Late-Night Interview: Allen Roda and Lauren Saunders, PhDs: PhDone, Dissertation Editor, PhD stories and more...

Students and Graduates!

Allen Roda and Lauren Saunders, PhDs, are the authors of PhDone, A Professional Dissertation Editor’s Guide to Writing Your Doctoral Thesis and Earning Your PhD. PhDone is a resourceful book for anyone who is applying for a PhD and who is already a PhD candidate. Book release date: 8th of August.

Allen Roda is the founder and CEO of Dissertation Editor, while Lauren Saunders is the Vice President, and they work with PhD students in giving their best work and tools for PhD students to have an excellent PhD thesis for examination and publishing. With a team of PhDs, Dissertation Editor works on proofreading, formatting, editing and provide consultation sessions. 
Dissertation Editor Website: https://www.dissertation-editor.com

For any listener of PhD Lounge, you will get 10% to access Dissertation Editor ONLY if you mention that you are a listener of PhD Lounge.

Allen Roda Social Media (Instagram): https://www.instagram.com/allenroda/
Lauren Saunders Social Media (Instagram): https://www.instagram.com/drlaurensaunders/

Are you a PhD student and would like to be a guest at the PhD Lounge or writing a blog (new feature)? email me at luisphdlounge@gmail.com

Thank you all for tuning in, it has been a pleasure!

Check out this podcast too: 
No Shame in my Name (NSIMN) https://open.spotify.com/show/75MJau8BwyVIPcrnjfflmJ?si=8eca8951cfb64a93

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Transcript

Hello students and graduates, welcome to PhD launch the podcast of late Night interviews where PhD students have a drink and talk about their research topics. I am your host, Louis, and many things have been going on both on my PhD and the podcast. Let me give you an update on what has happened during the past months of June and July. 1st and foremost, I was at Oxford in late June doing my field research.
For my PhD project, there I gathered older and modern sources to write some substantial nodes. For my subsequent case studies about ancient cities in the Near East and the archaeological findings in art and architecture that show any instance of a hybrid culture and 3rd space events that led to the construction of cities like Palmyra to Europas, Hatra or Antioch on the Orontes. As for the research.
Cities, I chose Hatra as it is according to the sources and Erith town where religion was predominant. However, it does not have any example of ancient literary evidence related to Hatteras inhabitants daily life.
The literature we have is from Cassius Dio and Herodian who talk about the Roman path in wars during the campaign of Septimius Severus, but in an unusual and biassed perspective.
Archaeology is more reliable when talking about Hatra, as the reports contain inscriptions and different languages such as Greek, Latin, Aramaic pointing out names for people who lived in Hatra, small and life sized sculptures, pottery coins and building restorations that have been done throughout the 20th century. On the other hand, I barely know anything about Hatra and it would be exciting.
Describe it for my project to increase my knowledge of ancient urbanism and learn more about other ancient cities that are, to an extent less famous to the new academics and general public. My stay at Oxford was excellent, with lots to do beyond the research. Having the chance to eat at 3 restaurants of Nando's with the right of having a discount. Since I'm a Nando's employee and the opportunity to visit the Ashmolean Museum.
Where I saw an exhibition about the city of Gnosis and the uncanny Cretan labyrinth. According to Greek mythology, and if you have read Homa, the critical labyrinth was not only a structure that was a reference in the Gnosis, urbanism, art and architecture, but also house the monstrous Minotaur. How human and health bolt creature.
The Minotaur in order to live had to eat 7 male and female youths and maidens respectively, and according to the myth, Theseus fought and slayed the Minotaur with the help of Ariadne, the daughter of Cretan king Minos. Putting an end to the suffering of all the youths and maidens that were subjected to the minor tools hunger, the exhibition lasted until the 30th of July.
And like myself, if you had the opportunity to watch it, I am happy for you to witness an incredible display of archaeological evidence about gnosis and the mythical tale of the Minotaur and the Cretan labyrinth.
Aside from my filthy research at Oxford, I'm also updating previous draughts of my PhD dissertation to restructure the written English and relevant aspects about cultural hybridity and 3rd space for the project overall, for and for the case studies of the CDs for Myra Drew Ropers and Hetera. Hopefully for myself, my supervisor and the examiner, whoever the department will choose those I selected either daughter, doctor Ted Kaiser.
And Professor Jen bed. All my draughts will become solid and convincing, for when I will defend them at the Viva of Walker in the foreseeable future.
As for the PhD launch podcast, many updates have been made throughout July. After my late night interview with Gabriella Radulescu, one of them was setting up a blog for those who enjoy writing texts expressing their experiences about anything.
Now you can't write and submit your blog on the podcasts website where you can write about your experience as a first year PhD student. Me and Natalie Jarvis, who manages the website and is also a PhD student at Swansea University, will read and consider your blog submission to be published on the website. So when you have time, consider writing about your experience when you were a first year PhD student and we will wait.
For your submission, besides the blog and another admin updates of the website, I also want to adapt the concept of the PhD lunch. I want to invite PhD graduates and post docs in the future to keep increasing the outreach network and popularity of the PhD lunch, providing their experiences and ways of conducting research. Nonetheless, the central conceptualization of the PhD launch remains in having current.
PhD students sharing their PhD struggles, research and advice for other students that want to pursue a PhD. Current PhD students are my main goal, and with this new adaptation, I hope that any listener turning in tuning in to the PhD launch will enjoying it.
I have more updates to share with you, but I will tell them in the future sessions and late night interviews, so stay tuned and I promise you to say any update that comes on the horizon of the PhD launch podcast.
Now let's turn to today's session. Today, we have a late night interview with two guests who are PhD graduates and authors of a book called PhD Done a professional dissertation editors guide to writing your doctoral thesis and earning your PhD a book which talks about advice and steps to take from the beginning until the end of the PhD through personal stories of various PhD students.
Including the authors themselves and outstanding book which I read before the interview, and all I can say is that you will find that this book is a friendly guide with many examples on how to achieve success during the PhD and who does not like hearing captivating stories and challenges from other people that overcame their difficulties to reach success.
If you like to hear successful stories, then the book pH done is definitely for you. If you are struggling with your PhD journey, the book will be released on the 8th of August. So wherever you buy from your favourite books, pre-order PhD done. As for the authors, one is the CEO and editor in chief while the 2nd is the Vice President of editing and Research. At this equation editor an American company.
