The Small Business Safari
From Hands-On Operator to Strategic Owner: Pete Mohr's Unforgettable Entrepreneurial Journey
What happens when you mix entrepreneurial wisdom with a splash of humor and a dash of personal anecdotes? You get an unforgettable conversation with Pete Moore, a seasoned Canadian entrepreneur who's seen it all. From investing in franchises without considering operating capital to mastering the art of delegating tasks and understanding team dynamics, Pete shares his journey with us. Ever wondered why tools like the Colby test aren't more mainstream despite its ability to predict a successful hire.
You'll not only learn the essentials of transitioning from a hands-on operator to a strategic business owner but also gain valuable tips on navigating the Five D's of Unplanned Business Exits: Death, Divorce, Disability, Disagreement, and Distress. Pete's candid reflections on starting and sustaining various ventures—like his bathtub refinishing and bathroom cleaning franchises—help open your mind to new ideas and get out of the details.
Pete doesn’t just stop at business strategies; he brings a personal touch with humorous stories about home renovation mishaps and unexpected discoveries behind walls, making this episode a delightful blend of practical advice and entertainment. Whether you're an aspiring entrepreneur or a seasoned business owner, you'll walk away with actionable insights on business valuation, exit planning, and even the significance of strategic delegation. So grab a glass of bourbon and join us for a conversation that's as insightful as it is enjoyable!
What happens when you mix entrepreneurial wisdom with a splash of humor and a dash of personal anecdotes? You get an unforgettable conversation with Pete Moore, a seasoned Canadian entrepreneur who's seen it all. From investing in franchises without considering operating capital to mastering the art of delegating tasks and understanding team dynamics, Pete shares his journey with us. Ever wondered why tools like the Colby test aren't more mainstream despite its ability to predict a successful hire.
You'll not only learn the essentials of transitioning from a hands-on operator to a strategic business owner but also gain valuable tips on navigating the Five D's of Unplanned Business Exits: Death, Divorce, Disability, Disagreement, and Distress. Pete's candid reflections on starting and sustaining various ventures—like his bathtub refinishing and bathroom cleaning franchises—help open your mind to new ideas and get out of the details.
Pete doesn’t just stop at business strategies; he brings a personal touch with humorous stories about home renovation mishaps and unexpected discoveries behind walls, making this episode a delightful blend of practical advice and entertainment. Whether you're an aspiring entrepreneur or a seasoned business owner, you'll walk away with actionable insights on business valuation, exit planning, and even the significance of strategic delegation. So grab a glass of bourbon and join us for a conversation that's as insightful as it is enjoyable!
why aren't more people talking about colby then? Well, and that's why, uh, one of the biggest reasons I I wanted pete to come on, and we we met through this uh great thing called pod match, and it helps people uh find that like tinder a podcast yeah, it is you swiped right or left.
Speaker 1:I, I swiped. Oh god, I'm so bad at that. I don't know, uh, but, but I swiped. That's a trick question. I'm glad you don't know. I swiped, yes, and then we had him on, because I really want to understand why don't more people know about Colby, and when should you?
Speaker 3:apply it. Well, a lot of people do know there's been over a million Colby tests.
Speaker 2:Pete just called us a dumbass in Canadian. Did you hear that?
Speaker 1:Actually, isn't that funny, yeah, even when they're calling you a dumbass. Canadians make it sound so nice. I feel good about being a dumbass, right? Yeah, unless you're playing hockey against them, it's a whole different game. But anytime else they're right. They're telling you a dumbass and just the nicest way. Welcome to the small business safari, where I help guide you to avoid those traps, pitfalls and dangers that lurk when navigating the wild world of small business ownership. I'll share those gold nuggets of information and invite guests to help accelerate your ascent to that mountaintop of success. It's a jungle out there and I want to help you traverse through the levels of owning your own business that can get you bogged down and distract you from hitting your own personal and professional goals. So strap in adventure team and let's take a ride through the safari and get you to the mountaintop alan, let's get ready to rock and roll.
Speaker 2:I always love that music, man. It just gets me so pumped. You're not tired of it. No, I mean, how many hundreds of episodes have we?
Speaker 1:done. We have done 183 episodes, alan 183 that's not. That's not as many as our guest? Probably not as many as our guests, but before we get there, you know, we always like to find out where I'm going.
Speaker 2:Oh God, that's right. Should I ask when are you going?
Speaker 1:Oh, I'm so glad you asked you guess. Naples no, one more. Mykonos no, I'm going to the US Open in Pinehurst. Number two you suck so bad.
Speaker 2:God, I hate you.
Speaker 1:Oh, baby doll going to the US Open on Saturday at Pinehurst, number two, going back to the cradle, going back. I've actually played the course before, probably just as well as these guys did. Yeah, what'd you shoot?
Speaker 2:I mean, I don't even want to play it, it's so hard. It was that hard.
Speaker 1:I have to say. You know he's got those, the domed greens, turtlebacks, and that's exactly what happened. So they're talking about it already, leading up to the tournament, that they dialed in the landing spot to be even smaller. I'm like I don't even know how you do that. No, because I was like I'm one hole, I was 60 yards out.
Speaker 2:I'm like I got this and then, after I took my second shot, I was 60 yards out yes, so I've never played number two, but I've been to pinehurst a number of times and there's so many other great courses around there. But every time we go, all the guys go to the resort, sit in the rocking chairs out there on 18 at number two with our gin and tonics and then we bet on the guys coming in.
Speaker 1:Yep that was probably actually my favorite part was drinking and playing the cradle. It's a little part three where you just right, but there's music going, it's pumping. You can stop at the beer trailer, you can stop with the bourbon trailer, you can do all that stuff. So, um, but you're right, I liked the other. Pine horse courses, uh, are much more approachable for somebody it sucks so bad.
Speaker 2:I'm saying I just got through probably telling you I'm gonna go play a goat track up in north georgia on father's day, right one of us is playing the muni and the other one's going to us open.
Speaker 1:But let's get going everybody, because how do you get to enjoy this? You get to enjoy this by becoming financially independent, which I'm not, or you get that because you sold your business, which I have not. But one of the things that we talk about on here all the time is, when you start a business, it's hard man, it's a grind, and when you start you're not thinking about leaving. But I'll bet our guest is going to have another idea on that one. He's got a pointer or two, I think he does. Pete Moore, welcome to the show. We can't wait to start kicking around talking about business, business exits, how to run businesses. Thanks for joining us, man.
