S3E9: ‘If You’re Looking For Success, You’re in the Right Place’ (Brady Sallee, Head Women’s Basketball Coach at Ball State)

Brady Sallee became the head women’s basketball coach at Ball State University in 2012. Since then, he has established a culture of excellence for the Cardinals, a culture that is rooted in fundamentals and teamwork. For years now, Brady has broken records in Ball State Athletics. He is the only head coach to take his team to nine postseason tournaments, and with 237 victories, he is the winningest basketball coach in Ball State University.   

In this episode, Brady shares how his recruiting skills helped him to advance in his career and how coming to Ball State represented an excellent opportunity to compete at the next level. He also shares some of his favorite Cardinal victories and how he began his tradition of treating players to ice cream after every win. 

Later in the conversation, Brady shares how his “Seven Pillars” helped him to build a strong program at Ball State. And he reveals how his family’s new business venture in The Village, Everbowl, has strengthened their ties to the Muncie community. 

If you enjoy this episode, please leave a review to support the show. 

Transcript

[GEOFF MEARNS]:

Hello, I'm Geoff Mearns, and I have the good fortune to serve as the president here at Ball State University. On today's episode of my podcast, I'll be having a conversation with Brady Sallee, who is the head coach of our women's basketball team since 2012. Since arriving here at Ball State, Brady has established a culture of excellence for our Cardinals, a culture that is rooted in fundamentals and teamwork.

Just this March, the women's basketball team concluded another very successful season with a 28-6 overall record and a record of 16-2 in the Mid-American conference. Both results are program records. Brady is the only head coach to take the Cardinals to nine postseason tournaments, and with 237 victories, here, he is the winningest basketball coach in Ball State history.

In this episode, I'll talk to Brady about why he decided to continue his coaching career here at Ball State, and I'll ask him to explain his seven principles. I'm also going to ask Brady about his own days as a collegiate athlete, and about his plans to balance a new business venture with his dual roles as coach and father to three children he shares with his wife, Mandy.

But first, Brady, I want to commend you on another exceptional season. Welcome to my podcast. Brady, congratulations and thank you for joining me today.

[BRADY SALLEE]

Yeah, I was excited to get the phone call about coming here. I've listened to just about all of them, and to just be asked to come on here and share a little bit of what makes me tick. I'm excited for the afternoon, for sure.

[GEOFF MEARNS]

Good. Well, I look forward to it. And I know folks who are listening are interested to hear more about you and a little bit about your coaching history and philosophy. But before we get to that, I want to begin where I do with, really all of my guests, which is tell me about where you were born and raised and went to school.

[BRADY SALLEE]

Well, you know, I'm going to whisper this because, you know, coaching at a school in Indiana. You know, if you say that Kentucky word a little bit too loud, some people get, all, all sorts of ways, but....

[GEOFF MEARNS]

Do they play basketball in Kentucky?

[BRADY SALLEE]

A little bit. You know, and here's what's interesting: So I was born and raised in Lexington, Kentucky, 18 years before I went to college. And so, you know, now I call myself a visitor. But you know how it is when you drive home, no matter where home is. There's always that feeling: you know, where home is, right? And, so, that's a place that's awful dear to me. And, you know, as most in that city, you grow up bleeding blue. And we were fortunate. My grandparents had tickets, season tickets, to football and men's basketball all the way back to the Adolph Rupp days. And so, you know, we were spoiled. Didn't know any better, but, you know, we were able to go to all those games and see all those great teams. And, you know, it was funny when, when I then went to school in Northern Kentucky at Thomas Moore College, you had a smattering of Hoosier down there. Some Indiana guys. And my roommate was actually from Indiana. And so we would have this debate about where real basketball is always played. You know, Indiana clearly, has that claim to fame. And, you know, Kentucky still to this day has a true Sweet 16. There's no classes. There's none of that. So that was kind of the back and forth. And I, you know, hopefully not too many of my family or people are listening to this, but, I would admit Indiana does it just a little bit better.

It's different in this state, but, yeah. Lexington, Kentucky boy, born and bred. I don't know if you can tell by my accent still, but, uh....

[GEOFF MEARNS]

Just a little bit. I can tell you’re not from Boston.

[BRADY SALLEE]

That's for sure.

[GEOFF MEARNS]

So you built your career around basketball, and we'll certainly talk about it, but it really was another sport, baseball, that was really your focus when you were young. So kind of two related questions. First, what position did you play in? And second, how did your passion for baseball as a young kid really influence where you decided to go to college?

