Acts 20 - Adieu

Summary:
It's all about goodbyes on today's podcast. Paul bids adieu to the leaders and elders he mentored -- and we say goodbye to the Book of Acts. Along the way, Gregg DeMey (Lead Pastor), Jeff Klein (Pastor of Outreach), and Caryn Rivadeneira (Director of Care) discuss leaving legacies of relationships and the difficult things the Spirit sometimes calls us to.

Today's Hosts
Gregg DeMey, Lead Pastor
Jeff Klein, Pastor of Outreach
Caryn Rivadeneira, Director of Care

Questions/Comments:  We'd love to hear from you! Email ASK.

Note: Wade in the Word is a weekly podcast designed to take a deep dive into scripture for the weekend message. Join our pastors, staff, and occasional special guests as we reflect together.

Wade in the Word podcast is a production of Elmhurst Christian Reformed Church, located in Elmhurst, IL. Wade in the Word is produced and audio-engineered by Kyle Olson, Technical Director. For more information about Elmhurst CRC or to find out about other tools and resources to grow you and your family in faith, visit elmhurstcrc.org.

Transcript

Gregg DeMey  00:05

Alright, hola todos bienvenidos el podcast. Iglesia Cristiana Reformada de Elmhurst

 Jeffrey Klein  00:14

what is going on? We have like rock and roll music. Now I go away for a week this place is going bananas.

 Caryn Rivadeneira  00:19

I already have

 Gregg DeMey  00:20

a new podcasting system here. It's amazing. Pastor Gregg, here we are. We've been traveling through the book of Acts. And sitting here this morning with some of Elmhurst, CRCS best and brightest Caryn Rivadeneira

 Caryn Rivadeneira  00:35

Indeed, literally bright as the sun is just beaming

 Jeffrey Klein  00:38

it is. Yes,

 Gregg DeMey  00:41

almost blindingly like Paul on the road to Damascus and Jeff

 Jeffrey Klein  00:47

Klein. Good morning. Good morning.

 Gregg DeMey  00:49

And Acts chapter 20. involves a lot of travel of Paul. Jeff has been traveling recently to the east coast to some family and friends in Philadelphia area.

 Jeffrey Klein  01:00

Little Philadelphia time. It was warmer out there

 Gregg DeMey  01:04

it is. Yeah, East Coast winters quite a bit warmer than Chicago winter.

 Jeffrey Klein  01:08

Yeah, no ice rinks out there. Yeah. Okay, I said,

 Gregg DeMey  01:12

and I will be traveling soon to visit my daughter in Spain, which is, I guess what possessed me to

 Jeffrey Klein  01:18

I'm assuming that's why I had this Spanish intro.

 Gregg DeMey  01:25

I have to figure out how to like order food and get on trains because I'm flying into Madrid and then need to take public transportation for another several hours to get to a rendezvous with my daughter. So I'll be I'll be alone in an American in a foreign country. Hopefully you can manage this, I will

 Jeffrey Klein  01:44

be in big trouble with my Spanish skills. Como esta? Tambien porque. A.

 Gregg DeMey  01:52

That's not going to get it done.

 Jeffrey Klein  01:53

Okay. There's a few words I remember.

 Gregg DeMey  01:58

Exactly. Well, how fun. Awesome. All right, yes, but this this is actually going to be our last podcast for a little while we are at the end of the road for our journey at Elmhurst CRC with a book of Acts at Acts chapter 20. Say a little more about what's coming next at the end of this podcast, going to take a few weeks off and then relaunch at the beginning of Advent at the end of November. So thanks for traveling with us and sticking with us. So we're gonna read through Acts chapter 20. And start off with the first six verses if you can get us going current.

 Caryn Rivadeneira  02:29

Sure, well, of course, I'm on the wrong page already. All right, here we go. When the uproar had ended, Paul sent for the disciples and after encouraging them said goodbye and set out for Macedonia. He traveled through the area, speaking many words of encouragement to the people and finally arrived in Greece where he stayed three months,

 Gregg DeMey  02:48

three months, that's a fine way to spend the winter in Greece. Because some Jews had plotted against him just as he was about to set sail for Syria. He decided to go back through Macedonia, and he was accompanied by so Peter, son of purists from Berea, Eris, Dorcas, and Secundus from Thessalonica. Guys from Derbe, Timothy also and Tychicus and Trophimus, from the province of Asia.

 Jeffrey Klein  03:12

These men were not ahead and waited for us at Troas, but we sail from Philippi after the festival of unleavened bread, and five days later joined the others at Troy's where we stayed seven days.

 Gregg DeMey  03:24

All right, so there's a ton of people names and place names in these few short verses. It's good for us to remember that Luke of the Gospel of Luke wrote this. He's a consummate historian. He's actually on the journey at this point. So probably years later, he's you know, literally consulting his diary, or travel notes to keep keep track of all this. So there had just been a major riot in Acts chapter 19. In the city of Ephesus, Paul is putting that in the rearview. And really, except for the 20 is the beginning of the end for Paul. He's saying goodbye to folks. He's offering some final encouragement and stopping and some of the places that are near and dear to his heart and traveling with some of the people who are near and dear to his heart. So it's really striking to me like the names that are listed here. Not very common names for young people in the English speaking world at this point, so Pyrrhus from Berea, Aristarchus and Secundus, but three of them are from Macedonia, two of them are from Malaysia, different sort of province and two are from Asia. So it's like Paul is assembling this sort of all star team of leaders from the different provinces in the Roman Empire. So this is one of one of the striking things about the end of the book of Acts that as Paul kind of disappears from the scene, and really, we don't get a we never know exactly how Paul dies or when he dies is like Luke intentionally Acts chapter 28 I think kind of does a slow fade to the end to give you the idea Like the gospel work is continuing. And it's not ultimately living and dying with Paul, because the life has that started with Jesus now has been spread out in so many places and been invested in so many people. So, just want to wonder a little bit about, you know how we're doing on this front these days. I think it's a strong temptation in the western world in the American church right now to kind of guard your borders, hunker down. And that mentality is not necessarily real compatible with passing the baton to the next generation, investing in the next generation and trusting that the gospel works gonna continue and have a life of its own. And if it looks different than what it looked like, when we were kids, or what it looks like right now. Like, that'll be okay. Because the gospel keeps moving forward.

 Caryn Rivadeneira  05:51

Sure, I mean, I'm really struck by that, actually, when you look at the different names and the places and so it's like, These people are all going to be very different, very different cultural backgrounds, very different perspectives. And I feel like that is really important at this idea. You're right, that it doesn't live and die with Paul, it will kind of the message in the media and all that the message will stay the same, but the way that it's presented and that it spreads, obviously like wildfire from here on out. isn't going to be just as Paul said it and yeah, I think I wonder I'm, I'm thinking that is probably why Luke added these little details, but we know that that's how it that's how it goes. Little vacuuming in the background. Is that what we're noting? Quite quite possibly

 Jeffrey Klein  06:30

something something's going on. Yeah, no, I love that. In fact, if you if you dig into these people that is Gaius, guy was baptized by Paul, that is supposed to be Gaius. Probably guys. Yeah. Alright, sorry. And he lived at his house in Corinth. And then Aristarchus  goes to prison with Paul, he ends up in prison with Paul and his companion, even in prison. And I love our Paul picks these people up and seems to develop them, you know, Wayne Gordon at Lawndale, he often talked about his own leadership, leadership development that he did was to bring someone with him everywhere he went. So if he was going to a meeting, he didn't care who was the mayor of Chicago, he take one of the young people in bandwidth. And that person would sit next to him and do this. Henry Nowis does similar thing when he was at Arch Home for the Mentally Disabled, he would bring along with him to his speeches, someone from there and then even give that person a chance to speak, which was pretty spectacular.

