Acts 13 - Dynamic Duos

Summary:
On this week's Wade in the Word, Gregg DeMey (Lead Pastor), Jeff Klein (Pastor of Outreach), and Caryn Rivadeneira (Director of Care) follow Paul and Barnabas on their travels, where they tangle with sorcerers, fire up crowds with their succinct sermons, and leave Jewish leaders green with envy.

Today's Hosts
Gregg DeMey, Lead Pastor
Jeff Klein, Pastor of Outreach
Caryn Rivadeneira, Director of Care

Questions/Comments:  We'd love to hear from you! Email ASK.

Note: Wade in the Word is a weekly podcast designed to take a deep dive into scripture for the weekend message. Join our pastors, staff, and occasional special guests as we reflect together.

Wade in the Word podcast is a production of Elmhurst Christian Reformed Church, located in Elmhurst, IL. Wade in the Word is produced and audio-engineered by Kyle Olson, Technical Director. For more information about Elmhurst CRC or to find out about other tools and resources to grow you and your family in faith, visit elmhurstcrc.org.

Transcript

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

barnabas, paul, people, god, jesus, scripture, antioch, sermon, called, saul, hear, synagogue, read, holy spirit, gospel, fasting, speaking, blindness, word, verse

SPEAKERS

Caryn Rivadeneira, Gregg DeMey, Jeffrey Klein

Gregg DeMey  00:04

Hey, welcome to the Elmhurst CRC Wade in the Word podcast where we dive deep into a chapter of the Bible every week. This week, we're going to be in Acts chapter 13. Gregg DeMey here with Jeff Klein, who always add some extra energy and provocation.

Jeffrey Klein  00:20

 I am Here I am ready. I'm ready to rock and roll. Yeah. 

Gregg DeMey  00:24

And Caryn Rivadeneira, who is supposed to add some care department and compassionate perspective. 

Caryn Rivadeneira  00:30

And I always do I just always bring kindness and love. Right, we do need some kind of someone needs to

Gregg DeMey  00:38

hate this. If you're listening to this in advance of the weekend, with Sunday, August 29. We're not gonna have a regular worship service. So very good move to tap into this podcast this but we will have worship. So we are going to have an online-only worship service. We intentionally have those a little bit shorter, there will still be a sermon. But

Gregg DeMey  00:59

yeah, I think it awesome that we're doing this.

Gregg DeMey  01:02

So I was talking to somebody in the Chicagoland area just a couple days ago. They don't live in Elmhurst directly, they work for a Christian organization, different part of the city, and they were having a conversation with a co-worker, and his co-worker contrasted either treating people according to Scripture or treating people with love as if those were like opposite ends of the continuum. And I was kind of horrified by that this person I was having a conversation with was horrified by that. And I hope that for our listening audience, or members of our community, that if you hear that as a false dichotomy, you instantly recognize that that is a false dichotomy. So by diving deep into a chapter of the book of Acts, every week, we are not trying to be anti-love, or get more scripture in us so that you can whack people with Scripture and stop treating them with kindness and love. But oh, you these things should go together.

Jeffrey Klein  01:59

There's a Instagram account called the and I think it's called the andcampaign. It's all about truth and love, and how we treat each other and they have a whole conversation going on there about can we be Christians, but disagree, or be people and disagree and have these loving and truthful conversations. So it's really interesting little Instagram account. And of course, I

Caryn Rivadeneira  02:20

sit here getting nervous because I agree with all of that. And but I think maybe the point is that we have erred so strongly on this idea of truth, and feeling like we need to hammer certain communities or people with it sometimes when we do forget to love, or we forget to show loving this on there. So I'm on more team love. But of course according to Scripture,

Gregg DeMey  02:41

I'm rejecting the dichotomy and no teams altogether. There's no

Jeffrey Klein  02:45

team. Tough

Caryn Rivadeneira  02:47

Yeah, anyway.

Gregg DeMey  02:48

No. Love every church, every organization, probably in every individual believers heart, there is a temptation now and again, to set up that false dichotomy and think, nope, this one needs to win in this particular situation. And I would say again, and again.

Jeffrey Klein  03:06

Yo, no, and are you to it, you need to subscribe. So here's what

Caryn Rivadeneira  03:09

I will do that. Here's where I come from, from a long time ago, I worked for marriage partnership magazine for a long time. And there's all this stuff about your biblical marriage, biblical marriage, we use that. And I always think so again, this I'm not the first one to say this. But it's tough. Because when you look at the whole of Scripture, there's a lot of different ideas, there's polygamy, there's adultery, all this sort of stuff that happens. And so that's where I think the love thing comes in is like Jesus changed a lot of stuff. So I think that we just need to sometimes be careful because people do pick and choose scripture, as you know, and use that against people sometimes or for people. So that's all I'm saying. That's why I'm, I make these pastors. So now I'm following you

Gregg DeMey  03:48

exactly. But he already made it listeners to polygamy within the first two minutes. So

Jeffrey Klein  03:53

if you hear a hammer, it's me hitting a car with a hammer.

Gregg DeMey  03:58

It clearly male intentioned or uninformed folks have taken probably every verse of the Bible and misapplied it. So what we're trying to do in this podcast is take an entire chapter of the Bible, relate it to the rest of the Bible so that we have a very wide embrace of what God reveals rather than trying to take our just favorite verse or a singularly seemingly potent verse, and then just sharpening that up and seeing what we can do with it.

Caryn Rivadeneira  04:27

Yeah, for sure. And I think when you look at the Bible is God's love story of his you know, going after God's people. I think that that helps. Anyway, now that that makes it more team love. All right.

Gregg DeMey  04:36

So we are going to jump into this by this chapter, the Bible. We're going to start with the last verse of Acts chapter 12, and then work our way through Acts chapter 13. Here we go. When Barnabas and Saul had finished their mission, they returned from Jerusalem taking with them John, who is also called Mark.

Jeffrey Klein  04:55

Now in the church at Antioch, there were prophets and teachers. Barnabas, Simeon called Niger, Lucius of sirene, Manaen, who had been brought up with Herod the Tetrarch. And Saul, while they were worshipping the Lord and fasting, the Holy Spirit said, set apart for me Barnabas and Saul for the work to which I have called them. So after they had fasted and prayed, they placed their hands in them and sent them off.

Gregg DeMey  05:24

Alright, so they're going to be a lot of names in Acts chapter 13. And so, we're gonna meet this dynamic duo time and time again, Barnabas and Saul we also meet John who is also called Mark. We do know from one of Paul's later letters Colossians I think that john mark is Barnabas his cousin? Yep.

Jeffrey Klein  05:46

We also know that John Mark most likely was the author, author, maybe even if Peters New Testament letters, some people think he dictated them to john mark, who wrote them down because Peter probably did not a writer wasn't certainly a writer. He was a fisherman. So

Gregg DeMey  06:02

yeah, probably Peter's Greek was not awesome. And Peter refers to mark being with him right? In one of his letters. So quite possibly, yeah, Mark was the scribe or can I was mentored by Peter, quite likely this john mark is the author of the Gospel of Mark as well. Yeah.

