Encountering a crossroads in life often brings us to a moment of reflection and potential transformation. I met with Dr. Don St. John, who not only navigated his own challenging journey from a traumatic past but emerged to teach others about finding empowerment and joy. Throughout our conversation, he shares his insights into the healing process, emphasizing the necessity of addressing both emotional and physical traumas to tap into a state of wholeness. Dr. Don's story is a beacon for anyone who feels weighed down by their past, illuminating a path that leads to a vibrant, fulfilling existence even at the young age of 80.
This episode explores the ongoing quest for wholeness, taking us through the deep questions about our parental influences and the evolution of love over the span of a lifetime. Dr. Don St. John provides a window into the four pillars of wholeness, starting with the somatic experience and extending into the psychological and emotional realms. He guides us through the challenging, yet rewarding, work of self-awareness and harmony, both within ourselves and in our interactions with others.
Concluding our emotional journey, Dr. Don imparts a powerful message of hope and adaptation, suggesting that our essence has the same fluidity and resilience as water. We delve into the spiritual perception of the heart, not merely as an emotional center, but as a profound organ of spiritual perception. His narrative, rich with personal anecdotes and transformative moments, serves as an invitation to all listeners to discover their authenticity, lead with love, and pursue an empowered life from within. Such a life, he assures us, is not just a possibility but a reachable destination for each and every one of us.
Encountering a crossroads in life often brings us to a moment of reflection and potential transformation. I met with Dr. Don St. John, who not only navigated his own challenging journey from a traumatic past but emerged to teach others about finding empowerment and joy. Throughout our conversation, he shares his insights into the healing process, emphasizing the necessity of addressing both emotional and physical traumas to tap into a state of wholeness. Dr. Don's story is a beacon for anyone who feels weighed down by their past, illuminating a path that leads to a vibrant, fulfilling existence even at the young age of 80.
This episode explores the ongoing quest for wholeness, taking us through the deep questions about our parental influences and the evolution of love over the span of a lifetime. Dr. Don St. John provides a window into the four pillars of wholeness, starting with the somatic experience and extending into the psychological and emotional realms. He guides us through the challenging, yet rewarding, work of self-awareness and harmony, both within ourselves and in our interactions with others.
Concluding our emotional journey, Dr. Don imparts a powerful message of hope and adaptation, suggesting that our essence has the same fluidity and resilience as water. We delve into the spiritual perception of the heart, not merely as an emotional center, but as a profound organ of spiritual perception. His narrative, rich with personal anecdotes and transformative moments, serves as an invitation to all listeners to discover their authenticity, lead with love, and pursue an empowered life from within. Such a life, he assures us, is not just a possibility but a reachable destination for each and every one of us.
Welcome to Empowered Within, a soul-quenching, transformational podcast that will set your soul on fire. Through candid and inspiring conversations, leading experts, celebrities, healers and I share our journeys of how we've overcome challenges to living an empowered life from within. I'm your host, jennifer Pilates. Welcome to another episode of Empowered Within. Hi there and welcome to the show. I am honored to have with us today's guest, dr Don St John. He's a psychotherapist and continuum conscious teacher. He's the author of the award-winning book Healing the Wounds of Childhood and his revision, healing the Wounds of Childhood Culture. Welcome to the show, dr Don.
Speaker 2:
Thank you, I'm delighted to be here and looking forward to our conversation.
Speaker 1:
I'm so honored to have you here and I want to dive right in because your story is such an amazing one. You talk about having an over-the-top traumatic childhood. Your destiny was early death after a miserable life. Yet you are a young 80 years old, talking about how the last 50 years were better than ever. So take us back to where it started, to how you got to where you are now living this empowered, happy life.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, that's a big question. It started in 1943. I was born and almost died at birth, so that was the initial entry into the world. And to make this succinct and not drive your readers or listeners crazy with the different traumas in my early childhood, suffice to say that my mother would lose control and swing, and it started when I was an infant and it continued until I was old enough to say that's it, no more. I'm bigger than you are now, so about 15 or 16 years or so.