 Gregg DeMey  07:29

In his case, I think he brought the same young man that's right with him for years and years and years on end.

 Jeffrey Klein  07:34

Yeah. He tells a great story in the book in the name of Jesus about letting that guy have the microphone and gets up in front of all these priests and says, it's amazing, just simple message. But again, leadership development, or discipling people, how how well do we do that?

 Gregg DeMey  07:53

Yeah. So this is something behind the scenes. I mean, it's probably three years ago now. Just book called Growing Young, and one of the main big ideas is bring young people along or share the keys with them as soon as possible. And because this is informal, and not a sermon, like I'm not right, I'm not declaring things but for sure, like our leadership groups behind the scenes have like talked about this. And like, Would it be great to have a couple young people sit in on the elders meeting? Wouldn't it be great to have a couple high schoolers, like, hear what the SLT talks about? And how we make decisions? Because I can guarantee like, what's actually going on there is a lot humbler and less powerful than probably what a young person's conception of like, Oh, these older adults who have their act together making decisions about stuff, they would quickly realize, like, Oh, my goodness, there's like, nobody has this figured out. And part of the way the wisdom of the Holy Spirit moves is through, like people wrestling with things and working through things.

 Caryn Rivadeneira  08:53

Yeah, I mean, I'm also thinking about, whether it's age or whatever, but just again, getting back to the differences in these people, like I love hanging out with people, Christian, I mean, I don't know, non Christians as well. But Christians from different faith traditions, you know, I think about a number of writers groups that I'm in, number of them happen to usually it's women happen to be pastors as well, too. But just hearing their different perspectives, how their churches are working, and that sort of, I don't know, just for my own perspective, and my own growth and leadership development, too. It's really interesting to hear what other churches are wrestling with, what other care departments are doing, you know, how they handle these sorts of things. And so I see that as the benefit of this to that it isn't, it's certainly it's to raise up younger people as well, but just even for our own, you know, interest understanding what else is going on with the other perspectives are out there.

 Jeffrey Klein  09:43

Yeah, the, I mean, this is obviously a huge problem in the American church right now. Yeah, not just not just Elmhurst CRC, but trust the American church, the the generation of 18 to 29-30 year olds are all kind of you know, Heading elsewhere. I was in a church this weekend that was aimed kind of at this. So they handed me earplugs when I came in because I had gray hair. So they gave me they saw my gray hair. And the guy says, here, here, Sir, here's some earplugs. I'm like, Why do I need these? He goes, Well, the music's kind of loud, and you look like you're a little older. So we just don't want to have you, you know, like, be uncomfortable or so how could you change into a race? I told them, I said, Dude, I can handle your music. I kind of got you know, I was like, Yeah, I get it. So he was, you know, that. But it was interesting that that's how they aim. Their church is like, well, we're going after people that aren't shirts, and we're going to people that are younger. And so when you look around the crowd is the crowd gathered. My two nephews are the reason I went to this church in Philadelphia. they're younger, and this is the church they found and so their dad's been going, their parents been going with them. So I went along, I went to see this church and was all about it. Nothing's different, just a lot more flashing lights and rock show to start for worship. And then you know, the sermon. He said some words in the sermon that I think if I sit here, I'd be probably in big trouble ouzo, but again, he just, again, care to repeat

 Gregg DeMey  11:05

any of them.

 Caryn Rivadeneira  11:08

Gregg cast power to mute you now.

 Jeffrey Klein  11:12

I'll be in big trouble. So

 Gregg DeMey  11:14

yeah, well, I think this issue having is less about music, I mean, music, right. You know, styles change. I mean, as a musician, myself, if the music is so loud, that you can't hear yourself singing or participating. Like, I don't care what style it is. But like, that's, I think, I think it's actually a better goal. To have people have a sense of common participation, right? Like, no matter what style of music, it is, right? Yeah. However, I think those of us who are older, our real problem is we don't trust the younger generation to keep the church on the rails.

 Jeffrey Klein  11:45

That's true. Yeah, we think that if we turn it over to them, they're gonna mess it up.

 Gregg DeMey  11:49

I'm not saying I personally believe that I'm saying like, I think that spirit exists of like, hey, where culture is going? The assumptions are young people have like, they might change this thing, away from what has been like, historic Orthodox Christianity.

 Jeffrey Klein  12:04

I don't know if we know how to even empower younger people. Like if we did have them on a team, let's say you're the only young person on a team of elders or there's even two of you there. How's it gonna go? Like, are you gonna feel free to speak up? Are you gonna have you know, someone's have to call on you, someone's gonna have to ask your opinion, because you're not likely to probably just jump in and start talking.

 Gregg DeMey  12:24

Right? Well, so I love talking to like three and four year olds. Honestly, like I had a couple great conversations this last week about superheroes and cookies, like we had these orange cookies out. So I mean, my talking to a little kid, the approach has to be just like, let them talk about whatever they're interested in. And, like, listen, ask more questions, like, they come out with the most awesome stuff. And I think with young adults, obviously, this is not a perfect analogy. I'm not comparing them to three and four year olds, but their real contribution will be in the area of what they're genuinely interested in, not us having an agenda of like, we need to download these three or four things on you while you walk alongside or while you are there at the meeting. Like they will intuitively pick up what's most essential. But when it comes to actually like talking, like we do well as the older and more experienced folks like to let them talk about what they're already genuinely interested in passionate about. Well, and

 Caryn Rivadeneira  13:19

I think and then the challenge is to listen and to appreciate and not to devalue. And not to say that's wrong, that's wrong. You know, this is that's bad. You're unorthodox. How dare you think this? And that is sort of a knee jerk that happens in a lot of communities. And because that That, to me, is the thing. It's not about music that drives younger people away. It's not about preaching any of that. It's this idea that no, these things matter to us. And we're not being heard and listened to. And, you know, the church is not so inviting younger people to an elder meeting, or SLT meeting is great, or deacons or staff meeting, whatever, if they're actually going to be listened to and not like, oh, let's just have them in and see how silly their ideas listen to

 Gregg DeMey  14:00

doesn't equate. We're going to exactly do what you

 Caryn Rivadeneira  14:05

definitely not right, definitely be taken seriously and have it considered, I guess, not just written off. I guess it's

 Gregg DeMey  14:11

true that but then it takes it does take maturity. Sure. So I mean, I have a little bit of a struggle with this right now. Like, right, our elders have led us into a vision where we have one worship service, and you know, people's reaction or excitement or level of grief about that are all over the map. And I mean, over the course of the summer had any number of like listening sessions, and the majority of the time was not me or the elders presenting a vision about this, but actually was collecting people to like, hear how was your worship experience been in the last at that point, you know, your plus of COVID and online and what are your thoughts about the future? But, you know, because people's preferences were already all over the map, like, obviously, you can do a lot of listening. But it's not like, we honored everybody's preferences as a result of that. And some people have come away from that experience, you know, thinking like, wow, that was pretty cool that the elders cared enough to organize these sessions. And there was like a pastor and multiple elders. And, you know, we got to probably almost 150 people that way to have these conversations about worship, but other people have come away from this. With exactly the opposite conclusion of like, you didn't really hear me you don't care? Sure.