[BRADY SALLEE]

Yeah, it's such a weird story how I became a basketball coach. It's, you couldn't script it in a movie and people, they'd say, well, that never happens. So, when I was in high school, this will shock everyone, but there wasn't much of a market for a slow point guard—

[GEOFF MEARNS]

That's true. 

[BRADY SALLEE]

Yeah, you know, as smart as I was and as great as I thought I was and probably still am (laughs), there wasn't much of a market for that coming out of high school. Our baseball team ended up winning the state championship my senior year. I was a pitcher. And, I like to say that I was a pitcher because I chose to be. But I think my bat forced me to be a pitcher, maybe ... 

[GEOFF MEARNS]

[laughs] ... wanted to play.

[BRADY SALLEE]

Looking back now, I'm like, yeah, probably made a good decision, you know? But, and I think through the course of that senior year, where we were on such a great run and it culminated in a state championship—the first one in school history, by the way—we're still proud of that and we still keep in touch. I know exactly where that ring is in my office. The whole thing. I think the momentum of that, a lot of us went on to play college ball. And, you know, I look back on it now and I was I was so blessed with the coach I had in baseball. Coach Chandler.

[GEOFF MEARNS]

Your high school coach.

[BRADY SALLEE]

My high school coach, he was a former pro. He had worked through the pro systems, and I didn't realize it then, but now looking back on it, I was the kid that wouldn't leave his side. So when I wasn't on the bump, I was on a bucket next to him. I was always in his van whenever we traveled to games. And he was the kind of coach that talked. And it wasn't always baseball. I just know now that the imprint he left on me ... because I wasn't the number one guy. We had some guys that, I mean, pros were there watching. You don't win a state championship without some of those guys, you know? SEC teams are there watching all these guys. And I was a NAIA guy. But, I think the part that makes me feel good about what he did for me was I think he valued my part on the team, even though I wasn't throwing 95, even though I wasn't, you know, that guy, there was a place for me. And it was an important part of what we did. And I truly believe that. And it's made a difference in the way I've coached all these years. 

So, you know, you take that momentum and I had an opportunity, and this is how basketball and baseball intertwines a little bit. So, a guy that grew up in Lexington, that was a heck of a basketball player, my dad had coached a little bit, and had actually hired later on as a high school kid, he had gone and played basketball at Thomas More. And so in my head, I'm like, I want to take a look at Thomas More and, you know, see what it's all about. Went up there. Again, I followed a coach. I liked the coach. I liked what he was about. And that's how I ended up at Thomas More. And, you know, I've said this to a lot of people, if I would have gone down the path and gone to the University of Kentucky, like a lot of my friends do, there's no telling where I'd be. That would have been too big, too many distractions. You know, to be able to go to a small NAIA school, a faith-based college, it was good for me. You know, and I use that story to tell people about fit and how important it is. And whether it's a university like we get to work at now or whether it's a small one, I think being able to find that fit and staying true to who you are and understanding how you can be successful, I think is such a big key in this whole thing that that we do now.

[GEOFF MEARNS]

And so while you were at Thomas More, you were playing baseball. But you also served as the student assistant with the women's basketball team. Is that one of the next steps in the journey that brought you here?

[BRADY SALLEE]

Yeah. Again, you look at all these stepping stones and you think, how did they even happen? How did they come together? But, so when I got done with my baseball career, I had three classes left to graduate. My AD was also the baseball coach. So he said, “Hey, if you help out the women's team, we’ll pay for those three classes. We'll get you out of here. And it'll be good for you, it’ll be good for them.” So, you know, I thought, well, I'll go sweep the floors. I'll pull the balls out. You know, wave the towel and, you know, and just kind of do whatever they need me to do. Well, you know, luckily, the head coach sent me out recruiting.

She had me working on scouting reports. I was on the floor and, you know, during my time as a as a player, as a baseball player, I was like, a lot of the guys we use right now as a practice player. They didn't have very many girls on the team, so they needed practice players. So it was all the baseball guys went and practiced with them at night and just to run, just to get up and down and play.

And so I, you know, I got to know the coach and it was a real easy transition. And so, through going out and recruiting and doing all those kind of things, I started meet a lot of Division I coaches and a lot of people that became mentors for me down the road and ended up working for one that to this day I still talk to quite often. But it's right place, right time.

Again, the thing that I was blessed with was a set of parents that instilled this in me, whatever I was going to do, I was going to do it as hard and as tough—

[GEOFF MEARNS]

110 percent.

