Island of Color | June Collins Pulliam

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Island of Color: Where Juneteenth Started :https://www.amazon.com/Island-Color-Where-Juneteenth-Started/dp/1418469742

Mrs. June Collins Pulliam, a Galveston native, learned extensively about the history of African Americans in Galveston from her mother, Mrs. Izola Ethel Fedford Collins. Mrs. Collins authored the book "Island of Color: Where Juneteenth Started," highlighting African-Americans' history in Galveston.
Mrs. Collins purpose in writing this book was to shed light on the accounts of her grandfather, a man of color who came to Galveston with his family immediately after the Declaration of Freedom. Additionally, Mrs. Collins used recorded interviews with citizens who were alive when the book was written to tell the story from the perspective of those who lived it.
According to Mrs. Collins, this story's significance extends beyond Galveston and calls for acknowledgment and revelation due to its far-reaching effects on the world.
Mrs. June Collins Pulliam discusses growing up in Galveston, Integration, her mother's book, and how some of her family survived the 1900 storm.  

Transcript

the 1960s   was so far away. Segregation uhhuh still has an effect on the people we  talk to and know every day such as yourself absolutely

there had been some member of my family continuously teaching in the public schools for a hundred years.

We can take that idea and move it forward.

 📍 Hello, and welcome to Galveston unscripted. I have another fascinating episode for you. Today I sit down with mrs. June Collins Pullium.

One of our great community leaders here on the island,

I'm gonna skip her bio because she does a great job at describing what she does here on the island and in our community. I wanted to sit down to discuss her mother's book,

her  📍 mother mother mrs.  Isola, Ethel Bedford Collins. Wrote the book, island of Color. Where Juneteenth started,

 this book was released in the early two thousands

 the book was written using a series of journals, conversations, interviews, and general local knowledge.  And this book describes what it was like in Galveston for African Americans. From 1865 up until the early two thousands, this book is absolutely fascinating and  gives us some amazing insight of what it was like here in Galveston from multiple perspectives.   

 I'm gonna be leaving a link in the description for this book, so be sure to check it out.

 If this is your first time listening to Galveston unscripted, be sure to check us out on Spotify, apple, and anywhere you find podcasts. We are also on YouTube, Facebook, Instagram, TikTok, you name it. Hop on over to those platforms and join us while we explore this island's Fascinating history.

 I hope you enjoyed this  📍 conversation  welcome to Galveston unscripted.

June, thank you so much for joining me today on Galveston, unscripted. I really appreciate you coming in. So many people have told me about you and your mother's book and your family and just the amazing amazing efforts they have put forth on this island and elsewhere to really make this a better place to live for everyone. 

I had to get you in here.

To tell you a little bit about this book, island of Color, where Juneteenth started that my mother wrote. She had, as a child, seen that her grandfather would write in a journal, and then when she was grown, she found this journal again and found that it had a, an amazing wealth of information about African American life in Galveston, going all the way back to 1865.

And so she was able to, Cole from that information that she could write for this book. It has very various categories that her grandfather had chosen to, to divide it into about black businesses and churches and schools and enter entertainment and much more. So she used that format. She interviewed many people.

And included her own information and published this book in the early two thousands, around 2001, 2002. My sister who had gotten her degree in journalism from University of Texas edited and Cheryl Collins Creighton is her name, , so that she published it and was able to begin sharing it with people.

For the next several years until she passed in 2017. So now at this point my brother Roy Collins iii, my sister, who I've already mentioned in myself, were trying to continue sharing it with people whenever people express interest. 

Could you tell us a little bit about yourself and what you're up to these days and what you got going on? 

I guess just to start people like to let people know when they're b o I I am one fourth generation here on the island.

Fifth, if you go talk. Two, those who have been on the island, the fifth generation, wasn't born here, but came here as soon as they could. So my family on my mother's side goes back to 1865. So we've got deep roots on this island and have been building literally and figuratively since then.