 Jeffrey Klein  15:35

So getting practical, it'd be awesome if our older adults would actually, please tell me about that. I mean, you're you're getting pregnant, we're getting practical, I older adults would actually consider, yes, grabbing a couple of young people and walking with them. You know, can you imagine if you were a young person, and some older adult wants to do that. I know, he's been doing this Christianity thing for 50 years, and said, Hey, would you like to get together read the Bible together? And it probably good for the older adults who might get a whole new perspective on? Yeah, right. And then also the kids were the, you know, the younger people would be poured into by someone who has had lifelong wisdom and could be a really dynamic relationship.

 Gregg DeMey  16:15

Yeah. Yeah, I think the key phrase is a older person, is to if you can say this, honestly, to a young person, I see this in you, right. I mean, even like every believer, like, that's when we come alive, when we have a sense that, like, God sees this in us, or made us for this, it's like, that's when you feel, you know, meaning and purpose for and like your life. So we can do that as older adults, because we have, you know, we've met more people we have experienced, like, it's easier for us to, I mean, identify the gifts and potential in the young person and not that we're laying out a prescription for the rest of their adult life, but just to like, name something good and strong. Yeah, that if you're older person listening to this, like, that's an amazing thing to do whenever you can do that.

 Caryn Rivadeneira  17:02

And I would say, even if that thing sort of makes you a little nervous, because I think, again, this younger generation, obviously, every younger generation has had different ideas, new fresh ideas, but to allow that this could be the Holy Spirit working in this generation. And again, not to like clamp it down. That's wrong. But just to say, not only do I see this gift in you, but I see whatever this is bubbling up in you this passion, that this is a gift of the Spirit to be used. And that sometimes this is nerve wracking, especially if we think oh, no, this is going to change things. This is going to make the church different. This isn't going to be the same, you know, but just sort of be open to that. Not that everything is you know, comes from the Holy Spirit. I don't mean to say that, but

 Gregg DeMey  17:42

just one tiny example this week, we'll be saying goodbye to our choir accompanist, Robyn Vitson who's moving to Erie, Pennsylvania, lovely Robyn to live with and take care of her mom in her later years in Erie. So like, where do you go to find an new piano player to work with the choir?

 Jeffrey Klein  18:06

I know some good old ones.

 Gregg DeMey  18:07

Yes. You want some of the experience? That wasn't my experience? Exactly. But, but in fact, we've turned to a 19 year old. Oh, my goodness, I know.

 Jeffrey Klein  18:18

Oh, my goodness.

 Gregg DeMey  18:20

So Rachel Beles, who's in her sophomore year at Wheaton College's just had her first week with the choir. And I'm super excited. Yeah, because I mean, she has great musical skills, but for sure the like the role of accompanying excited to, like, come alongside her because that's a whole different like aspect of music. It's one thing to like, be a crack performer and be able to do your own thing. It's another thing to like, be the orchestra that plays along with a group of singers. So anyway, there's probably a limitless way to invite young people into something that even things that we generally think are for older adults.

 Caryn Rivadeneira  19:01

Yeah, for sure.

 Gregg DeMey  19:02

A couple of odds and ends here. So Paul, the reason for Paul's trip back to Jerusalem is likely he is bringing an offering collected from all the far flung churches. At this point, I think the mother church back in Jerusalem was having struggles. I mean, we do know from early acts, they like sold everything, gave everything away on the front end. And perhaps a couple decades later, they are finding themselves in a moment of need. Also, sailing around the Mediterranean Sea in the winter months, like not a great idea. So everywhere in the northern hemisphere, like you get higher winds, you get colder temperatures. And if you don't have you know, a motorized boat, or any kind of heat onboard like the idea of traveling in late December, no wind and the waves. So Paul very wisely, and people may Your world very wisely kind of hunkered down. And not that there's horrible weather in Greece, even in the winter months.

 Jeffrey Klein  20:06

But a lots of waves and storms come in then. So yeah. Yeah. And I mean, this is when I was a rave in LA. And he said that during this era, the Roman Empire stock market would be up into the right for 80 straight years. And so like the places like Corinth, Ephesus, these places were what just pile with money, right? They had money come out of their ears. And so it's a great analogy. Yeah. And so So basically, you know, be able to the church in Jerusalem, I don't know what was going on in Judea, that area was certainly the far flung part of the Roman Empire. And there was always trouble between the Jews and the Romans. And so you never know if that economic wealth spread there. And obviously, the church there was struggling. So the Christians and all these other places to have lots of resources, send it to Jerusalem.

 Gregg DeMey  20:52

So Luke doesn't say this in particular, but I would suspect that if Paul's staying in Greece, probably he's in Corinth, the place where he had previously spent a year and a half that had all kinds of problems, complicated challenges. But that Paul, like love dearly, like he left a lot of his heart there. It's theorized that likely he wrote the book of Romans at this time. Yeah, so I don't know that for sure. But possibly in this three months, but we do know from later verses like he is really really eager feels compelled to get back to Jerusalem. Like there's something driving him so however, before this trip gets made there, there's a very interesting aside that happens at a church service, probably in Corinth.

 Jeffrey Klein  21:40

I think it's in Trouis, stayed seven days, then we don't know. Yeah, no, you're right. And Troy's Right. So there's still intro as the state seven days and so it's the first day of the week, which is the Sabbath day, right? The Christian Sabbath day, not the Jewish Sabbath day. So that's where it begins. Okay,

 Gregg DeMey  21:55

yeah, read this out for us. There

 Jeffrey Klein  21:56

you go. On the first day of the week, we came together to break bread. Paul spoke to the people and because he intended to leave the next day, kept on talking until midnight. Whoa, that is a sermon. Go man go there were many lamps in the upstairs room where we were meeting seated in the window was a young man named muta kiss who was sinking into a deep sleep as Paul talked on and on. When he was sound asleep. He fell to the ground from the third story and was picked up dead. Paul went down through himself in the young man and put his arms around him. Don't be alarmed, he said, he's alive. Then he went upstairs again and broke bread and ate. After talking until daylight, he left the people took the young man home alive or greatly comforted.

 Gregg DeMey  22:39

Wow, alright. A friends if you've ever fallen asleep in church, don't feel too bad. But results may vary. It is biblical,

 Jeffrey Klein  22:50

but this sermon right here that goes till midnight, and then they pick this guy up and heal them and they go back upstairs and talks all night

 Caryn Rivadeneira  22:58

long. Like how he keeps going, like he doesn't read the wrong room that people are falling asleep are getting bored

 Gregg DeMey  23:03

man on a mission? Or maybe Paul was not great at reading the room? I don't think so.

 Jeffrey Klein  23:09

You think sermons are long in the modern day church, we complain if they're like, oh, man, this guy's talking for 25-30 minutes. He's gone over time. Paul, he's going for like 12 hours.

 Gregg DeMey  23:21

So we're making fun of the situation and making fun of Paul a little bit. But possibly there's some virtues of Paul on display there because for sure, I am sure this was not a light hearted situation in any way shape or form. Like Paul probably begins this evening. thinking this is probably the last time I'm going to be with these people. I'm want to share like something significant to empower them. And like spiritually fuel them, like into the future because like, after this like it's gonna go on. But that's my that's my last shot.

 Jeffrey Klein  23:55

Oh, absolutely. And it is amazing. The commitment of the believers to stay all through the night knowing he's leaving the next day. They don't want to leave, like they're there. I always call this the first all nighter in the church history. You know, your youth pastor, the lock nighters is the first time ever.

 Gregg DeMey  24:09

So was there a pizza?