Speaker 3:Thanks so much for having me. It's just a real pleasure to be here with you guys today and, you know, always excited to talk to some other business owners and we've got some commonalities and different things. I think it's going to be a fun conversation here today.
Speaker 2:Well, pete's already one of my favorites because he saw that we had a glass of bourbon and he's like hang on a second.
Speaker 3:Let me go put down my water, here we go, and we're all drinking bourbon.
Speaker 2:He's got his angels envy, so is that he's canadian? Right, he is canadian. We have a lot of canadian guests. We we have. So are they just better than us?
Speaker 3:because I mean statistically we're just an entrepreneurizing, entrepreneurializing bunch I agree with that.
Speaker 1:A lot of the franchise groups come out of there. We've had a lot of franchises come out of there business coaches, people in no business, um, and, and they're nice people, they're super nice people, right? Yep, yeah, they're never sorry all right go ahead, do one more, all right, well, yeah, out and about. Yeah, so the one thing I can say is.
Speaker 1:I went, uh, I went to school in houghton, michigan. I'm proud to say I went to school where north of most canadians live uh, because it is in the upper peninsula of michigan and most everybody else lives where it's warmer. But there's a reason I'm in Atlanta now because I got colded right there. We're out of there.
Speaker 2:Canadians are smart, they live in Canada, but as far south in Canada as they can.
Speaker 1:Smart, yeah, nice places. So, pete, welcome to the show. One of the things we talked about before we got started is that we do have a lot of commonalities me being a remodeler and a handyman, uh, and have scaled it up size, and then alan being a commercial real estate. You're like, well, guys, I did both of those. You're like, oh, okay, so do tell why it's a little bit back, more about your whole background and then we'll start talking about business and just business.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah and business, so we'll exit and we're next to the business he might give you a pointer or two.
Speaker 3:I need some, I'm ready yeah, you know, um, I've been in business all my life, guys. Basically, long, long story short. Uh, after university, finished university and took a business degree and I went to work for, uh, my dad's best friend whose name was peter, who I was named after, and, um, basically I worked for him for about six months and he said you know, peter, and he said I think you're meant to be on your own doing your own thing. And I said I agree, I love Peter, he's a great guy and uh, and I liked his business too.
Speaker 3:Yeah, exactly, you know, and and I loved his business he was a heavy commercial landscaping stuff and gabion baskets and all sorts of different pipes and tile and all sorts of stuff. I came, my family has always been involved in heavy construction and stuff like that, so I've got some background there. So I just liked that business. But I realized at an early age and I was 23, I realized at an early age that, you know, I just wanted to do my own thing. So you talked about franchises.
Speaker 3:I bought a franchise, I had 10,000 bucks and at the time that's what I could afford, that's what I had in my, you know, saved after university. I paid for my university because I worked all through university. It was paid and I had 10,000 bucks extra. And back then we used to flip. This is 1994. We used to flip through Entrepreneur Magazine like every month, what's new, what's happening, you know, see what the franchises were, see what was new and all this stuff. And I found this one called Surface Doctor and Surface Doctor was a company that was based in Atlanta. So I, actually Joe Lunsford, owned four franchises based in Atlanta Furniture, Medic, Professional Carpet Systems, Surface Doctor and Floor Coverings International at the time Holy crap.
Speaker 1:Yeah, floor Coverings International is still going here in North Cross and literally less than 10 miles from our house. Yeah, we drive by it all the time now.
Speaker 3:Yeah, they're on Old Dixie Road. At the time I don't know where they are now.
Speaker 2:So you stuck all your 10 grand into this business did you think about having, like, any operating capital left over, or were you?
Speaker 3:no, no man, I didn't think about that, I'm 23 yes, I'm 23, damn the torpedoes.
Speaker 1:So we'll make it work. Yeah, that is such optimism picture for so many people listening to this if you're thinking about starting a business. We didn't have these things like podcasts and TV. You know we didn't have. We didn't have TV, we didn't have microwaves. This is only 94. It wasn't that bad so, but we didn't have all the stuff you have available to you on your fingertips and the internet. So he's talking about the franchise magazine.
Speaker 3:I used to buy the entrepreneur magazine cover to cover in the same time frame. That's the only way you can find out what's going on, right, yeah, yeah, so all right. So you picked which one? I picked surface doctor. So, and with that business, we refinished bathtubs, we refinished tile, we changed green um avocado green bathtubs to white.
Speaker 3:We uh you know, like I ended up getting into bathtub liners and wall systems outside of the franchise in a later date, but I had that business. Ultimately, I learned a lot about franchising in those first five years because the franchisor sold that franchise about two years after I bought it to another franchisor. He had it for about a year, sold it to another one about a year, sold it to another one and upon the third franchise or I ended up defranchising the business and going on my own and paying, paying it out and doing the. You know I did it properly, legally and all that sort of stuff and but I just decided at that time that you know I wasn't going to go through another change of ownership, all the different stuff and and they weren't really doing a ton for me at the time anyway. So I just went on my own and did my own thing and I was saying to you guys, before we came live here, I just had a call from the gentleman that bought it from me back in 2009. So I ran it for 14 years, 15 years, and then he just called me and he said, hey, I bought the business from you 15 years ago and it's turning 30 here in August. So it's like amazing how time flies but the business is still doing well. It's still a multi-truck operation.
Speaker 3:I started myself, went out and did the spraying, did all that sort of stuff, had one truck and then got off half day of a truck, started another guy just like you would think anybody kind of starting off their business. Right, I was selling, I was spraying, I was doing all the stuff and we built it up to a multi-truck operation and it was really well and still doing well today. And at the same time I ended up buying another franchise. So I had two franchises at the same time and that franchise was called Sani Service, which in the States was called Swisher, and we cleaned and sanitized bathrooms and we looked after air fresheners and paper products and hand soaps and all sorts of different things for restaurants and retail and a variety of different things.
