Death to Life podcast
#172 From Trauma to Healing: Joshua Bonifacio's Journey Through Faith, Community, and Personal Transformation
How does one navigate cross-generational trauma, strict religious upbringing, and cultural challenges? Join us for an emotional and uplifting conversation with Joshua Bonifacio as he shares his journey from trauma to healing.
Joshua recounts the confusion of growing up between his father's strict Jehovah's Witness beliefs and his mother's Catholic traditions, the strain of his parents' divorce, and the impact on his faith. He reveals the values of Filipino community and family, and the pain of losing these connections after relocating to Georgia.
Joshua details his experiences in a violent household and the emotional aftermath of his mother’s abusive relationship. A pivotal act of defiance led him to find solace in hip-hop and art. His journey highlights the importance of addressing past traumas and finding community and personal transformation through spirituality and close friends.
Experience Joshua's spiritual awakening in South Portland, where a powerful connection with Jesus brought him love and acceptance. This episode underscores the significance of community, love, and healing from past trauma through faith. Join us for a heartfelt prayer for those affected by trauma and an invitation to the Death to Life Bible study—a space for discussing the gospel and finding healing in community.
Chapters
0:00 - From Trauma to Healing
7:33 - Community, Values, and Trauma Healing
17:59 - Surviving and Thriving Through Adversity
27:51 - Seeking Community, Finding Stability
31:13 - Discovering Jesus Through Community and Healing
43:44 - Transformation and Community Through the Gospel
48:28 - Embracing the Call
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📚 LEARN more at our site: lovereality.org
4o
Looking for discipleship and fellowship? Join a Circle at lovereality.org/circles
How does one navigate cross-generational trauma, strict religious upbringing, and cultural challenges? Join us for an emotional and uplifting conversation with Joshua Bonifacio as he shares his journey from trauma to healing.
Joshua recounts the confusion of growing up between his father's strict Jehovah's Witness beliefs and his mother's Catholic traditions, the strain of his parents' divorce, and the impact on his faith. He reveals the values of Filipino community and family, and the pain of losing these connections after relocating to Georgia.
Joshua details his experiences in a violent household and the emotional aftermath of his mother’s abusive relationship. A pivotal act of defiance led him to find solace in hip-hop and art. His journey highlights the importance of addressing past traumas and finding community and personal transformation through spirituality and close friends.
Experience Joshua's spiritual awakening in South Portland, where a powerful connection with Jesus brought him love and acceptance. This episode underscores the significance of community, love, and healing from past trauma through faith. Join us for a heartfelt prayer for those affected by trauma and an invitation to the Death to Life Bible study—a space for discussing the gospel and finding healing in community.
Chapters
0:00 - From Trauma to Healing
7:33 - Community, Values, and Trauma Healing
17:59 - Surviving and Thriving Through Adversity
27:51 - Seeking Community, Finding Stability
31:13 - Discovering Jesus Through Community and Healing
43:44 - Transformation and Community Through the Gospel
48:28 - Embracing the Call
💰 DONATE & SUPPORT our Ministry: lovereality.org/give
👍 LIKE us on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/alovereality
📷 FOLLOW us on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/riyoung31/
📚 LEARN more at our site: lovereality.org
4o
Looking for discipleship and fellowship? Join a Circle at lovereality.org/circles
The world doesn't think that the gospel can change your life, but we know that it can and that's why we want you to hear these stories, stories of transformation, stories of freedom, people getting free from sin and healed from sin because of Jesus. This is Death to Life.
Speaker 2:I put a big hole in the wall, I picked up the lawnmower and I threw it through another wall and then, when they heard a loud crash, they stopped fighting and opened the garage door and saw what I was doing and I yelled at them that they needed to grow up. All this fighting, all this like I just it was me like yelling painfully and just trying to like get them to think that I'm going crazy or something. Right, right, yeah. And then they my mom, recognized it right away. She yelled like he doesn't do this, we are damaging him.
Speaker 1:Yo, yo, yo, yo yo. What is good? Welcome to the death to life podcast. My name is Richard Young and today's episode is with my bro, my guy Joshua Bonifacio. This guy has a beautiful heart. There is some trauma in his story, there's some heartbreaking stuff, but God has made a way and has revealed himself to Joshua in such a beautiful way. Yeah, some of this stuff is dark, but when it's real dark, that means the light shines much brighter. So buckle up, strap in. This is Joshua, love y'all, appreciate y'all. All right, my man, where are we starting? Where are you taking us to? Where does the journey of Mr Bonifacio, where does it begin?
Speaker 2:Oh man. I was born to two immigrant parents who moved to America to give me a better life and was not prepared for what would actually happen once they got here. And they are both believers in Jesus but also did not really know the gospel, so you got a lot of cross-generational trauma that's passed over. Trying to find that balance and what it means for having a kid in a land that you don't speak the language of.
Speaker 1:So I mean, where did they immigrate from the Philippines, the Philippines, and you were born in the philippines, or you were born here I was born here.
Speaker 2:They came here. I want to say 90, 92, I want to say, and then and 91, 92, honestly 92, and then they had me the next year, so I'm a 93 baby you're 10 years younger than me.
Speaker 1:What part of the country did they theyrate to? Was it the Northwest or somewhere else?
Speaker 2:Northwest.
Speaker 1:They came out in Oregon. Wow. So they were believers but didn't know how life kind of worked out here and it was tough going what happened?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so my dad's side is Jehovah's Witness and then my mom's side is Catholic and they also didn't really connect with legalism of it all, because both sides are very legalistic and there's also an unsaid thing that happens in the Filipino culture where they go to the particular and surrounding social circles didn't really connect with the gospel itself. They were very focused on we are sinners, we have to redeem ourselves every day, every second. And then jehovah's witness side was like they were also very legalistic and my my experience with that on my dad's side was was like this is not the same as what. Yes, there is jesus, but he was, was on a stake. There was no cross, it was just constant little bits and changes that they didn't believe that was the same to other Christian faiths.
Speaker 1:So I don't know too much about the Jehovah's Witnesses, except that they came out in the early 19th century and they and they pretty strict, like no birthdays and stuff like that. Did you, oh yeah sorry.
