How To Get a 16% Conversion Rate - with Shopify Merchant Dan Greef

If you want to start a business that is More than a passive income / hands-off ecommerce store then THIS is the episode for you!

OR if you are not making sales and just can’t understand why then listen in and learn. 

I have been offering marketing advice to this next guest and his wife for the last year and love their passion and dedication so invited Dan here to share his experience with you.
Their store is www.deliciouslyguiltfree.com

This store is getting a MINIMUM 6% conversion rate and up to a 16% conversion rate! This is NOT normal but today I will prove it's VERY possible even with ZERO knowledge.

Dan and Basma Greef came to me about 1 year ago. Starting out. Not making money but VERY passionate. I have had a few calls with them and each time they have taken my advice and blown my mind with how they are able to implement and make a success of their business. 

It’s so easy for me to provide advice. I do it all day. But not many are out there DOING IT and make a success of their business. It’s funny how many people will pay me, not do the work then  wonder why they are not succeeding. 

Let’s discuss...

• What made you decide to make low sugar, keto/low carb cakes?
• How and what have you since learnt about low carb?
• What are the challenges of running an e-commerce store?
• What are the highs and lows of running your own business?
• Why are getting such high conversion rates?
• Basma and yourself have realised that there is a lot more to this than just trying to sell
• Offline store V’s  online business
• The fear factor… 
• Price selling
• Building loyalty 
• How important is it that you are more than just trying to sell a “product” You are doing things differently by building a community. “Serving” not "Shouting at people "
• How many hours a week do you put into this business?
• What are the next plans for growing  DGF
• What plans do I have to grow the low carb community in the UK
• You recently signed up for Just Ask Parker services Why?
• Why should someone start a Shopify store?
• Tell us about your podcast

Dan's Recommendations 

• Book  - E-myth 
• Setup your business as if you are setting up a franchise
• Get feedback!

Sponsor
Gorgias.com - Mention the podcast for your second month free

Transcript

Intro/Outro:   0:05
Welcome to the winning With Shopify podcast. This is the podcast that will teach you to take your Shopify store and turn it into an order mated sales machine. It has the latest marketing, email, sales and social media advice and also have strategies and tips from the experts without fluff. Your host is Caroline Balinska. She's a Shopify education partner with the Shopify approved course, 1000 sales and Beyond. And she's the founder of JustAskPaker.com, the only small marketing tasks agency for Shopify owners. She has 15 years experience in marketing, manufacturing design and eight comments in the podcast. She'll share her knowledge and interview the experts to help you in your journey to success. Sorry, don't forget to subscribe to this podcast so you never miss an episode. Now, here's your host, Caroline Balinska.  

Caroline:   0:52
Hi, everyone. Welcome back to the podcast. I have a very special guest here today. I'm very excited. We are going to be talking all about how to create a business when it comes to creating businesses that are not at that passive income. A lot of people are wanting to start passive income businesses that a hands off. But there's also quite a few of you out there that do like the idea of creating a business that's more hands on, and this is definitely going to be the episode for you Now. Maybe you're in a situation where you do want to create a passive income business, but you're not getting any sales at the moment and you're getting frustrated. Then listen on in because I'm sure you're going to look a look today as well.  

Caroline:   1:37
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Caroline:   3:26
So today I have a fantastic guest. I could Dan on the line. Dan Grief is actually someone that came to meet last year with his wife, Basma. Actually, the two of them came to me, found me online. I'm sure it was through my podcast, I think, and reached out to me, and I managed to find some time to have a chat to them at that stage. And then it was lovely that I was doing a live event in London and they were sitting in the front row watching me at my life events. So I got a chance to meet. They're in person and since then have spoken to them quite a few times, helping them along the way with their business, and it's been a very interesting year for them. When they first came to me, they had and we're going to get more information from down. But when they started out, they had just purchased of business that wasn't making any money, but they were very passionate about this idea, and they came to me and they asked me, They're both very, very intelligent people with intellectual backgrounds. But they had never bean e commerce before. So they came to me and one of the first questions was all week for easy getting into these. And once I explained that business, I said, This is such a great idea. And I've been along the journey with, um listening to how they've been going the ups and downs on dhe I spoke to down the other day, and they have actually now got in their business to a minimum of a 6% conversion rate, with a 16% conversion rate on average all over the time, which is fantastic. And after hearing that from down, I said, I've got to get you on my podcast. I want you to share all of your knowledge with everyone because unlike a lot of those drop shipping, business is this is a lot different on. I think that the passion and the work that's going into this is very easy to be digestible and scene. You can see the success that's coming out of it. So I just really love this story, and I'd love to introduce you to Dan, and Dan can tell us more about what they're doing. Dan has not have not had, as I said, any off their own knowledge in a comments themselves. But what I really love is it along the way, without any knowledge of a comments, have taken on board things that I've told them and run with it and put them into action. And I see the success that they're getting along the way, and that to me really blows my mind because I find that a lot of people come to me, asked me for help, get free advice from me, get paid advice for me, but never implement the things that I have told them or told them to do. But what we're finding is that with Donna Basma they are implementing the actual advice and I'm giving and finding that they're getting results. The best part for May. I think that it really helps me see that what I do is successful and I love hearing success stories all the way. So let's hear more from Dan now. He's gonna give us so much information. We've had a quick chat before this call and he's going to be covering off a lot of the areas that I know that you want to know that as an equal must own up. So Dan Hi, welcome to my podcast.

Dan:   6:23
Thank you. It's great to be here, and it's been like being at your own funeral where you get to hear eulogy of yourself. I'm a bit embarrassed you can't read face, but I'm a little embarrassed. But thank you so much for being so kind and thank you as well for the support you've certainly given us over the last year.

