Teach Middle East Podcast
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Teach Middle East Podcast
Navigating Change and Preparing Future Leaders With Mark Leppard MBE
In this insightful episode, we welcome Mark Leppard MBE back as he shares his transformative leadership journey.
Mark delves into how the pandemic reshaped his outlook on life and work, fostering a deeper sense of empathy, tolerance, and the importance of self-care.
He reflects on the profound impact of meaningful interactions with students, emphasising the importance of legacy beyond physical achievements.
The conversation also navigates the complexities of leadership succession in educational institutions, where Mark offers invaluable strategies for preparing future leaders through mentorship and structured support.
As he looks ahead to his next chapter in school improvement initiatives, Mark discusses the significance of collaboration among school leaders, the joy of family time, and the powerful lessons from the book "Anxious Generation." This episode is packed with practical wisdom and heartfelt reflections, offering listeners a wealth of insights on leadership, legacy, and the challenges of today’s youth.
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Speaker 2:Hey everyone, welcome to the Teach Middle East podcast. I am with Mark Lepard. I just looked back and realized that Mark was on the podcast in 2021. I cannot believe it's been three full years since we chatted on the podcast. So much has changed, so much more to dig in. The last time we spoke, I went back and listened to that episode. So if you're listening to this, maybe go back and listen to that episode and then come back and listen to this episode. But the last time we spoke we were really deep diving into well-being and what you know leaders and schools in general can do to help with staff and student well-being, as well as leaders well-being. But today's podcast is a little bit different. Mark needs very little introduction, even though I'm still going to talk about some of the things he does. I think if you want to know what Mark's about, go follow him on LinkedIn. His posts are insightful. We have a lot to talk about, mark. Welcome to the podcast.
Speaker 3:Lisa, thank you, that's a lovely introduction.
Speaker 2:Now, mark, I wanted to touch base more on a behind the principal's desk type interview, so we're going to leave the school a bit to the last part of this, what I hope to be 30 minutes, and I'm going to go through it really quickly and I'm going to ask a really deep question to kick off how has your perspective on life in general changed in the last two to three years?
Speaker 3:Wow, that's a really good question. Well, I think, speaking really honestly, I don't think values have changed. I think you're right, pers't think values have changed. I think I think you're right. Perspective may have changed.
Speaker 3:Um, I think I've become a little bit more tolerant to things that are going on. Um, and you've used the period two to three years, so let's say it's pretty much around covid and coming out of it, and I think that did change a lot of perspectives. I think it changed a lot of thinking of how we do things for a start. So I think there's more ways of being flexible to solutions and I think there's more ways of using your initiative and finding solutions. But, from a personal perspective, I think I've become a little bit more tolerant.
Speaker 3:I don't think I was intolerant, but I think I now look at things, thinking I don't necessarily know what's going on inside somebody. And I think during COVID, when people were in their own home for a long period of time, some some behaved, acted, were impacted differently from what you may have seen of them prior to COVID. So now in my mind, when we're faced with a challenging situation with an individual, I often think of I don't know what's going on inside. I need to try and scrape away at that a little bit more than taking what's on the surface, and I think that's the biggest change for me in how I look at things. Whether that impacts others I don't know, but it definitely is another layer of thinking for me when I'm dealing with something.
Speaker 2:And in terms of your own personal life, have you changed anything in the last two to three years?
Speaker 3:that's significant two to three years. That's, you know, significant. Um, you know I always talk about looking after yourself and I and I I don't feel selfish saying that um, I do feel we need to make even more of a conscious effort for that, and that's to impact others as well. So, taking the selfish bit away, which I don't think it is selfish, but looking after yourself will now enable you to look after others. And again, I think, as you, you've used the time frame two to three years when we were going through covid, we really had to look after ourselves because we were isolated from some of the support around us, um, and I think not that that's a good thing, but I think it's enabled people maybe to understand that there are coping mechanisms that you have yourself, that you can control. Previously we may have ignored them, thinking there's help elsewhere or I'll just muddle on.
