CX Passport

The one with the simplicity of CX - Evas Bazirakakye E106

• Rick Denton • Season 2 • Episode 106

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🎤CX Passport’s first guest from Uganda(!) in “The one with the simplicity of CX” with Evas Bazirakakye, Customer Relationship Manager at Umeme🎧 What’s in the episode?...


😊Simplicity is attractive...especially in experience

👉The evolution of Customer Experience in Uganda

💡Every interaction should create a memory...an experience

📈Good experience = Good sales = Good business results

😲Shocked to hear what some customers might do in reaction to a bad experience

😍Elevating beyond customer experience to a social responsibility


Hosted by Rick Denton “I believe the best meals are served outside and require a passport”


💭“And I realized that if a business really focused on…ensuring customer focused, they're trying to provide a solution to a customer…what does the customer want? How can we better a customer, probably it would make more sales for their business and bring in more business” - Evas Bazirakakye


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Episode resources:

Evas’ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/evas-bazirakakye-kizza-a327a424/

Rick Denton:

You're listening to CX Passport, the show about creating great customer experiences with a dash of travel talk. Each episode we’ll talk with our guests about great CX, travel...and just like the best journeys, explore new directions we never anticipated. I'm your host Rick Denton. I believe the best meals are served outside and require a passport. Let's get going. Yay. It's always an exciting moment for me when I get to talk to someone from a country I've not yet had on CX passport. longtime listeners know that I want to get voices from countries that aren't as represented in the customer experience world. That's why today I'm so excited to talk with Evas Bazirakakye customer relationship manager of Umeme coming to us today from Kampala, Uganda. Passion for customer experience spans the globe. It manifests in different flavors and styles. What's great in Sao Paulo may annoy and Southampton may challenge in Seoul and may delight in San Francisco, or any mixture of reactions across the globe. What's also fascinating is how similar things can be whether you're in Kyoto, or Kampala. It's intriguing and inspiring to see how the customer matters, no matter where you are in this great globe. And that's true of Evas with her career journey into customer experience, Evas found why it matters. And how great CX creates great business results. Yes, real business results. Along with their own passion for the customer, something else caught my eye and II was Evas' profile, a focus on simplicity. We often spend a lot of time searching for the grand and spectacular win simple will be what wins? What to learn more about why simplicity centers eavis his approach? And yeah, when I get a chance to talk with someone from a new country for me, I absolutely want to learn more about what it's like to be there. We'll get into Uganda talk today, for sure. Evas. Welcome to CX passport.

Evas Bazirakakye:

Thank you, Rick. I'm so thrilled. And thank you for the opportunity. I'm so excited. How are you?

Rick Denton:

Well, I am doing well, because I get a chance to talk to you today. So I am just as excited. And maybe even more so as I get to talk with a new voice from a new place for me. And that's always great. So let's actually do that. Let's just start off with a really wide view for a second. Since you are my first guest from Uganda, I'd like to ask this question. Tell me about the overall focus on customer experience in Uganda How far along are companies they're in using CX As a differentiating factor?

Evas Bazirakakye:

I think three, Uganda, customer experience has really evolved probably now we can talk about that pre COVID and the post COVID. Because those are two scenarios that have really changed that customer experience in Uganda. So yeah, if I can talk about that, pre COVID, it was more of customer service, and probably can just break it down. Yeah, whereby you'd go to a shop or you want a service, and the service is offered. And that seat probably that that service provider will do it follow up, get to understand how you feel about the product has it served the purpose, a few of big brands, we really know, looking into the whole experience the whole journey. But we say that after that pandemic, most businesses have come to realize that it's not about offering a product to a customer, there is more to it. And then also because of competition, and then customer awareness. customers know where to go, they know where to get what they want. And then see most of Ugandans have now traveled, they have had all these experiences. So now their perception towards service towards experience has really, really evolved. So yes, I can say the pandemic also led to people getting to understand that you can have value for your money when you buy a product. And you can have this product anywhere, you know, at your convenience, and you can access it anywhere. So there's been a very big change. And I know most businesses have really gone into the digital world because of the pandemic and this has created very good experience to customers.

Rick Denton:

Well, I certainly like to hear that right. As someone that wants to see customer experience grow around the globe. It's good to hear that this evolution is taking place. It's a shame that it was triggered by that but so many companies advancements have been triggered by that, that I suppose that's one positive that we'll be able to look back on that period of history. And God willing, it is just a pity You're a bit of history that we will look back on it as let's talk about so we've got that wider view of Uganda and customer experience, let's talk about you. What about you and your role? How do you get into customer experience?