Speaker 2:Yeah, when you that hot laugh is uh is a trauma hit oh sorry, dude, when's your birthday, we need to celebrate with you no, here you go.
Speaker 2:This is why that laugh came out. My birthday is December 26. Oh, wow. And so it's the day after Christmas. And then my dad's side was not very big on holidays or birthdays. And then I'm back to back. Wow, yeah. So there would be like on my dad's side it would be I'm not supposed to. I'm like growing up as a kid, I'm not supposed to. I'm like growing up as a kid, I'm not supposed to celebrate, not do anything. At least it felt that way. And then my mom as soon as I leave my cause, my parents got divorced so I'm going back between them every two weeks, so there's no downtime between right. So dad's side would be like quiet, like not much, like no celebration, and then on my mom's side, Merry Christmas, happy birthday.
Speaker 3:And then oh wait, i't stop my dad's outside the door. Let them walk away first, and then let me gradually warm up to it.
Speaker 1:Who is stricter in their beliefs?
Speaker 2:Between my parents or, like the family circles, your parents Between my parents. Here's the thing is that my mom and my dad both felt something was off, and so they would teach me stories and talk about it a little bit, but when it came to actually practicing it, it wasn't really there. So it would be mostly the aunties and uncles and grandparents, which Filipinos are really tight knit, so I would see them all the time. They were the ones who really it was mainly grandparents, and then my dad's side, what I think was, uh, heavier on the legalism of it.
Speaker 1:Wow, so you come into the world. Do you remember your parents being together, or for the most part you?
Speaker 2:that was pretty much separate pretty much separate in having their own Issues, so I was forced to grow up pretty quickly.
Speaker 1:Yeah, tell me about that.
Speaker 2:My, my dad had his own problems with what it means to be a man in this country and how to pass it on and be a good father to his son, and I could sense a lot of pressure happening with him. But as a kid you don't really know what to do. They just know that something's up and then and that kind of the similar stance on my mom's side. It wasn't maybe until my mid-20s when I started really connecting the dots on why my parents were the way. They were Having to come over here, sacrificing a ton of stuff and you're supposed to be with your life partner and then now you're not, and just the pressure of having this fast-growing kid who is loud and all over the place and jumping everywhere and asking questions. My, my parents really really dug in deep and tried to do their best, but I could. They hurt. They were hurting a lot. They were hurting a lot, yeah.
Speaker 1:What kind of values do you feel like you picked up from, like the Filipino culture that you grew up in, from both families, but or or both sides, not together. What kind of values do you think were instilled? Oh my goodness.
Speaker 2:Yeah, community and family was probably is I'm not gonna say was probably, but it actually is the number one state like staple. That was embedded in me from an early age. The whole, even like the little things they do, where, even if they're not blood relatives, they would be my auntie and uncle somehow. This is auntie Craig Johnson. Oh, cool, hi, nice to meet you.
Speaker 2:I am five years old and I think you are my relative and I'm sharing plates of food with them all the time, always asking if you're hungry, to make sure you're full, even though you've had your fourth, third plate of lumpia and rice and everything. And they're always asking if you want to take food home. We overcooked, we have all this stuff. We have get-togethers and just being socially around other people all the way to night. It was really crazy All these older people and just a variety of ages constantly being with each other and eating and talking and socializing.
Speaker 2:That's something that was embedded into me very young. I then became the kid who would run around in the apartment complex knocking on all the doors, asking if the friends could come out and try to get people together, to the point where the parents knew it was me. They didn't even check the door and he was like, hey, josh, before they even like, before they even looked the door, they were like, hey, josh, before they even looked the eye hole Okay, Kayla can't come out to play right now, but she can in an hour. I'm like, okay, sir, and I'll just run off and knock the next door. So I took that on at a really young stage in my life.
Speaker 1:So as you're growing up, I mean what happened man? What happened man? You're living mostly with your mom. Is that a trauma? Laugh.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it is, we're going to mark them through the video.
Speaker 2:What happened in your life? Yeah, a lot of trauma. So I'll just fast forward a little bit. My mom met a guy who she had my lovely brother and sister with Andrea and Andrew, and we moved down to Georgia. We lived off a Marine base and that took me away from all of the social circles that I had, familial and friendly, so I didn't get to see my family and friends a whole lot. It was just ripped from my life. But then I was able to build a new community down in Georgia, which I still connect with because we lived in a small town called Leesburg, georgia, and it was a wonderful place. It still is a wonderful place, but I didn't have any family and we also did not go to church at all. So God was also ripped away from my life too, and so I was left in.
Speaker 2:I felt like I was walking. I keep thinking about walking through the wilderness and just like trying to figure it out, and it's it's. The relationship between my mom and this guy deteriorated and also got violent. It became a very violent home, abusive home we're talking like broken glass everywhere, hitting each other. I went through a very abusive stage there too, where I was I'm a bigger kid kid I was, I had a bigger body and I was more athletic and so, uh, I could like tank the hits, but it's still like. It's still like it embedded like a, the trauma and psychological pain of like, when pain comes along, I like become like a robot and just shut down and like bet what's next because it just it would just keep happening. So people are like fight or flight and I was very much stand and take it kind of guy where, like I don't want to like cry and or like show that it hurts, but oh it hurt for you was is that freeze?
Speaker 1:I don't we try to pigeonhole everybody. There's fight, flight or freeze you just. You just took it like it's like a chant yeah, like I, I would quite literally tank it.
Speaker 2:So, but as in, like the hits would come my way and I would hit it and I wouldn't hit back and or try to yell back, I just took it and then wait and then cried by myself like in the corner or yeah, some, this is. I don't know if it's gonna be part of recording, but this is the part in the story where we got into it. The first time I tried to record with you and then I was like, oh, I was not ready to talk about this and that's why I kind of panic, like anxiety really. Yeah, so this is where. But I like I'm better this time around, but that's, this is like the part of the story where it got it.
Speaker 1:I realized I hadn't talked about it in so long oh wow, just even talking about the violence or talking about that aspect, just the feelings all came back, huh.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it came back harder than I thought it was. Again, it was the psychological trauma of going, of going oh, I can take it. It might be more of me being a man if anything going like oh yeah, no, I can handle it. And then it comes up like, oh wait a second, I got water coming from my eyes and yeah, but yeah like what if stuff really hurts?