Speaker 3:And the franchisee in my town I was living in Ottawa at the time, our nation's capital and the franchisee at the time was really suffering. He had 30 clients and wasn't making a go. So we took it over and we built it to 300 clients and then we sold it as well. So we've had a couple of businesses that we either started or bought and then built and sold. I ended up going back to school, take my executive MBA in 2007. And the goal was to be out of both of those businesses by 2009, which I was and then I ended up becoming a business broker helping people buy and sell businesses, which is where I found the business that I still have 14 years ago that we bought in 2010., and it's called Shoe-topia, and we have a couple of shoe stores that we're still operating, owning and operating as ongoing entities, but I spend most of my time coaching other business owners these days with simplifying entrepreneurship.
Speaker 1:And then let's talk about that who would you rather be coached by? Tom Brady, bill Belichick, people who've done it or somebody who's never done it?
Speaker 2:but they got a piece of paper that says I know how to coach yeah, I'm a certified coach, but last week I was a financial planner.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'm a certified coach, but last week I was an accountant at SunTrust Bank.
Speaker 3:Well, I mean, I am a certified coach, but I'm still running businesses and I always have.
Speaker 2:So I got a question for you. Well, two of them. First of all, you had the one franchise and then you kind of sounds like you quickly bought a second one. Is it because you saw an opportunity to have multiple revenue streams with the same customer base?
Speaker 3:No different customer base entirely different, oh it was.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah. So one was the bathroom remodeling company with the bathtub liners and all that. We worked mostly for apartment owners, so the big landlords in town. We did do homeowners too, but our main business was recurring revenue with apartment owners. So they'd send us back in the days, they'd send us a fax and I'd get a page saying we've got six bathtubs for you, you know, building number one, and four bathtubs for you, building number two, this month, and we, you know, call them back and schedule it out.
Speaker 3:This is really before even email, right. So you know, we did all that sort of stuff. And then of course that's progressed, like everything else since then, but that's kind of how it worked. So I was selling to property managers on that side. On the other side we were selling to mostly to restauranteurs, to retail store owners, to a variety of those kinds of places, because their bathrooms were never really looked after very well. And you know, I think most people can associate the fact with if you walk into a filthy, disgusting bathroom at your local restaurant, you kind of think the kitchen's the same, that's a good point.
Speaker 3:Yeah, so our goal was to make sure that the bathroom smelled good, looked good, were sanitized, fully stocked and looked after, so that because they weren't doing a good enough job and good owners recognize that so we would go into their spot once a week and take care of all that, while their own team looked after it from day to day, but at least once a week it was really getting fully serviced and sanitized and then stocked up to make sure that everything was looked after, all the dispensing equipment was working, all that sort of stuff. So it was sort of a behind the scenes business, but at the same time we had 300 clients, so it was a needed service.
Speaker 2:Okay, well, that created another question, so I still have one in reserve. All right, go so you buy the second business. Why do that? Rather than just spending? I mean, you've got a certain amount of time, certain amount of resources. You can focus on the one that you have and scale it up, but in this case you decided to divide your attention. Attention, and it wasn't for the same target customer.
Speaker 3:No, it wasn't. And you know I like to diversify. I'm also a little bit scatterbrained at times and like to have different things on the go at different times, and so, from a variety of aspects, I was looking for something a little bit different. After running that other business for a while, I had a good management team. You know, what I coached to really is moving from operator to owner, which I'm sure you've heard that sort of terminology before, but I I do that. So I set my business up so that I have other people running it, and then I get bored.
Speaker 2:So maybe that answers. Maybe that answers the original second question I had before I asked my second question. But most of the entrepreneurs that we talked to I mean exit strategy is a recurring theme, but when you talk to most entrepreneurs they really weren't thinking about that when they got in and yet in the first few minutes you already talked about yeah, my plan was to get out of this one and get out of this one, oh yeah, why was that so top of mind for you early on to know that you wanted to get out?
Speaker 3:Yeah, Well, I think as an exit planner, somebody that helps people get their business ready for sale yeah, everybody and everybody will exit their business one day. That's a given. So, in my opinion, exit planning is just good business strategy. So you need to have your business running on rails, not only for the fact that it's going to be more value when you go to sell it, but also to enjoy some of the freedoms that it offers you as the business owner. So if you end up having to make every decision in your business every day, you have to open the door, you have to close the door. You have to make every sale. You have to spray every tub in that case, or clean every toilet with our other business, or sell every pair of shoes with the business that we've had for the last 14 years. You can go work for somebody and not have the headaches, stress and financial commitment. So why are you a business owner?
Speaker 1:Does that hurt, chris? It does a little bit, because I'm still doing it all. The question I've got for you following up on that were you thinking of the idea that you'd have one, sell one and you'd always so? I had the two businesses. I was always thinking about actively exiting one of them.
Speaker 3:I was always thinking about actively exiting one of them? Not really, because I held the one for 15 and held the other for 10. So we wanted to build and grow them, and we did, and even the ones that I have, the shoe store. I bought one shoe store, we opened another one, we opened a third one, we closed the second one, which didn't go well, because we've had some failures too. I mean, we've been in business 30 years, so not everything is peachy.
Speaker 2:What.
Speaker 3:That's impossible. No, imagine, that's been for me, right, yeah, imagine. Oh my God, I've had some learnings.
Speaker 1:The sarcasm, just like dripped through the microphone when I say that. But yeah, yeah, I think people listening to this and I've talked to a number of them over the years and actually in the last two months I've had another guy come into our office to tour and see how we scaled our handyman business. Nice, nice, we talked about this and that is staying singularly focused and be able to grow your business. But you said I'm going to try different industries and I think sometimes for a lot of people that's a shiny object. I'm excited about it. Tell me the disciplines you had to have to be able to execute that.
Speaker 3:So you know, there's so many little catchphrases that I use on different podcasts and different things that we talk about, but a couple of them are like this One is I've had to move from detail to dashboard right.
Speaker 2:I've had to move from detail to dashboard. That could be the podcast title.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and and I mean I think the reality of it is is I can't be in the details all the time. I can't. I couldn't continue to grow anything. I couldn't continue to coach business owners and take on new clients. I mean, this morning I booked a job, another half day session for a Cole. I'm also cold Colby certified with Colby system and so I booked a half day session with an executive team. But if I had to open my store that morning, how would I go two hours away and work with an executive team for the day?