Evas Bazirakakye:

How do they get into that customer experience? I wouldn't say that. As I was growing, even at university, even after university, I have I used to even now, I'm a kind of person who always believes that every time you meet a person, there's an interaction, someone should at least have that memory you should have, they should get an experience from that interaction. And so when I joined the employment world, I joined one of the big banks in Uganda, and my work was really about yourselves. And I realized that every time I would have an interaction with a customer, I would really try to help them try to give them a solution. Sometimes I go on and find myself advising these customers, you know, and most times, I would, like keep my promise. That's what they always say, when I told the customer this, I always ensure that I follow through, offer them other products, probably they're not aware of. And this was so magical, you know, you're in the sales world. And you're not going out to look for sales, but you're just getting referrals and referrals. Yeah, to me, that was a win. And I realized that if a business really focused on that, you know, ensuring that all the stuff customer focused, they're trying to provide a solution to a customer that tried to find a what does the customer want? How can we better a customer, probably it would make more sales for their business and bring in more, you know, business. So

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Rick Denton:

I love that spot. And it's so much about what we talk about in the customer experience world. And that is, if you do better by your customers in the experience world, you will see business results. And you have a direct example of that, that when you were delighting your customers, not only did they add more products, they were Yes, telling their friends and family and you were receiving referrals because of that great experience. I think it's brilliant. And it's a direct example of how the business results are driven by customer experience.

Evas Bazirakakye:

And that's true, and also the fulfillment that I used to get every day when I interact with a customer and they are happy. For me that was a win. And that is the point when I discovered that I can really make it big in this whole customer experience world and can help businesses big and small. So that's where it all started.

Rick Denton:

I love it. And I know this is an audio podcast listeners, you would see me grinning from ear to ear because then each of us just brought in the idea of employee experience into this, that it was fulfilling, being able to deliver that that aspect of customer experience. And so Eva's now that you're in that world now that you're in the world of customer experience, you're now working out who may may, which I know a lot of my listeners may not know what that company is, but it covers 99% of the distribution of power in Uganda. So this is this is not just market domination, it's almost market completion. So if customers don't have options, why should a company care about customer experience?

Evas Bazirakakye:

Um, Rick, I must say that, if not true that customers will not have options the options are always there in the business world, everyone in the world options are there. And Phil may make it covers 97% of PA distribution. But that doesn't mean that to me has to fall this time it signs and ignore its customers because customers are too many. It's a very critical to the business to its bottom line to its performance. For example, if you don't care about customers, you know, we look at now customers ending up going into power theft stealing power because no one cares and that hits directly to the bottom line of the business. Okay. And then also customers have options we've seen so loud in other private production production plants coming up. So we then want competition to eat up all that we already have. So we have really ensured that the cost Walmart is key at maymay. In everything we do, because what customers can do in the event that we do not care for them has a really, really big impact. We've had the vandalism, these are the same people go out and destroy the network, you know? Huge Yeah. There's no way we can sell a timeshare. For our customers. It's very critical. We wake up every day to limit to ensure that we serve our customer, they are powered, you know, they're reliable and quality supply. So it's very critical.

Rick Denton:

The I shouldn't laugh, right, you're describing I think I laugh because it was just so shocking. You know, we think about business results, I don't think I'd ever really thought about, you know, how customer rage could manifest into something so strong, it but it's real, right? These, we don't have to hide away from the reality of stories, even if they're a bit darker. The idea that customer experience could be so poor, and someone's so reliant on power distribution, that when it's not there, it creates that kind of an impact. So that's a business result, it may not show up on a financial ledger, although repairing damage will certainly do. So. It's real, though. And it it absolutely is something that well, before this episode I hadn't thought about, but it's so vital.

Evas Bazirakakye:

So Rick, you see, with customer experience, you are ensuring that at least your customers can pay you when they are not, you know, grumbling when they're not complaining. And they're paying you because they have consumed your product or service. So it cuts across if your customers are to pay diligently, that means they're, they're happy about the service. And they find value for money. But you avoid scenarios whereby you have to look out for your customers pushing them to pay reminding them to pay, it's too much work. So with a good experience customer always have you on their mind that I need to pay the bills I need to know. So it's the experience that you're offering.