Literally, because some of my predecessors were carpenters who built homes for some of the first recently emancipated persons coming to Galveston, but also figuratively in that I. Come from a long line of educators on my father's side too, because they have been here since the 1880s oh wow.

Anyway, that is that part in a nutshell. And then As for myself again, grew up here in Galveston, educated in the public schools. In fact, I was among the very few who integrated Rosenberg Elementary School in 1961 in the, as a first grader. Wow. That was the first year that there was integration and it was only for the first graders.

They did not integrate the whole school system. And then you know came through the school systems, very active in, in different leadership roles and things. Went on and got my degree, my first degree in music therapy. So I spent the first half of my adult life as a full-time board certified music therapist working in a variety of settings, but especially inpatient and outpatient psychiatric settings.

Also got my master's in Psychology, behavioral sciences, and in more recent years, without going on and on through my entire adult life I, I wanna hear it all. I wanna hear everybody. In more recent years, I have been primarily in terms of my job executive director of Fanfare Lutheran Music Academy, which is an afterschool and summertime program for children in music, but also art and dance. So currently I am chairing the City of Galveston's Family, children and Youth Board. I am the these are all volunteer things I'm talking about now.

Oh, yes ma'am. I'm also the executive director of the Galveston Heritage Corral, which was founded and directed by my mother 1992. So we're now in our 31st year. we've kept it going since she passed five and a half years ago. I am on the board of the Galveston Sy Orchestra, immediate past president of that board.

 I'm also on the board of directors for the near cultural center. Which has been doing all kinds of wonderful things, including collaborating with the.

Installation a couple years ago of the Juneteenth mural and many more things Currently I'm on the design team of a collaborative called The Future Us, which you may be familiar with.

And I'm also an online worship host at my church, the Fellowship of Texas City

really? Okay. 

Did that start before 

Covid or? No, That started, yeah, the summer July of 2020. Uhhuh. They were looking for people, I had been Teaching Sunday school and, the church was closed. I couldn't do that. And I heard they were looking for online worship hosts, so I started doing that.

So now the church is open, but there's still both uhhuh, there's online as well as in-person services. So I do that every Sunday 

too. That's great. That's great. I always wonder how that's gonna continue. How, COVID changed everything Yes. And how we move forward with technology and everything.

 All of us humans on the earth and now have an expanded opportunity to reach people. In doing what we do, you know? so our, I know that my church in every church is reaching people that way.

 As a result of our understanding now the technology that was already there, but that most of us weren't using uhhuh. 

Wow. That's really great. Yeah. So to go back, I do wanna ask you a question about integration. So integrating when you were in first grade.

Mm-hmm. I'm gonna ask some stupid questions here, but I think it's important to ask. 

They're not stupid questions. My parents told me that when I was six years old. There's no such thing as a stupid question. Mm-hmm. So, So go ahead. 

thank you. Why just 

first grade. That's not a stupid question, but it's one I don't have the answer to.

Oh, okay. I was only six and no one ever told me why. Mm-hmm. But I can speculate. Okay. I can speculate. As you probably know the Brown versus Board of Education was in 1954, which is coincidentally the year was born, but very few school districts across the south are the country, period.

Integrated in the fifties, they waited until they had to with the various civil rights movement and acts in the sixties. My speculation, and that's all this is that it was thought that it was, would be easier to more gradually mm-hmm. introduce. Integration. I do know that they, after that first year, 1961, the next year, it was first and second graders.

Okay? So those of us who were already there continued and then they allowed those behind us, and they did that for four years. Then they opened up The integration access across the school district. It was a few more years later before they closed Central High School to where there was no longer a choice.

I believe that was 1968, if I'm not mistaken. But prior to that, it, the choice to have the access, I think, took place in, across the district in, around 1964, approximately. Okay. So I, I don't know the powers that'd be, what their reasoning was. That's what I imagine 

maybe more of a, a phase in rather than throwing, high school students altogether, which could probably, could be.