Speaker 3:Like there, there are different things that you just work your way out of some of the detail as you move from those different levels on the accountability chart to the owner's box, right. And when you're in the owner's box, the idea really, as you try to work through that, is that you're really working in your love-it zone. So when you're working in your love-it zone you're adding even more to your business than maybe doing some of the detail. Because a lot of the times, at least with people like me who like change and are change agents, doing sort of the stuff that's regular routine-y type stuff bores the heck out of us. But if we hire the right people. They love that.
Speaker 3:It's like I just want to do like my bookkeeper. I'll use my bookkeeper as an example. I have two business degrees I have an MBA and I have an undergraduate in business and I understand numbers really well and that's part of what I need to do with exit planning. But I don't want to balance the visa. When my bookkeeper balances the visa, she woo-hoos and if I had to balance the visa, I haven't balanced a business visa in 15 years probably and it's like that's painful work for me. I don't want to do it so.
Speaker 2:I hire somebody who loves to do it but turns on an accountant.
Speaker 1:Well, I know you're married to one, so you've seen it. And there you go. So you big stud turn on an accountant.
Speaker 2:I know how to talk dirty dude. And it isn't what you think.
Speaker 1:Let's balance those things, baby, what? Yeah, but I uh you're in that calculator.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's right, you do math so good, I love the way you punch those keys, baby.
Speaker 1:Oh, dirty accountant talk. Now that's music right there. Man, that should that should be a franchise, what? No, okay, but pete. But Pete, you, you had done a lot of things that. That happened to me A lot of times as an entrepreneur. We don't have the flexibility to be able to see outside of it and you had to move from operator to owner and you guys start and I always tell people and I want to see what you think about it. You said work in your love at zone. I say find the stuff you hate working on and hire somebody to do that, because you said I do not.
Speaker 1:Woohoo, when my books were a complete shambles two years ago, I I woohoo, I threw, I was throwing shit all over my hood, I boohooed and I let everybody have. Is there? What's the analogy for the damn it doll that I have in my office? Because they were, it was getting flung everywhere, because it was, it was a mess. But to point, you've got to know where to lay off and let somebody else play into your. You play your strengths, let them play to theirs.
Speaker 1:And you know, we were just talking with the guy who came into our office. Yeah, I said nobody sells your business better than you do. I said so in the beginning. I would say, if you like sales, stay in it. If you like, oh, I can't stand it. I said then find a really good sales guy. But, uh, you got to find it and so he's like you're right. So he's actually out looking for somebody who's going to be his csr first touch superstar in the office, who's going to do the bookkeeping and the scheduling, because he can't stand that. He wants to be doing what we love doing.
Speaker 2:Now you're talking is a love it zone your term, or is that a Colby thing? No, it's mine.
Speaker 3:So I put my it'll steal it by the way. Yeah, go, I mean already, already stolen.
Speaker 1:Yeah, One of my next book international boundaries, you know, nothing applies. That's what I figured. I mean, I mean you can't come after me. I mean, so I got from. But you know, actually I call it my love at home, that's right by Chris Lalamia, by your love, it's so big, chris with credit to Pete Moore.
Speaker 1:All right, so, pete it's. We've been talking about this Colby stuff so I was going to hold. We got to get into it. So I'm a disc guy. I've had everybody in my company been profiled by disc. I use it one way, but I'd be interested in what you think Colby Enneagram disc. Talk to us a little bit about. I'm thinking about doing this. Which one should I use and why should I use it?
Speaker 3:Well, there's three parts of the mind. There's thinking, feeling and doing. And the thinking side of things, the cognitive side of things, is how smart are you and what have you learned? So there's IQ tests out there and you know, if you were, if you were to be a bookkeeper, let's say, and you're hiring for bookkeeper and you put that bookkeeper through a test to see what their basic skills were. That's the thinking part of the mind. You know, um. The feeling part of the mind is disc, is Enneagram, is um, mbti is all those ones that ask you questions around emotional intelligence which do you prefer? Do you prefer to work this way or that way? Do you prefer to do things this way or that way? So it's all about sort of preferences and things like that.
Speaker 3:Colby is uniquely different in that it tells you how you take action and that's why I like it as a business owner and I coach business owners. So, from that perspective, disc again is how you, if you look at their assessment, they're going to ask you what do you prefer? Do you prefer this or do you prefer that? It's thinking, it's preference-based. So you can't hire to that legally these days, right, but you can still hire legally to Colby, because Colby has nothing to do with your preferences. It's how you take action legally to Colby, because Colby has nothing to do with your preferences. It's how you take action and so we can put people into a right fit system and you can set up hiring procedures around and put them through the Colby A, b and C tests and work through those assessments in order to better hire, in order to better align your team, in order to better communicate, in order to better understand how you work together as a team to get stuff done. Because it's all around how you take action. Why aren't more?
Speaker 1:people talking about colby, then well, and that's why, uh, one of the biggest reasons I I wanted pete to come on and we we met through this uh great thing called pod match, and it helps people uh find that like tinder a podcast it sounds. Yeah, it is you swiped right or left I?
Speaker 1:I swiped. Oh God, I'm so bad at that. I don't know, but I swiped yes, that's a trick question. I'm glad you don't know. I swiped, yes, and then we had him on, because I really want to understand why don't more people know about Colby and when should you apply it?
Speaker 2:Well, a lot of people do know like there's been over a million colby tests. Uh, so we're just pete, just called us a dumbass and canadian. Did you hear that actually?
Speaker 1:isn't that funny. Yeah, even even when they're calling you a dumbass, canadians make it sound so nice I feel, good about being a dumbass, right? Yeah, unless you're playing hockey against them, it's a whole different game. But anytime else they're right. They're telling you a dumbass and just the nicest way. So all all right, you know, dumbass I mean.
Speaker 3:I'm not. I like all of those other tests. I've taken them all and I know them all and I understand them and I still use them. And I think you should use, like all I talked about, three parts of the mind thinking, feeling and doing. I think you should use all three of them with your team, right? I don't? I don't think you need to use just one. You need to know the thinking side of things, you need to know the feeling side of things and you need to know the action, the doing side of things, which is Colby. So I think they all work really well together and I love them all.
