In our latest episode, we unpack the ins and outs of HVAC business success with the insightful Chris Hunter, a name synonymous with excellence in our field. From secret shopping tactics to the importance of mentorship, Chris leaves no stone unturned in explaining how to thrive in today's competitive HVAC landscape. Don't miss this in-depth conversation that will surely elevate your company's game!
Key Takeaways:
Don’t forget to share your favorite insights from the episode with someone in your network who could benefit. Together, let's keep the knowledge flowing!
Find Chris:
On The Web: https://www.servicetitan.com/
E-mail: chris@gotimesuccessgroup.com
Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hunterhvac/
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/ServiceTitan
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/user/servicetitan
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/servicetitan/
Join Our Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/hvacrevealed
Presented By On Purpose Media: https://www.onpurposemedia.ca/
For HVAC Internet Marketing reach out to us at info@onpurposemedia.ca or 888-428-0662
Sponsored By:
Chiirp: https://chiirp.com/hssr
Elite Call: https://elitecall.net
On Purpose Media: https://onpurposemedia.ca
In our latest episode, we unpack the ins and outs of HVAC business success with the insightful Chris Hunter, a name synonymous with excellence in our field. From secret shopping tactics to the importance of mentorship, Chris leaves no stone unturned in explaining how to thrive in today's competitive HVAC landscape. Don't miss this in-depth conversation that will surely elevate your company's game!
Key Takeaways:
Don’t forget to share your favorite insights from the episode with someone in your network who could benefit. Together, let's keep the knowledge flowing!
Find Chris:
On The Web: https://www.servicetitan.com/
E-mail: chris@gotimesuccessgroup.com
Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hunterhvac/
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/ServiceTitan
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/user/servicetitan
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/servicetitan/
Join Our Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/hvacrevealed
Presented By On Purpose Media: https://www.onpurposemedia.ca/
For HVAC Internet Marketing reach out to us at info@onpurposemedia.ca or 888-428-0662
Sponsored By:
Chiirp: https://chiirp.com/hssr
Elite Call: https://elitecall.net
On Purpose Media: https://onpurposemedia.ca
You go to start a business and then all of a sudden, the more your business grows, the less and less and less you actually get to do any of that stuff that you really love doing. And it's why you started the business.
Thaddeus Tondu:Hey, welcome back to another episode of HVAC Success Secrets Revealed with Thaddeus and Evan and you probably saw in that image that it is no Evan. It is just me rocking her solo today. Evan is down in New Orleans or New Orleans, depending on how you like to say it. He is at the ServiceTitan Marketing for the Trade Summit giving a message, I believe tomorrow on the future state of SEO. So excited to see his recording from that a little bit later. Maybe we'll spin it and put it up on our podcast networks for those to see. But today we have on no stranger to the world, Chris Hunter from few different roles he's had in the past. He's currently a director of customer relations at ServiceTitan. He's also the co owner of Go Time Success Group, but he also started Hunter Heating and Air in 2006, which is now called Hunter Super Techs. Probably heard of it. They've got five locations. He exited that business in 2018 and really diving into the Go Time Success Group and the director of relations customer relations at ServiceTitan thing that I like about what it, what he was talking to me about before is they take, he basically Taking a customer and planting them into the platform and he's basically an owner that's helping other owners. But one of the fascinating things is he gets to see the data, study the data, to see what the best of the best are doing in order to be able to replicate success in their business. I am excited to dive into that topic. There was another topic that I was going to pull up, but I closed the wrong window. So now I don't have it in front of me because, Hey, you know what, when you're running solo, sometimes shit happens, but going to be a fascinating episode, a couple of the topics. Selling a business in what it's like on the other side and the emotional raw impact of that. I'm going to look forward to that conversation. I think a lot of people are going to hear that. A couple other highlights of things that we hopefully get time to get towards and get to key strategies and optimizing operational excellence, profitability, custom relations, recruitment and retention strategies for contractors navigate the skilled labor shortage, but he also ran his business in 2009. So. Through 2009. So we know what happened there. We know what's happening in 2024. So it's going to be a good topic, but today's show would not be possible without these guys on the top of the screen, a lead called Chiirp and On Purpose Media. Let's go ahead and start with Chiirp. So you want to transform your home service business with Chiirp, the ultimate automation toolbox, capture more leads, connect and skyrocket your sales. Chiirp integrates seamlessly with platforms like ServiceTitan, Housecall Pro, offering automated text, emails, and even the ringless voicemails. You want to boost your Google reviews and customer loyalty with our proven rehash program. If you schedule your demo with them today, you can get 25 percent off your first three months at chiirp.com/hssr the other company, Elite Call not really the other company. Jack is phenomenal individual had a call with him actually just before the podcast. So Elite Call have you ever thought about outbanding your databases to fill your dispatch boards with lucrative savers and sales appointments and boosting memberships too enter in Elite Call. They are a U. S. based call center that does just that. For over 20 years, their dedicated teams don't just make calls. Calls, they directly integrate appointments into your CRM and fill your dispatch board. Don't let your competition get ahead. Let Elite Call connect with your customers first. Visit them at elitecall.net today. And last but certainly not least, us, On Purpose Media. We are Your ability to enhance our online presence with On Purpose Media, your go to home service marketing experts for everything web design, SEO, and PPC. And we got stunning user friendly websites. We've got increased visibility on your search traffic and we've got targeted traffic through effective pay per click ads. Let's turn your online presence into a lead generating powerhouse. Visit onpurposemedia.ca today to start your digital transformation and watch your home service company thrive. Without further ado, we'll be back on the other side.
INTRO:Welcome to HVAC Success Secrets Revealed, a show where we interview industry leaders and disruptors, revealing the success secrets to create and unleash the ultimate HVAC business. Now your hosts, Thaddeus and Evan.
Thaddeus Tondu:Hello. Welcome on the other side of the world in AKA our Streamyard space. So that was a lovely intro. You know what? It's a little bit more difficult doing that by yourself.
Chris Hunter:I'm impressed, man. My gosh, you nailed that thing. Yeah. I was out of breath just watching you.
Thaddeus Tondu:Welcome to the show. Thank you for taking some time out of your busy day to sit and chat with us and spread some knowledge to the listeners of HVAC Success Secrets Revealed. So I always like to start off with the easy layup question. Walk us through your start into the industry and your journey.