Rick Denton:

Even there's a that's a lot in there that is least not part of the conversation that I'm seeing in a lot of kind of my quote, traditional customer experience groups and that sort of thing. Because we do talk a lot about business growth. And we talk about that being what customer experience is about. You're talking about some of the fundamentals of just business, right, and it's still a business results. But if your customers aren't paying their bills, you aren't receiving revenue. And if they aren't paying their bills, because they have a poor experience with you. It doesn't matter that they have a competitor or not, you still want them to pay. And that is that sense. Insightful eavis. Absolutely. I'm glad you shared that

Evas Bazirakakye:

experience it cuts across regardless of having the whole market share or not. Customers will always wake up to an experience. And if you can't offer them an experience, trust me, there's always an alternative. There's always an opportunity.

Rick Denton:

Use I almost want to lay on the episode right there. But there's no way that I could end the episode without and we've got plenty more to talk about. I got a lot of things I want to ask you about. But I want to talk about travel for a second because I'm getting to talk with someone that I've mentioned it several times. I've never been to Uganda my only Africa travel has actually been Egypt and it was on a work trip. But I we did have some time to do a little bit of exploring. So there was fun and enjoyment there. But I've not been to Uganda. I'm really excited to hear about this aspect of your experience. What has your experience been like traveling in Uganda?

Evas Bazirakakye:

Wow, Rick, first of all, like you you're really missing out you should have Uganda on your bucket list of countries to be seriously, Uganda, very interesting. Tons of travel. It's a country in East Africa. Of course, in Africa. We have more than 56 tribes. You can imagine more than two to six train. incredible people, loving people, good food, you know, imagine the future six tribes. These all have different kinds of foods. You know, it's very interesting. Monitoring story. I hope you've heard of maltron story one of the tallest mountains in Africa. It's in Uganda. Been to Queen Elizabeth National Park. Very huge national park. Good for Safari is one of the best national parks you can have a safari in Africa, Murchison folds. You know, the list is endless streak. Uganda is beautiful, you know, so I just invite you come home.

Rick Denton:

I love having an invitation like that Eva's I actually just had his episode and released when you and I are recording but by the time your episode comes out, it should have come out. And a guest talked about their experience in Uganda and said it's the most the most beautiful oh gosh, and I can't remember whether it's sunrise or sunset, but I believe it's sunrise sunrise that he had ever seen

Evas Bazirakakye:

Hey, I'm telling you, and the people are so warm they asked for loving Rick managed to come to Uganda

Rick Denton:

Evas let's do a little change of pace here. Join me here in the first class lounge. We love travel we like if I were to go to Uganda, it's a long way. If you were to travel other places, it can be a long way. So it's nice to have a little break. Join me here in the first class lounge. Let's move quickly and have a little bit of fun here. What is a dream travel location from your past?

Evas Bazirakakye:

From my past, I would allow me to give you to listen to Yeah, the recent one was in Turkey that is Cappadocia. Nice. It was so good. Making good beautiful, you know, the hot air balloons that good the chimneys. The heritage is rich, it is that so I can go over and over again. And then I also love beaches and Zanzibar. I never thought about Zanzibar. Zanzibar is so beautiful, breathtaking. It's a place I can always go to anytime. So those are some of that to count. Memories. Okay,

Rick Denton:

I like that. I like both the turkey and the Zanzibar examples. I've not heard the ladder come up in the show before. So now you've given me another place that I need to go travel to and I can't wait to do it. Thinking about your future travels. What does a dream travel vacation you've not been to yet?

Evas Bazirakakye:

I haven't been to Bora Bora. And I would love to be there.

Rick Denton:

It sounds absolutely magical.

Evas Bazirakakye:

Yes, magical, then I would also love to travel to Italy. So those are two counties that I would really love to go to.

Rick Denton:

I like how you've got to have your dream travel locations, both the past and the future. That's you've got mais kind of spirit of wanting to go a lot of places. You mentioned the food of Uganda. What is a favorite thing of yours in general favorite thing of yours to eat?

Evas Bazirakakye:

Myself? It's grown up pest and Tim. Okay, yeah, that's some local food we have. I love it.

Rick Denton:

Right? I'll have to look that up and get a little sense of it. And see what your favorite food is. Now, on the other side events, what is the thing your parents forced you to eat? But you're hated as a kid?

Evas Bazirakakye:

Oh, my goodness. I can't say when I was growing up, I knew like it's at all. Okay. I'll always be forced to eat the eggs. Yeah.