Yeah. Interesting. Mm-hmm. I just think it's important to highlight the fact that. Young people I, I think they think it, the 1960s is far away. Uhhuh, it was so far away. Segregation uhhuh still has an effect on the people we absolutely talk to and know every day such as yourself.

Absolutely. And I think that's very 

important to highlight. And the thing is, one of the things I've thought about um, is that, if I had been born just. Two or three months earlier than I was cuz Galveston had, and I imagine still does a rule that you have to be six years old by September 1st or whatever to be in the first grade.

I happen to have a late September birthday. Gotcha. If I had been born just a month or two earlier, I would've already been in first grade and would. Not have been with this group that started at that point. So I have people who are very close to my age, just a grade ahead of me who did not experience integration in Galveston until later.

And that, that has a different impact. Both experiences have their pros and cons, but that has a different impact. How 

was it growing up in Galveston for you? What was your um, honest uh, open experience growing up in Galveston? 

I was blessed to have two amazing parents who were from here also, evidently, 

right?

Yes. 

I had a very good childhood and I attribute that mostly to them. Mm-hmm. I, again, when I go back and look in history, I think, you know what, what was happening that they were probably shielding me from as a child uh, which is good parenting. Mm-hmm. Um, But my personal experience was positive.

I was blessed to, have a stable home to college educated parents who were both working and providing and loving and nurturing and at that time, quite a few relatives in town. That's not the case anymore, but so I had a good network.

Mm-hmm. So growing up for me was good. My home church was Reedy Chapel AME church, which is where my mother's family has, had been attending since about 1865. What 

a history. What a history. What a history. 

And so I had, that network of support and other, community organizations since both of my parents were very much integrated into the the community as well.

My childhood experiences were, for me personally good. Which I'm very thankful for. I know that was not necessarily the case for everybody else. I'm thankful for that. 





So to transition into, your mother's book which is Island of Color. I highly recommend everyone. Get this book and read it because it does an amazing job going back to the 1860s and seventies and detailing the life  and lifestyle and things that African Americans were doing, had to do, had to deal with right through the, up until, your mother wrote the book.

Mm-hmm. So one thing I was struck by was the role of your, that your family had in education. Back to the 1870s, I believe, if I'm not eighties mistaken. So 1880s. Okay. Could you tell us a little bit about your family's role in education here on the island?

Sure. 

As just a brief background to directly answer your question, my great-grandfather Ralph Albert Skull, who later became Reverend Ralph Alberts skull was brought here with his parents. Who had all just been recently emancipated from being enslaved at Bover, right across the Galveston Bay.

He was five years old at the time. Wow. His parents ho and Emily Skull brought him and his siblings. Who were alive at that time. So he himself was educated in those very first schools that were set up at places such as at Reedy Chapel, which I'm sure has a lot to do with why they affiliated with that as their church.

After getting the education he could get here, he went away to Wilberforce University and got his teaching credentials. And so he is the first person. Of color, a black person to have grown up in Galveston, educated here, to come back and teach here. The other black people who did come were from other cities.

They were recruited and brought here. He came back and he began teaching in I'm pretty sure it was 1883, either 18 83, 18 84. And. He taught for 52 years. Oh my goodness. 52 years. He married in fact in the updated cover for Island of Color that might Yeah, we can set it right here if you want that.

My daughter, Janae designed about a year ago. This was the original cover you see the photo of the family, this, oh my gosh. Picture is from approximately 1908.  And the steps of the family home, where I live today, I didn't grow up there. It was rented for many years. Okay. But I've lived there anyway. He. So he passed down.

Hi. His sister Claco was also an educator. She did not marry and have children in those days apparently was very rare and looked down upon for female teachers to even get married. Much less have children. Really? Yes. It was a very different kind of scenario than today, but she was very well known.

She was active. In the National Educational Association that you've, we've all heard of nea. I've seen a record of her being listed as, I think one of only like 12 people from the state of Texas in the 18, 8 18 something early, late 18 hundreds that she was a member of that. Anyway, so she was the other educator of that generation.

