From Tennis Pro to Rancher: Marko Babac's Journey to Raising Healthy, Grass-Fed Beef #144

In this episode, we chat with Marko Babac, the founder of Independence Ark Ranch, to explore his remarkable journey from tennis professional to grass-fed beef rancher. Marko shares his motivations for leaving the city life behind and embarking on a mission to raise healthy, natural cattle in the heart of Arkansas.

Throughout the conversation, Marko delves into the numerous health benefits of grass-fed beef, highlighting the importance of allowing cows to graze on pastures as nature intended. He explains how this approach not only improves the quality and taste of the meat but also contributes to a more sustainable and ethical farming practices.

Listeners will gain valuable insights into the process of raising cattle, as Marko discusses the challenges and rewards of starting a ranch from scratch. He shares his experiences acquiring his first cows, navigating the intricacies of rotational grazing, and building relationships with local processors and customers.

Marko also opens up about his personal health journey, discussing how embracing the carnivore diet and focusing on high-quality, grass-fed beef has transformed his life. He shares a powerful story about how his mother was able to overcome health challenges by adopting a meat-based diet, showcasing the potential benefits of this approach.

The episode explores the economics of grass-fed beef, with Marko explaining how Independence Ark Ranch is working to make this premium product more accessible and affordable for consumers. He emphasizes the importance of supporting local ranchers and farmers, and offers advice on how buying in bulk can help individuals save money while enjoying top-quality meat.

Throughout the interview, Marko's passion for his craft and commitment to producing healthy, sustainable food shines through. He offers words of wisdom for aspiring ranchers and health enthusiasts, encouraging them to take control of their food supply and embrace the benefits of natural farming.

Whether you're a curious consumer, a health-conscious individual, or someone considering a career in ranching, this episode is packed with inspiring stories, practical advice, and eye-opening insights into the world of grass-fed beef. Join us as we explore the intersection of personal transformation

Chances are, you wouldn't be listening to this podcast if you didn't need to change your life and get healthier.

So take action right now. Book a call with Dr. Ovadia's team. 

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Theme Song : Rage Against
Written & Performed by Logan Gritton & Colin Gailey
(c) 2016 Mercury Retro Recordings

Any use of this intellectual property for text and data mining or computational analysis including as training material for artificial intelligence systems is strictly prohibited without express written consent from Philip Ovadia.

Transcript

Jack Heald: 0:36

Marko Babac was living a typical or maybe slightly super typical urban life in Las Vegas and decided needed to get out of the hustle bustle. So he moved to Florida, lived on the beach. Wife had a great job and then COVID happened and lockdowns happened and everything went to hell. And so he bought some land in Arkansas. That was, A little over three years ago. Next thing you knew, he was a rancher. Now he sells beef around the world. Yeah, a guy who never did it is doing it. Pretty cool. Pretty inspirational. Great conversation. Great guy. You're gonna enjoy this one. welcome everybody. It's the stay off my operating table podcast with Dr. Philip Ovadia. And today we're talking to someone who's in I probably, I'm trying to think of an industry that I like better than this guy's industry. I can't think of one, Phil.

Dr Phillip Ovadia: 2:02

I don't think I've, I still haven't found it. And I think I've said it before on the show. I hope to do what Independence Ark does when I grow up one day. We're really, I'm really excited to have Marko Babac on the show with us. Independence Ark has Really just established. We're going to hear about Independence Ark farm where he ranches beef as well as other other great real whole foods and really excited to kind of hear his story and talk about his take on our food supply and I'm sure there's a couple of other interesting topics we're going to go into. With that, Independence Ark, I want you to introduce yourself to our audience, give a little bit of your back story.

Marko Babac: 2:47

Yeah, I'm a Marko Babac. I am the founder of Independence Ark Ranch and I come from Europe, from Croatia, as most of you can. Tell I have an accent. So I'm not your typical Arkansas guy out here. I also played a lot of tennis. I have a tennis business as well, where I contract out with different facilities. I have other coaches doing a program. So I'm very active in sports and now with food, especially with beef and everything we do with our. Turkeys and chickens. We process our own chickens and turkeys here that I all learned as it goes. Before all that madness happened with COVID and everything, I decided to get away from the city lifestyle. Also a city guy. I'm not a country guy at all. It's not just that I'm from Europe. There is a lot of Europeans that live or they live on a farm and all that. I really lived in the city my whole life. And this was just all new. I was just kind of like really wanted to get away from congested areas from a lot of people. I wanted to build an arc. That's why I called it Independence Ark, not because it's an arc of safety and independence comes in from Independence County. As other people would say what is Independence Ark? It's just the county that we're in and it really fit in with the arc of safety that I wanted to do. And I really wanted to grow the food for ourselves just to have and learn with a couple of cattle to start with chickens and all that. And it's turned out to be a nationwide and now a little bit international, we started to ship to Canada as well. And it wasn't like this was not planned. I just wanted to do something for us. And then we had so many family friends that would come over, have burgers or whatever pot roast, any kind of beef or chicken meals. And they would just be so impressed and the way the meat looks and all that. And I said, maybe we can do something else with it. Cause I ended up having more cows. And then all of a sudden he turned into one by one, you know, It turned out to scaled out to be a pretty big operation right now. As we speak mentioning back to what Dr. Philip Ovadia said earlier. Yeah, you can actually become what I am. Everybody I advise, I would tell everyone to try to farm, whether it's just a garden in the back or whatever it takes. I know I can't be a heart surgeon. That's impossible. But I know the doctor can become a farmer because I did. So there is a big difference here. I can't be a heart surgeon, but I know that you and Jack can both become farmers. And I really hope a lot of people do that. So that's A little bit in a nutshell. There is a lot more in between here and I'll leave it up to questions as you guys go along.

