Navigating the journey of parenting an LGBTQ+ child can often feel like uncharted waters, but my guest Jennifer Boudrye, founder and CEO of Parent with Care, is lighting the way with her steadfast beacon of empathy and education. Together, we're peeling back the layers of complexity that accompany the role of an ally, revealing that the paths to understanding and support are as diverse as the community we seek to uplift. In this heartfelt exchange, we confront the intricacies of gender identity, the societal pressures that shape our reactions, and the monumental significance of genuine support for queer youth.
As the mother of a transgender child, Jennifer shares her profound personal experiences, offering up her narrative as both a guide and a comfort to others facing similar challenges. We're reminded that the process of embracing our children's true selves isn't just transformative for them, but for us as parents and allies, too. From the trenches of legislative battles to the intimate victories of a name change, this episode uncovers the dual nature of advocacy—it's as personal as it is political. We're taking a hard look at the current climate of transgender rights and safety, and pointing out the critical need for inclusive spaces and policies that affirm, rather than harm, our youth.
As we wrap up our conversation, the strength of parental advocacy takes center stage. We hear inspiring tales of resilience and the tireless work being done to ensure that every child feels seen, heard, and above all, safe. This isn't just an episode for those directly impacted by these issues—it's a clarion call to anyone who cares about the well-being of our next generation. Through education and empathy, we can all become champions for the rights and safety of transgender and non-binary individuals, ensuring that their futures are as bright and limitless as they deserve to be. Join us as we navigate this nuanced terrain, bolstered by Jennifer's expert guidance and a community's unwavering kindness.
Do you dread Mondays? Does the thought of another Monday steal the joy of your weekend? Let me tell you about a product I have found and tried that can do away with the Sunday Scaries. Oddly enough, it’s from a company called Sunday Scaries. I have personally tried their products, gummies and tinctures and I can personally attest to their efficacy. If you go to their website and order any product, use the code Kindness20 to receive a 20% discount on your order.
Do you like good coffee? Are you like me and go to bed in anticipation of a great cup of coffee in the morning (and afternoon, maybe). Then let me introduce you to my newest sponsor, Coffee Bros. They have built their business on the cornerstones of sustainability, quality, consistency, and freshness. From coffee to brewing techniques to coffee and espresso machines, they should be your go-to for all things coffee. And if you order from them, use the code Kind10 to get a 10% discount on your order.
Did you find this episode uplifting, inspiring or motivating? Would you like to support more content like this? Check out our Support The Show Page here.
Navigating the journey of parenting an LGBTQ+ child can often feel like uncharted waters, but my guest Jennifer Boudrye, founder and CEO of Parent with Care, is lighting the way with her steadfast beacon of empathy and education. Together, we're peeling back the layers of complexity that accompany the role of an ally, revealing that the paths to understanding and support are as diverse as the community we seek to uplift. In this heartfelt exchange, we confront the intricacies of gender identity, the societal pressures that shape our reactions, and the monumental significance of genuine support for queer youth.
As the mother of a transgender child, Jennifer shares her profound personal experiences, offering up her narrative as both a guide and a comfort to others facing similar challenges. We're reminded that the process of embracing our children's true selves isn't just transformative for them, but for us as parents and allies, too. From the trenches of legislative battles to the intimate victories of a name change, this episode uncovers the dual nature of advocacy—it's as personal as it is political. We're taking a hard look at the current climate of transgender rights and safety, and pointing out the critical need for inclusive spaces and policies that affirm, rather than harm, our youth.
As we wrap up our conversation, the strength of parental advocacy takes center stage. We hear inspiring tales of resilience and the tireless work being done to ensure that every child feels seen, heard, and above all, safe. This isn't just an episode for those directly impacted by these issues—it's a clarion call to anyone who cares about the well-being of our next generation. Through education and empathy, we can all become champions for the rights and safety of transgender and non-binary individuals, ensuring that their futures are as bright and limitless as they deserve to be. Join us as we navigate this nuanced terrain, bolstered by Jennifer's expert guidance and a community's unwavering kindness.
