Postpartum University® Podcast

EP 182 Honoring Ancestral Wisdom; The Power of La Cuarentena in Modern Healing with Pānquetzani

• Maranda Bower, Postpartum Nutrition Specialist

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What if traditional healing practices could transform your postpartum experience? In this episode of the Postpartum University podcast, Maranda Bower sits down with Panquetzani, the founder of Indigimama. Panquetzani brings ancient wisdom from her Mesoamerican heritage to light, discussing traditional healing practices that offer profound support during postpartum recovery. Dive into this conversation to explore how these practices address not just the body, but the mind and spirit, and learn how you can integrate these ancient traditions into your own healing journey.

Check out this episode on the blog: https://postpartumu.com/honoring-ancestral-wisdom-the-power-of-la-cuarentena-in-modern-healing-with-panquetzani-ep-182

Why Listen?

  • Understanding Traditional Wisdom: Gain knowledge about ancient postpartum practices and how they support overall well-being beyond just physical recovery.
  • Holistic Healing: Learn about comprehensive approaches to postpartum care that include mental, emotional, and spiritual support.
  • Community and Support: Discover the importance of community in healing and how to foster a supportive environment for new mothers.
  • Respectful Integration: Get guidance on how to integrate indigenous practices into your own life or practice without cultural appropriation.

What’s In It for You?

This episode offers a deep dive into ancient Mesoamerican healing practices that are often overlooked in modern postpartum care. Panquetzani’s insights bridge the gap between traditional wisdom and contemporary needs, providing valuable perspectives on holistic wellness. Whether you are a postpartum mother, a healthcare provider, or simply curious about integrating cultural wisdom into your life, this conversation will expand your understanding and offer practical tools for healing.

Connect with Panquetzani
Panquetzani "Pahn-KETS-ah-nee" breathes life into ancestral traditions, offering time-tested wellness practices inspired by Mesoamerican medicine and Mexican folk healing. Using inherited Indigenous knowledge from her Valley of Mexico and Northern Mexican lineages, Panquetzani has dedicated herself to healing la matriz and disseminating Indigenous wellness

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Speaker 1:

Depression, anxiety and autoimmune symptoms after birth is not how it's supposed to be. There is a much better way and I'm here to show you how to do just that. Hey, my friend, I'm Miranda Bauer, a mother to four kids and a biology student turned scientist obsessed with changing the world through postpartum care. Join us as we talk to mothers and the providers who serve them and getting evidence-based information that actually supports the mind, body and soul in the years after birth. Hello everyone, welcome to Postpartum University.

Speaker 1:

Today I have an incredible guest. You guys are not going to believe it. I have Panket Sunny and she is a beautiful founder and creator of a Mesoamerican medicine, mexican folk healing practice, and she's bringing that wisdom, this indigenous knowledge from her Valley of Mexico and Northern Mexico lineages, and she's dedicated herself to healing and dismantling this indigenous wellness practices to her people. She actually founded Indigimama, which is an ancestral healing and direct response womb wellness for her communities, and she provides online and in-person programs, healing services, education worldwide, and today she has ushered over 8,000 BIPOC members through her online school and DigiSquela. And welcome. I am so honored to have you here. Thank you, miranda. Okay, I want to hear your origin story. What brought you to this place, this creator of Indigimama, were these healing methods and practices something that you were constantly exposed to, something that you were constantly exposed to.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, yeah, first, my name is Branket Sunny and I want to thank my ancestors for ushering me here to this place. I grew up in a very Mexican Chicano community in LA Echo Park. It's now gentrified. It's very different. In LA Echo Park, it's now gentrified, it's very different.

Speaker 2:

But growing up in a real community and when I say real community, it's folks who come from all different parts of you know Mexico, central America and the US living together and really sharing and collaborating in with food, with medicine, with all of the traditional teachings respective to their indigenous communities. And so my grandmother. She came from Coahuila, which is northern Mexico and borders Texas, and she brought her traditional healing food practices with her and I believed growing up that all families were like mine. I believe that everyone's family ate from you know food from the garden from scratch. Family ate from you know food from the garden from scratch. And I believed that everyone had limpias and ritual rites of passage as well as herbal healing growing up.

