The Small Business Safari
Have you ever sat there and wondered "What am I doing here stuck in the concrete zoo of the corporate world?" Are you itching to get out? Chris Lalomia and his co-host Alan Wyatt traverse the jungle of entrepreneurship. Together they share their stories and help you explore the wild world of SCALING your business. With many years of owning their own small businesses, they love to give insight to the aspiring entrepreneur. So, are you ready to make the jump?
The Small Business Safari
Navigating Small Business Challenges and Family Legacy with Humor and Insight | Carl Nicpon
Ever wondered what it's like to juggle the unpredictable nature of small business ownership while maintaining a good laugh? Join us on the Small Business Safari Adventure as we kick off with a side-splitting tale of peeking into a dark room, setting the stage for our high-energy chat. Alan and I delve into the rollercoaster of running a small business, sharing smart strategies to navigate its ups and downs. I also recount a memorable trip to North Carolina to celebrate a friend's appointment as a Superior Court judge, complete with the fascinating tradition of engraved guns and a chat about concealed carry laws.
Meet Carl, our special guest and an adjunct professor at Georgia, who shares his incredible journey back to his family's wedding and prom apparel business. From his early days in the business to pursuing a master's degree in clinical social work, Carl's story is a testament to resilience and adaptability. We also touch on his mother’s extraordinary leadership after his father's passing and indulge in some nostalgic banter about tuxedo styles from past decades. Carl’s insights on the complexities of family business transitions are a goldmine for anyone navigating similar waters.
Ready to maximize your business value? We discuss the merits of hiring a business broker and share real-life anecdotes that highlight the importance of expert advice. The episode also touches on the emotional journey of selling a business, likened to the culmination of an Olympic athlete's years of training. With a mix of heartfelt stories and practical advice, we aim to motivate and entertain, leaving you with valuable insights whether you're in the thick of a family business or contemplating an exit strategy. Don’t miss out on this lively discussion packed with humor, wisdom, and a nostalgic trip down memory lane!
And it's dark in the room because the film trip is on. So I peek the door open and I pop my head in just around the door and the rest of my body is hidden behind the door. And what do I see? But flying at my head is an.
Speaker 2:Welcome to the Small Business Safari where I help guide you to avoid those traps, pitfalls and dangers that lurk when navigating the wild world of small business ownership. I'll share those gold nuggets of information and invite guests to help accelerate your ascent to that mountaintop of success. It's a jungle out there and I want to help you traverse through the levels of owning your own business that can get you bogged down and distract you from hitting your own personal and professional goals. So strap in Adventure Team and let's take a ride through the safari and get you to the mouth of the top.
Speaker 3:Now I'm just going to stare at the mic.
Speaker 2:All I got to say is just keep the mic, will you? For God's sake, alan?
Speaker 3:what the hell is going on here. I am so tired of being kept in the dark by you, chris. You know you are a corporate mushroom.
Speaker 2:I am a corporate mushroom, or as one of my guys said today, I kind of like working in the dark and then when people turn the light on, I like to scurry away. I said so, you're calling yourself a cockroach. I said so, there you go. You can go home and tell your wife tonight that your boss called you a cockroach I. But that's my motivational tactics, that's what I do, that's how I get everybody. I don't like it, you don't like it, you know I don't like it at all just eat the mic.
Speaker 3:I have been doing this for three years.
Speaker 2:What does? Omnidirectional mean to you anyway, it, it. I didn't say omnidirectional, I said it's side directional. But it's not a um, it's not the one that's no, no, no, no.
Speaker 3:That's not what you described.
Speaker 2:Yeah, Two and a half years of just it's just you know, I want everybody to go to the YouTube right now because they're going to see exactly what I think it is. Alan, congratulations once again. Flip off early. In fact, I might be the only one.
Speaker 3:We had a little side bet. How quick can I get Chris to flip me off? And it's a minute one. We're back Now if I get the double birds, you know I've really done my job.
Speaker 2:Because he calls it out, he goes for those listening. Yes, on my job. Yeah, because he calls it out, he goes for those listening. Yes, he's flipping me off. I'm like you know, I did it, I did it quietly for a reason, but now we got to keep going.