Speaker 2:
It was miserable in so many ways. The result was that internally I froze. I was incapable of really feeling and therefore incapable of connecting with another human being in a way that was nourishing, but, of course, living it. One doesn't realize how wildly crazy that is. It seems normal, and the attraction to alcohol from age 15 was great because I felt alive when I drink, and so I never became an alcoholic, but definitely a problem drinker. Relationships were extremely difficult. Intimate relationships came and went very quickly, and one day I woke up in the backseat of my car at 5 o'clock in the morning. I knew in that moment that I needed help. That was in 1964, and it began a journey that has lasted to this day and, as you said, yes, I'm 80 years old and, as you said, yes, I'm 80 years old, I teach fluid movement, taught intimacy classes, those things that were impossible for me.
Speaker 1:
And you've studied so much, you've learned so much. And in your book you talked about how you were frozen in time, living in that frozen state. You talk about the autonomic nervous system.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, it's the autonomic nervous system that does two things. One, it maintains us in equipose or equilibrium or balance, and when necessary, it prepares us, it mobilizes us to either run if we can't get away, fight when that's overwhelmed. Get away, fight when that's overwhelmed, when the organism gets impacted in a situation like I said I almost died at birth, there was nowhere to run and nothing to fight or, for example, even a car accident, that nervous system gets overwhelmed and you can't run, you can't fight, you freeze. That's your last line of defense. Or you just go limp and I lived in that state and that goes along with the muscle system. That's way over tense and we can talk about the effects of chronic tension if you want. But that was my life and I had headaches and I loved sports but I didn't have the capacities to be good at it because I was so disconnected from myself, from my organism.
Speaker 1:
How did you begin your journey to become connected and start that healing process?
Speaker 2:
I went to the Yellow Pages and found a psychiatrist who worked on Saturdays, because I was still in the Air Force and Saturdays were a day off. And I found a therapist psychiatrist and I made an appointment. And then I got interested in psychoanalysis and one thing led to another. I realized that five or six years into it that my body had to be addressed because the tensions were profound and it's part of our emotional psychological system. For example, if you were a casting director for a movie and I was a producer and I said, jennifer, I want you to find someone who has very low self-confidence, is shy, withdrawn, okay, you get a picture of that in your mind. Now, if I said also find someone who's assertive, confident out there, get a picture of that in your mind in two different bodies.
Speaker 1:
Right, because the body and the personality correspond to each other that is fascinating the other thing that I found very fascinating is part of your, a part of your work that you share and what you wrote about in your book is you talk about how we all have been wounded by life in our culture, and healing those wounds, releasing those limitations, is what we're here to do, and you talk about four dimensions that we need to tap into for healing for true healing on our journey while we're here on earth. Will you dive into that a little bit? I found that quite fascinating, that the depth that you went into those dimensions.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, it's amazing. What I came to simply in the process of pursuing healing for myself and it's my central message is that we all need healing, meaning the journey towards wholeness, that I can ask your listeners a couple, three questions. One would you want your marriage to be exactly like your parents? Two were you able, as a child, to confide in your parents your deepest feelings and most people that I've asked those questions?
Speaker 1:
to say no, that's what I was thinking.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, I get a hard no, where we're elevating, growing our conception of what it means to be human and why we're here. And if you look at the state of the world and we all do, and we all lament, complain, dread, get frightened by all of that is a reflection of where we are as a species at this moment in time and that this journey that I call the healing journey is about elevating our capacities in order to live in harmony within ourselves and among ourselves.
Speaker 1:
Agreed. So how do we get there? How do we work on these four dimensions that you talk about? Because it doesn't sound. It's not easy, but it's not hard either, right, when you get on that journey. It's a tango that you have to do that. You have to be willing to work on yourself.
Speaker 2:
Yes, I think, jennifer. I think both are true. It's not easy. I think both are true. It's not easy, it's work, and we will encounter major challenges and disturbances and surprises along the way, for sure.
