Hey Julia Woods
Join me, Julia Woods, a couples coach and wife of over 3 decades, as I share some of my client's stories and my own so that you can be encouraged, inspired, and gain new results in your marriage.
Hey Julia Woods
Our Marriage is Falling Apart! A Story of Resilience.
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What happens when the pressures of parenthood and personal struggles collide? Join us as we sit down with Kyle and Mallory, a couple who've weathered ten years of marriage and the trials of raising three young children. They candidly share the darkest chapter of their lives, starting with the birth of their second child and intensifying with the arrival of their third. Kyle opens up about his battles with anger, resentment, and substance abuse, while Mallory's patience and understanding play a crucial role in steering them towards healing. This episode is a raw exploration of self-reflection and accountability in the face of seemingly insurmountable challenges.
The birth of their colicky third child, Bryce, was more than just an addition to their family; it was a catalyst for profound change. We delve into the emotional turmoil this period brought, from Mallory's desire to leave a longstanding job to be more present with the children, to the significant marital challenges that surfaced. Frequent, unresolved arguments created a deep sense of loneliness despite external support. The struggle to communicate effectively and the habit of internalizing conflicts emphasized the need for new strategies to navigate their relationship.
Discover the transformative tools Kyle and Mallory gained through coaching and breakthrough experiences that reshaped their approach to marriage and parenting. Kyle shares the importance of personal responsibility and accountability, while Mallory highlights the power of generous listening. They discuss how shifting from resentment to gratitude has turned everyday tasks into cherished moments of connection. This episode is a testament to how gratitude and appreciation can enrich family life and foster personal well-being.
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Welcome to hey, julia Woods podcast. I'm your host, julia Woods, founder of Beautiful Outcome, a coaching company focused on helping couples learn to see and understand each other, even in the most difficult conversations. On my podcast, I will share with you the real and raw of the messiness and amazingness of marriage. I'll share with you aspects of my relationship and the couples I coach in a way that you can see yourself and find the tools that you need to build the marriage you long for All. Right, welcome to today's episode of the podcast. I'm super excited to get to introduce to you Kyle and Mallory. We have been working together for two years, I believe. So first, kyle and Mallory, welcome, thank you. I want to share with the audience just a little bit about you to add some context. So you guys have been married how long? 10 years in August, 10 years in August and you have three little ones, right, correct? And how old's the youngest and how old's the oldest?
Speaker 3:The youngest is two and a half and the oldest is six and a half.
Speaker 1:Awesome. So you guys. My first connection with you guys was you guys came to a breakthrough two years ago, right. Yes to a breakthrough two years ago, right, yes, yeah. And then after that we started working together through coaching and, kyle, you did some different work on your own, and Mallory, you and I really focused on the coaching side of things, and then you both came back to breakthrough again this year and are coming again next year. Did I get all that accurate?
Speaker 2:year and are coming again next year. Did I get?
Speaker 1:all that accurate, all right, great. Well, I am excited for people to hear your story. I think there's a lot that couples will resonate with, and so let's jump in and get started with. I'd love each of you to share what would you say has been your hardest season in your marriage and what was hard about it for you.
Speaker 2:I'll go first. Okay, after having the second kid, you know, things got a little hectic. There's a lot of pressure and expectations, not only for yourself but for your spouse, and it got a little hard. And then we found out we were having our third kid and once he came along, life got really hard. I think there was a lot of resentment, judging close-mindedness, if you will, from both of us.
Speaker 2:Me personally, I took a route that was not very healthy through drugs and alcohol. That was not very healthy through, um, drugs and alcohol. Um, I was.
Speaker 2:I personally was a lost individual, um, mad at the mad at the world, angry with Mallory, daily, um, um and uh. My way of lashing out was to run away, and I use substances to do that and it was, um, not the right decision, obviously, but, uh, one that took me a little while to realize was not the answer. Actually, through all that, mallory did keep her patience with me. Somehow. I think she knew I had a lot of work to do and I don't want to talk for her, but I believe that she knew she had work to do herself to help better our relationship. Um, for me personally, just starting over with a clear mind was most important. And you know, once I spent some time with a clear mind, feelings start coming back and emotions start coming back, natural emotions. And then you know, it was easier for me to look, not at Mallory, but instead in the mirror of what I was bringing to the table, where I was at fault and what I could do better.