Speaker 3:For me, I think that self-care. I put a post out last week about emails. I know you know you commented and I am far from perfect on this or far from the finished article, but I think we need I now, since COVID, I now regularly try and check what my behaviors are. Are they where I want them to be in terms of self-care. I think before I'd have just smashed through everything and not really reflected back on self-care I'm not talking about others, but on the self-care. I'm not talking about others but on the self-care. So, asking about change for me, I think I make a conscious effort. I get it wrong, but I make a conscious effort to check in regularly. Am I still going the direction I should be in looking after myself?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I like that. So recently I've been doing a lot of thinking about legacy and how do you want to leave a place? How do you want to be remembered? I'm not talking about dying per se, but when you move from one place to the other, how do you want people to think of what you've done, the body of work that you have produced, the impact that you have? So I'm going to ask you the question, mark when you walk away from being a headmaster, how do you want to be remembered?
Speaker 3:Yeah, that's a great question Pertinent at the moment. As you know, both of us have recently suffered loss, so that's about legacy as well. It's interesting. I really am not into when people say about a legacy and you know there's signposts for your legacy and things around the place. That really genuinely doesn't bother me. I think as heads of school or as working in a school, we're blessed that we see our legacy every day when returning students come back.
Speaker 3:If a student comes back and talks to you in a positive way or talks to their friends in a positive way, that that's your real legacy. For me. You've had an impact along the way. So for me, if I'm walking down the street we've recently bought a house in Paul and if I'm walking down the street, we've recently bought a house in Paul. And if I'm walking down the street in Paul and I bump into an ex-student of mine whatever school I've taught at and they come up and say hello, for me that's your legacy, because they've made a conscious effort to come and touch base with you. You must have had an impact that after so many years, they still want to talk to you In school students, not are forced to talk to you.
Speaker 3:Um, in school students not a force to talk to you, but you're in the same environment, so that's slightly different. But for me, walking down the street and bumping into it, either an ex-staff member, an ex-parent, an ex-governor or, most importantly, an ex-student, and they come up and say hello and talk about where they are in their life, for me that's that's true legacy, um, and I'd be really proud if, if, when I walk, that happens. That would be me very, very fulfilled.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I like that. It's almost like the legacy starts now and it's not dependent on whether you leave or not. You're here now and what you're doing now is shown by how people respond to you in the moment. That's a fresh perspective on that. Talk to me about preparing a way for leaders coming through. So you. It sounds like I'm retiring you, but I'm not, because I've got plans for you, mark, regarding my kids. I keep saying that.
Speaker 2:I've got plans You've got to help with my kids, but when you think of the next crop of leaders, what can leaders in your position do to help to bring them up?
Speaker 3:I'm really glad you've asked that, lisa, because we hear all the concerns about teacher shortage and if there's teacher shortage there's going to be leader shortage. You know there's a natural sort of line. But I think there's a lot we can do and I think there's positives out there as well as maybe the press grabbing negatives. So for me there's two parts to a legacy of like leadership legacy or, you know, succession planning, for example. Number one we have to plan our exit so that we are preparing those around us for that time. It's not just the case of I'm turning the lights out, I'm going. I think we need to look. I feel I'm a strong leader, but that's for other people to decide. But the b-sac should continue regardless of who's leading it. I'm just a cog on it so far, 55 year journey, hopefully a cock moving in a positive direction. So I think that momentum we should plan for the day when mark leppard retires or walks away or whatever it is, and it's not just me but every head should be planning when they walk away that they're not leaving a void behind them. So we do a lot of succession planning. We do succession planning for every aspect of leadership in the school. So I know I've worked with my HR department and my chair to put together a whole pack of what the next leader to take over BSAC should look like, who we speak to, what recruitment companies we use, so that if I were to walk away, there's a pack in the safe that people say right, we've got a starting point I think we should be giving out.
Speaker 3:I take every one of my leadership team to board meetings at different times and they present. I remember I became leader at Doha College and there was no succession plan. It was a fairly brutal transition. I just happened to be fortunate to be put in place. But my first ever board meeting was my first board meeting as head. I had no experience before that. I remember it still. I get tingles on the back of my neck. I've worked with Post-its. There's one here.