Speaker 2:

It wasn't until I started getting out like past high school around high school is when I realized like, oh, this is something special. Actually, one of my friends she gave me a book and it's called Infusions of Healing, and in that book there were narratives of different curanderas, which are traditional healers, and when, as I was reading their narratives, I was like, wow, this my grandmother does that. Oh, this could be my grandmother. Wow, I have something really special at home. It wasn't until I saw myself reflected in a book that I realized that there was something magical about where I'm from, this community, this family, this home, that I just it just felt so normal to me. I realized that it was different.

Speaker 1:

I love this so much. I feel like in my, my culture my grandmother's from Spain and my son is uh, his grandparents are all from Mexico and I feel like this was not something that I got the privilege to grow up with, like my grandmother was told not to speak English when she came to this country and she had to learn how to speak Spanish, and my mother never passed that down. She never had that, and neither did I, and so it's so beautiful to see that that is still being done today. Um, and what an honor, like what a what a beautiful thing to to witness and explore. Yeah, you, you used a word to describe healers in your community.

Speaker 2:

A curandera is someone who practices curanderismo and curanderismo is. It has many definitions, but popularly it's considered the shamanic traditions of Mexico, central America, even South America, has curanderos and these are folks who cure you with herbs. But the important thing to note about curanderos and curanderas is that we have this worldview of the body where we're not curing only the body, because you are a holistic human, we not only work with the body, we work with the spirit, we work with the mind, we work with your emotions, we work with your role in your family, your role in society. So we take a holistic, ritualistic approach.

Speaker 1:

This is beautiful, and how does that translate into this time of pregnancy and birth and postpartum?

Speaker 2:

that was my great awakening. I realized when I was 15 that we had something special. And then, when I was in my early 20s, I got pregnant. And this is when I realized, actually, this is not just special, this is crucial work. You know, as my body opened, it's like my, my abuela, my grandmother. She had a remedy for every single thing to keep me comfortable, to keep me healthy, to keep me fed, to keep me hydrated, to keep me rested, to keep me fed, to keep me hydrated, to keep me rested, to keep me feeling good, in good spirits. You know, there was something for everything. And this is when I realized how much we are as a community, in our community and even in the broader Indigenous communities, how much we lack our traditional knowledge.

Speaker 2:

She would wrap me in a cloth called a faha. It's a textile made of cotton, and she would wrap my belly in this and on the bottom here, to make sure that my, that the baby, stood in the perfect position, to make sure that my broad ligament wasn't in pain at the end of the day and to make sure that my posture was great, right. So it was this supportive hammock for my body that she's putting on me every day and she's reminding me. If she sees me not wearing it, put your faha on right. And these are the things that people look at me and they're like, oh, what is that for? And it's automatic education. So my pregnancy became an awakening for my community, for the people around me who are asking me questions, and I freely explain to them oh, this is what it's for. And if I didn't know an answer to a question, I'd go back to my abuela and be like why, why do we do this? And I was affirmed by her when I gave birth to my first son in 2008,.

Speaker 2:

I remember asking my midwife what, like in my culture, we wear this faha, like is it helpful, you know? And she said well, it's not going to harm, but it's not going to help either, you know, do whatever you want. And so I didn't wear the faha and I stood up to use the restroom for the first time and I just felt like my insides were dangling out of my body. I felt like everything was like gonna fall out and like, right away I paused and I called over my aunt, my tia, and I was like, okay, no, wrap, girl like me. And the bathroom was only 15 steps away, but it helped me feel comfortable and secure. I literally felt like if I sat down on the toilet. I was just gonna just turn inside out.

Speaker 1:

Which is a really common thing, and we have, you know, modern day wraps right now. Yeah, these are so very different and their design and their approach and their purpose, like this isn't what you're speaking of. It's like this, this holding of the womb, it's this warmth, it's this, you know, it's providing you a special touch and support system, whereas I find today's modern wraps are all about let's get you some weight loss, let's wrap you up so that you can, you know, look skinny again.