Caroline:   6:37
No, it's it's fine. And, you know, it's What I love about the choux view is that you're both so passionate about what you're doing, and we're going to get into exactly what that is because I think that it's a very interesting area. But what I love is that you're both so passionate, but you both come from backgrounds where you have nothing to do with e commerce will be on loans face. So Basma is a doctor. Your wife's a doctor and then tell us a bit about you and what you were doing before, and even now that you're still doing on this side of during this business.

Dan:   7:06
Yeah, so I've never bean somebody who, well, firstly as much downtime or sleeps much. But then it's because I generally love. Why do so? I've got a few different projects of the moment, so I teach two days a week to allowed with autism. Ah, he can't go to school. So I get paid by the government well with him two days a week. I also tutor in politics in my spare time for those who are trying to learn English or want to take a qualification in politics in this country. Apart from that, also on dhe, a sort of politician, I've stood in a few elections, now national and local three national elections at about the same local heaven. One is yet, but I still campaign in the party, and I'm still hoping to get elected one day on. Also the job I had before this when I left teaching was working for a social enterprise on my job is to go into schools on to recruit kids so basically teenagers to about developing world countries and build schools and actually Kenya and help with community work out there. So I've kind of I really think that life is worth living and if you see an opportunity go for it, and in a way, that's why we've come to this as well.

Caroline:   8:09
I love that. And what I love most after meeting the two of you, the first time in the media broken person as well is that you're both very passionate. So let's talk about what you're doing now because I find this super excited. When you first came to me, the two of you came to me, he said. Are we crazy for getting into this space? But once you explain what you were doing, I was lately blown away, and I think that what you enjoying is amazing but for your own passion but also helping other people. So let's talk about what your business is. Let's first start off with the name of it. I love the name of it.

Dan:   8:39
Yeah, so record deliciously guilt free on Dhe. The whole idea, really was that we wanted a change or keep your options to change the way they were eating. So we make brownies, cakes, biscuits. So far, so good. But the bad bits and that's only the sugar. And so what we have decided to do is make our cakes and biscuits and brownies less than a gram of sugar each. They also are gluten free. They're not made with flour because want to make them low carb as well. So it's for anyone who wants to have a low carb diet. Ah, kee toe diet. Some people be aware that as well, then they can eat these cakes and biscuits without any of the guilt that I might have if they're eating something sugary on DDE. What we managed to do was by using natural sweetness. There's no rubbish. There's no nasty chemicals or anything like that. So all freshly produced every week. What we managed to do is, by mixing the sweetness in a certain way, were able to replicate the flavor of sugar without having a ll the negative impact on your

Caroline:   9:32
health. Okay? And I can bash for when you guys came and met me in London, came to my event, you would not not to bring me some of the brownies you brought me to. I remember orange and the the raspberry, I think. Oh, yeah, those two different claims that you brought me, um I have to say I'm really polished off all of them on that night I went out after that meeting, I went out with one of my girlfriends in London, and she I was good in free at the time. And I had been for about 15 years due to allergies on Dhe. My friend is not at all, and we sat there eating them just going. These are the most amazing tasting brownies I've ever tasted, and I really hate that taste of the state sugars. I'm not good with I Diet Cokes and yeah,

Dan:   10:13
most people do. That's what we found as well.

Caroline:   10:15
And so they they are, mind blowingly delicious. So anyone who's thinking about it, I can tell you that the only problem is, don't buy too many because you will eat too many a lot once because they are just amazing. So I can say that

Dan:   10:26
you can freeze them, you can freeze them, and then that's a bit hardest to into frozen brown. You're supposed

Caroline:   10:31
I'm sure, our manager that they have brilliant, So I really love the taste. But let's talk about why you actually did it like that. What's the background behind it? What made you do it in the first place? Like why low carb y Kato because I know my reasons for, like why I would need it. But what was the reason to you guys?

Dan:   10:47
Yes. So best, of course, is a doctor. Andi. She's also a scientist. A cz Well, that's my life story. On in 2015 she was pregnant on dhe. I remember this like it was yesterday. I got a phone call I was teaching at a school at the time, and I got a phone call from her and she was in tears and she said to me, Oh, my God, I've got diabetes Type two diabetes on dhe. I said, Sorry, what you went in for, like a blood sugar test or something. And she calmed down. She explained to me gestational diabetes, which I didn't know that what that waas on And gestational diabetes, Of course, because she's pregnant, her body was reacting a certain way, and she had all the symptoms of diabetes. They say that after pregnancy it goes away again, but best. But being a doctor, she knew full well that was a real marker, that she could have diabetes in the future. On that she could become pre diabetic. And so I think most people that situation reporting, just follow the doctor's advice and think I'll take whatever drugs they say. The best man decided you really wanted to try her best to try and manage this by diet. First on Dhe. Then if it turned out she couldn't venture, turn to the drug option. But she wanted to make sure she was kind of doing it in the most healthy way for her and the baby. Now the advice he was getting at the time, we didn't think with that Great on. I think in all honesty, if this had been 10 years ago, then this would not have happened. But with the Internet, the way is now with YouTube. We literally looking up different light speakers and lectures and programs. And then we started reading articles and journals on I think, because this is her areas. A doctor, she felt very comfortable to kind of look at the research in the evidence, and that's how we came across local on Dhe. Sarah Holberg is a low carb electro a doctor in the States on We watched her video and I just thought my words, I've got a weight problem I think I'm pre diabetic. I think I've got this issue as well. It's just that I haven't thought about it before. Now on the more I looked into it for my diet, I realized maybe if I eat a different way, I feel healthier on for me. In particular, I've always found I gain weight very easily. If I look at Peter Pizza, then we feel on the hips, whereas if I was able in some way to kind of eat more healthily for me on this is what I found now I have more energy. I'm somebody who can eat the right foods that soon my body on lose weight with less exercise and that used to use those to whom or exercise and gain weight. Now I do less nice. I still lose weight because I'm eating the right food. And that's how it all started initially with this idea of a dream on that then led me to the most weird A supposed to some people. But to me it seemed like the natural next step. I saved up a CZ much fun as I could on I said two best men, right? There's this the amazing conference in California. I want to save up our money. I want to go. Want to learn about this because this is going to change the world everybody in for health for lots of people. So I went to the States and I met Sarah Goldberg, who was there. I couldn't believe that this woman has changed my life there. She's invited me giving a speech, and I met so many people is a community as well. Off people at that conference were just into the same thing. And I thought, I've got to do something. I've gotta have a business in this area because I really believe this on Dhe. So for me, coming to this whole business idea was nothing to do is becoming a millionaire one day it was nothing to do with becoming a big entrepreneurial success and saying, Devon on an entrepreneur, which on the way to being hopefully it was about Can I take this diet but worked for me and share that with everyone else?