Do you dread Mondays? Does the thought of another Monday steal the joy of your weekend? Let me tell you about a product I have found and tried that can do away with the Sunday Scaries. Oddly enough, it’s from a company called Sunday Scaries. I have personally tried their products, gummies and tinctures and I can personally attest to their efficacy. If you go to their website and order any product, use the code Kindness20 to receive a 20% discount on your order.
Do you like good coffee? Are you like me and go to bed in anticipation of a great cup of coffee in the morning (and afternoon, maybe). Then let me introduce you to my newest sponsor, Coffee Bros. They have built their business on the cornerstones of sustainability, quality, consistency, and freshness. From coffee to brewing techniques to coffee and espresso machines, they should be your go-to for all things coffee. And if you order from them, use the code Kind10 to get a 10% discount on your order.
Did you find this episode uplifting, inspiring or motivating? Would you like to support more content like this? Check out our Support The Show Page here.
Mike:
This podcast is part of the Deluxe Edition Network. To find other great shows on the network, head over to deluxeeditionnetworkcom, that's deluxeeditionnetworkcom.
Jennifer:
Kindness, we see it all around us. We see it when someone pays for someone else's coffee or holds the door open for another person. We see it in the smallest of gestures, like a smile or a kind word. But it's different when we turn on the news or social media. Oftentimes what we hear about what outlets are pushing is the opposite of kind. Welcome to the Kindness Matters podcast. Our goal is to give you a place to relax, to revel in stories of people who have received or given kindness, a place to inspire and motivate each and every one of us to practice kindness every day. Hello everybody and welcome to the Kindness Matters podcast. I am your host, mike Rathbun. I have a fantastic show for you today, but first some housekeeping notes. Don't forget to check out the Deluxe Edition Network's podcast of the month from March. There are three of them this month. First up, bacon is my podcast Host.
Jennifer:
Mike Waman and Jimmy G created the show after friends and fans asked what it was like to be a fly on the wall during their weekly pre-songwriting hangouts. They decided to let the cameras roll, resulting in random and often hilarious conversations over a few whiskies, which evolved into inviting interesting guests from all forms of entertainment to find out what their bacon is. Second up, I need some creep. Two very real comedians discuss their other dark addiction horror movies. Tune in as they talk about the genre, monsters, creators and movies that send tingles creeping up their spines. Welcome to your weekly dose of creep. And finally, up is the Beard Laws. The Beard Laws is a show where Toby, brandon, J McDermott, logan Richie, producer Zach and special guests have free-flowing conversations as if they were sitting around a bonfire having a beer or seven, as if they were sitting at their favorite dive bar, chatting about whatever pops into their brains. Sometimes it's serious, sometimes it's heated, but every time it's fun and you will laugh at least once during the show. And finally, whew, call me Alaska Airlines, because I'm barely holding myself together.
Jennifer:
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Jennifer:
And now let's get into the show. To start off here, I have a kind of disturbing statistic, and this comes from the Trevor Project, from their 2023 survey of LGBTQIA queer youth 41% of queer kids seriously attempted, seriously considered attempting suicide. My guest today is helping to maybe get that number down a little bit. She is the founder and CEO of Parent with Care and I understand she may be a vice presidential nominee in the 2024 election. Just kidding, maybe we don't know. Please welcome to the show, jennifer Boudre. Thanks for coming on, jennifer.
Mike:
That nomination would absolutely depend on who the presidential candidate would be.
Jennifer:
I think we know who we're stuck with. You know what? I have nothing. Nope, we're not going to go there.
Mike:
That's a whole other topic. We'll talk about that another day.
Jennifer:
That is an entire another show. Jennifer, as the founder and CEO of Parent with Care, your role is specifically helping parents. I'm going to mess this up, I just know I am. I want to say come to terms with their child coming out as queer, it really is.
Mike:
So I talk about helping people to overcome their misunderstanding and fear of LGBTQ identity.
Jennifer:
Yeah, okay, but you're there primarily supporting parents, correct?