Speaker 1:Before we dive deeper into today's episode, I want to talk to you about something super exciting. It's a game changer. Really, to have the relationship you long for, you must take responsibility for yourself and who you are being, moment by moment. It's not about what your spouse needs to change. It's about you taking control of the only thing you can control, which is you. That's the truth that nobody's talking about when they talk about marriage. But I am inside the marriage growth community where I will help you take responsibility for your ability to lead conversations with your spouse to love and connection, so you can have the marriage you dreamed of when you first fell in love. At the very first link in the show notes, you can grab my marriage growth community and that's really going to help. I know that because it's based on the same principles I've used to coach this couple and hundreds of other couples to marriage success over the last nine years. So grab Marriage Growth Community at the top of the show notes. Okay, back to the show. That's a lot. There's a lot.
Speaker 2:It was, it still is a lot.
Speaker 1:Yeah Well, and I I think not a lot in regards to like you know that's so much on you. It's like it's really powerful, like the honesty and the ownership in that. It's a lot and I think it's powerful. I want to slow it down because I think a lot more people might resonate with you than you may realize. So I want to go back to the beginning, when you started sharing and you said you know it makes a lot of sense, a lot of pressure and expectations having two kids, and then you find out in the midst of that you're having a third one. And you said you were angry and, you know, judging and resentful. Can you tell us, give us, a glimpse into that? Because as humans, we all are resentful and judging and closed-minded to our spouse. We don't realize it and sometimes, when someone else can articulate it, what it looks like for them, it can be really helpful for us to connect to. So do you remember what you were really angry about? What were you resentful about with Mallory?
Speaker 2:So I mean, there certain things were said that um hurt me and I held onto them. They were hard, it was hard for me to deal with, to just like brush off and just like through everyday life. You have, I guess I made expectations, maybe of what more Mallory should be doing. And you know, if I did, if she wasn't doing what I thought she was supposed to do, then I would get angry like what.
Speaker 1:What did you think she was supposed to be doing?
Speaker 2:gosh. Like household chores. Um, I like I was I cook every night and like I would be angry like that she wouldn't ever like even try. Like after being at work all day. Like I would always have to come home um make dinner. Like I take care of all the kids, sports stuff, um, so any after like extracurricular activities or whatever I was in charge of. Um, so I felt like all that was on me it's, I mean, it's it's easy to say these things now, but I like the feelings have changed. Obviously, instead of looking at just what I do, now I'm I also am able to stop and look at the things she does as well yeah.
Speaker 1:So I'm going to ask a question and there's two questions I want to ask. So the first one is like what? Like what was the breaking point? What brought you to say something's got to change?
Speaker 2:I mean, I think we were both miserable. There was, we were not connected whatsoever. We're. I remember a point, mallory telling me like our family is falling apart. I still that. That memory is ingrained in my mind. She was very upset and I think that was the point. Like I, I knew that I was a big part of that, possibly.
Speaker 1:How'd you know that Cause you were I mean, I'm assuming you were on substances when she said this.
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 1:How did it sink? How do you think it sunk in in the midst of that?
Speaker 2:her raw emotion and my um gosh I don't know how to explain it was um, um, I almost felt like she was in a point of helplessness and I felt like a lot of the helplessness was because of me and my actions. Like she can only take care of herself, you know, like there became a point where she like there was nothing she could do for me. I had for myself yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:And you said you um, you started over with a clear mind. What do you mean? Like, how did you get a clear mind?
Speaker 2:I mean, getting sober has a lot to do with that. And working, uh actually I guess before you even realize, started working my program, like I lost a lot of raw emotion and I was pretty much numb thing around me. I was pretty much numb Thing around me. So you know, when once I spent some time sober and realized what my actions had done and what I had put on the table, there's a lot of guilt and shame that follows that.