[BRADY SALLEE]

And, you know, in my silly mind, I thought, I'm going out, I'm the best recruiter out here. You know, some NAIA guy didn't know what he was doing. But we did end up with that class that I helped get there. We beat a Division I school to get a kid to come play NAIA ball, and she ended up being one of the top five scorers of all time at Thomas More. So it was in me early, I guess. 

[GEOFF MEARNS]

Yeah. So I want to talk a little bit about that aspect of the job, as recruiting. So my understanding is after you left Thomas More, you were the recruiting coordinator at Idaho State. Then two years later, came back to the Midwest, you were the recruiting coordinator at Kent State. And throughout your career, recruiting efforts have been a key part of the success of your program. Why don't you tell us what makes some coaches, whether head coaches or assistant coaches, what make them better at recruiting those athletes?

[BRADY SALLEE]

Well, some would say that, my initials match up perfectly with my ability to recruit: B.S. [Mearns laughs]. But no, really, I think you have to have an ability to connect. Clearly. But I think being able to listen is one of the most important things I do. And I think that's where some people get lost. They think recruiting is about slick talk and, you know, all the words and all the stuff and everything that way. And I've always been one, and I learned it early, that the more you listen, the better you can respond. And you can make that connection.

[GEOFF MEARNS]

Because you're learning what's of interest or concern to them as opposed to what you want to tell them. 

[BRADY SALLEE]

100 percent, yeah. And, you know, I think we all see it, right? Some people you talk to, they're so busy thinking about the next thing they're going to say, they never hear the importance of whoever you're trying to recruit or whoever you're trying to work with is about. And so that was the part I think, I was never afraid to be on the phone for an hour with the kid.

I can remember one of my first recruits at Idaho State. I went in there and, didn't know what I was doing, right? But I knew how to work hard. Again, I my parents bless me with that, thank goodness. But, we recruited a young lady that ended up being the all-time leading rebounder at Idaho State and was a heck of a player.

And, I was always somebody that was going to try to get to the player and everybody around them.

[GEOFF MEARNS]

Yeah. So let me ask you about that. I've heard some coaches say you got to make a connection with the player, but you also need to connect—you recruit the family or as you say, family and friends. Is that a key part?

[BRADY SALLEE]

No, it's 100%. You have to get all those people to trust who you are and what you're about. Because they're sending their daughter sometimes, you know, across the ocean to play for you. And so I think that trust factor is a big part of it. But, you know, this one in particular player, she had had this longtime boyfriend, and he was nervous about her leaving home. And, you know, going to college, and I became good friends with him. And he trusted me to the point that I was going to look out for his interest and her interest while she was on campus. And, I think they broke up about a week into her being at Idaho State, but—

[GEOFF MEARNS]

So didn't fulfill that promise, right? [chuckles]

[BRADY SALLEE]

You know, I always say God's plan, right? But I think we signed nine kids that first year. And the guy that I ended up working for at Kent State, I can remember the conversation. I can almost picture the gym of where we're sitting when I was at Thomas More, and I'd met him out on the road recruiting. And I remember him telling me, “Listen, if you want to be a head coach one day, you better butter your bread with recruiting because that's how you're going to move up. That's what you're going to do, to become what you want to do.” He said, “verybody can coach at this level, the X's and O's, everybody has ‘em. But your ability to get players is going to be everything in your career.” And I took that to heart and it was something I tried to do. And I had some great bosses along the way that allowed me to do it and saw the talent, I guess. And we put together some pretty good classes in those years.

[GEOFF MEARNS]

Yeah. So, you go from Kent State to be an assistant coach at East Carolina. And then you became the head coach at ... I'm sorry. And then at Eastern Illinois...

[BRADY SALLEE]

A lot of easts in there ... 

[GEOFF MEARNS]

Sorry. So you're moving around a little bit. So your first head coaching job is at Eastern Illinois. Tell me what that was like: You get the call, you get the opportunity. You hang up that phone, you're excited and, a little bit nervous, too. What were you feeling?

[BRADY SALLEE]

You know, I look back on that now, and, you know, I was only married probably two years at that time. We had, jeez, when I left Kent State and went to East Carolina, we had an eight month old. So when we left East Carolina and moved to Eastern Illinois, we were expecting with our second daughter and, of course, we had, you know, close to a three year old that we're ... you know, so all that family stuff, that was new to me, you know, in taking jobs and that kind of thing.