Jack Heald: 5:34

Yeah, I'd say there's a lot more. Let's start with how'd you end up in Arkansas?

Marko Babac: 5:43

That one, a great question again. So we were in Florida at the time we moved from Las Vegas. So you can't be any more extreme going from the desert to the beach. We were lived right on the beach of Reddington Shores, Reddington Beach, close to St. Petersburg, right? And all this madness happened with the lockdowns and all that. And I lived through socialism slash communism back in the day. We had hyperinflation civil war. So I kind of saw the writing on the wall before COVID madness even happened. And I've been telling my wife that we need to make an exit out of congested areas. I do not want to be around where I have to depend on someone else to provide necessities for me. I wanted to see if I can become self sufficient, but it was a little scary because I didn't know much about it. That's for sure. So this is where we just said, you know what? My wife made a move. With me, of course, and the whole family because she got her MBA in Las Vegas for the, for business executive what is it called? EMBA, Executive Master's Business Associate degree. She got a position that she could not say no. It was a no brainer right on the beach, big money. I didn't even have to do my tennis stuff in Las Vegas. He was just like, Hey, we're going to go live our dream. Life right on the beach of florida. It was beautiful for kids for us and all that. And all of a sudden her job was, she was basically laid off, including 225 employees that she was managing. So we were stuck. In florida with major overhead. I mean we were right on the beach We're talking big money and we couldn't even use the beach A lot of people don't know in florida what would really happen for first several months Of course, it wasn't like california and any of that, but it was pretty rough I mean they had yellow tape access to the beach And all that and I said i'm paying all this money here and now she didn't have a job. I said You basically have I told my wife 24 hours to find a place You we can still prove that we have income coming in from you because I'll figure it out because for me It's no big deal. You can pick me up and just drop me anywhere and I'll find my way around I kind of i'm used to that. And she was looking. Okay, how about texas? So we looked at one property in texas and He didn't have much pasture land. He was more like woods and all that. It was nice. But I said that we need some grass. We need, you know, she wanted to have a horse. I wanted some cattle, of course. And we were just kind of going with whatever it leads us kind of like a leap of faith that's what it was. Yes. And Arkansas came up. I said, Arkansas, I've never been to Arkansas in my life. Okay. Never in my life. I never even drove through Arkansas. So we found this property that has 48 acres and the house that was about 16, 1700 square feet. So nothing big like our house in Vegas was 4800 square feet, but I had 40 acres of land. Okay. Yeah, and it was productive. It was your land, right? So and the house was built in the mid 90s. It looked turnkey ready Everything was cheap through all that madness that was going on and I said, you know what? I'm, just gonna jump on this we made an offer side on seeing and I asked the real estate agent Can you give me 24 hours if I physically go there and see it because you know on pictures it can look a lot different It can be And we showed up, dropped the kids off at the in laws and showed up and I love the place. I mean, there is, I basically have no neighbors. I can do whatever I want. There is no HOA. I'm building tennis court now, as we speak, clay court, Olympic size right outside the front door. I mean, it just kind of all fit in. As I'm sure people will say, you probably had millions of dollars or something to make this happen. No. I had some savings for about four to six months for Media, basically like a median income and I knew I can do some stuff from home Working some cheaper jobs just to kind of get going and all of a sudden Independence Ark was born from there. I mean it is just a really crazy story There is a lot more to it, but I don't want to spend a whole hour talking about that. Did I do?

Dr Phillip Ovadia: 9:58

Yeah, I love it. So You know, you buy these 40 acres. Was it already you know, being farmed or ranched or you really had to kind of start the whole operation?

Marko Babac: 10:10

I just hired some, I brought some cash, actual cash with me. I said, maybe I can get a deal from some local handyman. You know, I found some really amazing veterans that like to get some extra work for cash. So I just said, you know what, I needed a fence. I had one part of the fence done and I just wanted to get the fenced off about maybe 10 or 12 acres and start with just Few cows on that side and figure out how do I do a rotational grazing and my wife is all about reading books and all that, you know, so she was doing all the research when it comes to that. And I'm the one that makes all the crazy decisions like I did to make her, you know, say yes to make a move from the beach of Florida to in the middle of the woods in Arkansas. That's just one of them. We did a lot of research on that. We did we fenced it off with those guys. So it was not farmland. We did just a little garden in the back. We were mostly just, hey, it's pasture land. These cows and horses are just grazing all day long. I'm watching them out the window and I just had to fence it off. I already had a barn that was not fully set. That was another project that we. It was not a barn. It was more like I just you know, the RV Marko Babacing in the country style with a little metal roof. Yeah, it had just structure. And we just added stalls in case I needed that. So there was another project and we were able to complete that. And all of a sudden I had cows and horses and we were just ready to go. But like I said, there was not a plan to go nationwide and international. meat farm to table business. It just it just kind of happened. And now I'm enjoying it. I can't believe I'm actually talking to you guys about selling beef. I mean, I've been a tennis guy my whole life. I have nothing to do with any of that. I just learned as I go. And I was fortunate enough to find some real men out here real cowboys, real ranchers. I learned all the tricks and trades pretty quickly. Cause I just was, you. Really listening a lot. I wasn't trying to act smart. I just wanted to learn. I got to meet the one of the best processors, I think, out there because we just love the way they process the meat. It's a USDA facility, only 40 minutes for me. So that was a big deal because I can't just do and butch my butcher my own cow. I'm not a USDA facility. So for chickens, it's different. We don't sell those. We just do it. We just have it for ourselves and our family. But yeah, for cows, that was a big deal. So it kind of all fell into place. And like I said, here I am talking to you guys about steaks, about beef and about being self sufficient.