Speaker 2:

Yeah the postpartum waist trainers are. You know, just, I feel like it's gender violence. You know it's gender violence. It's telling you oh, you had you pushed out a baby, cool, okay. Now when are you going to be skinny again? Or when are you going to have your form again, right? And the violent part is not even that. The violent part is not even the expectations that are unrealistic. It's not even the pressure that society puts on us. It's literally harming your body when you put on these waist trainers. So the waist trainer is meant to thin out the waist, but as it's applying pressure just like my son is applying pressure right now around my belly, hugging me really hard you're so sweet as it's applying pressure to your midsection, it's actually pushing down your pelvic floor to make space and it's pushing up your stomach and you stopped hugging me. It's you can hug me.

Speaker 1:

He's like oh no.

Speaker 2:

I'm doing all that and it's pushing up your liver and your stomach into your ribs, right. So with time, you're weakening the pelvic floor, you're damaging the pelvic floor. This is 24 different muscles that are meant to keep up your uterus, that are meant to keep up your bladder so that you don't have a dropped uterus, so that you don't have frequent urination and a dropped bladder. This is so that you have longevity and you don't end up in adult diapers, right. But no, they're damning women to this because of the way we're expected to look, and the postpartum faja is much different. The postpartum faja actually lengthens the amount of time that you're able to use your pelvic floor in time in life, so it's a tool for longevity and wellness. It supports your muscles so that you use them properly, you engage them properly, without overworking your body. Be in the perfect, the optimal position to keep the organs moving, flowing, sliding and gliding. In the perfect position versus down or too high.

Speaker 1:

Hey, I'm going to be 100% straight with you. The postpartum world is changing right now and I know you feel it. It's in the politics, our community spaces. There is an urgent need to implement a different approach to postpartum health. If you're an alternative provider or postpartum advocate, you need to be with us in the Postpartum University. Pro Membership Get the method, the tools, the handouts, the advanced trainings and so much more to not only help your clients and your business grow, but to help you grow too. Marketwatch says that the afterbirth services and nutrition and support is set for extraordinary growth by 2030. Don't miss your opportunity to help women and families who desperately need your holistic support. Go to wwwpostpartumucom. Slash membership. We're accepting registrations right now and we can't wait to see you there. This is just like one of the many tools that your culture uses. What are some of the other support tools and tips do you recommend during this time?

Speaker 2:

The number one thing I recommend and I'm super biased on this because it's my specialty are the soladas de matriz.

Speaker 2:

The soladas postpartum sobadas are head to toe massages that you perform on the postpartum body, and the idea behind it is that when you are postpartum, this is your chance to reset, because your body is so soft Imagine a soft piece of clay that you can mold exactly how you want it to be this is your chance. If you have chronic back pain, if you have, you know, some knee issue, if you have, like um, usually, if you have a dropped uterus or open hips, this is when you massage the whole body for 40 days, every single day, to ease the body very gently back into optimal position, better than you were pre-pregnancy, because a lot of us go our whole lives with imbalances physical imbalances, right, ignoring our bodies, and then during pregnancy they come up because we can no longer ignore them. Right, the pressure is too much, the weight is too much, that the change is so rapid that we just can't ignore our bodies, and then we blame it on the pregnancy. That has been there the whole time. We just haven't felt it yeah, this is.

Speaker 1:

This is beautiful. And the other thing that I that I'm consistently picking up from you is the importance of community during this time. Like your family and your community support you and support the mother's well-being. Like you're not the one who's doing your own massage yeah, you're not the one who's wrapping your body. You have people who are coming to you and caring for you. Oh, yeah.

Speaker 2:

I compare myself to like when you're trying to getting ready to slaughter an animal and you fatten them up and you're just like fattening them up and fattening them up and fattening them up Like that's how I'm treated postpartum. You know, I never get hungry, never get thirsty, and I'm always told to rest.

Speaker 2:

I don't cook, I don't clean, I don't even walk to the bathroom alone for the first few days you know, yeah, and my only job is to hold the baby, to nurse, to rest, to sleep, to ask for what I need. Someone's always there keeping you company. Someone's always in the house. My mom and my family, we do a lot. We do a lot of fermentation. We have so many beautiful traditions and fermenting food is one of them, and so my mom. She fermented gallons and gallons of different fermented vegetables for me to have every day of my cuarentena.