Then his daughter, Viola Skull, who married and became Viola Skull Feder was my grandmother. She went. After graduating from Central High School that had been established in the 1880s, she graduated and went to Prairie View a and m and got her teaching degree, and then she also taught for 52 years.

Her two daughters were my Aunt Florence Bedford Henderson, married name, and my mother Isola Bedford Collins. They both became teachers as well. My aunt was what, let me back up. I don't know what specific subject my great-grandfather taught, but I know that probably a variety of things. My, my grandmother was an English high school English teacher.

. Mm-hmm. My mother was a music teacher right here in Galveston. All of these, and my aunt was a math teacher By the, they both taught other districts as well but did most of their career here. So by the time they retired, which was in 1984, there had been some member of my family continuously teaching in the public schools for a hundred years.

Oh my goodness gracious. Um, So the education legacy did not stop there. It's just that it left Galveston. Ah. The education legacy has never stopped. We just don't currently have one, anyone teaching the public schools. But if you include the fact that I am a music educator in an afterschool, in private lessons, that's degree, you could say it's still continuing here in Galveston.

I think it's important and I think, it's it's only natural to, you know, come here to Galveston, start it, and then grow from it, and then move, upwards. Right. Uhhuh, I love that. Uhhuh. Mm-hmm. Without keeping you here all day, cuz I, I swear I could keep you here all day and talk to you.

I just, a few things that struck me about this book was really I guess your great-grandfather's, these would be your great-grandfather's,  foresight to write down all of his experiences in his diary. Yes. And almost every day he would write Yes. And talk to your mother.

About a lot of these things, and that's where a lot of the information in this book comes from. Precisely so to preserve and. Pass along the experiences. Precise. Precise. It's, It's almost like he knew how important that time period was. 

Yes. I I have often thought, wow, if he hadn't done that, apparently no one else did.

When my mother wrote this book, no one had ever written a history of the African Americans in Galveston, because I presume there wasn't all in one place. That much information. Many people such as Sam Collins have done an excellent job of unearthing things in various sources to add to the knowledge.

But yes my great-grandfather did keep this journal and he was able to record things that he knew from his childhood. Mm-hmm. In 1865, which is why This information goes back to 1865 because he was here. Now he was not writing it down when he was a child, but he was certainly remembering.

And the thing that was so fascinating from my mother, she remembered him writing it when she was a child, but When she found it long after he had passed one of the things that was striking to her is not just that he wrote things randomly, but he had sections, and you can see a copy of his journal in the archives at the Rosenberg library upstairs on the fourth floor.

He wrote it in sections. So it's like you see a section about all the black businesses, and then you see a section about all the black churches, and then you see a section about all the black schools and on and on. So she was naturally not no. Did that make that easy for her research to, to learn about things before she was born in 1929, but it gave her the idea of how to organize her book, and that's, oh yeah, that's how she chose to organize her book as well.

So she was able to build on that with things she knew personally, having grown up in Galveston. And then she interviewed lots and lots of people and especially those older than herself who, who were still alive at the time. Yes. That foundation is just amazing when I think about it, that he had that foresight.

I'm sure he had no idea of it, specifically how the information would be used, but he must have had the foresight that it was important to be recorded. And I'm very thankful for that. 

It's amazing, what you think going in and writing in a, in your, let's say diary every day, but you write down these notes about what you remember and how. It can literally be used to shed light or to completely open up a section of history or to paint the full picture. On what otherwise would be, you wouldn't have the entire, obviously the entire full picture. You just have what is the main narrative is, right. that's right. But this here, Highlights  the African American version of it.

 It is just it's so crazy to me to think that it goes from a diary every day to your mother writing this down and then what you will do in the future. Adding additional chapters to this book to expand upon that, which I assume that's what you plan on doing. 

I do not have plans to write at this point, but I certainly have taken on the legacy handed to me that I never thought was going to, of sharing.