Speaker 3:I went into my first finance board meeting. I have no financial background whatsoever and I was asked to present a budget. At the time I had no head of accounts and I literally went in with a post-it note saying 75% of school income spent on staff, 20% on this, and they laughed at me. They said you're the head, what are you doing? And I? I said I was really out of my debt, so there was no succession planning. Fortunately, I had a chair who put me in place and said we've put mark in place at short notice. We should be supporting him, not ridiculing him. We should be helping him with our expertise of how we put our finances together, not expecting just because you got the title, you know the job and that's the other thing you you know. I've got a new head of year started at the start of this year.
Speaker 3:Last year they weren't ahead of year so effectively, over a holiday, they've suddenly got the job. Do they know every aspect? No, does everybody who looks at them think they have every aspect of the job? Yes, so we need to mentor, we need to protect, we need to guide, we need to bring staff through that. There's a succession plan for every position in the school. Now, that's not easy. Have we got it right at the moment? No, but is it something we're working on? Yes, we should be asking the exact same question you just asked when that person goes, what's the next plan? And it's not pushing them out the door, it's making sure they can go in a positive, seamless way and the students don't suffer. For me, that's really, really important.
Speaker 2:Again, I'm not rushing you, mark, but for Mark, what does life after headship look like?
Speaker 3:I don't take it, you're rushing me, lisa.
Speaker 2:I swear people, I'm not rushing him, I do. I want him to remain there I want him to remain there for at least another five years yeah, I'm 55.
Speaker 3:I spoke to my chair last week and I said I've no plans on rushing away. I genuinely love my job. I'm not saying it because I'm on a podcast, for you people know, I genuinely I get up every morning and I'm getting to work because it's it's, I'm fulfilled with that. So it's it's, and I'm not using the cliche, it's not a job. It is a job, but I love this job. I really do, and I love, I love. I've just rushed from one meeting to you and I've chatted to three kids along the way about their exams and it put a spring in my step. You know, I was prepared for that. So I'm not rushing away. But, yeah, afterwards I haven't really got a plan. I didn't have a plan to be head either, but I haven't got anything set. But what I would like to do, something I'm really keen to think about, is I'd love to help schools if, if they found I would be of any value on not on inspections, I do that but on school improvement work. You know where the head has a really, you know, difficult issue, um, and they can't see the wood for the trees, as as I regularly can't. But you have someone you can call and say can't see the wood for the trees, as I regularly can't. But you have someone you can call and say can I just talk through this with you? Can, can I just try and unpick it? And we know as leaders the answers with the leader, but sometimes they can't unpick it. So I'd love to do some school improvement work where they have targets from an inspection of how they can then unpick that and implement it. Or just be it on the end of a phone call to say, mark, I'm dealing with this, you.
Speaker 3:I think we shouldn't write off experience. It's, it's a wealth of experience lots of leaders have, but the minute they finish in school, is it utilized? Um, there's a book I've been reading about demotion and instead of seeing as a positive, where you take steps back as you go towards the end of your career, but your mind and your experience is utilized Just, you know, there's a couple of companies in America that do it and I just think that's interesting. You take a lesser role, but you've still captured that person's mind and experience. And I think we talk about teacher shortage, leadership shortage. Surely there's some great expertise out there that has turned the lights out, but then we haven't pulled them back in or let them go a bit early, those sort of things. I think there's a lot of work to be done around that area when you talk about teacher shortage.
Speaker 2:I want to, I want to, I want to just unpack just a little bit. I'm really conscious of that no, no, you carry on what's what's? What do you think ising? And I know people are going to give us the cliche sort of salaries, but really, mark, what else, apart from salaries, is fueling this real teacher shortage that we all hear about?
Speaker 3:Yeah, I'm not sure it is salaries, if I'm absolutely honest. I think in some instances of course it will be, but I don't think people go into teaching to to become a, you know, a millionaire. I think you go in for a different reason. Um, I think some of it is how uh staff are treated, both in terms of by schools, by students, by parents. Where that is a positive interaction, I think people want to stay in the industry. Where it's a negative interaction, I think people want to get out. Just as the same if you were a policeman, if you were a lawyer and you've had negative interactions every day, that's going to force you away. And I do think some schools I'll talk about UK I think standards have slipped in some, and I'm not necessarily talking about the, the teacher, I just think some of the um discipline within schools.