Speaker 1:What?
Speaker 2:are you thinking? I'm thinking that I'm not happy where I am right now.
Speaker 1:That's what I'm thinking, yeah.
Speaker 2:So just for listeners to understand so how did you get sober?
Speaker 1:I had to go to a 28-day inpatient rehab program. I didn't want to go at first, but it did not take much convincing to get me to go. How did you wind it?
Speaker 2:Was that Mallory telling you to go, or what happened with that? Well, of course, mallory told me that she didn't want me at home while I was getting sober. Honestly, I really took that into consideration. Then I talked to my mother. That didn't really work, I mean, and the person who really broke me was my brother-in-law, the one I work with every day. We run mouse dad's company together. At this point I was really worried about leaving him with for a month with all you know, managing all of our employees, and he does a lot. He did a lot while I was gone, but yeah, he just told me most people end up there anyway, so just go get it taken care of, and that made my decision a lot easier. I don't know why it seems so simple, but he's. I really value his opinion.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 3:Thanks, I dig it.
Speaker 1:It's amazing. Amazing, the power of honesty and community. What I hear you saying is you didn't get there on your own.
Speaker 2:Oh God, no, community. What I hear you saying is you didn't get there on your own. Oh god, no. He took me to a crisis center after I broke down and basically admitted everything I'd been doing. Um, I did some pretty, pretty shady stuff I don't want to talk about, but but it wasn't good, so my conscience couldn't take it any longer, so I just blurted it all out and he took care of me, for lack of a better term, and he took care of me quickly.
Speaker 1:Wow, powerful Mallory, how would you describe the hardest season in your marriage?
Speaker 3:so I would agree that it was the transition from two to three children. Um, I guess there's like a common theme of feeling lost. Um, I think, I don't know, the birth of Bryce just changed something in me where, like it's not that I didn't have a happy life, but I really it was just a huge season of change. Like with work I left, I decided to leave the job that I thought I'd be in forever, I don't know. Something just about being like outnumbered with children felt really overwhelming. Um, you know, at the time it didn't feel like, but looking back, I think Bryce was a gift for me to learn to let go and accept what is. He was super colicky, he did not sleep through the night and, you know, one one glimmer of hope in that was I did. I overcame my, my insomnia and by just accepting that we were doing the best we can for him and he'll sleep one day and I'll sleep one day, um, but I think, just motherhood in general, um, I realized that I didn't. I no longer wanted to answer to a job, I wanted to be home with my children more often. Um, but at the time I had no idea what that looks like. Um, and you know me and I like control and I I'm a bit of a perfectionist, um, so I think you know a lot of the I also probably had.
Speaker 3:Well, I also did have, um, a lot of resentment and expectations toward Kyle. Um, to be completely honest, I think and I hope I'm not going on a tangent, but this is just what's popping up in my head is that it's funny? I share with everyone that we're high school sweethearts and we often get, oh my gosh, that's so cute. And to a point it is, and to a point it's not, because I think we just were naive in thinking like we love each other. We're high school sweethearts. You know, like that's very I don't know the word, you know it's culturally like something like really, really cool and really it set us up not to work on ourselves or our marriage. So once you throw three kids in the mix and we don't know how to communicate and we're just have building blame and resentment, um, and it's turning into explosive arguments that are occurring in front of our children. That was really hard and I think I think I had and and still still do, but I have an awareness and um work it through it, but kind of this like the victim, the martyr, like well, I'm doing all this, I'm caring for all, all of our three kids. You're just.
Speaker 3:You know, it got like when he was, there was a point where he I just felt like he wasn't around, like physically there were times he just wasn't around and mentally he just wasn't around for a while and that got really hard. And I think you're one of the first people to bring up like I didn't realize how lonely I felt, even though I had my mom helping with the kids, like my brother willing to help my dad, like not being deeply connected to my husband and then like also not feeling that deep connection with my kids. It felt really, really lonely, um, and I think I did. I just got to like a hopeless help. I mean hopeless, helpless point where I was just begging, like I knew something was off. I didn't, I didn't know exactly what it was.