Caroline:   14:00
What? I love anyone who listens to my podcast on my videos. Old meet me in person. Whatever it is my number one thing that I talk about is understand your customer and people ask me which trainings I recommend of my own. My number one training I recommend is my one about how to work out for your ideal customers. And when I met the two of you the very first time and you're asking me, Are we crazy? I straightaway loved what you did for that exact reason. You're your customer. You know exactly who customers. But it's very niche, but also very broad at the same time, because a lot of people come to me with these great business ideas. And then I've spoken about this particular one as a great example. So I've got this particular client that avoids with and she talks like she's got a T shirt and it's my name is and it's like that. Oh, yeah, well, a sticker that we have the red stickers that you wear a conference and you write your name in that thing and she's got this T shirt is the design My name is, and she's written in there with her kid marker underpaid. So she's got this whole movement of our I'm underpaid. And when she came to missions, I wanna run this business. I want to settle this T shirt because there's a lot of people out there that feel like they're underpaid for their jobs. And her. You know, Bernie Sanders is sort of like her ideal audience. The problem is, while that's fantastic, I said to her, I love the concept. I believe in what you're doing. However, the people that are underpaid if you work in warmup for toodles an hour, you can't afford your T shirt. You wanna wear it, but you can't afford it. Understanding who your customers, but understanding. Is there a market there? I have two very important things that you must understand before you go anywhere. And I tell people, Do not even start your business until you know this inside out. If you do not know your customer inside out, you're crazy for going into this business. And that's why when the two of you came to me, I loved it because you said to me, Hey, these are the types of people, This is what they have And then I gave you some ideas. For example, the allergy that I've had for the last few 20 years was around Cibo on that's it, like another sort of allergy. And because you've got sort of some of the products that I can eat, it's niche, but it's also still very broad, and there's a lot of different things. You've been doing that so that to me was like the number one thing that made me go for it. Do it,

Dan:   16:15
Thank you. And that was really inspiring for us, because I think it's always important to have people who are ahead of you in this journey that you can then say, Well, this sounds good to me, but is also pretty scary on Dhe. Do you think this is gonna work and to get your reassurance really helped us then particularly hard time as well. So thank you for that. But what I'd say is, I think if you look at Prince since you know in the UK right now, we have supermarkets are struggling a little bit special. Them really massive stores, hotels. I swung somebody in the hotel industry recently. He said that I have a real comes their kitchen because the consumers are changing their habits and that's what we've noticed. So supermarkets are very much set up to sell toe Everybody who came to the door You're gonna get your washing powder going, get you whatever. And you probably choose the best price for the rest of quality you can get. You go to a hotel, you'd get the bland menu and you're just gonna choose the vegetable lasagna, a few vegetarian, the stake. If you're in a meat eater, not be a you know, a few things in between on DDE What realizes the supermarkets are working on that because we're becoming more discerning his customers. And we want tohave things that fit our lifestyle, Maur. And that's where we come in with our business because we're trying to do that. If you go to a hotel now, this hotel owner said in actual fact putting. Yet people having their food delivered him from a restaurant in town is looking exactly the food they want. If they're vegan, then they can go get a vegan food. If they're doing my car, then get their low carb meal. So I think the world is changing and actually there's no better time for you calmest them right now because we are so connected me into that. So if I think about 10 years ago opening this as a business in Cambridge only. Why live in the U. K? You might get a handful of people who do low carb, although I do suspect that will get a much greater over time. But the fact that I can now connect with people on line on we can kind of know about each other's lives in chest stories on Facebook groups, we can actually talk to each other by making videos, et cetera. I think that's just connected us in a way that we feel that we've got a community now on. I want that movement to grow and it's in fact, what I find interesting is I just want somebody in the states of the day. I've never met him in person. I feel like I know him through Instagram on Do we know? We share meal ideas with each other, and I think what world we live in, where we can do that now on. I won't just go and buy this off process food or whatever rubber shock and finishes cheap here. I actually wanna go and get something right for my body. So consumers, a well informed they know what they're doing on. The other thing I say is as well, you have got Sony Resources now, but you just did not have in the past. So if you think you don't know something and we didn't know a lot go online, you learn it very quickly. Everything's on Google YouTube and if it's not and it is a bit more complex than that, they're people like you, Caroline, that you confined, you can reach out to. You can ask questions. The only thing stopping most of us is insecurity. But if you can get over that, then you could learn. And if you say to somebody I don't know about this, I'm actually a very accomplished person in some parts of my life. This part, my life, I've got no idea. So Essie Oh, I don't know what I'm doing, but I come to you and I say, Excuse me, Do you think it could be some advice on this? Because it could be better on you and you have, And that's made a difference to me. So you know, reach out, get over insecurity and you will learn and you will grow.