Mike:
I do. Most of my work is supporting parents. I also do work with organizations and companies and other folks A lot of people in education world, because we are all living in a world where 7% of our population is queer and there are a lot of people who don't understand, but my focus is really, truly my goal, is to make the world safe and affirming for all people, and when I find that parents, especially of LGBTQ folks, don't understand, I'm going to start there, because it starts at home.
Jennifer:
Yeah for sure. But now you didn't always. I mean, you didn't just wake up in your teens and go. I'm going to advocate for parents of queer kids. What was your journey from to here?
Mike:
Every time I do this, I try to make it shorter and I'm not being really successful.
Jennifer:
Take as long as you need.
Mike:
I'm not going to be successful with it. So a million years ago I started having my own children and in 1996, I was the producer and host of a radio talk show called Discovering Kids in Wilmington, delaware, and I was featuring community resources for parents and families. And then I moved back to Montgomery County, maryland, which is my hometown, and then I had three children trying to figure out like where all the things were for them to do, and so I created a resource directory called Family Netsource, which I ran for several years. And then there was this time where I realized like a health insurance and regular hours were good when you had kids. So I went back to school and got a master's in library science and worked as a school librarian for 17 plus years, and for those years I was the director of library programs for DC Public Schools. And then I got to a point I was working. My children obviously had grown and gotten older and I was working for an all girls boarding school oh, the same as the director of library.
Jennifer:
And then at the same time.
Mike:
at the same time, I was doing a lot of advocacy work in the LGBTQ space world. My own son is a very proud bisexual man and I'm also the bonus mom to a trans man, so I'd been working with a local nonprofit doing a lot of work on training and educating and advocacy and, at the same time, working in this all girls school. I had several students who were no longer identifying as female, so I became the go to person with all things DEI being around LGBTQ plus and got to a point where the school really couldn't, wasn't comfortable placing themselves, like defining what is girl right.
Mike:
So I had a situation where I had a group of advisees, as most educators do, and I had one student who was not identifying as female, and I had another student whose mother was a very, very rabid anti-LGBDQ cross person.
Mike:
I just said, I can't. The cognitive dissonance was just too too painful. So I stepped back and realized I wanted to do something different with the next chapter of my life and I literally Googled because I'm a librarian is parent coaching a thing? Right? Because, I thinking back to my entire career, everything had always been about connecting people with information and resources. What about parenting? Yeah, I'm very passionate about trying to parent, well, knowing that I don't always, often.
Jennifer:
Who does Really?
Mike:
Always trying to learn, because nobody teaches us right. So parent coaching is a thing. So in between I had also gotten a master's in educational leadership. So as an academic, I'm like I need another, you know, certification, something. So I went to the GI Institute for Parenting and became a certified parent coach. I started working as a parent coach and realized that the folks that I was connecting with the most and one of the greatest needs was parents whose kids were coming out, who may have been or may have felt that they were allies, but didn't understand what this was, or were completely shocked and taken aback by the fact that their child was now identifying as queer. Like what is this?
Jennifer:
Yeah, because it's one thing to say you're an ally and you can have those feelings, but it's kind of different when it's your own child, isn't it?
Mike:
Yeah, when it comes home.
Jennifer:
Yeah, you, you, why? You know, you impress me as one of those people and I always admire people like this, because I am not one like that who looks around the world and goes, what do we need? Well, we need this. Is there anybody doing that? No, there is nobody doing that, I'll do it. Is that kind of describe how you were?
Mike:
I happened to have a t-shirt I'm not wearing it today, but I have a t-shirt that says Changemaker and I often find myself in situations where I will stand back and, you know, throw the grenade and then watch things blow up and figure out how to help fix it.
Jennifer:
People just want to watch the world burn.
Mike:
Yeah, I don't want to watch it burn I want to fix it before it burns and so, yeah, I really I do feel like this is a part. Again, you know, as an ally, right, I am a cisgender, heterosexual white woman. I can look at the world from a place of privilege and recognize that it's my job to help. I can look at people who are in a marginalized scenario to be able to educate and give space people, you know, the space for people to feel their feelings about things and explore why we have these beliefs and then, you know, really truly shift people to becoming enthusiastic allies.