That serves excellence and professionalism and I in aiding PhD students to complete their dissertations with professional editing, structure, proofreading and formatting, with a vast network with many universities and having assisted many students, dissertation editor is America's premier dissertation and thesis service, and with their team of professional editors, your dissertation will become professionally.
Accredited and have a whole new level over the ice of your PhD. Supervisors and examiners. Feel free to check on Dissertations editor website For more information about their services. The team behind the PhD writing and editing Magic and most importantly Chkbook. So grab your seats, have a drink and let's give a warm welcome to doctors Alan Roda and Lauren.
Saunders.
Hi, doctors, Roda and Saunders. Welcome to the PhD Lounge, and it is a pleasure to have you at present. Your book pH. Done to be released on the 8th of August and which the listeners that the release of our late Night interview on this day are having not only the access to your book, but also hearing from the authors themselves about obviously PhD. And I would like to start with the common question.
About your journeys on how you got into the PhD and how your PhD journey led to write pH done and found dissertation editor.
Well, I'll go first. I was in undergraduate studying anthropology and I was really just very excited to explore the world and all of the different types of people in it. And when I realised that by studying anthropology I could keep doing that.
Then I just didn't want to stop. So for me it was. I was just very, very excited about the research. And remember when I got into my PhD programme, exclaiming someone's going to pay me to sit around and read books all day, this is the best job ever. And you know, I had other friends who had sort of barely made it out of undergraduate who did not feel that way at all.
So for me, I got into it really just out of a passion and love of learning and travelling and research.
But As for BH done, it was it kind of and, and of course dissertation editor. It really came up towards the end of my dissertation process when I got stuck formatting my dissertation. I couldn't get the page numbers to work or the table of contents to work for the life of me, I still laugh that I actually produced 2PDF files with separate page numbers and then merge them together and that was how I finally figured out how to do it, because I would never advise that to anyone now.
But so you know, I realised this is really hard and I thought there's gotta be.
Somebody who could just do this for people.
And we realised there wasn't really anyone who could just do this for people. And so we realise ohh look, maybe, maybe I could just start doing this for people. So that was kind of how dissertation editor got started. Sure. After working with, you know, thousands of grads, students over the years, we realised, you know, not everyone has reached out to us for help or can or needs to, and we should really put some resources out there that are accessible to absolutely everyone. And that's where the book came in. It was really an A desire to make the dissertation process understandable, accessible and available, really.
Anyone who's considering it so that they know what they're getting into ahead of time and can figure out how to move through it gracefully. Sure. And how about how what was your journey, Lauren? Yeah, similar for me. And thanks so much for having us. It's great to be on the show. I majored in undergrad and dance and creative writing, some ostensibly impractical subjects, and I wasn't sure what to do with those. Next I got the question very often. So are you going to be a teacher? And grad school seemed like the logical next step, but I also really loved the process of producing undergraduate Capstone papers for both of those degrees, which. My pleasure. Made me realise that the the research and the producing original knowledge was what I loved the most about both of those areas of study. So I went into a master's programme in Dublin, studied Irish literature there and from then went into a PhD at the University of Denver in Literary Studies. So a very similar in terms of just somebody's going to pay me to read books and tell people what I think of them was wonderful. But the thing I actually loved most.
In my whole higher education career and the job I love most during the PhD was working in writing centres and helping other people with their with their writing and that way and then finishing up the PhD. And as the funding was running out, I thought what can I do remotely that uses this degree? And that's when I found dissertation editor and Matt Allen and came on as a freelancer with the company and been been around ever since. Sure.
Hmm.
Hmm.
So we can't say all of this, uh.
Where there's a a problem, there's always a solution and we and as PhD, there's plenty of ways to grasp some of those solutions that we have to craft it. But it's really interesting how.
Your journey's matched and your ambitions of doing something for the PhD community contribute for the outstanding experience led to write this book PhD done, which I gotta say, I've read the whole book in 2-3 days and some several of the aspects that both of you touched upon it kind of resembles when I started my PhD. When I started my. Because it was something that, like I was having a conversation with the book.
And pointing out some of the flaws that I had, uh, at the start of it and how.
Then, upon conversations with my advisor, we say here Super or supervisor.
Then some of those those solutions came out throughout through my probation as we have here in the UK. I don't know if you have you had that also learning in Dublin.
Ohh no no no. If you had also Doctor Rd if you had it the probation meeting where we say all the things that we have to defend. So kind of like a simulation to say the least. But I could say that upon the what I've read.
It's a educational book, really strict from what? It's my interpretation really strict.
And really suggestive entertaining as well. And to see the other side of what the PhD is and taking all those stereotypical views of the general public, this PhD is hard. It's taken me too long time and I don't want to write 100K words or 75 K words, or even going into academia. There's always a solution and the sensation editor is one of them.
Those experiences.
Though.
So now we're gonna get.
What is the ethos of PhD done and why sharing personal stories across your your book, what effect does it happen? Does it have? That's a great question. And I think going back to what you were just saying about, you know, they're always being a solution to a problem. I think one of the things we've found through working with so many dissertation writers over the years is that, you know, no matter what the subject area, the dissertation has some of the same goals in terms of how to present research in a way that the scholarly community can understand and how to structure the document. So some of those more, more specific sections about what to include and what not to include are really a result of seeing how different successful. Sure. Consultations across a broad range of fields work well and you know my background being in literature, I've worked, you know, in dissertations, way outside my field, probably the most different being a dissertation on the chemical properties of cactus juice, which was amazing to me as an editor. Just seeing how even though that's that couldn't be further from my subject matter expertise. But I was still able to see, you know, this is the way that you're argument is progressing. And this is the way that your organisation could be improved.
And so I think that's one of the one of the takeaways that in terms of the structural elements there are you know there are common threads across fields and similarly in terms of the personal experience, it can be really isolating to do a PhD to be working you know from home on something that only you understand. And we've also found that by talking to clients that nobody's experience is completely unique. You know, if you have a problem during your PhD in terms of your relationship with your advisor.
Her work life balance, you know any of those things that are outside of the dissertation document itself. The odds are that somebody else has had a similar experience. So just bringing real stories to a broader audience. Our hope there is that it'll make people realise that they're not alone in those those struggles. Everyone has has similar experiences with that, and we're all, you know, we're all in this together. Has PhD candidate. Sure.
Yes.
Yes, and that's that. You're absolutely touch. You touch the point that we're all in this together and with those experiences telling stories, I have people get fascinated by.
Uh. Hearing stories from mothers and what they can learn from them so that they can also.
And take their next step and go through it and facing those adversities. And how would they?
