On the Horizon: VMware’s EUC CTO Office makes 11 predictions for EUC in 2022

Since it’s early January, it’s the season where everyone makes predictions about the upcoming year. At VMware EUC, we decided to share some of our predictions too, but not in a “pie in the sky” non-relevant way. More like, “If you’re an EUC professional, here are 11 trends we think are going to increase in relevance in 2022, and things you should think about if you want to stay on top of your EUC game.” For example, AR/VR is not on our list, because while we’re doing some cool things like XR Hub, AR/VR still won’t be a significant part of the job of most EUC pros out there in 2022.

By the way, I’m Brian Madden, the guy actually typing this blog post into my laptop, but these 11 predictions are based on collaborative thoughts from Shawn Bass (VMware’s EUC CTO) and the entire Office of the CTO team.

Host: Andy Whiteside
Co-Host: Moin Kahn

Transcript

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Andy Whiteside: Hello everyone and welcome to episode 20 2022 episode 22 it's year 2022 i'm your host Andy whiteside this is on the horizon podcasts I think I left that part out.

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Andy Whiteside: And this is our first one to 2022 I got the moment con with me Eric is actually having a sales kickoff today so he's not available to us.

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Andy Whiteside: but luckily mo and stepped in and no one's gonna be joining us every week we do these mo in your part as integrity or your global cto and you've been involved with working with vmware technologies, including their end user compute stuff for how long.

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moin khan: are about to see 1213 years now.

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Andy Whiteside: that's amazing I really would have to stop and do the math to even figure out how long it's been around but that's about right 1213 years make sense.

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moin khan: yep so I started back in 2006 and seven when V sphere came in as X was a big thing so we're computing people trying to cut down the cost and look into how they can consolidate.

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moin khan: Their growing real estate costs and working with Citigroup this was one of the big tech they didn't have enough space to keep all the solar so that's when we were V sphere came in and.

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moin khan: Everyone started jumping on this, and when when V sphere came and the slowly with citrix and other thing, so I go back starting from day one, and I was the person who was watching out for vmware ipo and it came out.

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moin khan: This was one technology that we bet upon very initial days and i've been working since then.

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Andy Whiteside: So, so let me tell my vmware story real quick and then I want to see how it aligns with your so 2002 2002 2004 time frame.

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Andy Whiteside: I implemented a V sphere two dot five to or something, and one of the workloads that I wanted to run on early on, was my citrix environment.

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Andy Whiteside: And so fast forward about a year or so and I was working for another company after doing a little stint at Microsoft.

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Andy Whiteside: And I was at a vmware user group meeting and the number one workload on vmware was this product called citrix, and so I got to get to meet both the citrix and vmware team at the same time.

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Andy Whiteside: In the same room and that's how I became a citrix vmware consultant, and then about a year later vmware started doing their own version of virtual desktop infrastructure, which was really just RDP connections into a.

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Andy Whiteside: into a virtual desktop running on vmware and that became horizon.

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Andy Whiteside: And then over time vmware has slowly not slowly but rapidly picked up what they do, to the point where now citrix and vmware are basically the top two competitors, with each other in the EU, see space did your world of.

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Andy Whiteside: vmware and citrix kind of come together and then pull apart Is that how you saw it.

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moin khan: It did so when I started my 2006 days when I was working for citrix consulting and my first engagement with Zen server that when then source was acquired by citrix and first deal happened with the Dell Dell was trying to re and went to their.

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moin khan: imaging portion of the business where when you go in order server they will image it and package and get it ready, and when you when you server shows up at your workplace that server has already image that you need already installed on that hardware Dell thought of using.

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moin khan: Zen source, which is something that they were testing and that's when I went as a Zen so our subject matter expert being the first in citrix to implement something like that and.

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moin khan: vmware was there, and that was my first bake off with vmware competing with dense dense over and truly there was no bake off there was no comparison on how mature V sphere V sphere was compared to Zen source, but that was my first interaction with vmware 2007 2006 2007.

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Andy Whiteside: So i'm glad you brought that up as I left is in server story, so it was it was vmware citrix own physical and then vmware showed up was great place once it got a little better.

