All About The Joy

Police Accountability: Confronting Violence, Misinformation and Sonya Massey

• Carmen Lezeth Suarez • Episode 147

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How can society trust the police when bad cops merely move from one department to another? This week's Carmen Talk unpacks this critical issue, delving into the disturbing trend of officers who commit misconduct being rehired elsewhere. We emphasize the importance of direct language when discussing serious issues like murder, particularly in the context of the tragic killing of Sonia Massey. Our conversation stresses the need for police officers to stand against wrongdoing and highlights the emotional toll of witnessing police brutality, urging law enforcement to genuinely uphold their duty to protect and serve.

Is our society becoming desensitized to violence? We explore how the lack of accountability within police institutions contributes to this troubling trend. The episode examines the broader implications of systemic issues in policing, the effects of misinformation, and the proliferation of conspiracy theories on public trust. We share personal stories to provide nuanced perspectives on safety and community, emphasizing the need for informed and empathetic political discourse. Join us as we dissect the complex emotions and power dynamics that influence both law enforcement and politics.

Why is female leadership still lacking in the United States? We address this pressing question while maintaining a balance between serious discussions and moments of joy. Our goal is to create a community-like atmosphere where listeners feel both enlightened and uplifted. By promoting fact-based political conversations and understanding differing viewpoints, we hope to foster personal growth and better citizenship. Tune in every Thursday night at 6 pm Pacific, 9 pm Eastern for more meaningful and joyful discussions on All About the Joy Live Stream.

Thank you for stopping by. Please visit our website: All About The Joy and add, like and share. You can also support us by shopping at our STORE - We'd appreciate that greatly. Also, if you want to find us anywhere on social media, please check out the link in bio page.

Music By Geovane Bruno, Moments, 3481
Editing by Team A-J
Host, Carmen Lezeth


DISCLAIMER: As always, please do your own research and understand that the opinions in this podcast and livestream are meant for entertainment purposes only. States and other areas may have different rules and regulations governing certain aspects discussed in this podcast. Nothing in our podcast or livestream is meant to be medical or legal advice. Please use common sense, and when in doubt, ask a professional for advice, assistance, help and guidance.

Carmen Lezeth:

Hey everyone, welcome to Carmen Talk. Let me just say that on Thursday night it was July 25th we had a live stream, our regular live stream. That's always on Thursday nights at 6 pm Pacific. We had a live stream, a regular live stream. That's always on Thursday nights at 6 pm Pacific, 9 pm Eastern. And this past Thursday was I'm going to call it a whopper.

Carmen Lezeth:

It was a really good, interesting conversation, but it was also hard and it was the first time, in a really meaty way, that we talked about politics and we talked about some of the social issues that are happening today, the biggest one being the murder of Sonia Massey. And I know that people get confused about what I want my show to be. And I'm going to say this my show all about the joy is evolving. The show was never meant to avoid hard subjects. It was meant to make sure it was an umbrella for everyone to be able to come in. So that's why I don't talk about politics all the time and I don't talk about religion, because I don't want people to feel as if they can't have a part of hanging out in the neighborhood, right. So the concept, again, of All About the Joy is that we all live in the same neighborhood and after work we all kind of see each other, as either we're getting off the bus or we're walking home from the train station, or maybe you're parking your car into your driveway and you see your neighbors and you just say hi, and then you end up just kind of standing there at somebody's stoop or somebody's porch or you know, just hanging out on somebody's lawn chairs and just having a conversation about your day at work or about your day in general, or about your day in the house or your day at school. And that's the whole concept of all about the joy, right, being able to know that you could have conversations with your neighbors, to kind of just let it all out and maybe have conversations back and forth that might help each other, help each other get through the day, or just downright let it out and gossip a little bit right, not in a mean and evil way, but gossip a little bit about can you believe this happened at work? Nuh-uh, this happened to me too. Just having that kind of comfort level, that place where you can vent a little bit, you know, before we all go in and eat our dinners or whatever. That's the idea of All About the Joy, but it was never meant to avoid the hard subjects.