Jennifer:
Yeah, and I'm probably because I am also the parent of a trans man and a gay man. And you know, I say I'm an ally. I do my little posting on Facebook that says I'm an ally. I've never been to a Pride event, so yet, not being like a Republican in name only, I'm an ally in name only Aino, I don't know. I love my kids and really I mean, that's what it all boils down to right, absolutely Because.
Mike:
And.
Jennifer:
I want to say not everyone.
Mike:
Allyship is a verb, right, we are active allies. For some people, that is being that active, supportive ally for your child, and that can be all it is, and that is huge. Other people are going to go out and, you know, wear rainbows all the time and then blow it all up everywhere. I am not. I'm not, you know. I wear a rainbow wristband on my watch, but I am not dressed top to bottom in rainbows.
Jennifer:
Right.
Mike:
And so I want everyone like there is no specific way to be an ally, but I think it is in any scenario where you are, if you can stand up for whoever it is that is being targeted, whether it's in a conversation or, you know, at your kid's school there are ways to do it that are within your comfort level no-transcript.
Jennifer:
My kid is queer, or I think my kid is queer. What can I do? I'm not sure about this. You have an amazing and I may just link. There'll be a link in the show notes to your website, but in your blog you had a fantastic article and it was titled I Don't Want my Kid To Be Queer and it was so powerful to read that I'm guessing that was a real client.
Jennifer:
Yeah it was. And just folks, if you ever wanted to know what it looks like to think your child is queer and not know where to go for help, and then to find somebody who can walk you through that and discover the steps that need to be taken, right, because you had to go through. Okay, what's your real fear? What are you really afraid of? And I'm not going to spoil the article because I think everybody should read it, but it was just fantastic so they come to you and they say help, are there a lot?
Mike:
Yeah, you figure it is again. 7% of the population is queer.
Speaker 2:
It's not a small amount.
Mike:
No, and the percentages are greater for Gen Z right, and I think one of the things that I want to make clear is it's not that all of a sudden there are all of these queer kids right, or that social media is making them queer.
Mike:
I think what's happening is that we have a lot more language to explain all of this. We have a lot more visibility of LGBTQ plus people in media and other spaces, so there is, in some places, a lot more acceptance and affirmation, right. So in a lot more places, kids feel more free and we are, as human animals, built to put things in boxes and to label things. It makes us know how to operate in the world and I think there are a lot of kids that are like you know what I'm not really sure about those boxes I don't fit any of these boxes?
Mike:
Maybe I'll make up my own right, and so I think there is it's just a more of a freedom, and I have an analogy that I'll get to when we discuss, like, maybe, if we get to, what is gender identity and how do they know? But I think it is really important for people to realize this is not a new thing. It's just that we have more awareness and unfortunately it's become such a hot button political issue, which it should never be. There's a lot more visibility about the whole topic.
Jennifer:
I know, and it does seem that especially okay. Let's take trans genderism, for example. When I was growing up okay, boomer, you know nobody it was funny when Tom Hanks and Peter Scallari dressed up as girls to get into that apartment and nobody badder than I, but it was comedy and it was done for that, and we didn't maybe even know anybody in our real world who and they weren't transgender, they did that for a specific person. They were dressing in drag.
Jennifer:
I should say that. But growing up I didn't know anybody who was transgender. And now it seems like and I think that's the key there it seems like every time you turn around, somebody's coming out as another gender.
Mike:
So I think it's important for folks to understand that, from a psychological standpoint, kids know their own gender by about age three.
Jennifer:
Okay, that explains a lot.
Mike:
Yeah, then you get a lot of messaging right from the world that says your boy or girl.
Jennifer:
Yes.
Mike:
And so kids are either going to be supported if they're born, if they're identified as one gender and they believe that they are a different gender. They'll either be supported in that or not. Right, they might vocalize it or they might not. And so there is a lot of social conditioning and I want to give an example. This is one of my stories that I repeat, so if people have heard me other places, they will have heard this. But, as I mentioned, I have. And the mom, bonus mom to a transgender man. First of all, he did not transition and start his transition until, I think, age 26.