Speaker 2:Alan, we're back in studio and, as always, we love bringing high energy, getting people pumped up. You're probably in your truck, you're in your car, you're driving, maybe going off to that job, maybe going to see that client you didn't really want to see. Get your mind right, get your head trash out, listen to us for a little while. Let's have some fun with them. Maybe they're working out, chris, and maybe they're working out.
Speaker 2:I have a top of mind for you. It is not I. I do work out, but I, when I'm working out, I am headbanging bro, I really I'm doing classic hard rock. I got, uh, actually I I have some stuff somebody's like I bet you they're things. They probably think I'm listening to podcasts or npr and I'm actually listening to rob drop, say, rob zombie. I'm afraid to even say that, but I mean I gotta get my, I gotta get my axe going, man, because, uh, you know, back in the day, playing football working out. We only had one boom box in the entire weight room and we had to listen to something and the coaches as soon as they leave, we get away from the. So, anyway, we're back to our podcast, so they are in their car.
Speaker 2:They're probably walking soothing and they're listening and going okay.
Speaker 1:Next there we go.
Speaker 2:No, all right, don't 30 second yet all right, because we got a lot of great stuff to talk about today, do we? We do, okay, and it's not about my travels, which will continue this weekend, really, yes. Well, last weekend was North Carolina to watch my good buddy get sworn in as a judge and get a judge gun. He's got his own judge gun. What does that mean? Like a gun, gun, gun, gun. Like the real gun gun.
Speaker 3:Do they have to hike their robe up to get to it?
Speaker 2:though. So check this out In the state of North Carolina and I say that just like that, please we've established.
Speaker 3:Your accents are terrible.
Speaker 2:All right. So he got sworn in as a judge it's called an investiture and he is going to be a Superior Court judge for Western North Carolinaolina, covering 20 states. He's now one of 100 superior court justices in north carolina. He is the eighth one to cover this one in the history of it being established in 1957. Maybe, anyway, one of his other friends. I got him a double magnum of uh champagne, thank you. But his other buddy got him an engraved glock that says judge stappernot I like it. So here's the rule if he has a concealed gun permit of which he probably knows people who give those to him, but he can go apply for a concealed gun permit he can wear it in the courthouse and he, he and the uh, he is the only one allowed to do that. Wow, yeah, but then, uh, we had, so we had to make sure he had access in the robe so he could get it and pull it quickly. Now that begs. The question is how often has Troy James Stafford shot a gun?
Speaker 3:I'm guessing he has other people shoot it for him.
Speaker 2:He no, he probably hunts he did as a kid, yeah, and he's squirrel hunted, I mean from the bayou they. We squirrel hunt for food. But no, he's not a gun guy, but but it's a. It's a great gesture and I think it's really cool. And it was really cool seeing somebody take a huge pay cut to go do something for all of us, because these guys make nothing I mean in the grand scheme of being a lawyer, to doing what he's doing now. And the judge who swore him in told me for about 10 minutes about how great of a job it is and how much he loved it. And he's been doing it for 12 years and he just he says the best job in the world. And I was looking at him like you poor thing. I'm like is it a double wide or that you're in there? Uh, no, I didn't say that it's beautiful, but I tell you, uh, it's a pretty quick elevated status.
Speaker 3:Troy's gonna be missing a meal because of this career decision he's definitely not gonna miss any vacation.
Speaker 2:He was complaining about that by the time I got done telling it up. He has 11 weeks of vacation every year. I'm like I think he'll be okay. Yeah, he goes, but where am I gonna go and how am I gonna get there? I said, well, I guess the private jet's out, but in the investiture and in the uh indoctrination or whatever they call it invest. There is a whole paragraph about you will not take bribes, you don't? I mean there's every angle Like they have to put that in writing.
Speaker 2:Really they did. I know it just like really.
