I joke about this. It was a woman that set me on my path and my journey on what it truly means to be a man.

Speaker 1: 1:03:10

She called me on my shit straight up and that's look, man, if you're honest with yourself, you know you want to be held accountable. You know you want people, and this is what I foster that in my relationship with my wife. I'm like babe, don't, you don't need to hold back here. Like you, I'm. If, when I'm dropping the ball, I don't need you sugarcoated, I'm not a baby, I'm a big boy. I got big shoulders. Tell me what it is. We want to be held accountable. Tell me I'm not a baby, I'm not going to sit here. And you know, if you think I'm dropping the ball here and she does, she sure does, and I've given her permission to. I've given her permission to. I've created a space where she can call me on it. Hey, man, you were, you were you, you were out of line here with the kids. Hey, you were out of line here when you did this wrong and you know, and we, you got to give permission. So don't be afraid to men, do not be afraid to let a woman help you.

Speaker 2: 1:04:11

That's right.

Speaker 1: 1:04:12

Do not be afraid to let a woman help you. Oftentimes, they're the best ones to give us the advice on what a truly what a true masculine man looks like For them. They're the ones that are on the receiving end of it.

Speaker 2: 1:04:23

Well, it's so funny you say that because so many I got roped I shouldn't say roped in I got the gracious gift to get involved with. We Are the they because one of my clients started. He was one of my Robbins clients. I love working with men because I'm a mom of boys and I believe that men need to hear the truth, but they also need to hear it in a way in which it's communicated with love and not judgment, and sometimes a woman can do that better. A woman can do that better. So a lot of my I would say three quarters of my practice is men. I do a lot of work with men and I also work with women, but I have a unique relationship with men because I speak their language and I can also bring in the component of the feminine. In a way they can hear it. So if they want to reach out, they can get to me through my website, which is wwwmelissavonmusercom. I don't know if we can type it in there or if there's a way to get it.

Speaker 1: 1:05:18

We'll make sure we put it all in the show notes.

Speaker 2: 1:05:20

Perfect, melissavonmusercom, and then just reach out to me and we can see ways for me to help you find a coach or a mentor or support, whatever that looks like. I am here to see that the men of our country and our planet, that they get to heal and find their true identity, because without it, as a culture, we're done. And I, I want that song by a, was it by Tina Turner? We need a hero. We need our men back.

Speaker 1: 1:05:54

I need a hero, we need our men back, and so I'm here to speak to that and that's why I love that you asked for that conversation, because to me we need more people talking about this no-transcript. He got so popular because men were under attack.

Speaker 1: 1:06:44

He came in a time when men were under attack and he just kind of fought back yeah, he didn't accept it he just fought back and he was like no, you know, and he just, and then, and he, that's how he got this dark following. But, gentlemen, a lot of times we are trying to figure it out and we don't know, unless you have a healthy, strong male in your household. That wasn't my experience.

Speaker 2: 1:07:11

Yeah, most of them don't.

Speaker 1: 1:07:12

It wasn't my experience and you them don't. It wasn't my experience and being you figure it out by tv womanizing this. You take a little bit from here, a little bit from there, a little bit from there, and then you kind of create. But if you're not really intentional and you don't have someone in your space that can help you through this thing, like hey, what does it? What does it really mean? You know, what does it really mean? What is that?

Speaker 1: 1:07:31

yeah, healthy man, what does it really mean to be? It's okay to say hey, I feel this way today. I feel offended when you spoke to me this way. I hurt my feelings when you said this and I don't want you to please speak to me in that way. It's okay to express yourself. It's okay.

Speaker 2: 1:07:53

When did it become unokay for them not to say that that they you hurt their feelings? You guys have your feelings, are like they're powerful and if we don't get to, if you don't express them, they either materialize in illness or bad behavior. This is why porn addiction is off the charts. This is sexual misfunction. All these things play out because you guys can't speak the truth. Speak the truth, we need it.

Speaker 1: 1:08:17

Yes, that's right, 100% Unapologetic. Speak the truth, unapologetic. Thank you, melissa, so much for coming on with me. I really, really appreciate you. Connect with her. She's awesome. She's a rock star.

Speaker 2: 1:08:29

Thank you, honey, so are you. I look forward to seeing you again, peace.