This is say again providing those solutions for to improve themselves and reaching the the milestone. So it is really interesting hearing the stories you've you've written about the book, one of them I was. At one of them I was really fascinating. I believe was uh.
A PhD student called Rick I know it's romanticised names so it would calling about Rick about his issues, alcoholism and then had a girlfriend that had a partner at the time the partner couldn't be so supportive and then end up breaking up. But that episode that I read about Rick is a matter of.
Going over the over the problem to reach a solution which it was doing the PhD and finalising it with excellence, that one, one of the most the stories that I got most fascinated have you one of you? Yeah. Uh, when you were writing the book. Uh, which story?
Were.
Was more, uh.
Touching.
From which one of you? You know, we've had so many stories from so many students. It's been. It was actually really hard for us to kind of decide.
Who gets included and who doesn't and also which stories we could make sufficiently anonymous?
To make sure that nobody was was being identified, but you know for me, the story that that really resonate are from people who are just working so hard, and I'm always in awe of students who managed to work full time jobs, take care of families and representations all at the same time.
And many of them are working on things that I'm just honoured to be part of. You know, they're working to make nurses better nurses and to make teachers better teachers and just to have a chance to support them in that. Hmm. To help them through what the hurdles that they're facing with the skills that we have, it's it's an honour and I'm always moved when I get a chance to speak to our client about the work that they're up to in the world. And that's one of the exciting things about doctoral level research is that they're breaking new ground. We're learning things that nobody has ever known before.
Each and every time.
And so it's that means is is really, really beautiful. Hmm.
Yeah. Well, and what about what about you, Doctor Saunders? Any.
Story that.
Was more.
That you had was hardly felt. Absolutely. That's what there are two stories in the book in which dissertation writers had to virtually start over one in the plagiarism section, where a writer had relied much too heavily on a previous literature review on the same topic, and that that made this right a really need to start the research process over. And, you know, and figure out how to synthesise the literature, you know, in their own way, instead of relying on this existing literature review.
And that was really, you know, an inspiring situation to me in just the the drive to, you know, to not only do the whole dissertation writing and research process, but to need to take a big step back and start with a clean slate and the, you know, the motivation needed to do that. There's a similar story where a writer thought that they were almost done and then found out from their adviser that it was more of, I think, I think she thought she was in terms of the final proofread and.
Formatting stage and then it turned out that there were major content issues and it ended up being more of a year long revise and resubmit process. So again just the, you know, real firm belief in the research and that it's worth doing and you know revising and redoing until it's right. So those two stories stood out to me as it's really inspiring. Wow. It takes tenacity to do a dissertation, and you know that's something that, you know, we're often inspired by by the people we work with is that there is a commitment and a drive and a passion that that you have to have to even start the process. Yes. You know, nobody goes into it lightly and so it's a it's it's a beautiful thing to witness. Sure.
Yes, and I agree. And with all those experiences, hearing those stories should be.
A an inspiration plus another big inspiration for students who strive because there's.
I think that.
In in due future, the PhD degree will be at demanding degree for many for many students is.
And it that and that happens with a already in academia, but I'm assuming he in India, in industry jobs, they starting to request PhD degree and hearing those experiences they they they think people should be aware.
Of taking out of taking out the equation that public opinion and it kind of amazes, amazes me hearing such incredible stories.
And.
But then there's come comes this this issue of accumulations and I have the question for you, Doctor Saunders.
That I found when I was reading chapter 2.
And that I found that finding the.
Sorry, finding the the reason behind why PhD students accumulate many things over their dissertation and overall life duties.
Any thoughts?
Well, one of. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. So I would, I would say that's their kind of two ways to look at that. And 1st, the, you know the PhD and the Graduate School process itself, you know, involves that accumulation you're talking about. So, you know, right in the dissertation, as we mentioned in the book, would be a lot more straight forward if that was the only thing that you were responsible for. But, you know, within the structure of your PhD programme, that's obviously not your only responsibility. And you, most people are responsible for teaching several courses.
Research assistant duties out of minimum. On top of that, there's, you know, can be university service expected. You know, serving often on a board of a journal or in graduate student leadership. So the the Graduate School experience itself, you know, takes on quite a bit of additional responsibility that needs to be balanced with the work of writing the dissertation. And then, of course, there's everything else in life as well. So, you know, as adults. Sure. Everyone's got additional responsibilities on top of.
The PhD that's constituting the job at the time, whether that's a second job, a side hustle, you know, working on a PhD on top of an existing full time career, which many of the writers we work with are experiencing, as well as things like household, family, keeping everything else in your life running and and taking care of yourself as well the, you know, the mental health and self-care at any dissertation writer needs to do to make sure that they're. Sure.  You know, taking care of themselves as well. Sure.
No, I mean, uh, it's again the additional additional things that are occupies a lot, especially when studying full time, which is a I think it is a major adversity for PhD students to want to complete, to complete the degree.
As soon as possible to get into the job market.
Don't know. Probably the the the setting PhD part time you'll be alleviates that that stress, but still comes another another weight because it will be too long, will be taking long 6-7 years plus the full time job that they're doing and might not even the job that they are.
Working on all the desire to working on.
Uh, those are additional responsibilities and sometimes it can be a burden and all of that and all that, so you know.
What? What is your opinion on accumulating?
Many duties, Dr Roda. Well.
Yeah. I mean, in many ways, that's also sort of the beauty of dissertation editor and what we and the support we provide is that. Sure. You know.
There's a lot to life and one of the things that you know, our services enable people to do is let go of some of the less important pieces. You know, they can have someone else check every reference against their citations and make sure that the APA style is perfect.
But they can focus on the big ideas and by taking some of those things off their plates.
You know, we help people finish faster.
And with less stress and you know, I think it's it's it's hard to say, you know which is.  Sure. Which path is is the right one? Or the easier one? Or the better one? You know, some people go straight from undergrad into their PhD programmes and they're able to do that with out all the extra responsibility of, you know, families and careers and jobs and mortgages and everything else that comes with being an adult.
And other people, you know, we have clients in their 70s finishing their PhD and it's never too late.  Sure. After I feel like it's a really important message, we like to bring home in this book that, you know, finishing a PhD, it starts and begins with a passion of for the research and for learning. And that can happen at all ages. So for some people, they wait till they retired and then they do their PhD. And for some people, you know it's, you know, they're straight out of college. There's no, there's no right way. There's no wrong way. But it's not a surprise to me that the majority of the people we work with.  Hmm.
Sure.