Carmen Lezeth:

But as we are going along after this first year and as I am just so grateful for all the people that keep stopping by, not just onto the show We've had so many people who come onto the show and I'm just so grateful to everyone but also people who are in the chat, people who are contributing and people who are also just listening, people who watch the replay on YouTube or Facebook or LinkedIn. I really appreciate it and I do get a lot of DMs. I do get people who send me emails and let me tell you, I read them all and, as you can all tell, I respond to all of them and I appreciate it. I understand that some people don't want to be visible or don't want to share their opinion live, and I think that's okay too. But all about the joy is evolving and I hope that as we evolve, as we grow, people will still want to chime in and join in, just like we did on Thursday night. It was a little bit of a hard conversation, but it was a good one. It was a really, really good one.

Carmen Lezeth:

I want to also clarify a few things that I said, and my voice is going in and out, so I do apologize. It's not an audio thing, it's just that I'm extremely tired, as you all know. But I do want to clarify a few things. I think I'm saying Etienne's name right, but Etienne was in the chat and mentioned that I did say, in reference to Sonia Massey's murder, that I do think it's all cops, and you know what. I did say that. Let me clarify why.

Carmen Lezeth:

I believe that I think we're getting into parsing words so much right now because we don't want to blanket all cops as bad cops. I get that, I understand it, but here's the thing it's happening way too much. The murders of our fellow citizens is happening too much, and one of the other things that Etienne had said was which I think is a conspiracy thing I'm 99% sure this is a conspiracy thing had mentioned that white people are being killed just as much as black people are, but CNN isn't showing that because it doesn't create news. Are you kidding me? I know that's a lie, just based on the fact of I can call out Amber Alerts Anytime there's a child missing, a white child missing that's plastered all over the place, but if there's a black child missing. We don't hear anything about it.

Carmen Lezeth:

I doubt very much that there are white men, white women being killed on a regular basis, like black people are being killed by police on a pretty regular stream basis for this country, police on a pretty regular stream basis for this country, and these media moguls are just hiding that. So let's just void ourselves. By the way, even if that was true, that doesn't make it right, okay, that doesn't make it like, oh, okay, so they're killing as many white people as they are black people. No, police shouldn't be killing people whatsoever. It just should not be a thing To protect and serve does not mean you have to always kill people. And the reason why I say it's all cops. Let me tell you why I keep saying this. Do I actually think all police officers are bad? I do not believe that, at the end of the day, most cops are bad, but they belong to a very bad and horrible organization. They are working in an institution that does not seem to have the ability to actually police itself. Now, I said this on the podcast I go into companies, I am hired to go into companies and try to figure out procedures, try to figure out what may be wrong in a company.

Carmen Lezeth:

And then I go and I say here's what's wrong with your company and this is what you should do about it. Sometimes we have to hire people. Most times we might have to fire people. We might have to let go of people who are not contributing in a good way. But what seems to happen in the police department is if you have a bad cop, they get fired. If they get fired before doing real damage which means killing people they get fired and then they turn around and get a job somewhere else. I don't understand that, and the fact that the police department is okay with this all across the country seems weird to me.

Carmen Lezeth:

We've also gotten very desensitized to the idea that killing people is a bad thing. So I understand why everyone says unalived right. That started out because every time you say the word kill or murder, social media will flag it and knock it down because it thinks it's adding to violence or whatever. So now we say this really nicer word called unalive, which sounds better, right, and it doesn't flag on social media. So this person was unalived, well, better, right, and it doesn't flag on social media. So this person was unalived Well.

Carmen Lezeth:

Here's my problem with that Unalived, does not have the same oomph as we've killed somebody. Somebody has been killed. We have murdered somebody. Something has happened to make someone no longer be part of their family, no longer be able to breathe air, no longer be able to contribute to society. We have become so desensitized to what it means for someone to leave this earth without it being a natural cause or something they cannot control. Somebody using a gun to kill somebody else is a big deal, but we don't care anymore. We're just it's just part of the news cycle, it's just part of what we talk about now.

Carmen Lezeth:

And then we go on to the next thing and I'm I'm shook by it. We are so desensitized to who we are, to other people, and I think that's what's incredible to me about the police department. If somebody has killed somebody else or has hurt somebody else, or who has done something wrong, they don't just need to be reprimanded, they need to be thrown out of the organization. And if they're not thrown out of the entire organization, why do I want to be part of that organization? Why do I want to go and work for a company that would be okay with somebody who killed somebody else or hurt somebody else or harmed another person, especially when my job is to protect and serve. Now, I know I'm asking a lot, I know, but police need to stand up to what is wrong. I've seen a few TikTok videos of police officers. I think two of them were women and I know one of them was I forget the other one I saw Um, and then one was a man for sure.