Um, It, you know, my mother passed five and a half years ago. Prior to that, there was a, there was interest she would do talks occasionally on her book and book signings and et cetera. But within the last couple of years in particular, there has been such a great interest. And as the only one of her offspring who currently lives in Galveston, it's been like, okay, I guess I'm doing this now.

I feel like it has been Something that I, a mantled that I needed to take on because with people having the interest to, to spread the word, I know nothing would make her happier. My mother never made this. B, wrote this book with the intention of, oh, I want to be an author, or, oh, I want to make money.

She wrote it with the idea of I want people to know and she would speak to audiences large and small. Just trying to spread their words. I know she would be very pleased to know that I've now, been interviewed by local, regional, and couple of national outlets to where there's more people hearing about this.

Absolutely. Um, Just so that the history is known that it is no longer obscured from view. 

What are some of the most. When you read this book or you talk about this book on national platforms, what are some of the things that make you most proud of your yourself, your family, your mother, your gra, your great-grandfather, your whole entire family.

What are some of the things that make you most proud when you look back? 

I don't think a whole lot about being proud of myself. None of us chooses what family to be born into. I mm-hmm. I can't take any credit Okay. For any of that. But I am certainly thankful that despite what must have been all kinds of adversities that they were able to overcome one of the Songs of the Civil Rights Movement was we Shall Overcome One of the most famous, probably the most favorite song of the whole Civil Rights Movement.

And what I am proud of is that my ancestors were able to overcome, probably unspeakable things and not only survive, but thrive and give. Not just for themselves. I'm pleased. To have been born into a family that's always been about giving, about reaching and helping others. And how could I do anything less than that at this point?

I know that when I was growing up, my parents told me, I guess maybe everybody's parents tell 'em this. It's we've done this, now you're supposed to go on the next. And you know, in some ways I think I have done that. I do think that the generations have continued, a couple of my brother's children are doctors and,  I think about that sometime because my father wanted to be a doctor, but there was no money.

Mm-hmm. So he did get a bachelor's degree, which, in the 1940s was not a common thing for. African Americans to do. He did get his degree in science. But so in, that's, you know, the, the generations have gone very much forward in that sense. But I think that it's also about continuing to make a difference in your community and not just, for yourself.

That would be a total waste. And so I guess I'm proud of the fact that my family Has done its best to give and make the community better through the years.

One thing um, that your mother opened with in this book is that the way she wrote the book was more as not looking at it like a book, but looking at it like she's writing music uhhuh and telling the story through music. Yes. And I, that's what struck me Just, and it flows that way.

Right. So you have some very serious things, obviously, and then you have some funny stories and that are just like, oh my gosh. Yeah. That is great. So yes, it's the ups and downs and it just tells all of it. It makes it so dynamic and real. 

I'm glad you said that because Yes, that is, that was her style of communicating.

She was very much a musician. Her becoming a historian was something she did later in life. But she, I think, blended the two very well. And I am, I'm proud of her for many things she did. But among the many things is that although she had written and arranged a lot of music during her years as a band director and choir director, and church director, when she was in her mid eighties.

Less than two years before she passed, she wrote an orchestral piece that was performed by the Galveston Symphony Orchestra conducted by her. And. She is, she was the first galvestonian to ever have their music performed by the Galveston Symphony Orchestra of any not white, black, old, young, the first one period.

And I'm very proud of her that, at that age she was still going strong and she was writing a play when she passed that she never got a chance to produce. Wow. Sh yes, she was she was someone who was always in that creative musical mode, but a fighter for Galveston. Galveston children, the black people in Galveston, poor people in Galveston, being on the school board for nine years, et cetera.

So she was all about all of that. 

One thing I wanted to ask you about was your mother mentions that owning property was  or acquiring property was difficult, but maintaining and owning the property was almost impossible.

Mainly because you had all these outside forces. Mm-hmm. Essentially Taking away or trying to take away this property from African Americans in Galveston. Right. Could you elaborate a little bit on that? 