Sure. Are the ones who are juggling a lot of other responsibilities. Ohh. And that makes a lot of sense. Yes, uh sure, I agree with you. And as you touched another important aspect that PhD is for everyone. For any, yeah, everyone of different age ageing rates.
One of the interviews that I had on my on my on on the pH D Lounge was a PhD student called David Finch. He he's also studying English literature.
At about the setting the the life and works of Arnold Bennett and he was talking about his age and he said that.
I mean, I'm doing this cause it's a passion and I'm retiring. I was a a school teaching and I was doing a cycling as a hobby and I have done a lot and then decided to retire.
And then now what I'm going to do. I'm going to do a PhD. That's what he said. And this subject that he studied a lot is he studied and gave English literature throughout his career. So he decided to increase his knowledge. And he said it. There's no age limit. Anyone is welcome to do it. And.
But but on the other, on the other hand.
I think for us youngsters like myself, uh and other ones who aspire to do a PhD, I believe he's not. Isn't just the passion itself.
It's just more striving for for a job, essentially for getting all the passion and.
I do believe with the.
Did the PhD slowly being a demanding degree for any type of job? Then there will be more youngsters, more young adults to.
Achieving that ambition, that that ambition and I know if you do you agree or not. Well, I think we've seen that already a bit with the master's degree. So it seems like, you know, 20 or 30 years ago, a bachelor's degree was all that anyone needed and now a master's degree seems to be kind of a baseline level. It's like the master's degree is the new bachelor's degree and the PhD is almost the new Masters. It's like that that the the the competition is greater, I'm guessing.  Sure.
Hmm. And so there's just in order to rise to the top and stand out. You know, there's an advantage to having some extra credentials. And, you know, as we discuss as well in our book, the.
Research is transferable. These are important skills that you learn in the doctoral journey that are not strictly related to the subject matter.
Learning how to write a well organised, thoughtful piece on Irish literature can help you edit a well organised, thoughtful piece on the chemical properties of cactus juice. Sure. And you know, and so you you learn skills that that are absolutely valuable to the wider world. And we're seeing that more and more as people who get Phd's are not necessarily doing it for the purpose of teaching in a university. Sure.
Sure. No, absolutely true. And as we we were saying before that PhD.
It's not only the the way out to academia, but also for industry jobs working in museums, for example, arcs.
Lapse.
Anything that is related to.
Whether industry or academia so.
Uh, now.
I have a question now for for Doctor Saunders that I was. I was reading a Chapter 2 and in the last two sections it was dedicated to finding the writing editor and also the establishment of boundaries, which is a thing for me. It's an important aspect in PhD establishing boundaries, both professional and personal.
But I think this these two aspects of the writing, finding the writing editor and establishing of boundaries have much of interconnection when it comes to feedback and writing style and structure.
And do you believe Doctor Saunders that not being realistic? The. With investing wisely on professional editing of the dissertation can lead to a a boundary breakdown between peachy students slash advisor relationship because the advisor might know that the whole writing structure was completely altered, and the students to an extent might have ignored the adviser's feedback. Yeah, that's a great question. And I think it all comes down to, you know, the wise use of your resources, whether those are, you know, financial or time based or relational. And so I would say that you always need to think from the most global broad organisational content based feedback to the most minute. So of course you know the advisor is is the person who's going to decide largely whether you earn the degree or not. So I think always starting from the point.
Of the content level, subject matter feedback from the advisor and putting the time in to make sure that the content is what you want it to be, the broad organisation is what you want it to be and then as you move toward finalising your content and your methodology, I think that's when bringing in additional support, whether that's an editor, a writing group, whatever you, you have the access to and the means to attain is really going to help make sure that your time is being used in the most effective way.
Possible the pre our previous conversation made me think of this as well. Just this morning I've been corresponding with a client who's having a hard time making his page numbers in his table of contents aligned to the right and I said no problem. I will help you send me your document and he said no, I'm just I want to figure this out. I don't think I deserve the degree if I can't figure this out. I keep saying no. Please please send me your document. I couldn't get my page numbers to align when I submitted. Sure.
Ohh. Happy H either. I've only learned that since don't waste your time, I can fix it for you in 5 minutes. But he is determined to figure it out himself, so I'm sending him YouTube videos trying to help him figure it out himself instead, but I think that's a really good example of, you know, that's not the best use of your time as a PhD student. You know, that's something that bringing in somebody who does that on a day-to-day basis is going to save you so much time in the end and similarly with. Hmm. Wow. I think feedback from family and friends and you know using your support network I would say you know you mentioned the sort of public opinion about PhD, you know people not understanding what that process is like being a potential problem there. But I think the relational component is the biggest factor there. So you know, by the time you reach a PhD, you know who you have or could have a great editing relationship with. So I had some close friends who are working on their PhD at the same time that.
You know, we've been editing each other's work from undergrad, and I knew that would work really well. So we gave each other great feedback. We made jokes to each other in the comments. We started calling each other while the nicknames of the words we used too often. I think mine was multifarious for a while. So then I'm I realised I needed to tone down my use of that. Sure. Word in my dissertation, so that was a great relationship and that worked well. But I think people can run into problems when they are relying and it's I think, especially when it's a partner or spouse that can be a tricky relationship. You don't want that advisor power dynamic to come into your personal relationships. I had a client who's dissertation I was reading who had had his wife comment on on the writing, and her comments were still in the margins and one red. Hmm. No offence, but why is the writing still bad still so?
Spending so much time on this.
And I don't know about him, but I took offence on his behalf and I think that was an example where a professional editor, a more objective source than his spouse, may have been a better choice there. So overall, I would just say using your resources wisely, moving from the broadest to the most specific and really realising when when bringing in some support is going to save you time, that you could be using to do something that is. Yes. More more. Sure. Or.
Or saving your marriage.
You know, there's that too. Ohh but then?
Obviously, uh. It's also emotional and also the feedback, we don't know. The feedback can be.
Quite an accolade approach, or can be a warmer approach. There's there's a constructive one and there's the most there's the those that are direct towards. But how does that impact negatively or positively?
Those two versions of the feedback. You know.
That again, it's a relationship that you cultivate with your advisor. Sure. And I remember having this conversation actually with.
Someone in my cohort who said, you know what, there's not a lot of people in the world who are allowed to kick my ****.
But my advisor is.
And I'm okay with it and like I've become OK with it.
She can kick my **** and like and it's OK and cause, you know, I remember having a cause. I got like, a a chapter back from mine. I was just, like, ripped to shreds. And it was, you know, into like. Yeah. But.