Dr Phillip Ovadia: 12:48

Yeah, that's a great story. Yeah, tell us. I really because, you know, we've had one or two ranchers on, but they were sort of, you know, multi generation and career. You're, you know, you're the first, I guess I'm going to call it a new blood rancher that we've had on. Yes. You buy the property you build a fence and now you have to get some cattle. Talk to us about buying your first cattle.

Marko Babac: 13:15

Oh, this is, I think this is beyond hilarious. So it's not easy to buy cattle. You got to know these guys. Okay. You can't go on Facebook because you were immediately labeled as some kind of You know, a conspiracy theorist or who knows what you're labeled as if you're talking about beef, unless you're talking about, you know, something different, like being vegetarian, then it's no problem. But if you're looking to buy a cow, actual cow. It's very hard to go through all these loopholes to find, you know, someone and people kind of got to hide and give you the number in your direct message. Hey, I got a cow for sale. It's not as easy as people think. So we found this guy that was about three hours away. I think it was Scranton, Arkansas. Maybe someone, one of your listeners may be familiar where it's at. Just a small town kind of where I'm at. Very small town. And we agreed on, I said, I needed two cows, right? And I had a hard time understanding him because he's got a really thick Arkansas country accent. And here is me, European in Arkansas, the only one, probably in the radius of, I don't know how big Arkansas is, exactly how many miles, but I haven't seen one yet. So like me, I know that he was trying to figure out what was I saying as well, but we somehow made a deal that he comes over with cows at my property from whatever Scranton, Arkansas, right? So he comes in, he must have been 85 years old, but rough looking 85 years old. Okay. Like country rancher looking total cowboy. He's sitting in his you know, beat up truck. He's got plenty of cows in the trailer. So this was his driver, right? Not the guy I talked to. So I said, Hey, you know, I just wanted two cows, not nine or 10, whatever you got in the back. And he said just pick whichever one you like. I'm like, this is great. I don't know much about cows, but if I see a cow looking like this, I'm not going to buy that one. I'm going to buy a hefty looking cow. They were all about eight months, six months old. So they were already weaned off. Basically they were they did not need to nurse. None of that. They were ready to go for the pasture. And I told the driver, I said, I need 20 and 21. Let's say the numbers. I forget which numbers they were because they had like numbers on the ear tag. And he says go get them. I said, how do I get two cows out of the trailer? And I even had one of the Arkansas guys that played offensive line. I mean, he's a hefty Arkansas Razorback strong army infantry. Like he can squish you I think with his left hand and he's right handed. I mean, he's a strong guy And he says I'll just grab one. I said, what do you mean? You're just going to grab one. So he went on in there to try to get these cows out and nothing worked. You know, they're doing the herd mentality. They stick their heads together against the trailer and they're not moving. So I go to the driver and I said, okay, so can you help me out, man? I got to get these. I'm ready. Here's the cash. I want these two cows. He says, I can't help you. I'm 85 years old. I can't even get out of the truck. So I called the owner, the main guy, I guess. And of course he was playing games and sending me nine cows instead of two, hoping I buy all nine. I mean, I get that part, but I said, okay, listen, I'll buy all nine. It's fine as long as they all come out, but you need to give me a deal. And he says, no, that this is the price. This is what I can do. I said unfortunately there is none. I can do that. If you can give me all nine for this price, I'll buy him. So he said, he couldn't do it. We were about to leave. And then two minutes later, he calls the driver back and says, fine, let them have them all. I said how do I get all of them out again? He says, just bang on the trailer from one side, which two of you and they're all going to run out together. And that's exactly what happened. We had a little stick like a not to hurt the cattle, just like a little tiny stick to kind of stick on the side. And they all came out. Now I have nine cows. And I looked at my wife and she's as a city girl as they come, trust me. And she looks at me. I said now what, it was kind of like a Finding Nemo movie when they escaped at the end and said, now what, you know, like I said, I got nine cows. And that's how the whole story happened. How it turned out to be not just food for us. It turned out to be those nine cows. As soon as they got up to about 26 months or so, 27 months. They were going into into the processor and we sold them pretty quickly. I mean, this is where people really wanted to you know, support smaller farm businesses, stuff like that. It was just family, friends. They buy, you know, 200 pounds of meat. There goes basically your cow. One, you know, 250 pounds of meat. It was just gone. I said I like this. This was pretty good. So I ordered more, and it's turned into, to what it is now, you know, thousands and thousands of orders across the country and Canada.

Jack Heald: 18:12

Okay. So you went from I'm in the tennis business and my wife has an executive MBA to a rancher. Yes, we know basically what less than five years

Marko Babac: 18:28

we've been here three years now. We got here in 2020. Yes. Yes. Oh, I know. It's very, it's this it's hard to believe this story. But when I say when I tell when I told my friends what I did. They could not believe they said, where are you? Cause I lived in Las Vegas. I mean, I also played poker full time in between or part time I should say between tennis and all that. So I was basically living on Las Vegas strip has nothing to do with cows and ranchers. It was completely. As you guys know, different lifestyle and I told him you're going to be wishing you did what I did in three or four years because I see where our country is going. I see the writing on the wall. It's gone with what's going on and I don't want to get political on your show. Because I'm a political atheist. I don't trust anyone in office. Not one person, by the way. I'm not an atheist. I'm a political atheist. I just don't believe in anyone. I don't think they are out there for my own good, for your own good, for anybody's. They're just out there to get the votes. And I do not want to rely on them. Whether it's Republican, Democrat, I don't care. I just want to be on my own and move on from there.