Speaker 3:There's a fear of disciplining students for the kickback maybe from some parents, and I think that that doesn't help. You know, imagine a young teacher with not a lot of uh experience behind them and then being shouted at. You know, we, some of the areas we've come from where there's, you know, imagine a young teacher with not a lot of uh experience behind them and then being shouted at. You know, we some of the areas we've come from where there's, you know, knife crime in school and you think, and that's, that's happening. You know and I'm not saying it's everywhere but are you going to go and work in that type of school? It's not going to be the most attractive to go to. I think you have a different purpose if you're going to that school and a great purpose, but it's not necessarily going to attract the very best teacher or the widest field. Let's say the widest field is probably a better. It's going to be very niche and I think those sort of things impact. Um, I think COVID is going to have an impact on teaching because a lot of other industries where teaching the school holidays was seen as a huge benefit.
Speaker 3:Now my son's going into work at Deloitte, which has previously been described. As you know, they sweat you dry and he's going to be doing three days at home, two days in the office. You know, I think some of the careers that were seen as very corporate and nine to five or nine to very long hours and no flexibility. This covid has now created some flexibility in sectors and I think where previously teaching with some of the positive holidays that you had, I think. I think not that they're not, but I think they're not seen as outstanding as they were before. So I think there's multiple factors. Um, obviously pay will come in, but I think terms and conditions in terms of how you're treated in school and the respect you have.
Speaker 3:If you look at Finland, teaching career is seen as a very high-level career. I don't think the UK government treats it as it should be, the same as they don't with healthcare. We could talk all day about that, but I genuinely think if you were a government that had longer than a four to eight year lifespan which not many do in the UK you'd have a vision of 50 years and you'd be putting that in place and you'd be making sure that you are succession planning. But most of it now I must admit I'm disillusioned is sort of vote grabbing and short term and that that can't be education. That can't be education, that can't be health care, that can't be those sort of sectors.
Speaker 2:Yeah, no, I agree with you. Do you think the UK teacher shortage? Do you think the international schools have a blame in that?
Speaker 3:It's a good question, partly because it may be more attractive to work overseas in some place. Because it may be more attractive to work overseas in some place. But then I say, well, if I was losing students or staff to another school because it was more attractive, I'd try and make mine more attractive. So I think you can't just blame one end saying that's happening. You've got to be saying, well, why is it not happening here? Or what can we do to reverse that? I also don't think you know you talked about when Mark finishes, but I've got lots of't think you know you talked about when mark finishes, but I've got lots of teachers you know, maybe in their 50s, who are thinking of finishing here. They've still got 10, 15 years of great experience teaching to give. Why aren't they being pulled back to the uk? Why is that not attractive? And I said so.
Speaker 3:I think there is a shortage, but I think there's a counter to that shortage that hasn't been tapped into and I think there's a lot of teachers with. You know I would love my children, if they were in the uk, or my grandchildren in the uk, to be being taught by a teacher who's basically trained, you know, wherever, taught in the uk but taught overseas and bring that richness back. Surely that's got to be great. But I don't know if there's that pull effect at the moment and it's not just salaries and tax, because there's countries where people are teaching, where there is all those taxes and similar things, but they're still going overseas. I think we've got to have a mechanism to attract people experience people back into teaching who have been overseas, and it won't solve a shortage, but it certainly addressed some of it yeah, I do agree with you.
Speaker 2:I think previously and I don't know if it's changing but previously people thought when you go overseas, you're really just having a great, wonderful beach holiday and you you're of no benefit when you come back. But I think they're so wrong, um, and they're, they're out, they really are missing out on some great teachers who could come back and help. Earlier in the conversation we talked about, you know that leader who's probably needing someone to talk to them about where they go, not being able to see the woods from the trees. Tell me, what would you say to someone who's probably stepping into headship and they've inherited a school where the succession planning was dreadful. They're actually a new hire into that school and they've come in and it's just a complete shock. What would you advise them? Where should they start?