 Jeffrey Klein  24:10

I don't know if there's pizza, or they broke bread. It says yeah, and I assume that's also both the Lord's Supper and then, you know, this was more of a meal then. So they probably Lord's Supper. You know, they ate bread, and they kind of was all mixed together. But

 Gregg DeMey  24:25

yeah, yeah. So just to clarify the situation here. I mean, the Jewish Sabbath runs from sundown on Friday evening, through sunset on Saturday evening, right. So the Christian Sabbath, would have run from sundown on Saturday evening through sundown on Sunday, so likely they are together after the sun goes down and Saturday night. So both having like Resurrection Day worship, but like the concept of like Sunday morning worship might not have been a thing yet, like We don't know exactly. So maybe just that like the day shifted from the Jewish Sabbath to the resurrection day, but that the day started with a sunset and that when you get up in the morning, so right, reimagining like they're getting together it says they came together to break bread. Quite likely, I think not just like a meal, but the Lord's supper together. I mean, Paul writes, on one occasion to the Corinthians in quite a bit of detail about that shared supper in Jesus name, and then an epic message.

 Caryn Rivadeneira  25:32

Yeah, I mean, I do think it speaks, though, to the, you know, it's funny to think of him just, you know, speaking, speaking, speaking for 12 hours straight, but it probably speaks to that deep love and relationship that I think we talked about previously, just that Paul had with people that I would imagine maybe there was some conversation happening questions, and you know, and answers and things like that, I would hope but, yeah, I mean, it does sort of seem like something you would do because you knew that your, you know, Grandfather was leaving on a year long trip or something. So you want to spend every moment listening. But yeah, then for Eutychus,

 Gregg DeMey  26:04

So Caryn, what is your general feeling about sermons that last more than say 20 minutes?

 Caryn Rivadeneira  26:09

Yeah, I love them now. Yeah, not. I like a nice short sermon. I was reading an article this morning about how during COVID, a pastor managed to tighten her sermons to 1000 words, and I was like, wow, that's like, probably eight minutes or something like that. But I'm just because

 Jeffrey Klein  26:28

during whatever turns dream,

 Caryn Rivadeneira  26:31

I do love a tight sermon that said, there are times obviously when, you know, there's a lot to be said, and again, imagining this as more of a conversational thing. And, you know, someone, you know, giving all their wisdom before they they leave in someone who's, who's Beloved. But yeah, I have great sympathy for Eutychus. I'm not a late night person, either. So if I were in this situation, I probably wouldn't have sat in a window

 Gregg DeMey  26:57

and discovered yet in Europe.

 Jeffrey Klein  27:01

The wonder like this. So this is Luke. He's super detailed. He's he's writing scripture, right? This ends up in the canon, this is like scripture. So like, Okay, what's going on here? Why is this story of all the stories you could tell ahead of you a lot of these kind of stories along the way a little mishaps, whatever that went on. So this particular story makes it Eutychus falling asleep. And I have a hypothesis about them. I don't I mean, obviously, there's the miraculous resurrection from the dead that is performed. The guy dies falling out a third story window is

 Gregg DeMey  27:32

a long way. There's lots of healings, not so many resurrection.

 Jeffrey Klein  27:35

Exactly. So this is a resurrection from the dead, young man who would have been would have been super sad in the middle of the church service. If you know, I've been in church services we're using an older person may be kills over if they call an ambulance, stop everything. Get them out. It's super disruptive. It makes everyone like, oh my goodness, what's going on? kind of wakes everyone up. For sure. This guy falls out the window. He's a young guy. We don't know how young he is. Is the high school kid. Is he even younger than that? Is he's in his 20s. We don't know. But anyway, he dies. So everyone runs downstairs like Oh, my goodness, can you believe what just happened? And then Paul grabs them, and he's raised from the dead.

 Caryn Rivadeneira  28:12

So what they don't write about though, is you followed a third story window and you're not dead. You're very broken. So the scenes of then being picked up dead. I'm just picturing how. Yeah, like all those broken bones to I don't know. Makes me a little queasy. They pick them up.

 Jeffrey Klein  28:28

But yeah, yeah, falling from any distance like this is

 Caryn Rivadeneira  28:32

hopefully the miracle included bone regeneration quickly healing. Well,

 Gregg DeMey  28:37

we don't have any kind of injury report. No, no, nope. On the one hand, like I don't young people who have been struck by cars and broken thing, this tends to go more poorly, the older we get,

 Caryn Rivadeneira  28:48

right? Sleeping, he's relaxed.

 Gregg DeMey  28:51

One of the other hypothesis on this is that you to kiss not only had this amazing experience, but that in later life, he grew into an early church leader, or a bishop so that like, hearing his name, like in the early church would have made some kind of a connection sense.

 Jeffrey Klein  29:10

Yeah. Yeah. And again, this experience for you to guess would have been a life changing experience. He was clearly he was clearly not that enamored with the sermon or what was going on. He was falling deep sleep, right? Who knows maybe what else maybe 12 hours a day right before that could have been doing a million things. Right. So here he is. Now he falls asleep and falls at the window. He's raised from the dead. I'm sure you heard this story over and over again. Hey, do you were dead. And now Paul came down raise you from the dead. And so you know. Yeah. So I think it's a fascinating story. I was actually preaching on this particular passage, at General Synod for the Reformed Church in America.

 Gregg DeMey  29:49

And yeah, let's be clear, this did not happen at the CRC Synod. No, this

 Jeffrey Klein  29:53

is the RCA Synod and Reformed Church of America Synod. I'm preaching the worship service. And as I'm reading the passage, All right in the part where you look as falls asleep and falls, there's a four tiered like choir loft to my right. And the guy in the top tier, falls off the choir loft and smashes on the ground right in the middle of the reading of the Scripture. Amazing. And everyone's just like, what just happened? You hear people sort of giggling then people running like is this guy Okay, what's happening? And it was like one of those moments of like, Okay, Lord, what is going on?

 Gregg DeMey  30:26

What was that man's name?

 Jeffrey Klein  30:28

I don't know his name. I forgot his name. But he was he was a he was fine. He was not a young man. He was an older man, I think I'm not super old, but probably in his 40s and just fell off the back of this choir riser. Somehow.

 Caryn Rivadeneira  30:41

That happens fairly frequently. And so it was

 Jeffrey Klein  30:45

just the craziest timing like, Okay, what is going on? So? Yeah.

 Caryn Rivadeneira  30:50

And in fairness to Paul, I mean, after a resurrection after this, it does feel like that would require some more words. So I do feel bad for making fun of his long sermon. But

 Jeffrey Klein  30:59

and maybe people were more tuned in, I bet. They're gonna list out guys raised people from the dead, we better tune in.

 Gregg DeMey  31:05

Yeah. So partly the scene or when I even think about, like, you know, the writings of Homer like, the Odyssey and like, the human capacity to, like, sit in front of a story, in some cases, to memorize a story, but to experience something like, narrative, like, is much bigger than what we give ourselves credit for, or we have been so like, we're the weird ones. We've been conditioned in our modern world by, you know, 32 second ads, and now five second ads on YouTube so that our, like, attention span is like it needs to fire to something new all the time. But we're the weird ones.

 Jeffrey Klein  31:47

Yeah. Cell phones have greatly enhanced this issue, right? We're constantly distracted by our phones are super powerful. I was going through the airport the other day, everywhere I look next to me, people are plugged into the wall and staring at their screens. So this is pretty much what we do. I do it too, right? You just sit down and you just know what you're doing. So you pick up your phone and start scrolling and looking at things. You're getting these notifications. And then it's this quick two minute video or this woman thing. And then our attention span has been destroyed. Really?

