The Hidden Harm

In this episode we hear from John Bradshaw about gambling. He shares his knowledge about the harm it can cause, tips for stopping and services available to help you. He also talks about the sessions he provides for kids on gambling and how it is not a normal part of sport.

If you need help with gambling you can contact Gamblers Help’s confidentially 24/7 for free at 1800 858 858.

Interested in the topic and looking for more?

Cafs  is a proudly independent organisation, driven by the community it supports. At its heart is the wellbeing of children, young people and families. It also extends its inclusive and accessible program to everyone needing help. 

Gambling help services:

Gamblers Help or call 1800 858 858

Cafs - Gamblers Help or call 1800 692 237

Financial counselling services:

Rural Financial Counselling Service Victoria West or call 1300 735 578

Bethany Community Support

Cafs

In the episode John gave some tips for helping to stop gambling, such as:

• Setting a limit 
•  Alternative recreations
•  Spending time with mates at the races instead

You can also check out these links for more tips:

Better Health Channel

Gambler Help - Help yourself

John also discusses how he talks to kids about how gambling is not a normal part of sport. If you are interested in getting John to talk about this at your school or community group you can find out how here. 

Love The Game Not The Odds is a Victorian program focused on gambling not being a necessary part of sport.  Your local club can get involved.

Join the conversation
Facebook: @FarmerWantsaHealthyLife                                            Twitter: @_FWAHL

Facebook: @FarmerWantsaHealthyLife Twitter: @_FWAHL

Transcript

BM

This is a West Wimmera Health Service podcast. Presented by me, Brigitte Muir. 

This series focuses around stories and issues related to health and wellbeing. Some of the people we hear from are sharing their stories, hoping that their experiences will help us with our own health and wellbeing. Please be aware that some of their life experiences may touch on issues that are sensitive to some. Please listen with care. You will find information on seeking help if you need it in the notes attached to each episode.

Many of us will have a bet on the Melbourne Cup or local races. But what happens if that turns into a habit? John Bradshaw is the Gamblers Help Community Engagement Officer at CAFS, Child and Family Services in Ballarat. And he also covers the Grampians region, talking to people and even kids about the dangers of gambling.

JB

I run a school's education program where I talk to kids between year seven and year 12, and teach them how to be more financially literate, how to recognise critically that there's gambling everywhere in their sport and their advertising, and how that's not normal. So, we seek to break that normalisation of gambling and sports, and we also take a look at gambling and gaming as well. Even though the average age of a gamer is 34. Lots of kids are exposed to gambling, even in their games. So, that's a presentation that we do for young people to be aware of the fact that there's gambling elements, within the games that they play. 

BM

I guess that means that everybody is at risk of becoming addicted to gambling simply because of what's around us.

JB

That's right, it doesn't discriminate. It doesn't matter what age you are, what gender you are, where you live… in the nation and anyone's at risk and there's a saturation, really with gambling that we're seeking to break and… think with young people come back to young people briefly is that when they see it everywhere, it feels normal, and they underestimate the risks and that that can be dangerous.

BM

And of course when you're young, you've got that dare mentality. It's an adventure… like any other adventure and of course there are much healthier adventures to be had. I know that it's everywhere, but who is more at risk?

JB

The first thing to say is this half a year you know the footy season has started. So when we look at sports gambling, you see lots of adverts really aimed at young males. You know, you never see the losers in the advert you know, lots of wins and it looks glamorous. And you know, they're often in pubs or social settings as well, there’s a lot of advertising at the moment around bet, betting with mates getting a group together, a gang together, a kind of collective mentality. So, that can be really dangerous for our young blokes. So, we teach anyone really in sporting clubs to love the game, and not to love the odds. Back to their pure sense of sport rather than having gambling attached, you know our young people, if you're 10 years old, you've grown up with gambling as part of your sport, which isn't normal.

BM

No, it's not is it…

JB

No

BM

…that’s not what its about. Crikey. People on the land, are they more at risk than others?

JB

It's, it’s a difficult question because there's lots of facets to it, I suppose. The first thing I would say is that it's very, very accessible. So, back when I was a young fella, you know, I love my love my soccer, being from the UK, as you can probably tell by my accent. I'd have a bet on a Saturday morning complicated odds… I’d have to draw out cash, remember cash, Brigitte?

BM

I still use cash *chuckles*

JB

*chuckles*…withdraw out cash, and then go to the bookmakers, and a big complicated odd sheet and I got bored of that quite quickly. Whereas, now you know, if you're on the land, you get out your phone, tap, tap tap and you've had a bet so it's easier, it's more accessible. So, we're actually spending more money and more often. 