Jack Heald: 19:44

We're going to get a lot of crossover listeners here from the health space into the I don't even know what to call it, but this is amazing. I have often thought, you know, I should buy a piece of property and. I should have my own cows and then I thought, Who am I kidding? I can barely nail two pieces of wood together.

Marko Babac: 20:07

And yeah, I can't either. I'm not a handyman by any means. You just learn as you go. It's crazy how it works out. You just learn as you go. And yeah, that's why I mentioned earlier. I can't become heart surgeon and eye doctor. I am 46 years old. I cannot become, I have no interest of becoming one. And if I wanted, I can't, but I know both of you guys and every single person listening can do what I'm doing. And I always tell, yes, you can buy meat for me or any other ranch out there, a farm to table business, but you got to do it. Number one, you do it yourself because the major corporations have a strong hold. on everything. Farmers are being squeezed out constantly. And it is sad to watch how quickly they destroyed so many hardworking people around where I live. They don't do farm to table because this really takes a lot of moving parts from shipping to marketing. It is and you gotta spend some money. You gotta make some moves. You have to do some promos You gotta do giveaways. You gotta be out there. You have to have a social media presence Most of these guys don't want to deal with that they're selling pennies on the dollar because big corporations and I don't want to name them here because these people are basically vicious and they will shut down your channel. They will shut down my farm You know This is where we are in United States. You have to watch what you're saying. You have to, we are all at the mercy of these big corporations. So they are guaranteeing these ranchers. Let's say they have a 2000 head of cattle, right? And they're saying we're going to for sure buy it from you. You don't have to do anything. You don't have to advertise it. You don't have to do anything. This is how much we pay you. And they get, like I said, pennies on the dollar. They can't sustain it. They're taking those cows and the prices are being raised at the stores. As you guys can see, when you go to the store what a pound of ribeye is or ground beef or whatever. But ranchers are not doing it. They're not making it. So that's why I decided to do farm to table, even though I knew it was going to be way harder. I said it's just a challenge. I want to give it a shot and see where we can go instead of selling my cattle to these blood sucking, vicious companies that want to destroy it. Not me. Everyone out there. That's not in the 1%.

Dr Phillip Ovadia: 22:39

Yeah, I mean, this certainly goes along with you know, one of our themes here, which is, you know, we talk about taking control of your health. And it's really taking control of everything in your life and the food that you're eating is a perfect example of that. Now so I'm going to interject a little bit, you know, your kind of maybe health aspect of this and your dietary preferences. And I know from sort of following you now on social media, you know, your, pretty much a carnivore. Did that happen before or after you started raising cattle?

Marko Babac: 23:17

It happened. It happened actually in January with the World Carnivore Month. I was able to interact with so many carnivore folks on Twitter, on whatever, X, and everybody was talking about, I said I have not going to say unlimited amounts of beef, but I have a lot of beef. Why would I not try? And and I did it. I did it for the month of January. Right now, I think I'm more keto. I don't mind a little bit of Of a mix of let's say avocado or whatever it is, but I'm about 70 to 80 percent carnivore. I love it. I do eat a lot of chicken that I process here. It tastes completely different than the chicken at the store, just like a grass fed and finished beef looks. Tastes different. It takes a lot more time to prepare. It's not for everyone. You might have to do sous vide like you're doing, Jack. A lot of dry brining marination. It's not all this marbling that you get from grain fed cows that you can just slap on the grill and you say why would I not want to do that? It's because grass fed does have a lot more minerals. It is, cows are supposed to graze. That's just the way the nature is and there is a lot more iodine in grass fed beef. Yes, it's going to be a little tougher if you don't make it right, especially certain steaks like New York Strip. If you're looking at New York Strip, you might want to go grain fed because New York Strip, you should be using fajita meat for that when it comes to grain fed, because it barely has any fat on it. It's just going to be pure meat. And it's going to be dark color, not much marbling, and the fat is going to be just a little bit on the side. It's almost like filet, but it's not going to be so tender like grass fed filet. So these are the little things that people need to learn because you got to look at it. What are the benefits? Are you going to eat really healthy meat that the cow was raised and finished, meaning taken to the processor from grass versus finished on corn or grain? So those are the differences and you can see in the color it's more like a burgundy color when it comes to grass, but you don't see that bright red and the fat. It's got a little more yellow tone to it. Versus white plastic, almost looking fat that you see at the store. It's a very thick white as white can be. And you can just tell those are just grain fed. I'm not saying that's not healthy for you, but they do a lot of weird stuff with gas to make cuts look more appealing. Very bright red. I would really be careful with that. Because I just don't know what's true, what's not true, what they're doing. So for those that are not sure when it comes to grain fed, you have to do a lot of, a lot more work to prepare your food in order for it to taste better. Ground beef is no problem. That's just going to be easy. It's going to be delicious, but like I said, every other cut, you're going to have to do a little more work to it to make it taste really good. So it's up to people if they want to save some time, make, or they look more into nutrition, what's in their meat, just to kind of give some idea on that.

Jack Heald: 26:29

I, I never, I, you know, we've talked like Phil said, we've talked to a couple of ranchers and they probably said it I know for myself, these things take a while to, to sink in, but you just kind of gave us a quick little rule of thumb there.