Jeffrey Klein  06:20

I also love some of these names. Sometimes we skim over these, right, but like, I love this one right here, it shows the reach of the gospel Manaen. And it says in parentheses, who have been brought up with Herod the tetrarch, who is here to and tapas, so here it Antipas was a ruthless character who never understood the truth, who received Jesus or loved anybody, right. And here's a guy that was brought up with him, it was probably his fast friend growing up or whatever, I don't know how that looked. But he has come to know Jesus and is one of the prophets and teachers in Antioch, who is now sending Paula vibes and admission that's, that's cool to me. That a guy you know, that was there to touch Ark has now been transformed radically by the gospel. That's awesome.

Gregg DeMey  07:05

So many other names. Lucius, from Cyrene. I mean, Cyrene in North Africa. So again, the extending the reach, we're talking about, like a multi-continent. Yes. And the experience at this point.

Jeffrey Klein  07:17

Yeah. So I love that. I love that.

Gregg DeMey  07:20

So the first mission that Barnabas and Saul got commissioned into was to take an offering to the mother church in Jerusalem. So they are just coming back to the bigger city of Antioch, the more cosmopolitan international city of Antioch. And

Gregg DeMey  07:41

they're about to receive a second mission. So we get a little window into what was going on in the early church in Antioch, there are prophets there, they're having this experience of seeking God and fasting and praying, and lo and behold, the Holy Spirit breaks through with some new marching orders for Barnabas and Saul, 

Caryn Rivadeneira  08:01

right, in a nose, I just underline that in about the Holy Spirit speaking there, because it this now seems so tame in comparison to the other soup, you know, we've talked a lot about the supernatural breaking in, you know, and all these other stories. And then you come to this, and it's like, oh, the Holy Spirit said, blah, blah, blah, because it's not an angel knocking, but like, still, this is amazing, the clarity of this and saying, you know, to set the southern part for the work that I've called them to do, like, this is a huge moment to that, I think, most of us would love to have this to hear this clear word from the Holy Spirit, you know, saying set apart, you are them. You know, for the work, it's 

Jeffrey Klein  08:32

Yeah, I think that, like, when I think about how the church is supposed to work, I mean, you know, one way you can give people a mission is you can browbeat them and say, you know, You lousy Christians, what's wrong with you get going, try harder, you know, try harder, work harder, be more discipline, you know, do it out of duty, or guilt, whatever. Those are all bad motivations, the best motivation for mission is to hear from the Holy Spirit. I want you to go do this. This is what I've set you apart to do. That is a pretty powerful motivation, right? When you hear the Spirit of God speaking to you in some way, in Spirit speaks a lot of ways it could be through a sermon, it could be you're reading the Bible, it could be you're sitting quietly. In this case, they're fasting, and they're praying, and the Spirit speaks. I wish we could teach people how to how-to, I guess, understand or hear or even teach myself how to always catch when the Spirit speaking to me, right, sometimes I think I miss it. 

Gregg DeMey  09:22

Yeah, so I mean, definitely part of the How to is I mean, these Christian practices of fasting and prayer. So fasting, not to punish yourself, not to starve yourself. But fasting is voluntarily ceasing some kind of normal or healthy behavior, so that you can pay more attention to God. Right, so probably they were fasting from food. At this point, I think generally, that's what fasting means, but in our modern era, equally valid to fast from food or shopping or just being on the internet so you can give God more of your mind and attention. And again, you don't get

Gregg DeMey  10:00

extra points for doing it for 40 days and 40 nights. But even like a day, or even a few hour period might give God the extra permission to nudge or whisper or say something new, where the messaging, you know, might not break through these ordinary and not bad things that we're always up to.

Jeffrey Klein  10:19

Yeah,

Caryn Rivadeneira  10:20

yeah, I think I'm an I'm a terrible faster I'll admit that right now. But in times when I do, seek stillness, or silence or just time with God, there is something we it seems silly like God, I'm going to give you this time. So have at it, you know, it's not that God needs always that permission, but it does. I feel like it really does do something when you are anticipating it to like you're saying it because you are primed to hear from the Holy Spirit. And yes, certainly having

Gregg DeMey  10:45

we're leveraging God, or earning his blessing that way, in the same way, that like our financial gifts, like God doesn't need our tithes and offerings either, but he loves it when we use our freedom to give and then honors that and multiplies it. Yeah, I think that's what I'm saying. Same thing with our time.

Jeffrey Klein  11:04

Yeah. And this is also the I like the immediate obedience of this. It's not like they said they fasted and prayed and they thought they should do this. And so purposes Oh, and packed their bags and got a lolly liability insurance policy and prepare for their mission trip. They just can't they just go. It just can't lay their hands on and sent them off of the going out. We don't know what that looks like. Exactly. But it seems super immediate obedience, not just waiting around waiting for all the

Caryn Rivadeneira  11:30

thinking about it talking to people about it, was

Jeffrey Klein  11:32

it you know, like, they just off they went?

Gregg DeMey  11:37

Yep. Hopefully they got their malaria shots.

Jeffrey Klein  11:40

That's all I'm saying. Like, it's so funny. I remember this experience getting ready for a missions trip with a church I was at and the mission's pastor was running it. And we were reading the passage in the gospels when Jesus sent them off to buy two. And if we read the whole passage, he's like, you know, this flies in the face of everything I do to get us ready for these missions trips like Jesus did none of this, he just said, Go, you know, we have all these things to put in place first and all this, you know, and again, it's obviously wisdom to put those things in place. But sometimes I wonder if that doesn't get in the way of our immediate obedience and just going we get ourselves in such an analytical mode that we almost get ourselves out of the, you know, real obedience to the spirit

Caryn Rivadeneira  12:22

and fairness, or do we really think they just immediately left with a loaf of bread and apparently through

Jeffrey Klein  12:27

the party had a goodbye,

Caryn Rivadeneira  12:30

party, but I mean, maybe they rolled up a mat.

Gregg DeMey  12:33

Yeah, unless we think they're like, off to some unknown jungle. I mean, as we're about to hear, the first place they stop off is Cypress, which Barnabas actually had formerly on land and Cyprus. True. We know from early x, and then there into Asia Minor, not so far from the city of Tarsus, where Paul was born and raised. So both of them had at least some familiarity with the two major destinations that are gonna be on their itinerary 

Jeffrey Klein  13:01

they were sent to the wealthy areas to do missions.

Jeffrey Klein  13:06

missions trip, go to Hawaii preach the gospel.

Caryn Rivadeneira  13:13

Their time on islands here. This is right, this is

Gregg DeMey  13:16

 Well speaking of their itinerary. Let's continue on starting at x 13, verse four. So the two of them Barnabas and Saul, that is were sent on their way by the Holy Spirit. They went down to Seleucia and sailed from there to Cyprus. When they arrived at Salamis, they proclaimed the Word of God in the Jewish synagogues, and John was with them as their helper.