Caroline:   19:15
No, it's so true. And I think that yeah, that's definitely the things that I've come to love. And really, why I keep on talking to you guys and help you guys out along the way Because I just love that you're actually taking action because a lot of people come to me and they get this adviser than they go. That's OK. And then they say to me a few months later, nothing's working and I go. Okay, Well, what did you try to implement? From what I told you? Well, I haven't had time to implement it to be over yet. Yeah, it's fear comes into it. Laziness comes into it sitting around waiting for the next bright, shiny object to, you know, maybe that bright, shiny objects just gonna fix it all and resolve everything. But the truth is, in this space, it's not gonna happen like that. And you're proving your investment approving. You've got to just take action and keep going. I want to touch on the fact that we will talk about passive income. And I said in the intro, You guys are not about passive income at all, not at this stage, because of the moment you are having to create everything. You make all of the products by hand for the orders. You do like it seven days a week and you make the products. Of course, in the future you're going to be in a situation you hope I hope for you that you will have a factory that could make them for you, and you will be hands off in that way. And hopefully, like I talked about the snowball effect, build everything up now that you will be in a point. Once you create a community, you will be able to be more hands off. But at the moment, you guys have realized that you do need to put in the work to begin with. So let's just talk a little bit about that, like one of the challenges that you're finding it. The moment with a call mess and especially from the point of view, is that your you are having to put in the effort to make this happen.

Dan:   20:50
Yes, certainly. So there's a really good book that I'd recommend you'll read called E Myth Common with full name recommended to me by somebody who has his own business on it was so true. And this is what I learned about my life now. So he's This book breaks down the idea that every business for a start up for ah e commerce stories of perfect example of this has three different roles. You got the technician, which I'd say, The worker you've got the manager on. You got the entrepreneur on dhe. We all go into this because we're more like the entrepreneur with a big idea, the vision, the direction. We have a plan for where we want to go on. We're the ones who are trying to drive that vision and dream and make it reality. And then, very quickly, you saw slip into the technician used in the day in, day out. So my day in, day out for the last two years has been very much baking, chopping, making boxes, posting, contacting customers, building relationships, talking to them. And if you're not careful in an e commerce setting, you could almost become an employee off your business only, and you have to realize that you have to become the manager to set up systems in place to become more efficient and by becoming more efficient making systems you can then have people come and work for you on the stage. I'm at the moment is that I'm actually making protocols to my business. And the idea is, and this sounds a bit crazy. At first, I'm building my business to be franchised. I'm not gonna franchise it. All I'm gonna build my business is if it could be franchise so that anybody could come in on DL the protocols to be in place, that it would just run like clockwork on they could take it off a day, one without me being there. And if you can get your business to the stage where then it is running like clockwork and you don't have to be there, that's when you can comfortably be the entrepreneur pushing forward to the future of the vision, the dream on making connections, opportunities in the future on because we are generally one or two people. In our case, it's two of us. Well, one on one and 1/2 now is more. I've gone back to her PhD I'm having to do with a three rolls. And so I'm trying to now learn this week, and I'm gonna be completely honest about this. I don't get it right all the time and pretend I'm an expert. But I'm trying to learn this now off, dividing my time really well in the week so that I can be the technician who's making stuff. I can be the manager who's like developing the business plan and how it's all fitting together. And it could be the entrepreneur to make new things happen on. I think you've gotta have a balance of those three, so they make sure you have it all. If you kind of get it wrong, you're only the entrepreneur. Then you find very quickly that orders are getting sent out. People getting annoyed. You're too long talking to the next opportunity. If you're just the manager, you pretty getting a bit too small. C conservative and trying to hold things back to try and keep it under control. And if you're just a technician, is pretty miserable because you feel in the end you've got a foot world more than full time job, no holiday pay. You can never let it go, says those three things together. That's really important and trying to make sure you put enough time into each them so your business is growing and not being held back by. You

Caroline:   23:36
know, I love that In a couple of weeks ago, I brought out a podcast episode that was exactly about Here is how you have to structure your day on. I go through here than nine things you have to do every single day in your business before you start thinking about other things. Because what we tend to do is exactly that we get so caught up in something that afterwards it's like, Okay, I could've just paid some on five bucks an hour to do that for me. Or I could have found a way to automate that, and I didn't have to do it at all. Or if I would have set a time and just said, Okay, I've only got 15 minutes to do this one task and that's it. I would have got through it faster. So I love that you give that advice because it's so true and people do get to down into the hole. But I have to do it all. Yeah, and you're proving you don't have to do it all. You gotta suck it up and just do it all to begin with. But unless you put those measures in place of teaching other people how to do the task, you will never be able to hand them over someone else.