Chris Hunter:Okay. Yeah. Wow. So it's probably like a lot of people completely by accident. I had no intention of doing HVAC at all. In fact, that was my senior year in high school and I thought, I just want an easy half a day. So I'm going to take this HVAC class and get to go to the Bowtech and spend half a day away and then I'd come back and play baseball and take one other class and I did that and I thought, okay, it's pretty cool. Never thought I'd use it. Fast forward several years later, I'm actually working at a job for AT& T and they were going to lay off 10, 000 people and I was one of them. So luckily there was this guy that was going to retire that did HVAC and they said, man, if you can pass this test, you could save your job. You can have this role. Lo and behold, thank God I remembered a few things. So I went and I took the test, passed somehow. I don't even remember how now and the next day they said, all right, you're hired or you get to keep your job. Here's a credit card and a truck. You take care of all the commercial systems in Southeastern Oklahoma. remember this is how out of practice I was. I remember having to call the guy before and like, which one is the blue hose hooked to? And which one is the red hose hooked to? And he had to school me on that and then after that, I become a study man. I was a student of the game. I read and consumed everything I could learn how to be the best tech that I could and then fast forward into starting a business. I did the same thing there. I didn't know a thing about it, but I went and I learned from all the best that I could and I had a lot of really great mentors and tried to consume everything I could and then took.
Thaddeus Tondu:So and it's funny because sometimes when people do get into running their own business they had no desire to do it in the first place. They just stumbled upon it or stumbled upon a particular niche or an industry and started working on it. Now, here they are and they just love everything that they do. But if you wanted to to back up to that, okay, you didn't know a single thing. I think this is pretty common and by the way, there's nothing wrong with this at all and so I'm going to, I'm just going to make sure that when I say this, I'm not calling anybody out. A lot of times we start business, we don't have a fucking clue what we're doing, right? Like there's, we're like, I'm going to start a business. You're like, I, and then you move into the first steps and you just figure shit out. In going back to that though, if you're to go back in time, Shit almost 18 years and start your business all over again with the knowledge that, now, what are two things that you would have done differently when you first started?
Chris Hunter:Wow. Yeah. So let me, before we even get to that part I would have done different. Think about this. Think about most people that come through the trades through as being a technician. You love what you do. You're really good at fixing a problem. You're great with maybe sales and the customer aspect of it. I love that part of it. I love getting in the truck, going out, meeting new people, doing things like that, serving well and then you go to start a business and then all of a sudden, the more your business grows, the less and less you actually get to do any of that stuff that you really love doing and it's why you started the business. Now you're doing things like trying to figure out marketing and pay per click and insurance stuff and, payroll, my God, and taxes. All this stuff that you have no idea really about that you have to start to learn. It was like learning a whole new career. So for me, if I was to go back and do something totally different right off the bat it would be exactly what I did a few years into it. I would have started day one by going and finding the best mentors that I could. Learning what they did that made them successful and try not to reinvent the wheel. I would have just replicated that and right now it's obviously integrating the right software getting the right people on your team and getting a headstart like that. But that's what I would do.
Thaddeus Tondu:Llike mentors are great and having that conversation or even just masterminds for that matter. Like I got added to one in WhatsApp yesterday with a bunch of other agency owners and other it, not necessarily agent, just business owners and some of them have eight figure brands and some have seven bigger marketing companies. Even like the conversations that are already happening within 24 hours of phenomenon, because you can help learn you can teach something and you can learn something from others. If somebody were to be like, okay I need to find a mentor. what questions do I ask? How do I find one? How do I find the ones right for me? What direction would you point them in?
Chris Hunter:Oh, it's easy just go on Facebook. There's all kinds of great mentors out there that'll promise the world to you, right? It's that simple, isn't it? I don't know.
Thaddeus Tondu:Do we get into that conversation? I don't think we'll, yeah, we got to, maybe we should stay away from the word gurus and influencers.
Chris Hunter:Yeah, It's fun out there, right? But my biggest advice for finding a mentor and it doesn't, and a lot of people are like, Hey, if they weren't in the business, if they haven't accomplished this they can't be a mentor. I would disagree with that. I think you need a team of mentors the saying is you're the average of the five people that you spend the most time with. I believe this is the same for your mentorship. You can be the average of the five people you're learning the most from and so for me, I would definitely look for someone with character, somebody that had the right values in the whole core value system that align with mine, because if not everything you learn and try to implement could easily come crashing down on you. it's not built with a steady foundation, but, and then two, I would definitely go find those that have already been exactly where I wanted to be. Why not? The fastest way to get from point A to B, it's a straight line. So why in the world would I want to try to figure this thing out by going sideways and forward and backwards, two steps. And why not go to already point B right there and say, Hey, all right, what do I need to do to get right here? So I figure a big part of that is that and then the last part is what you said. It's maybe someone not even in the industry. This is why me personally, I joined the John Maxwell organization. It was all about leadership. I wanted to figure out, man, need to learn to lead people. This is a people business. How do I do that better? How do I communicate better to them? How do I figure out how to attract them and grow them and keep them here? So it was some, I had to go. to that organization started learning from them and they knew nothing about HVAC. That was okay. I think you gotta choose several. Like I said the other thing is, I think you don't want to go, while several, a small circle is good, if you try to listen and follow the advice of many you're just going to confuse yourself. That's why I think if you start with the value system, find people that have been exactly where you are or where you want to go and then third is the, whatever you're missing as far as the leadership, maybe it's another mastermind that's a specific area of marketing or growth or finances, whatever it is try to put that in your mentorship small circle.
Thaddeus Tondu:Success leaves clues, right? And that's the biggest thing and business is business almost across any other industry. A lot of the similarities and yeah, there's different nuances industry, but a lot of it's the same. The thing that I liked is be careful of the advice of many. You want to be careful of groupthink. Because groupthink can paralyze somebody. You get too many opinions and too many hands in the pot. Now you don't know what to do or if you have a few, or even one person that's really good at this area, one person that's really good at this area, another person that's good at this area, but not being scared to ask them the questions is the key impactful piece.
Chris Hunter:That's a great answer. Great point. In fact, I was guilty of doing this to my team without even realizing it. So I wanted the best for them. I would bring in all kinds of trainers, and we were part of a best practice organization, Service Nation Alliance, and it was phenomenal at the time and you could pick several different trainers, that you wanted to learn from. I thought the more the better. But then I realized, Oh my gosh, I'm just confusing the heck out of my technicians. One week I'm training them how to do this system. The next week it's doing this system. What we really needed to do was, yeah, we needed to learn from a few, but establish our system and then hold them accountable and keep training on that system as well and it definitely just confuses your whole team.