Speaker 3:Yeah, no, that's a really, that's a really good point and I don't think you have to necessarily be new to headship to suffer those things. It could be a new context, it could be a new challenge. I I, I was on the phone last week to a colleague of a school here, um, who I knew was going through quite a tough time in their own school. And any parents of the schools will see us as rivals. We're rivals on the sports field and I think quite often the external faces and I call parents external, looking in often see schools as competitors. I see them as collaborators. We can share CPD, we can share lots of things. The competition is on the sports field or whatever you know, and at the end of the day the final whistle goes. I can guarantee most heads do not lose a wink of sleep if they've lost their football match to their local rivals. But it's not that it's not important, but it's not as much a rivalry as people think beyond the sports field. So the head was, I thought was possibly struggling. So I called Deborah at BSME and they're a BSME CEO. I said can you just check in on them, make sure they're OK? I gave them a call, not that we can solve anything.
Speaker 3:But I think a head coming into a challenging situation it doesn't have to be new situation, lisa leader, it could be. I could be facing it tomorrow, having colleagues who are not in the school but in the same profession with similar experience, having that as a network. You know, I have a whatsapp group of local Abu Dhabi heads and it's priceless for me and and we you know, has anyone seen this regulation? Has anyone had to deal with this? And someone will. If not had the same situation, had a similar situation. So for me, as a new head or as a current serving head, but new in an area definitely network with your other schools. It's invaluable.
Speaker 3:Give people like yourself a call, who's in the educational circuit, but not necessarily in a school, and say, lisa, you're a connector as well, you know. You'll say, actually, I know such and such. They might be able to help you pull those resources. They're not advertised. Maybe we should advertise them, I don't know, but they are, they are there and I think using that, building that network, is key to I was going to say surviving as head is over on a survival island or something. It's not that bad, but coping as a head and getting over the bits at the time you think is the end of the world. Having a colleague on the end of the phone is priceless and I've benefited from colleagues around the region. Hopefully I've been able to help others as well, and there's no shame in asking for help. I think that's actually more courageous and brave to ask for help meetings.
Speaker 2:Go to those conferences, touch base with people. You are going to find that when you need them they're more readily available than if you say we're very isolated. In your school I often get heads.
Speaker 2:I talked to a lot of heads and I often get some of them. Well, I can't leave my school. I'm like as if it's the walls are going to cave it in, the whole thing is going to fall down, and I'm like that's where the problem is. You have to set things up so you can leave your school sorry, it's that thing I said earlier.
Speaker 3:You're the cog, aren't you? You're just a cog, don't don't over egg what you are you're, you are a cog within the organization. That cog should be able to function. You take that cog out. It should still work that you do not ever think you're the only spinning wheel in there. That's that's where you just become so isolated and internally looking yeah, that's good advice actually to really tap into those networks.
Speaker 2:Um, I wanted to, since we're not pressured for time, guys, so keep your headphones in. Keep your headphones in, mark, let's turn. Let's turn the spotlight on you for a minute. What brings you joy?
Speaker 3:My family spending time. You know, I've been blessed through COVID and after my two sons and my daughter, their university got disrupted. It's not a blessing for them, but I had more time with them when they should have been fleeing the nest. Spending time with family. As you know, my mum recently passed away. We had the funeral last week and it was, I said, a beautifully sad occasion. Sad that she's gone, but it's beautiful that the whole family, cousins, everyone were together. So family is really important to me. Um, so that's personally. Uh, you know, I love, I love my sport.
Speaker 3:So watching, watching any sport, brings me joy, whatever it is, um, but in in work, I get a lot of joy of seeing someone maybe been struggling, maybe lost their way a little bit, and it's not I'm not talking about the discipline just not quite flowing as they should, um, and with some support.
Speaker 3:It doesn't have to come from the head, but they find a way of getting support, be it colleagues, friends, whatever, and seeing them pull through that and then really shining. And for me that's the easy thing to do and you know, here, with contracts, the easy thing to do when someone's struggling, you say that person's not good enough for us. Let's move them on that. That's that happens in some schools. I get more joy turning around saying do you know what? We were right to? Give that person a bit more time, a bit more breathing space, because look at them now and if you can do that, you've got them for life in terms of loyalty and and what they do. So that brings me joy, that you, you take the tougher route and get the better outcome yeah, yeah, I like that.