Dan:   24:30
It'll and actually there's a big part of you. Go there as well, isn't there? You know it comes into Do you feel like you have to do a ll because you're a perfectionist or you can't trust anyone else with it. If that's the case, maybe need to be more of a manager on, bring people in and they can then help you do it and make your life easier. But I also think sometimes being the technicians, the easier job we are natural programmed, I think, to be busy and feel like what if I'm busy that I'm awfully achieving It doesn't always work like that. Like you said efficiencies. You need to find efficiencies to use your time. Well, because that could be ways to make more money to grow your business more to make more connections, which is actually much more beneficial. Long term on. That's something I've learned on. My life's a lot better than that than I AM, and she'll say, Okay, you're baking to three in the morning. Don't you think? Should get some help. Now, I, uh You know, I don't think it's an important conversation on also realizing you learn so much in this and you look back at the last year and you think, Oh, look where we've come from But it's really hard to see the next year ahead really hard. And you think, Well, I guess it would be like this, but a bit better on actually sometimes need to stop, actually kind of pull back for your business, reflect on where it's all going on, make a real strategy. And then, of course, you can try and follow the strategy and go for it. But you can easily get sucked into the day in, day out. I've got a producer. I've gotta cook. What opposed to go send about the email without realizing Oh, yeah. Have actually give myself time to think about the direction I'm going to. What are the goals of the future?

Caroline:   25:46
No, it's so true. I want to cover up quite a lot more stuff. I wanna talk about loyalty. I want to talk about awful investors online business. I want to talk about conversion rates, but let's go into first of all, talking about the highs and lows on front in your business.

Dan:   26:01
Okay? Yep. S o the high. Certainly. I started the positives. It's amazing when you're building and creating it doesn't matter. Water is. But if it means something to you that it is incredible, it's most liberating thing ever on dhe. For me, deliciously guilt free has Bean that thing that I've taken from a business that wasn't making a huge mouth buddy but it was doing okay is ahead of its time, certainly on turning that into something which is actually becoming a real brand appeals lives. And saying that connects to them is really, really amazing to see on that has beena riel inspiration for me, especially when sales aren't as good as you'd hope. Or perhaps you put a lot of effort into a new product, which isn't that successful, but whatever it might be, but the fact you're building up something over time and when you get the feedback from people So one of the things I definitely safer any on e commerce entrepreneur out there is you've got to get feedback from your customers on Caroline recommended an app for us in our store on it is really amazing. How before Then you get a couple of feet back pieces where somebody, some brave soldiers, actually decided on their own free time to find our website and write something for us on. We thought, OK, we put all the yam much fee, but we never do. But actually, by having its automated system, we were then getting this feedback coming in on that has such an impact on you as an entrepreneur. You think, Ah,

Caroline:   27:19
how much

Dan:   27:19
you make a difference in someone's life. And when they're saying to me, You know, I'm type two diabetic. I haven't been able to eat sweet things for 10 12 20 years, the first time I've had a cake in my life. And it didn't spike the insulin And these people, by the way, they track their sugar levels so they know exactly what's going on their health and they they eat our food, they test themselves on, they feel so liberated. That's so emotional about it. You know why they thought a few years ago they'd have to give up sugar forever. And now they're eating sweet things which aren't full of rubbish. They're not nasty. They don't damage their health and they can enjoy them and not feel bad about it is no guilt. As we said in our brand on that, for me is one of the most beneficial things ever. The most touching thing that came from that was last summer. We went thio an exhibit in the Olympia in London on its the allergy and free From show on. Two of our customers came work for the day for free. They just volunteered to help us sell brownies and to get our Brando because they loved us on DDE. That was really that bowled me over. I've never done that for a brand. I've done it for other things. I believe in other organizations and political organizations. But for a company I've never had that. So you realized the impact you having their lives about the not so good times? I think it is very easy when you're in the middle of things and you're just literally doing it. It could become a job rather than your business. You're going, and you're gonna be very careful other. And I think the fact that it's the two of us on dhe wife and I have very different kind of personalities are much more of a martyr. Get on and suffer and moan, and she's much more of a logical step back a minute. Rethink this, and I think you can easily become almost like working all the hours God sends sleeping very little when we had a baby last year as well, so you can imagine how little sleep we're getting on it. And it could be like, Why am I doing this? And I literally just doing this for the sake off, making not much money. You know what? I just did it for a brand that will be big one day, but not now. What's the point? I think it's running that in those moments, that's what it's got to connect with people in the community. And actually, you can do that. So on Instagram on Facebook, talk to the customers. I would never say I'm going through a hard time. I just wanted to hear their stories and how to get in on and realized We have an impact, and it's all about

Caroline:   29:22
impact impact. I love that. And so that leads into my next question. Why do you think you're getting such high conversion rates? Because this is crazy Whisper class week. And you said to me I am getting a minimum of 6% and then averaging around 16%. And I was like, What? That is amazing because in the e commerce space and I say this a lot, if you're getting between two and 4% you're doing well like those the averages across the globe in e commerce, So 16% conversion is mind blowing. Why do you think you're getting such high conversion rates? What do you think you're doing?