Speaker 1:what if it? There's really sad things in life and if we're men, we're not supposed to believe that they're sad or that these things hurt. You know that that's like the toxic masculinity, that that we can't act like things hurt but it hurt man.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it, it did it it's. It becomes, uh, almost a muscle memory. I don't like no man ever decided no one ever decides to go in their head. Go, I'm gonna be a toxic masculine man, right, it just it's. Things happen and then it becomes patterned because it's not corrected. Then it usually takes community or someone near you who cares about you to point it out and go, hey, that's something's wrong. And then you have to come to peace with that and decide if you want to, you know, hit it head on and try to figure it out or keep burying it down. I buried it down for a while.
Speaker 1:I think that's what we're taught right and in the light of freedom it's okay to. It's okay not even in the light of freedom, it's okay to feel things, because you can't help but feel things. And if we suppress them so that we don't feel like I've said this a ton before we don't turn down just one feeling. If you're going to turn down feelings, you're turning down all of the feelings and then you're just walking around as a robot. So after we recorded last time, you realized oh man, that's what hit me in that moment. I hadn't thought about that for a while.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I ignored signs of just oh man, I feel like I'm trying to over-explain it and seem like it's really well thought out. It wasn't. It was very simple, it was straight up, like I thought I could handle it and then realized I hadn't talked about it in years and even the last time I talked about it actually was in my baptism at PBC. Yeah, and I was bawling and I was crying because my mom and my little cousins were there, you guys are here and I love you so much and there was so much pain that was let out. And then I and I just shut, shut it down again, never talked about it until the time we had a interview, until we talked so that experience.
Speaker 1:How long did it last down there in georgia with this guy? Six and a half years, six years so this is right as a child going up into your teen years or before that from fourth grade to junior year of high school. Wow. Yeah, so basically my whole my developmental yeah absolutely Absolutely, and so you coped with life by just taking it on head on then, just like being a tank absorbing, yeah, being it's just being tough and then smiling and laughing on the outside to deflect and make a lot of jokes.
Speaker 2:And yeah, just being a quote, unquote a man about it.
Speaker 1:Was God a consideration at this point there?
Speaker 2:was no, it was not. There were glimpses of every now and then we would go to a church, go to a church maybe once every three years, two or three years. Towards the end, my mom decided to put us into a church community just to just because, I think she just felt that she's had enough and saw the change happening with me and that I wasn't doing okay, and especially my younger brother and sister, who were babies and toddlers this whole time, mind you. So they were like, they were in the same home that I was and the. So we started going to a church, maybe my freshman, sophomore year of high school, and I didn't know anything about church other than the kingdom hall, jehovah's witness and Catholic church, and even then I wasn't really tapped into a community. As a kid my parents didn't do that. I don't think they knew how to. But then I found out, like they have, it's not just church, isn't just mass church, isn't just the main sermon, because before that I always thought it was oh, you come, you listen to the preacher and then you leave and there's nothing else around it.
Speaker 2:And then I found out about what there's youth groups, there's these other, like men's meetings and then women's meetings and like all this, like Bible studies.
Speaker 2:I had no idea about that.
Speaker 2:When I found out there was youth group, being a youth myself at the time, I was elated and also sad because I felt like I missed out on so much too, not knowing that there was kids my age who were just hanging out every night or whenever they're, whenever church would have them, and just connecting and growing, and that put that, made me really sad because I compared it. I made myself sadder. I would compare these kids who are having fun and laughing, and I also felt like I had an imposter syndrome being there laughing with them, because at the same time that when I found out about youth group and hanging out with these people and these kids my age, at the same time, any other night before church it would be me crying in my room and bruised up, and so it was a huge 180. When we talk about just when the gospel starts to enter just a little bit into your life, it's so much better and I had so many mixed feelings and I'm still friends with these people to this day. We're like connecting.
Speaker 1:The small town culture is real, Would you say you were like aloof, Like when you went to these meetings and stuff, were you? Because I met you for the first time in person a couple of weeks ago and you're a big dude. Uh, you were probably a big dude back then, Were you just kind of the big dude. That's kind of just quiet and uh doesn't just nervous.
Speaker 2:No, I was the opposite. I was. I was the biggest dude in the room, I was the loudest, I was the funniest and I was I. A lot of people looked, a lot of people wanted to hang out and invited me and stuff, and I always came up with an excuse not to go. It would the. My home life was still pretty much pretty violent and not good, and so I would connect with these people, I would compartmentalize. This is the. These are the hours I get to have fun, and so I'm going to have as much fun as I can, so I'm going to tell jokes. I'm going to have as much fun as I can, so I'm going to tell jokes. I'm going to hang out, do like, be crazy and had just run around with people and then and then after that it was no more fun. After that it was time to buck up and just get ready for whatever happens that night.
Speaker 1:Hmm, so you were there up until your junior year. What happened at your junior year?
Speaker 2:All right. This is why I started crying last time, because this is what happened. Um, I became I'm very self-aware of how my situation was going. My mom was stuck in a trauma cycle and she's been through so much that I see her lost in this cycle of violent crying, hurt, missing family, not able to go anywhere. At times she would disappear from the house just because of all the violence, and she knows she doesn't want to fight, she's tired of fighting. So she would go stay like she was sleeping her van outside and like the driveway, or she would go to a motel or maybe hang out with friends, but she would disappear for a while.
Speaker 2:Um, and then her boy, her boyfriend at the time. He would start drinking at noon, so he would always have the big, tall cans of Miller Lite to start chugging and then be drunk before the day, before the sun even sets. So I would be left alone with him. And then my younger brother and sister, andrea and Andrew, who were born one year and one day apart. They got so used to the yelling, the violence, the cursing, the crashing of plates and furniture. They got so used to it that I would see them in the living room still playing and laughing with each other and toys, while all the violence was happening in the background, because they thought it was normal and that was very heartbreaking to see. They're like, oh yeah, mom and dad are just going at it again. This is what happens. And the stepdad mom's boyfriend at the time sometimes he would put his hands on me, sometimes he would just curse me out or just say really horrible stuff, or he would make me go sleep on the porch or lock me out or whatever it is.