Speaker 2:
But the rewards of staying the course are so great. For example, I couldn't sustain an intimate relationship, and throughout my 20s it was just even into my 30s I've been now with the same woman, my wife, 40 years together. We're both in our 80s, we're still learning about each other, we're still exploring our sexuality and discovering and learning and growing. And that's amazing and I'm not saying in the sense of pride or bragging, I'm saying it because people don't realize that this is possible that we can continue to grow throughout the lifespan. We could even become more fluid in our bodies as we age, even though I recognize and personally know that force of aging is no joke. It's no joke. It's to stay limber, to stay mobile, takes attention, takes effort, takes work, but it's all worth it. And I came up with four dimensions, called them pillars of wholeness, and would you like me to describe them a little bit?
Speaker 1:
Absolutely, because your work is incredible and I really I think it takes a depth that we haven't seen a lot in our society, so I would absolutely love for you to dive into those.
Speaker 2:
Okay, the first I call the somatic, and the word soma means living body. Most of the studies of the human body have been done on corpses, going way back into the 18th century. In the early anatomical studies have been done with corpses. So we know a lot about the body, how the joints work, what the tissues are made of, etc. Etc. Etc. And it's important. That whole dimension is important.
Speaker 2:
However, what we don't know about is the connection to our body, our felt sense, our experience from the inside. And if I said to you what is a body? What does that mean? The human body? One thing is that it's approximately 70% liquid. Then you ask the question how does liquid move? Does liquid move like a machine? Liquid moves in waves and spirals and there's a discipline called continuum, which I teach, which is a meditation on that level of movement, that internal, deep, wave, spiral-like movement in our bodies. And as that connection with ourselves develops, our capacity to connect with others increases. So the more chronic tension that a person is holding it does a couple of things. One is it primes the brain. It serves as a feedback mechanism to the brain to prepare to run or fight. That fight-flight mechanism that we started with is reinforced by chronic tension. Two it cuts us off from parts of ourselves, for example.
Speaker 2:
One of the things most important in an intimate relationship is the ability to speak from the heart. If you and I are together and if we can reveal our hearts to each other, there's a quality to that communication that you feel it reaches in. It's not just concepts exchanged, it reaches in. It's not just concepts exchanged, it's this quality of energy that we can feel and be nourished by. But if we're immersed in chronic tension it's harder to do that. So that's a little bit of this somatic dimension. I wrote a lot about that in my book. I'll talk about that later. But der Kolk and he's talking about how trauma affects the body. But it's not yet culturally understood how that happens and what can be done about it. The second is our psychological, emotional dimension, and that involves to a large extent understanding what we really believe to be true about ourselves, other people and the world. And these beliefs get formulated by the time we're three, four, five years old. Get formulated, by the time we're three, four, five years old, beliefs such as I can trust my caretakers to meet my needs or not. The world is a safe place or it isn't. Those beliefs, those really fundamental beliefs about life, about ourselves, get formulated. And in this process on this journey, it's important to uncover them. They serve as filters and they allow in information that's congruent with the filter and they keep out information which isn't.
Speaker 2:
If a person believes that they're really not good enough and the percentage of people who carry that I can't even estimate it could be 80, it could be 40. It's a lot of people who carry that I can't even estimate. It could be 80. It could be 40. It's a lot of people I'm not good enough, I don't deserve to be really loved.
Speaker 2:
So if you go up to that person and say you're a wonderful human being, I can see it in your eyes. That's not going to reach him Because it contradicts something that they know is true. And until that can be brought to light, then they begin to have the opportunity to test it. For example and this takes us into the relationship area If I have a belief that I can't be close to someone without losing my freedom and if I don't know that, I deeply believe that every time I get close to someone it's going to engender anxiety because I'm in a danger zone, I'm going to lose my freedom. I know it, I know it, and until we can recognize that we're operating on that principle. It just runs us automatically.
Speaker 1:
How do you work with people to get to that point so that they understand that subconscious beliefs that are running, that they may not be aware of, that are a detriment to what's going on in their world?
Speaker 2:
I'm going to give you an interesting answer. I do my very best and it's not hard, but I do my very best to love them and to just keep that energy of love right there and then begin to point out how they respond to that, how they block it. What are the conflicts around it?