Speaker 3:Um, I will say at that point I had started on like my whatever you want to call it, like healing journey, self-discovery. So I did have some awareness, um, and it was hard to sit in that awareness and but not Um, and it was hard to sit in that awareness and but not not really have the tools in order to go to make the change that I was looking for, um, and I think a big part of that was just learning to communicate better with Kyle, so we didn't have these blow up arguments, um, and also, I think, losing that like wanting to be right and everything. I really feel like we kind of started our relationship off like when to be right. It was always a competition and that kind of bled into like parenting and and everything else, so I think that was that was a huge thing, is like we both just wanted to be right and prove our point and that just never, never worked out for us.
Speaker 1:Yeah, do you guys describe, like, what arguments in that season? Like, what did arguments look like? Like, were they long, were they? Did you recover quickly? Did you stay mad for days, weeks, months? Like, how would each of you describe what fights were like, uh, in that season for me.
Speaker 3:I'll describe what it was like for me personally.
Speaker 3:I would get mad at something like typically it was probably over like parenting, something that I didn't agree with that he was doing, and I'd make a comment, and then he'd make a comment back and I make a comment back and we would get in this battle of who was right, trying to prove our point and it would just get like louder and louder and louder.
Speaker 3:It it might explode in that moment or it might have just turned into like just stop talking. And then for me that would lead to like ruminating and having like conversations in my head with Kyle, like for days of like arguing with Kyle in my head. That would just leave me like exhausted and with like building anger and building resentment because I'm having these, these conversations in my head, um, and I think that would just when we went to address it. I would just be here like I'm not ready to come to a solution. I'm ready to like tell you all the things, tell you off that I told you off in my head. Now I can do it in person and oftentimes it would get so like we wouldn't stop in front of the kids and that, I think, was one of the hardest, but one of the also the things that we were like okay, wow, like this is getting to a point like that. This is really impacting our kids and their emotional and mental well-being. Um, that was definitely like a wake-up call.
Speaker 1:Yeah, what about you, kyle? How would you describe your fights in that?
Speaker 2:season. Like I would just get triggered easily Like the same thing Mallory's saying and then, not to put anything on Mallory, but like one of her she would threaten me with divorce when she got really mad and I would like I would ruminate in that and like is she saying it because she's mad? Does she really mean it? Like what am I doing what in this relationship? If that's how she really feels and like I think a lot of the times I've that's what I would continually think about and then like because of that, like I would be quick to want to make up, but I know like a lot of the time Mallory like not ready, so then like there'd just be no talking and then that's kind of when.
Speaker 1:I like run like I didn very, very relevant to what a lot of couples deal with, but nobody really talks about how that actually works. Behind closed doors, right, we see the highlight reels of people's lives and it's like I'm sure they don't fight like we do. So you guys have gained a lot of different transformational tools through breakthrough and through coaching. So what would each of you say has is, when you think back to that season, what do you think are the transformate, is the transformational tool or tools that you most wish you had would have been most helpful in that season of of suffering.
Speaker 2:Can we go?
Speaker 1:All right.
Speaker 2:I'll go. Okay, yeah, so I mean, I've obviously learned. I've learned a lot with you through Breakthrough and the bit of coaching. I'm bringing to the table where I'm at fault first, the things I could be communicating or physically giving to our household or relationship, not just to make our lives easier but to make Mallory's life easier, and more so after the last breakthrough with you, something that I try to keep on the top of my mind you're going to love this, julia is like the I don't know what, I don't know, like I've just like Mallory, like I would make up all sorts of stories and this like the Brene Brown, the story I'm telling myself, like I could go for days on the things that I told myself that were probably just not even close to being true, mm-hmm. And I always like to keep that like in the forefront of my mind, like when anything comes up daily. I usually like at work. Really, it's just about keeping myself accountable first before I go and worry about anything or anyone else.
Speaker 1:Yeah, powerful. So I hear different ones in there. I hear what are you contributing, taking personal responsibility?
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 1:And then wonder, like wondering what do you not know? You don't know.
