165. Embracing Diversity | Textured Hair in the Workplace

#corporatewellness #texturedhair #diversityandinclusionsal
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In today’s video, we discuss:
Embracing Diversity: Textured Hair in the Workplace with Dr. Tammy

Description:
In this episode, Kathie Owen sits down with Dr. Tammy, a psychologist and textured hair coach, to discuss the critical topic of diversity and inclusion in the workplace. Dr. Tammy shares her personal journey of embracing her natural hair, the impact of hair discrimination, and the psychological implications it has on individuals. They delve into the Crown Act, mental health, and how these issues relate to corporate wellness.

Listeners will gain valuable insights into how promoting diversity and inclusion can enhance workplace productivity and overall well-being. This episode is a must-watch for anyone interested in creating a more inclusive and supportive work environment.

Timestamps:

00:00 - Introduction
02:00 - Dr. Tammy's personal journey with textured hair
05:30 - Understanding hair discrimination
10:00 - The Crown Act and its significance
15:00 - Psychological impact of hair discrimination
20:00 - Bringing awareness to the corporate world
25:00 - Educational initiatives and certifications
30:00 - Closing thoughts and call to action

Links Mentioned in the Episode:

- Story about the champion forced to cut his hair: https://eu.courierpostonline.com/story/sports/highschool/2019/09/18/wrestler-dreadlocks-controversy-new-jersey-referee-suspended-two-years/2367239001/
- Join the Mastermind with Joseph Rodriguez: https://www.onlinetrainingforentrepreneurs
- The Texture of Me Website: www.thetextureofme.com
- Follow Dr. Tammy on Social Media:
    - Instagram: @thetextureofme
    - Facebook: The Texture of Me https://www.facebook.com/thetextureofme
    - LinkedIn: Dr. Tammy White Jolivette https://www.linkedin.com/in/tammy-jolivette-phd/
    - Twitter: @thetextureofme https://twitter.com/thetextureofme
    - Pinterest: The Texture of Me
    - TikTok: @thetextureofme

If you enjoyed this episode, please give it a thumbs up, subscribe to our channel, and hit the notification bell so you never miss an update. Share this episode with anyone who might benefit from it, and let’s continue to promote diversity and inclusion in the workplace.

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- Website: https://www.kathieowen.com/links
- Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/officialkathieowen
- LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kathie-owen/
-Today's blog post: https://www.kathieowen.com/blog/texture-of-me

Thank you for tuning in! We build healthy, happy teams, one heart at a time. 

Peace out and Namaste.

Transcript

Speaker: 0:00

Have you ever felt like you just didn't fit in at a certain event? Maybe it was just a lunch. Maybe it was because of your age, your skin color, the way you felt that day, even, and just felt left out. I can tell you probably you have. And today's guest is going to discuss diversity in the workplace and including others despite our differences. In fact, our differences make us special. They make us important. And, We need to address these, and we need to accept these. Because today's guest is an expert in this field. Her name is Dr. Tammy, dr. Tammy is a psychologist, as well as she's a coach on textured hair. And today we're going to talk about textured hair in the workplace. Because discrimination. It actually takes place, even today, because of somebody's hair. And at first, this was hard for me to understand, because I don't know. I have straight hair. I'm a white woman. I don't even consider these things. And uh, It was a real good discussion with Tammy because I was easily, and you will find, you will easily put yourself into these stories that she shares with us and understand where that discrimination takes place. I invite you to listen today with an open heart and an open mind and understand that Inclusion is something we want to take place in corporate wellness and enjoy this awesome episode. You're listening to Kathie's Coaching Podcast. I'm your host Kathie Owen.