Speaker 2:So, all this coming to a head, I felt like I needed to do something. It was the beginning, or maybe the summer, of my junior year. I want to say that I've never thrown hands back. I've never reacted. I've always tanked it and went back. So I needed. I decided that I needed to do something out of character, but I didn't want to hurt anyone, but I wanted to do something. That was like alarming and the best I could do at the time was I went to the garage and I put a big hole in the wall while they were fighting. So mom came home and they're having another one of their arguments. I put a big hole in the wall, I picked up the lawnmower and I threw it through another wall oh, wow, yeah, it's like the incredible style I?
Speaker 2:I was. I was doing sports too at that time, so you know, I was also, really I was also big. And then when they heard a loud crash, they stopped fighting and opened the garage door and saw what I was doing and I yelled at them that they needed to grow up. All this fighting, all this, I just it was nothing. It's probably sounds way more sophisticated now, way more cinematic. It was not.
Speaker 2:It was me yelling painfully and just trying to get them to think that I'm going crazy or something right or like see that what they're doing has an effect, Because my brother and sister have decided that it was normal, because they were babies and they didn't know better. And I was like I'm literally the only catalyst that could do something. Yeah, and then they my mom recognized it right away. She yelled like he doesn't do this, we are damaging him. She yelled it like out loud and then he, the her boyfriend didn't react to it, and I think that's the kind of what sealed the deal with my mom too, to like officially call it off, because she saw her babies like hurting. And then the her boyfriend didn't actually care and then he tried to put his hands on me again, and this time, instead of just taking it, I like resisted and he found out that I was a bit stronger than him in resisting and then that made him feel unsafe.
Speaker 2:So we him being feeling unsafe because I decided to resist this time was also another sealed deal. To like actually leave, get us out, Like we were not going back. Mom and I lived in a motel, living off the vending machine, for maybe a, maybe a month. I don't really like that part because it's a little bit blacked out, but I want to say about a month and then we got money to fly ourselves back here to Oregon and and I would finish high school here- Wow, so uh you, you still had family back in Oregon.
Speaker 2:We did. Yeah, they didn't know how bad it was. Yeah, they didn't. They didn't know how bad it was.
Speaker 1:They, they learned after the fact. When you get back here to oregon, did things slow down for you? Did you feel safety? Or talk to me about that?
Speaker 2:man. You see an aquarium where you like spray in water or like shuffle up all the rocks and the dust, right, it has been clean in a while and then it all starts gently floating down and eventually settles and then you can see the fish and how beautiful it is. That's what it was like for, maybe in the next, until right before covet. So 2017, 2018 like I mentioned, that's when I met. During these time I started going doing hip-hop, like dancing and doing artistic things. I got got into the hip hop world. I would go into these underground studios, these rented out clubs that I should not be in, but somehow I got in and would hang out with all these artists in the city who just come out at night.
Speaker 2:I met Hui and Bebe in that scene and I was still in high school and it was years later when we and BB had Bible studies and invited me to come check it out. And this whole time I've always been, I've been trying to figure out this relationship with God and the gospel. I went to different churches, had really weird experiences, but nothing ever connected. So this is the first time I actually went to a Bible study. I like an actual sit down at home Bible study and it was different. It was connecting. Things made sense and I felt good about it and I was like I'm gonna come back again.
Speaker 1:Wait, hold on Through the dancing. What made you so you get into hip hop dancing? You, you graduate high school. What was the plan that you just like dancing, or what was the plan for your?
Speaker 2:oh no, dancing was like an output, so I was. I have an artistic output that I need to take care of, so I did a bunch of drawing, but dancing was a bunch of exertion, right, and it was to music that I enjoyed and I. It was also the very first time I connected with other people who believed in an art craft that would hype each other up and connect with you outside of just the performance or just outside of the building. And because it was, hip-hop is a culture, yeah, where it's not just the music they connect on, like the views and what's being said, and sometimes it's healthy, sometimes it's not, but either way it was connecting. So so I was looking for that outside of high school I wanted to do. I went to school for film.
Speaker 1:You went to school for film. That sounds super cool, so you found like a family with this dance community.
Speaker 2:I did. I did, and it's funny because they do give you nicknames. So there's almost a small disassociation with having to deal with your trauma and deal with who you are. Because you can, you're recognized as something else, so you can build almost a persona on top of what's actually everything that you live through. What was your nickname? I had two. One was at first it was ATL, because I was from Georgia, and they're like. One was at first it was ATL because I was from Georgia and they're like oh, atlanta is the capital of Georgia. That's cool, you're ATL. And then I got a nickname called Aang. I don't know if, but there's a cartoon called the Last Airbender, avatar, the Last Airbender.
Speaker 1:I've heard of it, I haven't seen it.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:So the main character, his name's Aang and he's like this bubbly dude who is just happy all the time, wants to be with his friends and he can get serious, but most of the time he tries to be happy and also just lighthearted. Also, he's pretty much buzz cut like shaved and I was rocking a life in that dance community, like I've done now three, no, maybe four interviews with people from this specific dance community. Uh, on the desert life podcast, what was the negative things about the community that were confusing or tough to deal with or mixed messages?
Speaker 2:Yeah. So it's like surface level validation at first, where you get this, you get cool nicknames. There's like fashion stuff that happened right and where you like you dress cool, people really love it. You get validated for basically confidence and doing really outstanding things that show that you are a great, unique individual and that we love it. And there's a lot of love for the individual and for yourself. And then there's a lot of hate that comes out when some of that is challenged. This, for me in particular, allowed me to again.
Speaker 2:I was going through the same mindset from when I was in Georgia, where this is the amount of hours I have to have fun and then out of that I got to go back to doing life and just trying to back that. I have all these triggers and my PTSD would come through during these hours and have to deal with it. But there is a disassociation and disconnect where I wasn't really getting better. I wasn't actually getting healthier, I wasn't actually getting happier. I had an escape and it felt very unhealthy and material.