Speaker 1:
Very deep. Yeah, that's very deep.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, it is. It took me a lot of years to be able to do that and say that, but I'm at that stage of my career where I'm not striving or insecure about it and it's a very simple answer. It's you just love them, but with the psychological sophistication and appropriate boundaries and all of that right. But the essence is love.
Speaker 1:
That's so powerful and I do feel that is a huge piece that's missing in our culture.
Speaker 2:
That understanding. Yeah, and that's why, jennifer, I say that what we're here to do is to move in that direction, where we're living from and in love.
Speaker 1:
And if someone's listening right now and someone goes, that sounds wonderful, Dr Dawn, how the heck do I get there? What's a simple step to help me in the right direction today?
Speaker 2:
Go on amazoncom and order my book first. Yes, her in my book at first. And, jennifer, the reason I say that is in that book. I talk about how we get wounded. I had a friend some years ago who got in trouble with an addiction and when he was talking to me about it he said he had to find the trauma. He knew it is related to trauma and he had to find what it was. And so I want to clarify a huge misconception about that, because it's usually not a trauma, it's a quality of relationship with one's parents. That's the baseline and it's, for example, and it's not to blame Because, again, we're living in a cultural fabric where that's more or less the norm, where parents don't look into your eyes and say can you tell me how that feels?
Speaker 2:
Or let me help you understand what you're feeling. A toddler, a young child, they're all feeling, but they don't have the words and they need help. And you know we don't recognize that yet as a culture. It doesn't have to be that somebody molested you when you were four years old and that was the source of all your life difficulties. It could be a certain deprivation.
Speaker 2:
I like to use the metaphor of nutrition A person can get three meals a day, even bought from Whole Foods, in other words, expensive meals a day. But if they're missing a vitamin, if they're not getting any vitamin C in those three meals, they're going to suffer. And there are emotional, psychological nutrients that are needed. But who knows about that? Who understands that? Now, let me quickly say it's beginning to happen. Now, let me quickly say it's beginning to happen. I look out at the world and I can see the horror of it all. You don't have to look far these days, right, but I can also look out at so many Right here, for example, the work you're doing. I don't know if you reach. I looked at some of your podcasts and it's fascinating. I don't know if you reach 10 people or 10,000 or somewhere in between, but it's a pot of light. Thank you Lots of them, and it makes me optimistic. It makes me feel good that, as a whole, we're improving that fabric out of which we weave our individual families, our individual lives.
Speaker 1:
Yeah, and that kind of weaves us right into something that you talked about. That I think is important. I feel our society is in seeing light and transmuting a lot of dark. That's been out there. In your book you talk about how to achieve the spiritual dimension of wholeness.
Speaker 2:
Yes.
Speaker 1:
And so many don't understand that statement, or have a very small, vague bubble gum in the container. 25 cents knowledge of it. And your depth, your knowledge, you've gone so deep into it that it's something that really needs to be shared with our society.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, there are a couple of ways that we can begin to look at the issue of our society, the level, again going back to that metaphor of the fabric, many people believe that being religious means simply to have the right beliefs, go to the right church. Okay, pretty much, that's it. Be a good person, don't steal or cheat or hurt. Okay, and not a problem there. But it misses the mark, and it misses the mark in a big way because, see, spiritual work is everything that I've been talking about so far. It's, first of all, it's work To get closer to living in love. The experience, the felt sense of love is a work of a lifetime, and there are those who say many lifetimes. I'm not going to argue because I know I wish I had another 50 years to continue this work, because all these levels and this is very not understood all these levels that I'm talking about need to be addressed in the process Our connection to our bodies, which is a topic in and of itself.
Speaker 2:
That connection to our bodies, going deep enough, connects me to outside my body, my body as a separate, contained, egoic. I begins to dissolve into something beyond, and so you can get a sense of transcending this separateness simply by going into the body, in relationships, for example, the love that's possible between human beings can again transcend this egoic sense of mine, my animal instincts, my four-year-old sense of it's all mine. And so that's work and that's my message to let's do it together, let's all do this. It's awesome, the rewards are awesome. I can attest to that from my personal experience. I think that's what the world needs. I think that's what the fabric of our civilization needs to keep elevating so we don't drop bombs on each other and kill 30,000 people in two months and that kind of thing I agree with you.