Rick Denton:

Oh, I love this question. I just love hearing the tension in people's voices. Going back to travel, what is one travel item not including your phone? You will not leave home without? Oh, wow.

Evas Bazirakakye:

Only one be? Yeah, that will be my morning devotion book. I don't think I would leave it behind my devotion.

Rick Denton:

Evas when you talked earlier, we talked about the culture of companies being a key factor in the delivery of experience. And you even alluded to that in time, how you may? How that culture matters in delivery of customer experience? How do you help get companies to go? Let's just say go beyond using these words about customer experience, but actually doing something about customer experience?

Evas Bazirakakye:

Okay, that's a good question, Rick. First of all, I believe customer experience, it's just a culture that you can create. It's a mindset among us people, employees, and then businesses, usually I advise businesses to first understand their existence, why do they exist? And that's a big question, to finding your reasons for really even investing in customer experience. The fact that you know why you exist, then it will, at the end of the day, it will direct you to a customer. There is no shortcut to that. So I usually ask businesses to first understand why they exist. And then also look at their employees. And it's always something that the C suite executives should understand that employees come first, if the employee experience is not good, then the customer experience is not going to be good. Because experience will offer the experience if the employee so we have to grow that culture within our employees, invest in them, you know, empower them. So there is a lot that has to be done even before we go out to the customers and businesses should appreciate that. and look at customer experience not just being a cost center. But knowing that if we invest in customer experience, look at the employees who are delivering this service, the experience, sorry, then the impact is huge. Then also businesses, you know, it's something that I discuss with a friend and I said, you know, customer experience have gotten to a level whereby it's not just customer experience, businesses should take it a notch higher, as it should look, it they should take it to be a social responsibility that will rate you know what I'm operating in this business space. And this is what I have to do for my community, this is what I have to do for my customers, every time they walk, to me, this is the experience, so it becomes a responsibility. So those are some of the few things that if businesses looked at, then the whole customer experience, situation would be better and bigger without even forcing it out there. So those are some of the things and you know, just someone who said that, when you say customer experience, probably the best business strategy or something found be like, Ah, no, no, they always say that it's a creature or something. But we know that it's the fact. And then also, we know that, yeah, it's a fact. And we know that customer experience, influences decisions, you know, people's purchasing power eating it, basically. And this affects the profitability of the of any companies. So is there's too much to say about customer experiences that businesses should always embrace. And those are some of the things that I always focus on the culture, the employee, first the employee experience, and then you can push it out to the customers, but then also look at it as our responsibility. Any customer who walks your business, or who buys your product or service, they need that experience, they need to come back, we've had scenarios you go to a hotel, if the experience is good, you will go back. You will not even talk about that hotel, but you only talk about it and even discourage other people from talking about. Cool, yeah.

Rick Denton:

Yeah, you'll absolutely talk about Evas, there's so much that you said in there, that and certainly focus on the employee. And it reminds me of what I said in the introduction. And that is how we want to learn from the differences around the globe. And the differences are absolutely true around the globe. And certain things are just absolutely fundamental. When you say a phrase like, yeah, you your employees, are the ones delivering the customer experience and their experience matters and influence that. Absolutely, of course, you went beyond though and that idea of elevating beyond customer experience to a social responsibility that's deep. I really liked that that depth of almost corporate social responsibility and how that is tied into customer experience. Even though I had mentioned simplicity in the introduction, it did it caught me in your LinkedIn profile, something that you had called out. And I know that companies spend an inordinate amount of time trying to find this amazing solution. And when they do that, they tend to layer idea upon idea and upon idea and things start to get complex. Why do you think simplicity is a better way to create great customer experience?

Evas Bazirakakye:

Wow, that's a good one. When the simplicity is attractive, always attractive. Yeah. And yes, businesses are going out there getting solutions, which are very important. The solutions are good, they are perfect. But what kind of solution are you getting? If us to go online, you know, to buy a product or service? Or access a service? How easy is it for me to navigate your platform? That is simplicity? No. Is it easy? For me? Yes, if I find it hard, then I'll just switch and go to another service provider who's offering the same product or service, but probably they have a website or they have the products can be accessed online. So even the solutions should be very easy, simple, and people can easily navigate through, you know, simplicity is easily understood, you know, if we understood by the employees, though, is they understand it, they will resonate with it, and I'll easily adopt to it. So why make things hard? Really, because you're you're dealing with customers who are busy, who have many things to choose. So the fact that you're making life hard for them, then you're not even adding any experience to them. So, simplicity is easily understood. Islam adopted, you know, and people usually remember you can easily remember you know, you know, like, for example, our I won't mention the name of this bank in Uganda. But when you go to their app, yeah, they are banking up. Oh my goodness, it is so simple. You can do everything I've been doing the last time I walked into that banking hall, you get it. So. So for me, simplicity will always win the day, if it comes to customer experience, man.

