Collaboration, Planning, and AZAEP with Eileen Baden

Welcome back to Environmental Professionals Radio, Connecting the Environmental Professionals Community Through Conversation, with your hosts Laura Thorne and Nic Frederick!

On today’s episode, we talk with Eileen Baden, a certified planner specializing in environmental and park planning  about Collaboration, Planning, and AZAEP.   Read her full bio below.

Help us continue to create great content! If you’d like to sponsor a future episode hit the support podcast button or visit www.environmentalprofessionalsradio.com/sponsor-form 

Showtimes: 
2:55  Nic & Laura discuss being a conversationalist
18:04 Interview with Eileen Baden starts
24:53 AZAEP
28:49 Collaboration
36:23 Planning
42:21 Field Notes

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This podcast is produced by the National Association of Environmental Professions (NAEP). Check out all the NAEP has to offer at NAEP.org.

Connect with Eileen Baden at https://www.linkedin.com/in/eileenbadenaicp/

Guest Bio:
Eileen Baden, AICP, has over 13 years’ experience in environmental and park planning, public outreach, and higher education. She holds a Master of Urban and Environmental Planning degree from ASU and an undergraduate degree in Economics from Virginia Tech. She has been involved with the Arizona Association of Environmental Professionals (AZAEP) since 2013. As the Park and Open Space Planner at Maricopa County she was responsible for park, trails, and open space planning for one of the largest counties in the country. As a Senior Program Coordinator she also taught environmental planning at ASU. In 2023 she was appointed to the Arizona BLM Resource Advisory Council.

Music Credits
Intro: Givin Me Eyes by Grace Mesa
Outro: Never Ending Soul Groove by Mattijs Muller

Transcript

Nic  
Welcome to Epi, your favorite environmental enthusiast Nick and Laura. On today's episode, Laura and I talk about being a conversationalist. We have Eileen Baden back on the show to discuss collaboration planning and the Arizona AEP. And finally, there are more rattlesnake species in Arizona than any other state. Some of my favorites include the western diamondback because it's big and cool, and it looks amazing. The sidewinder because it's a great name and has little horns. It's just so so fun. And then last but not least, the mighty Massasauga which is the coolest name for a snake ever and it's this tiny little fears punk and I love that about there we go rattlesnakes for everyone, not just for kids that knew

Laura  
all right, just have a quick reminder today that the NAACP annual conference and training symposium is being held May 5 through eighth in Minneapolis this year. You all the details@www.sap.org and now it's time for everybody's favorite. We don't have a sponsor segment. All right, cool. Have 30 seconds to make us laugh.

Nic  
Okay. So, you know, Laura, we all love fish, right? One of the things we love, we love to eat them. They're delicious. They're wonderful, but you don't always have it when you want it. Right. So maybe we do fish on the go right? That's really good. How could I get fish anywhere possible and I'm introducing fish in a can. That is exactly what it sounds like. We would take fish we grind them all up. We put them in a soda can and it's there for you whenever you need it. You want it you want it you want a little dash of fishy

Speaker 1  
fish in the can newest thing on the market is going to be incredible and I can't wait and both your faces are telling me that this is a great product, it's gonna be finally gonna break into the real world and I'm gonna take it on Shark Tank, it's gonna go really well because you know, fish sharks, it makes a lot of sense. So I'm really excited about that. And there we go. Fishing again.

Laura  
For real vision again.

Nic  
Oh, well, I mean like it's not in a soda can you can't drink it. That's what we're doing fish in a can. Is for fish soda, fish soda. I should call it that thing. You know what? We'll do some rebranding.

Laura  
rebranding. We don't

Nic  
think it's right to just so much better than fishing again.

Laura  
Like, I'm pretty sure where it happens. It's still when you say it like that. It still sounds gross.

Nic  
Yeah, it's yeah, that's why first it was cow and I can and then it became an issue. So yeah, yeah. So

Laura  
on that note, on that note, please head over to our sponsor forum on the environmental professionals radio website and sponsor a future episode.

Nic  
Let's get to our segment. Well, there's certain skills, soft skills that are really hard to teach. And one of them is just like, flow of conversation. You know, yeah. And he's helped by verbally stubbing your toe there are people that you talk to and you're like, why is this so painful? Why are you Oh, come on, Sam. You know, it is like, yeah, and it's not it's a hard skill to teach. But that is one that like, is so invaluable. If you can have genuine conversations with people you don't know. And the walk away not feeling like you know, that was a dumpster fire.

Laura  
Right? Or walk away going, oh my god, I'm an idiot. I'm an idiot. I'm an idiot. Why they say that? Why do I say that?

Speaker 1  
But I will say, I'm somebody that's supposed to be good at conversations and every now and then, don't worry. I put my foot straight directly into my mouth. Oh, yeah. Everybody does. And you can't help it like there's

Nic  
Yeah, it's just you take it now. You know, he just like, Well, that was bad. Hopefully I'll never see this person again. And I can just move on.

Laura  
Yeah, well, there's times when like, you're just there's some people you're never going to hit it. Off with. That's so true. And you have to just like recognize that like, I've had so many networking meetings, and I can recall a handful where it was just like II that we don't jive. You know, like there's something the chemistry or whatever that is there's something that maybe it just goes back to like deep rooted values, who knows, but there's just some people that are just gonna rub you the wrong way. And it can be kind of neutral. Yeah. Or it can be a Yeah,

Nic  
either. Yeah. Yeah, for sure.