Dr. Tammy: 1:59

First of all, great day, great day. Thank you so much, Kathie, for having me on your show. What an awesome opportunity this is for me. I'm so excited to be with you and, oh, to share about how we met. Um, honestly, being part of our mastermind group that has expanded our awareness and you reaching out to me because you had this health fair coming, I was so inspired and we talked and we connected immediately. You know, I love the passion and, um, compassion that you have in your heart, that you are really so, um, how would you say, so to you, mental health is very important. Health is important, you know, being that you, you're doing the work that you do and really helping people to understand and bring awareness of the impact of mental health in our industry. Right? Worldwide. And so, um, we connected because you saw what I was doing, which is about textured hair, bringing awareness of the mental barriers, or I would say psychological implications that hair discrimination has on people with textured hair. And I'm clear that you were inspired, bling bling, about what it is I had to share that, um, you, um, Introduce me to the health fair that you had coming up and what you're up to and to me that's how it magically has to be connected. What are your thoughts? Yes, and and what I love about this, and I want our audiences to know is this is a worldwide group. And we all got together on the very first meeting. I talked, and, and Tammy talked, and let me go back a little bit. This is in a mastermind with Joseph Rodriguez. There will be links to that in the show description below if you'd like to join us, but this is a worldwide flow based community where we learned so much. It's just like a wealth of information and wisdom and it's so synchronistic that Tammy was in Katy, I'm in Sugar Land and we're just So really close when this is a worldwide community. There's people from all over the world in this community. And it was like, um, definitely synchronistic. And, um, the fact that Tammy works with human resources, which is something that I work with as well. And I work in corporate wellness, but she is also. A PhD in psychology and I want to talk a little bit about that as well, Tammy. I should call you Dr. Tammy because that's, that's, that's my friend right there. And yeah, I, I'd like to talk a little bit about that and then also how you got your start in this and how you bring awareness to Textured hair and the discrimination that could take place and the diversity that takes place. And I wanna talk about that. Okay.

Speaker: 5:11

So a few things I'm hearing you say is talking about how basically my company got started. Is that what you're saying? Yes, yes. Yeah. Okay, cool. Let's start with that. Um, the texture of me actually got started, uh, during the pandemic. Right. Um, one of the things. I saw being in the industry and a lot of people started going natural. We'd start going natural in so many ways, right? eating healthy and all that. And that was the thing about going natural with this, this thing about going natural with textured hair start really booming in. And so, um, I had already been natural myself with meaning natural texture, textured hair, right? The curly hair. And, um, I started discovering some, things as I was going through my journey of wearing my natural hair. And, and this is before the pandemic, mind you. And I saw there was, because of my psychology background, I knew that there was something going on because when I would look at myself in the mirror, I couldn't be with myself with my curly hair. Like I didn't think I was pretty. Um, I just, I can't say that I think I was ugly, but I just didn't think I was pretty and I couldn't embrace it because it wasn't long. It wasn't. It didn't look beautiful to me, you know, and I'm like, this has got to be something. And, and Cathy, when I looked in the mirror, I couldn't really look in the mirror. I was gazing at myself in the mirror, you know, just enough to make sure I put my lipstick on right, my makeup on right, and be presentable, quote unquote. And so when I saw that for myself, um, I remember the day like it was yesterday. My daughter in law had sent us, send me a picture from our holiday trip. And oh my gosh, Kathie, when I saw my hair that day, I was like, wow, is that my hair? Oh my gosh. And I want you to know the curls, just a beautiful volume and bounce of my hair that I saw in my picture. really touched and it moved and inspired me that I like, Oh my gosh, if this discovery, if this is how this discovery impacted me, I wanted that for the rest of the world. And so going, like I said, with the pandemic, there was a lot of stuff about textured hair and, and knowing what I discovered for myself. And then I started having conversations with other people because I'm also in, uh, I'm a hairstylist as well by trade. And I started having conversations with my clients and they too was experiencing that. I knew I had something, Kathie. I knew I had something that would make an impact. And so, you know, then I hear about the Crown Act, creating, uh, the Crown Act is really an act issued out so people are not Being discriminated because of the texture of the hair. And, um, I can go on, you know, so let me just answer that, finish, answer that question. What, what do you wanna, uh, what was the next question? Did I answer your question on that one?

Dr. Tammy: 8:14

Yes you did, but I wanna go back to this because, uh. I can relate to what you're saying so, so much. And I think we all can on some certain levels. So for example, um, you know, I'm not as young spring chicken, but I, I'm like Joseph where I don't believe in age, but also as we, I feel like when you were talking about that story,

Speaker: 8:40

I

Dr. Tammy: 8:42

could put myself in that story where I, there's certain things I see in the mirror and I just, Don't like it. So what I would really love to touch on is how, what, what went off in your head because I felt that almost come through that what went off in your head that said, Hey, that's a beautiful thing that's unique about me. And how did that come about because I think that's going to be really helpful for all of us.