But here's, again, for, you know, anybody that's listening to this, that is, you know, embarking on a career and they're trying to map it out and all this kind of stuff. This is the craziness with how I got here. So I didn't know it when I applied for the Eastern Illinois job, okay? But he AD at the time there was an East Carolina grad, had ran track at East Carolina. I had no idea. Now here's how it gets even better. When I sent my stuff in, because of the connection between East Carolina and him, he put it to the side. He goes, I can't do that, everybody will think there was an agenda, so I can't hire this guy. And so, you know, references and different people are calling in and saying, hey, you need to take a look at this, this guy. And so literally, he had to bring five people in and I wasn't on his radar because of the connection—

[GEOFF MEARNS]

So, he just added you to fill out the five?

[BRADY SALLEE]

Yeah, I'm going to bring this guy in as the fifth. Everybody says good things about him. We're going to bring him in and at least we'll talk about East Carolina. And literally I won the job on the interview. I went in and sold myself and the whole deal and I changed his mind, the committee's mind and, you know, I guess some of the rest is history.

[GEOFF MEARNS]

Yeah. We're all just looking for that opportunity ... 

[BRADY SALLEE]

Absolutely.

[GEOFF MEARNS]

...just put me into the game.

[BRADY SALLEE]

And that’s the part, you know, I think for anybody ... man, like jump in the pool and, you know, don't be afraid of, don't already worry about the outcome. Like jump in, swim as fast and as hard, and then if it's meant for you, it'll happen. And I truly believe that. And I'm a walking testimony to.

[GEOFF MEARNS]

Yeah. Students often ask me, so what's the secret? And one of the things I say, it's very simple. When you're given an opportunity, just yes.

[BRADY SALLEE]

That's right.

[GEOFF MEARNS]

And then go to work. So you're at Eastern Illinois for about eight years, 2004 to 2012, and then you get an opportunity to come to Ball State. You said in interviews that that offer to coach at Ball State was another excellent opportunity because you were going to be able to coach and have your teams compete at the next level. What did that mean? What did that mean, and what did that mean to you?

[BRADY SALLEE]

Well, I think everybody has to understand what the Mid-American Conference means to me. So, I spent seven years at Kent State as an assistant, and we had some great success there. Now we don't think real highly of Kent State. You know, that's how it shifts ... 

[GEOFF MEARNS]

Wonder how that works?

[BRADY SALLEE]

Yeah, that's right. But so, for me, being able to be a head coach in the MAC was like, big time.

 Holy cow. Like, are you kidding me? Because I, you know ... again, my mentor, Bob Lindsey, all-time winningest men's or women's basketball coach in MAC history. And so the love I have for this league is maybe just a little bit different because of my experience at Kent State working for him. So, the other part of it is, in that same hiring cycle, I had interviewed at Bowling Green, and luckily for me, they chose a sitting assistant. Kurt Miller had left that staff and went to IU, they chose the sitting assistant and didn't hire me. And again, you talk about thank God for unanswered prayers. Garth Brooks had it right when he wrote that song. And I didn't ... this job had been open for a long time. I didn't send my stuff in. I just thought, you know, it's going to come and go. They didn't have an AD at the time during this cycle, so I didn't give it a whole lot of thought. And, I'll never forget, I was out mowing my grass and my daughter Taryn, who's now a sophomore here, she comes flying across the yard, blond hair flowing. And I had taught both of my daughters, “Listen, when daddy's phone rings, this could be a recruit, you get it to me.” 

[GEOFF MEARNS]

(laughs) Well-trained.

[BRADY SALLEE]

And here she comes, flying across there, holding my phone out, right? Well, it was the senior women's administrator here at Ball State, talking about this job. And so, when I said it's a chance at the next level, you know, Eastern Illinois in the OVC. Great school. Loved our time there, love the community. Still have some great friends there. It's a different level. You know, you really don't honestly have the chance to compete with anybody and everybody just because of the limitations. It's nobody's fault. It's just the way the Division I tier sets up a little bit. I felt like here, with the resources in place, you look at our arena, which is second to none. Our campus ... oh my gosh. Like, you know, the wow factors that we could put in front of families and recruits, I thought gave us a real ability to go compete against anybody, anytime, anywhere. And it's always been my mentality that way since I've gotten here.

[GEOFF MEARNS]

Yeah. And you've, during your time here, you've demonstrated that you can compete against anybody, anywhere. I mean, I looked up a little bit, you've had a number of victories, a lot of victories in the MAC, but you've also, your team has beat some Power 5 schools. Like 2017, you beat Purdue. You've beat Vanderbilt, Iowa, Minnesota. And just this past year, back to back, beat Pitt and Georgia. And I watched those games because, as you may know, around that period of time I was holed up there in Bracken House, recovering—  

[BRADY SALLEE]

A little laid up ... you would have watched anyway ... 