Speaker 2:There's a lot.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's powerful. What about you, mallory?
Speaker 3:it's powerful. What about you, mallory? I'd have to say, number one is generous listening. So I tend to be that person in an argument who's like the other person is like blah, blah, blah, blah and I'm over here like, hmm, how am I going to prove them wrong? What kind of research I'm going to throw at them? What statistic I'm going to throw at them? What statistic am I going to throw at them? What line from a book, what book am I going to tell them to go read?
Speaker 3:So it's thinking about all my comeback when someone else is presenting their case. I've been really, really, really focusing on listening to them and I think like that's kind of comes back to the also like I don't know what I don't know, listen to to their side and how they're experiencing this situation, um, and respond to that, rather than responding in the just trying to be right in whatever I've decided is true, that's been really huge and I think that's just been a pattern. That's like throughout my life that I'm realizing if I can do a better job, like listening to understand from someone else's point of view and how they're experiencing things that we that really like has you know that can cap off any like escalation of these like explosive arguments.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, yeah. So what? What difference do you think that those tools would have made for you in this hardest season you were walking through?
Speaker 2:Oh, for me, that's easy for me, Like I was so quick to put blame on everyone else and I had buckets and buckets of resentments. Buckets and buckets of resentments and resentments, I've learned, are just not healthy whatsoever. I mean resentments.
Speaker 1:Resentments can hurt a lot more than just yourself too. So, kyle, when you think about, like you know, you were making the dinners and you were getting earlier. You said you were resentful that you know you looking in the mirror, the tool that you mentioned, looking in the mirror or what are you contributing? What do you recognize would have been different?
Speaker 2:I mean like now it's like it's a privilege to feed my family, not like it's a very different mindset I have now. Like I get to come home, I get to spend time with my kids, I get to feed them food that we work for and bought. Like not everyone has those opportunities, yeah, like. And then like gratitude is something else I'll throw in there too. Like learning to be grateful for what you have rather than take an advantage.
Speaker 2:Like when you look at what you have and you can appreciate it. That helps your mindset a lot too. I would consider Mallory and I very fortunate people. We have loving families, a big support system, three beautiful, healthy kids. There's a lot to live for. Making dinner now it's no longer a chore, that's for sure. A chore, that's for sure. I'm happy and grateful that I can come home and put a meal on the table for my family.
Speaker 1:So I want to slow this down because I think again a lot of Pete listeners will resonate Like Kyle, that is massive to go from. Like Kyle, that is massive to go from. You know, my wife. She just doesn't get me. She doesn't see how hard I'm working. I'm working all day. I got to come home and I got to make the dinner. She doesn't even try and help me. Like this is ridiculous too. I get to come home, I cook food for my children. I get to put this on the table and gather together in love. Like that is like a night and day difference. Can you share a little about how in the world do you go from that to that?
Speaker 2:Yes, a lot of it is just when you numb yourself to life and feeling you don't get to experience that as it comes naturally to you. Um, um, in a way, I don't want to go too far with this, but, like you know, life to me almost became like a burden. I guess I looked at I spent too much time like focusing on the negative when there's so much positive surrounding me. Um, I mean, I was in, I was in a deep, deep dark hole and it's not not until you see, like a glimmer of light, that that, like, you want to climb out of it. But, um, you know, I was in a rough spot yeah it what I hear it's.
Speaker 2:It's almost like you got your life back oh, that's, yeah, I mean, it's, I've, it's a little more than that too. I got, I, I, I got like a second chance at life. Um, I got a second chance of like looking at life, though, I guess you could say, and the way in which I choose to experience life. Mm, hmm, yeah, yeah because that's a daily decision Like yeah, it's powerful.
Speaker 1:What I hear you saying is you were like the frog in the pot or in the home with carbon monoxide poisoning and you gradually got numb to the point you didn't even realize you were almost dead to your own life is that very close?
Speaker 2:yes, yeah I mean there's a point where, yeah, like mallory said, like I was at the end of my uh, ripping and running, like I was barely at home, I'd like, I'd for lack of a better term I, I just didn't care which sounds, but it's the truth no, that's powerful.