Ultimately, that's helpful to you, but you've got it. There's there's a certain process that we go through of, you know. Sure. Learning how to receive feedback and every writer grapples with that now, that said. Yeah. Advisers can cross a line and you know it is also important to maintain your boundaries. Where this question kind of started and and if you feel like there's something truly unacademic. Sure. If there's anything kind of personal that's like bleeding into your advisor, advise you relationship that makes you feel uncomfortable. Then don't let that continue.
You know that that there's that's a moment to reach out to someone else on the committee or maybe even a department chair, and make sure that the relationship stays professional.
Um. Sure. So you know they're there, have been some stories that we've heard and you know, so it's it's there are resources out there. If that doesn't work out the way a student would hope it would. Do you have a story to share on about on that on that episode? Haha.
Ohh man, you know it's those are kind. Those are kinda those are kind of Daisy but.
It's, you know if if.
And advisors truly crossing the line then you know, and and the student is a feeling attacked personally then.
Clearly, that's not gonna. This isn't gonna be a productive relationship. And so. Sure. We have suggested to clients that they consider requesting a new advisor.
That's really rare. I will say I don't want to make it sound like this is common, but I also just don't wanna tell people that they should, you know, deal with it. Cause if it's if it's really bad, don't deal with it. Well, it's a lot more common. Is that the advisor is overwhelmed and is advising too many students and is very curt with their comments. Sure.
Hmm. And they're doing it very quickly in a way that does not take the emotional needs of the student into consideration. Sure. Or, or more importantly, they're just not writing back and they're not getting back to them in a timely fashion. And that can be a really frustrating part of the doctoral journey is.
Managing the expectations around the advisor and when are you going to hear back and when has it been too long and what can you do about it to to keep things moving and and what can you expect? And one of the things we advise in the book is for students to talk to other students at the same university who are maybe a little bit further along in the programme and just ask them what their experience is like with their advisors and as you're.
If you have the choice to choose your advisor, not every university and every programme offers that. But if you have the opportunity to choose your advisor, you know, do a little research 1st and get a sense of what that advisor's like with other students. And if you think that's gonna work well for you, cuz some people work very well with a very formal very, you know, hard and fast relationship and some people need things to be. Sure. A little softer, a little more flowing. Sure. And.
That so one the same professor could be a fantastic advisor for one student and a horrible advisor for another student. And that's another thing to like, you know, really think about South when I'm saying not every advisor is great. I'm not saying that any particular professors, a bad advisor. I'm just saying that that fit might not be working. And so as a student, it's on you to learn and figure out what you think you're gonna need. And then. OK. Figure out if that is the same style of the different members of your department and who you might wanna work with. Sure. No, it's interesting and glad that you talked about talking with other students that are facing similar issues about their advisers here at Swansea University. We have a like a sort of.
And assembly of PGR students from different courses. We talk about our researchers, but also our experiences with our.
Advisers. Uh, what struggles we are we are experiencing and then in the end is.
Is just as if we are releasing a a hot air balloon out of our minds.
Because we were so drenched of work and also external pressures, family pressures, for example.
I I say years old from my personal experience, I get regularly pressure from my from my mom especially and say when we finish your PhD, when do you finish your PhD and say have you advanced a lot?
Uh, I say I'm still between a rock and a hard place.
And I I give the the the the expression so so that she won't. My mom won't bother me respect of course. But those are the things that we have to juggle about. And we were talking and especially with.
Supervised with our supervisors or advisors and we.
Have to as you said and you said, well, I agree with you figuring, figuring figuring out.
What differentiates from a good and that a bad advisor? So that's why these are these committees are so important to express ourselves, to express with others what we are struggling and again providing a solution to it for it well.And that's also why there's a committee. So the adviser's the most important person on the committee, but they're not the only person on the committee. Sure.
Sure And the committee has serves a purpose to make sure that all of these experts agree that the dissertation writer is worthy of the doctoral degree. And so, you know, we had. Hmm.
Sure. They these things all have a purpose. You know these these different parts of the process. And why do you have to defend your dissertation? And why does it have to be? You know, so many different readers of the dissertation involved, you know, and that's just to sort of provide a cheques and balances to make sure that the the work is truly worthy. And and that's why that does hair in place. Yes.
Sure.
Sure.
No, and I know I totally agree with you and it depends on the the supervisor and it can also be a clash of personalities. We we never know.
And it's really hard to find if if we were on a master's degree and there was a supervisor and if we choose another supervisor for the PhD, it will be a whole different level.
Luckily for me, I have the same supervisor as as I had on my on my master's sensation, so he knows he knows me really well. I know him really well. He gives constructive feedback, which is a positive one we have. We have also a.
Get a personal touch, to say the least, but still professional though. Let's say ohh how you've been doing and family issues once in a while. Not much but still.
Uh, that's what's, I think, differentiates a a good and not so good supervisor and.
For you, Doctor Saunders will or including Doctor Doctor Rhoda, will that the relationship between supervisor and student affect the the students?
And drop prospects as well.That's a great plan, actually, but anecdote from our book that I was going to mention was a.
A writer who was having a really hard time with the responsiveness of their adviser and just not hearing back for months at a time and then when they did get feedback, it was at a comma here. This should be a semi colon. You know, very, very minor proofreading rather than based on content. And and he considered, you know, the merits of trying to change and advisor and a couple of the pieces of advice that we mentioned. Sure. And they are worth considering in that process are do you have other sources of support? So are your other committee members more responsive? Are you able to get that support somewhere else and what's going to be the value of that professional connection and the name of that advisor on your dissertation? And in this instance, the other committee members were great. He was able to get additional support from them that the advisor wasn't providing and the advisor was a really important scholar in this field. Sure. And and the decision that that this writer ultimately made was that, that that was worth worth maintaining that relationship and having that name associated with the dissertation for the professional connections, even though the the day-to-day back and forth was not.
Providing the extensive support that he wanted. So that's how that situation worked out. So I think that balance between you know, how important is the person's name and how important are they in the field, who could they connect you to in terms of other scholars in the area and what does that relationship look like in the day-to-day? Sure, sure. How about you, Doctor Roda, any you know it? Well, I was just thinking of the same. The same story of, you know, career trajectory, yes. And advisors, I mean having that name on your dissertation and that letter of recommendation. I mean, it does go a long way. It's definitely something worth evaluating and considering.
And it's one of those things that again, I would take, I would tell any new student to talk to the other students in their cohort and ask them about.