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Andy Whiteside: 2005 or six this timeframe is great place but citrus workload, especially not nestle vm give me and we're getting better, but the hardware being more capable to scale.

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Andy Whiteside: That kind of happened, and then the two were like perfect peanut butter and jelly together.

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Andy Whiteside: And then vmware when, after the vdi space some and then citrus was like Oh, we better go after the hyper hyper.

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Andy Whiteside: hyper converged.

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Andy Whiteside: The hypervisor piece.

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Andy Whiteside: yeah, whereas in source showed up meanwhile there's Microsoft doing RDP remote desktop and.

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Andy Whiteside: And hyper V, all in the same thing that kind of came and went in terms of popularity over and over again, but then, that this is the to catapult well.

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Andy Whiteside: Fast forward to today right so we're here talking about being where do you see, which has a great benefit of having a hypervisor as well as a hypervisor that runs inside hyper scholars all at the same time that's that's.

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Andy Whiteside: A vision that we thought would work out for vmware a long time ago that's starting to starting to become a big part of their story having that in the cloud and on premise as capabilities all brokered by their uc solutions of workspace one or or horizon.

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Andy Whiteside: And all that's kind of come full circle and i'll make this statement, without going a lot of detail, six months ago i'm talking to citrix executives and they're asking you know what do you think of our partnerships and I name all their partners like Amazon.

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Andy Whiteside: Microsoft Google and then I get to the end they're like what do you think about vmware being a good partner for us, and like whoa wait a minute what just happened you you, you came full circle back to you know.

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Andy Whiteside: You know, recognizing that you and vmware can live in the same world and both benefit customers, at the same time, whether it's making citrix.

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Andy Whiteside: Virtual APP and desktop available through workspace one or whether it's making citrix workspace available with vmware as the underlying platform there's still a lot of environments that run them together right.

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moin khan: right they do, and this always have been from from citrix side, there was no competition where they both work together.

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moin khan: Always hypervisor space for vmware and layer On top of that comes with the citrix Apps and desktop.

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moin khan: Those days they all have come a long way, where there was strength already identified hypervisor side vmware has a strength.

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moin khan: Underlying layer On top of that, for end user computing that was citrix which over time vmware has caught up big time on the end user compute side with horizon.

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moin khan: easily competing with now if you go in healthcare, we have various competing with their horizon product with workspace one through acquisition of air watch now their solution and portfolio has come to a level where it was always citrix being leader on.

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moin khan: APP virtualization and text our virtualization vmware being more of our hypervisor now it has gone to a level where vmware has matured to a point that horizon is not any less than what vm about such acts and citrix and Microsoft can provide.

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yeah.

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Andy Whiteside: And I think it's a world where you know satya nadella Microsoft realizes they can't be everything.

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Andy Whiteside: Yes, not a play with other people if you're going to solve challenges for customers because trying to say you can do everything doesn't solve anybody's challenges it just creates isolation buckets of of capabilities, but not total solution capabilities.

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moin khan: It does, and on the same note, I was part of project maharaja working with Microsoft.

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moin khan: This is something that Microsoft tried their best to get into this world without understanding.

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moin khan: That to your point that you cannot do everything, there are a few things that if you are starting to be a desktop virtualization.

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moin khan: Our SME in in 2013 where citrix and vmware they have been doing this from last eight nine years it's very hard to catch up.

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moin khan: And that that's that's what came down to now fast forward 2020 21 2022 now Microsoft is just complimenting with the windows 10 multi session and not competing there is no competition anymore from Microsoft side.

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Andy Whiteside: yeah well you mentioned catch up catch up maintain it and stay caught up.

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Andy Whiteside: It has to be possible, and even companies, the size of Microsoft know that you.

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Andy Whiteside: can't do it all you got to have partners you got to have co op petition and customers will will blend themselves into what fits their needs in that world.

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moin khan: I agree.

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Andy Whiteside: So mo, and this is our first podcast together with you and Eric we back and then the three of us will do these going forward I did pick a topic, maybe an easy one for us today, because this is your first one, but very, very relevant.