Caryn Rivadeneira  13:37

 They traveled through the whole island until they came to Paphos. There they met a Jewish sorcerer and false prophet named Bard Jesus who was an attendant of the proconsul Sergius Paulus. The Pro Council, an intelligent man sent for Barnabas and Saul because he wanted to hear the Word of God, but  Elymas sorcerer for that is what his name means opposed them, and tried to turn the proconsul from the faith. Then Saul, who was also called Paul, filled with the Holy Spirit looked straight at Elymas and said, you are a child of the devil and an enemy of everything that is right. You are full of all kinds of deceit and trickery. Well, you never stop perverting the ways of the Lord. Now the hand of the Lord is against you, you're going to be blind for a time, not even able to see the light of the sun. Immediately, mist and darkness came over him and he groped about seeking someone to lead him by the hand. When the pro council saw what had happened, he believed for he was amazed at the teaching about the Lord who, okay, so they are off on the first missionary journey. Again a bunch of names in this chapter. 

Gregg DeMey  14:46

So Luke, the author of acts points out in verse nine of this chapter Saul also called Paul just mentions it very casually hitting Saul is a Hebrew name. Very common.

Gregg DeMey  15:00

King Saul in the Old Testament, Paul is kind of the Greco Roman equivalent. So it could be that it's part of the, you know, connection to Saul's transformation. It could be just He is known as Salta, Hebrew folks and Paul to Greek and Roman folks, and now they're off to more Greek and Roman lands could be as simple as that.

Jeffrey Klein  15:21

Yeah, I remember having this revelation that in Sunday school, I was taught when he became, you know, transform, his name was changed. And then I read the Bible myself and like, Sure, that's really how it went down. It seems like there's a Hebrew name and there's a great name here. And so he's being called, depending on where he is. That's leaving.

Gregg DeMey  15:38

Yeah, there is a little interesting nuance when they're in Antioch or in Jerusalem. Luke calls them Barnabas and Saul and later Barnabas and Paul, but when they're outside Jerusalem or Antioch, he calls them Paul and Barnabas, as if Paul is like the lead evangelist. But when they're back to where the church started, Barnabas had a better reputation. So he like leads with Barnabas, like I don't know if that's the reason but to be Barnabas being universally acclaimed as like the, the great guy and saw who has probably more complicated personality and reputation. So we meet some other folks, there is a profit on the island of Cyprus named Bar-Jesus, which Bar-Jesus Aramaic word bar just means like the son of so in Hebrew, it's the word, Ben, like, Ben jamin means the son of having or I mean, lots of languages have this right Scandinavian Johnson, your Johnson or Ivana Vich, You're the son of Ivan. in Aramaic, you have borrowed Jesus, but this guy has another name, which is Elymus, which means sorcerer, sorcerer

Jeffrey Klein  16:51

and Bar-Jesus actually be then the son of the Savior. Right. So that's, that's his given name, son of Jesus, son of Jesus. But Jesus translated I think his Savior, right? Well, sure, but

Gregg DeMey  17:03

there would have been 10s of 1000s

Jeffrey Klein  17:05

of dudes named Jesus. True. Yeah, that's right. So yes, now he's elements of surgeries yet like Jekyll, Dr. Jekyll, Mr. Hyde personality go. And he's got this kind of side that he was given at birth, that you know, maybe who he was supposed to be who God made him be. And then he's got this other thing he's adopted, which is this sorcerer side. Which is, I think, the dark side,

Caryn Rivadeneira  17:27

it's the dark side. And right. I'm always intrigued by the sorcerers that show up in the Scriptures because they're just, it's just such a mysterious thing that sort of like casually mentioned, like, it's just so normal. Normally, we only think of sorcerers as appearing in Harry Potter, or what you know, in fantasy things. And so I never even really associate this word with like, a real thing that a person would be. So I'm just, I get more curious about like, what was he doing? Did it just mean he was into witchcraft? Were there magical things that happened around him? Just, obviously,

Gregg DeMey  18:00

Westerners, but really in every corner of the world? Yeah, like there are still whatever the medicine man or do and yeah, the witch, healer, the shaman-like, he's probably

Jeffrey Klein  18:14

wrapped in. Okay. And I think it's interesting that the word is used the connecting himself to the government, to the governor to the guy who was in charge. So again, you know, this is like, dig in the under part of this, but the, you know, the authorities and the government, and the enemy of God attaches himself to the government to try to twist and change the government or have the influence they're not that happens. I'm not saying that all governments are like, you know, have evil attach to them. But I think that's where the enemy comes in to try to twist and change the government and make it more evil. Yeah,

Gregg DeMey  18:49

I mean, it seems to me that maybe this is a guy who understands power dynamics. So right, whether it's like the dark side of spiritual power, or whether it's true, or institutional government power, it's like he has the knack for hooking into that.

Caryn Rivadeneira  19:03

Yep. And yet, the pro counsel, who we made is we're told this an intelligent man. Yeah. So that means, that's an interesting aside to sort of like when they call Barnabas when Luke calls Barnabas, good, man, like, that's just sort of interesting to pay attention to those two like, and it was because he was intelligent that he wanted to hear this. Which of course, when we talk about modern-day culture, a lot of times people think, because we are stupid, we are Christians or something. No,

Jeffrey Klein  19:26

it's an interesting and intelligent man and connected himself to a sorcerer, like Well, that's it to like, even that's weird like to think if you're an intelligent person, would you but

Caryn Rivadeneira  19:34

is that his spiritual realm that maybe there is just something like you're just trying to figure out, right, what that is, but yeah, good point.

Gregg DeMey  19:40

So we have the unusual happening here of Paul being filled with the Holy Spirit, seemingly calling down a curse on someone. Right, and it results in the blindness of LMS. The sourcer thinks it's probably important for us to remember at this point that Saul himself encountered Jesus, and then experienced three days of blindness, physical before he was healed, and had his eyes open both physically and spiritually. So, Lord willing, by the grace of God like Paul's endgame here is not to punish and hurt and wound and permanently blind this guy, but knowing his own experience shepherding him into the the grace of God down the same road that he walked.

Jeffrey Klein  20:29

And it says right in there, there'll be he says, you're going to be blind for a time so this is not a permanent blindness. This is a Paul kind of blindness where and make you blind, groping around, and hopefully, you're groping, you'll find some truth to be sort of corrected or, like I was corrected, move to a different place or come to some new revelations, maybe your eyes will be open to new things.

Caryn Rivadeneira  20:51

Yeah. So what is this spiritual gift that I mean, because I just wrote down the word truth next to this, because of course, we talked about that in the beginning, he is clearly speaking in truth, kind of calling out the demon that he sees. But does this fall under healing? Do you think that this Christian ability to be able to curse someone with blindness, like what's that gift

Jeffrey Klein  21:09

audience discern just but I also like, okay, so there's a Judson university professor that made these interesting movies, probably 10 years ago, one's called the Father of lights. And this story makes me think of something that I saw in the movie. He's in India, he goes to a witch doctors house, which is a witch doctor in this town that was well known for doing weird things to children. I mean, just some strange happenings. And he goes and starts to pray outside this guy's house, and the guy's wife comes out is going go away, go away, go away. The Witch Doctor never comes out. But eventually, hear the witch doctor inside saying he can't see. Like he's saying to his wife, I can't see I can't. He's groping around his wife is yelling at this guy and his Christian who just is just standing there praying, he's not yelling, he's not screaming, just praying over this house and asking the demons to flee. And this guy literally is can't see grows round. And that's kind of where the story ends. They leave you with this guy there. But it just reminds me so I don't know that you know what that spiritual gift I don't know. And this guy didn't pronounce blindness over the witch doctor and like that, but he went blind the same way. You know,

Gregg DeMey  22:13

to me, it's a big difference, whether it's like calling down blindness that's like, right to punish out of the blue or a punishment. Whereas I think what's happening is like Paul is asking, praying, speaking into being as a physical manifestation of what is already spiritually there. Right. So it's not like out of nothing blindness. It's the breaking into the visible world of what's already there in the invisible world. Like having correspondence between those two.