Speaker: 9:12

Okay, thank you for that. So, um, well, cause I want to go back to when I said I was gazing, gazing in the mirror. So I wasn't really looking. So, you know, every day was a mundane thing, everything, you know what I'm saying? And something about that picture when she sent that to me, I could see myself without the gaze. And then I, I embraced what I look like and I loved it. And, you know, to say specifically what it was, I think the gaze, it's like the veil was lifted, you know, and I saw myself newly. And I found a new found love for myself and a new found confident for myself that no one could ever take away. That's what I got that day. And ever since then, I've been, I've been on it and been passionate about this work.

Dr. Tammy: 10:09

Wow. You know, I think the reason why you can't put it into words is because it is something that we can't even describe. It's more like a feeling because I, Seriously can relate to that story so, so much. And, um, it, it's kind of shifted my perspective on some things that I'm going through personally as well. And I'm like, I see that because I can see how that helps. That story is so helpful. It, um, it touches my heart cause it's like, I can see that. So, I kind of want to talk about. The crown act and and what that entails

Speaker: 10:49

So, you know, the Crown Act is creating a respect, respectful, and open world. The act was issued out in 2019 in the state of California, right. And it was issued also people who. Really for anyone, but particularly people of textured hair or African descent, whereas kinky, curly, curly, and wavy hair, and people wouldn't be discriminated because of their hair. Discrimination would be like, uh, losing their jobs, getting kicked out of school, kids, um, not graduating from school because how they wear their hair and which is the natural state of where it is, right? And so where I fit in and relating to that. I bring the awareness of the correlation of mental health and hair, right? Because what happens is, you know, you have these issues with the, the Crown Act is addressing, but what about the mental wellbeing of the impact it has on the individuals or society who are dealing with this discrimination? And I speak on, you know, this young guy who, um, was wrestling. It was a while back and it was his championship. And a lot of people know the story. It was his championship, wrestling championship. And right before he goes to do the championship, the, the referee or judge said he has to cut his hair off or do something with his locks. Now, mind you, there's, there's, there's a part where this is a championship. So that means he's been wearing his hair like that for a while. Right? Yes. And then after that, But he's worked hard to get here. So this is on national TV, Kathie. They go get some garden scissors or some type of scissors to cut his hair off. On national TV and you see he's crying because what choices he really have because he's he this championship means so much to him But yet his hair is something that means so much to him too And he wants it when he gets it cut. I mean, they're cutting it off on national tv And so my thoughts are there's an impact on him and there's an impact on them the kids in the, in the event and people watching on TV. Who is addressing this issue where this kid is crying because he's judged by his hair? Can't do the competition. And so it's, when I saw that, and I'm not gonna lie, I was very upset about it. I thought the impact that had, and then I thought about other children who are getting kicked out of school because of their hair, or people are losing their jobs. And I, you know, had the lens as a psychologist going there. I'm like, this is a lot of psychological impact. Which had me to discover the concept called post traumatic care syndrome, and we'll talk about that on another event, but that's just, that's the psychological part to address this issue. And so once we have the crown act, which addresses the issue in itself with an act, the texture of me with post traumatic care syndrome, syndrome addresses the psychological part of the mental wellbeing. So that's where the texture of me. supports the Crown Act.

Dr. Tammy: 14:00

That story right there touches my heart and there's so much to it and I definitely want to, um, circle back, uh, at some point in time about post traumatic care because I have a diagnosis of complex post traumatic stress disorder so I can relate to that, but that story, of the hair. I, it, I almost want to find that and link it in our show notes and description below because I think awareness needs to be brought to that. So, um, what happened in the future? Like, let's say that happens now, today, is it? It's still happening.