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Andy Whiteside: Let me share my screen here, so you can see it, so the blog that I chose to review today it's one by Mr Brian man who's been in the space, a long time, do you know, Brian personally.

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moin khan: I had no.

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Andy Whiteside: Okay.

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moin khan: So my separate states.

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Andy Whiteside: yeah so I know, Brian slightly we've met once or twice no gay lot better but Brian i've met before we all kind of run in the same world.

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Andy Whiteside: But Brian wrote a blog earlier this year January 11 and the title of his vmware is he you see cto office makes 11 predictions for you see in 2022 so I thought we'd go over this one today I know a lot of these are going to be near and dear to your heart.

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Andy Whiteside: The first one talks about mobile threat Defense.

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Andy Whiteside: yeah I mean the world's working remote the world's more mobile, how do we make sure we enable those workers while still making sure that we do everything we can to protect ourselves thoughts on this one.

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moin khan: If you see the irony of.

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moin khan: Going into a big circle, this is what a big circle is, if you start looking into a unix days with the dumb terminal where I was talking to one of the customer, they said.

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moin khan: Large.

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moin khan: lumber company, and they have been using dumb terminal for about a decade, they never liked the windows and they still don't like windows now, when we look into.

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moin khan: How the whole mobility has evolved from the pandemic, where everyone is working from home, which used to be mobile mobile mobility was limited to sales team.

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moin khan: Mobility was limited to some of the mobile device mobility was limited to some of the thin client or dumb terminal that people are using now it has gone to anything and everything now you have your workforce as mobile devices are mobile, we are talking about ipads and smartphones sick.

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moin khan: Each and every thing that you turn around and you look from your workforce to the devices, they are all mobile now that has opened a big threat.

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moin khan: That we talked about and I hundred percent agree on being number one threat on making sure that.

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moin khan: Having a proper Defense in place with fishing with malware now the four walls, where all the information security was where all your applications your users, where.

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moin khan: It has disappeared, there is no four walls anymore, so your data is exposed your users are exposed your devices are exposed so having.

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moin khan: Having mobile threat Defense as number one prediction, I totally agree with it yeah.

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Andy Whiteside: yeah we went from a world where we kind of let the outside world in but, yet we were very guarded about it to a world where do whatever it takes to get work done again right overnight.

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Andy Whiteside: and, hopefully, a lot of companies just didn't throw security out the window and if they did they're coming back around and figuring out how to get it back in there and I think that's probably the case.

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moin khan: Oh, it ransomware everyone is seeing this that how are not having a proper security and exposing yourself to external world.

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moin khan: how important this is now so this is, with all the attacks that we see and every day any security vulnerability, that is coming out any threat that is been.

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moin khan: uncovered you see that how each and everything at one point your developer will write a code and that code will run for 1516 years without anyone, even going back and seeing that service account password is is hard coded in the code.

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moin khan: Now those things cannot survive young generation coming in with an amount of knowledge that 510 years.

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moin khan: In information is out there for each and everything and.

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moin khan: Trying to keep yourself up to date for those information is a key to key to stay secure.

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Andy Whiteside: So staying on the topic of security, the next conversation is password less Okay, so we live in a world where we need to secure everything, but now you're telling me, we can do it without having passwords that the scares people, but at the same time, those password.

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Andy Whiteside: scenarios coming up with one maintaining and managing one using one having to type one in those are things our users hate so what's this world look like where we don't have passwords but we're still just a secure, if not more secure.

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moin khan: and

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moin khan: And, and this is, this is the key now if you go in ask anyone how many passwords you have.

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moin khan: There are hundreds and hundreds of password beat your banking beat your application we.

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moin khan: beat every day SAS based product that you're using everything requires password one thing that that was that came like single sign on you coming with every every company came with the product version of their own password manager or.

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moin khan: Security Walt where you can store your password and those things now it is coming to a point where you just cannot keep up with anything where your passwords are saved, so this goes with.

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moin khan: To in an era that we are walking in it has to be password or less, we have to have a level of security, where you are not relying on your memory to to cooperate with you to remember all the hundreds of password that that you have to manage or remember to be operational.