Marko Babac: 26:41

Just, yeah, just a couple of examples because we've had thousands and thousands of customers that love it. And you've got a few that just. It's not for them. They said, listen, I don't even know the difference between the T bone and the ribeye. I don't, I just want to, I say, you know what? Grass fed beef is just not for you. You really have to be in your kitchen and maybe have, maybe you're working from home and you have flexibility of time to dry brine these. Like you, you get these carnivore communities. I mean the passion and the time they take to make that pot roast, for instance, it is not just put it in a crockpot, undercook it, overcook it, and then say later, oh it was okay, or whatever. They really take time to make that and appreciate.'cause you can just see the way the meat looks. So it's a little more work on it. But co considering something with health. Going back to what doctor was asking earlier my mom was recently diagnosed with. What is it called? A stage one or I don't know if it's stage one or what is it? Stage one cancer. Is that what you say? It was the beginning stage. Yeah, it was a breast stage one cancer, right? It was not a fast spreading. I understand. Everybody's bodies are different. Every cancer is different. I get all that, right? So this is, of course, not medical advice or anything, but this was just recently and for two months. Before she took any she didn't do any Kibo, by the way, any of that, we just went strictly on meat diet for her. I was providing meat. She did eat some spinach and olive oil with garlic and a lot of eggs, a lot of chicken from my farm and a lot of grass fed beef that I was providing. The doctor that oncologist that she saw that she said that's what she was doing. He said, so you are a no sugar and no protein diet. And she said, yes, he kind of downplayed the no sugar part pretty quickly. And my mom was a little bit upset with my wife was with her. They are asking all the questions and my wife can ask questions. Trust me. I mean, it would make you stop like this with all the, you know, annoying, good questions that she would come up with. And the doctor really just downplayed it. And then two months later, we see him and the tumor shrunk from five centimeters. Okay. They were able to make the operation a lot easier that didn't have to cut much out at all. They just went microscopically underneath, scooped it all out. Basically she was cancer free within two months, cancer, they just, we just starved the cancer. By being on no sugar protein, grass fed beef, organic chicken. I should say natural because you can't say organic because that's what the big corporations. Weaponized. They have the organic right. So I'll just call it natural. I like natural better anyways. And cause they're free range and eat bugs instead of me eating bugs. I let my chickens eat bugs and then I eat their eggs or I eat the chickens if I have to. Not egg layers, but the meat birds. And that's kind of like the breaking news I think for this interview is my mom being cancer free in two months. Not eating carbs and sugar. I mean, she went cold turkey. She's 100%. No, not even a sip of OJ. Nothing. I mean, no sugar at all. And the cancer shrunk. And I don't know if doctor or you Jack have heard any of stories like this, but this was amazing to me because it happened to us. Like I know from personal experience. Have we heard anything like that, Phil?

Dr Phillip Ovadia: 30:16

We've had Thomas Seyfried on, and we've had a few others. I'll put a little plug in for Grace Price. Her documentary is now out on, you know, the relationship between what we eat and cancer. Definitely, but love to hear it every time I hear it. What are I guess, and I know this could probably turn into multiple podcasts, but give us a few like top most surprising things that you've learned about you know, doing this about, you know, raising cattle and getting them to market and being able to, you know, sell and then distribute distribute them.

Marko Babac: 30:59

First I was shocked the way the meat looked. When I went for the first time, it was the first cow we brought in, which was not easy. You know, you raise these animals and you take them in, you know, it's not easy. Okay. And after a while, you just understand this is food. It is not your pet. This is what it is. And at the beginning, that was the first thing I learned was like my wife was literally outside like sobbing when I had to take the first cow when she even named her. I said, stop naming cows. Don't name the cows. That's number one. That's number one rule. You just have to understand that this is food. It is not, it's livestock. It is not your pet. And then when I went in and I came home and I picked and I, when I waited for the meat to, you know, to go out and I looked at it and I said, and the smell of freshness. And the way it looked I said, I've never seen anything like it. Okay. That was the first moment that I realized This is different. So I said, okay Maybe the taste is going to be really bad or something because this looks too good to be true so I made the first hamburger out of the ground beef and I was just stunned in a way How juicy and how awesome it was like with steaks. I've had a few like New York strip, like I said, and even ribeye because it's not grain corn fed. Doesn't have much marble. You really got to do more with dry brining and all that. So I had our trials and errors with those, but when it comes to everything else, I was like, wow. This is amazing. Then when it comes to eggs, this is the biggest one, even bigger than the way the meat looked and all that it was the orange color on the egg that I've never noticed that the store was always kind of like runny, sick looking eggs, even if I would buy whatever they say, organic. And I said, why is it so orange? And it tastes so good. You can just tell that you're eating something healthy. I can just tell when I eat it that my body is absorbing it. What is the word I'm using? It's taking it so naturally. There is, I'm just eating it just like when eating grass fed beef, there is no, you don't feel heavy when you're done eating. Okay. Like I had steaks at a five star restaurants that are grain fed and all that. There'll be delicious marbling, but I feel Really good. You know, I eat a steak, you always feel honestly almost like an animal.. You feel really strong and good. But I felt like it was a little heavy, you know, with grass fed. I just go and go and eat. I can eat a steak and a hamburger and couple of eggs next to it, and I never felt heavy. I never felt like I ate a break. It just feels like it's a part of you and you're good to go. And that was the biggest learning curve when it comes to that. But everything else, the process of taking the cow in, figuring out the processor, there is so many things that can go wrong. So it is for someone who's never done it you know, you got a cow that possibly is born on your cab that's born on your property, so millions of things can go wrong there. Number 1, they survive, there is big blizzard coming in, somehow they survive miracle then they got to be weaned off, then you have to figure out, um, all the hay issues when the grass is completely frozen, they can't graze. So if I'm not feeding them grain or corn, I have to have a good access to hay, local hay. Because if hay is bad, your cow is going to it's just not going to be good. You got to have a really natural good hay. So you have to have all those pieces in place. Then you got to get the cow to get in the trailer. Then you got to get the trailer. With a pickup truck. You have to figure that out. You got to take them to the processor. Then you have to pick it from the processor. Then from there, it comes down to is it vacuum sealed? What if they didn't do a good job with that? What if the ground beef looks like 80 20, but it's really not 80 20 because they were rushing. It looks more fatty. People will complain again. Millions of things that can go wrong there. And then on top of that is packing, getting the right packages, the insulation on the box to make sure that you are safe when you're sending them out. Then you got to rely on UPS not to mess up. And then on top of that, like I said, the whole advertising, marketing and shipping itself, how do we, so we have a contract now with UPS, they come in Mondays and Tuesdays and they pick up, you know, Hundreds of boxes. We have them set up ready to go. They come in at the end of the day and I help them load it up. If I'm home inside the UPS truck and they take it from our ranch straight to the shipping facility. So so many moving parts, they can go wrong with bad weather or droughts. So you've got the summer droughts that you've got to deal with water security and all that. And then of course bad storms, which out here we don't get too much. It's about a week or two throughout the winter where you literally cannot even walk outside. It's ice everywhere. It's about zero degrees, but it's only two weeks, so it's not terrible. There is a lot of moving parts, like I said, that you got to figure out and a lot of things that can go wrong when it comes to this. Like I said, you can learn it. It is not as complicated as I made it sound because if you have certain things that can go wrong, then everything goes wrong. But if it runs smooth, for the most part it does. It's not that big of a deal once you learn the system. That's what I'm trying to say. But if something goes wrong, everything goes wrong. If that cow doesn't make it, or the processor doesn't do a good job, et cetera.