Speaker 3:I'm not certified in any of the other ones. My second favorite is Strength Finders. I love Strength Finders, but I've taken Enneagram, I've taken DISC, I've taken most of them out there because I'm a bit of an assessment junkie. But ultimately I hang the hat with Colby because I really like the idea. It's like if I'm working with other people and I put all of my clients through Colby before we even start working, so that I know how to communicate with them properly.
Speaker 3:And the idea here is that because I communicate in a certain way and because I act in a certain way I often will assume, make an ass of you out of me. You know that word that you do the things in the same way that I do. Well, that's where things start to fall apart. That's where procrastination happens, that's where a lot of these other issues that we have in team-based environment happen happens. That's where a lot of these other issues that we have in team-based environment happen. So, if I know that you like more information and I'm a person that basically wants the executive summary, I'm giving you an executive summary and asking you to make a decision on it and you're saying I can't make a decision on an executive summary. I need all the information and we're wondering as a team why we're not working well together.
Speaker 2:So when you say how somebody takes action, it's what they need before they take action.
Speaker 3:It's the process and how they take action. Some people need information upfront. Some people are good just off the bat, Like some people um have to put it into a system. Other people will modify the system. Other people want to create a model. Other people need a graph, Other people need the lists and some people just freaking, go Right.
Speaker 2:That's Chris, thank you.
Speaker 3:I'm just a goer right. It's like I I'm a, I'm a nine in what they call quick start, which is change agent, and it's like I can whiteboard stuff in two seconds and come up with ideas and change things and all that stuff. No problem.
Speaker 2:So proud of yourself, you would also run into the machine gun nest whereas I'm going to go around it.
Speaker 1:No, I'm going right through it, man, and I'm taking bullets. Go, you can't get me. I'm bulletproof. It's funny. What's funny is that, right before we get to this podcast, I'm screaming out of the office and I had gone through three whiteboards. I mean, filled it up, erased it. I told everybody take pictures of it. All right, I gotta go.
Speaker 3:we need more whiteboards and we can scare the heck out of our team who aren't like us if we do that yeah, amen to that, but they knew it was coming and
Speaker 3:so yeah, they know because they worked with you and stuff like that. But but at the same time it doesn't mean that it's any better. And so these are the things like if we know each other's mo is their modus operandi, how they take action, and they know, we know kind of the process in which they take action as leaders of our business and as leaders of your organization, that for any of you listeners out there it's like it would be nice to that and so that they know that about you so you can reduce frustration and get shit done.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no, that's a great point. Uh, we joked about the way I did it, but, uh, we, we lay the ground rules because we we've used the disc profile to talk about. Look, this is the way I'm going to roll. Um, this is the way you're going to roll, and I know that you over here are going to not like what I just said. I know you here are going to take it. I know you here are going to champion it, and I said so. You just got to realize. You know I'm trying to adapt to all of your styles, but I'm going to have all 10 of you guys in here at the same time.
Speaker 2:The problem I have with disc is I know you're not as good as me and I have a problem with that well, I uh, I uh yeah, pete. What say you?
Speaker 3:hey, pete, I'm staying out of this one man, I'm a disc hey, whose podcast is this?
Speaker 2:anyway, you know what I got. Michael cut that out no, you got you.
Speaker 1:You know what youtube check this out. Yeah, anyway, that's not the number one.
Speaker 2:You know, oh my god, a day without getting flipped off by chris is like a day without sunshine. It is really I mean it does happen.
Speaker 1:No, I mean, I again, uh, we, we talk about. That's one of the things and I would I agree with pete. I'm gonna look up Colby a little bit more and understand it, but we do talk about the disk profile a lot, not only in how we communicate with our teammates, but in sales and in project management and customer-facing roles in what we do in remodeling. You have got to figure out who you're talking to, because the odds are, 75% of the people you're talking to aren't like you, right, because there's only four quadrants and we and yours is the best. Of course it is, but I know that. See that that's the thing. When I, when I come here, alan, I realize I've got to. I got to bring it down a little bit so I can let you talk. If it was why I have to ask a few questions thank you.
Speaker 2:Thank you for letting me into your world, chris. Well, now I'm letting you in a little bit.
Speaker 1:You know what, after I colby you, you're gonna be in big shit because I'm gonna have another one that you never even heard of. So all right, pete, we got to talk about there. You have a couple other. You said some great nuggets, so far right, obviously we need to talk as a strategy. Let's talk. All right, I'm in my biz, I'm getting started or I've been at it for a couple of years like, say, I don't know 16. What would you tell people what to start on? Where do they start working? Where should they start shifting their focus?
Speaker 3:it's different for every single person.
Speaker 2:And I'll give you an example.
Speaker 3:Um, I talk with somebody today. She owns a pet store, has been at it 25 years, um, and is looking to exit her business by. She actually has a date, Um, I think it was September 26. So she's about two years away. Oh, that's a super specific date.
Speaker 3:Yeah Well, that's when her lease ends. Oh, okay, so she's like I want to be out before the end of the lease because I don't want to sign another five-year lease. So it's given her a target, right, which is great, and two years is a decent amount of time, because for people that are looking to exit their business, if you want to exit your business and obtain sort of maximum value for your business, you're probably going to need between two and five years to get it ready. If you haven't started, if you're just running your business and haven't really looked at any exit strategies or understand that kind of stuff, you're probably going to need two to five years.
Speaker 3:One of them is to clean up your books and get them ready for exit so that they're clear and understandable by a potential new owner. One of them is to clean up your process. Do you even have any process or is it in your head? We need to get the stuff out of your head onto paper, onto video, into a shareable, understandable, recurring, executable way of doing business without you. These things take time and if you haven't started, when should you start? Probably today, and you start learning about some of these things and you start working on this stuff because the idea of being exit ready, like I said off the bat, is that it's just good business strategy to be exit ready. Because here's the thing about 50% of businesses that business owners exit their business not because they want to, but because they have to Right.
Speaker 1:It's forced upon you A lot of the times. Entrepreneurship is forced upon you. Maybe you've been downsized in a company. Entrepreneurship is forced upon you. You know, you, you, maybe you've been downsized in a company, maybe you've been told you're no longer, uh, employable by them. I get it, but, um, I think that that's what I've heard and that's why you, you answered the question the way I was hoping that I would expect that and that is so.