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Andy Whiteside: When it's funny because as we're talking about this and it almost looks like i'm not paying attention I got a new phone yesterday.

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Andy Whiteside: i've got a million applications i've got to go figure out how to get integrated back and set up.

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Andy Whiteside: And in an ideal world right i'm going to be a US Hello camera i'm going to use biometrics i'm going to be able to use multi factor and i'm not going to be typing passwords if I do it's one time, I can store it.

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Andy Whiteside: And by the way, I shouldn't be typing passwords anyway, I should be typing pass phrases.

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Andy Whiteside: yeah the imagine if we turned on mandatory pass phrases what our customer what our end users would do to us.

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Andy Whiteside: it's bad.

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Andy Whiteside: it's bad enough, we make them pick eight characters and two special characters in a number or whatever it is, they would they would not be happy with us so.

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Andy Whiteside: It is this really talking about more the ability to save and have a pen and have multifactor that kicks in every time you log in biometrics or all the above.

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moin khan: All is about yeah.

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Andy Whiteside: Well, the third one goes back to the two we've talked about.

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Andy Whiteside: Already, I think, and that is.

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Andy Whiteside: Zero trust How are we supposed to be password lists and work from anywhere but yet trust nothing how's that impossible.

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moin khan: That is interesting, and that is something that.

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moin khan: Is the thing of pandemic that you don't trust anything if you if you think about it, in reality, when when the four walls have four walls of your.

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moin khan: of your corporation where your data Center was has disappeared, how do you trust anything, how do you trust the device that your users are using, how do you trust the vpn now there is no network security at your home, you are relying on.

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moin khan: The wireless router that is sending it to any users home.

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moin khan: Be it these people being smart enough to write that password or just leave it open So how do you trust the in the network that your devices are connecting to.

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moin khan: So, going from.

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moin khan: Your work into a home based wireless connection with the device that may or may not be controlled by enterprise those can be users home computer now if coming into your network and you're accessing you have to go zero trust you cannot trust anything at this time, be.

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moin khan: Your users who are working from home or connecting it used to be occasional airport connection or hotel connection.

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moin khan: which was always the thing that we have to get into kiosk mode when your users are connecting from hotel or airport now think about that scenario which was.

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moin khan: Point 5% or 6% of users connecting from hotel and airport now pretty much all your workforce are connecting from on secure untrusted the Internet or network back into your.

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moin khan: Data or your proprietary information, so the zero trust is the one thing that.

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moin khan: That is an obvious thing that you just cannot trust on anything.

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Andy Whiteside: So mo and I started with this term zero trust me it's zero default trust, but then let people earn the trust.

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Andy Whiteside: When people say zero trust that's like a trust nothing ever and the reality is we do trust it once it's.

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Andy Whiteside: Just validated itself, yet we continuously monitor it, which might be the next thing we talked about here, to see if it starts getting out of line with what we did trust originally.

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moin khan: yeah it is yes, I trust you today, but again tomorrow we don't know user has come up with a new device user has come with.

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moin khan: A new wife I switched from one Internet provider to other Internet provider other Internet provider came with a router with no password leave it in your so.

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moin khan: You just cannot blindly trust with the foundation that they have proven they have earned their trust, but this has to go with your like you said, your next point of continuous enforcement.

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moin khan: Right, so you trust you don't trust Dave when the trust to get limited access or some access and this continuous policy enforcement continues to monitor and ensure that you are at any point you are not just.

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moin khan: Keep closing your eyes or or not watching out for.

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moin khan: The things that got you to win this trust.

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Andy Whiteside: yeah I use my home example right my i'm like in the right time of year, I want the windows open.

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Andy Whiteside: I want the doors unlocked the screen door open my wife, though every door has to be locked all the time, even if it's four o'clock on a Sunday afternoon.

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Andy Whiteside: And the kids are out front plan we still locked the doors she trusts, no one, and the kid has to ring the doorbell provably is to come in, or it has to come in through the garage with the keypad the doors are always locked.

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moin khan: yeah my.