Jennifer:
Yeah.
Mike:
Because he honestly didn't know that it was an option right.
Mike:
So he's now 35, 34, 35, and is married and his wife and he have a child and his wife is a cisgender woman and when she was pregnant she came back with the sonogram one day and he was so excited to say it's a boy and my immediate response was is it Because, even as a transgender man, he was automatically like penis means boy, and I think of all people you know that. That doesn't necessarily mean, and I think this is where we have to get into a little bit of the definition. I think of gender identity versus sexual identity, right? So sexual identity is what the doctor declares, it is what we see, the genitalia and what if they do anything further and looking at chromosomes and all of that, that's your sexual identity.
Mike:
That is what you were assigned at birth. Your gender identity is who you know yourself to be. And, mike, this is where I will ask you know. The question I ask when I'm explaining this is are you Mike? Are you left handed or right handed?
Jennifer:
We'll be right back with more of my conversation with Jennifer Boudre after this message from another Deluxe Edition Network podcast. Take it away, guys.
Speaker 2:
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Mike:
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Jennifer:
The Milf and Me.
Speaker 2:
Podcast.
Jennifer:
I'm right handed how do you know? Because I've always used my right hand.
Mike:
It's just what comes naturally, right I can't write legibly with my left hand. You can't. It would feel really weird if I insisted. If you broke your right arm, you would feel really strange trying to write with your left hand.
Jennifer:
Yeah.
Mike:
It is that innate sense. You know yourself to be right handed because it feels right. Gender identity is the same. I know myself to be a cisgender woman. I know myself to be female and I am.
Jennifer:
Yeah.
Mike:
But if I wasn't sure, if I felt very sure that I was either non-binary or that I was male, I would have to make a decision of whether or not I'm going to share that with anyone, or what does that mean? There's a whole process of coming to terms with that.
Jennifer:
Yeah, I guess I don't know my transgender son's journey. I mean, I do. Obviously I was there for part of it, but I think a lot of it was hidden from me. I remember he hated to have his hair messed with because in his former life he would have to brush the hair every day and here, put on this dress, look cute, look like something that you're not. It basically is what it boiled down to, and he never really expressed that to me until the day he came out, and he was 21 when he came out.
Mike:
And he may not have had the language. I have a good friend who came out, who decided to transition at age 55.
Jennifer:
Oh, my goodness.
Mike:
As a transgender female. She now looks back at her entire life and it was like, oh well, duh right. It was there, we just weren't paying attention.
Mike:
And that's where it's talking about that social conditioning and when working with parents. It's really again the messaging that we give our kids and I always talk about guys to always start out with working with intrinsic bias. What are the beliefs that we have that we aren't even aware we have? And when my son, my bi guy, was growing up, he knew I'm of that era of pick a team, right, you're either gay or straight, I don't care what you are, you're fine.
Speaker 2:
I love y'all.
Mike:
And he had that messaging in forever. And when he was 19, he came out in an article or an op-ed for his college newspaper in response to being called the F-slur on campus and in that article he came out as bisexual and I was like, oh, what, I don't know what. That is Right, he's now 27. So clearly I've done some work and done some research and learning, and now I completely understand it.
Mike:
But we were talking just a few months ago about his coming out story and he said explain to me that that messaging that he had gotten from me forever of boy, girl, pick a team, straight or gay, caused him to deny his bisexuality to himself and to me for a very long time. Right, so again, even somebody who I considered myself an ally forever still had a lot of learning to do and still has to go back and repair some of the damage.
Jennifer:
Yeah, and I've told this story and I've told it on air before, and I may end up cutting this out, but when my son came out as trans to me, it was in the fall of 2015. And I had lost my mother, had passed away in April of that year, and I said probably one of the most hateful things you could say to somebody in his situation. I said well, first of all, I said I love you, which is a good first step, and then I completely trashed it when I said great, now I've lost my mother and my daughter.
Mike:
And even now saying it.
Jennifer:
It's just like I kind of want to you know and I apologize later, obviously, but I think it still sticks with him we make mistakes and I know it was a mistake and I've apologized for it.