Jack Heald: 36:43

Yeah, kind of like everything else in life that is exactly just okay. But I got to understand this now. I've been buying my beef from a local ish rancher for the last couple of years. And they only deliver, they actually, I mean, they literally deliver here in town. And, but they only deliver four times a year. And I understand that's due to when they're harvesting the cattle. So you're shipping every week. How much walk us through the process there of you harvest a cow when it's either a certain weight or a certain age, I'm guessing, which

Marko Babac: 37:30

we want to be. Yes, we want to be under 30 months. If you're doing the USDA process, if you're doing everything the right way, because the backbone, a lot of times the cow can have cancer, all kinds of diseases, so you can't even get the steaks with bones. You won't even get your porterhouses, you will not get ribeyes with the bone. And you would lose a lot on weight when you're selling, even though the customers could appreciate that because they get more actual meat, but some people like myself, I like the bone, especially on sirloin steak, which is my favorite grass fed cut sirloin steak, which is so underrated. I liked it next to the bone. It's my favorite, right? So we're going in under 30 months. I keep them for about a year and a half. I get them when they're six months old. I also have access to the local auction, which is right next to us, like literally five minutes away with all the local farms, bring their cattle from the pasture. If I needed additional cattle, which is called Charlotte, Arkansas livestock exchange. I can go there. I can buy them when they're a year old. I can buy them when they're six months old. They disclose everything when it comes to they call them all natural, meaning no vaccinations all of that. And this is, like I said, only you can do stuff like this in small towns when everybody knows everyone. Like for instance, if you buy a bull at that auction and this bull is not good, meaning it cannot produce good calves. Something is wrong with him overall. And they need, you need to fill out paperwork and they actually go to the processor to make sure that this bull, if you tell him he's just going straight to the slaughterhouse, they would go there with you to make sure, not with you, but with the processor to make sure that this bull was brought in. Why? Because you don't want some cattle that are really small, weak, sick, because the bull was not healthy enough, not being able to produce good cattle. So everyone knows Independence Ark has this type of cattle. They got Black Angus. Jack down the street has this one. Phillip down the street has this one. And it's all small community that everybody works together and I just fell into it perfectly here where we got to meet great people that are no nonsense, basically, like literally cowboys. I mean, it doesn't get much more cowboy than out here. That's all I can tell you. I mean, these are some big,

Jack Heald: 39:59

they're making your living with cows. Yeah.

Marko Babac: 40:02

Yes. These are some rough looking man out here in a good way. And I've been enjoying it living here. Like I said, I would not mind visiting Vegas. We go to Florida every year for vacations and all that, but just love it here. I love the freedom. And I hope a lot of your listeners do something like this to decide to make a move instead of saying, All the excuses all the time. My job is here or something. A lot of people work from home too. And you might have to get some kind of you know, pay cut because you decided to do this, but your overhead your rent, your mortgage, hopefully you bought a property is so much less than it offsets the cost from a big city living. And it's just gotta. Put things into perspective what you really what really matters to you versus look at pros and cons in this one and then make that decision and go from there. That's what I hope a lot of people will do because I think unfortunately, our country is going in the direction where you're going to need to know people that grow food, you're going to you better do it yourself. But if you don't, you better have connections with them because you cannot rely on those freaks in office. That's just the way I see that.

Jack Heald: 41:16

How many cattle do you run on 40 acres? Are you still 40 acres?