 Gregg DeMey  32:19

Well, it's still there. Right? If Yeah, if you want to recover, it does take some work in discipline. And I would, I would say for all of us, we come across things that are so compelling, or things that are so interesting to us that we somewhat naturally are able to break out

 Jeffrey Klein  32:33

of it like a football game. Like I'm just saying I can sit for three hours in front of a football game, right?

 Gregg DeMey  32:41

If you're a music lover, you can go to a Wagnerian opera and be enraptured for three straight hours. Or if you're a you know, cinema file you can if it's the right movie, you can sit for three plus hours or, or a

 Jeffrey Klein  32:55

great play like Les Miserables. I mean, I was mesmerized the whole time, right? I've seen that thing like three times it was like, Well, this is amazing. So

 Gregg DeMey  33:04

or for people who love to read, I mean, there's been times where like a certain book has come out where true confessions when Harry Potter seven came out, like I did not sleep an entire night. I was I got that thing at midnight is right, lost a perfectly good night's sleep. And I think this occasion maybe has more in common with that. Right? Absolutely. Sort of energy than it does with our conception of a Sunday morning worship service. For sure. It's like Paul is here, and what this might be the last time like, and Paul would have brought that same kind of, you know, energy. So like, this is a moment in the city in the church.

 Jeffrey Klein  33:43

So the next time we preach great, we should announce this is the last time you hear me? And then I'll be wandering off. So like, what is it? Oh, just kidding. Just kidding.

 Caryn Rivadeneira  33:55

I'd go over really well.

 Gregg DeMey  33:57

Can you do that every week for years? Yeah, no, this is maybe a podcast for another day. But the the benefit of being like a short timer, or a one timer. Right? Right. There's like a window of opportunity in that where you can speak something really strong and direct. But there's also something and being you know, the long walk in the same direction and sort of slow shepherding at Elmhurst CRC I mean, Bert was here for 32 years right? 27 or 28 as the senior pastor and he's still around so yeah, I mean, it's been nearly 40 years at this point. So that this church has had like a good long stretch of so if anything, we probably need a little more of the the fly-by drop in. Like, like energy to like, like break some things up.

 Jeffrey Klein  34:56

Yeah, yeah, that's what's that's what's fun about being an itinerant speaker, right, you go to these places, you can really speak into them with honesty and, and really go after and say, okay, you know, people can get mad at you, but you're just gonna leave anyway. I think, yeah, more relationship than that with these folks. He wasn't really

 Caryn Rivadeneira  35:14

probably but but I was thinking like when I would, you know, lead like a retreat or something like that for a weekend like you do get, I mean, you don't know them deeply, deeply well, but whatever, it's a lot of light, late nights and sitting around and talking and you know, all this sort of get to know people. And so there is something you write about that, like last night mentality of not that I would ever go talk more than 25 minutes,

 Gregg DeMey  35:34

but there's, there's something like, so in a couple of weeks, I'll be on a spiritual retreat to, and I'll be leading some singing and music at these things. And I don't mean, it's gonna sound narcissistic. But when you're with people, and with this group of like, 70 people four times a year, and when you know, you're going to drop in, and if you come with like an open heart, and some transparency, like you can have super transparent and significant, meaningful, lasting connections and conversations with people in very short order, especially if the gathering is around, trying to listen to the Holy Spirit and gathering in Jesus name. Bless you, Jeff, I should mute you, but I can't reach the button and trying to

 Jeffrey Klein  36:16

mute myself, but I could even know where the button is. Right.

 Gregg DeMey  36:21

But also, how should I put this? So I think when you're with other people, like I play a little music there, and people are generally super encouraging, like it's so awesome to sing together. I mean, in two days, there's more courage than when you're in the long haul. You just, I'm not I'm not doing I'm not trying to say please encourage us more as staff people church, if you're listening to this, that's not the point. It's just that when you're with people all the time, like your own family members, like you recognize who they are, but you don't tell them how awesome they are at everything every single day.

 Caryn Rivadeneira  36:53

Yeah, it's totally true. And like family man in a church like they've seen you at your best your worst the baggage, you know, they know it all. And that's, that's great. And it's hard. And it's all those things, but right when you're popping in itinerant, then he just kind of they don't know all that. You know, you can they only see that they only see the best in Seminar. Yeah.

 Jeffrey Klein  37:14

Your best five sermons you've ever preached? Sure,

 Gregg DeMey  37:20

yeah. So leaving situations, there's always a tiny little voice of temptation of like, Wouldn't it be great to organize your whole life this way? I mean, it's totally false.

 Jeffrey Klein  37:29

It is a mess. It's the whole camp thing, right? It's like when you go to camp, and everyone's like, Oh, man, I wish we could stay here forever. I'm like, yeah, if we stay there forever, then basically, we be here. And that would cause everything

 Caryn Rivadeneira  37:38

that was exactly

 Jeffrey Klein  37:41

right. Because you know, within the two weeks, we'd all be sick of each other and it'd be right back to normal. Because we all have that inside of us ways to just mess this up. So it's been great for a week. Hang on to this as being a great revival experience. And then just go home and try to live out of the power of this instead of wishing you could stay here because for sure.

 Gregg DeMey  38:02

Amen. Well, after this amazing all night worship service, Paul gets back down to it and is trying to get himself back to Jerusalem. So we are going to finish out Acts chapter 20. Quite a few verses, so invite you to listen up carefully.

 Caryn Rivadeneira  38:18

Yeah, here we go. We went on ahead of the ship and sailed for Assos where we were going to take Paul aboard. He had made this arrangement because he was going there on foot. When he met us at Assos. We took him we took him aboard and went on to middling. The next day we set sail from there and arrived at Chios. The day after that we crossed over to Samos and on the following day arrived at mad at us. Paul had decided to sail past Ephesus to avoid spending time in the province of Asia for he was in a hurry to reach Jerusalem, if possible by the day of Pentecost for Miletus. Paulson to Ephesus for the elders of the church.

 Gregg DeMey  38:58

Alright, so Paul doesn't want to go into Ephesus, he might have created some nonsense, law nonsense last time he's there. So he sends for the elders and they come meet him a little ways away. When they arrived, Paul said to them, you know how I lived the whole time I was with you. From the first day I came to the province of Asia I served the Lord with great humility and with tears. And in the midst of severe testing by the plots of my Jewish opponents, you know that I have not hesitated to preach anything that would be helpful to you. But I've taught you publicly and from house to house I've declared to both Jews and Greeks that they must turn to God and repentance and have faith in our Lord Jesus.

 Jeffrey Klein  39:35

And now compelled by the Spirit, I am going to Jerusalem not knowing what will happen to me there. I only know that in every city the Holy Spirit warns me that prison and hardships are facing me. However, I consider my life worth nothing to me. My only aim is to finish the race and complete the task. The Lord Jesus has given me the task of testifying to the good news of God's grace.

 Gregg DeMey  39:57

Now I know that none of you among whom I have gone above preaching the kingdom will ever see me again. Therefore, I declare to you today, that I am innocent of the blood of any of you, for I have not hesitated to proclaim to you the whole will of God. Now keep watch over yourselves and all the flock of which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers. Be shepherds of the Church of God, which he bought with his own blood. I know that after I leave, savage wolves will come in among you and will not spare the flock. Even from your own number men will arise and distort the truth in order to draw away disciples after them. So be on your guard. Remember that for three years, I never stopped warning each of you night and day with tears.

 Jeffrey Klein  40:40

Now I commit you to God into the word of His grace, which can build you up and give you an inheritance among all those who are sanctified. I have not coveted anyone silver or gold or clothing. you yourselves know that these hands of mine have supplied my own needs and the needs of my companions, and everything I did. I showed you that by this kind of hard work, we must help the weak. remembering the words of the Lord Jesus Himself said, The words the Lord Jesus Himself said, It is more blessed to give than to receive.