Speaker 2:But it was super cool. Really, old courthouse, very cool things. But let's get on to our guests, shall we? Let's Okay, well, well, who do we have today? Alan Tell us? Oh, that's okay, I will. We have Carl Nickpond, who is a part of a brokerage firm that helps people exit and sell their businesses. He's going to explain that. But I have known Carl before. He was that and I have.
Speaker 2:The first time I ever met him, I came up to Chris Hanks, who's been on our show, who runs our CEO group, and so it's our monthly CEO group and you guys have heard me talk about this one. I'm a big fan of this group. It has actually been life-changing for me. I've said this over and over about what it has done for me.
Speaker 2:But the first time I met Carl, I put myself on the hot seat, did an issue and he is just peppering the shit out of me and I'm like I don't know if I like this guy or not. Do I slash his tires or do I roll it? And it's every time it was like oh, that's a good question, have you thought about that? No, and I was like.
Speaker 2:So I came up to chris after and I said so, who is this guy and he says, well, he's an adjunct professor at georgia and, uh, I said so you're bringing him in as, like, your second hired hand to take me out. He goes, no, no, no, he's looking at and you know they're probably going to join the group. I'm like, are you sure about that? Because, um, it felt a little different. So what I'm getting at is carl's got a wealth of knowledge, a huge background, a wealth of, uh, just his experiences, his tapestry of experiences that we put together look at you like a politician, using big words and putting your fingers together like that Bestature, now tapestry, let's use other big words.
Speaker 2:All right, carl, welcome to the show man. I'm so glad you came in today. Great to be here, carl. Let's start from the beginning, though, you're born and raised in. Atlanta, I am native. Yeah, check out that accent.
Speaker 3:He's like what am I doing with these two knuckleheads? Can you feel it? We're dumb. Can you feel it?
Speaker 2:dominant down, so you're the average of the people that you're around. Carl, you just went right down here, yeah. So, carl, uh, little background on yourself. Uh, in, in. You want to give us that 30 second. You know, this is where I started and this is where I got to yeah, well, I.
Speaker 1:So. I actually grew up in a family business and tried like hell to get away from it and ended up in chic getting a master's degree in clinical social work comes in handy, by the way and met my wife there and after being there for a few years, you know really the family's like, hey, we need you back. And my wife. I convinced her that raising children in the South a little bit easier.
Speaker 2:She's not from here.
Speaker 1:No, she's from Chicago. Oh boy, cheaper, yeah, but still, and you don't have to zip up every time you want to go to the Wall Street, right? So you're trying that move. So it worked. It did, yeah, and she came down. She's like all right, we'll do it.
Speaker 2:Let's go like. That call was like the call that Michael got in the godfather, michael, it's time to come back.
Speaker 1:Well, you know what the family business was like the Death Star.
Speaker 3:It had a gravity of its own.
Speaker 1:So what is it so? Okay, family, business, wedding and prom apparel, tuxedos, bridal gowns, suits. You know, biggest days of your life. Here we go.
Speaker 2:So that was the family biz. And you said oh hell, no. So you went off. I said way, I'm way smarter, I tried and you went away and you got it didn't work for very long, yeah. So they said, come on back. They said, come on back, and so I my question I have for you is that when you came on back to the family business, did you grill your dad like you grilled me?
Speaker 1:well, uh, I have a chance you're gonna let. You're not gonna like my answer on this one, because he passed away when I was a teenager.
Speaker 2:Oh, way to go, Chris.
Speaker 3:Way to go, Chris.
Speaker 1:But my mom took over the business and my uncle's a little bit surprised. So the family business was my grandfather, my dad and my uncle, my mom's brother uncle and my grandpa, long since retired, passed. My dad passed and it's now mom and her brother and she's the president. She didn't have any college, she just did it on gut instinct and did a damn good job.
Speaker 2:How about that? I mean a female-owned business and then having to tell her brother-in-law oh, by the way, I own the business.
Speaker 2:Well, half and half but you know, like you know, you're not getting rid of me like I'm here right, here we go, because when so dad passed a very tragic I and uh, I I know part of the story and I didn't realize it was the timing on that one. I thought it was later. That's all right, just for the record. Um, just so you keep digging, I'm sure you'll get out. You know what the employee has hit rock bottom.