Carmen Lezeth:

I honestly don't understand why it's so hard to speak out against this horribleness. Now, for those of you who haven't seen the video of Sonia Massey being murdered, that is exactly what it is being killed, being unalived, whatever you want to use. It's really harsh and I would tell people not to watch it. I think people are becoming more and more desensitized and you can imagine that it is painful. If you saw George Floyd being murdered, if you have ever seen anyone being harmed, that's all you need to know. And it was unjustified. It's unjustified and you know I made the mistake of watching it and I can't unsee it now and I'm heartbroken about it and I had a nightmare about it the other night and I think it's part of why I'm so tired and I can't understand what is happening to us as a society, where we are so unloving of each other and I'm not even trying to be all kumbaya about it it seems like we just have lost our way as human beings, and I don't want my show to become a place where we have to have these hard conversations, because I know there are many, many places where people are talking about it.

Carmen Lezeth:

But I also don't want to pretend that things aren't happening and then we're pretending to be in a place of joy when actually, yeah, I'm kind of miserable about this, I'm heartbroken. Now, what I want to believe is that most police officers and I know this to be true, most police officers go into this because they want to help other people. I think that's the same with politicians. I think initially, politicians go into this field because they think they can help their community. But, like everything else, things get corrupted. Maybe it's part of our human nature that we like power. Maybe we all have a sense of wanting to be in control of things. Maybe we don't like to share. Maybe that's part of our natural essence as human beings.

Carmen Lezeth:

I always talk about jealousy in the same way. People like to say like oh, I'm not jealous. Maybe we're all jealous of something because it's part of who we are as human beings and being jealous can be a good thing. It's the behavior and how we act when we are jealous. That's the bad thing, right? If I see a beautiful woman wearing a fabulous outfit and she looks amazing, maybe I go home and try to put on the same outfit or try to dress a little differently, or maybe I try to do something so that I can feel that pretty and good too. But if I turn around and I say, well, she's dumb. I mean she's, you know whatever, she's an idiot. I mean I know her, she's blah, blah, blah. If I'm now bringing her down because of my, that's the bad part.

Carmen Lezeth:

But jealousy can also act as a way to inspire us or to help us. And the best thing I do with jealousy and I'm sharing this with everyone, I've said it before when I am totally looking at someone and they're fabulous, I tell them girl, your hair looks fabulous. Or I'm like oh my God, you're so brilliant. Wow, I didn't think about that. I put it out there because not only does it give someone a compliment, but it also takes the angst out of me and it makes me feel good and it inspires me to then acknowledge that someone is fantastic and beautiful and smart and wonderful, you know, and it's like I've killed two birds with one stone given them a compliment, gotten myself some motivation and inspiration, and I just feel good about myself when I can make someone happy. So I wonder the way in which we are naturally jealous, human beings right, it's a natural thing we all have. Maybe we also have a natural instinct to want a lot of power, and maybe we have a natural instinct to want to be in control of things, control of people. And maybe when we have a gun attached to our waist, and maybe when we have a uniform, and maybe when we're given the opportunity to do it, it's so much easier to be that.

Carmen Lezeth:

Now I'm not making excuses. What I'm saying is the police department has a huge problem because they are not looking at this. They keep trying to one off it. It's not all cops. We need to stop saying that If you're part of an organization that keeps doing this to black people, then you're part of the problem. Stand up against it, Get away from it. I'm not saying we don't need a police force. We do, but we need a different kind of policing because this ain't working. It hasn't worked since I was a kid. It's not working, and I'm not against the police.

Carmen Lezeth:

I never call the police. You know what? That's a lie. I did call the police recently, but the only way you're going to see me call the police is because my landlord was here. I was on the phone with him. We had a huge problem here in the building and everybody in the apartment building was outside. We were having this loud noise. We couldn't figure out where the noise was coming from and so we were all in it, like you know, and they're all white. I felt very safe. You know what I mean, and that's how we called. You know. I called the police and the police came out. He was very nice with his dog, which was awesome, and he was a very nice person and he figured out what the well, he actually didn't figure out what the problem was. We ended up figuring out, but he helped in kind of isolating where it was coming from.