 Caryn Rivadeneira  41:08

When Paul had finished speaking, he knelt down with all of them and prayed. They all wept as they embraced him and kissed him, or grieve them most was his statement that they would never see his face again. Then they accompanied him to the ship.

 Gregg DeMey  41:24

Quite a scene here. So we've alluded this several times in a podcast already. Paul wasn't just a Christian intellectual. He wasn't just eager to hold himself up in a study and write some letters to keep proper, you know, Christian theology and Orthodoxy in the young churches. I mean, he was a guy who was all in, in friendship in relational involvement. I mean, this is one city among many that he preached and suffered and bled in and when he's saying this final goodbye, I mean, the scene of Paul kneeling, maybe they're kneeling together, maybe they lay hands on Paul, and everybody's weeping out of love, and sort of bittersweet. Yeah, in these intermingled feelings, both appreciation for Paul and just nostalgia and sadness, they're not going to see his face again, in the land of the living just like beautiful proof of Paul's close friendship and relationship. It's striking that the thing that I mean, Paulson, it says a lot of hard things to them, like wolves are going to come and tear the church up. And the thing they're most sad about is that they're not going to see Paul in person again,

 Jeffrey Klein  42:38

right. Not the other thing, right? And Paul's commitment, I mean, he's that he's life means nothing. He's he's willing to give his life for this gospel. So he's, he's following the instructions of the Holy Spirit, even though they're leading to imprisonment, and probably death. But he's gonna follow anyway. Like, I don't know, I'm thinking, wow, when I was reading something, it could I do that. Like if I knew that if I follow the instructions of the Holy Spirit, I was going to be killed, or imprisoned or something bad was gonna happen to me when I go through with it. And to think that why would the Holy Spirit lead me to a place where bad things are gonna happen to me? Right?

 Gregg DeMey  43:16

Right. That's the most that tension is the most striking thing about Paul's closing words, the Ephesian elders here like it's very clear, the Holy Spirit has given him directions compelled him. Yeah, it says, to go to Jerusalem and bring this offering. And then also, it's the same spirit that is warning him everywhere he goes, like, pain in prison await you, dude.

 Jeffrey Klein  43:38

Like, whoa, yeah, I

 Caryn Rivadeneira  43:40

mean, you just try to imagine I don't. I mean, I guess you understand that as a Christian. And we talked about that, again, you know, here as well, that it's just it's not an easy road, it doesn't mean everything is up into the right, like the Roman stock market. You're saying, and yet it just in our hearts, we don't want to believe that that's true. We really want to believe that, well, if I do what God says, that's going to be, you know, holy living is going to be the path to good living and easy living. And

 Jeffrey Klein  44:07

I mean, even worse, if you're a pastor in seminary, or a guy trying to be a seminar, or a woman, Trinity seminary pastor, and you're over there, you're not dreaming about, oh, man, I can't wait to get on the journey. So that someday I'll get, you know, Paul, I mean, I'm gonna I'm gonna get on the journey. I'm going to build this massive, amazing church where people are gonna come to know Jesus is gonna just grow and grow and grows, and I'll be up into the rising, be amazing. And people will appreciate me. That's right. I mean, seriously, this is what you're thinking. I mean, this is in your mind, these dreams of like building the kingdom and these amazing things. So it's like, wow, I often think of Paul and think if he were being measured, or or evaluated, or his metrics are being put out there, you know, in the modern day world, he would probably be considered like, well, I don't know, did he succeed or not succeed? He planted a lot of churches but they were these little churches that all kinds of struggles and all kinds of problems and

 Caryn Rivadeneira  44:59

you know, it's a great point, I think we would view him as a failure. I think if he weren't here, you'd be like, Oh, now here

 Jeffrey Klein  45:04

he comes. Here comes ball. The guy's gonna talk, can't even

 Caryn Rivadeneira  45:07

stay at one church for without getting thrown into jail for a year and a half. I mean, I mean, it just,

 Gregg DeMey  45:12

it's just interesting to think about. I mean, he definitely would have had frequent flyer miles.

 Jeffrey Klein  45:18

Frequent sailing, sailing,

 Caryn Rivadeneira  45:21

right. At this point, all his cruises were for free.

 Jeffrey Klein  45:24

Yeah. But it is interesting to think about, like the metrics we think of, you know, the Holy Spirit's compelling us to do this thing. And we often measure it by if it comes out all roses. But what if the Holy Spirit's leading us to a place that he needs us to go, where things are going to come out roses, but that's part of God's design for building his kingdom, and you're just the person in the middle of that's what you're called to do. And that's what you're called to be. That's your role, right?

 Caryn Rivadeneira  45:50

And yet, I feel like we do have the sense that when we are doing the right thing, and following the spirit, that there's going to be pushback and challenges, like we understand that we understand there's going to be the spiritual warfare, not even just from, you know, Satan, but from just other people, there's going to be pushback when we want to do the right thing. But I don't think we ever think it's going to be this, you know, it's very difficult.

 Gregg DeMey  46:13

I think anybody who has the experience of trying to lead anything outside the church, business world, sports inside the church, like you understand. Yeah, there's going to be just pushback and resistance and misunderstanding, all the way. And oftentimes, it's pushing through that that actually confirms that you're doing the right thing. So I mean, that's, I think what Paul is embracing here, the Holy Spirit has told me to do this, that much I know. And now the Holy Spirit is just confirming, like, there's gonna be all kinds of things that like, I don't like and are gonna hurt me and result in me sharing the sufferings of Christ rather than things working out, quote, successfully.

 Jeffrey Klein  46:55

Yeah, there's I went to this conference last week, called Amplify Outreach at Wheaton College. And one of the speakers in the morning talked about playing your role in the kingdom, that, you know, he basically said, Look, not everyone's going to be up here on stage speaking at the conference, not everyone's going to be the megachurch pastor, the whatever in like, you know, like, just embrace the role God's giving you to play in the kingdom. It's, it's an important role. And he's called you to it, because he's knows you're uniquely designed for that role. And so I think, that spoke to me for him for a number of reasons, like Okay, so you know, I'm, this is where God's placed me Elmhurst CRC, so he called me here, I have no doubt about it, I can tell the stories of all the little bit laserlight. So he put on to get me here. So okay, so I have a role to play in this church this time. For this reason, I don't know what's happening in the big tapestry of the kingdom. But this is the role that I've been given a place. So just play the role. Don't try to, I guess, find another role or, you know, run around trying to. Yeah, as I think it's an interesting word. So I think Paul was playing his role. He knew what his role was, and he's listening to spirit and he's being obedient. He's like, trusting that God is up to something. It's I think it's hard for us as Americans,

 Caryn Rivadeneira  48:06

yeah, my writer friends, and I talk about that a lot, too. It's like, we feel like we're supposed to write these books we have in our hearts, you know, you send them out into the world, whether they're bestsellers, whether they're medium sellers, whether they don't so well, it's just that sort of thing of well, and I do use language of God told me to write that book, because it that gets a little tricky, but just this idea that as writers, that is our role in the world and as writers of faith.

 Jeffrey Klein  48:30

So 500,000 copies and some people's book sell 5000 copies.

 Caryn Rivadeneira  48:34

Yeah, five 5000 is still a great number. The average book sells about 500, or something. So anything above that you're doing well, which is remarkable. All that said, Yeah, I mean, it is you just sort of have to embrace Well, this is what I'm supposed to do, and kind of leave the rest.