Laura  
And I think you know, you just have to recognize that it's not a failure or anything, but it

Nic  
just is yeah, you have friends and you have your best friend. Why? Because you get along really well with that person. Even people you can get along with that you love like know, there's people that you get along with better you can think you know, gosh for me this week, so I met a lot of new people. This week, and one of them were in a breakout session together and we're talking about like, what's not on your resume is a fun fact about you is not a resume. It's like, Oh, it's you know, I did stand up comedy. And this guy's like, So what made you give up on your dream and it was hilarious, and I'm like, Oh my gosh, we're gonna be best friends and right it was perfect. But Tim and I were the only two people laughing. Everyone else in the room was like that's the perfect example of that. It is literally like, yeah, that's it. Sometimes you just click with somebody. All right. And then we've had

Laura  
that with volunteers. We've had a couple of volunteers come who were just like, this isn't for me. You know what I mean? It's like, and they and they've like ghosted us, right? So we're like, Is it us? We do. You're just not gonna fit, whether it's individual or group of people. There's just certain times you're like, Ah, no,

Nic  
I know. Gosh, I mean, honestly. You and I didn't have chemistry, we wouldn't still be doing this. Oh, yeah. Since it just like some people you just can riff off of and you can bounce ideas off of a little bit easier than others. And

Laura  
that's the best the conversation isn't hard them because, again, it's back to shared values and common interest. But if you don't have that, I guess that's where people need the help. When you don't have that or you're not in a like right here. We can talk about whatever right but if you're in a professional networking, can't there's a lot of stuff you can't really dive into. So getting to know someone is a lot more difficult. But what do you recommend? What does someone do when they're like, Okay, awkward silence. The thing is that awkward silence gets longer and longer, and then you get more nervous and it gets harder to come up with something Saba shaking her head. So like, how do you have something in your back pocket that you can pull out which is what I've tried to teach to people, here's five questions. You can ask anybody at any time.

Nic  
Yeah, and that's a that's a great way to do it. And like, you know, was it like, the Dale Carnegie thing and they'll tell you that people think of pictures and then you have to remember if you remember a scene, you can remember a question, and I found that to be kind of hard because even if Yeah, okay, well, it's your house. And that's supposed to tell you to ask them where they're from, you know, which is different than where do they live? You know, all these things. And you know, picture a pink poodle and that's you ask them about pets and kids. I think it's easier to just remember those basic questions. Yeah. Where do you guys live again? Oh, yeah. Somebody isn't there, whatever on Sunday. Yeah. Do you like about it? No. Did you grow up there? Is that like a new place? You know, and then there's, that's another conversation. That's kids family trips. You know, there's so many basic basic questions, understanding where you are, the easy one for us. was talking about if you're in Denver, and you're talking about Denver, guess what's in Denver altitude, it is dry and if you're exposed kid like me, is brutal to kind of go out there. And I would be teasing them about like, coming east and now here I am coming last and complaining the opposite way. So it's like you know, it's fun ways to kind of talk about an area of people. We're all experiencing the same thing, right? Everybody's coming to a spa, and it's new and it's different. We're all experiencing all if we don't drink water, you'll wake up your nose. Not for any other reason other than you didn't drink what?

Laura  
Yeah, instead of the awkward end of that is like, Hey, have you ever had a nosebleed? We I mean, like because you live in Denver, you know?

Those moments happen where you're like to talk about right?

Nic  
And all you can do is just laugh about it and move on. Sometimes you just have to take it you know, like yep, that's that's not great. Yeah. Yeah, stand up is going up and doing stand up comedy wants isn't hard. It's going up after you've bombed. But it's in the conversations. It's the same exact thing. Where it's like, well, that did not go well. Let's try something new. Yeah,

Laura  
I'll try a different person might let it go. Yeah, yeah, exactly. Like, it could just be you catch that person on a day they're thinking about something else. You never know what people are going through may have like, work things or family things on their mind. Because I think the other hard part is like, you got these questions and you're ready and then you've gone through them all and the person was just like, yep, dope. Yeah, from here. And you're like, Okay, you want to ask me something?

Nic  
I'm gonna go somewhere where they want to talk to me.

Laura  
Yeah, you could always plan your exit like, Oh, I gotta go to the bathroom. I gotta go. I gotta make a phone call. I have actually done that. Like I gotta make a call. Like walk away.

Nic  
Getting into a conversation super easy. Oh you mind if I join you? Simple acetyl my join you mind

Laura  
if I join your mind if I listen in because sometimes like, you know, like, can I just say in your listen?

Nic  
Very, very simple getting out a lot harder. So you have to have those plans of attack right? But I would tell people all the time, that's what you should have planned it out. Think about what to say. You don't have to memorize it because you do that you're just gonna be down there going.

Laura  
I've even like looked at my phone as if it was ringing and then just been like showing a finger like gotta go walk away.

Nic  
Call by and it's totally fine. Because

Laura  
sometimes people are talking and you can't interrupt right so you're just like, hey, gestures gotta go by Sia is talking to you? Yeah. Cesar insider secrets here. Yeah, that's

Nic  
right. So that's right. I would say to his practice, yeah. You know, just do it. You know, if it's a social setting to say yes to it. Go there. Like you were going to a networking event. Just go there acting like you're gonna talk to people just keep practices and you the more you do it, the more comfortable it will be. You'll start remembering Oh, yeah, if I ask these questions, people will say these things and I can help with that. And you know, the basic thing and then every now and then you'll start telling you know, asking these questions and you'll hit on something goal that you both love. Yeah, there it's, you know, having an interesting fact about yourself. I found that that's that's a really nice one. If there's an icebreaker always try to add in that extra, like something interesting about yourself, you know, kind of thing. And it was oh, everything interesting about me. All that

Laura  
kills me when people say that.