Dan:   29:56
Yeah, thank you. And thanks for tennis accident to go even appreciated until when you told me that it was good. You sort of think you think sang on. There's 94 people in 100. Do not buy from our website that many how What's wrong with them now? We're gonna say it could be taken in two different ways. Social media on dhe, I think people use social media in different ways, and that's the way use. It's important, not the actual platform we're in an age now, where we have a number of platforms where organic material content is so easily spread amongst people. But what people do in advertising generally I find on social media is no different. They shouted. People, they just almost purple wall of stuff in their face. You know, you kind of get the adverts, which just appear, and they just bug you and they follow you around the Internet and every website you go to the advert appears, whatever on what we decided was with our social media Waas, instead of just shouting at people we thought, Let's learn about tarnish the local community and the key to community. Let's that's research about the diet itself for us. Let's live that. And that's then talk and learn from other people in that community. So instead of just saying bye brownies, which is annoying and we all know it doesn't work on us, it just annoys us. That's appetizing. The past. We just have conversations of people. We engage. We tried toe put things on groups that we are reading ourselves about this way of life. For when I went to California, I decided, Okay, I could do this is just me or I could just with my iPhone on dhe a selfie stick, talk to people who are here and share their stories. And I've always been storytelling anyway, so I decided, you know, just to go to you at first the speakers and get them to talk. And then secondly, to talk to other people who were there from all over the world doing low carb on to say, You know, you've got a top tip that I could share in a Facebook group, and I've just posted these on the Facebook group. This is before I even had a business because I thought I believe in this. I'm gonna share this with these people. And if you have social media working and by the way, we have no adverts, which which is a bit bizarre for a company who's got such a high conversion rate, it's because we literally are living this and talking and listening and being part of our community. And in the next step, and I'm sure we'll come on to this is the podcast, which I want to get to the next level and make a show which is about the community for community made by them, not just me shouting at them now if they then learn at the same time, I'm the guy who makes the brownies or what is to make the brownies because he also lived the same life that I live all right. That makes sense now. So he understands Matt crows and nutrition, and he understands that we have to have best ingredients. We can't have Nazi preservatives. We want to make sure that, you know is made fresh and it's is kept fresh. And it's fresh fruit used in things. And they know my values because I lived them. And that's I think we're done Well, if you get on the other end of shouting at people, then it becomes best price. And if you just do best price, then I think it's cheap if you do it based on your values and you don't give into your values at all than people know that Andi, as we develop our branded as we develop also, our products were listening. We're getting feedback. We bring out a new brownie or new cake every month now just to see what works and we send out when we get the feedback they've been. Tell Sophie about it and decide to do another one. When we do that every month, and it's going really, really well,

Caroline:   33:04
I think a lot of people listening to this will say, Oh my God, that doesn't sound like something I could do my own business. But I think we spoke about this a while ago and you were interested in the whole podcasting scene and you asked me about that. And I definitely think for you it's right. You're not gonna be talking about brownies every single episode because that that

Dan:   33:24
little there's nothing to do that. Hey, I've

Caroline:   33:26
tasted them, so I would understand that. But at that point, like just talking about Bradley's is not gonna work that you're gonna be talking about the whole lifestyle that goes with it. So then there's exercise like that. There's the other sorts of foods people can eat. There's how people live. Health problems that people have is that so many different areas. And I think people need to understand it doesn't really matter what knee Suren, and maybe it's not podcasting. But like you said, it's about building that community online's I might be a Facebook group, and I spoke to you about setting up a Facebook group as well. So you've got a lot of opportunities that but there's a lot of other businesses that don't realize how many different areas they can go into and like you just said before. And I've got that written down and highlighted serving people in not shouting at people because that's what a lot of people they're told to run a Facebook added. It's like run. A Facebook ad put in the Facebook had sailed 20% off our Browning's, and it's like if I've never seen your brownies before and I'm sitting there on Facebook and I'm writing a message because my I'm gossiping about what my best friend was doing blah, blah, blah. We're on writing to my grandmother because she wants to see new photos of my kid, and then your ad pops up about some brownies and I'm like groups, whatever. That's how it's going to be taken and shouting at people it doesn't work, and those sort of adds don't work anymore. I agree, but if you can turn around and say, Hey, have you thought about your health this week. Or have you had ex wives that health problem, or have you ever been told that you've got gestational diabetes or whatever it might be? You've got so many different angles. It's a very different way to talk to people. And that's where you're coming into it from that community side. And I think people need to understand that they could do this, join their business, whether they're selling baby shoes or whether they're selling jewelry or whatever they're selling. They cannot get a client I'm working with now, and she's got a jewelry range that she makes by hand. And she's doing this now where she's doing YouTube videos of purchase sitting in front of a camera on dhe. She's like, Hey, so here's three necklaces if you're going on a holiday and you're over gauge of 40 but you want to have, like, a small mix and match water via holiday, here's different ways. You can wear these necklaces

Dan:   35:33
nice, and it's actually tying into a lifestyle, isn't it? It's not the product. It's the person's lifestyle. So what? I said, Listen to people. I think I can sound a bit airy fairy. I want to fill out. What I mean is well, like in terms of the podcast. So there are a number of low carb on dhe Ranchito podcast in the market. Already on my research for this podcast was I asked people who was interested in getting on the show on I said, Oh, you know, Do you listen to any low carb pizza? A podcast on They all said no, which instantly would make you think That's pretty no reason to have a podcast. But when I said why, they pretty much said the same reasons I say And that was it is really science. See, you've got two experts talking like the university seminar about an issue

Caroline:   36:12
showing their own expertise. That's not exactly,

Dan:   36:15
and you feel like you're on the outside looking in almost like, well, good for them. But it isn't really for me. So I thought, Well, if we have a podcast, which was for them on dhe, Okay, this is the difference that people come on my show and I've recorded now nine episodes. It's not launched yet. It's called UK low carb. So is completely separate to the business or that sponsored by foolishly guilt free that will be launched in March. When it comes out every episode, I have a co host. I don't have a guest of a co host and they come on. They firstly tell me their story about 10 15 minutes because I think stories of how the world works. And I think we as people need stories, true stories about your successes on also the hard times. I don't need to be perfect and only to be polished. I want it to be honest, honest stories about people who've gone through things. And so far I've heard amazing things about pills, mental health People have been in real problems, their weight with diabetes, somebody who's trying to do vegan and key toe the same time and how they manage that. And then the other part of the show is that because there are co host, not just sharing the story, we have points and comments sent in. So I wanted to be like a chap show each week where people are writing in with their comments that we share on that has gone incredibly well because in the moment before launch, I'm putting comments on a Facebook group or two in the UK in Kita No carb people are then writing their responses, and I'm saying kind of share that on the show on. Then the co host of Maya share reading out these points and then talking about them and given our opinion. And it's all about connection. That's what the show is all about, connecting with people. I'm not really on there saying Arman expert and Tito, you must do this in your diet. I'm not gonna say after my research of my Ph. D's in this, I'm gonna say, Unlike you, I'm living this way of life. I want to learn more on if you want to be part of show either right in or come on the show on share your story. And I think that's how you build connection.