Jeffrey Klein  22:43

Yeah, and I think I think there's a lot of discernment here to discern that there's actually an evil spirit that's behind this guy's acting out and distracting from the Gospel. Mind devotional. I said, Man, as a camp speaker, I've, I've run into a lot of distractors. I love the color blindness on them, right when I'm trying to talk in a camp and there are some kids going loopy in the front row, and totally distracted me. I just want to say hey, enough, but you don't do that because you want to be loving. You don't want to turn a kid off Steve never do that. But I can remember being in certain situations where you're talking with the kid right in front of you, for whatever reason is just going bananas and you can't get the kid to stop and say, Okay, what is this? What's happening? There's interference again, there's always interference for the gospel. Right? The gospel is trying to get out there's always interference.

Gregg DeMey  23:28

Yeah. Think of how handy it would be if all of our various sins had some kind of physical manifestation. Yeah. Like, what do you got gossipy? Or get your hands into? somewhere? They jumped along if you just had like arthritis, you know, in your wrist and you're like, Oh, I

Jeffrey Klein  23:44

should have I should have done that. Yeah, that wouldn't be something your mouth is just like you couldn't talk for a day cuz you're just saying all the wrong things or something. Right?

Caryn Rivadeneira  23:54

That would be Yeah,

Gregg DeMey  23:56

we would have to be silent on Saturdays then

Jeffrey Klein  23:58

Exactly. But I do like to think of this term personally as like a gift of grace for this guy elements. He's giving him a chance to find the truth. He's showing him Hey, you're blind to the real true spiritual things in the world you understand them so I'm going to make you blind hopefully, in this blindness shall seek the truth find this Jesus, and stop distracting from the Gospel. Rather than this is a punishment. I'm calling blindness on you and you're just gonna be miserable for us your life because you oppose me, because that'd be a pretty bad gift to have right to run around like Paul and Zeb anybody wants to get by, but

Gregg DeMey  24:32

it is striking how many times in the gospels in the book of Acts. blindness has been mentioned in the restoration of sight as mentioned and yeah, whatever. Even an amazing grace probably the most well-known him in the English world race, but close the closing line of verse one was blind but now I see. Because in the end, like that's a way of describing the gospel. That's true of all of us

Caryn Rivadeneira  24:55

completely. Well, and I like it to just even the words you said they it was a mist in the darkness that came over him because that too is just freebie is so great. So of course I love that. But it just, I don't know you just picture that fog kind of rolling in and sort of the darkening and then I don't know. So it's one when his sight is restored, you know, maybe it's the reverse of that and suddenly

Jeffrey Klein  25:20

we don't get to see that like well now it's restored and then it's awesome as the as he gets in mist and darkness the pro council suddenly can see because now this distractors out of the way have been removed. And now the proconsul can get he sees the light and goes Oh, I get it. I want to be a believer in this Jesus.

Caryn Rivadeneira  25:38

This could be a major dynamic duo. You know, in a few days later weeks, we're gonna

Gregg DeMey  25:44

Alright, let's press on with Paul and Barnabas. We're going to go from the island of Cyprus back to the mainland of Asia Minor.

Jeffrey Klein  25:51

This is a long stretch of verses. Yeah, we're also going to

Gregg DeMey  25:54

story here we're gonna hear Paul's first sermon so but buckle up,

Jeffrey Klein  25:58

buckle up. Here we go. From Paphos Paul in his companion sailed to Perga in Pamphylia, where John left them to return to Jerusalem. From Perga they went to the city of Antioch. on the Sabbath, they entered the synagogue and sat down. After the reading from the law and the prophets, the leaders of the synagogue sent word to them saying brothers, if you have a word of an expert, exhortation for the people, please speak.

Gregg DeMey  26:23

So standing up with Paul motioned with his hand and said, fellow Israelites and you Gentiles who worship God, listen to me, the God of the people of Israel, chose our ancestors, and he made the people prosper during their stay in Egypt with mighty power. He led them out of that country and for about 40 years, he endured their conduct in the wilderness, and he overthrew seven nations and Canaan given their land, to his people is their inheritance. All this took about 450 years

Caryn Rivadeneira  26:53

after this, God gave them judges until the time of Samuel the Prophet. Then the people asked for a king and he gave themselves and of Kish of the top tribe of Benjamin, who ruled for 40 years. After removing Saul, he made David their king, God testified concerning him. I have found David's son of Jesse, a man after my own heart, he will do everything I want him to do. From this man's descendants God has brought to Israel the Savior Jesus as He promised, before the coming of Jesus, John preached repentance and baptism to all the people of Israel. As John was completing his work, he said, Who do you suppose I am? I am not the one you are looking for. But there is one coming after me who sandals I am not worthy to untie.

Jeffrey Klein  27:37

Fellow children of Abraham and you God-fearing Gentiles. It is to us that this message of salvation has been sent to the people of Jerusalem and their rulers did not recognize Jesus yet in condemning him. They fulfilled the words of the prophets and ret and that are read every Sabbath. Though they found no proper ground for a death sentence, they asked Pilate to have him executed. When they had carried out all that was written about him, they took him down from the cross and laid him in a tomb. But God raised Him from the dead. And for many days, he was seen by those who had traveled with him from Galilee to Jerusalem. They are now his witnesses to our people.

Gregg DeMey  28:13

Paul still preaching here, we tell you the good news, what God promised our ancestors he has fulfilled for us, their children by raising up Jesus, as it is written in the second song, you are my son, and today I have become your father. Indeed, God raised Him from the dead so that he will never be subject to decay, as God said, I will give you the holy ensure blessings promised to David. And so it is stated elsewhere, you will not let your holy one see decay at Psalm 16, verse 10. Now, when David had served God's purpose in his own generation, he fell asleep he was buried with his ancestors and his body decayed, but the one whom God raised from the dead, did not see decay.

Caryn Rivadeneira  28:55

Therefore, my friends, I want you to know that through Jesus, the forgiveness of sins is proclaimed to you. Through him everyone who believes the set free from every sin, a justification you are not able to obtain under the law of Moses, take care that what the prophets have said does not happen to you. Here's what the prophet says, look, you scoffers wonder and perish, for I am going to do something in your days that you would never believe even if someone told you.

Jeffrey Klein  29:23

As Paul and Barnabas were leaving the synagogue that people invited them to speak further about these things on the next Sabbath when the current condition was dismissed. Many of the Jews and devout converts to Judaism followed Paul and Barnabas who talked with them and urge them to continue in the grace of God.