BM

Okay, so that's the risk. But what is the attraction? 

JB

Again, you know, it's everywhere. It's linked to sport intrinsically, in terms of the odds. It's part of our vernacular as such, they're tracking and sometimes, it's everywhere. And luckily, you know, a lot of people are saying, ‘No, that's enough. It's actually too much’, but we still have a lot of work to do in terms of breaking down the harm and the normalisation for some people it goes away from an attraction, and more of a chasing a loss or chasing another win, which is you know, something that is really dangerous, but I'm sure we'll talk about a lot of help out there and talking and getting support early is, is the best thing really.

BM

Can some people see it as a solution to financial problems? Once again being on the land you know, there might have been a bad year so we've still got lots of bills to pay. Well, maybe put five down on something, and I win, I'm out of the hole.

JB

I'm sure that has happened in the past, unfortunately, I think the best, the best thing to advise really is to seek, seek help, but certainly as soon as you can, talk to a trusted mate, if you're falling short of money. You know, you can seek out help with financial counselling. So, Gamblers Help provides financial counselling services. There's also the Rural Financial Counselling Service now in the Wimmera, I know, and Bethany and Community Support, provide help as well in that area. So there's always an alternative to gambling in terms of chasing losses or trying to make up a shortfall in income. You're getting that already dangerous, slippery slope, you keep trying to chase it, and I say this to everyone, there is always a way to spend money and not to make money.

BM

Has anyone ever lost their farm… due to gambling? Are you aware of any situations?

JB

Anecdotally, yeah we would know that is has happened in the past in terms of cases that we were exposed to, in our work that people have lost farms or businesses or…and, and I think unfortunately, as people get deeper into a hole of gambling, and don't seek that support, it's harder for them to make those ends meet, and it's hard in terms of you know, cases where farm…and I know that anecdotally farmers have lost everything, but…um… yeah.

BM

It’s not just the farm. It's the relationships. It's everything in the life.

JB

It is people think about money, and money is often the first thing that people come to us with, with problems and … but it's relationship based. Gambling harm is rarely in isolation. There's often problems with substance abuse and alcohol as well. So the first thing to do is to talk someone…. talk someone… or you're worried about someone, you know, that the other thing to talk about is there's affected others with someone's gambling. When someone is gambling, there's at least four or five other people affected, you know, spouse, children, and they can seek help from us as well. So, it's not just for the gambler as such, it's for people affected around them. We also talk about you know, having that conversation early and planting that seed… and the person might not be quite ready to seek support, but keep chipping away, don't give up, keep reaching out to your friend or leave a help services leaflet on the table and then just walking away can sometimes, can be enough for them to have a look and process it and, and as I said before, financial counselling is often the first and soft step into seeking help for gambling… and addictions as well. 

BM

Of course if you get in touch with CAFS, Child and Family Services, Ballarat, although you operate in this area…

JB

We do, yes

BM

… the Wimmera, it's anonymous. Nobody's gonna go and shout on the roof ‘Hey, such and such got in touch with me’. 

JB

That's right, all our services are free and confidential. So, you can actually seek telephone support through Gamblers Help as well, and so that's 24 hours a day, seven days a week. 

BM

So it's very easy to get in touch.

JB

Very easy to get in touch and sometimes people just want to learn a bit more about how they can help themselves, so on the website, which is gamblershelp.com.au you can just get some tips and tricks to see if you're, you're struggling with this, is this is a concern for you, or just to get some help for yourself as well or for someone around you. Wealth of information on that website.

BM

Okay, can you just give us a few tips? 

JB

Yeah, sure. 

BM

I'm itching to go and spend money on the horses on my phone. *chuckles* What do I do?

JB

*Chuckles* please don’t

BM

*chuckles* no I’m not

JB

*chuckles* No its okay *chuckles* It can be tricky for some people and we know that in rural areas, you know, the country cup is a big thing. It's all about… coming back to what I said previously, that it's a way to spend money and not to make money, so setting a limit for yourself and knowing that if you've got that amount of money, that you're prepared to lose it, and then when it when it's gone, it's gone. You know, find something else to do going to catch up with a mate or have a drink with someone else and do something else, if you're at the races… and setting that limit for yourself can be a healthy first step. 

I speak a lot about alternative recreation. If you're on the land, can you go and volunteer? Can you go to the Men's Shed? Can you join the Active Farmers program? Can you do something to improve the health and wellbeing in a different way? There's, there's heaps of different things you can do and part of my role is, is encouraging people who may be thinking about gambling to actually do something else, to get out and about to get healthy. For me, where I work, it's all about soccer. So, its gets us getting out and getting people active in that way. But it could be joining a local running group or volunteering in a different way.