Marko Babac: 41:21

I have 40 acres, but not all is pasture land. So I have about three rotational grazings for about seven or eight acres. So you're looking at maybe half of it. So I would have like about 15 head once I sell three or four quickly, I get another one that's about six or eight months, put her on that for about a year to to just graze and just a little tough sometimes because these cows that are grass fed, it takes time for them to get up to that. Weight that financially makes sense to you it takes a lot longer. That's why grass fed meat is going to be tougher unless you cook it right, because they are working out. Okay. If you're looking at some,

Jack Heald: 42:05

yeah, they're not sitting in a Barcalounger, flipping through the soap opera. Yes. Eating bon bons.

Marko Babac: 42:10

Yes. It's just like all of these things I learned and it's so interesting to me that I was like, wow, this makes so much sense. So you got a cow that's out there for two years grazing running around. They actually run a lot. Believe it or not, they jump. They do all kinds of stuff. They play just like. You know, small puppies when they're a year old or under they're active so they have muscle and when you have muscle you have more stronger tissue versus the grain fed corn fed cow you put them in these speed lots. I don't know if you guys ever seen it. They have their heads forward. They can't move. and they feed them and they bulk up so they can have more meat out. And a lot of times these cows are just in distress. It's not good for the liver and all that. It is, but some people, most people do prefer grain fed meat because it's got more fat, more marbling. It's easier to make quicker. You just got to know which way to go. It's your preference. And understand the difference in the meat and then make your best decision. Are you looking for really healthy or are you looking for something that's pretty good, but it's nowhere as healthy as, because the cows are supposed to graze. They are made to eat grass. They're not made to eat cupcakes like they feed them sometimes in feedlots, or whatever else they feed them to bulk up. They're supposed to eat grass. K grass. Same thing. That's what the cow that's what horses are supposed to eat. Not anything else. And I did not come up with that. That's just the way it is.

Jack Heald: 43:48

Yeah. So you're so so 15 ahead of cattle on 7 to 8 acres year round.

Marko Babac: 43:57

No, seven to eight acres with rotational. So all three of them have that much. So about, you know, 20, 20 acres, and it goes with hay. You've got to do about three or four bales of hay per cow, sometimes per, for a month. If they're really big, if it's a bull, that goes pretty quickly. So that's, we have a lot of cost too, if the weather is bad. So that's another part. That you have to consider some one of those bales, it's about 45 to 50, depending on where you go. So if you got, like I said, bad weather, so this is another reason why when people have it in Montana North Dakota Indiana, Illinois, where there is a lot of farmland. Utah, you're looking at winter. I mean, Wyoming, you're looking at six months of winter. I just don't know how they do it. Honestly, I don't know. So these are the little things that are, I guess, big things for people to put into consideration when they were looking into it. Somewhere down south would be a little bit better. We are right on that Kind of like on the cusp between are we really down south a little bit with more north. So we do have some snow, but it's really like I said, the winter is it's pretty nice. I'm not complaining. We really struck it pretty good here. And I hope a lot of other people do as well. Instead of looking for these sexy places like Florida, Las Vegas, where you're paying an arm and a leg for one acre of land. And you have to deal with all the bureaucracy with HOAs and all that. Over here, nobody cares what you do. I mean, it is just freedom.

Jack Heald: 45:35

I will say this in defense of the Las Vegas area, just drove back from Las Vegas last week, had a trade show, stopped in Boulder city at a barbecue place and had One of the best piles of beef I've ever wrapped my lips around. I really wish it was not four and a half hours away from my house. I would be there every week. Phil, they're not paying us any money. Can I promote them?

Dr Phillip Ovadia: 46:03

And then we gotta meet up some day over there, I guess.

Jack Heald: 46:07

It's a place called Fox Barbecue in Boulder City, folks, get the slop bucket. That's what it's called. That's what the plate is called. You will thank me later. It is extraordinary. So probably, but it's not good enough for me to want to live in Las Vegas.

Dr Phillip Ovadia: 46:22

I probably using local meat, but so yeah, let's talk about the economics of it. Some, because you know, I I, on your website, you know, you can order. And you're one of the few people one of the few online you know, meat distributors, meat sellers who it looks like you're selling kind of a half or a quarter a side of beef there. So you can get 200 pounds of beef for, I think the price was somewhere under 14 a pound for that. When you do that, yeah. Yeah. So 1350 a pound. And you know, anyone who's shopped in the supermarket recently, you know, you're paying pretty much 10 a pound for the low quality, you know, for much less quality stuff that's for the ground beef. And then, you know, steaks. I think it's very challenging. I rarely see them under 15 a pound. So here we are you know, by Cutting out a lot of the middlemen is probably a big part of it. You can get, you know, very high quality product at a much lower price.