Why they chose their advisor? You know, that's one of the beautiful things is there's always students a few years ahead of you in your programme, no matter where you are. And those are resources that I think a lot of people don't don't see. They don't think about the other students as being really valuable sources of information. But you should really start networking within your cohort from day one. And you can get recommendations from your advisor and also from. Sure. The other students in your programme and from the other members of your committee. Yes. Um. Yes, so uh cause network is so important and that is one I believe that is one of the.
Aside from writing the thesis, that's the second hardest characteristic in the PhD because we trying to network with someone and then they they get with this fake promise of something. OKI will do that, but then they have all the things to do plenty, and then it's it's really difficult whether.
Well, we meet in person and it's also comes with the the online issue, which is also another another major impact in in PhD networking.
Uh by?
As I like to think positively uh feeling optimistic from what comes ahead then then network will will eventually come up and.
It gets stronger and stronger as as we take further steps, whether through presenting a paper at a conference or writing the an article and obviously finishing the PhD. Yeah, I was gonna mention, actually, that the conference attendance is really one of the best places for getting to know other scholars in your field. Yes. It's it's invaluable and when you get a chance to participate on a panel, for example, then it's great if you can try to do that with people who you don't already know, and then it's it's a great chance to meet them and and you get, you really get to know people when you're on a panel with them and it's a it's it's a it's a beautiful experience. Yeah.
Yes, I I totally agree with you. Specially when when we're going to to present not being the attendee. I remember having a I remember having a talk with a PhD colleague and friend of mine talk presenting. Like He he presented his paper in a conference about the Egyptology and he told me once.
At the only best. The only way that you can network with people is when you're standing on the pedestal.
Ohh. I mean on the stage present your topic and you argue against their questions.
And I was. I felt, I I at the time that he spoke that to me, I was. I already presented in conferences, but at the time I was wasn't realising as well.
How that how that small aspect is so important for the for networking? And then I realised okay so I have to think.
That.
The conference is only for networking.
They might not enjoy the paper, but the conference is for the networking. Well, and when you um.
When someone does raise their hand to ask you a controversial question. Yes. Try to remember who that person is and follow up with them later, cause that is someone who cares enough about your scholarship. Yes.
Yeah. To want to ask you a hard question. No, no, it's. One of the advices I gave out often for the defence of a dissertation is to tell people, hey, look, this is the only time in your life where this many highly educated people are going to have given this much thought to your dissertation. It's never going to happen again, so enjoy it. There's no reason a defence has to be an adversarial.
You know, combative relationship. It's actually a beautiful opportunity to hear what people think about your work and to take that feedback and make your next piece. Your book, your article, even better. And the same goes for a conference paper. Sure. Those kinds of challenging questions are the best ones because they're going to help you think through how to improve your arguments for future publication. Was there any any story that you've both of you wrote about a conference paper?
In PhD. Done.
Or not. We focus mostly on the dissertation process itself. I think we mostly just encourage people to do conference papers and to get into that world, but I think we tried to really maintain the focus of the book on the parts of the doctoral journey, and that that is a little bit of a side step. Or maybe it's similar? I feel like it's important, but it's it's not. It's not a requirement. Sure. Yeah. And I think we mentioned in a piece of advice for using conference as well. I would I would give his, but it's always useful to kind of pair a conference presentation with a self-imposed deadline. You need to meet. So I always tried to when possible arrange conferences to become a section of a chapter that I needed to write next. So in terms of selecting the the topic, I would propose at a given conference a lot of those eventually became sections and later.
Chapter. So it was a great way to have an external deadline to know. You know, I need to present this paper on Friday, so I need to write this section can be a little bit more exigent and easy to adhere to. Then someday I need to write that chapter. So using using the material conferences not only for networking but also for advancing the dissertation writing can be useful as well. Right.
Yes, it it is a an. It is an advance I I do agree.
And as long as it doesn't go off topic of the dissertation, then it's a a A+ more points for for the students to to conclude that this session I do, I will believe faster and efficiently. Right.
Yeah, as much as possible. The advice is always for students to try to make any paper that they write directly related to the dissertation. So the earlier you know what you're going to write about, and the more you can tailor your course papers and early early degree assignments towards that topic, the better prepared you're going to be to to write the dissertation quickly. Sure, sure. One of the things that.
At.
We hear about PhD comes also with grants because obviously I think that each each year in the PhD, tuition fees are getting higher. So there's that old saying of.
It it the willing is more about.
And of.
Having financial power then having the desire to it, I think it fits almost perfectly for whoever wants to do PhD. Hmm. Uh, but obviously.
There's all the solutions like having grants and to aid the the those tuition fees and also the Student Loans obviously. But here for the grants are helpful, but they still competitive and to write an application it's even more I think it's even more harder to convince those who will grant. And that scholarship to to that PhD candidate.
I have a question for you, Doctor Rhoda, and also for Doctor Saunders to participate. So do you think that not having a PhD grant increases the rate of dropping out of the PhD even though they have the opportunity to reapply? So in the United States, there's there's two different types of models for doctoral programmes.
Some of them are what we call funded programmes and some are not.
And many of the brick and mortar universities have funded programmes where the doctoral student is given a small living stipend to help cover their expenses, and there is no tuition.
Now in these programmes, which are very competitive to get into, there's also the expectation that the doctoral student will be a teaching assistant or a research assistant or a lab tech. Basically, the doctoral student is working for the university and in exchange is also receiving the stipend and a tuition free degree. Now that is very uncommon in the online programmes so online.
Programmes, you know, they don't typically have that as an option, but what they do have is the flexibility for someone to pursue the degree on their own schedule while working their own job that they currently have.
And so.
Every programme has its advantages and disadvantages, and it's kind of up for each student to see where they are in life and what is going to work for their their needs. Sure. When I was going to get my degree, I was only interested in the programmes that would offer me a stipend, because I I wasn't prepared to to take on debt. I didn't have a job. Hmm. So.
You know, so I didn't have a career or like savings per se. And so it was. Woohoo. Someone's gonna pay me to read books. Yay. But also that meant I had to go in person to that place and teach there. And there, you know, there wasn't that other flexibility, but I can absolutely understand now, as later in life with family and children and a job that if if I were trying to pursue a degree at this moment in time, it would be a huge ask to uproot.
My entire family and move to another city where I could be a teaching assistant in order to get that stipend and going to get a degree online would make a lot more sense. So you know, it's it's, it's complicated. It's kind of the, the, the, the short answer to your question and it really depends. Sure.