Carmen Lezeth:

The point is, it is not that I don't ever want to have help, but I have the non-emergency number that I call more often than not if I need something, and I never do. But if I need something I will request the fire department, but I don't even reach out, because you just never know, and I think that's what this is about, right? So our conversation the other day, on Thursday night, did not go down a rabbit hole. I don't want people to be confused. We're going to have to have some hard conversations and I think that the only way the podcast and the live stream grows is that we are able to touch on these subjects respectfully and kindly and with empathy and with consideration of each other. And I'm not saying this is going to be what the show is all the time, but it's too big to ignore that Biden stepped away from the Democratic nomination that's a big deal and that Kamala Harris has stepped in. We had to touch base on that, right, we had to acknowledge that.

Carmen Lezeth:

And with that said, I want to say there are so many weird conspiracy theories out there and I've known this to be true for a really long time about our country. But it's really hard to listen to people not have any facts at all, but coming from a place of authority. Now I called out a friend this morning on their live stream and I was just appalled. I was so upset and the biggest thing I learned from that was I cannot listen to people's live streams or watch their replays before I've had my cup of coffee in the morning. That's a bad idea. But I was livid. Livid because I know it's really hard nowadays to trust people. I get that because back in the day, when there was Walter Cronkite, there was Peter Jennings, there was Tom Brokaw, there was all these old school newscasters. People thought they were objective. People just listened to them because they were the voices of authority giving them the news.

Carmen Lezeth:

I'm going to say another thing that isn't going to make people feel good, especially journalists. There has never been ever been objective news telling. If you go back and watch any newscast from back in the day, you can totally see people's bent on the news. I'm sorry, with all your experience, with whoever you are as a human being on the planet, when you're telling a story, when you're telling a news story, it's coming from a place that you have been in your experience and therefore it is always going to have a certain bent to it. Now we can try to play the game and say well, like science, no, science is different Science. You come in with a theory and then you prove it with facts.

Carmen Lezeth:

But most people who are explaining the news, they try to be as objective as possible, but it's really hard to do when you're, you know, a human being. The most we can ask for is that you give both sides of the issue Okay. So if I tend to be more liberal, democratic, I tend to lean left, then what I want to do is also turn around and say and here is the other side of the story from this perspective, they believe A, b, c and D happened, blah, blah, blah, blah. That's the most you can ask for. But this idea that you're only going to get your news from one source and you're going to believe it without doing any fact-checking yourself, those days are gone because journalism has changed. Journalism has been mixed with entertainment. By the way, fox News, in legal documents, is an entertainment channel. They are not a news channel, they are an entertainment channel. That is not me saying that. That is them in a lawsuit, admitting that.

Carmen Lezeth:

Now, the reason why I bring up Fox News is because so many people and a lot of people who listen to my show are Fox News people, and I get it. I understand, but here is where there is a problem. A lot of the things that are being said on Fox are not true and they're never giving the other side. They never are. They do not give the other side. I am not saying that MSNBC or CNN are any better. I am saying we have to do a better job. We ourselves, individually, have to do a better job of going in and making sure we have different resources to look at before we start mouthing off bullshittery Like unless I hear it from somebody's mouth themselves, I'm not believing it, and I know you're all thinking like, well, there's AI. Okay, we're going down a rabbit hole here. I'll give you an example. Somebody said just this morning and I know they're going to listen to this podcast and get mad at me, but I'm going to say it anyways, I'm not putting them out there Just said there's never been a female leader in the history of the world or something.

Carmen Lezeth:

And I was like what? Margaret Thatcher, golda Meir, I can go down the list it's only in the United States have we not had a female leader. President of the United States. The rest of the world is ahead of us on so many things. Even if we don't want to believe it as Americans, it is true. All you have to do is Google that shit and you would be able to see. There have been many, many. There are currently leaders who are women in the world. So you can't make a statement like that.

Carmen Lezeth:

I understand why people are confused, because it feeds into the storyline of whatever it is we're thinking. Let me give you an example. If you don't like Kamala Harris, the Vice President of the United States, then it makes sense that the way in which you dismiss her is by saying no one's going to like a female leader, no one's going to accept her, no one's going to be okay, because we've never had that before. See, that feeds into what you want to believe, but it's not true. I'm going to say something else that I really believe in. People are very emotional about politics. I am too, and I'm not saying you shouldn't be, but don't talk about what you don't know and don't keep assuming that you know what you know, because so many people I listen to do not know jack shit.