[GEOFF MEARNS]

I would have been watching anyway.

[BRADY SALLEE]

But you were, you were more focused.

[GEOFF MEARNS]

I was more focused. And it was something that brightened my day in the early stages of my recovery. So what are the games that you, you know, that you talk to recruits about or when you're sitting with your best friend or your wife, you're saying, that was a special win?

[BRADY SALLEE]

Yeah, man. Jeez, there's so many of them. When you've been doing it a long as long as I have. But that Purdue win was a lot of fun. It was at their place. As you know, their student section can get a little spicy. yeah.

[GEOFF MEARNS]

Yeah. Using some words that we're not going to use on the podcast. 

[BRADY SALLEE]

Yeah. And for some reason, I draw the ire of a lot of opposing fans. I can't imagine why.

[GEOFF MEARNS]

Because you're occasionally talking to the referees.

[BRADY SALLEE]

Occasionally. I call that motivating. Yeah, I'm trying to motivate them.

[GEOFF MEARNS]

When I do it, I usually just I describe it as constructive suggestions as to how they could do better. I let you do the coaching. I'm trying to coach up the refs.

[BRADY SALLEE]

Believe me, I remind a lot of officials that that guy over there, giving you the business, is the president.

[GEOFF MEARNS]

So don't do that anymore.

[BRADY SALLEE]

Yeah, he's always right.

[GEOFF MEARNS]

I did call one. I did call one foul— 

[BRADY SALLEE]

You did. You had the travel. 

[GEOFF MEARNS]

Yeah, I got the travel...

[BRADY SALLEE]

It was the travel call or the out of bounds, I can't remember. It was one of those. But yeah, that Purdue win was fun. It was special. You know that locker room afterwards, I still remember it. It was a blast. But, you know, the special wins come with special teams. Special players. That's why it's neat, you know, just beating another team is what it is. It's what you're supposed to do. But when you've got those kids, and, you know, ten years down the road that win is still going to be special to them. You know that experience has just changed them a little bit.

And that's the part that, you know I look at them and I smile and I take a lot of pride in because I know like, you know, this is going to pay off for you in ways that you don't even know right now. And that's the really cool thing—

[GEOFF MEARNS]

Because it's going to show you it's proof that you can exceed your own expectations.

[BRADY SALLEE]

Do whatever you need to do and adversity is nothing more than a challenge. And that's the part that we try to instill in our young ladies. And that's my favorite part of what I get to do, is seeing it happen and knowing ten years down the road that they're going to drop me a note and say, that's what you were talking about ... that's what this was about. And that's the really neat part. And I've, again, been doing this long enough now that I've been able to see it play out in kids’ lives. And that's the great thing of coaching.

[GEOFF MEARNS]

And there's certainly a lot of challenges for college sports. We probably don't have time to talk about the whole transfer portal and— 

[BRADY SALLEE]

That’s a whole other podcast, right? 

[GEOFF MEARNS]

But that’s why college sports is so valuable, because it's not just the competition over that period of time. You know, that 94 feet. It's what it does for our student athletes as people and leaders after they graduate. So let me ask you a little, maybe a little bit of an inside basketball. So you've had, again, little research ... Gail Werner helped me do a little research. You've had nine players score, in their careers, score 1000 points or more. But also, as I've watched your team, it's also clear that you focus on defense. is one side of the ball more important than the other?

[BRADY SALLEE]

Well, if you had a lie detector test here, I would probably have to tell you that I enjoy the game planning and setting the defense up. More than the offense. But I think in today's game, you have to score points to win in this league. You have to score points to win. You have to put a big number up.

[GEOFF MEARNS]

But as you showed this year, you're scoring more points because of the defense you’re playing, because of the aggressive defense you’re playing ... 

[BRADY SALLEE]

And that's where buy-in becomes so important. You can be the best coach in the world and you can have the best playing in the world, but if the kids won't buy into it, it's not going to play out the way it needs to. And so this team bought into what the defense was going to do for our offense.

And, you know, you take an Ally Becki and you take a Marie Kiefer. And you look at a lot of those kids and how they had to change in order to play the way that we played. And they did it. And without that buy in, we don't win 28. There's no doubt about it.

[GEOFF MEARNS]

Alex Richard is pretty tough...