Speaker 2:It felt very plastic, especially when you see some of the older people who've been around in the scene and they've they're still struggling with the same stuff and they have. There's no improve, improvement, and then you see some of that. Where they're just been, there's a lot of suffering and you, over the years, where people your age or even older than you are still going through the same thing and you just have to think to yourself there's got to be more than this. I don't want to. I don't want to be 60, 70 years old walking through the same thing and you just have to think to yourself there's got to be more than this. I don't want to. I don't want to be 60, 70 years old walking through the streets, always going to this meeting with wondering like what happened to all the young folk, and then I'm so grumpy and like mad about my own existence.
Speaker 1:Yeah, community is powerful in that way, cause it can bond you even in a negative thing, but to love and be loved. Man, we're just, we're built for it, and so we search for it, looking for it, and then we might end up looking in the wrong place, but from this community. So, hui and Bibi, when you met them, they were obviously or you tell me, were they vibing with God at all, or were they just like the coolest kids or just a part of this community?
Speaker 2:So Bibi has always been a sweetheart to me. Bibi and I have always connected, on the same page, where we see each other and we have big smiles so good to see you and it's like actually having a very positive aura. I knew Hui before he came to Jesus, I would say, and where he was still in his Red Bull DJ kind of bull, like dj kind of days, like the like chasing the dollar, and at that time we just knew each other by name and it was very casual but we didn't really connect other than just seeing each other at the same kind of stuff or going to his event that he would host and he would host some really like banger events, like a ton of people would come out, like he would shut down blocks and yeah and it would be. People were so thankful for it and I so I've been to a number of these things with him and I was.
Speaker 2:This was very much, I felt, was like more is better, more is better. Everyone's here, there's so many people of different, varying cultures and like coming out and partying and having a good time. And then it was like blackout, where I was like I'm not really, I'm not happy and I want to and I'm getting this call from. I don't know what it was at the time, but it was definitely the Holy spirit in hindsight that saw me like you need to come to church, you need to come connect and figure this out, because you've been thinking about this way too long and putting it off. And then we post on Facebook. You know who wants to come to a Bible study. Like years later, out of nowhere, I'm like Whoa, okay, yeah, that'd be dope. And I'm like it's going to be like a hip hop Bible study is going to be like a.
Speaker 3:it's going to be like a DJ. That's what I'm saying, and so I walk in.
Speaker 1:Had it been a while since, you'd seen who he is?
Speaker 2:Yes, yes, yeah, so I disconnected from that community. I actually had an interesting conversation these past couple of weeks with Pastor Kessia Rain and it's been amazing to really hear her talk because I found out that I had a pattern. Again, this is the amount of hours I get to have fun. These are the hours I have to buck up and be a man. That translated to I'm going to be with this community for a while, connect, and then I'm going to leave them and then go find a new community, because I didn't have stabilization in my life. I didn't know what it meant to be consistent actually. Yeah, she's amazing. I found that that was one of the really great highlights of talking with her, with Hui and them.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I disconnected from the dance community and then that came through and I show up and it's just a few people. It's me, hui, bebe, I think Lindsay, lindsay, the roommate, who is also a great friend of ours, was there and, yeah, it was, that was us and I think there was, they had and then they had a roommate, dante, who was like later there, also part of it, and then we had some friends come through. But either way, it was a smaller group of people, but it felt like it was the whole world in one living room, and that was. It was the only room that like mattered to me at the time.
Speaker 1:Do you remember what he started talking about?
Speaker 2:We in the Bible, like the very first time. The only one that I clearly remember was the night I found Jesus. That's the one I clearly remember.
Speaker 2:Talk to me about that when the other ones are cool, yeah, so it was out in the Pleasant Valley slash, happy Valley, here in Oregon, which is South Portland, south Portland metropolitan area, and they had this apartment. And the really cool thing about this apartment is that the dancers that they are their living room. They push the couches over to the sides of the wall so it's just open carpet so you could just lay out and do just be silly or whatever. So it was towards the end of the night and our homeboy, dante, was there and BB and Hui were there and I think Lindsay was there, but I think her and someone else was like she was like talking with someone in the room or something.
Speaker 2:Anyways, it was Hui was on the couch and then I laid down on the floor and I just had like my jacket on me and then Huy just started reading the Bible. He just started reading and quoting some stuff and I'm laying there and I felt like a light, joyful nuclear explosion right in the dead center of my sternum. That spread out and then like it went for my body and went through my limbs and then came out and settled right behind my eyes. And right behind my eyes, that nuclear explosion, the wave came out as tears and just started pushing and I'm like what is going? On what is happening. Why am I feeling this way?
Speaker 2:I was just laying here, I turned into an 80 year old man and I was just laid down. I was questioning his existence and then we, oh we is so fun, like he, when he sees the holy spirit like ignite he goes into. He goes into full-on pursuit mode, he turns into vin diesel from the faster furious, or he's jumping from the car over to where you're sitting. He's oh, what's going on?
Speaker 2:oh, it's like another one for family and he's's just, he starts going in and and I always say that at the time I was like. I felt like if I ever did find Jesus, it would be. The clouds would open up and trombones would be playing and spotlight would come out and Jesus, oh son. But not, it was none of that, it was ugly. I was crying, I had snot come out my nose. I was trying to hide my face behind my jacket. I was just, I was. I didn't know the tear, if the tears would stop, but it felt good. It felt good.
Speaker 1:What was the main idea that was pushing this emotion?
Speaker 2:That Jesus was real, like, actually real, it felt I kept like the closest metaphor at the time when they were asking me that night and I was already drained was like it felt like knowing the sky was blue and always seeing your peripherals, but it was like the first time looking at it and actually seeing it was blue, oh right, and seeing it with your own eyes rather than just like you know it's common knowledge. Yeah, jesus died on the cross, and when? Here's what it is exactly is that jesus died on the cross, died for sins, and then I never connected myself to that avatar of you. Jesus died for you. Jesus died for you, right, he loves you. And whenever I hear you it feels like a more collective. When Jesus died for our sins, it's always yeah, you, you, you, you, you, you, you.
Speaker 1:Sometimes it feels like them. Jesus died for them sometimes.