Speaker 1:We'll send you a ladder down there Rope.
Speaker 2:Yeah, oh boy, I'll hang myself with that one too. It'll all be done soon, so you get involved.
Speaker 1:You come back, what did they tell you they wanted you to do? You know, at first it was like you know, figure this out right, like just get your feet wet and understand this, because I grew up in the business. I grew up literally shining shoes. I've done everything in the business that there was to do outside of literally sew a tuxedo from scratch, that just about everything else you know I at some point did.
Speaker 2:So when we think about that biz and you go back to your days when you uh, alan, I'm sure you had the part of Blue Poxito and the white flower Lots of ruffles, nice, oh, yes, love the ruffles, yeah. So we all imagine this is just a small little mom and pop. This was, of course, it was your mom and your uncle. So we're thinking, okay, a couple people, a little shop like this, how big really was it?
Speaker 1:So we had 14 locations in atlanta and uh distribution network throughout the southeast about 200 people working for us what are you telling me about the story?
Speaker 2:I'm like, oh, nice little family business, and you know we sold it. Now I'm like, oh, cute, good for you. Yeah, did you make a couple, maybe maybe five, ten bucks out of it? Oh, no, no, we had 110 employees and 14 locations. Oh, my god, yes, you guys absolutely were able to scale what is typically a mom and pop business, right? So how did you? Were they that big when you came back?
Speaker 1:So the bridal division didn't exist and the wholesale division was there. But it really started to take off and we looked and we said, hey, how do we get out in front of the decision maker earlier? The decision maker on every wedding is the bride, zilla. Yep, and what years were these? Just to give everybody yeah, so uh, this would have been like 2002 to to eventually, 2019 so internet boom is happening, but not the way you found the customer.
Speaker 2:So you had to come back and get in front of the bride when and I just love it because you want to age yourself quickly it's technology, oh yeah, it happens so fast. So back then you had to come back and they said all right, carl, figure this out. And your job was to figure out how to get in front of the customer.
Speaker 1:Well, my job at first was just to figure out what's happening right, and so I had to relearn the organization. I had to relearn the operation, and part of what was going on was we also had a software. We were the very first organization that had live inventory availability at our, at our point of sale. Wow, yeah, think about that.
Speaker 2:What a competitive advantage huge, yeah, and so, yeah, I know I asked the question. You were, you guys, at 14 locations at that point. Uh, somewhere around there. Yeah, you were. So you kept the same number of locations. Your breadth of offerings just went big.
Speaker 1:That's right yeah, that's right, and and so part of the other thing that was going on here was we had that same computer system that enabled us to be point of sale, live inventory and right, great differentiator. But we had the same one when I got there. Wow, yeah. So it's now, like you know, 12 years old and we're training new staff. And the new staff, you know we want to spend time teaching them how to sell, right. We want to, how to develop a relationship with a customer, get them to fall in love with you and just close the deal, right. So that's what we spend time working on. We want them to understand the product, romance the product, all that good stuff, right. So that's how we spend our training. After all that's said and done, then we show them how to implement it in the computer system and done, then we show them how to implement it in the computer system. And we got all these people like white nickel, white knuckle syndrome in front of the computer frozen because they're looking at this green screen. Oh boy.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I mean remember those days, I, I do and I don't know.
Speaker 2:Green letters in black black background oh, boy.
Speaker 3:I remember when enterprise went to computers and I mean it was the fourth largest rental car company in the nation when I started with them. You know hundreds of thousands of vehicles and they were all kept on index cards. And so we finally, when I was there, it wasn't my deal, but they brought on the green screen and we went to computer training in downtown Portland and it was right when we had invaded Iraq first and there was, as you know, in Portland they protest, and I mean there was a violent protest going on outside. So I'm trying to learn this new thing I had no idea I was very scared of. But then I'm also looking outside and seeing tear gas and rocks being thrown.