Mike:
But it's out there. You're a human and this is. You know it is never, ever, ever too late to repair. The other person may not accept it, but you can always go back and explain. You know it's my Angel is do the best you can until you know better, and when you know better, you do better.
Jennifer:
Do better, right? Yeah, for sure, but this, this, what you do. I think Jennifer takes on a lot more importance these days Just because there seems to be a lot more focus on the community, as my good friend Jillian Abbey, author of perfectly queer is the name of her book, and I had her on the show last earlier last year and she's legit a bit of qua and I don't know. Queer may be easier than that, but it but there is so much hate focused on that community and maybe specifically the trans community.
Speaker 2:
Yeah.
Jennifer:
And I. So what you do is very important and so needed these days. How many? I saw a stat, and I'm not going to remember it right now the number of bills that were introduced just last year in all over the United States.
Mike:
This year. Okay, we're recording this in the middle of February of 2024 and there have been over 500 bills, oh my gosh, in the first month and a half of the new year. And that it is. Yeah, that's why I do this work. It is. I really have a hard time wrapping my head around the why, yeah, and I tell people I approach parents and anyone where I'm having these conversations with, starting out with help me understand how you came to this belief. Oftentimes, again, it is that social conditioning, and so I try to dismantle and pull apart as many of the false beliefs as I can, and we often get to a place where it's, you know, people will pull the religion card, to which I respond. One of my daughters is a Lutheran pastor and my son-in-law, her husband, is a Presbyterian pastor and I have it on their good authority and they went to one of the most prestigious seminaries in the country that God loves everyone. Period the end.
Jennifer:
And we're supposed to do the same.
Mike:
Yep.
Jennifer:
And I'm pretty sure that go ahead.
Mike:
I would say if your religion is leading you to hate anyone, you're doing it wrong.
Jennifer:
Amen to that. See, I don't have a t-shirt all over the place. Is it a rainbow t-shirt? Just a thought. So let's try to educate here. Let's talk about some of the misinformation or lies that are spread about the transgender community. Oftentimes you will hear somebody say they're mutilating the children, and that's not true.
Mike:
Nope. So gender affirming care, especially when it comes to children, there are different aspects of gender affirming care. Okay, so there is social affirmation, medical, legal and surgical all separate things. Okay, right. So when we talk about gender affirming care for a child, we're talking about social, we're talking about respecting the name that they have chosen, respecting the pronouns that they have told you that they are Right. So it is believe who your child tells you that they are in this moment, because it could change, right, so you have to go with the flow.
Speaker 2:
Yes.
Mike:
So no one is advocating for surgery for children, period Zero. Nobody is doing that. When it comes to medical gender affirming, care, right. We're talking about, first of all, puberty blockers. Puberty blockers literally just put a pause on puberty. It's just a hold.
Jennifer:
Right.
Mike:
So they have been used for decades on children who have precocious puberty. Children, you know, little girls who are getting their period at age seven, eight.
Jennifer:
Oh dear.
Mike:
So it's really early.
Jennifer:
I've never heard the phrase precocious puberty.
Mike:
Yeah, so it is literally just wait. We're going to hold on for a minute because the rest of the body and the brain has to develop before you're ready for that. So the safety record for these medications is very, very well established.
Jennifer:
Yeah.
Mike:
So all we're saying is if you have a child who consistently and persistently has identified his transgender puberty blockers, give you that time for their brains to develop. Is this the correct path? Then there is the possibility of shifting into surgical gender. Affirming care when they are of age, when they are adults, right.
Jennifer:
Eighteen or older.
Mike:
And what the reason that it's really super important for the puberty blockers piece and that in between there is hormonal care. So if you are identifying as male, you may, at age 14, 16, be given testosterone or, if you're a female, estrogen so that you go through the correct gender puberty. Because if you have I'm going to stick with transgender female If you have a transgender female, so assigned male at birth, then they go through a male, traditional, normal male puberty. They're going to physically change right.