Gregg DeMey  29:41

Alright, this is quite a scene. So where we started out, we get a little bit of that geographic detail and itinerary of Paul and Barnabas leaving the island of Cyprus selling back to the mainland, what we would call modern Turkey. Not so far from where Paul grew up. They end up in a city called Antioch or Pisidian. Antioch. This is a different Antioch than the Cosmopolitan giant Antioch on the east side of the Mediterranean that St. Paul and Barnabas on this journey, but rather, another city named Antioch in Turkey. And as will become their practice, Paul and Barnabas whenever they get to a new city, will go to the Jewish synagogue first. That's kind of their strategy of how to connect with people. Any thoughts on why? That was the first thing that they did?

Jeffrey Klein  30:33

Well, it's the low-hanging fruit, right? The scattering of the Jews all over the ancient world, and the building of these synagogues put Jewish people in every city and even Jewish converts. So we saw at the end of that passage there, there were some of the Jewish converts people that were, the Jews had witnessed to and have come to believe in this one God of Israel. So those synagogues provided a low-hanging fruit place to come and explain to people that should already understand this from the Hebrew Scriptures. What's happening with this Jesus?

Gregg DeMey  31:04

Yeah, for sure. That's huge. One of the things we notice in Paul's preaching is that he's quoting the Old Testament a lot. So he's trying to make connections for this audience that already accepts those words as the Word of God and connect the dots to Jesus and hope that the Holy Spirit does the work in people's hearts.

Caryn Rivadeneira  31:20

Yeah, I mean, and, you know, their audience by this point to the gospel has opened up to Gentiles, but I'm sure they still feel compelled to bring it to the Jewish people who that was, you know, it was raised as Jews, that's going to be who they feel like needs to, to hear it. So it's good,

Jeffrey Klein  31:36

I think, is that I need some missionary strategy for these guys. I mean, they every city they go to, we're going to see them the ones that lead to have a Jewish synagogue, they're gonna enter the Jewish synagogue first. If the Jewish synagogue people either listen or don't listen, they make decisions from there as to where they're going next. And it's often to the Gentiles. But this passage is puzzling. I don't know much about this person in Antioch, I confess, I need to read up where this is, and but it seems like there's a lot of God-fearing Gentiles in this particular past, it's like later and X, we're gonna run into groups of people, even the next chapter, who have never been exposed to this God of Israel. So they're clueless right? So Paul's having to then do a whole different kind of speaking, witnessing that he does here. This is like a speech of outline the whole story of the Old Testament of this Hebrew Scriptures from Abraham Ford, and try to tie it all together.

Gregg DeMey  32:27

Yeah, yeah. No, the city, his memory serves kind of more in central Turkey. There's like an elevated plateau, surrounded by quite a bit of like water, actually. So I think this was like a major Crossroads kind of trade city. So I think it was a pretty big population. I think one of the other strategies is, shall I say this, for being a relatively small population still globally. Jewish culture has enormous influence. I think that has always been the case, part of God's choosing the Jewish people for himself has been this blessing of influence. And Paul and Barnabas, either knowing that or just getting that intuitively, I think, are trying to leverage that, like, wisely to spread the gospel by connecting with not only people who know the scriptures, but who also have kind of the gifting of influence and the history of Judaism, just valuing being people the book, and education, I mean, that's part of the influence, but tapping into all of that from step one,

Jeffrey Klein  33:42

and they look totally different than everyone else. I mean, they dressed like it said in the Scriptures, right, so they had the tassel, the little curls down the side of their heads and the way they wore their clothes and what they would eat, not eat and circumcising their children. I mean, that's all very unique, really stand-out stuff that would all sort of make someone go What is with you people? like can you explain what's going on? And then we give an opening probably their distinctive lifestyle to explaining Well, here's why we do this. Here's what our laws say, or what our God has said to us. Yeah,

Caryn Rivadeneira  34:13

yeah. I mean, that's an interesting point. They were also people then used to living among other cultures and kind of working in that system. And, you know, being I don't know, valued is necessarily the right word. But exactly if you were able to be influential in your culture, and at least, you know, not abused but yeah, to

Jeffrey Klein  34:32

Daniel Lee, right, Daniel live distinctively. And then that led to him having a huge influence in the, in the kingdom of Syria, right, or that was Babylon. That was Babylon. So you know, but that's like, you see these stories all through the Scripture and how they live this distinctive lifestyle that it stood out and people were like, Whoa,

Caryn Rivadeneira  34:50

yeah, I think a little bit about Mormons today. Maybe it's just when we think about groups that live differently, like, you know, you'd say like, I have a family member who used to live next door tomorrow. And family and so you always want to have Mormons as neighbors. They're great neighbors, you know, really keep it you know, hard-working in the yard. It's like there is a distinctness that whether Christians have that distinctness or not, I don't know that we do anymore. But anyway, sorry, Mormon.

Gregg DeMey  35:12

No, it's interesting. I used to live in Sacramento, which after Salt Lake City has the biggest concentration of Mormons, you disagree of No, no, that same reputation around Sacramento. And just yesterday, because there was a hurricane in New York City, there was a professional golf tournament that ended in Jersey City. So you can see the skyline of Manhattan from this golf course. It's pretty cool. But the guy who won is of Pacific Islander descent, his name is Tony Fino. He was born in LA, I think, and he's a Mormon guy. And the two things that golf announcers always say about him, how his how he is the nicest guy in the entire world. And I think maybe he's 30 years old, and already has five children. So there's that. So they don't say that he's a Mormon explicitly, but just like, make those two comments about his family life and his character.

Caryn Rivadeneira  36:06

You're gonna know, I don't know that many other groups necessarily have that. But anyway.

Gregg DeMey  36:12

So what pops out about the sermon we've already kind of leaned into Paul being trained as a Pharisee. You know, is always going to make connections to the Hebrew Scriptures and the Old Testament, we see him doing this time and time again, I think he quotes the book of Isaiah here, multiple Psalms, the prophecy of Habakkuk. I mean, Peter, more sticks with the Psalms, in the earlier sermons, and acts, Paul seems to have the whole, what we would call the Old Testament, kind of on the tip of his tongue or is able to make connections to the Messiah.

Jeffrey Klein  36:46

It's also very intellectual. like Peter sermons are passionate, and they're hard hitting and Paul is, is you can tell a trained Pharisee. When he speaks, he's weaving all this together in a super intellectual way. Again, I think as Paul continues his missionary journeys, I'm thinking ahead, but he has a lot of conversations because he can just, I think Paul has been able to sit there and anything that comes out and he's got an answer for he says, So genius, right? So he's got he's thought all this through and, you know, like, he's quick on his feet, probably because he's so intellectual. So genius that he was able to weave all this together.

Caryn Rivadeneira  37:24

It's also super concise, I think it's like, you can tell he's, he's practiced this or worked through with it, Stephen, or Peter, with just Stephens.