Speaker 2:

The cuarentena is the 40 day window postpartum, where you quarantine yourself, you don't go out, you don't go outside, you don't do anything public. If anyone comes into your home, it's to serve you, it's to serve your family, it's to contribute. My uncle and aunt came over with their son after my fourth baby. I think I didn't even see them. They came, they cleaned the whole house, they kept the kids entertained and they left. This is the way, and you know you would consider it rude, like, oh, they didn't even say hi to me, they didn't even ask to see the baby. You know, but you're not even supposed to ask to see the baby. It's not about the baby. It's about giving the family what they need. It's not about your selfish need to see what the baby. What does A plus B equal? What does a baby look like?

Speaker 1:

Oh, my goodness, it's so true, it's so true. And you know, in today's world, like we don't see this, we don't see these practices being done. See this, we don't see these practices being done. And I feel like this is a massive part of the reason why we have so many challenges, and it would be such a dream to bring this back into our cultures, into society, into BIPOC communities. Like, how do we overcome this challenge and bring this knowledge and expertise and wisdom and community back into those who deserve it most?

Speaker 2:

It's all about condemning the patriarchy. Patriarchy says I need to do things alone. F you patriarchy. Right, I'm going to call in my sisters, people, who people will ask you what do you need? Let me know what you need.

Speaker 2:

And we are so easy to dismiss that, to ignore that, to cringe at the thought of other people helping us, instead of being like, oh yeah, there's this, there's a sheet. You know Melody has the sheet. Go put your name on it, tell her to email it to you and tell her to text it to you. You know, this is what my friend Melody, literally what she did. She had a sheet for all my friends for the whole 40 days to come over every single day to help, to support, to write down like what are they doing? Are they bringing food, are they massaging, are they cleaning, you know, are they bathing me with herbs? Are they setting up my vaginal steam? And I had that every day for 40 days and I didn't have to worry about scheduling anything because one of my besties out of so many besties that I have stepped up and organized this for me right and I was there for her postpartum, she was there for mine and other people like who came? I supported them.

Speaker 2:

So it's, it's a network, and in indigenous culture, we have this beautiful concept of social debt, right, social debt. So you owe people, right, you owe them your love, you owe them your compassion, you owe them your labor, you owe them to show up for them when they most need it. Right? And if we all have this concept of social debt wow, okay, banketsani is postpartum right now and I'm going to give this what I can. I'm going to drop off. I made soup, I'm going to give her an X, this extra. You know, two bowls of soup that I have, right? And if we all have this concept of like this person is owed love, if we all have this concept, then it's so much easier for all of us to be taken care of, because we're taking care of each other.

Speaker 1:

And this is so different, like just hearing you speak of, of this debt, and it's not like I'm not hearing oh, it's this personal debt, because this person owed me or did something for me and now I owe them, so I better do it, because I'm going to feel guilty, not or I'm going to be condemned to hell, or like there's nothing of that that you are, you are expressing here. This is just like no, you're a fellow human being and you deserve support, and I'm a fellow human being and I'm going to give that to you because it is my duty.

Speaker 2:

I am a fellow human being and I'm going to give that to you because it is my duty yes, yeah, more of that. We need more, yeah, yeah. And it's all about balance too. And we have the concept of social debt because in Mesoamerican culture, we believe in harmony and balance in giving and taking, in harmony and balance in giving and taking. And if there is not a sacrifice, if there is not a giving right, giving means I'm losing something, so that's a sacrifice, right. If I give you a pot of soup, that means that's one less pot of soup I'll have for later. That's a sacrifice. If we don't sacrifice every day, then there will be no harmony in my life, in my home, in our communities, in the world or even in the cosmos.

Speaker 1:

This is such a patriarchal model that we're living in where it's. I don't owe you anything. I don't know you, or I'll owe you something, but you're gonna give me everything in return.

Speaker 1:

Right, that's like that is the almost definition of like the patriarchal model that we are currently living in, and you're just like shattering every bit of that. I love it, I love it. I feel like here's another question, especially before we end. You know, people want to learn from this, and this is something. I am a huge person who loves anthropology and cultural studies and it's a basis for so much of what I do here at Postpartum University, and I feel like people are just like yearning for this tradition. They're yearning for this other way of living, and maybe they're like me who were so disconnected from that culture. How can they integrate these similar practices in their postpartum care, but also without cultural appropriation? I want to address the elephant in the room here, because so many people are afraid of that but at the same time, they're desperate for it same time they're like they're desperate for it.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, I wrote a whole chapter about that in my book thriving postpartum, the first book I didn't know, that, yeah, okay, it's available now for pre-order.