Caroline:   37:56
It's so true. And that's one thing about my podcast. What's so successful is because I asked questions that people want to know the answers for that for me, seeing very basic. But I know that those are the questions that need to be answered, and I find that there's a lot of people out there that are going on that really high level. While that's great for the people that you know everything already. Then why would they listen? They don't need to. So, yeah, I totally understand that. Different. I think it's I can't wait. I'm very much looking forward to like us.

Dan:   38:24
Well, you know what? It's because you know your audience, you know? You know, I mean, I'm your audience and I listen each week because I get so much value on if you're giving value, it doesn't matter how you're doing it. Is it value for that audience in particular, the worst thing in the world? Just think, Well, I want to do this because I want to feel good about myself. I want to say that I've got a podcast or I just love the idea of having a business

Caroline:   38:45
that I had the biggest one and I have everyone. I don't need everyone. And I know that mine's not the biggest podcast because I know that there's one more listeners, but I'm very niche and I know who I'm talking to. It's exactly what you guys are doing. You're very niche because you could easily just say we're out of brownies that tasty and you can try to go after the whole market and trying to do what a lot of people say to me. My audience of males and females 18 to 65 everyone

Dan:   39:09
Yes, yes. And in fact, you know what the public needs to nobody ever talks about. Not only are you saying you're providing something of value, either product to service whatever for these people, you also implicitly saying it's not right for some other people. Yes, and that's what you kind of have to realize. So what I've learned the hard way is somebody had come to me and they say, I've got another due to nuts and you make your some almond flour so it can make out of coconut flour. And I will do that one day for them. But the moment I just have to concentrate on what I have got and then grow later. Other people might want some inches fat free and key tone like copy. Will Germany like fat? And I think, Well, maybe not few. Then there are lots of fat free things out there, which are for you, and that's fine. I'm not saying you're not welcome here. I'm just saying it's maybe no asked for you is. It's these people. And if you get into any shin, you really do live that with them and you serve them. And that's what you do with your Shopify podcast. It really is an issue which we need you on. We could listen to anyone else doing other things, but we don't listen to you because we need that. I think that's the important thing is for these people. They need this thing on. That's what we're doing. And it means by implicitly saying, these other people have got something else to go to, and that's fine. That's how the world is now. It's not just a supermarket where you go to the one place and buy everything there. It's where we are bit more selective on with a bit more, I suppose. Yeah, discerning about what we want.

Caroline:   40:22
I look and I see it without, Just as Parker Service's I have had over the last two years, the amount of people coming to me you should offer this is your service. So you should run. Your service is like this, or you know you should do it this time. I'm like, Yeah, but then it wouldn't be when it is for the people that I know that need our help in that particular way. So I've lost a lot of opportunity to sell to a lot of people. But I also know that the people that I do help other people, that I want to make a difference foreign. You've mentioned that you know, it's about making a difference on I think when you're trying to be true broad, you're not making a difference.

Dan:   40:55
And are you happy being brought as well? I'd rather I can't be nice to be wealthy and hopefully will be one day. But if I am, I'd rather know it because I've actually achieved something I believe in. And it's been the right thing for me, and that's more important.

Caroline:   41:05
Yeah, so we don't have much time. I know you need to get off in five minutes, but I have a few quick questions I wanna ask you as well. I want to know quickly. Offline investors online. You mentioned it briefly before we got on the recording you mentioned Why is it because I think it's nice to have the idea of having contact store, but you want to just go into a little bit of detail. You mentioned it before about having the online business rather than having a storefront.

Dan:   41:29
Yes, so I think that one thing it's really important for my kind of niche is that we are on line. I don't think it would work. Are they Okay, so people locally party want to have sugar free food, and I think they'll come around to that eventually on. I would imagine that there will be sugar free options in cafes and more not in the future. But when we, for instance, going to cafes locally. What we find is that Jerry people compare our product to normal brownies and say, Well, it tastes just as good or better, but it's more expensive. Why would I bother his dear Brownie? But when you're online, of course, you've been making those connections of people who know about this way of life. They know about the science and the problems with insulin. Instance. They know about eating sugar and what it does to your body, and so we are able to connect with people on mine that you just couldn't do in the past. So this or business and this I think the Internet has made a selective in this way online means that we shipped to the States. Now we also ship Thio some European countries on. We've also happy or from Pakistan from Singapore who have bean on business trips to the UK They've been following us for years, and then they're like she couldn't wait to get here to the gets to send stuff to the hotel and by certain day, And we've done all that because we are selling to people all over the world and hopefully it could become even more global. But it's that way. We are an international company in a very small way in Cambridge now, like I said 10 years ago, so that wouldn't have been like that. The next thing, of course, is you know we do this not from a rented shop space, which we really expensive. So it meant that we could access things pretty quickly. Everyone's got a phone in their pocket. So one of my competition soon is gonna be the best video that customers send in. Reviewing our products will be the winner off some brownies on. Then we'll get those to be shared on our website because it's about telling other people that's very hard to do in a shop setting. So I think I'm lying to you. So many more creative opportunities on it means you can connect in a global way with the local community, which you probably wouldn't find them. Just one local place. That said, there is actually a key to restaurant open in London a few weeks ago I was at the weekend on. This is something that was really good piece of advice I recommend to anybody. Generosity always pays back with interest. It's no, you should never be generous because you're looking at what comes back. But I honestly believe if all of us were more generous with our time with our energy, with our talents, the world would be a better place on. So I said to them, Can I come down, Please? Can I film? Got some camera equipment kind of film your restaurant? Can I then edit it together is like a little ad for you and you and you can then talk to Cameron. You can use it on, I said. You know, I just do it because I believe your restaurant is what we need on dhe. I don't know if anything's gonna come from that, but I feel good doing it. And I know that it's good for the cuter community, so I'll do that. If we all did that, I think it will be better