Speaker 2:What are you reading?
Speaker 3:uh, at the moment I'm reading, uh, anxious generation. Uh. If you haven't read it, lisa, just grab it. I've recommended it. It is the most amazing book, um, about the digital world that we're in, and it's not about screen time, that's a different argument. It is literally scientific data about the impact, um, smartphones and social media have on 8 to 19 year olds all of us, but 8 to 19, because the way the brain develops, that's when we're most addicted, and all the tools that make you addictive are on our screens in front of us, and it's got me really thinking.
Speaker 3:I'm going to do a presentation in a couple of weeks to our year six parents an An example of the book. So, as we were growing up, our rites of passage were 13, because you're becoming a teenager. 16, because you're at 16, you can leave school. There's certain things you're unable to do. 18, the traditional sorry, you're becoming an adult. And 21, the traditional age of an adult. They're the rites of passage. They call them.
Speaker 3:This book's saying the new rite of passage is 11, because when children tend to get a smartphone is when they move from primary to secondary. Parents feel well, that's they've become, they can access everything that they shouldn't have been able to access until 13, 16, 18 and 21. They access them and they're saying that's the new rite of passage. And are children mature enough to be seeing things, doing things at 18-year-olds, 21-year-olds? The answer is no. But the smartphone and the social media and all of this, the impact it's having on ADHD and certain challenges, the impact it's having on self-harm the data is frightening.
Speaker 3:So I'm reading that at the moment and I've recommended it to every one of my parents to read Already. I've had parents coming back going is it too late? What can we do? It is so impactful, the book, I can't recommend it highly. I think it was talked about in British Parliament the other week when they're talking about smartphones and the age of access to social media and all these things. So it's a really good book. You've definitely got to read it. You'll whiz through it. It's amazing.
Speaker 2:I'm definitely going to get it. My kids don't have a smartphone. They're probably the only ones in their year, seven class, without one. I do not have them on social media either. I just I'm scared for them.
Speaker 3:So you're absolutely right, and that's good parenting. And there'll be them coming home saying, mum, I'm the uncoolest kid in school because I haven't got it and all my friends have got it. And there's that emotional blackmail as well, that you're being pulled in. Pulled in, fight it, lisa, honestly, because if you read this book, you're going to just thank yourself that you haven't broken yet.
Speaker 2:Wow, okay, I'm definitely going to read that and what's on your list? What's? On your list, are you? Reading Anxious Generation. What's on your list? I'm just. What else is on my?
Speaker 3:list. I always take recommendations Me too.
Speaker 2:That's what I'm doing right now.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I'm just going to pull them up because I've just downloaded a few, so you don't mind me, I I've got them here in my library. Uh, what else? Time to think is something I want to read by nancy klein. I haven't read that yet. A lot of I don't know some people have recommended it. Um, I'm, I started reading and I stopped.
Speaker 3:A thing called the checklist manifesto. Uh, at all guande. Um, it's about putting lists in place and it's about it's really about the medical profession, but it's actually putting procedures in place to make sure that you don't make the same mistakes again in a business environment or school environment. So we were talking about cybersecurity and if you're going to do it, you need a checklist manifesto sort of thing. That stuff, sapiens, I'm about to read. Um, I haven't read that yet. So, uh, I think that's it on my on my list at the moment. Oh, upstream as well. I started that. That's pretty good.
Speaker 3:Um, it's about going to the source of the problem and not trying to put remedial things in place. So, uh, the story is someone a 10 year old falls in a river and drowns. So they say let's put a fence up. Okay, well, they will beyear-old falls in a river and drowns. So they say let's put a fence up. Okay, well, they walk beyond the fence and then fall in and drown. Okay, let's put a life ring there. So now you've put a fence and a life ring. Well, actually, if you went upstream and taught them how to swim, you'd be solving the problem. Don't put remedial things in. Go to the heart of the issue.