Speaker 2:Yeah, exactly, so that's why I found out you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you. Sometimes, if he was like them, jesus died for them sometimes. Yeah, exactly, so that's why I found out you, I was actually saying them and not me. I wasn't putting myself in the mix. I was like, oh, that's hearing again that he knows everything about me, he knows everything that I've done and still decided to lay his life. And that's what really got to me, because when he, this is what really started tears going. Is that during these years in Georgia, I failed to mention? Is that two times during those years I tried to commit suicide because of how bad it was and I just didn't it. Just it was a really, really dark place.
Speaker 2:And then I hear that Jesus gave his life, died poor, and then I connected to what I went through, just for my own selfish reasons. And then Jesus getting tortured and actually dying and going through it all Right, and then saying that he died for me, and so I, all the trauma, everything was coming all Right. And in saying that he died for me, and so I all the trauma, everything was coming up Right. And then Jesus. And then just hearing Jesus is like, yeah, no, I still love you, like, yeah, I know all that stuff that you went through. I still love you and I still got you.
Speaker 2:You are more than what you are labeling yourself out to be right now. You are more than your pain. I do not just label you as a pain. You aren't just all this pain that you're holding around. Sorry, yeah, I'm like it was all my trauma coming being pushed to the surface and I felt the Holy Spirit quite literally just digging it up, like, oh, cool Piece of crap, toss it to the side. All crew, this has nothing to do with you. Toss it to the side. And then just all this grub. This has nothing to do with you. Toss them to the side. And then just all this grub just being dug out, and then, just at the center, just that nuclear explosion of light that just started pouring out.
Speaker 1:You're doing this Bible study with Hui and Bibi. For how long You're like? I'm a believer until you got another revelation.
Speaker 2:You mean like for this night?
Speaker 1:No, for how long? Jesus is real. He died for you. Did you keep on coming back? Was Hui continuing to host these things?
Speaker 2:Yes, I've never had something like that before. And then Hui and Bieber were like, yeah, no, we're getting called to figure out. I might be paraphrasing here, but basically they were going to start shopping churches to be a part of, and so they went to different churches in the area and they said, and they were like we're going to keep you in a loop because you should come. And I'm like okay, and they went to different churches and eventually they found PVC, they found Pleasant Valley Church and then invited me to it and said you got to come check this out.
Speaker 1:And I came, and not soon after love reality wave one came through. Did you like the church at first? What was it about that church? That was just a blessing to you.
Speaker 2:It challenged me. It challenged me in a way where I was not comfortable with everyone else's comfortableness, where it was like the smiles didn't seem like the fake church smiles you sometimes get, where it's just hi, yeah, no, it's good to see you like that kind of stuff, right? Yeah, like there are people who are pulling me and learning about me and asked me how I was, and then and then get like listening to what I'm saying and and I'm hearing what they're saying and it's not. There's more talk about how would you say not so much to the old testament. You know, I'm saying like so much. It's like what to do with the old testament in terms of the new testament and how they relate to each other. There's a lot more that talk, whereas all I've ever known before the bible study, before pvc, where these other places I've gone to was I felt like I've been. I feel like I've been stuck in exodus for like my whole life.
Speaker 1:Honestly, so were enjoying that. But also it just feels kind of weird when so many people like are taking interest in you.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I had a panic attack where I had to go out to the parking lot and leave for a hot minute and just cry outside. And then that's when Dante, our old, their old roommate, came out and was like helping me through that and some other people from church has talked me through it. But I had, I genuinely had a panic attack where everyone was it was. It was when they were washing. It was time to we're doing. They were washing everyone's feet. Yes, thank you, thank you. Yeah, you can tell by my words.
Speaker 1:I didn't grow up In our church. We call it the ordinance of humility, Gotcha.
Speaker 2:Yes, ordinance of humility gotcha. Yes, no, that's so. We would do that in communion, and I was looking at everyone. It was so peaceful and quite like, quite literally so heavenly, and and people were connecting and and enjoying each other's company and I was like I can't handle this and I ran out and I cried in the parking lot.
Speaker 3:Why is everyone so happy? Why is everyone so happy and touched each other and like all this stuff?
Speaker 2:and because and anyways, it was just unresolved trauma coming up again. Just yeah, I don't deserve this. What did? What do you have to do to get this? I didn't do anything other than just walk through the door, and so here I was, bawling my eyes out in the street what do you remember about jonathan coming through with love?
Speaker 1:reality this is.
Speaker 2:this was, yeah, so who even maybe know my story? Right? But then we had a community and now that was in relation to this bible study that they started and our hip and our like dancing, that we started coming through to pvc and so love, reality comes through and starts speaking specifically on identity and worth. Right, and I realized that I've just always been hearing stories and again this is the first time that I'm connecting myself to the gospel and like seeing what my place is in it, rather than just a story where I aren't picturing people from like a safe distance as like a watcher.
Speaker 2:There's a specific moment where Jonathan asked everyone come up to the stage and who and BB are always egging me on, you should go up there. All right, I'll go, I'll go up there, I go up there and I'm at the side of the stage, I'm in the video. I have like friends here who are going through. There's a Bible study out here, who's going through wave one and I'm like Josh, you're in the, you're up there, josh. They're like seeing me in something. But yeah, that was me, but that specific.
Speaker 1:I love seeing you in that video. I'm like, oh, there he is and you look big. And then when I saw you in person and even the same room- that you're.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so there's a moment I don't know if it happened in that video, but there is. It was one of the nights, cause I went to multiple night where Jonathan is. He's. He just starts speaking out to the crowd and like prophesying like to people, like saying things about people. He remember I remember one time he told who he started going through stuff and then Jonathan pointed at who. He said God, you're like God, a CEO, you aren't.
Speaker 2:And so he, jonathan, said something to me had like very much to do with my specific past and my identity, that I felt it wasn't like a broad statement, it was a generalized statement. It's even it's hard for me to remember what it is now. I just remember when he said it that I felt a mix of like positivity, happiness and also offended and attacked and just kind of exposed. And I don't know if it's in that video, but what happened was I turned around to like I'm gonna go sit down, like I'm not gonna stand up here right now. I turned around and I had nowhere to go because there was like a sea of people behind me, just a crowd of people behind me, that, and I had nowhere to go and all their hands are out like this, like this, and they're all, and I'm like all right, I guess I'm staying here and I'm taking it. I'm standing here and taking it.