Speaker 2:I got a quiz for you and I don't know the answers. But in pete's notes there's the five d's of unplanned business exit. Yeah, I got one.
Speaker 1:What Death.
Speaker 2:Okay, right, divorce Two Dismemberment Whoa, I'm liking where this is going.
Speaker 1:Divestiture of all your funds. We can reclassify ourselves as True Crimes Podcast. We're going to hit the stratosphere.
Speaker 3:Only for entrepreneurs entrepreneurial crimes yeah, death divorce.
Speaker 1:I don't think it's this, I don't know. All right, we got two. What are the other three?
Speaker 3:uh, you got uh disability, because that happens I mean you get in a car accident. I'm right, oh and, or you know, so you have death, you have divorce, you have disability, you have disagreement, which is partnership uh, partnerships, okay, be brutal and you have distress, which is financial. Distress, like covid, has caused a lot of people to exit their business because they couldn't hold on. They were already teetering and they teetered too far.
Speaker 2:So distress can be in a variety of different ways, but a lot, of, a lot, a lot of times it's got to do with financial distress, whether but if you've worked with heat beforehand and you've got your plan and your systems in place and all that, then you can withstand one of the d's, except for maybe, the death one I think I don't, I don't know how you know actually.
Speaker 1:Uh, you can overcome that.
Speaker 3:One right, pete it's if you have things laid out properly and you have, like the, the plan to what happens when I pass, or if I pass. Here's, who should make the here. Here's who is capable of writing the checks here can make the calls here's. Here's a business broker that can sell the business. He already knows what we're about all those different things. Or maybe it's handing off to family members and that's already set up and in place. I mean the variety of different things that can happen.
Speaker 3:But the idea is that you should have contingencies for these different things, because I talked to a business banker earlier today.
Speaker 3:We had lunch and she was saying how one of her clients, um, got cancer and passed away in three months.
Speaker 3:Like literally was healthy, 52 years old three months later, debt and, um, the business wasn't really ready for exit. Because the person's like I'm not ready to, I'm, I'm running this thing, I feel good, I'm running it, you know, and they weren't ready. And like, from our side of things, even if I put my business broker hat on which I'm not anymore, but I used to be um, like it's very hard to sell a business that doesn't have process, like that's outlined and clear, that doesn't have accountability in place that maybe doesn't even have an organizational chart, which is a lot of small businesses out there that don't actually have an organizational chart to show who's in charge and you know. If the organizational chart is completely flat, you got 14 people and and there's 13 under you. That's not so good, because if you want to sell that business, that means the new owner has to look after those 13 people, and if they aren't in your industry already, they don't know what to do.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think a lot of people. That's a big one, cause actually, alan, you said it well, you can't overcome death. Well, they can, and it doesn't have to be as crazy as getting a lawyer and it's not as complicated as you think. You start with small little baby steps and get yourself into it and you'll find that the pieces start to fall together. And that's what Pete was saying, that I, that I wanted everybody to hear, is that exit planning doesn't have to be this holistic. I have to go away, smoke some ayahuasca, sleep in the mountains, take seven weeks go to a sweat lodge?
Speaker 1:No, it's. It's little things and little things that will make sure that you're ongoing. You know I don't have to do this anymore, but it's documented, or? Um, we actually one of the guys that came in to our office came in and talked about a new platform called notion for us to put our operation manual on. And actually we've embraced it already and said, oh man, we're already on our way doing it.
Speaker 2:So we have the operating manual. Pete it already and said oh man, we're already on our way doing it. So we have the operating manual. You hear.
Speaker 3:Pete. He kind of approves. I mean, he kind of looks down on it a little bit Notion's good, notion's good, I mean it doesn't. I'm sort of tool agnostic. We use Trello, we use G drive, we use 90.io, we use a lot of different technologies to do different things. But I'm totally familiar with that and I think the idea is you've got to use the technology that's going to work for you and your team.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so we're testing it out, but so far my general manager has gone gaga with it literally over just a week and a half, by the way the general manager thing is a new thing for Chris.
Speaker 2:How's that Nice? How's that? We're going to put you on the spot in the air. We're in 15 galaxies now, and so everybody's going to know.
Speaker 1:Everybody's going. I've done this, so we are. We have Pete on because, yes, I am working on an exit strategy. I'm I'm three years into my five year plan and one of those was to put a general manager in place on my biggest unit, which is Atlanta, to run the remodeling and the handyman division here. I'm still going to have Athens and I'm still going to have the Home Service Institute, but, yeah, it's been going really well. He it was a good hire because he is not me. You know, you always want to hire for people who are smarter than you and do things that you don't.
Speaker 2:He loves the details it's pretty low barrier entry, don't you think the smart thing you know okay, remember, I'm a high d.
Speaker 1:Oh, that's right. All right, did I mention I can take over the work? I'm kidding, no, it's, it's true. Though yeah, I know he's doing a great job and it has gone well. I've allowed him, uh, some freedom and some flexibility, and I've also, uh, we're working on a working relationship that's working out pretty well, and we've already had our first hey, man, don't do that, you gotta do this. And he went, okay, got it. I'm like, oh, that was easy yeah, has he.
Speaker 2:Has he set you straight yet?
Speaker 1:oh, yeah, yeah, I said hey, uh, when you come in, you're allowed to ask me dumb questions. And, and he does, I said but I'm also allowed to go. That last question pissed me off. I'll have to get back to you on that and that's. That's what happened. But no, I said. I said you're allowed to ask me dumb questions. And you know why do we do it like this? I said you're here to make sure that we run better and more efficiently than we do today. And he's doing it. Challenge the status quo. Yeah, in fact, one of the things is they keep turning my lights off in my office. When I go, like out to go to the bathroom or I go take a phone call and walk around the building, I'll come back. My lights will be off. And yeah, that one pissed me off. But they're trying to save pennies. I love it. They're trying to save me money. Put emotion sensor in there. Does that cost money? All right, back to Pete. All right Back to Pete, can we please?
Speaker 2:Yeah, pete, do you uh clients all over the world, just Canada? Or can everybody have access Most?