Thaddeus Tondu:Right? But good point to bring up and, it's one that I never really, thought, you can overtrain, right? And that's a caution, right? But you also mentioned develop your own system, right? Taking what works for, from somebody and leaving the rest aside, right? Taking from somebody that, out there doing great things and you might not like all of it, but you can take a couple of things you can learn from that and you can put that into your business. What are in looking at that, I want to go a little bit deeper on this training topic in this overtraining aspect of things and I think it almost blends into what I mentioned earlier about recruitment and retention strategies for skilled labor and making sure that you're doing training the right way. What are some common, one of them obviously overtraining, right? What are some other common pitfalls that people are making when it comes to training?
Chris Hunter:Yeah and so I'm a partner in Go Time Success Group. So I've got the kind of the bird's eye view of seeing phenomenal trainers and they get people in the class and I hear the feedback and try to measure and see what they're doing, how the students are taking it and when we say over trained, I don't think you can over train, but what I mean is pull in too many different voices of training, instead of finding one system and continuing to train and improve on it. For example, we have different classes down at Go Time most of them are based on a technical ability. So we're teaching something technical, not just a sales ability, because we believe that, if you can, I know as a technician, if I can fix something, or if I have the confidence in my technical ability that confidence brews over into my sales side, right? So at GoTime, we teach the technical side. We teach the customer side where we're teaching how to relate to the customer and then obviously the sales side. But what happens is we see technicians comfort advisors come in that have went to numerous other trainings and then they get confused. They're like, Hey, am I supposed to do so and so says to do it this way. You guys are teaching this way, or another group taught this way. What's right? And essentially they're all right. It's just a matter of which one fits the best for what you're trying to accomplish at that in that system or in that company, and implementing it, and just keep making it better. So that, that's one big pitfall that we see is just too many voices tend to confuse a team and the next one is not being consistent with it and I think we're all guilty of this where we'll send people to a training and then think, okay, yep, check box. They're trained. They're awesome. They're good. Here's how the light went on for me, how I realized, oh, there's more to this. I was a partner in Go Time, I actually hired the lead instructor to come up to my shop and he trained all of our technicians and it was on static pressure and airflow diagnostic. Phenomenal class, right? And we went through that thing and it was really awesome and then after I thought, okay. But a week or two after, let's see how well everyone really Or are they still doing it? So I had them start sending me videos of them actually doing these tests and lo and behold, almost all of them did really well, but there were a few that. lost. So if I wouldn't that by following up and some coaching? Do they ne I would have just checked they're trained. We're go how to check that pressure No problem. That wasn't n for all. You know there's, I say all the time, what gets measured and recognized gets repeated and improved. So you cannot forget the measure and the recognized part of it, or it won't get repeated or improved.
Thaddeus Tondu:And
Chris Hunter:sometimes
Thaddeus Tondu:it's just as it's literally that simple, right? Hey, did this stick with you? Or giving a spot test, and having those questions and having ongoing dialogue and asking, being transparent enough to be able to ask your team, Hey, did this make sense to you? Do you have any questions? And following up, doing ride alongs as well after to hold on that accountability piece for the training. Yeah in terms of utilizing training for retention techniques now, obviously on the job training and making sure that they have all the tools necessary to be able to complete what they need to complete. That's any business should have that in there. But when it comes to retention techniques with inside of a business, what are some ways that people can leverage perhaps some alternative or different types of trainings versus just the technical the customer facing and the sales types trainings? Are there other things that you've seen to be able to master retention?
Chris Hunter:Yeah. If you think about why does a, why does somebody stay at a company, right? And there's really three big areas and I'm a huge fan of the Gallup organization and, I look at all their research as far as, why are people staying at jobs? Why are they not? There's a scary stat out there right now that says 51 percent of the workforce is actively looking and if I don't scare the pants off of you, I don't know what will, because my goodness, it's hard enough to get them in here. So we have to develop some time to or learn what's going to keep them here and how do we help them? And number one is they want to work for a better boss. They want a good leader at their company. So this is why if you're a company owner, manager, owner, even an aspiring manager, you should be trying to sharpen your leadership ability. You got to invest in yourself for this part, because ultimately it's going to come down to do they like who they work for? Because if they don't, they're going to be out of here. The next one is where the training comes in. I think If an employee is not being developed or they're not think they are provided with the tools to help them grow their income, their family, their career path, they're going to find someone else that will or find another place that will ServiceTitan recently did a a residential contractor report and it asked the question, Hey, Do you plan to raise any of your technician salaries over the next year? And it was crazy. In fact, let me see if I can find the exact number. I think it was 20 let's see here. 20, yeah, 23 percent of all those surveyed. There was a thousand contractors surveyed. 23 percent of them were not going to do any improvements in pay for the next year. So there's a quarter already. They're checking out. 20 percent after that was only going to do like a 1 percent increase. So you're not the pay is table stakes. You got it. You got to invest and pay them what they're worth, but to the training part of it and helping them grow, if you're doing a performance type pay, which I highly recommend that you do. The more you invest into them with training, the better they feel about it. The more confidence they have and guess what? The more money they make and you didn't just have to keep upping the ante on them. You help them grow and achieve what they want. the other part of the whole performance aspect there is I'm a huge believer in figuring out what do people want to actually accomplish? What's their goals? What's their bucket list? And have a process to identify this and once you get it, at Hunter, we had it up on the wall. We had everybody's work goals, personal goals, and their bucket list and guess what? Me as the leader, I spent a lot of time looking over all of those things and anytime that I could help connect the dots between what they wanted and back to our work or our company mission, that's where the gold happened cause then I could say, Hey man, if we can send you this training, we can help improve your airflow skills. You're going to end up selling more. You can hit that this revenue or this income goal you want. You can put that money down on your house. You want, let's set a goal. Let's make this thing happen in six months. And bam, now we're working together they're growing and then the last thing is I think they want to work at a company. All the data shows that actually means something, right? Are you working for someone that's just, all they're concerned about is the numbers are you working for somebody that wants to genuinely, give back to the community and grow the company and grow the employees and make it a better place, to work at. So that's my take on why they want to be there. What's going to keep them there. Those three things. We got a better boss. Personal growth and you got to work for a company with a bigger vision or someone that means something.