Sure. On the student you know you mentioned, is it contributing to students not finishing? And I would say probably is. But I think the bigger issue is how well is that process going. Sure. I think students who are breezing through their coursework and are conducting their research quickly and are having a good time in Graduate School, regardless of that financial situation, they're the ones who are going to finish. They'll make it happen one way or another, whereas I feel like if it's not going well and they're someone's experiencing a lot of delays and challenges, then. Hmm. You know, the debt situation can be a real.
Can tip the scale you know and and make someone to think about. OK, well, maybe this isn't working well enough for me to want to continue. It's a really tough decision for anyone to make.  Show. But I think again it it, it varies greatly from 1 programme to the next and from one student to the next. Sure.
No, I I totally understand and free and it comes as we were speaking previously previously is the hardship with life struggles and even not.
Uh, even studying full time? Both PhD Ants and working full time as well, and also so so that's why some of those grants are for many from many PhD student candidates are so important to aid some of those life struggles and even the loan. But the loan is well get have the loan and then have to pay that debt which will take longer and it depends whether the pitch.
When it becomes when becomes a graduate PhD.
Takes time to find a job which is even more harder.
The any opinions from you Doctor Saunders?
Her bone the grants. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I I just completely agree that if if you want to complete the degree, then it's just about looking at which type of degree makes the most sense given where you are in your life and what is going to motivate you, whether that's complete focus on the dissertation or having other supplementary responsibilities in terms of the grant writing and applications. I think that's also something that's important for PhD students throughout the process, but especially those who are early in the process to think about.
There's a lot to researching what grants you're eligible for and how to apply for them, and that is a time consuming process, but an important one. And if you get started on that early and find many grants to apply for, you know your odds of success at those are going to be much higher, and that skill of learning how to apply for and receive funding is incredibly transferable for, you know, moving into a post doc or the rest of an academic career, or especially if you're going to move into an industry. Sure. God, you know I.
I would have a hard time imagining any job where being able to seek and receive a great deal of funding is not a valuable skill. Sure. I need a home as early in the process as you can, and certainly to articulate on your on your CV or in any job interview you find yourself in. Sure.
No, I.
It's absolutely uh, 100% those when it comes to those issues of writing the application, then there will be a plus skill to add which will be the resilience and also that would be reflected upon after after the PhD to apply for more grants and applying for.
Other jobs and getting more network.
So then, but then comes as well.
With writing issues, and nowadays there's plenty and plenty of writing solutions, and say this situation editors, one of them to provide those helpful solutions. Well, I hope I.
Nuts that step on the wrong on the wrong side of the road, but.
But so those writing solutions and one of them that I've was researching and we'll talk you were talking about on the on the book was about the popular.
The popular name of it said ChatGPT.
Correct you fam wrong the IT will. I've read it on the book and.
However, there are many academics and even students.
During the committee's and even the evening conversations, casual conversations they consider ChatGPT dangerous and enticing to plagiarism.
However, I think there's another side of it, and it can be a powerful tool to avoid it, to avoid plagiarism if used wisely throughout this situation. But does that the problem?
Doctor Saunders does that. The problem of using ChatGPT passes on the PhD student being lazy to research.
And write an original thesis, or the lack of guidance and advice from the PhD advisor to motivate the student or.
Is it both? That's a great question and I think it's still very much developing. So my, you know, my short answer would be, I think we've got to wait and see how it's cause. I think it has the potential to change the you know, the academic landscape. I think depending on how it ends up becoming increasingly monetised, whether it's just database or if it becomes subscription based, what the direction of the finances of those types of services go. And you know how that starts to be used more by those in higher education.
You know both the the students and the professors. I think that's just it's an incredibly developing situation that I intend to keep a close eye on. But secondly, I think it would be the kind of thing that, like any type of software, any type of research process, I think it can be used really well if it's used intentionally or I think it can be very easily misused. So I think the.
The baseline is that it depends on how the individual in question wants to use it. I don't think there will ever be a substitute for really carefully attributing your sources thinking about which ideas you know really belong to you and which ones were informed by a previous solar. And so I I think that I would see its potential not so much being in the avoidance of plagiarism because I still think the only way to avoid plagiarism is by that really intentional scholarship. But I can see it being a really effective.
Tool for research in terms of casting a broad net, conducting the early stages of a systematic literature review. Those are kind of the things that occurred to me that I think it could end up.
Really being helpful if used correctly and I think both students and professors could fall into the trap of becoming overly reliant on it, so that's something to to really watch out for. I think if it seems if it seems too good to be true, it probably is. If it's saving you, if it's saving you an inordinate amount of time that you should be sending on something, that's probably when you're falling into a trap, when it's helping you do something better that you're spending a tonne of time on, like research, then I think that's where it can be used well. No, I I I do agree and.
That is the I think that.
As you said.
That church beauties, a recent tool that we are recently exploring it and we still don't know how how to do it well but.
It just trying to attempt it and play it around and I think one of the thing one of the the key, the cool issues is and I can give the example of undergrad students that.
That I've seen as a as a as a teaching assistant that I've seen.
Undergrads. Undergraduate students?
Using Chachi PT for the whole text.
And which is can be easily detectable through other software issues such as turnitin, which we use a lot here to do the the marking the assessment marking and that's I think that's one of the things if that applies to a PhD, I don't know depends if the person wants to complete the PhD fast and.
The advisor.
Has to be a has to be having a good eyesight too. To detect that I mean if we use it wisely then it could be a powerful tool to use it. You know the the American Psychology Association APA, which is, you know this for citation standards, has already determined the appropriate way to cite AI. Sure.
Sure. So if you have written a paper and you've used a I to you know, improve your abstract and you want to cite that or or you should cite. That is basically the new standard, and I think we're still waiting to see what that will really mean for academia. But for now, at least.
The baseline is if you're going to use it, own it and put a citation at the end that says that you used it, and then, you know, go on from there. Sure. And it's about.
If using it, as we said wisely in terms of.
OK so I have this chunk of text I'm going to use it for a bit, but I'm going to change GPT.
And the AI does does its magic, but at the same time.
I think he has to. The student has to, has to be precise in what what student wants to use ChatGPT for it and if he uses the whole text either. Hmm. The the student the PhD candidate has to adapt. It bites with his its own language, then using the whole thing for the ChatGPT cause it will be easily detected detected by any any advisor. Well, and it goes back to what Lauren said. I mean, it's kind of an honour. Yes. Question if it feels like cheating, it probably is. Yeah. And um, you know, the APA is thinking about this being used in scientific research. That isn't necessarily for the purpose of academic credit. What happens when the lab just wants to share their results and they have this data. They've got these results and they've got these tools to generate this paper that helps them share their data and their results with the wider world. Sure. It. You know, there's not. No one's asking the lab to prove that they're worthy of a degree, so it doesn't have that academic integrity piece to it.