Gregg DeMey  37:31

Very long, Old Testament, recounting and

Caryn Rivadeneira  37:34

psi, Steven. But yeah, that was so long. And this is just I mean, he just hits those key parts. And then I just think it's, you know, when he gets to the part about Jesus, and you know, being set free from every sin, and then he says, you know, something, a justification you were not able to obtain under the laws of Moses, like, that's just such a great moment of just hitting that home. And I would think, for people who are exhausted at trying to follow the laws and a tone and all of that, that has to feel incredibly refreshing, I would think so I just, I just appreciate that this is a nice tight, he's got the history, he's got the promise. I mean, just all of it. Well done. sermon

Jeffrey Klein  38:14

off, often when I think like even Steven, I think, spends more time in the Exodus. This is using the central story. But in this case, he mentions the exodus talks about regarding during these people in the wilderness because he had to endure their complaining and grumbling and whining and not lack of faith. But those were only a couple of lines, that he jumps into spots. And normally, you know, by judges up until Samuel, and he takes us on this historical journey with all these details. So, you know, it takes us through the whole story in a super concise way. But we're getting bits and pieces of the whole thing.

Gregg DeMey  38:50

Yeah, I mean, one of the things that comes out very clearly are multiple mentions of the resurrection here. Yes. So it's not. I mean, there is the phrase for the forgiveness of your sins. So there's like the linkage and Paul's preaching from the very beginning, about Jesus' death and crucifixion, leading to the forgiveness of our sins. But there's also the resurrection like those two things are part of one story. They're not, you know, to two separate stories. I just read somewhere recently, I think it was missionary to India years ago, a guy named Leslie Newbiggin, who said something like the cross was not a defeat, to which the empty grave was the great victory, like the cross was the beginning of the victory. Right, like linking both the cross and the empty grave to Jesus. Victory. Yeah. And I think Paul's saying the same thing and

Jeffrey Klein  39:48

I love the consistency of the Holy Spirit in preaching. So Peters's sermon, Stephen's sermon, this sermon, I'll talk about the purposes of God being fulfilled through all His activities and events, right? I think Peter mentioned that you know, God's purposes are fulfilled even though you didn't see it, even though you didn't get it, even though that was all part of God's purposes being fulfilled so that Jesus would be hung on the cross and deliver you in Paul's is the same thing, right? So that thread of God's purpose being worked out through the life of Jesus is a thread that runs through all these sermons. And you know, and we read the book of Ephesians, right before time began, God had this plan if you read them in the message, so, you know, before he ever made the world, he already had this purpose laid out in Jesus Christ, which is pretty crazy. So,

Gregg DeMey  40:37

so I really like the human detail that Luke includes at the end of the sermon. So this is happening in a synagogue, and it's Sabbath day, right on a Saturday. And it's not like everybody who heard what was probably a pretty compelling, well-crafted spiritually powerful sermon, started following Jesus on the spot. So the people in the synagogue invite Paul and Barnabas like, wow, we maybe should, here's more about this. So they invite them back the next Sabbath day, and some start following immediately. And, again, it's like God gives us freedom for how to respond and how to react. And, you know, who knows how many dozens or hundreds of people heard this, but it's not like everybody had a cookie-cutter response. Right? God works with us at different times and speeds and paces, and we don't have the same receptivity levels.

Jeffrey Klein  41:32

Yeah, there's a different time for everyone to really get it.

Caryn Rivadeneira  41:35

And you think about even the power of the people who didn't get this, like the people who left gone like that. That was crazy. That was weird. And you start talking about that sort of stuff with your friends and neighbors. And then that even turns into you got to come back and hear this guy, and he's not so things he's saying, you know, so like, even that, like the Holy Spirit working through that, but yeah, I do love the detail about the next Sabbath and etc. Come back next Saturday, Friday, Saturday.

Gregg DeMey  41:58

Yeah. So I don't know that we have a neat category for this because I mean, here at Elmhurst CRC, there's kind of a track record of pastors sticking around here for a long time. I mean, Bert was here for 27 years. He's still here. I've been around for 13 plus years at this point,

Jeffrey Klein  42:17

it's in my mid-six I think, right? So he's, it's a different,

Gregg DeMey  42:21

love you Rev.

Jeffrey Klein  42:21

I just want to I just want to get some I got your dig in.

Gregg DeMey  42:24

Yeah. How long have you been here?

Jeffrey Klein  42:29

Really. If I stayed until I'm eighty,  I won't make it past Burton, you

Gregg DeMey  42:34

guys are gonna keep running together for a while. So there's something to be said for that for shepherding in the same direction. There's also something to like in America where we call the Billy Graham method, right? They like you drop in and something big and amazing happens. But then you leave town and someone else deals with the consequences.

Jeffrey Klein  42:56

True. And wouldn't it be cool if in our services, some Sunday, we would look out and see, I don't know whoever was here and go, Hey, you're here today you have a word for us that you could share and this person would just impromptu Lee come up and just go. Like, I mean, think about that. That's that doesn't happen much in the American church. Right? This is I think this is a pretty regular synagogue practice me having a Jesus right. Luke chapter four. He gave them a real succinct sermon today. This was fulfilled in your hearing that was it and then sat down. Right. But

Gregg DeMey  43:26

what do you think the nursery workers and the children's ministry volunteers said when Paul and Barnabas got up there?

Jeffrey Klein  43:32

They went for a while, right? So yeah,

Caryn Rivadeneira  43:35

you're gonna ask what ours would say. And then I was thinking because nobody would say anything.

Gregg DeMey  43:40

I'm not taking a dig at any of the lovely people who volunteer for kids, right? It's just that we North Americans are so on the clock and on a schedule that Yep, or maybe not so flexible as a result, in some ways, because anything that would upset that routine or get in the way of our brunch plans, it's clearly out of order.

Caryn Rivadeneira  44:00

Yeah, that would be interesting, though. Just a three-minute sermon and just open it up to see if there was a word. Well, it's also

Jeffrey Klein  44:07

usually in the synagogue, there's the scripture would come out they would kind of dance around with and they would read some portion of Scripture. It doesn't it's not really recorded here. I don't think, oh, it does. The after the reading from the law and the prophets, leaders of the synagogue were sent word to them saying, hey, if you have anything you'd like to give exportation so so I guess they read the law and the prophets, right, a portion of the Torah portion, the prophets, and now they get up and they start expository ins even that level of detail. I

Gregg DeMey  44:31

a picture like the austere leaders over one side of the synagogue and they send a little messenger over to Paul and Barnabas of like, Hey, would you guys be willing to step up?

Jeffrey Klein  44:40

Cuz I mean, seriously, I was in a synagogue and see Gamla and it was, it's well preserved, and there's you can see the high seats where the religious leaders set and you can see the regular ends, it's a square, and it's designed to be kind of dialogue, right? It's a square versus how we have it. It's just a square with benches and you sit in a circle and then the person gets up and reads and then speaks. So it's interesting.

Gregg DeMey  45:03

Yeah, I mean, also the way seating wise is it's hard for us to imagine was men on one side and children on the other side and this practice carried over into the early church, which when you read some of the counseling advice that Paul has for the early Christians, we do need to imagine that kind of seeing that there's not a separate nursery going on or separate thing happening for kids. It's like moms and women who are both attending and also like, yep, parents caring for kids at the same time.