Thaddeus Tondu:Oh, it's a higher why, that end part, right? It's when you're bigger than something that's part of yourselves, you feel validated and you feel like it's worthwhile to keep pursuing what you're doing. But I like the middle piece about the it's actually a dream board. When you walk through with your employees and your team members to be able to find out, okay, what actually lights you up in your personal life? How can I help you fulfill and help I get you those things in your personal life? And I think somebody that's really mastered is Tommy Mello in terms of what he does in his organization and how he takes care of his people and what he pays them. Now, some people are like I can't afford to pay them. Because your pricing is shit and you should probably look at revising your pricing to be able to take a look at that. But the biggest one is yourself and taking that look in that mirror at a certain point in an organization's journey. Now it becomes about, Developing leaders, leading leaders inside of an organization and I think that's a really tough thing for a lot of people to be able to do. If you were to make a trans, cause you've made the transition from, leading yourself and your business to leading others, to leading leaders. What is the biggest challenge in growing that leadership base to get the buy in to match your vision for your business?
Chris Hunter:Yeah, so the biggest challenge, one even making the transition is generally, if you've got to that position of success, you have a lot of talent yourself, right? So you're pretty good at doing specific things. Learning to step back, let others think and figure things out. Even if or you think you know what the answer is, empowering them to actually think do critical thinking to solve problems and come up with ideas and then empowering them to actually act on it and before you know it you've got this culture of Hey they're willing to think for themselves, grow and take action without you having to approve every little thing or come up with every answer. That's the most freeing to me. When a company leader can actually do that that's when they get set free for sure. So the other part is, the. you go and look and you've visited with thousands of business owners at this point, and you can see there's something noticeably different about those shops that have great leadership and all it is, John Maxwell says, all it is influence. It's nothing more. It's nothing less, but to influence people, they got to respect you and they got, you got to empower them to, to act and do what you hired them to do, but you can't do this if you don't have a great onboarding process to figure out, Hey, are we bringing in the right people? Have we got the right value system in line, all these skills that we can teach, but are we bringing in the right people? Then let's train them. Then let's release them.
Thaddeus Tondu:It's funny that you mentioned, I'm listening to a book right now on audible and I'm going to pull up the name. So I have it correct. Never lose an employee, a great book and they talk and literally just finished the first part about the onboarding process and how you, now they're talking to interviews and they're going to probably go into deeper onboarding, but. When you have that continuity, when you actually train them, you actually give them the information and look, we've seen this in our organization where we're like, okay, onboarding call is done. It was three hours. Bye. Have good luck. Right now it's shit, now we've developed a more meticulous onboarding program where we're giving them a lot more tools and now you should see them have the ability to have that success, right? But the one word that I liked that you said is empowering. Not delegating, empowering. I mean, Delegating is part of it, but when you empower your team to be able to make decisions, that's where that really, that key thing becomes in and it's a very tough thing, myself included, to let go of control, to be able to allow them to make a decision and be able to let them go forward with that decision and allow a mistake to potentially happen with the decision that they made, even though you might be able to already see the mistake that might be happening, right? That mindset is tough to overcome. How would you explain that to somebody in a way that they can be like, okay, I see this, but I still just can't let go of that. What would you tell?
Chris Hunter:It's simple. You can have growth or you can have control, but you can't have both. You know what I mean? So if you want to, if you want to grow, you're gonna have to relinquish the reins in the control of this situation and you talked about, you said you can maybe sometimes see some mistakes or a failure. I'm a fan of failure. Let them fail. If they're trying and they fail, I will support them 100 percent all day long. It's when you rush in and you rescue them every single time, they're going to start to rely on that. But if they fail and they come back to you, like, all right, good swing, buddy. So let's figure out what we got to do now to keep going forward and then they can, critically think to learn to solve problems and overcome that, man, it's going to make them that much stronger. They're never going to make that mistake again. I promise you that and it'll just keep going. It'll get stronger, but if you don't let them build that that fortitude that, that resilience man, you it's going to be a tough road, same way with raising kids, right? You got to let them. You gotta let them fail a little bit every once in a while to, to figure out how to overcome that and come back swinging again.
Thaddeus Tondu:I have a one year old and a three year old, both boys and we tell the three year old all the time, is that a safe decision? No. I'm like, should you do it? Yeah. I'm like, okay, but doing dangerous things safely. Right. I want to jump into the data that you see in the success thing, leaving clues and also talking about what book consumers sent to me in 2024, what you went through in 2009. From that, but first the random question generator, one of the favorite parts of my show of the show, my show, it is my show. Evan's not here. Evan's not here. It is my show. The routing question January is brought to you by On Purpose Media where we turn clicks in the clients faster than you can say conversion optimization three times fast. Try to say that three times fast, like a tongue twister. So I tell you, I ask you if you want question one, two, or three, you don't get to actually know what it is. Until you say question one, two or three, I'll read it out and it has absolutely, I've, I'm reading them right now and they are I really hope you choose the one specific number on this. Cause I think it's a hilarious question. So which question do you want me to read out? One, two,
Chris Hunter:I'm ready, man. I'm thinking if you ain't first, you're last. So number one, let's go with it.
Thaddeus Tondu:What about what Scott's saying? Number two.
Chris Hunter:I like a good number two. That's hard to, hard not to do that, but yeah, I'm going to go number one.
Thaddeus Tondu:Oh, number one. All right. So sorry, Scott. Oh, this question.
Chris Hunter:Oh boy. Maybe I shoulda had number two. Maybe I shoulda went three. I dunno, but
Thaddeus Tondu:No. Jesus, would you rather fight one horse sized duck or 100 duck sized horses? And why?
Chris Hunter:One
Thaddeus Tondu:horse size
Chris Hunter:duck. That's a big duck. Or what? Or what else? What was the other one?
Thaddeus Tondu:Geez or a hundred duck sized horses.
Chris Hunter:I'm probably getting whipped either which way. So I guess I'm just going with the one so I can make it fast and I'll get a hundred trampolines along the way. So yeah definitely one horse sized duck.
Thaddeus Tondu:It was probably one of the most outrageous questions we've asked on our show and I think it's absolutely hilarious.
Chris Hunter:That's the first time I've ever been asked that. I've never even thought about that before. So yeah, good random question.
Thaddeus Tondu:I didn't even come up with the questions. That's the best part and so for Scott, in case you're wondering, he's probably wondering, okay what is question number two? It's what's the biggest risk that you've taken? So we'll ask that one just for Scott's sake.