I can elaborate some on that. Okay. I know that when my mother, particularly when she spoke about Robert McGuire, whose daughter.

Was Jesse McGuire Dent having owned what she described as lots and lots of property near the seawall at about 26th to 28th Street, somewhere in there. He owned a bathhouse as she described it. I know that with his property and that of many other black people in Galveston there seems to have been in some case, descriptions of land that was sold, but where it's like you don't get a sense that it was willfully sold.

You don't necessarily have a record of someone literally blatantly, overtly stealing the land from people. But there's so many different ways that seem to have happened which is the reason why in that particular case, with her knowing about. Mr. Dent's property and her having been taught by his daughter, Jesse McGuire, dent La Latin when she was in high school, and Mrs.

Jesse McGuire Dent and her mother, having been such good friends at Mrs. Dent, was a bridesmaid and her grand and her parents, my grandparents' wedding, she knew about this personally and it was important to her, which is why she campaigned vigorously for the city council. To eventually name the recreation center, the McGuire Dent Recreation Center, as it is named today.

It had prior to that been just the Menard Park Recreation Center. And we know of course that Menard was the founder of Galveston, but he was also a slave owning. Founder of Galveston, even though this was land that, that park was named after, that was African American owned. And it was important more beyond that.

I don't know other specific stories,  but I do know that you know, historically across the south, not just Galveston rules that have been waived or bent for people, Other people for people of color have been well, no, you know, this was due, so sorry. You've lost this land. People have lost much land unfairly.

 It is of concern to me today that bla black land ownership in Galveston is less now than when I was growing up. There are many homes that you can drive by right now that I remember black families living in that are now short-term rentals owned by white people.

Many, 

Some way beyond the island. Yes. So it's not even community owned, which is, which would almost be, it's okay, well that would make sense, right? Yes. In the grand scheme, but it's yes. Now these people own management companies from. Thousands of miles away sometimes, 

And so the sense of neighborhood is gradually being eroded of people connecting to others and their neighbors. Because if most of your neighbors are just folks who are coming in on a weekend, et cetera it's a very different thing and of sense of ownership. And pride in that neighborhood.

So I'm not saying that in every case, black families have not just chosen to sell their property. Of course that happens as well. But I'm just saying that there are many instances where people would've held on if there had been a little leniency in things like exorbitant taxes and et cetera.

Especially when it is known that lenient is often extended. To people who are not of color in those same situations where, somehow people are looking other way while their property taxes are not being paid, et cetera. that lack of equity continues mm-hmm. To this day.

Mm-hmm. 

 If you had a room full of a hundred ex extremely diverse kids, let's say um, between 15 and 18, what is one thing that you want them when you're done speaking to them? What is one thing you  want them to leave the room with?

Well, if, If they were galvestonian kids, I would spec especially want them to know that they live in and come from a place of great importance. That. Therefore, they should be proud to be able to say, I'm from Galveston. I live in Galveston. Let me tell you about the wonderful things that people have done in this city, white and black, that they should know that if they are not from here, they still need to know because so much of Galveston's history is American history.

It is, It is American history. And so in order for 15 through 18 year olds across the country, especially when you consider that tho those 18 year olds will be able to vote they need to know what has happened here, what is happening as well. Not just a looking in the past, but a current look as well.

Because I think it would help their understanding of why are things like this now? Why do people act this way in, in various city, counties, state and national governments? Why is this, what is the background? What led up to this? And knowing those things I think would help those teenagers to Hopefully chart out a different course and not just repeat the mistakes of the history but rather to build on the successes and the innovations of history and to go, huh, they did that before.

Look what we can do. Look what we can take that idea and move it forward. But if they don't know, that's a lot harder to do. It's harder when you have to go figure things out for yourself rather than someone just openly sharing with you, the good and the bad and the ugly. Because 15 through 18 year olds would be able to hear and comprehend a lot of that.

Yeah, that was great. 