Caryn Rivadeneira  45:33

Yeah, probably not invited to get up and share words either. But I

Gregg DeMey  45:38

Well, we don't corn. They

Caryn Rivadeneira  45:40

totally well. Yes. That wasn't in the synagogue, right. That was in the church. No, in the church. Yeah. That's what I'm saying. No, Jesus changed all that. But now, I'm just sorry. sidetracking bringing in other faith communities but the Quakers right. Do they read scripture? Do they just all sit silently? until somebody has word I'm just trying to think about is that the Quakers? Yes, right. But did they read scripture first or anything or is it just a silent meeting and somebody gets I would think so but I don't know.

Gregg DeMey  46:07

ever been to.

Caryn Rivadeneira  46:10

The Quakers are

Jeffrey Klein  46:11

there Quakers mannequin that camp I go to in Colorado Quaker comes from quaking.

Gregg DeMey  46:15

Yeah, it comes through. stirred by spirit.

Jeffrey Klein  46:18

The camp in Colorado that we actually rent for Colorado challenges a Quaker camp and their maker camp was a bit of quaking. I just

Caryn Rivadeneira  46:25

picture this stillness on the benches and feel like Chicago's famous Quaker ties in but I can't think of the person's name but the founder of Quaker Oats was a Quaker.

Gregg DeMey  46:41

Yeah, yeah. Chicago industrialist classic picture, the dude on the front. Yes, colonial Quaker guy. Okay, so we do get a little detail of what happens seven days later on the next Sabbath day. So take us away.

Caryn Rivadeneira  46:57

Well, on the next Sabbath, almost the whole city gathered to hear the word of the Lord. When the Jews saw the crowds, they were filled with jealousy. They began to contradict what Paul was saying and heaped abuse on him.

Gregg DeMey  47:10

Then Paul and Barnabas answered them boldly, we had to speak the Word of God to you first, but since you reject it, and do not consider yourself worthy of eternal life,

Jeffrey Klein  47:20

we now turn to the Gentiles. For this is what the Lord has commanded us. quoting from Isaiah, I have made you a light for the Gentiles, that you may bring salvation to the ends of the earth. And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad and honored the word of the Lord and all who are appointed for eternal life, believed the word of the Lord spread through the whole region. But the Jewish leaders, incited the God-fearing women of high standing, and only the men of the city. They stood up persecution against Paul and Barnabas and expelled them from their region. So they shook the dust off their feet as a warning to them and went to I conium. And the disciples were filled with joy and with the Holy Spirit is the women of high standing stirred up, leading men stirred up.

Gregg DeMey  48:12

Well, speaking of stirring things up earlier in the book of Acts, it was Saul, who was doing a lot of stirring up and creating trouble for the first Christians. And oh, how the tables turn. Now he is here he is a whole different part of the Roman Empire, hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of miles away. And he is the one whom Yeah, the the gazes and the gun barrels are turned. Obviously, nobody had gun barrels, but so he was the Jewish opposition. Now he is met with Jewish opposition. And this is the same,

Jeffrey Klein  48:49

I guess, motivation for this persecution that we see over and over again, and happened during Jesus' time. And now earlier in the book of Acts, Now, again, we get this phrase, they were filled with jealousy when they saw the crowds. So Jesus always drew a crowd, the early disciples drew a crowd. And now these guys are drawing a crowd. And there's jealousy. Because Wait a minute, we're the synagogue. We're the scene. Our leaders were the official religious group here in the city. And we can't get these people to come to synagogue every week. But now these two jumokes show up. And they start talking and now all these people are coming out to hear what is going on. And they're ticked off. You know, it's kind of crazy there instead of like, entering into and celebrating, well, people are coming. Immediately. There's jealousy and fear. And let's get these guys out of here.

Caryn Rivadeneira  49:38

Yeah, well, I think it's back to that power dynamic we were talking about before, right? When you're the powerful one and you're not drawing or you're supposed to be the powerful ones and you're not influencing the way you should or drawing that. I mean, it seems that's, you know, still happens.

Gregg DeMey  49:51

Yeah, so for sure. There's probably jealousy over interest and numbers and influence. Just know from flipping over a page into x 14, one of the things that the Holy Spirit is going to do through Paul and Barnabas is regularly. I think the verb is confirming their proclamation of the gospel with signs and wonders. So not convinced, not prove, but confirm that what they're preaching about is real. So I can add all of those things together if their ministry is characterized by energy and spiritual influence, and there are accompanying signs and wonders, and they're talking about resurrection, and people are turning out. And you're just the local synagogue ruler, who is just like hoping a couple of dozen people are going to show up on Saturday.

Jeffrey Klein  50:45

I'm always amazed though, I feel like this is even true today. A release of the Spirit's power or a demonstration of the Spirit's power, or when the Spirit of God shows up in a powerful way. It seems like some people, their reactions to be irritated, or fearful, jealous, I don't know what it is like, and just push it away or criticize it or get out of here. This is terrible. I can't believe we're doing this. Even though as you read this book, you're like women, this is every page, the Spirit of God, he's breaking in breaking through angels, visions, mist, and darkness. All this does going on. But for some reason, for some people, this is super offensive. And if it's if they're if it's in their church, they're like, Oh, no, we can't have that here.

Caryn Rivadeneira  51:27

Yeah, and maybe this gets back to a little bit that the truth and love thing that we were talking about before with Scripture, I think, where I react to when people I think what happens a lot of times is when people start beating down others with scrip and putting scripture in quotation do that nothing podcast listeners can see me do that. But this idea that when the Spirit is in the movie and entering something new, doing something new, and we feel nervous, it is very easy to go back. And well, no, that can't be it. Because someone's You know, this chapter, this verse says, blah, blah, blah, and trying to even beat it down with that. Which I think is probably what they were trying to do a little bit too, like, No, this can't be.

Gregg DeMey  52:04

Yeah, well, a big part of the success of our civilization is controlling elements. And a big part of the scientific method, God blesses is repeatable results, controlling variables, and other factors. And this has led to countless good things in the world. So please don't hear any negative about that. But when it comes to the spiritual world like we cannot apply the same principles because we ought not, cannot, will never be in control. And when it comes to the influence of the Holy Spirit, who blows, you know, where as the windows where God wills in where it pleases, our desire should not be to predict and forecast and get repeatable results. And to control not like, No, we long for the very opposite, for surprising things for things that we're not in control of the things that we can't predict or make happen again. So, Jeff, Jeff, and Caryn, both nodding like, I want you to know, listeners like that this is what being in ministry is about. So we make our plans. But it's not to be in control of stuff. It's not that we have all the precise outcomes determined, I mean, what we try to do is be organized and purposeful enough and intentional enough so that it gives God maximum permission to do whatever he wants to do in our midst. And I can testify, definitely, the best things that happen are always things I didn't see coming, or graceful surprises or changes or something that happens in a group or a person that I had no idea was even brewing or stirring. I mean, that's where the real action is.