Whereas a I in the university setting, that's a whole different can of worms, and we're all kind of waiting to see what types of policies, institutions of higher education are going to, you know, put into place. Sure. And we're, you know, it's it's too new and I don't think any university has made an official statement about it yet, but I would expect those to start coming soon, like within a year. Sure.
So probably.
Uh.
There's here should be like a training an A free training course.
To use.
Chat GPT as they use as well in. Ethical uses of chat GPT. Yeah, that's a great idea. Yeah. As we as they also use as they also use in how to cite.
How to to do footnote citations, whether through a PA or Chicago or Harvard style?
There should be also using for ChatGPT, but do you believe Doctor Saunders and Doctor Roller? Do you believe that?
You that training course will appear in due soon, or maybe in a few years. I think it's a wonderful idea. I can see, you know, university libraries wanting to run something like that. I mean, I think that I will probably take this idea and try to start bringing something like that myself. I would like to be involved in putting something like that together. So I I think it will absolutely emerge shortly. And I think I think training courses, webinars on the ethical use of chat. You. Right. Yeah. Yeah It would be a really useful tool for.
Our students and anyone else in higher education as well. And I think we're still waiting for the institutions to kind of determine exactly where those boundaries are. You know, this is kind of this is a new frontier for academic integrity policies. And so once those get set in place, then it's time to start training how to work within them. Sure.
Sure.
Yes, of course. And for me personally, I do believe that, uh, ChatGPT.
Or any other source of AI to help to aid writing style and structure is to stay and has to be applied wisely. They can, they can scroll, they can scan over the whole text, but then it comes to the student.
If the student wants to be PhD candidate, his case wants to have an excellent dissertation.
Dan has to adapt to its own language, to its own structure.
And then a few lines of of the of the writing a I to solution mate the problem so.
And.
Now.
As we are approaching to to out to the end of our fantastic interview, I would say first. Yeah. And foremost.
What you do, what you both of you do in dissertation editor in summary to to help PhD candidates while hearing our session.
In terms of writing silent structure. Got it. So I mean a dissertation editor, we work with students from start to finish. Right. Sure. We have a very strict academic integrity policy, so I think it's worth mentioning we do not write content for any students at anytime ever, but we coach people on finding their topics. We help people. With finding sources for their literature reviews, we will assist people in selecting the appropriate methodology for the research questions they're trying to ask answer and we have an entire statistics division.
Dedicated to help people with their qualitative or quantitative analysis.
So pretty much anything that we can take off the plate, that isn't the ideas of the dissertation we're set up to help people with that part. So whatever that challenge that they're facing, whether they're stuck on the the methods or the writing or the formatting were there to help. And so at the end of the process, we do full editing of the draught. We do critical feedback on how to improve the argument. Hmm. Make it better. Hmm. And we can help people prepare for their defence. We'll do a zoom session like this and ask them the kinds of questions they might anticipate having so that when they go into their defence, they feel confident and ready to enjoy themselves talking about their research and not, you know, completely white knuckled over. You know, what's gonna happen when they walk in that room?
And importantly, too, we also help people publish their research so, so many people think of the dissertation as the end of the road, and then they've got the degree and they're they're pH done, as we would say. But I think it's really important to get your research out in a place where some people will actually read it. Sure.
Sure. Very few people read dissertations, but lots of people read books and journal articles, so we encourage pretty much anyone. If you've put this much time into researching your topics so deeply and passionately.
Do the research the the service and the justice of allowing it to be seen in the wider world.
And I feel really passionate about that because so many people, I think just get the degree and they're done and they don't want to look at it anymore. So what a service we offer is a dissertation to book and dissertation to article conversions where we work with students to help them publish that research and get it out into the world. Sure. And.
That is fantastic and whoever, whoever is listening.
To this amazing late night interview, I'd say to PhD candidates go seek dissertation editor.
They can help you with.
Your your struggles.
And you will excel in your in your PhD.
That that's why I would, I would say, for the for, for the listeners. Thank you so much. No, thank you very much. But before we end.
I would say.
To know more about it.
Do you have any social media? Doctor Saunders? Doctor Roda? Yes, so we're we're both on Instagram and Tick Tock. I'm at Doctor Lawrence Saunders. Sure. Now, and I think you're Alan Roda. And.
I'm at Alan Roda. Just that's a ball. Just. And.
Yeah, ALLENRODA on Instagram, TikTok and dissertation editor.com. It's dissertation, hyphen editor.com, but we'll put links in the description, I'm sure, and anyone who who is listening to this and you've made it this far mentioned pH. D Lounge when you reach out to us and we'll give you 10% off of your order at dissertation editor. So that's our our thank you to all of your listeners.
And for for having us on your show, we absolutely have love being here. Ohh, thank you very much to to both of you for reaching.
Reaching me out, demonstrating your interest. Uh, I'd say to the students. Make sure to to wear to your shelves. pH. Done. It is an incredible tool and you will get fascinated when you're going to read it. As I was as well before making the questions.
So.
Yeah, yeah. It's coming out August 8th, so it's available for pre-order now and we think it will be a tremendously valuable resource. And please please look it up. It's available at all the places where you would find books. O.
And that is it. Doctor Rhoda. Dr Saunders. Thank you again for for coming here. And I look forward to hearing more about this session editor and both for me as well. So thank you very much. Thank you.  Thank you very much. Thank you. Thank you.
Thank you to all the listeners who tuned to this amazing late night interview with two PhD graduates and authors of pH. Done. I hope that you have enjoyed hearing doctors Alan Rota and Lauren Saunders talking about pH. Done, dissertation editor, and thoughts on doing a PhD degree with all the professional and personal struggles many candidates have to routes that arduous Rd of the Doctor of Philosophy.
This late night's interview will be published on the 8th of August Day of the release of pH, Done just to have a special double gift for you while you tune in to this session and read all here the book.
If you are interested in knowing more about doctor's Rhoda and Saunders, then check out their social media and dissertation editor website where you can find more about their passion in helping PhD students with their dissertations around the world. Furthermore, for those who are struggling in achieving success in their PhD writing and need some help, dissertation editor helps you editing, formatting, proofreading, and data analysis.
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