Speaker 1:
I agree with you, absolutely agree with you. So, when you look at both books, one is the original, one is the extended, the revised. What is your number one hope that readers take away from it?
Speaker 2:
My number one hope that readers take away from it. My number one hope that readers take away is that no matter where they are in their lives right now, the potential exists for a problems emotional, relational, even chronic illness, even chronic illness Addictions 75% of the population with those categories that they can recognize that there's so many resources now out there that my parents never had and my grandparents certainly never had. Their main issue was putting enough food on that table and keep their kids out of jail. But now we've got so much more comprehension and so many more resources, and my book mentions some of those talks about, explains some of those resources that people can look towards to support themselves. And then the second takeaway, jennifer, is for people to realize that who they really are is so much more than who they think they are. Who they think they are is so much more limited than who they really are.
Speaker 2:
Even if you simply look at the body and recognize that it's primarily water and you look at water and say what's the nature of water? It's one of the most adaptable substances known to man. It's one of the most adaptable substances known to man, one of the most receptive, one of the most powerful, one of the most humble. Runs at our feet, washes our feet, it nourishes everywhere. One of the most resilient, transparent by light.
Speaker 1:
Okay, so that's where who we are at our essence that is beautiful and such an incredible reminder for anyone who is sitting in any place of doubt to truly tap into who and what we really are.
Speaker 2:
That's yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:
Very powerful. Dr Dawn, we are getting to this point in the show where I ask this very special question Are you ready?
Speaker 2:
Okay, let me have it.
Speaker 1:
What is one thing that possibly no one knows about, dr Don?
Speaker 2:
I grew up afraid of my own shadow, not literally, obviously, but the whole lot of fear, simultaneously with the whole lot of pretense about how fearless I was. And the process of becoming real, manifesting some of those qualities that I just spoke about, has been a journey of almost 60 years that continues to this day.
Speaker 1:
That is amazing. What a great share.
Speaker 2:
Thank you, thank you Thank you for that.
Speaker 1:
That's very powerful and everything about you is so powerful and so deep and so much more of what I feel we all need. Every person needs in this entire world right now to tune out, to tune in and connect with our deeper selves.
Speaker 2:
Absolutely. Can I show my book on the camera Please? Yes, of course. Healing the Wounds of Childhood and Culture. Excellentconnectioncom.
Speaker 1:
Thank you for that and, of course, all of Dr Don's information will be over in the show notes on jenniferpilatescom. You'll be able to connect with his website and grab a copy of his book. As we close out the show today, dr Don, what is one last piece of inspiration that you would like to leave with us today?
Speaker 2:
Attend to your heart, listen to your heart, get to know your heart. I'm not talking about the hallmark cards heart. I'm talking about an organ of spiritual perception. Get to know it.
Speaker 1:
You have absolutely brought me to tears with that one. So thank you for that, and I think that is truly what we all do need to tend to our hearts and tend to the hearts that are around us and lead with love. Absolutely. Dr Don, thank you so much for your book, for sharing your knowledge and your journey and your insights today. I'm so honored to have you on and be in your presence and learn from you.
Speaker 2:
Thank you so very much Thank you. It's been a pleasure really when are you?
Speaker 1:
located, so I am yeah, I'm in the midst of traveling so it's fun. So you never know where I'm going to pop up.
Speaker 2:
If you ever pop up in Salt Lake City, you know where to find me.
Speaker 1:
I just might take you up on it, because that is one spot that I've not been to yet, and I do love a little snow.
Speaker 2:
Good.
Speaker 1:
Went to the right place in the winter Wonderful. Thank you again, dr Dawn. This has been fabulous and, as we say, until next time, may you live an empowered life from within. Thank you so much for tuning in to another episode. Please remember to rate, review and subscribe to Empowered Within with Jennifer Pilates. Your feedback is important. It helps me to connect with you and gives me insight into who you are and what you're enjoying about the show. For today's show notes and discount codes from today's sponsors head over to JenniferPilatescom Until next time, may you live an empowered life from within.