 Jeffrey Klein  48:50

Because I used to I got I'll just confess my ego sin. Yeah, in the past, as a speaker, I set these big, you know, youth conventions with five or 6000 kids, and I'd be listening to speakers going, I could do this. Like, why the heck am I not up there doing this? And that would be my thought, sir. It's my ego speaking to me and you know, then at some point, it came to the conclusion I'm like, okay, because God just doesn't, you know, want me to do that. Like he's got you know, who's going to speak at Timber lead the kids there who's gonna speak at Fort Wilderness the kids there who's gonna speak at this camp and that camp, you know, these big speakers are going to go there. So this is the role in in even the speaking world that he's given me a place to just lean into it and just play it don't try to be the whatever keeps advancing myself up the right the speaking ladder, whatever that is. Yeah. Trying to get to be the big speaker with all the other big speakers you know, it's just funny because that's American mindset. We always want to keep advancing keep No, I'm not saying it's wrong. It's just interesting to to be in your spot and go okay, I'm gonna listen to the Spirit. I'm gonna lean whatever the Spirit tells me this wrong.

 Gregg DeMey  49:54

Totally agree with all this. What are my thoughts looking back on my life is like God wisely don't trust me to be an overly famous person. Yeah.

 Jeffrey Klein  50:05

I think that's probably true for me. Also, I think that's my ego wouldn't be able to handle it. Right. Oh, to turn into some kind of nut job. So he just keeps me humble.

 Gregg DeMey  50:14

No to your exact,

 Jeffrey Klein  50:15

uh, no to your job. And I already am.

 Caryn Rivadeneira  50:17

Right. Well, yeah, you see, and I think that's the you know, it's that strange comfort anytime you see the the very real downsides of fame and fortune and all that and it is. Yeah, thank goodness. So one of the things can I just mention them that I'm always struck by in this passage is just how, you know, we every time we do our little devotions, we introduce them and say, where the Holy Spirit is the main actor. I just am like, so crazy about the verses where it gets so remarkably Trinitarian like all of a sudden, we're talking about shepherds and God and Holy Spirit and Jesus and just this lie in the Church of God, which he bought with his own blood. Yeah. And not using that and not using Jesus did

 Gregg DeMey  50:54

the cross, Jesus' blood Yeah, like God's own blood

 Caryn Rivadeneira  50:58

amazed it just really hit me like wow, this is some this is intense, and how might that have been? You know, received before you know, they use to the language of the Trinity you know, where their minds kind of like what is happening, you know, or Yes, roll with it. You know, I mean, this took a long time to

 Jeffrey Klein  51:13

figure out necessarily, yeah,

 Caryn Rivadeneira  51:14

word yet it wasn't a word correctly. It wasn't a thing. I guess it was a thing. Right? Was

 Jeffrey Klein  51:19

it when it became a thing?

 Gregg DeMey  51:20

It's clear, like God is the Creator, it's clear that the Holy Spirit is God. It's very clear that Jesus of Nazareth is God.

 Jeffrey Klein  51:27

Sure. And I mean, really, even your as an elder, you should take great comfort in this verse 28, keep watch over the flak you keep on top of yourselves and the flock of which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers. So if as an elder overseer of the flock, you know that God has called you through His Spirit in that role, hopefully, right that that's,

 Gregg DeMey  51:49

yeah. so wonderfully. This is kind of a formal moment in the annual life of the church when we ordain elders and deacons. But literally, we read these words, right to charge our elders every single year.

 Jeffrey Klein  52:00

Yeah, that's awesome.

 Caryn Rivadeneira  52:03

I don't think we mentioned the savage wolves though by name. I think we should bring that and that is a great image. Yes,

 Jeffrey Klein  52:09

savage wolves will devour you.

 Caryn Rivadeneira  52:11

Exactly. But yeah, it's

 Gregg DeMey  52:13

I don't want to get too personal about that. I think I think the wolves more are the spirit of the age. Oh, for sure. Right. And just a great image, corrupt part of whatever culture you find yourselves in that is antithetical to the kingdom of God. But some people are better at personifying those ideas or carrying those ideas.

 Caryn Rivadeneira  52:34

Yeah, no, I wasn't suggesting that we personify that, like who the wolves are. But I think it's just such a great image of even just, you know, the way a wolf sneaks around.

 Gregg DeMey  52:44

Yeah, unless I be pointing fingers at the worst possible situation, according to the Bible. I mean, there's some horrible chapters, and then easy keel, which we'll be launching into November about when the pastor's when the shepherds become the

 Jeffrey Klein  52:55

wolves. Exactly. That is your 16. That is the

 Gregg DeMey  52:58

worst of all possible spiritual worlds.

 Jeffrey Klein  53:02

It's probably the whatever we won't get into zekiel. Now was a great, you did point out something in our little notes here that I found interesting. I guess I had never really noticed this. But Paul quotes Jesus here, is more blessed to give than to receive. And if you look through the Gospels, you can't find that

 Gregg DeMey  53:19

correct. I think this is the only quote of Jesus that is outside of the Gospels, right. I mean, Jesus repeated elsewhere in the New Testament, but things that have connection to the Gospels.

 Jeffrey Klein  53:30

Yeah. Yeah. So that was that that was an interesting little thing, just to point out like, oh, so Jesus didn't really sit. I mean, well, he said this, Paul heard it, but it's never been written down in the gospels anywhere. So pretty cool.

 Gregg DeMey  53:43

Yeah, my mom repeated this phrase all the time. "It's more blessed to give then to receive."

 Jeffrey Klein  53:47

sir, yes. That was my mom and my grandmother. And yeah, it was constantly repeated, but she

 Gregg DeMey  53:53

was standing on pretty solid ground. Yes, exactly. Even that the Lord said at first. So yeah, I do wonder like, how many things we'll never know, like, kind of we're in common parlance and the first generation after Jesus that were remembered, but not written down in the gospels, on the other hand, like trust, the wisdom of the Holy Spirit, that what we have received all these years later is like what's essential? Yeah, but I'm a little curious about that. Or is this something that Jesus had personally to Paul, I guess, oh, that's also a possibility. Yeah.

 Caryn Rivadeneira  54:24

But they had like the sayings of Jesus right. They had those little things. So then you just wonder when the gospel writers were sitting down, right, for some reason, this one, it just didn't fit in, or they couldn't remember where you know, I don't it's it is curious when you think about how they come together to grow

 Jeffrey Klein  54:37

the gospel. Yeah, exactly. It's is that where's that story? Maybe

 Caryn Rivadeneira  54:42

it just never fit in? And he's like, well just throw it here. Yeah, exactly. No, that's a great point.

 Gregg DeMey  54:48

So any final thoughts? I mean, Acts 21 through 28 is kind of the trials and travails of Paul, once he gets back to Jerusalem gets on trial appeals to Caesar eventually ends up in prison and Rome and then from there, the slow fade into the gospel continuing.

 Jeffrey Klein  55:03

I always loved to think about the guards that were in the rented house in Rome that were guarding him day and night. Can you imagine guarding this guy for eight hours? And he was talking about Jesus the whole time? I mean, I'm just saying, like, if you didn't become a Christian, you're chained to this dude in his rented house, cuz you're waiting at trial, you're just assigned. Can you imagine the guards going? Oh, man, I gotta guard that guy again. Right? Did

 Caryn Rivadeneira  55:26

they convert just or just

 Gregg DeMey  55:28

Paul's Philippians jail record of like singing and worshiping, chained up, like, this guy's probably learned a whole bunch of songs, too.