Speaker 1  
Yeah, it's total BS. So it's just you know, trying to find out what it's like for me to stand up comedy when super easy, and everyone asked me 1000 questions about it, right? Yes. It's so fun. I could say I was in a band and I'd say I was in whatever else, but stand up comedy is the one that people really like to ask about. So okay, that's it. You just gotta find something that people aren't curious about, and they'll come to you and that way you almost don't have to do half the work is done. But yeah, it's just practice. But more than anything, it's practice. Yeah,

Laura  
it's good. I think, you know, younger generations, especially have less practice, law say that but at the same time, like online games, y'all talking to strangers all day. long conversations with somebody, you'd haven't seen their face. Same time, it would be good. But

Sam Bartleson  
that is anonymous. All you're doing is you're typing you're not actually talking to them, right. And so you can kind of take five minutes in between someone typing and saying something and then you can you know, you just have time to plot out your response if, if you want. Yeah,

Nic  
yeah. In some ways, it's easier, but it's also like there's, and so, you know, maybe the younger generations I don't want to generalize but

Laura  
exactly, that's why I'm saying like, there's, there's still opportunities there,

Nic  
like verbal nonverbal communication, you know, like texting and emailing is much, much, much more prevalent than was before. But yeah, there's still, I mean, like, that's great, but there's still times where you're going to have to engage. So the more practice you can get with that, the better you know, some people can do Toastmasters, and that's helpful for them. I honestly think it's a little too safe for me, like it's just, there's garbage. There's too many guardrails, because it's just like, so structured, that it's almost a disservice to how actual conversations go. And it's like, okay, I'll give you one minute and a half to tell me a very brief and wonderful story about yourself. No conversation has ever had that phrase in it, you know, so I know it's supposed to be practice to get you comfortable saying things. And for some people, that's very good, but for me, I'm like, Okay, well, that's great, but I'm not going to be like, Okay, I have a minute and a half to tell the story go. You give me a timer and I'll go you know, it just doesn't it's not how an actual conversation words.

Laura  
Yeah, they do have the, the table topics the one minute, super fast things. Those are, I think, helpful for off the cuff talking. But as far as like anonymity, I think people don't realize how forgettable they are. So what I mean by that is like, you think you're gonna have this conversation with someone and they're gonna be like, Oh, my God, Laura was a frickin moron. I couldn't hold a conversation. Nope, you're so forgettable, like, they're not even gonna think of it twice. So you do have to remember that. Like, yeah, it is face to face and it's definitely more in the moment and whatever but it's still they will remember you know, so like, you can still give it a try with that same sort of, you know this with the same casualness you might have playing a video game with a stranger. You know what I mean? Like they're just not going to remember and when they do remember is usually the good things. Yeah. And

Nic  
it's kind of nice when someone does and, gosh, I have a very embarrassing moment where I'm meeting someone like, Oh, it's so nice to meet you. And she's like we've met last year at the same exact event. I'm like, No, I remember that and I'm like, Oh, wait, we did. You know, and even that is cash. I still, you know, you reminded me of it. I forgotten what you reminded me of it happens, you know? Yeah. after that. I couldn't tell you what their name was. But it happens. You're totally right. You're totally right. It's not nothing against that person. When you're meeting tons of different people all the time. It's hard. And we're all in our own heads and so true. And like, you know, that thinking Laura as a mom that thinking, oh my gosh, I'm a moron. I can't believe I said nothing to this person. I just had nothing. I was like, I've been to Tampa, you know? That's not important or interesting. And you know, sometimes you just mess it up. Yeah. But as

Laura  
far as keeping the conversation going, you know, just recognize that there's no conversation to be had. Yeah, walk away. But if there is there is or you're still trying to talk to the person, you know, just be curious. Where are you from? What do you do? How'd you get here? What's your life like? You know, just be curious about that person. Because I think people are too focused on the end goal. They're saying what they want to say you can always say what you want to say later, like, make the introduction meet the person you can follow up later and be like, Oh, I wanted to mention to you that I'm looking for a job and whatever, or that you know, whatever it is, but just focus on being curious about that person. And it'll be easier I think. Oh,

Nic  
okay, last let you Sally remind me this last bit. I totally agree with this. When you are doing immune people for the first time in terms of business, if the first thing out of your mouth is I do this, I do that I have decided that what do you do? Tell me what you do. You better tell them what to do right now. They're they're doing the conversations over before it's even started. Because the you're telling them the only value they have is business value. And people do business with people they like they do business with people that may you know, it may have to make sense, you know, has to have has to be some synergy. But if they have a choice between two companies, one of them has someone they like the other one will not stop badgering them the first time they meet they're gonna go with the other one, you know, like there is there's a really good thing. It was so much better to learn who someone is and then ask them for something and to start asking, and then try because you've already you've already told them you don't care. They are.

Laura  
Yeah, and the conversation will naturally end at that. Point if that's what they're interested in talking about to you. But you reminded me of I've I've seen so beware if you're at like a networking thing, and there are people there who not every mentor is they all have your best interests in mind, but they're not all that skilled. I see one person who literally would be like, come up, see a person who they knew was new, and be like, what do you do? Give me your speech? Tell me this and like, just like you said with them totally on the spot on purpose. And I was like, You're not helping. No. You're just scaring people and it's not actually helping their skills.