Carmen Lezeth:

My opinion about police officers and about us always saying it's not all cops is more about us not wanting to believe that there's a problem with the police department, and I'm blaming us. We don't want to do anything about it. We keep thinking the police departments are going to fix this, they're not going to fix it. I do not believe that there are white cops out there hoping to kill black people. That is not my belief system at all. But I do believe that there is a system in place that allows people who are not good people to continue being cops. And if an organization keeps doing that, then it's a bad organization and it needs to be changed, reformed. And you know what? We don't do anything. We just get bad when somebody gets killed and we get pissed about it. We might protest for five minutes and then we're done with it. Then we're back to the same old crap.

Carmen Lezeth:

I have an opinion about a lot of things, but I don't talk about things I don't know or don't have backup for. And that's what I'm talking about. There was another instance this week where I had to stop myself because I realized I'm just wasting my breath with people, and I think that's the other part that's happening. There's an apathy that starts to happen when I realize you know what? I can't talk to this person because they're so dug into what they believe they have no backup for it. But they don't want to hear that they have no backup for it and I stepped away. And that's me trying to preserve my sanity. And also I'm trying to understand where they're coming from, and I can't figure it out, except that they don't know what the fuck they're talking about.

Carmen Lezeth:

There are so many complicated issues happening in our world right now. That doesn't mean that we are not in a good place, and I know that sounds really weird. I feel like we have the ability to change things if we really really want to. We have the ability to see beyond our own selfish, tiny ways, to become part of a society that cares once again about our fellow citizens, regardless of whether they are Trump people or Biden people, red, blue states, whatever. And that's not about pretending we don't have real differences and real things that anger each other over things we talk about or things we believe in. But we've got to get to a place where we can at least say you know what.

Carmen Lezeth:

I disagree with you on everything you believe on regarding Trump, but I'm going to talk to you about this other police matter because I think you and I can find common ground. Or I know that you don't like me, because I will be voting for Kamala Harris for the vice president of the United States to be the nominee and to be the president of the United States. I know you may disagree with that and you may not like her, but if we're going to have a conversation about it, I want you to come to me with facts, not just stuff you heard at a rally, on TV and newspapers, because everything I tell you about her I'm going to give you facts on. Somebody was talking about Tulsi Gabbard this morning.

Carmen Lezeth:

The problem I have as a left-leaning person who believes in the Democrats more than whatever we're calling the conservative Republican Party nowadays, because I am against the Republican nominee 100% is a few things. If you don't have facts to back up your stuffage, you can like whoever you want, but you should like them for the facts you have, not for the stuff you've made up in your head. Them for the facts you have, not for the stuff you've made up in your head. I feel angry about the state of our country, but I'm also hopeful that we have a place to go towards and I will say this the thing that's great about all, about the joy the show is it's a place to have a conversation and to laugh a little bit. Sometimes we laugh a lot, but I hope it also becomes a place where we can have some conversations. That might be a little bit hard, but can also be a place where maybe we can all grow.

Carmen Lezeth:

Because here's one thing I'm really good at I'm really good at mediating and I'm really good at understanding where people are coming from. But you've got to have some facts behind you for me to even be able to hear you. I'm going to try to do better at listening, because I really have a hard time when I think you don't have facts. But maybe if I listened a little bit more intensely and stopped jumping the gun, maybe that will help me as well. I'm also going to try these are the things I want to do to be a better person and a better citizen in this country and in this society. I'm also going to try to stop talking so much so that other people can chime in. Now, don't get me wrong, that's my show. Okay, that's my show and it's my brand. But I also realize that I need to be better about allowing other people to share their points of view without me jumping in, and I also need to let other people try to debunk it right before I do, and so those are things I'm going to try to do, to be better at and I would like people who are listening to this to start thinking about that as well Like, what can you do to try to be better in this country, in this society during these times? I really want people to do a better job of having facts and references to back up anything you say.