I can see why your entire family has been educators because that was basically the representative of what you just said. That's amazing. June, thank you so much for everything you've, we talked about today. I really appreciate you being here. Is there anything else you would like to talk about that we, I may have not asked you or haven't covered, or anything you wanna say?

Oh, the only thing that comes to my mind is that since my mother wrote the book, a lot of the time my dad gets left out Oh. Of being people asking. And there's a, a great legacy there as well. My father's folks who came to Galveston The, many of the women were seamstresses and many of the men were cigar makers.

Ooh. Which I've always thought is pretty interesting. And set up business here in Galveston. My his mother, Marguerite Collins. Of course I remember the best because most of the others unfortunately were gone by the time. My, my grandfather, Roy Collins Sr. Died when I was just four or five years old.

So I don't remember him as well. However, I can tell you, That he served in the army in World War I. He was a postal carrier here in Galveston until he passed. And my grandmother as a seamstress, made dresses for white and black people in Galveston. That's how good she was. She was known across the city.

And my dad, after getting his science degree did some pretty cool things too. He's very active in the community. A member of Holy Rosary Catholic Church, member of Alpha Fi Alpha fraternity. He was very in he was a army veteran himself, served in the Korean conflict and was commander of the, one of the American Legion posts here in town.

Worked for what was then called Texas Employment Commission. It's now Texas Workforce Commission was second in charge of that whole Facility here in Galveston. I just, I like to give my dad a shout out too. He was a great dad. 

Amazing lineage you have.

 So your family was here during the 1900 storm? Yes. Do you have any stories about that? Yes, let's hear it. 

The one that I know most clearly is the one that my grandmother, Viola, who's. Pictured here on the lower right. She was 12 and she lived in a house located at the same spot where this house was built, cuz that house was destroyed.

She says that when they looked out cuz their house, the house is just, a block away from where the seawall is now. She said they saw a gigantic. Wave coming. The way she describes it it reminds me of the um, it reminded me very much of a tsunami, the way she described it, cuz she said it was huge and they just started coming and so people started gathering things and she was able to gather very few things. You know, just basics. And some friend of theirs came by with a truck with an open bed on the back of it, and they just basically jumped on the trunk and with others who were fleeing and went to stay at the Galveston courthouse.

And that is how they survived. I Don't know of any members of my family who died in the storm, which is an amazing thing. When you consider that a minimum of 6,000 or more people were killed. My grand, my father's side, I don't have any specific stories, but I know they also, they had been here for 20 years too, so they 20 years and so they had also survived it.

My, one of my aunts on my grandmother's. On my mother's side Annie McCullough has been recorded and that's, this is something that's been, I think on NPR and a few other things. When my mother used to give interviews there's a recording of her telling the story. No tongue can tell it that. No tongue can tell it.

Yes. Oh my gosh. That was Annie McCullough, my aunt. And she has lots of stories that, that she tells about, what her experience was firsthand that were recorded and. All kinds of things that you can listen to.  

But one thing that strikes me about that oral history that she gave was that she's one, she, the one thing she says was, nobody wants to hear that. And everyone says yes. Talk about it. Talk about it. We need to hear 

these stories.

Many Galveston, longtime Galveston families will tell you that their parents didn't wanna talk about it. I imagine you've heard this before. They didn't wanna talk about it. It was like, we've gotta move on. And so she was, yes, she was reluctant. But my mother is the one who was recording her on a, a little cassette tape in the early 1970s, if I recall.

Cuz I think that's when my mother first was getting the seeds of an idea of maybe, but anyway, so she Yeah. She has all kinds of stories that she saw firsthand. Big body floating in the water and all kinds of stuff. 

 📍 June, thank you so much for joining me today. I really appreciate it.

We gotta get you outta here. Thank you for  📍 talking about your mother's book and you have an amazing lineage here on the island. 

Thanks for  📍 inviting me.  

I hope you enjoyed this episode with June Collins Pullium.

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