Speaker 2:We talked just now when you were mentioning the book Anxious Generation, about the ills of social media and starting young. But as someone who creates content, you sometimes do create content on LinkedIn. You're not so much on Twitter. You're like me now. You're not on X anymore, are you? I've stopped as well. It's become too toxic. I'm like, nope, no, thank you for x. But what would you say are the advantages of putting your thoughts out the way you do on a platform such as linkedin for people in your position or even others other educators yeah, I like linkedin because I see it as a professional support mechanism, a professional sharing mechanism, so putting the thoughts out.
Speaker 3:There's two things I hope to achieve. One is others may benefit from my insight and it's not saying mine's the only one but also come back and challenge and offer further things. So I put one out about use of emails. I've picked up three or four great tips this week about that. But I also think it's the art of writing. It doesn't have to be LinkedIn.
Speaker 3:Linkedin just seems to get a wider sphere, but when you put things down in writing or typing, I think it orders your thoughts as well and you become clearer. So the benefit for me of putting something on LinkedIn is actually processing my thoughts so I get an orderly fashion, so they're clear in my mind. There's only two ways I can Well, three ways I can do. That is one putting it on something like LinkedIn, and the other two are going for a long walk or going for a swim and where I can't be disrupted and I get my thoughts in order. So I think it's the ordering of thoughts is the biggest wellbeing benefit of the social media. Sharing ideas and then getting ideas back helps me professionally as well.
Speaker 2:Yeah, do you think it's something other school leaders should do?
Speaker 3:Yeah, I think each to their own, but I think the bit about sharing an insight for others. So getting my thoughts in order, that's a personal thing. Others may say I don't like it that way, I'll do something else. That's fine, but I think there's a lot of leaders out there who are quiet and don't share things Not a criticism, but I don't think they actually see the wealth of experience they have and the benefits it could add to others. So for me, taking that bold leap and saying I've got something to share I think we're always a bit nervous of that. Is it worth sharing? How's it going to be reviewed? I think on LinkedIn, if there's a challenge challenge, it's a professional challenge. So you that that gets you sharper. So I think I would definitely encourage others to share their experiences to benefit others and what you get back benefits you as well yeah, how do they get over that?
Speaker 2:you know that little bit of I don't even know what to call. I don't don't want to call it fear, but you know that anxiety yeah.
Speaker 3:Do you know what I think? I think aren't we just saying that to students every day, to kids every day? Try this, try that you know, live by what the standard you're asking of others and just do it. You know what a great thing to say to kids. Do you know what? I'm asking you to do something? And the other week I I hadn't written ever on linkedin and I wrote on it and I was really nervous and but I've got this. It's a positive example. Kids will empathize more with you because you empathize with them.
Speaker 2:So I would say, you know, just do what we ask of our students every day yeah, yeah, my other question, because, see, we have time, but I want this is my second to last one. I promise no problem in education right now. What are you excited about?
Speaker 3:yeah, I'm genuinely excited about the future of international education. I'm not as excited about the UK at the moment and I just think that outside of the UK, the UK education system is seen as, I won't say, the, but a gold standard. It's held in such high regard and I think, why is that? Yet in the UK it's not seen like that. And for me, I'm excited about the future for education internationally. I think it's a growing market, I think it's uh, innovative.
Speaker 3:Um, when I've gone to the conferences like BSME, fabicia, etc. And I go to UK ones as well, I think I think the international sphere of experts and what they're talking about is really dynamic and forward thinking. Um, so that excites me. Um, and I'm excited. I know, you know you talked about succession plan. I'm excited that I'm still involved in it and I still feel I've got worth to be involved in it. Um, so that that really excites me. Um, the things kids come, the things kids come up with on a daily basis of what they want to do, their dreams and their ambitions are endless and that's got to be exciting.
Speaker 3:You know, gone are the days of the kid going. I want to be a fireman, I want to be a. You know the sort of stereotypical careers Not that there's anything wrong with those but our kids have like an unlimited array of options that we haven't even heard of and I just think that's in some ways frightening if we're not used to that. But if you take that fear away, you think how can we help those kids do that when we don't even know ourselves? That's exciting to learn ourselves. So I'm excited about kids' futures and I'm excited about, you know, kids' futures and I'm excited about international education.