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Andy Whiteside: wife lives in a zero trust world I live in a world where maybe I trust too much you know it's all good into that bad thing happens.

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moin khan: At this time, I think, going to where everything is locked and.

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moin khan: You request for permission makes more sense than leaving everything open.

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Andy Whiteside: You know, even a great example, this one we haven't thought about it, you want to know this, but my my kids are in college and my daughter, and my son were at a fraternity party.

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Andy Whiteside: Saturday night and to masked men walked in because the door was unlocked they let everybody in.

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Andy Whiteside: Luckily, the fraternity brothers that were there noticed them right away and tackle them, they were there to arm rob do armed robbery in the fraternity all day they had they had guns, they were ready, they were ready to pull them out and use them how scary is that.

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moin khan: Oh wow Tedeschi.

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Andy Whiteside: yeah crazy, but you can't I mean they got attorney palaces historically, you know trusted everybody now they got its point zero trust you're gonna have to door is going to be shot you got approved for your for your lunch come in now.

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Andy Whiteside: crazy worlds worlds worlds bad place world changing.

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Andy Whiteside: Well let's let's take that and move on to this continuous policy enforcement, you know let's say they move to a world where they you have to show you are.

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Andy Whiteside: And then someday they're going to walk around the party and ask you to reprove who you are or they're going to see have you changed your posture tell me about the continuous policy enforcement how you see in that being a big deal in 2022.

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moin khan: So to your point of someone walking into a party and not knowing so having the door locked where they didn't knock the door they come in, they pretend to be someone else and they gain gain access to the party, but once they are in having that.

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moin khan: Continued continuous policy enforcement on different layers of checks and balances, making sure that these guys are indeed what they are what they're saying to be so that's what our.

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moin khan: Enforcement is on once they are in, you have to continuously scan when you have to continuously.

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moin khan: check and validate and if those things are, if you find the suspicious that needs to be thrown out and the slice this goes back into your zero trust on yes, yes, they have validated, they are in, but now I am going to have multiple checkpoints on each floor.

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moin khan: Parties happening on first floor second floor they're going now they have to validate again they have to verify who they are, and the goal is to get caught up by one of the scanners or one of the checkpoint that is there to ensure that things are captured.

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Andy Whiteside: So, as I mentioned a couple times i'm in the middle of Center the zone somewhat while we're talking but it's very applicable.

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Andy Whiteside: And it's I got logged into my gmail my part my work gmail one of my companies and it had the right username right password but then the gmail.

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Andy Whiteside: Google my Google environment my identity provider for that company, it said hey I appreciate, you gave me the right username password for the mail, but you don't have a security pin on this brand new phone yet.

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Andy Whiteside: i'm not letting you in like it it it it saw me do the right things, but saw the bad or saw something that wasn't the most appropriate behavior or not fully set up and it stopped me that was.

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Andy Whiteside: me I I appreciate, I appreciate that it did it for me i'm going to put a pin on absolutely i'm glad that it saw that i'm glad to see that we're not allowing people to go painless just to get to the device.

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moin khan: yep.

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Andy Whiteside: And that's one of the nice things about as a service technologies, you can start to bring in other forms of security.

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Andy Whiteside: and enforce those because you can now say you can't use this unless you do this and if I change that what you have to do thing down the road it'll be impacted instantly not the next time you know reinstall the device or taken it to get some support on it.

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Absolutely.

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Andy Whiteside: All right, alright next one is number five vpn or dying and it starts with saying hello, Captain obvious yeah I mean, without a doubt.

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Andy Whiteside: A world where user has to do what I did in 1998 my first laptop I got establish a vpn connection and then try to remote into the APP i'm trying to use that's a no brainer but still more companies than not are doing that.

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moin khan: yeah and think about it, even when Microsoft came with direct access.

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moin khan: This was with the thought that vpn are dying because no one wanted to.

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moin khan: Go and connect put their user ID and password connect to vpn launched their application work any network glitch now you're you're disconnected again again you're going and reevaluating authenticating.

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moin khan: going through the corporate.

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moin khan: In the Internet, every time you have to do anything now, this is something that when Microsoft back in 2012 they came with the direct access that was the thought that people don't want to go and do vpn connection over and over again, so it has to be all.