Rick Denton:

Again, such depth and truth and they're even I think you've got a second career or a side career available to you as a customer experience leader, a customer experience advisor, I think there's a lot of companies that should be talking to you about the delivery of great customer experience, because so much of what you say, makes complete sense. And is is I forgive me for saying this. But it's so simple. And yet so many companies do not do that. And they could I know, I'm learning from you. And I'm glad that listeners get a chance to learn from you as well. It was I'm looking at the clock. And I know that we're kind of winding down with a little bit of time. So let me You and I are recording this in January of 2023. And I've been asking this of all my guests in this kind of January timeframe. I'm curious what you see for customer experience in Uganda going forward. What do you think the overall focus around customer experience will be for Uganda, in 2023, and beyond.

Evas Bazirakakye:

That's a very good one. I'm seeing most of the businesses, companies, big brands are all going online. And that means that they are really focusing on convenience, accessibility, because now we're realizing that people are working from all places don't even want to drive in the city center. Some people just want to go in and up or down for something delivered at their doorstep. So I'm seeing most businesses going online, which is a very important thing for Uganda. And they can initially say Derrick Ugandans are now exposed, they're now aware, they have traveled, they have most of them have accessed Amazon, they've done, you know, online shopping flow, they would want this back home. And that's why we're seeing most companies going digital, you know, so that is a very good thing. And then in terms of competition, we are seeing companies moving away from it's about the massive products I have out there, what is my competitor doing back to? What is it that I'm putting out there? And why would the customer come to you or they prefer my services? Or my product? You know, so we're moving from just focusing on competition, but to the quality of products and services you're putting out there? What value are they adding to customers. And this is really, really very important for Ugandans, no. So it is a landscape whereby we're seeing customer experience really evolving. And then also management of big brands. appreciating that if we invest in customer experience, then the cost of advertising, marketing, billboards, read your TV, that cost will really go down. Because we've seen what word of mouth can do within how people are, you know, putting out or commenting on social media about products and brands. So for me, I see executives are now going to really, really appreciate customer experience. And never know, we'll have even positions like chief customer experience, because I've not had that in Uganda, probably in other countries, it's there. But we'll see customer experience being on the board sitting on that, you know, in the board discussing critical and strategic decisions can that can help businesses grow expand, you know, and no. Yeah, it's really huge. Its massive. I'm very optimistic about this. And it's something that I cannot stop talking about.

Rick Denton:

Well, unfortunately, even as much as I would want to continue a conversation with you. We have come to the end of time. I do. I love the energy around that. And I think that's what gets me so excited about having conversations with folks around about customer experience around the globe, is that excitement, that energy, that passion, and that optimism to what customer experience can do for a business and I'm excited to hear about your views of what that's going to look like for Uganda in 2023 events. If folks wanted to get in touch with you to learn more to have a conversation around CX what's the best way for them to do that?

Evas Bazirakakye:

They can look me up on linked in, the email,

Rick Denton:

I will get Evas' LinkedIn information in the show notes, scroll down, have a link and have a great chat and get inspired about what customer experience is going to look like going forward. He was really enjoyed talking with you today. The insights that you shared both are delightful in how similar they are but then also inspiring and how forward looking they are as well. It always delights me to hear how Things are different around the globe and how similar they are around the globe. We are just one set of humans, aren't we? Evas had a wonderful conversation with you today. Thank you for being on CX passport.

Evas Bazirakakye:

Thanks, Rick. My pleasure.

Rick Denton:

Thanks for joining us this week on CX Passport. Make sure to visit our website cxpassport.com where you can hit subscribe so you'll never miss a show. While you're at it, you can check out the rest of the EX4CX website. If you're looking to get real about customer experience, EX4CX is available to help you increase revenue by starting to listen to your customers and create great experiences for every customer every time. Thanks for listening to CX Passport and be sure to tune in for our next episode. Until next time, I'm Rick Denton, and I believe the best meals are served outside and require a passport.