Nic  
Yeah, it's like whoa, I don't even know who you are. Why are you asking me all these things? Yeah.

Laura  
So just recognize everyone has different personality to you're gonna run into that.

Nic  
And yeah, honestly, we could keep talking about this forever. But but you know

Laura  
what, I think we've talked about some of the kind of before but it's never hurts to continue the conversation about continuing conversations. Perfect. All right, let's get your interview.

Nic  
Hello, welcome back to EPR. Today we have Eileen Baden, a certified planner specializing in environmental and park planning on the show. Welcome, Eileen.

Eileen Baden  
Hi. Nick. Maura, thanks for having me. Yeah,

Nic  
we're really excited to have you on again, you were on our show back in the live version, or our last live version, which is pretty fun. So, um, you know, one of the things we didn't really get to dive into as much on that show was, you know, your career paths. So can you kind of tell us a little bit about what led you to becoming a certified planning?

Eileen Baden  
Sure. So I undergraduate degrees in economics, but I found out about environmental policy and planning when I was a sophomore in college. So at that point, it was a little hard to switch majors but I did a minor at Virginia Tech. Where I know you went as well. And then I went back to school for my master's in urban and environmental planning at Arizona State University, but just definitely very interested in the built environment, how we can essentially create better places for people to live. I saw opportunities in my own hometown for places where there could be bikepath connections, but also really interested in historic preservation planning, and essentially just creating, you know, great communities for people. So kind of became interested in urban and environmental planning from that perspective. Then I became an environmental planner, so to compliance with National Environmental Policy Act, worked as a consultant for 567 years. And then I worked on a lot of transportation tribal projects, as well as got to do some park projects as well. And then went back to Arizona State University to work as a program coordinator for students in the graduate program in planning. So that was really fantastic to get to work with students again and really get to help show them and all the things that I wish somebody had told me when I was still in graduate school.

Speaker 1  
Oh my gosh, okay, I could spend an entire show just about that. exact thing. So we just want to remember coming out of grad school, and in my experience with it was you know, I was a biologist looking for a job of being a recession, right. So I became a planner kind of by default, right? Like I didn't, I knew it existed, but I didn't really know what it was. So that was kind of one of the funniest things about how I got to where I was right but even considering that, right, I guess the private industry versus academia, there's always that we've talked about it a couple of times on the show, but they're very unique experiences, and it's really challenging. So what are those things? What are some of the things you wish you knew when you were a student that you taught? Get

Eileen Baden  
involved in student groups at a network meet with people? You know, the people I remember that I know best and I'm still friends with from the program are the ones that I had group projects with. So even when I worked as a program coordinator, I tried to work with faculty to mix up the groups so that people had the opportunity to work with other students, as opposed to always working with the people, you know, to really mix it up and get to meet. I think it's such a great opportunity. And I think sometimes that's something that folks don't realize, you know, you think, go to school, do all of my classes, but definitely that engagement and meeting professionals meeting other students getting involved where you can, I think is going to help you in the long run more than more than you might realize.

Nic  
Oh, sure. That's a long game too. Because I think it's one of the things you talked about at a conference, right? It's the same kind of thing. It's great to see people that you know, and catch up with them, but you got to spend time finding new people to meet. And over time, you get to know almost everybody that's, you know, relevant to the conference, if you keep going and you keep doing it, but it always takes a little bit of time. So, I mean, like, what advice do you have then for people who are like, you know, kind of apprehensive about, it's like, well, I'm nervous about networking and nervous about, you know, joining groups and doing these kinds of things. How do you help push them towards that?

Laura  
I think this is great conversation for Arlene because she comes across to me as kind of a quiet shy person was you really put yourself out there so I'm curious to hear your response. Yeah, I

Eileen Baden  
think it does take time to get to meet people and know people so that's when you have to continue showing up. So like Arizona association of environmental professionals, I've been involved since 2013. And what if you just go once you're going to meet a few people but if you go consistently, which is why I like to advise people to join as a board member. I'm a board member, then you're gonna go to those regular meetings. You're gonna have more regular conversations, you're really going to get to know people and you're gonna make an impact. So I like AZ AP I joined a secretary right away and I've never been involved in the group they just needed they were looking for some assistance. So I joined a secretary, then I was really able to get involved. And so I think for young students that might be going to a couple different meetings to see what organizations they you know, the work that they're most interested in, but definitely to try to take on a board level position. I was involved in some student groups in high school. So I think when I was in, in college, I think things got a little bit busier. I was involved a little bit but then once I was when I was working full time and EZ AP came up, you know, it was great to really just take help out with a board level position or maybe help chair a committee and then you really get to know people and what I've found so interesting is that being involved in these different groups, when you get to know people then if you run across a challenge and your environmental project or maybe you need career advice, you know who to go to and who to talk to you and actually makes your life much easier. Know who that noise quality specialist is, and you have an issue on a noise project and you work for a small firm to go talk to them and ask for advice. So I would say, you know, there's definitely a lot of really important volunteer work to do out there but just to try to put yourself out there and if you see an opportunity to to grab it and then if after about you know after some time it doesn't work out you can try you know another organization or switch but as you'd think it helps. Also with AZ AP, I think it helps people in the environmental profession feel like they're part of a community as opposed to they're just sitting at their desk doing environmental analysis and that they only, you know, maybe talk to a few other environmental planners that they work with. So it definitely bridges out your knowledge and opportunity if you if you get involved in some of those groups.