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moin khan: going from your zero trust to continuous enforcement and then not having to go and validate and authenticate so it has to be a balance of.

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moin khan: Balance of comfort of user where they are not typing their user ID and password at the same time, behind the scenes someone is constantly scanning and that's where.

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moin khan: With all the SAS based application, but single sign on with multi factor if you have all those in place, there is no need, and i'll give you example of one of the customer that i'm talking to.

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moin khan: They are saying that.

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moin khan: They have G sweet that they are using they have a Google based application, they are SAS based application, why do I need to why Why do I need to have.

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moin khan: Corporate owned device or why do, why do I need to have a vpn in place if my users can take any device and go and run those applications.

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moin khan: SAS based SAS provider is already authenticating and doing the things that they should be doing, why do I have to connect to the vpn and four and have them come through my Internet and come through my network in my office and then open my network for my end user as well.

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moin khan: So, so that level of security, we feel that, having a vpn where your routing every one to your corporate network.

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moin khan: You are kind of exposing your network for the home computer and that's the reason why your vpn are not something and with the sassy offering and.

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moin khan: What now every provider Cisco Cisco citrix vmware all coming with sassy that is for a reason with office 365 it is running in cloud you're you're not limited by exchange that is running on your office, so why do you have to come to our entire network, when you can run without vpn.

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Andy Whiteside: Well, so this one is is obvious right it's you it's better for the end user and more secure all at the same time, more convenient quicker to access and more secure why companies are out there still running vpn on their mobile connectivity, is it just doesn't make any sense.

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moin khan: It does not make sense, I agree.

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Andy Whiteside: So the 16 they have listed here is multi cloud so moment, are you telling me that the cloud is not a cloud it's clouds.

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moin khan: It clouds yes, that is correct.

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Andy Whiteside: And so the idea that if i'm designing in the uc environment, maybe I don't design it for a cloud I am design it for multiple clouds take advantage of multiple clouds and I have scalability and redundancy all at the same time that's.

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Andy Whiteside: yeah that's pretty powerful when you start thinking about stuff that was originally was intended to run in a single data Center.

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moin khan: yeah, and this is more with aws azure GDP.

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moin khan: All everyone says it's the same thing that you don't rely on your own data Center you have a backup data Center or your colo where you're storing things that goes in the same line that Why do I rely on one cloud provider.

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moin khan: and get.

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moin khan: Get myself with aws going down a couple of times last year, everyone is moving towards having a backup.

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moin khan: Running your primary workload on aws and going into azure as your backup or vice versa.

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moin khan: Now, with Google trying to catch up and give you the third platform where you can run your application Now this is where everyone is heading.

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moin khan: Everyone has their forte on what their strength is azure is from infrastructure side aws is from platform and tcp is from your application side if you are developing an application.

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moin khan: The first choice becomes going to GDP, but at the same time now, you need to find someone like azure who's good with the infrastructure.

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moin khan: or aws who's equally good with infrastructure, what can do platform, or can do SAS so, so this is where multi cloud comes in, where you, you are not relying.

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moin khan: Again, falling back on zero trust you're not relying on one provider, you have to have a backup and you need to have the same checks and balances in different cloud taking care of your your information, your data and your business.

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Andy Whiteside: yeah and and, by the way, cloud means I as cloud means pass cloud means SAS.

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Andy Whiteside: yeah it's more than just an eye as vs on premises versus colo versus hybrid data Center world and.

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Andy Whiteside: i'm proud to say INTEGRA is investing heavily in providing our own data centers as a cloud option and most customers are going to need, especially with desktop workloads they're going to need more than one if.

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Andy Whiteside: You attack the scenario.

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moin khan: I agree.

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Andy Whiteside: All right number seven here is arm and i've done several podcasts recently on this, but arm in points the arm processor in points those things are coming whether it's for a thin client or whether it's for a high powered you're a MAC user experience what's your take on on.

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moin khan: Cost becomes one of the biggest effect on any any solution that you deploy and end of the day, business needs to justification on.