Mike:
Their voice is going to change. The Adam's apple, the face structure, is going to change. It is much more difficult for someone who has gone through that puberty stage to transition and feel completely comfortable, feeling as feminine as they want to be right, so that the puberty blockers just put a pause on that development, so that the person can continue to develop as the gender that they know themselves to be.
Jennifer:
Okay, so how long does that normally? How long is that pause? It can be indefinite, or it can be.
Mike:
I mean, it's a few years you're going to want again socially, right. So if you have a child, that's hopefully again. You're working very closely with psychologists, psychiatrists, medical doctors, right? Nobody is. You can't go to CVS and get this stuff.
Jennifer:
Right, that's the other part I was going to bring up is that none of this happens without the parents being involved A if they're a minor, and medical doctors and psychologists. It's all very closely coordinated. This is not just on a whim. One kid wakes up in the morning and goes I'm a girl, nope, and we run down to CVS and pick up some meds for it.
Mike:
Yeah, it is a very long, very methodical, very well supervised process.
Speaker 2:
Yes.
Mike:
So ideally you're going to have, you're working with your gender affirming team before your child begins puberty and there's many ways that they can determine whether that's happened or not. So you start puberty blockers and then you're watching to see when are the peers starting to go through puberty, when is the child emotionally ready to go through puberty, and then you'll switch to the hormonal therapy. And just so you know so, if you have an adult who has gone through puberty right in their 20s, 30s, 50s, if they start going through on gender affirming hormone therapy, they're going to go through a second puberty.
Mike:
For the puberty for that gender. And you know what? Puberty is not fun. So how about we just? No, it's not fun for anybody?
Jennifer:
Nobody. Yeah, I know my son. Yeah, at the time that he told me again, he was 21 and he had just I think right after he told me he started on testosterone and it was years before he had top surgery and another many years before he had his hysterectomy. He hasn't had any other kinds of surgeries since then but I mean, he did he find last year he finally got his name changed. Yeah, and, and his sex changed on his, on his driver's license. I was so happy for him.
Jennifer:
That's wonderful, so it's all becoming real it is and I think it's.
Mike:
It's so important for people to understand how affirming that is. And and when I tell parents and I I don't focus as too much on the scary statistics because they are terrifying right, and so every parent, it is is afraid for their kid, but Knowing that you have the ability to literally save a kid's life by doing some, literally simple things.
Mike:
I don't Understand why anyone you know I, I have a hard time with the cognitive dissonance of people who say you know, we want to protect children, we want to do everything right for kids, we're worried about kids mental health, but our advocating for laws and legislation and policy that puts kids in direct harm.
Speaker 2:
I. Yeah yeah, it's hard for me to get my hair absolutely right.
Jennifer:
I that would drive me nuts. If I because I don't work in your situation every day I I can't even imagine how, hearing that, day in and day out, the cognitive dissonance I'm would drive me nuts. So if you were Going to testify before a state legislature that was considering a bill I Don't know, to ban students from using a, a bathroom other than their assigned sex at birth, what would you say?
Mike:
Stop so.
Jennifer:
I think well, right to the point, very nicely done just don't right.
Mike:
I mean Again, I think it. You have to break down what is the actual intent of such a law? Right, it is right, people safe.
Mike:
So looking at Having to get people to understand that sexual predators are A whole different category than somebody's sex or gender right and so a female is no more at risk by having a Transgender woman in the same restroom as she is of having a lesbian or a another person who has ill will Period right. So the solution truly is if you want everyone to be safe, then have single sex, single person, all gender bathrooms right. Let everyone have their own space. Yeah so we need to disconnect Gender and gender identity from sexual behavior. They're very different and.
Mike:
And recognizing. When you do start to dig into the statistics and you find that the person who is Transgender is at much higher risk of harm physical, verbal, emotional harm that any cisgender person walking on this earth, yes, you start to see the folly of that type of legislation.
Mike:
Right, yeah, absolutely, I go ahead you cannot legislate people from existing, so you cannot. You try, you can try. But having laws that deny people Accessed and I people rights does not mean that those people are going to go away. It just means that you are making, you are choosing to make the world less safe.