Speaker 1:Okay, Mallory, what do you say? The difference these tools would have made for you in that season of you? Know, I hear the loneliness, I hear the not knowing what to do right, Like your husband's, he's saying he's he wasn't there. And how would these tools have made a difference for you in that season?
Speaker 3:I think they would have led to communication and connection and maybe understanding what was going on for him. Understanding what was going on for him, um, I think I had a tendency to just look at myself like as the mother, thinking like well, I'm the mother, so it all changed for me. Um, kind of getting stuck in that I'm the mother, um, I'm responsible for all of this, and kind of, I guess, feeling responsible, you know for it all, because you know, from my perspective I mean, if I'm being brutally honest, it was like well, yeah, the least you can do is come up and cook dinner and do everything else at home and I work. But I think I don't, I don't think I was able to appreciate that that season of life was hard for him too, and I just wanted to prove how hard it was for me. And, you know, I don't even know if I wanted help or if I just wanted sympathy, and I think I guess it just it just would have. You know, I wonder if it maybe would have like shortened the time, like maybe he would have felt if I was more open and understanding, maybe he would have came to me sooner and understanding, maybe he would have came to me sooner. Um, you know I told you before, but I think that you were able to hold the space for him and, like our very first coaching call, um, and even though he had hinted I mean he'd, I guess it wasn't a hint he had he had confessed, but very vaguely. Before that and then during our first call, was was when it all kind of came pouring out and then within a week he was at the crisis center and in rehab.
Speaker 2:Big resentment towards you, Julia.
Speaker 3:Big one.
Speaker 1:Big one Tell me more.
Speaker 2:No, that was one of my big breaking points. When you told me I couldn't do that, I was pissed and I did myself in real good for a week or two and then that was it.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Let me just for listeners, so they understand. So you came to the first coaching call and you had not kept some of the commitments of the program. So I started investigating. I knew that broken commitments are a cry for help and so I just started asking you some questions and you were really honest with me and you told me that you had dependence on drugs and alcohol. And I asked how? When was the last time? And it became evident that we weren't talking about a coaching or a communication problem. We were talking about a dependence, and alcoholic and drug dependence and I knew that coaching wouldn't help you, and so I let you know that.
Speaker 2:I wouldn't be able to coach you until you addressed the deeper issues, and so thank you.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'd love to to hear, like it makes sense, that it pissed you off, which I understood, and yet I loved you too much to try and convince you know, to try and pretend like something was going to help you when I knew it wasn't, and so what impact did that have on you once?
Speaker 2:once you let yourself sit sit with it. I didn't let myself sit with it, tell me. I was pissed, you know that's another was was the biggest reason at that point in time for me to to drink and use. It was like you, you know, screw the world yeah.
Speaker 1:It also. It hurt.
Speaker 2:Yeah, cause I wanted to fix my marriage. But you know, and I appreciate you more than you know um.
Speaker 1:I wasn't going to fix it in the condition I was in, and that's for sure. Yeah, do you think that played a part in you choosing to come into the light?
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely yeah. I mean, we came to you, to, you know, help us with our problems. Obviously, you're still able to help, mallory, but when I was told, you know, you couldn't help me, then at that point who could? No one but me?
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:So it didn't take long to figure it out. It took long in the whole process, but after that happened it didn't take long.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's the truth that sets us free free even though it's really painful at the time, and that's the greatest thing I can offer is truth, because I know that if you want to be set free, it will set you free, and it it played a part in you choosing that, and I'm grateful well, I'm grateful as well.
Speaker 2:I get it.
Speaker 1:I get it so, as you guys sit with this, like if there's people listening and they're resonating and they're recognizing wow, this is pretty close to home to home what would you say to yourselves back then? Or what do you wish someone would have said that you think might be helpful for them to hear in this moment?
Speaker 2:here we go yeah I can go I mean it's for me it's like fairly simple. If you can look in the mirror and honestly be happy with the person you are and what you're bringing to the table to your household and your family. If you're being rigorously honest with yourself, like then you're doing what's right. But if you look in the mirror and deep down, if you're being completely honest with yourself and you know there's things that you can be doing better, figure out how to do it better. It's not easy.