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moin khan: How to how to keep up with the cost and arm is one thing that has proven to be.

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moin khan: economical, at the same time.

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moin khan: It has become apple has proved to be.

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moin khan: be a chip that that can give you performance that you're looking for so apple has proved it and the cost justifies it to be used in more.

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moin khan: Killing this monopoly of Intel processes and getting into something that is that has been proven and it's more cost effective.

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Andy Whiteside: Yes, but then cost effective this brand new iPhone I bought it, they still cost $800 I say that jokingly how much cheaper should arm be than Intel is it is it about the processors about the power consumption savings.

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moin khan: Both.

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moin khan: As a good point that you bought that.

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moin khan: Still, you have iPhone and iPad Have you taken it cost you more than you spend on buying a laptop 1500 1600 dollars, but then there are there are.

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moin khan: devices with the arm chips, which are cost effective and cheaper.

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Andy Whiteside: Alright, when i'm you know I think there is a lot to be said about.

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Andy Whiteside: The cost of device being less, but then the long term, maintenance and cost of the power consumption is certainly something one good for the environment to good for.

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Andy Whiteside: Good for a while it goes back to you know conversations in the EC world 567 years ago green doesn't necessarily mean saving the earth, a lot of times, it means saving money and saving the earth.

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moin khan: yeah I agree.

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Andy Whiteside: All right, let's see we got man there's more.

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Andy Whiteside: there's 11 of these so.

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Andy Whiteside: number eight is one that, no matter what we did ahead of this, the other seven we've covered.

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Andy Whiteside: number eight should never sacrifice, and that is in user experience if you've secured everything if you've made it cost effective.

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Andy Whiteside: If you've done all the things that you really want to do you can't neglect the end user, if the end user experiences.

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Andy Whiteside: Bad or very subpar like end users will tolerate some things if it means I get their job done, but if they have a bad in user experience everything else we talked about here is is for not.

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agree.

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moin khan: hundred percent.

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moin khan: end of the day.

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moin khan: Business relies on your end user, they run business.

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moin khan: It has to be end user, experience has to be something.

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moin khan: close to or better than their traditional.

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moin khan: text based experience right.

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Andy Whiteside: as close as possible while still getting the benefits that we've talked about already around security and work from anywhere and.

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Andy Whiteside: The ability to have a consistent work environment it's a balancing act, but it can't be totally neglected the end user experience it's gotta be.

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Andy Whiteside: it's gotta be somewhere i've had several projects in my career, where the guy that was doing the project or the the CIO.

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Andy Whiteside: said, someone told him, it would be better than his MAC and i'm like it's not going to happen, but it can be good enough, where your users accept it for what it's good for.

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Andy Whiteside: and understand that there are some shortcomings and, in some cases.

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Andy Whiteside: Like my virtual desktop beds INTEGRA with with all the power and processing and I have a persistent one and and have graphics cards, it really is pretty damn good these days, I really don't know much of a difference in fact I find myself thinking i'm local sometimes i'm not.

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Andy Whiteside: So number nine here says out with the mindlessly following tradition Okay, so this one's a big one for me.

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Andy Whiteside: Over the past 10 years or so of selling end user computing technologies like vmware and citrix my biggest competition was status quo.

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Andy Whiteside: And the number one proponent of status quo was Microsoft, in other words, they were happy of customers kept signing up to stay on SEC.

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Andy Whiteside: Because that was their lock in and money, making now even the microsoft's of the world have embraced virtual end user computing and they no longer are the hardest people to compete against.

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moin khan: I agree Andy I think.

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moin khan: you're right when people, and especially when you see going mainstream which everyone is talking about now and and devices being on the field more than staying internal.

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moin khan: Moving office ECM system was something that was the default tool to take care of all the end user devices now with.

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moin khan: The devices getting on to the field where you're taking care of them.

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moin khan: By so, so this is, you have to take care of them and Microsoft is not your default choice now everyone comes up everyone like vmware.

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moin khan: workspace one or air watch or mobile era, and that was out there, or Zen mobile multiple product now you have different option, and you have to get out of this mindset of traditional.