Jennifer:
Yeah, I, there was a. I was just trying to find it and I can't find it now. The Trevor project is an amazing resource For queer people, especially queer kids, but they had a stat you probably have it about how many transgender, just LGBTQI Kids felt threatened on a daily basis. It's over in their school.
Mike:
Yeah it's close to 60% and that the really scary thing and again the reason I'm doing this work is only 40% of Queer kids feel that their own home is Safe and welcoming.
Jennifer:
So when it.
Mike:
Yeah, so when people, when we get into the conversation about you know the parents have the right to know, right should kids. Something else I wanted to bring up.
Mike:
Yeah, yeah, there's another, another state legislator that is trying to force teachers to outkids and I did a whole training for the school resale, our school resource officers in my local district and they had the same fear, like right, if we've got to tell the kids, the parents, because we need the parents need to know. And I my response was do you know for certain that that parent is safe to know? Because if you or if you have a child that says to you, you know, my parent is gonna kill me or my parent is gonna throw me out, you need to take that seriously. That may be the actual truth and so, yeah, letting that parent know you have condemned that child to harm.
Jennifer:
Yeah, because it's not like you know. A kid might say oh, I wrecked the car right, ding the car. My dad's gonna kill me. In this particular instance they may be. That might not be hope hyperbole.
Mike:
No, no, it is. You know, a majority of the home unhomed youth are queer and are out there because Parents have rejected them because they are no longer welcome in their home.
Jennifer:
Yep, because of who they are.
Mike:
Yeah, so I recommend. So I'll just you know we talk about when people share. You know the kids share the information and I think it's important for educators to Take a couple of steps. One is to say thank you for trusting you with this information, right? The second thing is who knows and who can't know, Right, you understand where that child is in their lives. And then the third is what can I do to help you and support you right now?
Mike:
That child might need you to be the one that helps them tell their parents. They might be the one that you know they might need the resources of you know, a homeless shelter, so that they feel they can tell their parents and they can leave and be safe. They might need you to Keep that a secret for now. Right, if there's a lot of different ways to approach it, but I think For me, even when working with parents, it the child is the one that needs to be protected and cared for.
Jennifer:
Yeah, and everybody says that, but not everybody's doing it. Yeah, yeah, and I'll tell you what if you are a teacher or an educator of some sort and a child comes out to you, kudos to you, because you must be doing something right. Yeah, they feel safe enough To do that with you. Yeah, so, jennifer, I could go on and on and on. I I really could.
Jennifer:
I appreciate it because this is such an important topic and it's obviously it's dear to my heart. I I'm so glad that that my kids Did not have. Well, I don't know about all of them, but at least the one I Don't. Think he may have been questioning at the time, but it wasn't public knowledge, so Any bullying he got at school was regular old bullying, not Don't even get started.
Jennifer:
Yeah, no, not about is not about it. Yeah, not about that. So, but God bless you for what you do, jennifer. I think it's so great and I'm so in awe of you and I so appreciate you taking a few minutes to come on and talk to me about it. I'm gonna have you back, for sure.
Mike:
I love that. I would love that.
Jennifer:
Fantastic. Thank you again. I appreciate your time and I appreciate what you do and Keep fighting the good fight.
Mike:
Thanks so much.
Jennifer:
Man. That was a great conversation with Jennifer Boudre. If you have a A queer child, if you know somebody who has a queer child, or even if you just want to educate yourself, I highly recommend checking out Jennifer's website, parentwithcarecom, and Just go in there and see what she does. She does a fantastic job of Helping parents Understand what's going on with their child and even just helping regular people like you and me, who may or may not have queer kids, to understand and be an ally, and I so appreciate that from her. It's just an amazing job, and that will do it for another episode of the kindness matters podcast. Thank you so much for the time that you have Extended the gift of your time and taking a moment to listen to this episode. We will be back next week, but in the meantime, be that person who roots for others, who tells a stranger that they look Amazing and encourages others to believe in themselves and their dreams. You've been listening to the kindness matters podcast. My name is Mike Rathbun. Have a fantastic week.