Nic  
Yeah, that's such a good point. And there's so many I've been thinking about it like from just a general perspective, right? If you are on a board meeting, you were talking about this organization, you don't it's not just necessarily Okay. Well, these are the things that the board has to do you bond over things like can you believe the crazy thing that they said at the last meeting? Wasn't that the wildest thing you ever heard? And that's how you build a relationship right? Like that's, that's it's just like you would anywhere else so Oh, gosh, I love that.

Speaker 1  
You're talking about like AC AP, I think it's a nice nice segue into the our next little bit here. How does the organization help like job seekers? What is the thing they do to kind of help bring people in and find their path?

Eileen Baden  
Sure, so ACP, we hold monthly meetings. So we have a speaker you know about wide variety of different topics, biology, cultural resources, Clean Water Act updates, and all sorts of a wide variety. So it's really helped me as an environmental planner, have a better understanding of all the different environmental resources that we need. To assess impacts to buy going to these meetings for over 10 years. It's helped me have a better understanding of all these different things. So but we, they post like they send out in a newsletter and we have job postings in there. We have a corporate membership, which corporate members can then post job postings for free. And they have the they can send like a certain number of employees to the meetings for like the member price, but I think in general, it just helps people when they go to the meetings to have some of those in person connections. And I really do appreciate the ability the fact that we're able to do so much more virtual work now post pandemic, but I also think that in person is really important. We have the holiday party in December, and just making some of those connections, seeing people in person. You know, I heard about multiple different opportunities that are available. There's a lot of environmental work out there with all the infrastructure laws that have you know, every all bills that have been passed. And so I definitely think that it's just about you know, those meetings in general, what we'll do is we'll usually have like a networking component in the beginning for about 2030 minutes and then we'll break for the presentation, then we'll have questions. So just in general, we hold those meetings in Phoenix and in Tucson. We're also doing them virtually now. So that's nice that other people from other parts of the state can join, because that was definitely a challenge before you know, we're all volunteer organization. So it can be tough for us to get to Flagstaff and to other places if we don't have people who are part of VCAP you know, because we have to go set up the projector go set up everything, usually the whole board go. So usually the meetings are in Phoenix and Tucson, but what I've really appreciated as some of the different things the group's taken on in the past so we we joined the Arizona Planning Association one year for their mentorship program. Oh wow. And we had about six environmental planners join, meet up with students and kind of like a meet your mentor event. Then they met with their mentor at their job and then we had like a volunteer event where we helped out this bicycle nonprofit cleaned up their shop and it was really nice opportunity to get together with folks. And you know what's so funny is that the professionals enjoy this too. Like they get to me and interact with other professionals you know, and so easy AP is joined the ASU planning Career Fair in the past and then one year we worked at you were down at the University of Arizona our president at the time had a good connection down there. And it's so interesting how sometimes events will just really work out so well. This career fair that was done. It was like a, you know, typical career fair with tables and stuff. But then we also did a section where we had presentations and it was a big like auditorium kind of style room. And the Forest Service was there. So federal agencies, local agencies, nonprofits, and they just gave a quick 10 to 15 minute presentation about what they did, who they were and what projects they were working on. And that was a really great example of I think something that could be great for other communities to try to do as well. Just because it gives that high level overview and you know, gets people understanding that there aren't even that these jobs even exist. Yeah, yeah,

Speaker 1  
it's really this level point, right? This the, the joy of that kind of thing. So I'm glad you're able to work with other organizations and other groups too, because yeah, it's really fun to kind of connect and collaborate that way. So what what is AZ AP have lined up for 2024 But I'll say you guys gonna do?

Eileen Baden  
We have a couple of meetings coming up. We have a cultural resource discussion this month. Next month, they're in Tucson, and we are also renewing our scholarship program, which is huge. So about five, six years ago, a woman named Amy Edwards passed away and HDR and Westland resources were two firms that she had worked for, and they came to us and asked us if we could try to help us get a scholarship established. So I created the GoFundMe and we were able to raise over $15,000 for scholarships. And it was really fantastic for environmental planning students. And so we, we worked with those companies in particular just because they had kind of, you know, it was kind of a collaborative effort and at that time, they had really wanted
_________________
Eileen Baden  
To do a significant scholarship that can really make an impact on the student. And so we had determined they were $5,000 scholarships. And so it's been nice to see over time I think two students from the University of Arizona have won and then one student at Arizona State University who I worked with in the planning program he won so that was great. It was nice to see somebody you know, and you know, I've helped work on this great to see somebody I that's such a good student environmental planning interest, you know, when that scholarship so that the scholarship funds have been depleted, but since we had the NA P conference in Phoenix, we were able to raise a little bit of funds from that and we're really excited to get the scholarship program going again. So we're gonna re look at it a little bit more, and possibly do like $1,000 scholarships, so that we can have some more longevity there, but I think that we're also really trying to look at it from like, what how can we get the students involved in AC AP? Not necessarily just like okay, you doing great in school, you win a scholarship, we don't see you not saying we don't see you again, but like, how can we make this a collaborative things like definitely getting that, you know, how can we offer like, I'd like to look into how we could use some funding to also just get students out to meetings, a little bit more, and things along those lines, but yeah, it's great. And we have a new board member who's a few years out of school and she's going to be heading up the scholarship committee and a couple of us will be helping to do the reviews. So yeah, great to get that going again,

Nic  
that's really cool.