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moin khan: Because, then, nothing is traditional anymore.

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moin khan: Things have changed.

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Andy Whiteside: So question for you, why did, why do Microsoft, why did Microsoft people quit talking about SEC being the best answer.

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moin khan: Because.

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moin khan: tcm is is an was.

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moin khan: that the product of choice for patching updating and taking care of devices which is.

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moin khan: In the network now you don't have all those devices in their network, this is all all sort of the network or the air or the wire and that's when in tune came in.

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moin khan: which can do some of some of the thing, but then you start getting into product maturity you you started building in tune.

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moin khan: 2014 2015 based on the thought that you know how to take care of devices which are inside the four walls now, when the device goes outside of these four walls, how do you take care of them.

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Andy Whiteside: So Mona kind of set you up for that when I should have been a little nicer about it, you gave me exactly the right answer from a technical guys perspective.

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Andy Whiteside: What I would say is Microsoft used to have these in user agreements with things like office and SEC and that's what made the company, the most money.

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Andy Whiteside: yeah now consumption workloads in azure make some of the most long term and short term money or let's say mid to long term money, therefore, all of a sudden, it became the best way to do it.

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moin khan: you're right yep.

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Andy Whiteside: it's hard for them to say hey you should put stuff in azure and then turn around and try to sell yes ECM at the same time.

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Andy Whiteside: They just took SEM turn it into into and turned it into endpoint manager and said Oh, by the way, put the the other put the workload in azure and then we'll manage the devices with this other thing you know it's like everything else in life follow the money.

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Andy Whiteside: All right number 1010 and we got number 11 coming up remote onboarding man, you were on my management call this morning and we're still talking about how to onboard new users remotely and then I brought up the fact that got this new phone that i've been messing with your four minutes.

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Andy Whiteside: onboarding when you're never come in the office that's up that's a whole new game.

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moin khan: yeah and we saw this as one of the biggest challenge during pandemic when this pandemic came, no one saw this coming.

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moin khan: No one was prepared for this, there are there are companies who are still relying on their workforce to come to office every day and i'll give you example of one of the power generation company here.

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moin khan: One fine day their their mandate was you cannot work from home, it was always you have to be in office to work.

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moin khan: When pandemic it and two weeks, everyone was asked to go home they started to lose money because they cannot work they have no devices, then, how do you want on board.

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moin khan: that's when they reached out to us as INTEGRA asking what can we do we went they went with Microsoft Microsoft said solution is.

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moin khan: In tune, you can use in tune for report onboarding but then they asked how do I know which device is our device, they said, well, we don't have a.

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moin khan: mechanism to tell which one is your device, you need to talk to either vmware or citrix so they went to citrix and said.

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moin khan: We need to identify that it is our corporate device, how do we do it, they said oh us, etc.

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moin khan: etc can tell which devices your device now how do I make these two companies talk to each other and make this thing work remote onboarding work, which was a difficult.

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moin khan: task because citrix will not talk to Microsoft Microsoft will look only in into citrix will look only an adc that's where partner like us, we come in and we understand what the world.

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moin khan: We went and we made this remote onboarding possible this was we took their device getting shipped from a from a from a hardware vendor directly to user home.

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moin khan: turn on it will identify that device is corporate owned through etc, and that makes the remote onboarding possible now, this is something that was one of keys, and I see this becoming a trend for anyone.

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moin khan: But big making a trend for anyone distinct prepared for next round of trouble and challenges that may come.

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Andy Whiteside: yeah look, you and I both run around telling people that pandemics could happen hurricanes.

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Andy Whiteside: snow storms family members sick you're sick there's so many reasons why you would have to work from home there's one thing that's not gone forever.

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Andy Whiteside: I mean we're going to go back in the office some, but the work remote thing is here for the rest of our lives and probably for the rest of society needing to onboard someone who never comes in the office has got to become a secure but efficient process.

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moin khan: hundred percent agree.

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Andy Whiteside: All right, well we're about to wrap up you're about to run out of time, this will be my fourth i've got one more podcast today than before today but we'll hit the last one here, which is probably one of the most important and you've seen it out.