[BRADY SALLEE]

Boy, she's a tough one. And, you know, all that coming together, again, it's hard to win 28 games. It is ... nobody could quite understand the grind of our season. You know, it's over two semesters. It literally starts in August and we run through mid-March. And there's very few downtimes, in that stretch. But the buy-in to, again, to play a full court pressing system, and up and down, you know, high octane, you got to practice that way too, right?

[GEOFF MEARNS]

Well, and I also think one of the secrets of your success is rewarding your players with ice cream after a win. That's the best incentive I know about ... 

[BRADY SALLEE]

So that's a great story. That's a fun story to tell how that all started. I don't know if we have time for it right now, but this is, I believe, I truly believe this ... I think we were the first to make it a tradition. And I think you've seen it spread. 

[GEOFF MEARNS]

Sure.

[BRADY SALLEE]

Not only across women's basketball, but a lot of different sports. But our all-time leading scorer here, Nathalie Fontaine, it was her. It was her thing. She loved ice cream. She was here from Sweden. She loved American food. She's a great player. And we had a big win, and I can't remember ... it was somewhere in the league. It was a great win on the road. It might have been Bowling Green. I cannot remember for the life of me, but she came to the front of the bus and she goes, “Coach, we played really well. You know, you think we should stop for ice cream?” Like heck yeah. Like, you know, whatever you want, Nat... you're scoring 25 a night and whatever you need, we can do. So we did it.

So we got on a roll. We start winning all these games. Win again on the road. She looks at me in locker room. She goes, “What do you think?” I said, “Tradition now.”

[GEOFF MEARNS]

Right.

[BRADY SALLEE]

And we've never stopped. So, it's a lot of fun. The interesting part is our kids got to a point this year where they're like, “Oh my gosh, again?” I'm like, we are never going to take that for granted. So enjoy it. Eat that ice cream and like it.

[GEOFF MEARNS]

It's good to know that even when they're competing at this level in college, it's a little like Little League or—

[BRADY SALLEE]

A little bit, yeah.

[GEOFF MEARNS]

—or like a middle school basketball ... So speaking about success, and I mentioned this in the introduction, you often emphasize your seven pillars. Players wear it on T shirts in practice. The words are in your locker room. What is the nature of those seven pillars? How have they become instrumental to the culture that you want to build every year? The identity you built for the team, and the success?

[BRADY SALLEE]

Yeah, so, for us, these are everything. So, committed. Hardworking. Accountable. Prideful. Tough. Invested. Selfless. Those are the seven. When I came here, it's what we built this on. It was something, you know, when I first became a head coach, some things come, some things go. You figure out what's important to you. What you think is what you’re going to want to hang your hat on, so to speak, and this is what I kind of got it boiled down to. 

When I came here, I was very to the point with here's what we're going to be about. We're going to recruit with those things in mind. We're going to coach with those things in mind. Every decision we make in our program ultimately comes back to those seven things. Sometimes one of them, sometimes all of, but I never, ever make a decision without thinking through in my head, how does it affect those things?

And so, you know, and I mentioned buy-in earlier, you know, all those seven things, just in and of themselves, it's not necessarily the secret sauce. You’ve got to be able to have that foundation. You've got to have the buy-in, to those things. And I think it's one of the reasons, hopefully if you asked people what our program was like or what it was about, hopefully they would talk about, team. I hope they would talk about how we have balanced scoring.

We, you know, we definitely have some kids that are a little bit more the face of the program year in and year out, whatever. But when you look at us play, we're not just trying to get one player a shot. We're trying to really play a team game and it's the way we go about it.

But, I wanted in front of all those kids and you know, what's hanging up in the locker room or hanging up in our offices, what's on a t shirt, is there are only words. But you have to be about it. And it starts with me. And so culture is really, really important to us. You know, I think that vision for where you want your program to go, where you want your career to go, where you want your college education to go, whatever it may be.

I think having that vision, finding out what's important to you, where your passions are and man, really just living it. I think is kind of that secret sauce like you mentioned.

[GEOFF MEARNS]

It's why, at the institution, we often talk about our values because values drive character and character drives culture and culture drives performance. And so, speaking of values, one of the things that I know you're proud of is how your players, year in and year out, excel in the classroom. And I understand that just this month, seven of your current players who had that great season, were on the MAC’s All-Academic team—made that All-Academic team. How do you also emphasize the importance of making that commitment in the classroom, and why it's important to the program and to their competitive success?

[BRADY SALLEE]

Well, simply put, I don't think you can separate success. I don't think you can separate, uh, trying to do things the right way and doing well. You're either about that life or you're not. I don't think there's gray area. I don't think in the gray. And so, for me and I explain this in recruiting to our players, my staff understands it, they live it.