 Jeffrey Klein  55:34

So I was thinking about those guys that are in the house with them like, okay, what are this poor guys doing? Well, yeah, amazing songs doing this stuff. Anyway, that's not my final reflections on Acts. My final reflections an Acts is that, you know, that the focus of the early church on the mission of God is absolutely leezar. Right, they don't let anything throw them off that mission, any opposition, any, whatever, they don't get distracted from the mission of God that they're there. They're the church exists for the mission of God, not the other way around. Right. And that's a huge takeaway for me, that these folks are laser focused. And that's the driving impulse of why they're doing what they're doing. They're not doing church to do church, they're not, they're, they're being driven by this gospel needs to be spread to all nations. This is the command of Our Lord, to make disciples of all nations. And we're gonna continue to do that, in every way, shape, and form we can, wherever we go, wherever we find ourselves, whether it's in jail, whether it's getting beat with rides, whether it's in a rented house with, you know, guards guarding us, I mean, whatever happens, we don't care, nothing's gonna throw us off that thing. So that strikes,

 Gregg DeMey  56:49

I'm gonna try to say this in just a different way. But it's very clear in the early church, that the borders of the church are open, because the spirit is blowing here, there and everywhere, is that right? The mission is going here, there and everywhere. It's not like the goal is to plant little closed systems, right in every single city. And because we've had cultural dominance in the West, and been, a majority movement in the United States of America, I mean, even just the language of like, we're a Christian nation, can lead us to believe that then we need to protect what we've had, or the way the past was, and be kind of like, more of a closed system, and keep everything in. And that is antithetical to the movement of the Holy Spirit and the picture of the health and vitality and the spread of resurrection life that we see in the end the book of Acts. So not saying it's bad to have a church building or a church campus are appreciate the good things that the Holy Spirit has done in the past. But that's not the point. Preservation is not the point.

 Caryn Rivadeneira  57:51

Right? I mean, even with the life of Paul, I mean, I'm really struck by that slow fade imagery. I mean, obviously, Paul is that super important person and just a huge gift of faith. But it's not about Paul, ultimately, it's about the gospel. It's about Jesus in the Holy Spirit. And so, you know, I think about the churches, and I'm glad we're not one of them. But you know, where the tradition is, you rotate out the pastor, a priest every few years to reinforce this idea. It's not about who is in the pulpit, it's about the message being proclaimed. And I think that's the other thing too, is that yeah, Paul's life ends on a downer. And I mean, a physical downer, I would say, you know, it does not end, you know, he's not in his big mansion, and this mega pastor house and all of that, like we do it today in America when you're a super successful pastor. But for going

 Jeffrey Klein  58:38

over our Yeah, and your Yes, sorry, Jesus would have had those I think, you know,

 Caryn Rivadeneira  58:42

those of which I speak Yes, exactly. Yeah, but I mean, I just find that really compelling. And because it didn't, didn't need to be Paul can be imprisoned and beaten and, you know, executed in the Gospel. Yes, it's both good and bad news.

 Jeffrey Klein  58:58

Legacy are all the people that he impact for sure. From the Philippian jailer, who is basically keeping him in the inner cell of the prison by order to the whatever centurions, you know, Cornelius, to, you just keep going to these other little guys is like Paul's legacy is impacting lives and helping them understand the gospel and then taking, you know, so when he dies, he's got this whole legacy of probably more people than we even have listed and acts that he's that would be a great goal. As a church member or a Christian. You know, you're here on planet Earth. Maybe you found Jesus at 12 or eight, or whatever it was, and God left to here. He didn't evacuate you from Planet Earth. He left you here to do something. So wow, wouldn't it be cool goal to say I'm going to try to impact at least a few lives along the way? That would be

 Gregg DeMey  59:47

Yeah, I think we have the mistaken perspective that Paul's legacy is like, wow, he planted a bunch of churches and God used him to write like quite a bit of the New Testament. We have his writings, but I think from God's perspective, really Paul's legacy is the human impact? Yeah, the relational impact, amazing. And we can all like, we're not all writers, God's not gonna use most of us to write things that people 2000 years later are still going to be reading. Yeah, maybe your books current, but I'm

 Caryn Rivadeneira  1:00:16

sure I'm sure that will be the case

 Jeffrey Klein  1:00:18

would point to you and say that person really helped me find this Jesus and impacted my life, right change my change my perspective change the way I was going helped me to alter the direction that's if we get everyone in church to think about themselves that way, we could change the world. Because think about the exponential multiplication of impact we'd have. If everybody was in life impact.

 Gregg DeMey  1:00:42

That is crazy talk, my friend.

 Jeffrey Klein  1:00:44

I know it is I know. These are my dreams, these things I dream about at night, when I lay in bed.

 Gregg DeMey  1:00:51

Okay, and we're the wild-eyed Holy Spirit thought. So we've come to the end of our journey at Acts chapter 20. Thanks for hanging with us. We're going to be a few weeks off. And then after the Thanksgiving holiday. The new church year begins for the first Sunday of Advent and then we will be back. What we're going to do as of the beginning of Advent is keep in step with the lectionary that may be in new thing for you. Quite simply, the lectionary brings together different parts of the Bible, Old Testament passage, a psalm, a New Testament reading and a part of the gospel. And oftentimes, there's like a common denominator or common thread that reveals something about who God is, or the heart of God or what God is up to, in the way those four readings interact. So we're going to spend a season keeping in step with the lectionary and trying to love God more and discover more about God and then follow the follow what the heart of God is already up to, through what we find there.

 Caryn Rivadeneira  1:01:59

Excited about that? Yeah,

 Jeffrey Klein  1:02:01

it should be good. Yeah.

 Gregg DeMey  1:02:02

So our daily Devo is gonna follow a similar rhythm. If you tuned into those, there's gonna be three-week break or so and then we'll be back and those two will be patterned. They'll same kind of readings. One day will be from the Old Testament one day from the Psalms, etc. So I'm hopeful like, as we allow ourselves to be exposed to the light of God in that way, some really great things might happen. And the

 Jeffrey Klein  1:02:27

lectionary forces the preachers to really be in the Word of God, right? When you're on a thematic thing, sometimes you can get like, oh, I can make this passage, you know, but when you're really digging the Scripture, like, Okay, I've got to like, God, speak to me about what this says, And now speak, whatever the word of the Lord is, right?

 Gregg DeMey  1:02:43

So yes, sometimes, like I view this as an act of humility for us as pastors, right? Because usually, like we're not short of ideas, right? It's easy to think like, I think I know what the church needs next. Right? Exactly. Plan a nice, whatever, two months series. But we're gonna keep in step with something that we did not think up that binds us to literally probably half the other churches and Christians worldwide. So like, that's pretty cool. Part of it to that is that we'll be kind of walking a similar path to lots of other folks who are trying to live life in Jesus name.

 Caryn Rivadeneira  1:03:18

Yeah. Just week by week being open to the Spirit. I mean, that's pretty cool.

 Jeffrey Klein  1:03:22

Yeah. Good. All right. We'll see everyone

 Gregg DeMey  1:03:25

all right. Yes. But first. First, Ezekiel for three weeks, month of gratitude, some crazy prophetic visions.

 Jeffrey Klein  1:03:36

Some people think he's Ezekiel was a little like probably touched in the brain from all that's what they write about him that he was a little bit maybe a little nuts. had so many visions from God that it almost drove me batty.

 Gregg DeMey  1:03:50

All right. All right. Thanks for hanging with us friends. meet you again soon. Voy a Espana!