Speaker 1:But better. It's not easy, but when you do, work on yourself, life gets easier a little bit at a time. Yeah, it's a long process. Yeah, it's a lifelong really, when we, when we right honest about what you just said, we recognize the reality of life is that it is meant to be a calling ourselves up moment by moment and it's pretending when we don't live that way.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 1:Mallory, what about you? What would you, what do you wish? Someone would have said to you, or what do?
Speaker 3:you think you would say to someone else in that situation? I think I wish someone would have said or you know, even my advice would be do whatever in your power to get help to work on your marriage. I never valued um, working on marriage. I really literally well, like I didn't see a great example of communication in a marriage, but also, like I mentioned earlier, I think I was just naive, like, yeah, love, if you love each other, it's all going to work out, um, and that's not true.
Speaker 3:Um, I think like, put in the work, um, don't be afraid to invest and work on yourself and your marriage, because you know, just, the biggest thing that I can see is the way our kids have changed. You know it was hard. They were, especially my oldest was having a really, really tough time. You know when our marriage and you know, because we're modeling, we're modeling communication, we're modeling what love could look like for them. They pick up on the tension in the house look like for them, um, they pick up on the tension in the house, um, and now you know they're back to just like playful, happy, go lucky kids, and especially my oldest, like some of the issues, kind of like challenges that popped up for her have just faded away.
Speaker 3:Um, so I think that just and it's really, I guess, what it's really led me to I didn't really understand connection before. I worked Like I'm like what, what does that mean? Um, so, you know, right now, like my deepest desires deep, like deep connection with Kyle and my children and like, without saying yes to this work, I don't even think that I would ever have the gift of deep connection with my family what does it mean to you now?
Speaker 1:you didn't know what it meant when you started. What did what? How would you describe it now?
Speaker 3:I would describe it now, um, as like almost going back to generous listening, like understanding each other, um, you know, validating each other's emotions, just being just holding space for each other, no matter what is going on. Um, and I think, just like learning to let like love and kindness just flow through you. I always that I wasn't really taught that growing up. Um, you know I was. For me, connection was often like being right or acting like you're better than someone and that feels lonely. Um, but when you're able to just like be with each other and even like in disagreements and still like be true, to like that we're all just love and we can all love each other, that's like a connection, like a deep connection that you just can't experience unless you're doing the work.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, so what does the typical fight look like now? Do you still fight?
Speaker 3:yes, we do. They're much quieter, much more in control, um typically shorter. We still have our moments of we still have our moments of getting stuck in our righteousness. But yeah, I mean we, you know there's still been a blowout or two, but that's it. But I mean like since he's gotten sober. I mean this used to be a daily, daily, weekly occurrence. And now it's like yeah, one or two for the past seven or eight months. How would you?
Speaker 1:describe them, Kyle.
Speaker 2:I think now it's like very short bickering and then just like a almost like a walking away, not in a bad way, just to like, all right, drop it, visit it later. Like I think, like we know each other's trigger points, mal still tries to tell me what to do. It won't. It doesn't go, like it's short. Now we're able to like revisit it and like someone can just bring it up the next day or hours later, like what were you really thinking here?
Speaker 1:okay, good, sorry, go ahead. Yeah, sorry, go ahead. Sorry, go ahead, kyle.
Speaker 2:I said, most of the time it's ridiculous. It's like the need to be right still, but we can notice it and just like nip it in the butt yeah.
Speaker 1:So what I hear you saying is you don't really let it escalate anymore. You don't say, okay, pause, whatever let's, let's put a pin in this, and then you come back to it later to work through it, to to understand what was happening, for each other, to hear each other. Is that what you're saying? Yes yeah, powerful, and it's been seven to eight months. I mean that's, that's massive.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we've had two big arguments, but that's it. Yeah, ones we were able to work through.
Speaker 1:Well, it's a lot different when you're looking in the mirror, when you're taking personal responsibility for your part, when you're generously listening.