Caroline:   44:12
off. You know, I'm a believer in that, So I vouch for that as well. How many hours a week do you spend in your business at the moment?

Dan:   44:20
Okay, Um, well, okay, so I worked Monday Tuesday from kind of 10 after the kids to nurse him or no through to about six. And then after that bedtime, probably until about midnight. So I do long, long days. I then worked probably another five hours the other two days around, teaching like all day, Friday into the evening on one day, the weekend on. I do a lot. I will really work hard at it now. In some ways, I could make efficiencies as time goes on and not have to put the hours in but still be is as effective. But at the moment, I must admit, I'm trying to get the foundations to such in it. Then that we can build on this And so I said to my wife the day she thinks a real geek. But I said, I just loved doing this. This isn't work, Churchill said. When you find a job you love, you'll never work again. And I honestly feel that way. There are parts of it I'm not as good at. So I'm not gonna do in the books. I'm not gonna You know, I'm dyslexic, So I certainly find it challenging with email writing and stuff. And maybe I'm insecure about these things as well. But I find that you could make a timetable. You can get the jobs done on all the other stuff, like editing the podcast, creating new brownie flavors, work in the kitchen to develop new flavor ideas and idle the photography as well. So I loved in the photography. It's real creative outlet, so

Caroline:   45:37
very good at it. Thank

Dan:   45:38
you. So in a way, I feel like you know, my hobbies. Airil tied into this, which is why it's fun. I really do enjoy it,

Caroline:   45:43
and you recently signed up for and just ask pocket six s. So if that's just being in the last couple of days, something why is it that you signed up like what was the reason? What do you want to get out of? Just ask Parker, because you are just the two of you working. So what are you trying to do by using our service is

Dan:   46:01
yes. So now I think I need lucky saying before about the manager role from the technician. I need to actually think about my time on dhe. I think this is the usual thing. So in all honesty, I'm not an arrogant way. I think I pretty much learned anything to do with this business if I put the time into it. I don't think you know, I think I've got the ability. But the thing is, do you have the time? And is it really the most effective way? It doesn't make sense to me to come. An expert on all the editing programs in the software, on also the person baking and also the person posting out and the person writing emails. And I just thought, You know what? We need to start getting clever and having a smart business. Not for long, hard business. And so the great thing about your service I spoke to for instance, a marketing agency we're gonna charge over 2000 month with no guarantee of what I get back from that. I just thought, What the heck, This is mad. You know, I don't have that money to spend. And if I did, I'd want to know what I'm getting returned. It seems like a lot of money being put in for experimentation purposes for their benefit. Where's your company? I like the fact that it's broken down to task. You can think yourself right. I I I, for instance, break up my day with Productivity Planet. So I know in time sections what I'm gonna do in each time section, and it's part of my sort of discipline to organize myself on. I thought It's the same way your business works. I can think to myself, right, I've got a list of tasks. Let's get these done, and then I can take them off and at the same time in that time, like I'm doing other things and I think it's that kind of collaboration. Now, one day I imagine that we're gonna be in a situation where we could have staff doing those things in house But if I can then learn those things from your experts and they are experts in those particular fields, then it means I can also help train my team in the future. And I'm growing a business. So you know, you can think about business in two ways. You think about it in what you're selling day today, what your product is and what your brand is. But also, what is the actual business structure building? That's gonna be something durable in the future? Or somebody you could build up to sell if you wanted to. Andi. That's the next station with the managerial part off building a team. And that's why I need the help from just arse Parker.

Caroline:   47:58
No, I'm gonna make sense, and I don't know if I explained it to, but once you start getting your team on board, then you get them to come into the back end and then bacon start arranging the tests and learning as well. So rather than you having to train them, how they can learn from our system, how to do it and then yet we're not there for you forever. That's not what we're trying to be. A We're trying to be the people that help you through that stepping stone of that first stage. So we will help you in any way that we can do that for sure.

Dan:   48:24
Looking forward to it. Really?

Caroline:   48:26
Yeah. So I know you need to get off. I know you have things to do. You're a very busy man. But you are extremely interesting to talk to Donald Love to get you back on in 3 to 6 months when she sat running your podcasts and letting you let me know where you're going with it. Because I think that building loyalty, building a community I think you can teach us a lot more about that. Especially once you running

Dan:   48:48
by. Then you'll have to talk to my agent, darling. I'm far too busy. I'll be drifting around the world. Of course. Come on. Thank you. It's a real honor for me to be on because I listen to this religiously undone G. By the way, one of the reviews an apple and go on there and write and review. Please, guys, because it's amazing.

Caroline:   49:04
Fantastic. Done. Thank you so much for your time. And thank you everyone for listening until next week. Keep smiling. Sign up for free for the shop. If I proved marketing course at 1000 sales and beyond dot com, and get our show notes at just as parker dot com forward slash podcast based listening to the winning workshop of five podcasts.