Caryn Rivadeneira  53:45

Yeah. And I think sometimes that's why it's hard to get caught up in numbers and wait, we have to, you know, evaluate ministries and stuff. It's somewhat like, well, no one is coming to this. And maybe we shouldn't be doing that. So whenever I'm thinking about, you know, some very small attended gatherings of things or whatever that we've had in the past. And yet, I think we've all seen that, that even in something that maybe wasn't, you know, huge numbers, or something so significant that happened that, wow, even though there were only seven people in this room, like, yeah, maybe we want to 20 maybe we want to 30 whatever. But these seven people experience something amazing. And that's

Jeffrey Klein  54:20

one of the hardest things. I mean, for me personally in ministry is just being able to let go of the outcomes. Yeah. Because I want you to know, I'll often say, Well, I was another C. So my whole ministry is just a bunch of C's, you know, it's like, it's not on me, right? It's not it's just, it's just on, you know, I can only offer it out there and the Holy Spirit's to come around it and then people have to respond, how are they going to respond? So, I mean, I've been thinking about this. What were Paul's metrics? Was he successful? Because if you actually study his life, he was stoned, ship, drug beaten, wept. People whacking on beating out on all the time, you know, he's like, I mean, This guy's matrix Holy cow, he felt terrible on himself. There's no mega church following most of the churches he started, some of them collapse. Some of them kept going. A lot of them had problems, all kinds of problems after he left, right. So I always think about Paul, like, oh, man, this guy, you have a lot of reasons to be depressed about his ministry. But yet he just knew what God told him to do. And he's just gonna go do it and trust that the Lord had called them, and I'm going to be obedient to that. And that's a super hard thing to do. It is,

Caryn Rivadeneira  55:24

I thought it was at the Art Institute a few weeks ago, and it was in the van Gogh section. And, you know, it just always strikes me like this guy had no idea. I mean, he knew that he had a gift. He knew that he was doing this and was doing what, presumably he felt he was, but until he did, but nothing like he had no success ever. And so now he's just there. And I always feel so bad standing there, like I hope you, you know, somehow know this incident. And same with Paul, you know, he's done. All right, who's quite influential.

Gregg DeMey  55:49

I think the fun fact about Van Gogh is he officially sold one painting in his life, yes. To a Belgian guy. so amazingly, though, like the God has gifted Paul, with this deep down confidence in the calling that he's given him. So after there's kind of this rejection scene, or complaining scene with the local Jewish leaders in Pisidian, Antioch, Paul quotes, Isaiah 49, I've made you a light to the Gentiles, that you may bring salvation to the ends of the earth, the pronouns in there actually, singular mean they have to do with the Messiah, well, the Messiah, but I think he's adopting that for like he and Barnabas and being the first missionaries and seeing himself as part of what's going to become an increasingly large company that is going to like fulfill that prophecy like, that takes enormous confidence, to apply the prophecy of Isaiah, to sell and expand the pronoun to a collective one of which you are the point person in the leader.

Caryn Rivadeneira  56:56

See, and I read that differently, because I thought he was just including himself as a Jewish person at the people of Israel are supposed to be late to the nations but perhaps I read that wrong. Yeah, probably was. Right, good for you.

Jeffrey Klein  57:11

That's enormous confidence to say, well, we had to speak to you people first. But since you're basically not listening, we're gonna go now to you know, the Gentiles. And here's what the scripture says about that. And we're going to just follow this call. So

Gregg DeMey  57:22

you can see why people who would disagree with that kind of confident conviction would be like, we should consider stoning you now.

Jeffrey Klein  57:31

Yeah, because early on when Paul is first converted, right, doesn't it say pauses to and our gods is and is go and free? Paul is blind is my chosen instrument to bring the word of the gospel to the Gentiles. Right. So my guess is that he will suffer much suffering. I will show him how much he will suffer for my name. Whoa. Like, what a calling? I never got that call, like, hey, Klein, you're going to Timothy Christian is the Bible teacher and you're going to suffer much I'd be like, all

Caryn Rivadeneira  57:58

right.

Gregg DeMey  58:00

No, thank you my appointed light to the suburbs.

Jeffrey Klein  58:03

Yeah, exactly.

Gregg DeMey  58:05

How many times you will have to mow his lawn?

Jeffrey Klein  58:07

Like, no, thank you.

Caryn Rivadeneira  58:10

It's brutal. So what I really love though, is just how this passage ends. And I feel like this, for me is the biggest takeaway, the idea that two things happen. They just shut the dust off their feet. They're like, all right, you know what, that's we're leaving. But yet they were filled with joy in the Holy Spirit. Like, I feel like even for us, when we shake our feet of the Duster, like, Okay, this isn't gonna work. We're still filled with, like, guilt and shame and all how it didn't work, or these people are mad at us now. And they're upset, and we have to try and fix everything. And it seems like they just left and we're filled with joy. And again, so confident and secure in their calling that I can't quite fathom that.

Gregg DeMey  58:47

Yeah, so well, this is in accordance with Jesus' words, right? If you don't receive welcome hospitality, to the good news, shake the dust off your feet and get gone somewhere else where it's gonna be fruitful,

Caryn Rivadeneira  58:57

right. And I get that, but it's the idea of still feeling filled with joy about it. Like that's the part that's just remarkable to me that you're not like disappointed. You're not frustrated, you're not angry. And I'm talking bad about the people, those lousy people

Jeffrey Klein  59:08

in Washington, DC, they never listen to me ever listen. Because I mean, as a speaker, this is a thing like this is a great line because it's like you get up there as a speaker, right? And you're just talking to these kids about things you're super excited about. And sometimes it goes really well. And sometimes it doesn't go as well. It probably has a pastor, same thing, right? Sometimes it's like they're really into it. And they're like, this is terrible. What is he talking about? And so you go home, and sometimes you're not always filled with joy, you're like these people. Right? Just be honest. Right? So as you like, I like to punch somebody. Yeah,

Gregg DeMey  59:38

indeed. And my experiences, sometimes maybe the audience has a lot to do with that or the group that you're addressing, and sometimes maybe it has more to do with, like my issues.

Jeffrey Klein  59:48

Exactly. I think a lot of times it is my issues like well, I need certain responses for me to you know, I had to learn that as a speaker like I don't need this response to validate my speaking. I just need to be obedient to saying whatever the Lord gave To say, whether they like it or not, doesn't matter, you just gotta speak it out. That's a hard thing to learn. And especially as a young person who just wants to be approved of and told you're a great speaker and all this stuff, right? It's like the flood that goes and goes, No, I'm just gonna let the Lord do this. Yep.

Gregg DeMey  1:00:18

One final line, tucked in there and Acts 13:48 and all who were appointed to eternal life believed, again, they weren't appointed by Paul and Barnabas but appointed by God, who knows the outcome. Yeah. Who is the one connecting all the dots together? Yep. Sounds good. All right. Thanks for listening in with us. Looking forward to preparing 100,000 meals this weekend at Elmhurst CRC. Hope God blesses you with this word thankful for Kyle Olson, who's making this all happen for us today. Yeah, Kyle. For Sheri Van Spronsen Leppink who keeps us in good order all the time. May God bless His word and use this to help you love a little more along the way.

Jeffrey Klein  1:01:04

In Danby, truth 

Caryn Rivadeneira  1:01:06

and love