Chris Hunter:Yeah. That one is it's a common one anyone that's ever went into business, it's a huge risk. In fact I had a very steady job, I was making at the time, it was a very nice salary, very predictable, and we live very comfortably on that and I remember going to my wife saying, Hey, I think I'm gonna start a new, I'm going to start this company up. Here's the thing. I don't know if we can make, I don't know. So I, and she trusted me enough to let us run with that and it was rough that first year I paid myself 25, 000 and it was a big cut, but the risk paid off in the long run. Yeah, definitely the biggest risk going into business.
Thaddeus Tondu:Oh, it's a massive risk. No, I think back to going into business for myself, too big risk. When I did it and glad that I did because I yeah it's always something that's risky and actually I was texting a friend and he's thanks for the mentorship. I went out and I finally, he's I just, I decided to quit my job. I don't know if he's actually quit his job or not, but he might still be doing it, but he's I just, I finally, I stopped getting lost in analysis paralysis and I got my first client for what he's trying to build for his business and it's in, those are those things when you just stop waiting until perfect, cause perfect will never come. Yep. So one topic and I'm going to squirrel a little bit from what I wanted to get into and like the data and consumer sentimism. But you had mentioned earlier that the journey of selling the business, growing and then selling the business and the emotional ride that went into that when you sold. I think a lot of people don't understand the mental anguish that happens at either A time of sale, B during the sale or C when it finally closes and you're done.
Chris Hunter:Oh yeah. All of them.
Thaddeus Tondu:Let's
Chris Hunter:talk about them
Thaddeus Tondu:because I think that's something that often gets overlooked.
Chris Hunter:Yeah. So the first part of it I was lucky enough to have several mentors that had built and sold businesses and they were wise enough to tell me, Hey, here's the level you need to get at before you can even entertain it and I got to see why that was even something I wanted to do. I was looking at, I was working very hard and we live comfortably, right? But I was looking at some of these other people in the industry, like Ken Goodrich and Ben Stark and several of these other people that I really looked up to that, man, they had some uncommon wealth, that, that wasn't very common at the time, especially if you're pre 2018 when this mass exodus, had not begun yet. Learning from them, I saw, wow, this is a shot to do something really special and, create kind of a generational wealth and I learned about selling the business multiple times through a private equity sponsored deal and how that worked before I had no clue, I thought you sold a business, you walked and that was it. No, now you can sell. You can help the private equity group keep growing. They sell it again. It could happen again. Numerous different times, and then what that can mean for your other team members. So the decision to sell is very hard and then the next part of it is you get up to the finish line and now you're committed to the sale. You've went through due diligence. You're almost to the point of just Just get this thing done, and so many deals fall apart and that, and it is so hard on business owners. In fact, one time I had a couple of deals fall apart before we actually did it and I just remember thinking. Oh my gosh. What in the world is, do I even want to attempt this again? Is it worth it? Cause that due diligence is tough and all the time you got to keep your company running very strong because they're looking at the trail in 12 months, and if you slip then deals off, sorry we're not going to end up doing this thing until you show us you can improve back. So getting to the finish line is a big deal and then there's this after you close this sense of, oh my, wow. I did it. This is awesome and then quickly followed up the next day when you woke up okay. Nothing's really any, any different. Yeah. Your bank account may look a little different, but nothing really changed. So there's this rollercoaster of excitement and then all of a sudden now what? And then for a lot of people they're staying on with the business. So now think about what they've just done. They've just sold a company. Yeah. They got the financial security the safety net back there. Now, if they're invested in keep growing the company and they're still got a lot of energy, this is great. Now they can take more risks. They got more capital. Yeah. The private equity sponsorship or whatever can help help them grow to do even more. But if they weren't really in it for the long haul like that, now they've just got themself a job, now they got, I remember the first real realization that, Oh, I remember my new employment contract for staying on at Hunter, and it said something about my two week vacation. And I was like, Oh man, I've been taking, six vacations a year with my family at different times all while I run the business remotely, so it wasn't that big deal but it was like, wow, now you've got someone to answer to. So it's a little bit different of a role regardless of what they say and it's not bad. It's just different. Someone needs to be prepared if they're going to stay on their company be prepared, you've got a job now and you still have to perform. It's not all. Go live your dream life type of thing and that's what I was signed up to do. I really, I was going to stay on with Hunter and keep growing the company. and I would still be there today. God had a little bit different plans for me though. and I had I got wiped out, man. I got this major illness, took me out a whole year in 2019. And when it took me out, my team did a really great job of stepping up and they ran the company and I consulted with the private equity group and I'm like, look. I'm bad. I don't even know if I'm gonna make it out of this thing. I think you need to go hire a new GM to come in and run this Oklahoma and Texas area and they did thank God, fast forward several months after I got healed up, I was back. Okay and then once then though, I looked, I'm like, I'd be doing a disservice if I went back in now after they've rung new people in, people have stepped up, they're doing fine. So it released me, so I got to be released, which that was a whole other feeling like, okay, I had my whole identity in this business. Essentially whether I want to claim that or not, that's essentially the truth. Me and my wife, my family, we were all in it in this small town and everywhere we went, people knew us as, the Hunter's from, the heat and air place and that was gone. So then what, then what do you do? You can go and do your hobbies and such, but I think there's still part of us that wants to create and cultivate and grow that whole part of it. So if anybody sells a business and is planning to actually exit. I highly recommend keeping your options open or be thinking about what's next, because if you don't you're gonna, you're gonna find yourself lost and then what do I do? Type of thing and then Ron Smith God rest his soul, phenomenal mentor wrote the book HVAC Spells Wealth, which was a big help to me, but I saw him one time and he's Chris, After you sell a company, you're probably going to have to move. I'm like, move? Why? And he said Chris, when I sold Modern Air down in Florida, he said, everywhere I went, people still said either, Ron, boy, it's sure not like it used to be, or they were still wanting me to come and do stuff for them. He said, I couldn't go to Walmart. I couldn't go anywhere and he said, it just, it was too much. It was like a continually dragging you back in mentally into this realm of something you can't control anymore. So he said he relocated. So me and my family did. We relocated to Texas and we also have a place in Florida now. But and that was honestly a pretty good decision. I love the town that I was at. There's a lot of people, I think, even watching on this thing from that area, but beautiful place. But I tell you, anytime I go back, I still get those questions like, man, it's not the same or can you believe they do this now or this, or, it's just, It never ends. So a business owner really has to be prepared for that to happen in their mind, or otherwise they're going to, they're going to find themselves just in a state of always turmoil and and even though you may have the money in the bank if you're not settled mentally and it's just not great. That type of deal.