Laura  
That's awesome. Like Tdap group in Tampa. I do a lot of work with 16 chapters when I was there last and they also have a scholarship. I can't remember how much they give out. I don't think it's a whole lot, but it's there. So you know, maybe you guys can collaborate and talk together what works well and what doesn't work? Well. I think you both kind of role model, ADP organizations. So it's, it's really good to see how you guys showed up and everything at the conference earlier this year. And, you know, to that end, what do you think are some things that work for you to keep the students involved so far? Yeah,

Eileen Baden  
I mean, I think trying to understand where they're coming from, so I do, there's ways that you can come up with student projects. So when I was working as a program coordinator, master's students in the planning program can do like an applied project. So mine I helped to plan a community park in eager Arizona, so rural community in northeast Arizona. And so what I had done was get like the town of camp, very came out and talked about trail planning opportunities, like students could volunteer, but then they have to do some type of a capstone studio class a thesis or an applied project to graduate. So for an applied project that student could work with, like any community or nonprofit to kind of do this great project. So for me, I always like to be really creative and come up with like, what are the students interests? What nonprofits or organizations government organizations are out there that we could help create these opportunities for them, but it's about the government or the nonprofit organization, helping the student identify that project scope of work, so that it's not just like a student because they're not going to know what do you done and what so it's kind of this collaborative thing. So I think for me, it's also about trying to convey to other professionals like what's realistic for students and what's not because I think they are so busy, a lot of them are taking a lot of classes. They're working outside of school, trying to make ends meet, just like all of us and so, definitely something is like what can we do to get students out to meetings. So last year, I think I donated so that like two students could come to a meeting for free, and that includes meal and so you know, if we could kind of make it so that two students could come for free to every meeting the first two students who sign up and then when they're there is really when it's like this aha moment of, oh my gosh, I didn't know that they were building this project, or they were doing this or they were doing that and so, but it is hard. I won't say it's easy to get students to come out to meetings because they have student groups as well. And so you know, kind of where do you find that right place? So I do you think the mentorship program was a great opportunity because students do want to know more. It's just sometimes about having that push or inviting them to the meetings. So when I was a planner at ACS and Tempe, my boss had told me about easy AP and he said, I should go so that I went, they needed the secretary. I became been involved for 10 years now. Same guy also wrote my husband is the Arizona hydrological society. They're still involved there. So I think it's just sometimes about getting people out of their shell and calm and then they realize it really is a great opportunity to meet people learn. Learn more, that can help them with their job as well.

Laura  
Yeah, what are those best ways to reach them? Are you reaching them through their professors through the schools programs through social media, like how do you even so let them know the opportunities are there?

Eileen Baden  
Yeah. Um, well, I have some connections since I worked at that school before but you can just look up the school at the like, look up, whatever university you have, look up there playing program, find their general email, you know, send them an email, ask them to share it with students. My first job I got out of school was through a listserv that just did send out, you know, potential job opportunities and stuff. So I think just kind of looking it up reaching out. And then it's also good if you can go and talk to students, so maybe offering to come and do a presentation. When I was working at ASU I did so many free presentations on NEPA because a lot of people out there don't know, a lot of us don't necessarily know what it is and know some opportunities there. So I volunteered with the indigenous imagination initiative at ASU with the geoscience Alliance and, you know, just I spoke to some seventh grade social studies teachers and they were like, You need to come and talk to students about this.

Nic  
Yeah. So

Eileen Baden  
I think, you know, just finding, looking at those schools reaching out, you know, asking if you can come to them to do a presentation or talk about NEPA, I think that that would be, you know, much appreciated and when I've heard from a lot of professionals is that they get just as much out of it as the students do. And who knows, you might find your next intern. So I think there's a lot of win wins on both sides.

Laura  
Yeah, that's really awesome. But you know, we invited here to talk about you. So we're glad that you're involved in the ACA up and all these other things, but tell us about some of your projects. You're working to protect public access points and Daisy mountain. Exactly.

Eileen Baden  
Yeah. So DC Mountain is a mountain in North Phoenix and it's owned by the Arizona State Land Department, and Arizona State Land Department sells land to the highest bidder. Land is held in trust for the beneficiaries of the state, which are like educational systems. So it's, it's a bit of a challenge because they're not doing as many trail right of way approvals anymore. And so technically, it's a so it's a 5000 acre mountain and just to the south is a master plan community that's also 5000 acres, but a portion of that is a gated Country Club, and two and a half miles of the country club block, Daisy mountain already so there's currently no access to the mountain from the south side. It's a gated community and it's it's two and a half miles along the south border. So the west, north and east sides are really important to protect public access to because quite a bit of the mountain is over 15% slope, which means that it's most likely won't be developed on there's a hillside ordinance that usually you have to get some type of approval if you're going to develop over that slope. But the important part for me is to is like protecting the foothills so that people who are walking up to the mountain you have that view that's protected as well. So I do think that there's some components there that you know, maybe it's not 15% slope, but we might want to consider protecting. I mean, we have four and a half million people here in Maricopa County. We're one of the largest counties in the country. We've been one of the fastest growing counties for like the last 10 or 20 years. So especially the North Valley, we have a new semiconductor factory being built out here, and it is expected to really grow the north Phoenix area. So right now there's no dedicated public access points. You can get your state land permit to go hiking and exploring. It's relatively inexpensive. 15 to $25 for the year, and it's just that it's not protected in the long run. And there's no dedicated public access points nowhere to park right now. And it really is a regional opportunity for people you know, we see all these health issues, that we have mental health, physical health, and all those challenges and then we have this opportunity in our backyard, but it's just about hopefully working with the right people and hopefully finding a way to at least protect public access to the areas over that over the 15% slope. Yavapai County which is just north of us, Prescott. Prescott Valley and Yavapai County recently came together and they purchased a 2500 acre mountain to become Yavapai county's first regional park. And that's only about an hour and a half from us here. And so I'm hoping that we can look at that as an example as a good collaboration and see what we can do here. In the daisy mountain area. Nice

Laura  
project that you're working on in your day job or is that something you're doing on the side?