Speaker 1:

It's called thriving postpartum, embracing the indigenous wisdom of La Cuarentena embracing the indigenous wisdom of la cuarentena, and you could find it at indigimamacom book. I'm so into this, I'm gonna make sure that that link is in our show notes and I will just tell you this is so on par because I was just able to, um, get a trademarked, mama thrive, mama thrive. So that is, you know, sharing with everybody. That will be coming here very soon and I talk about it a lot in my book. So, like hearing the thriving postpartum, I'm like girl, yes, yes, beautiful, okay. So we'll have that in the show notes. Tell me more For sure.

Speaker 2:

And so when we're learning and we don't come from the cultural background, I would like folks who are not indigenous, who are not black indigenous people of color, to first learn before they practice, which is why one of the many reasons why I wrote this book Thriving Postpartum is that so people can learn the concepts behind all of the practices. That way, when you decide to do this for yourself, you're doing so as an honored guest. You know what is the reason behind this. You're not just taking it, using it because it's a trend, because it's cool, because you don't know what your family or community has historically done. So you just take someone else's stuff, you know. So number one is learn, number two is practice as an honored guest.

Speaker 2:

And number three is really sit with the question what is my role here? Right, what is my role If I buy a vaginal steam bath blend that is Mexican or Mesoamerican? Am I buying from a person who is from the Mexican community? Am I supporting with my purchase? Who am I supporting? Right? So what role am I playing here? Right? So those are four things. And then the fifth thing is I think the hardest. The simpler that you see our medicine, the simpler that you think it is the more learning that you have to do. If you feel like this is easy, this is simple. I invite you to practice with your whole heart, practice humility and sit with the wisdom, because I promise you, I've been practicing this my whole entire life. And there is this theme where the more I learn, the more I learn that I don't know.

Speaker 1:

Yes, yes, and there's such a depth to it. You know it's not, and I teach a lot about food, but it's never really about food and nourishment. Yeah, it's, you know. It goes deep into our soul and our, the way we care for ourselves and our beings and how our ancestors cared for us and how that is that wisdom is, is embedded into our cellular structure Like it's so deep it's almost unfathomable and it really is like the more you know, the more you don't know. That it's. It's a beautiful thing, yeah, but I love that, to step into that, that gracefulness of unknowing.

Speaker 2:

And it's also shattering the patriarchy. When you decide to slow down instead of consuming and doing things quickly, and you know, moving with the pace of capitalism and productivity, versus what is my own pace, what is the spirit, my spiritual pace, that I need to integrate this wisdom, yes, yes absolutely Absolutely.

Speaker 1:

I feel like I can speak with you forever. This has been such a beautiful episode and I really want people to be able to find you and your book when. Where are you on social? Where can we connect in with you?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, you can find me at Indigimama. That's I-N-D-I-G-E-M-A-M-A. Indigimama, indigimama. All across social media you can find my free summit that I have right now. I have a free postpartum summit happening. Starts tomorrow Indigimamacom slash summit. And you can find my book Indigimamacom slash book. Find me everywhere. Indigimama, indigimama, indigimama.

Speaker 1:

So worth it. Please go take a look at her things and support her and all of the incredible work that she's doing. I'm just so honored, so grateful. I'm going to go into this conversation with the fact that I'm going to go practice more of my Spanish and thank you for dealing with my my chubby Spanish. It's not okay. Thank you for all of your wisdom. I appreciate you, thank you.

Speaker 2:

Miranda.

Speaker 1:

I am so grateful you turned into the Postpartum University podcast. We've hoped you enjoyed this episode enough to leave us a quick review. And, more importantly, I hope more than ever that you take what you've learned here, applied it to your own life and consider joining us in the Postpartum University membership. It's a private space where mothers and providers learn the real truth and the real tools needed to heal in the years postpartum. You can learn more at wwwpostpartumucom. We'll see you next week. You.