Marko Babac: 47:31

Yeah, 13. 50 is, that includes just for those that are not aware, when you buy in bulk like this, which is what most farm to table businesses do, you just gotta be sometimes on the waiting list for a while, because, like I said, all those moving parts have to come in, come into place. Here, we just got lucky, having the processor pretty close by, and all the things that that come into place. But 200 pounds of meat would fit in a seven cubic foot freezer, which would feed, I'm not talking about carnivores, full on carnivores, obviously, that's going to be more extreme meat eating. But those that are not full carnivore family of four would last a whole year. And that meat is good to go for one year being vacuum sealed. In your full up to the brim seven cubic foot freezer. So family of four So just look at like maybe for two people when it comes to most people here would that listen eat probably a lot more beef Than they do you know pasta and vegetables So that's kind of the first part to look at it and half of that It's always roughly half is ground beef because half of the cow is ground beef So if you're buying 100 pounds of ground beef, you're going to get roughly between 40 and 50 pounds of ground beef, then you're going to have your brisket, you're going to have your ribs, you're going to have your Q brown steaks, you're going to have your other steaks like porters, ribeyes, blah, blah, blah, all of those shanks all of those cuts are the other half of the half that you bought. So if you'll again, if you bought 200 pounds, Roughly 90 pounds is going to be ground beef, and the rest, 110 pounds, is going to be between the steaks, brisket, ribs, short ribs, dino ribs every, all the other cuts roasts, chuck roast, arm roast. We're famous out here in Arkansas for arm roast. People haven't really heard much about it. It's delicious in my opinion. It's got a beautiful marrow bone in the middle. And that's kind of how it works. So that's why you save a little bit of money when you're buying in bulk, but a lot of people have storage issues. They live in the cities, right? So they don't have a room for a seven cubic foot freezer. So that's why we offer a sample pack of 20 pounds, which gives you like seven, eight, nine pounds, whatever ground beef, you've got a little bit of steak. You've got a little bit of roasts. And we have those as well, especially for budget friendly burger box, 20 pounds, I think on our website, 157 for those. We, those are flying literally off the shelves, just the burger box, 20 pounds of ground beef that can fit in the corner of your freezer. Even if you live in the city and it's the easiest, as you guys know, meat to make from your tacos to hamburgers to meatballs. Maybe meatballs will take a little more time, but so many varieties with ground beef. So as much as it's not maybe your favorite steak that you get on the bulk, you get to really experiment from meatloaf to all kinds of stuff with ground beef. And this ground beef, I personally think is beyond delicious. Like I haven't had an issue with the ground beef. There was one person that told me they had an issue with, but then she ended up telling me that she put it on the frying pan. It was not even thought out. She put it when it I was like, no, listen, you gotta have that meat completely on the room temperature and then don't even put it on high, just put it on low and cut it up, maybe put a little butter over it and go from there. Cause it's grass fed, so it's not going to have all that grease on the bottom, which I know a lot of carnivores do like I'm just calling it. Was it a good fat or bad fat? We don't know. There is not much research, not even from what's his name? Norwitz. I'm sure you guys heard it. I haven't heard much on this from anyone. What is really the difference in this fat from grass fed? cow versus from grain fat. As much as it does have fat and you need some fat, of course, that's the whole point of the anti establishment narrative that fat is good for you. Protein is good for you. I just don't know. I'm just going to stick with, for me and my family, with what is natural and I'm going to continue doing so. I'm just going to stick with what I got and go from there.

Jack Heald: 51:56

So the website is Independence Ark, one word. ARK Independence Ark. com. I went and wandered around and just, my mouth was watering. I need to not be looking at things like that before I've eaten for the day. It looks fantastic.

Marko Babac: 52:13

I got, I got dinner coming up too. I'm sure you guys are ready.

Dr Phillip Ovadia: 52:17

Yeah, I don't. Yeah, indeed. Yes. Yeah. This has been a fascinating, entertaining conversation where we're definitely going to have you back on to go even deeper in this and you know, of course get updates on how it's going, but love what you've done and what you're doing. And you know, we've said many times the best food is going to come from you know, your local rancher, your local farmer, go shake their hand, go figure out what they're doing, and as best you can, but if you don't have that option, ordering from a local rancher who may not be actually local to you like Independence Ark is another is another great way to do it.

Marko Babac: 52:59

Thank you. I wanted to add if I can real quick for those that do like more fat, when it comes to grass fed short ribs, dino ribs, brisket, and some roasts like chuck roast, they have a lot of fat. And it's in my opinion, really good fat. So for those that are really into that, those are the cuts you want to look into when you are ordering grass fed and finished beef. Some people may say it's grass fed, but it's really not and you can just tell by the color. If it's really red and the fat is really white, it's not grass fed. It might have been grass fed at some point, but it's not. It's not finished. It's not taken to the processor. It's finished on grain and you have no idea how long. So I just wanted to throw that out there. That's good to know. Thank you.

Dr Phillip Ovadia: 53:46

Yes. Very good. Besides the website, where else should people find you, Independence Ark?

Marko Babac: 53:53

I'm on Twitter a lot. I post a lot of Independence Ark. I'm sure you guys seen it. I get a little crazy. Sometimes I go off the lot, but I don't care. You know, like I said, we, I'm not, I had people that would attack. Why would you say this? Why would you post a picture of Bill Gates laughing? You're not, I don't care. We are not big corporation that we have to follow anyone's rules. We do. If you don't like us. Go somewhere else. I don't care. That's my attitude. And that's what I'm gonna. I'll leave you with And thank you again for both of you guys for having me on I had a great conversation It's been a blast

Jack Heald: 54:36

And I think it's really cool to meet a guy who isn't a generational rancher who said, you know what, I'm going to do it and has succeeded. That will be that all by itself will be an inspiration to a lot of folks and we'll get a lot of cross.

Marko Babac: 54:52

And I hope it is. I hope it is. People need to take it seriously so they can stay away from the operating tables.

Jack Heald: 54:59

Absolutely. All right. Phil. As always I'm just I'm so pleasantly surprised by these extraordinary people we get to talk to. This one has been a lot of fun. I appreciate you bringing Independence Ark onto the show and I'm thrilled that I get to, to talk to folks like this. I'll remind our listeners that contact information for Marko Babac and Independence Ark will be available on the show notes. So you can click directly through, order some meat from Independence Ark show them your support and I think you'll enjoy it. So for Dr. Phillip Ovadia, thank you, Independence Ark, for Dr. Phillip Ovadia. This has been the Stay Off My Operating Table podcast, and we will talk to you next time.

Marko Babac: 55:41

Have a great day.