Speaker 2:And in terms of BSAC. Now I'm just kind of honing it down, narrowing it down what exciting things do you have planned coming up, because I think more than likely this episode is going to be out in the start of the new academic year, because we're already in June and we kind of back um back catalogue our episodes. What are you excited about for BSAC in the new academic year?
Speaker 3:Yeah, look, I think a great school never stands still. The minute you stand still, you're effectively going backwards and you're not doing the kids justice. So we've got um, we've got a new, a lot. We had a new science build last year, um, but that's triggered an ambition within the school that we can't rebuild the whole school, but we're going to regenerate a lot of areas of the school. So we've got uh areas where we're going to be able to bring more parents into events. So new coffee shops and all that interaction. That's like our facility plan is exciting.
Speaker 3:But what really excites me is, um, we've got a huge array of courses at the school that we're trying to. We're starting with e-sports BTEC. We're doing AI BTEC. So we've got lots of new. Yeah, we're already doing an AI BTEC. It's a. It's around about a GCSE level. It's not a full BTEC but it's giving the kids an insight into that.
Speaker 3:We're looking at hospitality BTEC. We've got new a levels coming on board. We've got a huge well-being program. We've got a huge sustainability launch where we put someone in. I've got a new director of digital coming in, a new director of sport coming in really exciting. We're going to try and be a lead on EDI. We're working with Angie Brown. She's going to come over and work with us and we're going to make a full commitment to our staff and wider community and other schools that we become a hub for that. It's not saying we're there now, we're certainly not, but you know they're exciting. It's where we're not, but where we can be is really exciting to me. So hopefully in if you ask me again in a year's time, I'll say a lot of those. They're never completed but they're much further along than we are today. So those sort of things excite me, lisa.
Speaker 2:I like that. I like the fact that you understand that it's a journey and you're willing to go on that journey and that's exciting in itself. So it's september and you're back. What's the summer plan? What, what? What are we doing in the summer? That's my last question and that's a problem no problem, I'm gonna.
Speaker 3:Just I'm gonna pull you up on one thing. You say it's like a journey. I always say it's like an adventure, because we don't always know where the ending is true, that is true it's an adventurous journey, let's call it an adventurous journey.
Speaker 3:I'm going to use that. I like that Adventurous journey, that's a great way. What are the plans? Yeah, so happy and sad times.
Speaker 3:We're all going on a family holiday to Greece Naxos. We went there last year, we love it. So my daughter's flying out from England. My two boys are here at the moment. They're flying with us, but that's not the end of them in abadabi, but, um, they're going off to their careers after this. So we go to greece for a couple of weeks, then back to the uk, but we'll be putting our son on a plane to, uh, saudi arabia, who's just secured a math teaching job in the british international school, riad, which I'm delighted for he's. He's just done his pgc here, so for me that's a joy that we've got someone starting their career in the family. My other son has just secured an audit and risk job with Deloitte in Newcastle, so he's off there. So they go the same day. So really proud as a parent, a bit sad because literally next year we'll have none of our kids around, although they've told me they're regularly visiting. So that'll be nice.
Speaker 2:And the one in Saudi is not too far away. It'll be you and Paulette and the dog.
Speaker 3:Yeah, she'll find out what I'm really like then and throw me out the window.
Speaker 2:Oh gosh, but it sounds like a really big time of transition for you. So I do wish you all the best with that and I wish you a great summer and we will definitely be touching base in the new academic year. I want to officially on the podcast. Thank you for your support for you know, for your content on LinkedIn, for tagging me and for really keeping me in the loop. I really enjoy that for tagging me and for really keeping me in the loop. I really enjoy that and I also enjoy just the work that you're doing at BSAC. I want to put it on record you have been one of those principals that have remained really consistent and I really enjoy just watching from afar the work that you're doing. So thank you.
Speaker 3:Lisa, that means a lot. It really does. I'll have to go off soon. She'll have me in tears.
Speaker 2:No, you're fine. Thank you so much for being on the podcast with me today, Mark.
Speaker 3:Lisa, always a pleasure. I love chatting to you. Thank you, you're welcome.
Speaker 1:Thank you for listening to the Teach Middle East podcast. Visit our website teachmiddleeastcom and follow us on social media. The links are in the show notes.