BM

Volunteering is such a lifesaver, isn't it? 

JB

It really is, a lot during COVID having that social connection and the power of being connected to one another and it's such a powerful tool for us, especially in rural communities to reach out, I know we are… in rural communities we're very good at helping each other and checking in on people but we can always do better

BM

and you know do something else, we're talking about gambling… pokie machines, 

JB

Yes 

BM

They’re gambling as well, aren’t they? 

JB

They are

BM

To see someone that's usually an older person who may be living on their own, and it's their way to… have a social time being, another, being in another place where there other people. 

JB

That’s right

BM

There's no connection between people. 

JB

That’s right

BM

Its only the machine.

JB

It can be a real challenge for vulnerable members of our communities, older people and people that are vulnerable in other ways… and we're very aware of the fact that pokies venues are warm in the winter, and cool in the summer

BM

There is that too if you don't have much money, you can’t heat up your house or cool it down. 

JB

That's right. 

BM

That's the alternative

JB

But it's important to say, we provide training to venue staff who work in the pokies venues to recognise people who might be struggling with gambling issues as well. So, we provide a kind of wraparound service for venues as well, so they can recognise those signs. 

BM

Great

JB

But yeah, my first step would be to find alternative recreation and one thing we are doing is… is a scheme that isn't in the Wimmera at the moment, and I'm hoping it will be, is libraries after dark where we open the library once a week… until about nine or 10pm and provide alternative recreation…instead of going to the pokies.

BM

Then of course there's church. 

JB

Yes… 

BM

Which has a big part to play in the social side…

JB

We’ve got family groups, I know in already we have family groups and we have people who look out for us and you know, sharing meals and….

BM

Do you actually go and have education sessions in churches as well.

JB

I haven't been to any churches recently, but, but I'm very flexible. 

Big a big outlet to me is the Neighbourhood House network, so I go to Neighbourhood houses and I talk to groups about… looking after your money, being aware of gambling harm, so you know what it looks like if you're struggling with this stuff, and what it looks like in your mate as well. So looking out for people around you. 

BM

Okay. 

JB

Yeah

BM

It’s…its very hard to… to notice that someone is a gambling addict. You can see if someone's drinking too much, but if you're gambling there's no outward with signs.

JB

That’s right. We, we call it the hidden harm, because it hasn't often, hasn't got a physical manifestation like drug abuse or alcohol abuse so, so can be difficult to spot. What we always say is, you know, is gambling in the mix. So if you see someone who you're close to, or recognising yourself and you're running short of money each fortnight, are you using gambling to… to make up a shortfall in in the budget, then that's can be a sign that you've… you've got an issue that you may need to address. Is your appearance starting to deteriorate slightly? Are you starting to withdraw from your mates a bit more? You know, all these little signs, or signs you recognise in someone else that could be a problem.

BM

Anything else you would like to share with people on the land?

JB

I suppose that like with any problem, calling Gamblers Help with 1800-858-858. Having a chat with someone. Sometimes it's a walk and a talk, you know, the end of a hard day just going through a bit of a wonder and saying that this is a bit of a problem. As I mentioned, always talk, share, support, Brigitte. Finding someone you can talk to sharing the problems and getting their support you need.

BM

Its the same with any health issue, isn't it? You've got to share with someone, we’re social beings

JB

We really, really are. There's always a healthier alternative. I think one thing that COVID has taught us is, we've kind of got out of our comfort zone and tried lots of different things and I for me I'm running is my new passion. So I just get out and I'll just I'll just run so there's, you know, we live in such a beautiful country, don’t we, so getting out and about and going for a walk or going for a run is really, really important. 

BM

Exactly. Yeah.

JB

Does our wellbeing good.

BM

And it's something you can do with other people as well. 

JB

That's right.

BM

*Chuckles* Well thank you very much for enlightening me on gambling and what can be done about it. 

JB

Thank you

BM

And hopefully a lot of people who may have problems or know someone who has a problem, will be in touch. 

JB

That's great. Thanks, Brigitte.

BM

Thank you, John. 

JB

Thanks for having me. 

BM

John Bradshaw there, Gamblers Help Community Engagement Officer at CAFS. 

You will find as always contact numbers and details in the notes attached to this episode. And while you're at it, please give us a star rating. We'd also love to hear your comments and suggestions. Our Facebook and Twitter details are in the notes. Until next have a healthy life won’t you.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai edited by WWHS Health Promotion Team