Eileen Baden  
No, I'm I'm a board member for on the board of directors for friends of DC mountain trails. So we are a nonprofit organization that's just working to protect public access, really focusing on the trails on the mountain, but also again, those public entry points like you need a parking lot a place for people to park but safe that's not in somebody's neighborhood. And that's what we're lacking right now. It's very challenging because you cannot identify Arizona state land as open space on planning documents because because it's held in trust for the benefit of the education system. But you know, we'll see what happens over time we held a field trip in November with also Tonto National Forest is to the east. So there's a good connection that could be possible from Daisy mountain into Tonto National Forest. So for me, I'm seeing that you know, people in the anthem area, which is that master plan community I talked about, you know, a lot of opportunity there for kids and for adults to go into long hikes go mountain bike riding, go backpacking. So there's there's a lot of opportunity here. I think it's just about trying to protect those connections ahead of development. Yeah, for sure.

Laura  
Once they're gone, they're gone. So that's really important work that you're doing. That leads me to the next question of, you know, the number of boards you're on the work that you do on your projects, like you have so much involvement in things student work, like how do you decide what to say yes, or say no to? Yeah, I

Eileen Baden  
think it's tough. But there I find myself you know, thinking the same thing. Where do I focus my energy on today? But for me, it's about like, last night, we had a meeting for community park near my my house and we need a new playground. So, you know, I think it's about finding the groups to there, where other people are taking action. Where can we make a difference? And so trying to focus on on those areas in particular, but I definitely like how can we get this done? And so trying to focus on you know, the highest priority while still making sure I'm still staying involved where I can, so sometimes I'll take a little bit of a step back right now I'm like past president for AZ AP, but I still get involved in like need help with different things if I can, and so yeah, just just trying to balance it all. I'm sure we're all just

Laura  
Eileen doesn't say no. Me, we all try.

Eileen Baden  
So much important work to do. Yeah.

Speaker 2  
So this is the second part of the show where we talk about field. We call it field notes. It's like when we talk about our memorable moments from the field. And it's one of those things that like we always have good stories, and I know you have plenty. So is there anything that comes to mind when we say tell us about something memorable that happened to you while you were working?

Eileen Baden  
Yeah, it's a it's a hard one. Yeah. Stuff that. I think it's been kind of interesting. There's the I worked on a recreation public purposes Act project A while ago with vulture mountain. It's a new regional park, the county's opening and I think, you know, that was pretty memorable because there were so many different agency representatives involved. So it was the Transportation Department, the parks department, Bureau of Land Management, and that was I was a consultant at the time, but I was able to go to the meetings and, you know, take notes, and it was relatively tough. I mean, 2530 people in the room, you know, trying to take notes and like, people are talking I'm like, Wait, who are you? So the beginning of the meeting, and I tried to, you know, try to write down everybody's name really quick and now doing things virtually. I'm like, I love that everybody's names on the screen. You can record go back refer to it. We actually had to record those meetings as well. And so, but you know, just going out and doing the field visits I mean, it was beautiful out there native desert you have aka to swaras rattlesnakes, so I always really liked the projects where I got to go out in the field. As the environmental planner, I usually got to go you know, maybe once for the kickoff meeting. for that project. I got to go a couple times and just really exciting to you know, get to get out there and, and kind of see how that process went and be involved from such an early kind of component of it. And then now I after working at the parks department got to learn a little bit more about recreation public purposes act so Maricopa County Parks has one of the largest county park systems in the country. It's 120,000 acres, and like 90,000 acres 80 to 90,000 acres were acquired using the recreation and public purposes act. And so underlying, I'm not sure if it's still considered underlying BLM. Land, but I see a lot of opportunity there. So that's why at any P I did the presentation at the conference this past year, I did the presentation on you know expanding parks and trails using our MPP so I actually don't know if they will let us do pathways and trails with our MPP. I know that they usually do like they're trying to do like 1000 acre park sites. But it's very interesting because I think you just have to find the you have to kind of come up with the project. And again, that's like working together. So a lot of collaborative things that take time to work with people on and so it's fun to be involved with that at such an early stage with Ultra Mountain Regional Park and kind of learn more about it and now to try to see what opportunities are out there because there's like this River Trails loop project up in all the way to Vegas and so it it's like a kind of like a little road you know, paved paths that people can go ride their bikes and suspect loop. And so I was wondering if we could do kind of expanding more bikeways out here in Arizona and if BLM could essentially if there was some opportunity for that. So that's something that there's still some wiggle room on and I'd have to look into some more but always great to be involved on projects that have a lot of different entities involved, and kind of your things from their perspective.

Nic  
That's so cool. I mean, okay, truthfully, like 90% of what I was thinking the entire time is rattlesnakes. And

Speaker 2  
you said it's funny I remember being in a site visit actually in New Mexico sorry not in Arizona. I was giving the safety briefing. And I'm like, Okay, so there's rattlesnakes here we got to be careful of you know, overhangs and you know, you know, areas where there's lots of brush or rocks and and all that since we were like literally Yeah, they're gonna be wearing them, you know, it's in the morning so they're maybe you'll see or maybe not, and this woman says, Were you serious about the rattlesnakes? I was like,

Nic  
Yes. Like why would I joke about that? Just yet. I'm just kidding. Just want to scare you guys. There's no rattlesnakes here. No, but

Eileen Baden  
that's on my house. Like really? Yeah. Right outside the back door there. So yeah, I'm up here in the north Phoenix area. So lots of lots of native desert.