Thaddeus Tondu:There's
Chris Hunter:a lot
Thaddeus Tondu:to unpack from that. That's I'm like, do I want to go back to the very beginning? And Hey, the question is like, how do you know when to sell? That's one thing, and, but then also these other factors that I think really relate into that question, because I wrote that down when you first started talking, like, how do you know when to sell, but now you've got to factor in all these other things on that. I think one thing that wasn't in there is what Scott said. Man, for me to be employees, I would fear that they may not be taken care of and that's also a good realization too, to say, okay when I sell, what's going to happen to my team? Are there going to be layoffs? Are they going to shift into that? And you're like, depending on who you're selling to. That might happen. You go to private equity and you, let's say you have a CFO inside your business. If you sell a private equity, guess what? They probably already have a CFO. Probably don't need your CFO. So that person might be able to work, right? And so it's those extra things about your people that sometimes people don't necessarily think about.
Chris Hunter:Here's the thing with the people. This is where you have a lot of control before you sign any deal. So for me, my team was, So important to me. I wanted to make sure, hey, is this going to be good for them? So number one, we looked at all what we were able to give them versus once we partnered with the private equity, their insurance costs halved, automatically there was a huge win. There was more room for expansion. Sure enough and gross, sure enough. Several people have even left my company, went to work for the parent company and training roles and other things out there and then the last part of it was financial. So for me, I negotiated in, I actually gave part of the sum of money that I got, a pretty significant sum. key people in the business and then I negotiated for another eight people to have equity in the new company going forward. So now no longer was it just me going to financially benefit from this thing. There was 12 other people with an invested stake in ownership, stake in seeing it happen and what happened was two years later, That private equity group resold again. And those four people that I gifted that to they become a millionaire out of that deal and for me, that was more beneficial and seeing them and then the others, they got a pretty significant return on investment as well or, return on their shares as well and for me, that was worth more than any extra money that I ever got. You know what I mean? It's just seeing that and seeing that happen and then after that, though, this really goes back to the leadership level and trust in your team. You've empowered them. You've trained them. Hopefully you've given them the right systems and then releasing them to go be who they can be. You got to turn them loose, let them go. and then it's exciting watching them and seeing their wins and their struggle. Even though it is hard, not one, not being back in there with them, which I would days I would love to, then there's other times that I'm like, man, I love my life right now. My goodness, there's no way, no how I want back in that world. It's pretty satisfying to seeing that but. The key to that whole thing was your employees negotiate what's gonna happen with these employees before you ever sign a deal. And you can take care of them if you want to.
Thaddeus Tondu:Yep. And the key thing, right? And that's the biggest part and there's many different ways that you can negotiate that in it's a, and the key word is negotiate on it, especially if you've built a business that is acquirable and people want to buy. Now you have power in the negotiations, which is key. Let's shift into the data that you guys with ServiceTitan, what you do and the director of customer experience. I think I got that title, right? I'm hoping almost a director of customer relations. There we go. I had to flip over to my other side. That's not it.
Chris Hunter:No,
Thaddeus Tondu:they should
Chris Hunter:update you. So I did that for two years now I am a principal industry advisor, me and Angie Snow yeah. So think about what ServiceTitan did. They did something pretty dang unique. They realized they have tons of super smart people that are excellent at building software and growth and all this stuff and then they thought, wow, we need to learn how to really connect with the customer. We got to figure out contractor speak. So they hired Tom Howard to come in and be the VP of customer experience and then Tom said, Hey, we need some internal voice of the customers that can be involved with marketing and product and add events and studying the data and then telling our team, Hey, what are we building? Is this working? Is it not? Do people really want or need this? So he brought a few of us business owners in. That like me and Angie, we'd sold the company and we're still looking to stay a worthy cause of giving back and learning and still creating and cultivating, as I said before. So it's a perfect role for me. get to come in, I get to study the best of the best, all the best contractors out there. I get to help the ServiceTitan team build stuff that helps them even faster. All the while, I don't have any stress of the customer side of it that that a lot of business owners have, but so it is a really great role that I get to do and hats off to Service Titan for realizing that and bringing in people like us to help them.
Thaddeus Tondu:And the other part is it's plugging in a business owner who's been there, done that in a sense in knowing what you need to do to move the needle or not and look ServiceTitan is one of the most robust systems out there and it can get really confusing. Really quickly, if you're not sure what to do inside of it, and look, any CRM is that way. I'm not painting a the blanket seam at surfside and essentially, no, it's any CRM system, any field service management system can be that way and having somebody that, that knows what levers to pull with inside of it is super smart. So in terms of the data that you get to see in analyzing some of those sorts of things and I believe the warning that that you use to get a study of the data and see what the best of the best are doing and I think really important in 2024 as well with what's coming up. What are some of the things that you're seeing the best of the best doing that others just simply aren't, or just not quite there yet?
Chris Hunter:Yeah.