You know, you're either about success, and it covers everything you do. if you're going to do it, let's go hard. It’s in the classroom. It's socially, it's you know, it's everywhere. And so the people that, you know, just want to be a great ball player and slack off in school, I don't think they're made for this program. It's a bad fit. We mentioned fit earlier.

[GEOFF MEARNS]

You're either disciplined or you're not.

[BRADY SALLEE]

Yeah. It's everything you do. And so, I want players that are wired that way. 

[GEOFF MEARNS]

Right. 

[BRADY SALLEE]

I want them to be, I want them to be maniacal about succeeding. And we really, you know, we talk about it in recruiting, and I tell them, I'm like, if you're looking for happy, I'm not your guy. If you're looking for success, you're in the right place. And I don't always have time to hit the nail on the head with 15 players and happy. But I can help you be successful. And I believe if you're chasing success, happy will come. Happy will find you.

[GEOFF MEARNS]

Satisfaction. Fulfillment.

[BRADY SALLEE]

You got it. 

[GEOFF MEARNS]

Happy is a kind of a thin word.

[BRADY SALLEE]

I think it muddies the water. I really do. I think, you know, a lot of kids nowadays get lost in happy. And unfortunately, I think some parents get lost in that part of it, too. And man, if we would focus a little bit more on success and, you know, it's okay to fail because it's going to lead to better things, it's going to teach lessons ... and man, happy just, I think, gets in the way sometimes.

[GEOFF MEARNS]

So, a more personal question now. Before I do, you know, that's why when I talked about the university's values, the first value in that list in our strategic plan is excellence, which we define as a commitment to excellence in everything we do. It's important for us to be excellent in the classroom, but we expect everyone on campus to make that commitment, because every one of those jobs is vital to the success of our mission.

[BRADY SALLEE]

Huge, huge ... 

[GEOFF MEARNS]

So you also have to balance that extraordinary time commitment with your commitment to your family. Tell us a little bit about your wife, Mandy, your three children. And I understand, very recently, you and Mandy opened a new business in the Village.

[BRADY SALLEE]

Yeah. So, got a lot going on. You know, and I'll tell you this, my wife is the true rock star, you know, and I'm so happy for her right now with what we're doing in the Village. This is her baby. And man, she is killing it. And for so long, she has supported me. And, you know, she raised a beautiful family. And, you know, she allowed me to really not have to think when I came home, she, you know, say we need this done. This done. I've got the rest of it. Boom, boom, boom. So I didn't have to, you know, I could keep focus where it needed to be. And I've learned through my career that, ultimately, that is the true sign of success for me. Even though I'm a coach and my paycheck is signed based on how many games I win, I get it. But man, when it's all said and done, that family and what you've done there is the ultimate, the ultimate barometer, I guess.

[GEOFF MEARNS]

Yeah that’s what we'll have on that last day.

[BRADY SALLEE]

Yeah. Amen. so I'm proud to say I've got, my oldest is in a couple weeks going to graduate from Ball State University.

[GEOFF MEARNS]

Congratulations.

[BRADY SALLEE]

Awful proud of her. And she has had a tremendous time here. The experience has changed her. And I'm so proud of the student she's been. But the way she's poured into the university too. She’s really been involved. And, you know, she started her freshman year during the Covid years. She sat in a dorm room and couldn't do what most do. And that was not an easy year for any of them. And I look back on that and thank my goodness, what those young men and young women had to do.

[GEOFF MEARNS]

Probably didn't have a high school graduation either.

[BRADY SALLEE]

No. She, they were able to walk, but no family was there. We had to sit in a car outside of the parking lot, and they drove through and waved. You know, and you think about that, and like I said, adversity. Yeah. It was no good. Yeah. But man, well, it changed her. For the better. I truly believe that. And so, we're awful proud of her, and then I've also ... her name's Avery, and then Taryn is a sophomore here. Psych major. She's wanting to get into the sports psych part of it, and she's actually, shadowing a guy down in—

[GEOFF MEARNS]

She's giving you some tips along the way? 

[BRADY SALLEE]

I need it, don’t I? But I think, you know, it warms my heart. Both of them, they really live and die Ball State women's basketball. They're invested as daughters. They want to see us do well because they know what it does to their dad when we don't. And then my little man is a sixth grader, in middle school, and, you know, he's a typical boy, he’s into every sport you can imagine and loves them all. So, we're blessed that way. And like you said, the wife and I just jumped into a franchise here in the Village called Everbowl.