Speaker 3:of my clients are in the States actually.
Speaker 2:Really.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and you know, um, I I only in North America at this current time. Um, I do have clients in Canada, but, uh, probably 70% of my clients are in the States and I do a fair bit of speaking at conferences and I run group sessions for different associations Like one of the associations that I work for is the National Shoe Retailers Association and I run next generation groups and conferences around transferring their businesses to the next generation, and so we talk about, you know, the kids side of things, the adult, you know the parent side of things and how the transfer of accountability goes and how the transfer of ownership goes, because it's two different things. A lot of times parents transfer accountability way before they actually transfer ownership and sometimes the kids are in the business 30 years and they still don't own anything, but they they're basically running it and have for many years. So it there's a lot of intricacy in family business and so I do some of that as part of exit planning as well and helping families through that sort of stuff.
Speaker 3:So whether you're looking to exit and there's, like I said, even understanding your exit opportunities is part of the exit planning structure and understanding what that looks like for you and your situation and what you need and to understand what the wealth gap is. Is the business the biggest part of the wealth gap that you need to make up to retire successfully? And, if it is, what's the valuation of the business? Because a lot of people you know their buddy at the golf course said, hey, your business should be worth two million bucks, but in reality it's worth five70. Um, yeah, that's a bit of a gap. And if I'm planning on 2 million bucks and I think that's going to be good and I really don't know and I really haven't had it valued, then that's a problem, because if you're expecting 2 million and you need 2 million, we need some time to get it to 2 million.
Speaker 1:Right, no, I think, uh, you're funny when you said your buddy at your golf course, because it's also the hey I sold in business, oh how much. Oh, I was like a seven multiple, you know, and that's like, yeah, you're swinging. I'm like okay, good for you. But these are all vanity numbers.
Speaker 3:They're real numbers, Seven multiple on what you know, yeah exactly right.
Speaker 1:So one of the things you said, so one of your specialties is working with families and family transfers. That's got to be some interesting dynamics where your specialty really hits.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and I think you know Colby overlays in that too, and it's like understand, because just because you're in the same family doesn't mean you have the same way of taking action Interesting, Right. So because it's not learned. Colby is not a learned thing, it's who you are, it's innate. And you know, um kathy colby developed the colby system 50 years ago. She's in her 80s now and they've been doing colby's for 50 years and people who take them 50 years later it's the same colby, like it's the same. It's not what you've learned, it's it's you are who you are. She works with a ton of kids, works with a ton of you, works with a ton of you know. There's all sorts of kids programs in Colby and understanding yourself so that you can pick the right occupation down the road.
Speaker 3:There's marital stuff, there's all I mean I I'm on the business side, but there's all kinds of stuff around Colby and the idea here is is it doesn't really matter.
Speaker 3:You really don't change over over your life and what you've learned and what you've seen and what you've heard and all this stuff.
Speaker 3:It doesn't change who you are and how you take, how you make action and how you take action.
Speaker 3:So from that perspective, it's really an interesting thing. So when we start looking at that and overlaying that, so a lot of parents in their, in their business expects their you know, expect their son or daughter to do what they did they may not be the same type of operator and, quite honestly, you should embrace that and they can hire around other things as they take over the business. And we hire other professionals that are good at what they're doing, like we've already talked about on this podcast, and for some reason, it seems that a lot of family businesses don't accept that as well as corporations or whatever the case is. But when you start looking at that with factual sort of numbers and you can take something like a Colby and put numbers to it and say, oh, this makes sense now and we have a dashboard to look at and we can make decisions based on that instead of gut feel, then it makes sense to make some of the decisions that we need to make in the transfer of this business, not only in accountability but in ownership.
Speaker 1:Nice. Oh my gosh, this stuff has been awesome. I'm digging it in, I'm drinking it all in. You got a lot of notes there, buddy, I do have a lot of notes, but, man, we're coming to the end of our time. So, Pete, how can everybody get ahold of you? We'll put all this stuff in the show notes.
Speaker 3:If you want to talk about whether we're a right fit for coaching, just go to speak to Petecom. Speak to Petecom. You can book an appointment with me and we'll have a chat for half an hour and go through kind of all the things that I do. And if we're a right fit, that's great. You can go to my website at simplifying entrepreneurshipcom, which is the name of my business, and there's all sorts of free downloads. There's a download page there for different tools and different things and my podcast is there. So if you want to learn more, head on over to simplifying entrepreneurshipcom and there's lots of there.
Speaker 1:Awesome man, that's been great. Speak to Pete, I love it. I mean, come on, that sounds like a slogan. Hey, do you want to come here and uh in the States and maybe run for president? Speak.
Speaker 3:Yeah, well, we have issues too.
Speaker 1:I love it it. Yeah, we can't get into politics. Let's keep going, shall we all? Right, pete? We gotta ask our famous four questions what is a book you would recommend to our audience?
Speaker 3:so the one I'm recommending, based on our conversation today, is called walking with destiny, which is by christopher snyder. He's the founder of the exit planning institute, and so that's where I've got my certification. But you can see I've tabbed it just a little bit, yeah.
Speaker 1:That thing's so well used. My friend is Christopher Snyder. It's a great book.
Speaker 3:So if you want to sort of better understand exit planning what you need to do to get your business ready because exit planning is just good business strategy planning Read Christopher Snyder's book Walking to Destiny. Good business strategy planning Read Christopher Snyder's book Walking to Destiny. It's not that long. You'll get through it in a couple of sit-downs and it's really good.
Speaker 1:Does it have a lot of pictures and coloring? No, I'm just kidding, it has some graphs but not a lot of pictures.
Speaker 3:It's a business book, man.
Speaker 2:I do have a question outside of this, just kind of on this topic, outside of our famous four. Somebody wants to get a business valuation. Where do they go? What's the reliable source?
Speaker 3:Well, go to an exit planner. They will be able to put you in touch with someone. Or, if they don't do it themselves, they will be able to put you in touch with someone who will provide you with a business valuation. There's a variety of different ways to get a business valuation. There's a variety of different ways to get a business valuation. There's business valuations that are more formal than others. There are ones that business brokers will do for you, which is basically giving you what they call a most probable selling price, which may not stack up against insurance and all that kind of stuff, but will really give you a good market value of what your business is worth. So there's different ways to value a business as well. So I mean that's part of learning about exit planning.