Thaddeus Tondu:So this
Chris Hunter:is a great topic because let's face it, it's been a tough tough several months span for a lot of contractors. Yet there's a certain group that are still absolutely killing it and the pressure is on for those that aren't and if they've sold a business and, and a lot of people that sold after 2018 and through the COVID area where 26 percent growth rate was the industry average. A lot of people came to expect that. They thought that was, let's keep building on that. Now things have came back to reality, came back to normal and I can remember before that where if a company was growing year over year by about 10%, that was a pretty healthy growth year and companies were happy with that, that we got a little spooled through that, that one splurge there. But so I've got a list I've been trying to figure out and study, Hey, what are these companies that are still growing heavily in the last few months versus these that aren't what's the difference and, as much as we'd like to say it's a specific thing, or they've bought this product or this product, it really comes down to the fundamentals and it starts with the leadership almost all of them have really great leaders that care about their team and they've invested in this, but it's really the execution that sets them apart. So I've looked and the companies that are very, that have planned. They went through a planning exercise. They know to the day how many calls we need to generate today, what the revenue needs to be how many technicians that's going to take to hit that. So the great companies have all started with a planning process. The ones that I've been studying that they That's what they've got. They knew what they wanted to hit. They were very specific and then two, they're executing on just the fundamentals. For example, the other day I had a contractor come to my house. I bought a house in Florida and when you buy a house, it comes with a home warranty and I knew this system was a little bit low. This is an example of, The lacking of the execution. Okay. So I knew it was a little bit low on refrigerant cause I still have gauges. I still remember how to check one, but I don't have any other tools. It didn't have any refrigerant. I'm not a, a contractor in Florida. So I called the warranty company. I'm like, okay, yeah send someone out they send a pretty large contractor out, this one's in about three States. Got great notifications when they're coming, all the scheduling thing was really good, but then when it got time, when they came to the house, the technician walks up and I tell him what's going on and first thing he's man, you got three units, but you only bought a you only put in one work order. So I can only check one. I'm like I'll pay you to look at the other two while you're here. No, I can't do it. So right away, the customer experience, he was like, can't do it. I can only look at this one. It's okay, look at this one. So he looked at that one and right away goes, ah, I think I see what the problem is before he even got to it and not, I'm not letting him know that I may know a thing or two about it, and he's looks like a little oil on the Schrader or on the cap here, probably where your leak is. I'm like, oh yeah. So then he said how low is it? So he puts his gauges on and anyone that knows anything about refrigerant knows that you have to check the temperature to get the superheat, the sub cooling diagnose the system, not just took some gauges on and go, yep, it's low. So he puts his gauges on. He's yeah, it's probably a little bit low. But here's the thing, the home warranty company, they won't cover any refrigerant. Okay you know it's low, but you haven't really checked anything else, I said how about I just look at a replacement? And he said well, okay. So he runs the truck, comes back, throws me out a price for a 14 sear bottom of the, the entry level system right there for one system and I've got three that are all 20 years old, right? One system and I'm like I'm looking for something a little more efficient, how about something better? Can't do it. No, can't do it. All we get is just this one thing. The other ones cause too many issues. So I can't give you one for anything other than this one. I was like, okay and that was it. The call was done. So I think about that and I'm like, Oh my gosh.
Thaddeus Tondu:I lost out on a three unit sale.
Chris Hunter:I'm begging, I would have bought, if they would have done a compelling offer. He didn't look at the inside at all didn't do anything like that, but, and this was a reputable company, but I'm thinking about the consumer experience. Now they expect so much more and if we're not executing on the fundamentals. It doesn't matter if you have the best software, whatever. If you're not inspecting what you expect in the field you're, you may be getting lackluster results and here's one thing I highly advocate. I did this at Hunter. I did a secret shopper where I had two of my salespeople go to one house and I wanted to see what the result was. Cause they, they both had pretty good closing percentages and one had a little bit higher average ticket than the other. So I wanted to see what, what's going on. But if I wouldn't have done that, I wouldn't have realized that both of them skipped steps in the process, right? So it was back to me as the leader, I needed to to reinforce our system, our training to make that happen and it opened our eyes to really a couple of minor things that were big deals that I would have never known if we wouldn't have inspected. What we expected out of that. So I think of this company, I'm like, if they really knew what was happening out in the field and why their average ticket was so low and why their conversion percentage was so low, they wouldn't just be saying, it's tough times, consumers are rough right now. Nobody's buying. It wasn't that. So it's back to basics, honestly is what the best companies are doing. They've got a system, they're executing it, they're measuring it. what gets measured and recognized, gets repeated and improved. That's exactly what they're doing. I was going, yeah I'm gonna, I'm gonna reach out to the owner and with him just friendly, but I didn't want to.
Thaddeus Tondu:But really, the two things I was like the planning, and you mentioned how many daily calls, so do you have a daily progress report in your business? Do you measure things on a day by day basis on what you need to know in order to be able to hit your goals and reverse engineering that backwards and there's plenty of I'm sure that you guys have it at go time success group. I know a few people that also have those sorts of things in there, but measuring those sorts of things on the planning, but like that back to basics is such a fundamental shift from a lot of people and going back to those basics, it's stops and starts, right? Hockey reference, I'm Canadian, so of course I'm going to have a hockey reference on stops and starts. But when you go back to those very basics, and you look at the professionals, you look at the pros, and if they're having a tough time in their game, you know what they do? They go back to the very basics on the extra fluffy things, they go right back to the very basics. In your opinion on the basics, what I mean, checklists, et cetera. Maybe we've already answered the question in and of itself, but if you're to pick out one back to basics item specifically for 2024 that a business needs to focus on, what would that back to basics be?
Chris Hunter:Oh, I got it and I got the data that backs it up. If you haven't called into your shop and listened what it's like to try to book a call, please do it today or have somebody call and listen or if you have ServiceTitan, go back in, pick some random calls that weren't booked and listen to them. The industry average, I believe it was like 46 percent was the call booking rate. So right away contractors spending so much money for marketing and throwing everything they can out there and marketers too. They're doing a lot of them are doing a great job. You guys probably do and then what happens? It gets to the shop and it's crap and it falls through the cracks and it shouldn't have to. So if you want to improve one thing today, it's nailed down this whole CSR, the incoming call thing. The second is a fast follow though it is a back to the planning part. It's when you know what, how many calls you need to do in a day. If you don't have those calls, guess what? It's time to get busy with the outbounding and do whatever it takes, whether it's the reaching out to past members, people that had open estimates and doing whatever it possibly takes to get your technician back in that home and fill that job board. That's got to be the second biggest thing you can do besides shore up your call booking rate.
Thaddeus Tondu:Yeah and two phenomenal, important things and I'm glad you mentioned that from the marketer standpoint, because nothing frustrates good marketers more than shitty operations. So you have, we said, we send you a hundred leads and you answer 50 of the calls. You've just lost 50 other opportunities because they're not waiting. They're not waiting for a call back. Especially when you think about why they're calling. If you're a plumbing or an HVAC, my A condition is broken and it's in Florida or you're in Texas, it's hot. Nah, I don't want to wait for you to call me back. I want to find something that can come out and come out quick, right? If you've, if you're plumbing and you've got a backed up sewer they're not calling. In waiting for you to return back when shit's coming out in their basement, right? They're going to be finding somebody quickly to come deal with that, right? Which is a big thing that consumer experience. But that other part of the back to basics is a huge thing monitoring the whole customer experience, but outbounding. It's this woe is me attitude and getting rid of it. In fact, If you're like I don't really know where to begin. Hey, guess what? Look in the bottom of the screen. The two sponsors, we did the Chiirp. They handle that for you. So if you don't know how to do that, then do it. If your back's against the wall, what are you going to do? Are you going to sit there and fold or are you going to actually make a stand? Make a stand, dial your database.