Speaker: 14:43

What? It's still happening. It's still happening? Yeah, just recently, um, the Crown Act was passed in Texas, and just recently a kid could not graduate from school because his locks were too long. So it just happened. So they're doing, they're having to revamp the um, the Crown Act, I guess the bylaws and everything. I don't know the terminology, that's not my thing, and um, but I don't know the particular terminology of what they had to do. But yeah, it's still happening. And, um, Yeah, that's just really, and I don't want to step over this either because I know there's some other questions that you wanted answered as well, but that's why even like in the corporate arena like we talk about mental health and what you even bring to this conversation is addressing the mental health aspect, because that's one of the things that I think across the board. It's, it's, it's stepped over, you know, we're taught to go to work, come home, just the mundane things, but no one is talking about our mental health because our mental health really impacts our physical health. You know that with the work that you do. Right. And so for the HR arena. You know, we're bringing the conversations around what mental health is, how to have a healthy mental health, and different aspects as far as even with hair, you know, just, just so many things that will make an impact as far as the productivity, first of all, the holistic wellbeing of an individual, and then as a corporate company, you know, supporting their, um, employees, what a huge impact that can make, you know? So, um, I just really thank you for the work that you're doing in that as well. And that's why I feel like the, we talked about the HR aspect. It's important to have the services. That's why we came together to, you know, address that issue, which is, you know, speaking on diversity, equity, inclusion, right? And so really speaking to bring mental health awareness to the corporate world. And that's what we're doing, the work that we're doing.

Dr. Tammy: 16:53

For sure. And I love how you touched on the fact that When your mental health is good, or even as a team, your productivity is going to increase your leadership is going to be more effective. Everything just comes together perfectly, and it helps. You know, I picture it as a triangle so that at the top of the triangle is the leader taking care of the company, but it starts there and it trickles down to the team member

Speaker: 17:24

who

Dr. Tammy: 17:24

may be suffering from something where they have that mental health awareness, where it's talked about openly in the workplace. That's why I loved bringing you into this. Because by bringing this type of work into a health fair, which is something that we just do, even we do wellness days inside the company once a month. But bringing awareness to this just gets people talking about it and making more aware and, and, and helping them to talk about it. Because as a white woman with straight hair, that, you know, I, It, this doesn't even cross my mind I, I don't even, it's not on my radar but at the same time I want to be there for those that may maybe need to talk about it and be more open about it so I, I really cherish this type of thing that the connection that you and I have, and how we both work together. And, from what I understand, you have a certification program that you offer to human resources. Am I right?

Speaker: 18:31

Well, no, we're actually, and thank you for saying that we offer diversity, equity, inclusion training, and we're looking to offer the certification, but that's in process. So it's happening. And, um, the certification that we do offer, um, is for, Cosmetologists are people in the beauty industry, because that's one of the big, um, I'd say issues that in the beauty industry, we're taught how to do straight hair, but not textured hair, right? And it's natural state. And so I saw that with, um. as a gap in the industry based on my research and being in the field that I created, uh, accredited CE credits. It's accredited by the state of Texas. So what that looks like is a, a person in the beauty industry, uh, we do CE credits every two years where they can take our textured hair CE credits and learn about textured hair. And even I have some information about post traumatic hair syndrome is in there as well. So they could be familiar about it. And, um, Take it and then get credit with CE credits from Texas. So, and it's the first ever of its kind. So it really was more about serving. The community in regards to hair, because one of the things that's been an issue as well is people who have textured hair don't have hairstyles to go to because they don't know how to do their hair. And so then that's another impact they can have on people. Um, mentally, you know what I mean? Because hi, hey, we know we go to get our hair done and it, it makes us feel good, right? There's a level of, of beauty or our handsomeness as I would say. And if you have someone who doesn't know how to do your hair, what are you supposed to do? And so that's why we created our C accredited CE credits. Text CE credits. Yeah.

Dr. Tammy: 20:25

Okay, good. I like that. Um, because I have a lot of friends who have, um, mixed families. Where, and one, one of my friends is a hairdresser. Mm-Hmm. And so she's a hairdresser. She's white, but her daughter is in a inter interracial relationship. Yeah. And they have a little girl and she needs to know how to fix her hair. That, because there are different things, uh, you know, that they need to consider. And it sounds like your certification might be right up her alley.

Speaker: 20:59

Yes, yes. And then we do have a dish because that's for like professionals in the beauty industry. But then we do have our regular texture education for people who are not licensed. And because you know, and then we have advanced professional level texture education for those who would like to learn more about texture beyond the CE credit. So yeah, we're really about having people educated from a broad perspective, perspective on textured hair.