Speaker 3:But essentially, if you go to the exit planning Institute, there's a variety of people like me who are certified SEPAs that a SEPA is a certified exit planning associate and, um, you know whether you're a financial planner, a lawyer, an accountant or any of us can have, or a business coach can have, sipa designations. But if we aren't doing valuations ourselves, then we'll certainly know somebody that we can put you in touch that is going to give you an evaluation, because that's where it all starts. You know, it really starts with this what's my business worth? And when I have that, can I actually make sense of whether this sounds right to me? Is it going to fit to my financial plans? And if it doesn't fit to my financial plans, then what do I need to do to instigate change in order to get it to where we need it to be, so that I can exit and create a legacy for myself and for my family, which is one of the reasons why a lot of people get into business, right, I know what you're thinking.
Speaker 2:Chris Dang Alan, that was a good question.
Speaker 1:Dang Alan, that was a good question, dang alan, that was a good question. Yeah, and I know actually I was thinking it's like how do I legacy now everybody? I? I was down in the weeds, I'm taking notes, uh, walking with destiny christopher snyder, and I'm cracking in my voice because I'm so excited about this. All right, can we go on to the other one? All right, thank you. What's a favorite feature of your house?
Speaker 3:uh, my outdoor lanai just uh kind of a nice little area to be and sit and relax and enjoy the warmth and outdoor lanai like that.
Speaker 1:I uh, I just got done telling somebody I'm not really outdoorsy, I'm more outsidey. Uh, so that is the truth. When I go to my cabin, I had the windows open this last weekend and uh, dan whippoorwill came, uh at three o'clock in the morning and I was like, oh, that's enough of this, I had to close the windows for dc back on you get mad at the deer when they're outside your cabin I mean, you're kind of in their territory yeah, well, you know, not only are they up there, but they've been eating my knockout roses here at my house.
Speaker 1:You look, look out back, they're all gone. They picked up all but one, those little shits, and they left little pebbles of deer shit all over the zoo. I said so, yes, I just went and bought deer repellent and a gun, but anyway, no, I'm one with nature. Anyway, back to Aliexpress. Shall we see that? All right, that didn't hit a nerve, did it? No, that didn't hit a nerve, did it no? Okay, that's what I'm here for. All right, alan and I pride ourselves on our customer service folks and what we do, because we're kind of customer service freaks. Thank you. When you're a customer serve and you're out there and you're the customer, what's a pet peeve of yours?
Speaker 3:Well, you know I've got a few, but one of my personal pet peeves, especially if it's a business relationship, being late is a problem for me.
Speaker 1:Working with the Hispanic population must be tough. I'm telling you South Americans, they love being late.
Speaker 2:You have just alienated like a fifth of the world. Well, no, he said it, I didn't. I like working with them, oh he didn't.
Speaker 1:No, I'm a fifth of the world. Well, no, he said it, I didn't. I like working with him. Oh, he didn't. No, I'm late too all the time. So it's just one of the things.
Speaker 3:I mean, I work with it and I deal with it. But you ask me what bothers me. That's one of the things.
Speaker 2:Now, are you okay if somebody, before they're late, calls you and says they're going to be late?
Speaker 1:sure, okay. I mean that's common communication, common curse. Yep, yeah, no, that's, that's a good one. I like that. All right, that's a good customer service pet peeve, I like it, okay. And the last question we want a diy nightmare story back to the five d's that we thought were out there. That's right.
Speaker 2:Death, dispersement, divorce actually all those could be a DIY. Enjoy other people's pain. We do so, pete, you know.
Speaker 3:Tell us the story and I I've seen a few um, mostly regarding bathrooms, because we worked in bathrooms a lot and uh. But I I've seen um, just some crazy ass, electrical and and plumbing and you know, as you rip open a wall to, you know retile a wall or put a tub surround in or whatever the case is. It's like what is this kind of stuff doing here? You know nests I've seen. You know just different. I've seen insulation, sand insulation, like like filling the cavities with sand for insulation. I mean, I've seen that probably works, don't you think?
Speaker 1:No, it's too thick. Yeah, no, you don't want that. Oh my God, no.
Speaker 3:You know it's too thick.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no, you don't want that. Oh my god. No, you know, it's like every time you close the window it's like puffing sand, uh, and it's like where is the sand coming?
Speaker 3:from you rip off the wall. Oh my god, that is crazy. So that's a lot of work. Yeah, I've I've definitely seen um my share over the years of of different things that are just wrong. You know, um basement issues where people have dyid their basement and it's like what is going on here I just had a former customer of mine.
Speaker 1:Uh, she moved away. She actually moved up to blue ridge. Send me a picture of a door that was installed upside down. Yeah, it is so hard to put this door in upside down. The guy actually had to do like three times the work that if you just would have done it right. She sent me that picture and she goes can you please move the blue ridge and work for me? And I was like I know, it's just crazy some of the crap you see out there.
Speaker 3:I've seen screen doors upside down because you know, and literally the window at the top and the and the dark part, you know like flipped over screen doors upside down and stuff like that, because they got a deal, you know, for half off on some door and put decided to put it on upside, like. I've seen all this kind of stuff. Oh yeah, man, it's awesome working in the apartment buildings too. I mean, I I saw um gardens growing in sunken living rooms. I've seen, oh, you know, onions growing in bathtubs.
Speaker 3:You know like, oh, that kind of stuff where you know fans like fresh onions no oh, you know, setting up the lights and having your little garden in the bathtub and we're supposed to go in and spray the bathtub, I'm like I can't spray the bathtub today there's a garden in it.
Speaker 1:Oh, that's brilliant. I'm actually throwing up a little bit in my mouth, really. How can we send everybody off and go forth and conquer this week and make sure it happens on that one?
Speaker 2:Think of all the avocado bathtubs in the landfills in Canada.
Speaker 1:There's probably a lot of them out there. All right, you can make money any way you want. You can go out there and start your own business, but if you're not thinking about it the right way, systematize process, figure things out, man. That's the hard stuff. It's not sexy. It's cool to get it done, though. Go check out Pete, go out there and make it a great day.