Chris Hunter:That's exactly it, man and so at ServiceTitan, we have a product called Second Chance Leads and so I was on the team looking at it saying, Hey, does this thing work? So basically it takes Titan intelligence or AI and it analyzes all the calls that said, Hey, these weren't leads, these weren't any good and then it re triggers and classifies it and says, Hey, we listened to them. We think these are legitimate leads and we, you should call them back and what we found is when they take action and call those people back, I don't have the exact stat, but it was like mind blowing high. How many actually booked these were shooed away, fell through the cracks, AI helped re identify the opportunity. Someone called them back and they actually booked. It was just Oh my gosh, look, what has fallen through the cracks.
Thaddeus Tondu:And
Chris Hunter:that's, it's
Thaddeus Tondu:such a good thing to be able to like using AI to see what's falling between the cracks. That's a phenomenal product right there and then there of itself, because it's just, it's so good because there, We can only do so much as an individual and we're always going to miss stuff and so leveraging technology, be able to do that Chris, I'm sure we can keep going on and on. We're at an hour and I want to be respectful of your time. Those that have gotten value of this, if you want to reach out obviously you can check out servicetitan.com you can reach him if you wanna check out Go Time Success Group, chris@gotimesuccessgroup.com is how you can get in touch with him. You can also ask him ServiceTitan related questions in there. I believe it's chunter@servicetitan.com. If you wanted to just go the ServiceTitan route if you're a ServiceTitan customer instead of the Go Time Success group. But the other one is gotimesuccessgroup.com is also open for consulting through that world in the coaching world of things. So the double edged side of things. So appreciate you taking some time out of your day to chat with us. But before we wrap up I do have one final question here for you, Chris. Yeah. What is one question that you wish people would ask you more, but don't.
Chris Hunter:Ah, for me, man it would be Where do you find your inspiration or your hope at, right? Cause I'm a follower of Christ. So I wish more people would ask. I'd love to tell them about it. Cause that's ultimately where I get it, what drives me and, I mentioned that being sick for a year. Ooh, that was an eye opener think you're not going to make it and I tell you what, you look at the world a little bit different and you want to find a way to do things that matter. So that was a, an eye opener for me. Really woke me up, but that's one question I wish more people would ask me.
Thaddeus Tondu:You,
Chris Hunter:you've already answered it itself in terms of, in, and I don't know if you want to go deep on that
Thaddeus Tondu:and I'm remiss for not for kind of glossing over that part of things, but in, again without going too far into details and make sure as much as you want going from business owner, rocking and rolling, selling the business into the plan to all of a sudden super sick and questioning whether you're going to make it through it all, that. What's that, what was that process like? How'd that, how, what changed were you after that?
Chris Hunter:Oh
Thaddeus Tondu:man, big
Chris Hunter:time change. So one, I just sold the business, and I'm still continuing on top of the world and then basically got news that they thought I had a stage four lung cancer. It turned out it wasn't it was something that I could actually cure, but I had eight different tumors in my throat in my chest or tumor like things that ended up being a something called Cryptococcus Neoformans. But I spent time at the Mayo Clinic and all this stuff, but 2019 pretty much set me on my butt. It took all my energy, made all my adrenals quit and all this stuff, when I came out of it or first, whenever I was going through it and I thought I was going to die because they told me I was I had this weird piece, man, because for me as a believer, I knew, okay, if it gets me, I know where I'm going. But if it don't, I'm going to have one heck of a story to tell when I'm left behind here. So that was it. But then the next part of it is once I was through it, it was like, whoo. Near miss. Wow and so now what do I really want out of this life? What do I really enjoy doing? What do I, What can I do that is gonna actually mean something? So a lot of people, man, they have this drive in them to go and build and strive and keep going and keep going and build 200 trillion companies, whatever it may be. That's great. I had that once as well but I've got this sincere contentment about me after that, and now I want to spend as much time as I can with my family. I want to do things with them that creates experiences that has fun. I want to find ways to give back to this industry that gave so heavily to me and my family my family and my team. So I'm trying to figure out how can I do things more in those realms instead of going out and conquering the world and giving all my time and effort to a business growth. Cause we did that, and now we have a, we have the safety net, and now it's time to do things that matter. So that was the biggest thing that whole thing taught me, because I guarantee at the end of your days. We're not going to look back and go, Ooh, I wish we'd worked a little bit more. It's going to be like, man, I wish I'd loved a little bit more. I wish I would have spent a little more time with mom or dad or my kids, things like that. So for me, it just reawakened that sense of doing things that matter.
Thaddeus Tondu:And
Chris Hunter:I think more people need to hear that message and especially because what gets lost is this hustle culture, especially
Thaddeus Tondu:on social media of, I'm proud to work 70, 80, 90 hours per week for my business and I'm building it for my family, but your family never sees you. And what if they didn't want that?
Chris Hunter:Yeah,
Thaddeus Tondu:that's
Chris Hunter:it and for some, yeah, man, for some having lofty goals is an awesome thing and I'm not advocating that one shouldn't. I'm just saying. Some of your lofty goals may be to have an awesome marriage. I've got an awesome marriage. Me and my wife spend almost every moment of the day with each other. Some people may cringe when they hear that. I don't. I love it. I love it. We were high school sweethearts. I've got four grandkids. I love it. We love to go fish, so if I can go out fishing and then still have a way to give back like stuff through this podcast or through ServiceTitan and helping, it satisfies all my boxes and that's what I'm looking to do.
Thaddeus Tondu:And that goes almost full circle right to the very beginning of the higher why and the purpose, right? And now it's your own individual higher why I guess the number two one is your dreams and your vision, right? Super impressive stuff thank you for all of your contributions into the industry and for that recognition through that tough time in 2019, because I think the value that you bring is tremendous and thank you for continuing to show up to help contractors. So I thank you for being on the podcast and dropping some absolute knowledge. It was great.
Chris Hunter:All thanks again.
Thaddeus Tondu:No worries. And until next time, folks, cheers.
Chris Hunter:Cheers.
Thaddeus Tondu:Well, That's a wrap on another episode of HVAC Success Secrets Revealed. Before you go two quick things. First off, join our Facebook group, facebook.com/groups/hvacrevealed. The other thing, if you took one tiny bit of information out of this show, no matter how big, no matter how small. All we ask is for you to introduce this to one person in your contacts list. That's it. That's all. One person. So they too can unleash the ultimate HVAC business. Until next time. Cheers.