Dr. Tammy: 21:26

Yeah, because like, even myself, I didn't know this was a thing and in it going back to corporate wellness, this, this really, I love the aspect of psychology that you bring to this because that's very helpful. And, you know, back to storytelling, even the story that you shared right there. What I also teach storytelling in the workplace and how to impact others. By telling your story, because that story, I put myself into that story and can see myself, especially that gaze, looking in the mirror, there's just things that we don't like, and, or maybe at certain times, we're human, and That story just really like started this off just perfectly because who couldn't identify with that. And then second of all, who couldn't identify with being in a championship position. It's like you've worked so hard to get there. You've been the same person the whole time and then all of a sudden they tell you, you know, I can't imagine somebody going, Oh, Kathie, your hair's just not right. So we're going to have to take, do, do this right here on national television. How traumatic, traumatic that is. And then I, I'd love to see how he handled the championship in there. What happened? Because again, we can identify with that. And I don't even think that these things take place. And, you know, By bringing awareness to it, it makes me very compassionate, very empathetic to the whole situation, which is an important skill in leadership, which needs to be incorporated into corporate wellness and it helps with your productivity because imagine if that really affected him so much that he couldn't be as productive as he usually is. He's in a championship position. This is like putting somebody in a position where they have to deal with. Trauma and try to find their way to success and it just seems like that's not fair and not right but I love that we're bringing awareness to this now.

Speaker: 23:39

Yes, yeah. And you know when you think about you know the corporate arena when you talk about mental health Cathy, there's a great point of the the holistic aspect you know, a person in the position you know wanting to go into the next level positioning you know from and the company doesn't. allow that person because of their hair. You know, that's also part of research studies that, you know, I'm going to be talking about in my future podcasts that I have. And because it's really a big deal. And what we're bringing as in the space of mental health is, you know, It's a broad spectrum because it's the mental health where being which causes the holistic approach of well being all together. So, yeah, I totally see. And that's why the diversity equity inclusion training regarding texture hair is so important because it's like you said. You know, it's a point where something even you get to learn. It's not just one sided, it's across the board for everyone, you know, and then the relatedness that we all have about our different levels of experience of discrimination, right? We all have something, and that this brings a level of compassion and understanding that we can actually You know, I'd say heal our mental health, at least beyond the journey of it. And it's all part of a discovery that we're having for sure. And, you know, I really appreciate the platform and the insight that you've expanded on that provides, you know, me to come and play with you, right. And be a part of this change.

Dr. Tammy: 25:07

Yes, I love that. And so, you know, um, I like that the conversation is being open and even by recording this. It starts a conversation like maybe somebody will go, Oh, I didn't know Kathie worked with this stuff and hopefully they'll come to me with questions and come to you with questions and we can start the discussion about it. And so I definitely see you coming back on the podcast again, so we can definitely share more tips and topics. And I'd like to talk about post traumatic Hair. Maybe we could, I know we could probably talk a whole hour on that, just whatever. I mean, because kind of, I was a little bit triggered by that champion having his hair cut. The best thing I can say is we're bringing awareness to it and let's, let's get this topic out there and let's share this and make, make our mental health a better place, especially in the workplace, and because you think about it we spend more time at work, probably than we do with our families and at home. Might as well make it a good place. And like I like to say, we build healthy, happy teams, one heart at a time. And that's where it all starts. It starts with your heart and with your health and your wellness. So, um, Timmy, thank you for being on here today. Where can people find you if they were looking for you?

Speaker: 26:38

Oh, thank you so much for asking. Um, they can find me at all the social media, um, links as far as Instagram, uh, Facebook, LinkedIn, the texture of me, and that's on Facebook, Instagram. And on LinkedIn, you can find me as Dr. Tammy White Jolivet and maybe under Dr. Dr. Tammy Jo LeVette. And there's, it is right there with my name, right? Um, they can find me on LinkedIn and again on the social media, which is Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, uh, even Pinterest and, uh, TikTok at the texture of me. And my website is www. thetextureofme and love to have you. You know, your guests, uh, come and, you know, sign up on our email list so we can share with about what's going on and what we're up to because we're up some, some big things. And, you know, we would like to have the support of just everyone to be a part of this. So thank you so much, Kathie, for having me.

Dr. Tammy: 27:33

Okay, good. And I will definitely have all those links in the show notes and description below. And, thank you for watching today's episode. I trust that you found it helpful. And if you know somebody who can benefit from this episode, please share it with them. And until next time, we'll see you next time. All right. Peace out and Namaste. Namaste.