Speaker 3:It changes the whole context of the whole conversation yeah, just like the energetics, the tension, like the you know six to ten level tension in our house has decreased, and just the overall, like I said, just the overall energy in our house is so different.
Speaker 1:So, but calmer, yes yeah, and the testament of the kids, that's, that's huge, that's results you can't ignore.
Speaker 2:Yeah it's important yeah, all right.
Speaker 1:So we've heard how, what a difference it's making in your day-to-day lives and as you interact together and how you see life, like your view of life has drastically changed. What difference is it? Are these tools of generous listening and, um, personal responsibility and, uh, ownership? What difference is it making in your sex life?
Speaker 3:I knew that was coming, that's you know, that's still a an area of growth, um, but I think, like we well, I'll speak for myself um, I think I have a better understanding and I'm better able to um I don't even know the word like empathize with um, where his, where he's coming from, I guess, um, and I'd say, you know, there are times more times than previous to him getting sober that we actually, like I do, feel connected and a deep connection, whereas, like when he was using it was just kind of like, let's get this over with Cause, it's something that I have to do, because it's something that I have to do. Sometimes I still feel that way, but it's less often yeah.
Speaker 2:What about you, kyle? I mean, I'm still ready to go all day, every day, but no, I mean, like what you said about the emotional connection makes sense for me. Um, I don't feel like I have to be like as pushy or I like expect it as much. Um, I'm more willing to wait. I guess you could say and then I don't want to put, I'm like to the point where I don't want to put Mallory in a position where I want her to be into it. I don't want her to be like a chore.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:More fun that way.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and did that? Did you have that desire in the past, or it just didn't really even you didn't think much about it.
Speaker 2:No, I didn't think a lot about it. I was like, yeah, just a dog, you know.
Speaker 1:Meet my needs yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, needs, that was it. Yeah, I do feel I feel like it's a little better for sure.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, that's the beauty of the work is it keeps getting better. It's it's emotional and physical intimacy. Both begin to evolve and develop and it can change a lot for both of you. So it's powerful. Guys, there's so much in your story and so much yet to come, and I hear both of you continuing in the work and wanting to continue in becoming who you're committed to be. Is there anything you feel that you haven't said that you would, that you would want to share about your story or you think would be helpful for people listening?
Speaker 2:I mean I can say one thing that, like a big like, what I've learned and what I'm still working on is like you can only you can't control life, but you can learn to accept life and deal with life on life's terms, and when I just feel like taking that approach makes things a little easier. You can't control everything makes things a little easier. You can't control everything. You can only control yourself and who you want to be and who. Well, you know what you want your legacy to be.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and it's such a powerful mindset shift because often that trying to control life is what drives us to the suffering, because we're then trying to control our spouse and that doesn't work. But when you accept that all you can control is you and your ability to accept life on life's terms, well then that's a whole different ballgame.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 1:Yeah, anything for you, mallory.
Speaker 3:I would say, just like keeping the mindset that, like you said, this is a lifelong journey. Um, as you know, I have a lot of trouble recognizing progress. Um, up until now, up until now, and except and I'm I'm starting to recognize it more and more um, but just through working with you and breakthrough, that's always like wow, okay, we have come a long way and we still have work to do to get to keep going. I mean just kind of not trying to look at it as a destination, but more as a journey and using everything as a learning experience, not like it wasn't good, it wasn't bad, but what can I learn? What can I learn from or how can I show up differently next time? Um, that's kind of been a big one for me, like who do I want to be when I'm showing up in disagreements?
Speaker 1:Right, yeah, it's a moment by moment growth opportunity, right? We don't look at our babies who are learning to walk and crawl and talk and be like, are you ever going to get this? We're so excited about each accomplishment and each new destination and it's powerful when we can take on that mindset with our emotional, mental development and who we're committed to become, one opportunity at a time. So thank you guys so much for sharing. I just really appreciate your honesty, your vulnerability. I think it's going to be really powerful for those listening. So thank you guys so much for this episode.
Speaker 3:No problem.
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