Speaker 1:So what was the offensive thing? Do you remember the offensive thing about it? I?
Speaker 2:remember how I felt.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I remember how I felt because it felt so it's what it felt was that I don't, I didn't keep a journal, I don't have a diary or a journal or nothing like that, right.
Speaker 2:But it felt like before Jonathan started doing that, someone gave him my personal diary and then read and went to the section that was labeled what is bothering Joshua the most deeply right now, and then, instead of going, hey, is it okay if I can say this out here, do you mind if I like bring it up and like it was like okay, cool, and just immediately said it. And then he does this thing where he's like saying with authority and he points right at you, right, so there's no confusion, who is it for? Right? Just in case he put a handout and this is for the crowd. He points and goes no, this is for you, like you specifically, this is you. So that felt very exposing and I was not ready for that at all, because I've only talked about certain stuff behind closed doors. And so here it was, a grown man I've never met before, pointing at me, telling me this is the gospel event for you, and whether I was ready for it or not.
Speaker 1:Okay, we're going to take a quick break from the episode. I'm going to bring on my sister, Becca. Becca, quick question for you. How long have you been rolling with the gospel? How long do you think it's been?
Speaker 4:I've been connected with Love Reality for about four years.
Speaker 1:Four years. And what has the gospel done in changing your life, would you say?
Speaker 4:Oh so much, Just so much freedom. I used to be really perfectionistic, just a lot of pride and worry and anxiety about what people thought of me, and I'm free from all of that now and I'm so thankful, Okay. So a little bit of change now and I'm so thankful.
Speaker 1:Okay, so a little bit of change, then Praise the Lord Mercy, you have dedicated time, money, energy so that this message gets out there. Why is this message getting out there, so important to you?
Speaker 4:I mean, it's changed my life. So, and I've seen so many other lives changed by it, I just want to do anything I can to help further the message and, yeah, I'm passionate about seeing transformation in other people's lives and this this ministry does that brings, brings the Holy Spirit to people who need it praise the Lord.
Speaker 1:If you are listening and you want to partner with us, you can go to loverealityorg give. That's loverealityorg give, and every dollar that you gives goes towards this message that we are free from and dead to sin in Christ Jesus out to the world. Whether that be through the podcast or internet church or one of the Bible studies, it goes towards that. So please partner with us. Loverealityorg slash give, and we're committed to getting this message out to the world. Thank you so much for joining Becca.
Speaker 4:Yeah, thank you.
Speaker 1:So by the end of that week, what were some things that were starting to be settled that were true about you? Before I asked you who was God? God wasn't even a part of it. And then you're finding out that God is like Jesus. Jesus is like God. He is real. Who was God becoming by the end of this week that you're hearing Jonathan preach these messages?
Speaker 2:God went from an all-knowing, omniscient figure, creator of the universe. It went from all of that to God is a loving father who actually cares about me and is looking out for me. God felt more personal and he felt closer.
Speaker 1:Did you start to understand like freedom from sin, or like that idea that you had actually been set free from, like this cosmic power, or did that take some time after that week?
Speaker 2:It hit me quick. So the following week, the following time after that, was full of tears and waterfalls and confessions and I got sped, run to baptism.
Speaker 1:After that Were you there the night that Michael Shannon was baptized.
Speaker 2:Yes, I was, yes, I was.
Speaker 1:What did?
Speaker 2:you think about all of that, how perfect it was.
Speaker 2:I felt the Holy Spirit kicking in and going you need to go talk to his brother because you have some things to say, and recognizing again just the stuff what it means to deal with this trauma and what you're expected to be as a man in inside and outside of the church.
Speaker 2:I was fresh off the connection of the loving father of God and I wanted to just tell him, like yo, there are arms wide open at the end of the tunnel with this, like there is an embrace, there is a loving father who is with you here right now and you have brothers here right next to you who is trying to encourage you. I went from crying on the sidewalk and crying alone to seeing people crying alone in other rooms and then knowing what that's like and just wishing someone came into the room to hug me or at least tell me it was okay or at least teach me how to process that. And so whenever I see someone in this specific moment yeah, when michael, we call him anthony, uh, because yeah, he was telling me about all of his different names when I said yeah, yeah yeah, the I recognized it.
Speaker 2:You just when you've been there a lot. You just you see it building up and you're like, oh, like the familiar, like throws, and I I wanted someone myself to pick me up and tell me it's all right. So I was like I just, yeah, we noticed it too and we're we gotta go talk to this brother right now, because this is, we can either just let this go by or we can get urged to follow the Holy Spirit and tell him what the truth is.
Speaker 1:Everything was perfect after that too, because it was as soon as we did that the Holy Spirit was like, hey, come, and that was coming up this fall five years ago yeah, it was fall of 2019?. Was that wave?
Speaker 2:one? Yeah, because, okay, it might have been 2019 then 2019? Was that wave one? Yeah, okay, it might have been 2019 then.
Speaker 1:Oh no, wave two was 2019. It might have been the earlier.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it was the one before. That is when all that started happening with me, so coming up six years ago.
Speaker 1:Yep, you've been growing in Christ ever since then, and with any kind of growth, there's pain, there's growing pains or speed bumps, there's learning, there's growing, there's pruning. What has God, overall since that time, been just showing you and teaching you, even in the mistakes or even in the growth?
Speaker 2:The biggest one is I've only mentioned this to a few close people of mine and now I'm talking to you about it on the podcast, so I haven't actually told, I haven't even told some of my family members about this yet. Very early on, very early on, god has been calling me to come pastor and I've been running away from it. Huy and Bibi knew it pretty early on because the whole realization and calling happened in their apartment and I came out telling them exactly what just happened. Realization and calling happened in their apartment and I came out telling them exactly what just happened. But this actually is a culmination of this past six years to this past month, where I've actually decided to listen. So um was not prepared to share that either. I was not prepared to share that either. But here we are, I am planning to figure that out.