Nic  
Yeah. And like the you know, they rattle but they don't always rattle and I think that surprises people because they're like, wait, what it's supposed to let me know when it's, I'm like, no, no, it just does that sometimes.

Eileen Baden  
You gotta watch your stuff. Yes.

Nic  
And they blend in so well. It is incredible. The camouflage incredible how

Eileen Baden  
we have Sonoran Desert tortoise out here too. So that was we are always doing surveys. For those as well. Oh,

Nic  
yeah. Yeah. So there you go. That's pretty cool. But you mentioned BLM, too. So I wanted to ask, I wanted to give you a chance to talk about this new role that you have here, where you were appointed by the Secretary of the US Department of the Interior to serve a term as the Arizona resource Advisory Council for the BLM. So what is that wrong? Will you be doing? Yep, so

Eileen Baden  
there's our 15 members on the RAC, the resource Advisory Council, and there's like three different main sections. There's like commercial commodity interests, there's environmental interests, and then there's like public, like elected officials. And so it's 15 members of the State of Arizona and it's they try to get a wide variety of people from different backgrounds and different areas of the state. And so, I'm in the environmental category, and I'm technically under dispersed recreation, my husband and I, we like to go camping, backpacking sometimes and like to get away from using quiet so I do appreciate dispersed recreation. And so, yeah, it's basically an advisory council, so they'll be bringing different issues to us to ask for advice from the public. The the entities on advisory council, will be meeting quarterly for about two full days. And we'll be going through some of the main topics they have so I think what they have a lot of backlog of is approvals on fees for like, campgrounds, sites and stuff like that. So there's just different any kind of fee approval means to my understanding is that any discussion would kind of go through the rack, and then we would just have a chance to hear presentations from whether it's BLM employees or like the rock will even approve its advisory, but we would approve like any fee proposals for like even Tonto National Forest if they're going to be developing new fees. So they'll essentially come to us talk about the issues at hand talk about what the work they've done already, what they're proposing. And then we would have time to deliberate kind of, you know, provide advice in that realm. So there's people who do range plans, who do cattle who have cattle who, you know, can kind of provide different inputs. So, it says that we will assist with like 12 million acres of surface management and like 36 million acres of subsurface mineral Emilian

Nic  
that's,

Eileen Baden  
that's what it says. there so I mean, I think it just depends on like, what projects do they have been proposed on BLM lands? And what are kind of some of the issues at hand there so you know, having a strong background in environmental planning and then since with more park planning, I think hopefully, you know, I can help provide some good input thoughts and suggestions into into the group. So yeah, I'm really looking forward to it.

Nic  
Well, I love that even you are talking to talk walking a lot, right? You said you'd like to collaborate with many different people from many different backgrounds. I don't that's probably one of the most diverse you could possibly get in the field. So there you go. So we're getting close to time. But before we go, we always love to ask about hobbies that our guests have because we love to just learn a little bit more about you as a person too. So what are your hobbies? What do you like to do for fun?

Eileen Baden  
Well, so so I'm really lucky. Now that I'm living in the North Valley. We have some Arizona state land near my house. And so as long as we have our permit, we can just go out and go exploring. So just a few minute walk and I have some natural desert near the house and I can take the kids and we just love to go out there and get into nature in in Japan, they call it forest bathing here. Desert bathing. But I did ceramics for a really long time with the City of Tempe. They have a great ceramics program. And so that was always really great to to get to really build something and you know, something that takes time as well. There's multiple steps in the process, but definitely trying to branch out and, you know, actually the home I live in now, artists have always lived here. And so I trying to embrace that and try to I think sometimes getting outside of our comfort zone trying different types of artwork. My husband does a lot of mixed media, different things. And so I think sometimes taking time to do that type of stuff. I haven't had as much time lately with the two little ones. But I do a lot of artwork with them. And we mix it up some times a painting and so yeah, I think whenever I can find the time I like to try to just get outside.

Nic  
Yeah, that's great. And like the you know, the older they get to the more the more you'll be able to do more things which is even more fun. So that's very cool. I

Eileen Baden  
dragged him out there the other day, and we made it about 30 minutes before one fell on face planted, but he was good. Yeah,

Nic  
of course. That's too funny. But like I say, We're close to time, but is there anything else we didn't ask you about that you'd like to mention before we let you go?

Eileen Baden  
I don't think so. But thank you all for the hard work you do and really appreciate it. You know, I think that having all the podcast sessions that students can come in and listen to and professionals can come in and listen to really just you know, helps people know what opportunities are available out there. And so yeah, thank you guys for everything you do. Okay,

Nic  
well, last but not least, where can people get in touch with you?

Eileen Baden  
Sure. So my email is Eileen baden@gmail.com. But probably the best way would be on LinkedIn so we can connect and stay in touch and continue sharing information. So Eileen Baden AACP on LinkedIn. Looking forward to

Speaker 2  
thanks, Eileen. Thank you. And that's our show. Thank you, Eileen for joining us today. Please be sure to check us out each and every Friday. Don't forget to subscribe. rate and review. See everybody I

Transcribed by https://otter.ai