Carmen Lezeth:

If you think Donald Trump is the greatest president ever, I need you to list 10 things that are factual. I need you to list three things that are factual. I'll take anything that are factual about that statement. Someone was talking about today how he did such a great job during the coronavirus. Are you kidding me? See, this is what I mean this kind of idea that you believe that Donald Trump did such a great job during the coronavirus. You forget that he was telling people to inject bleach into themselves, that he was hawking all of these things, the horse tranquilizer thing I can't remember the name of it that had not been approved, that he had not taken. He made the pandemic worse.

Carmen Lezeth:

Somebody was talking about stimulus checks. Are you kidding me? Stimulus checks and all of us getting unemployment during that time was the least our country could do for us, and I'm telling you right now, whether it was Trump or Biden or Barack Obama or Reagan or any other president, they would have done what they needed to do because the United States Treasury would have wanted to do something to keep the economy going. That's not a Trump thing, but what you remember because Trump is so selfish and so about him, and I have facts for that he made sure that his name was signed at the bottom of the checks so that you would do exactly what you're doing right now. Remember that. He gave you the checks. That is not okay. He did not give you anything. This is your country, that is your money. That is exactly what the government is there to do, and they didn't want the economy to keep faltering Like that's the other part of this. You think somebody was doing you a favor. They wanted to make sure we could keep buying things, to make sure that we all didn't end up homeless on the street. This was something that was beneficial to not just us, but to our country's economy.

Carmen Lezeth:

Think, think deeper. You guys are giving credit to Trump for things he did not do, and, yes, I'm against Trump, there's no doubt about it, but I have facts to back it up and I am sad that every time I hear people talking about things about Trump, they're always always lies, always, and it's not because I'm bringing it to the table, it's because I can easily debunk it Easily easily debunk it. I am afraid for our country again, and I know that there's a lot of hoopla right now for the vice president becoming the nominee for the Democratic Party, and I'm all in, I'm all for it, but the problem does not end if she becomes president of the United States. The problem is still going to be there. We have half of our country who is angry and upset and supporting a man that I think is a cult figure and upset and supporting a man that I think is a cult figure.

Carmen Lezeth:

And whether or not Vice President Harris becomes president of the United States, we are still going to have people in this country who are angry and upset in a way that has never been seen or known before. So we will still have an enormous amount of work to do and if Donald Trump becomes president, we are still going to have a lot of work to do in this country regarding race relations, regarding guns, regarding education, regarding health benefits and medical care. We have so much work to do because the hate is real and it's deepening every single day, and if Donald Trump becomes president, it's going to be really bad. And if Vice President Harris becomes president, it's still going to be bad, because half of our country hates who we are becoming. And who we are becoming is a people who are honest about what their actual history is in this country.

Carmen Lezeth:

We're starting to understand who we really are in this country as a nation, as a people, and we don't like being lied to. We don't like being treated as second-class citizens, and people aren't taking it anymore. Millennials, but definitely Gen Z, has had it with otherizing people, with being cruel to people, and that's why I applaud them. I applaud Gen Z to the nth degree. Everybody knows I do because I'm so proud of them, so proud of their optimism and their hard work and the way in which they are mobilizing and the way in which they use technology and the way in which they are unafraid about what they need to do to make the world a better place. And people in my generation, generation X, we're doing the best we can too, but we need to start understanding that there's a whole other half of our country that's in trouble and we need to start being considerate of all of that.

Carmen Lezeth:

So I want to get back to all about the joy, because I know I just went down a rabbit hole, but that's what this was going to be about. Anyways, please go and watch the last YouTube live stream that we had on Thursday. There was some fun there. It was fun in the beginning as well, but you know I also touched on some subject and I thought it was interesting. I hope you'll come visit us again and check out the live stream.

Carmen Lezeth:

It's not always going to be all these hardcore conversations, but we are changing the trajectory of the show a bit. We want to have joy, we want to have good conversations about substantive matters, but we also want to still be a place where you can come and make sure you're going to have quite a few laughs and leave knowing that you are in a better place than where you started, and that feels factual to me. It feels like that's what we're doing as a group of people who hang out on Thursday nights at 6 pm Pacific, 9 pm Eastern and, yeah, at the end of the day. Please remember, it really is all about the joy and I look forward to seeing you all again next time. Thank you. Thanks for stopping by. All About the Joy. Be better and stay beautiful. Folks have a sweet day.