Speaker 2:So a lot more reading of the Bible. I'm trying to decide if I'm going to go back to college for it or I actually have a list of people I need to talk to first before actually executing it. But that's where I've been is just listening to the Holy Spirit entirely, rather than just nitpicking. I can do this, I can't do that when God's been calling me to pastor and I'm like I don't think I'm ready for that, I'm scared or I would come up with any excuses, right? He's like, okay, fine, you can go pray for this person, I'll do that. I'll do that, I'll show up at his potluck and eat this food and talk with these people and do this kind of stuff. And there's little things that were like much more low risk. But, yeah, god is giving me confidence and pushing me towards this calling.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you and I have worked with each other throughout the last couple of years and behind the scenes, I've always seen your heart for people and a pastor, there's evangelists, there's leaders. A pastor is someone who's with the people, who's taking them and guiding them, and I've seen that side of you because I just know how you care about people and that you're a good communicator. So, man, to see what God's going to do, that's exciting.
Speaker 2:I'm terrified.
Speaker 1:Yeah, man, uh, I think that's not a reason to not do it. I think it's the people who are like I want to do it. I think he told me that you're like. I don't know if he did Like. You get a little nervous when people just it seems like that thing is completing them rather than they're just following the guidance of the Holy spirit. You know what I'm saying.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I've just been whispering this in like close friends ears and like I'm dealing with this right now because, god, I don't know what to do.
Speaker 1:But now that I've said it out loud on the podcast, it feels like I'm locking it in. Man, you're going to listen to the Holy Spirit and you're going to move in that. And if you're not going to be a pastor, that's not going to change how you pour into people and how you love people. It might just be something you're doing in a different role. Man, I'm excited to see what he does. But let me ask you this, as we wrap this thing up, is hearing how Jesus has changed your life? You get to jump in the DeLorean and you're going back to a little. I don't know, is it south of the ATL? Like how far south of Atlanta?
Speaker 2:We're talking like the Leesburg. Georgia is on the left bottom left corner, so right on the corner between Alabama and Florida, not directly on it, but in that region.
Speaker 1:Okay, that's real country down there.
Speaker 2:We're in deep South. Our downtown was a railroad track and a barbershop with a gas station.
Speaker 1:You get to go back there and you get to see this kid who's just taking it all and he seems like he's a tough guy, but it's really affecting him in a huge way, right yeah and you get to pour into this kid. What do you say to him when you put your arm around him? What would you tell him?
Speaker 2:man it would.
Speaker 2:There's so many lies that were being believed there, just because they were so repetitive and I felt weak over time just trying to defend against them and all these insults and all this hurt and all this pain and I feel almost it would be too much shallow.
Speaker 2:Too shallow to just say it's going to be better over time, because I feel even that would have connected with me. But if I said, maybe along the lines of the pain and the hurt and the suffering, that it was okay to feel it and stop trying to fight it and learn how to process it Because there is strength in learning how to deal with it and then coming out okay, but to not lean on my own understanding and not to believe in the lies and know that the truth is that I have already been chosen, I've already been saved, I've already been loved and that God is with me, even when I feel like he isn't, and that he loves me and that and I just said it was cliche, but it is going to be okay, even if I don't feel it at that time and I wish somebody would also maybe if there were like no words spoken sometimes, just a hug would have probably been sufficient enough.
Speaker 1:Yeah, the power of just being present with somebody.
Speaker 1:Yeah man, your story is a blessing to me. Oh, I know we talked about it a little bit in during the episode, but we recorded this before and I don't remember why we said we're going to do it again. But hearing it back then and hearing it now both times have been a blessing, and seeing the way you're moving and you're going after it, you're a blessing to me. Man, thank you so much for sharing your story and, uh, you know the vulnerability that it takes. You took that on and, man, thank you, you're a blessing to me.
Speaker 2:No, thank you, Because, like we, like you mentioned, this is our second time.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And I've always been insecure about my testimony and messing it up. The first time I was really focused on I know the hardest point to hit is going to be the suicide and the what's happening like suicide attempts in the Georgia story and then I focused so hard on that when I got to it I just started bawling. I was not ready and you allowed me to step back and then also came through to PVC and did a little testimony about yourself and taught us like, how, like, like, went through a little practice, which also strengthened my will at this moment to give it another shot and get better at sharing and speaking it and just like, hopefully refining it into somewhat comprehensible levels of understanding. So, no, this is. I want to thank you for creating this space and then giving it another go with me.
Speaker 1:No, absolutely. It was a blessing to me back then. If you remember, you're the one who called me and said I don't know, bro, but I was like okay, dude, but you blessed me back then and, like I said, when I was about to go up to preach, I saw you. I'd never seen you before and I kept leaning forward, I was trying to get your attention but you were locked into Kessia Rain or whoever was speaking at the time, and I just see your heart, man. I just see your heart and you're a blessing to many and this thing is going to go out and people will be blessed by hearing your story. And Jesus is real, the sky is blue and, yeah, none of that's changing anytime soon, right?
Speaker 2:Yeah, rich, sorry, I'm just you're, you're, you're amazing and I Jesus is real and I. I hope that. I hope that I get to see you again soon, brother, because I was. I was laughing at the moment you said you were trying to lean in. Yeah, I was laughing at the moment you said you were trying to lean in.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I was totally locked in and I was in love with the fact that you're about to walk up and talk. And I was preparing myself. I was like, here we go, rich is about to speak, he's about to speak and we go. We're lit.
Speaker 1:It was so much fun. All right, brother, we'll see you soon. Thank you so much for coming on. Yeah, man, no problem, man, in hearing Josh's heart and seeing what he has gone through. If you're feeling the effects of trauma in your past that bring up these emotions, then this prayer is for you, father. I feel pain and hurt from things that have happened in the past, but while I feel them, I know that you have made me whole, that you have healed me by the stripes of Jesus Christ, that by the whipping that he took, that I am now healed because of that, that he has felt everything that I have ever felt, that he's experienced everything that I've ever experienced, and yet he has made me whole in his body, and so I thank you for that. I believe it and I receive it in Jesus's name. Amen, all right, I want to invite you to the Death to Life Bible study.
Speaker 1:The Death to Life Bible study happens every Monday night at eight o'clock central. It is me and my bro Elias, and we just taught gospel for about an hour and then we do a little after party. So text DEATHTOLIFE to 808-204-4372. That's DEATHTOLIFE, and text it to 808-204-4372. We'll send you a link and it will be on and popping, love y'all, appreciate y'all. Bye.