[GEOFF MEARNS]

Yeah, you can put a plug in.

[BRADY SALLEE]

And I tell you, you know, for me, it's rewarding, to see this first 5 or 6 days of this business. I mean, literally Thursday we opened. And so, to put this in some perspective, the weather was awful. And we didn't know what it was going to look like Thursday night. We had people stand in line for two hours to come in, in the rain. It was cold. And I stood there just kind of front of the house, shaking hands and kissing babies, so to speak, and thanking people. And, you know, I saw some faces I recognize, I saw some I didn't, but they were excited for it. I think it ... it’s ... Muncie needed this, Ball State University needed, kind of what this is, and, it's a superfood, with the acai berry and everything that way. And so, we've had our first week has been through the roof, and I got to tell you just real quick, and I know, I don't want to talk forever about this, but ... so when we were going through this process, so at one point, we're on a Zoom call with the corporate in California, and they're kind of interviewing us. And one of the real estate guys that was in charge of finding places. He point blank said, you know, Muncie can't support this. This isn't a typical place for us. And I said, okay, you're either going to trust me that I know Muncie or you're not. And I'm telling you that we need this and they will support it. I know this place. And, so in our first week, the feedback we've gotten from corporate has been, yeah, you were right. 

[GEOFF MEARNS]

Good. 

[BRADY SALLEE]

So it's been, it's been great. My wife is absolutely killing it right now. And so, we're excited for Muncie. We're excited for Ball State. We're excited. I mean, what's going on in the Village right now and the expansion. Oh my gosh. Like, it's so exciting. It. And to be a small part of that? And that was one thing when we decided to do it. I mean, clearly we love this area and we love the university and we love everything about it. We saw a need and we're like, you know what? People are going to love this. And when you can put your passion behind something, I think that's an important ingredient, to being able to do something successful.

[GEOFF MEARNS]

Yeah, but please, congratulate Mandy on my behalf, but also, please tell her that, we're not going to turn you into a short order cook. You got a couple more things on your to-do list here before you spend more time behind the counter.

[BRADY SALLEE]

That’s the last thing anybody needs or anybody wants. So I've been, I've been the capital guy. And I've been her cheerleader when she comes home. It's an interesting time for us, for sure, because, I mean, I am knee deep in recruiting. She is knee deep in this, and we're literally passing in the night. But, you know, you're talking about, a marriage that has made me a better man. Boy, I tell you, that's an understatement.

[GEOFF MEARNS]

She's a strong woman.

[BRADY SALLEE]

Boy, you're not kidding.

[GEOFF MEARNS]

Good. And, so here's my last question. It's one that I ask all of my guests, and we talked about it a little bit along the way when you were talking about your seven pillars, and I was talking about our values, as you know, those enduring values are what define our culture, the university. And they're represented by the iconic statue of Beneficence on our campus.

So, so what, you know, and beneficence means, you know, doing good through service and philanthropy. You've been talking about as a coach and as a now a business owner. But why don't you share with us what does beneficence, what does doing good for other people? What does that mean to you?

[BRADY SALLEE]

Well, you know, the first thing I'll tell you is I think part of the reason this is such a good fit for me, is because of what this university stands on. And it’s the same way I run my program. It's the same things that, you know, I talk about, every day. But for me, I think I really go back to, not trying to tell everybody what they want to hear.

Not always trying to be a people pleaser. But trying to do what's right for them. And they may not even know it. And I think, you know, whether it's a student here, whether it's a community member, which, you know, by the way, like what this university has done in reach out, since your time, into our community, it's made it a better place.

And that was, I'm assuming, your goal, was quite simply, I want to make this the best place it can be. And it's worked. You know, but it's, you know, so many times, I think, you see, well, let me just do what they want me to do, and then they'll be happy and I'll go along my way.

But you don't impact that way. I think sometimes pushing somebody, sometimes putting them in adversity to make them better, whatever that may be. And then being there to support them through all that at the same time, I think to me, that's what I think of when, when you talk about beneficence. It's helping make people the best versions of themselves and, showing them how to do it, not doing it for them all the time.

I think, is what lasts. And so for me, that's, that's kind of what came to my heart when you ask that question, empowering people.

[GEOFF MEARNS]

Well, coach, thank you for joining me today. And congratulations again on another outstanding season and go Cards. 

[BRADY SALLEE]

I appreciate you. Thank you.

[GEOFF MEARNS]

Thank you.