Speaker 2:And you know, I think for a lot of people listening and when, when you think about this, you're like, why the hell are these guys talking about punch cards and index cards? I didn't, I brought that in. The point is, if you think about technology, if you start looking back on some of the archeology of technology, you're going to start to see where the next trends are going to happen. You know everybody says oh yeah, ai, and we've had Stephanie on talking about that. But that's why I love having these conversations, because if you go back to your roots and start thinking about it, that's where you start to think about punch cards and index cards. And I remember seeing a Commodore 64 at the Smithsonian, which was the very first computer we had in my family and we were the cool kids I mean, I was the coolest dude anywhere- I wasn't as cool because I had the TI.
Speaker 1:The TI wasn't as cool as the combo.
Speaker 2:No we were so cool, yeah. And then we got the five and a quarter floppy and like, oh, let's game it up. So this is way back in the 80s, right? And so now you come back, you're on Black Screen, so they're white knuckle.
Speaker 1:But yeah, because they're looking at, I do with it, like at this point it's old tech and it's not user-friendly and it's not what you see is what you get and you've got to understand these commands in order to use it. It's frustrating. So I said we've got a, we've got a problem here, because our, our, our people can't really use the technology without it. The technology is now in the way of a good relationship with the customer, great gold nugget right there.
Speaker 2:You're teaching people to have that relationship with Pridezilla, who's sitting there, and you finally got her calmed down with a glass of champagne, tell her everything's good, and you sit in front of the computer and you go it was backstroke L for list. It was, and you're like dude, can't do that, so that's a great point. Technology gets in the way of the sale. I mean uh, uh, and you're like dude, can't do that, so that's a great point technology gets in the way of the sale.
Speaker 1:I mean, oh so, so we revolutionized our technology, we brought it up to date, we uh created and, you know, owned the software. From then on that we, that we implemented and it, you know, was, was really a big, a big difference, because our people could feel comfortable with what they were using and it never was in the way.
Speaker 2:It just facilitated the transaction so, from the time you started uh into to the time you sold, how how big did you guys go from and to?
Speaker 1:well so we from the time I started.
Speaker 2:We doubled in size, doubled think about that doubled in size from two to the time they sold, without a bigger footprint, without with the same number of stores. Breadth of services went deeper or wider, I should say, and and so obviously you were in there and you're making those changes. So you made your first round of changes. Uh, coming in, working on the sale. What did you find that next hurdle to be?
Speaker 1:let's go through that change journey if you will yeah, uh, one of the challenges that we had to get over was when you think about family business and how family business grows up. Everybody in the family participates, they all pitch in and the question is, what do you need? Now? The question isn't necessarily, what am I good at? But somebody has got to do this. Who's going to do it? And one of those areas was accounting and I had, you know, family members who were still managing accounting, that never had any accounting training, and you know for the business owners out there that that have made the transition to professional accountant, a professional controller, right. You understand the difference it is when you've got somebody who really understands how to make the numbers make sense and tell a story and inform you about your business and convincing my family that we needed professionals and experienced finance managers leading the way in that from outside the family who will be willing to tell the truth.
Speaker 2:Outside the family, alan. Outside the family, by the way, you know what You're out. Tom the consigliere, that's right, he's not even Italian but he sounded Italian.
Speaker 3:Oh my God, he is Well he's close, he's Catholic.
Speaker 2:Bless you.
Speaker 3:Thank you so and, and he almost could say that right.
Speaker 2:Right, he almost can, cause we. Well, yeah, we're going to get back to the social work? Yeah, because. But convincing them, that had to be so hard because I had a, my family had a business as well and nobody came in from outside the family, right?
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, big deal and but, but, the but, the but. The winning story of all that is that eventually, eventually, my uncle, who was kind of the godfather right, you know, he, he, he didn't really want other people knowing the family's business, but eventually he'd always say, hold on, family, I want to know what our finance manager thinks. No, and then I was like score, he has been converted yeah, oh, hallelujah, hallelujah, hallelujah.
Speaker 2:That's great. Oh my god, that's hilarious, I mean. But but again, that that journey, you watch that whole transitional journey. That's why, uh, that's why I love the story from two to. And you guys sold in. We sold in 2019. We'll come back to 2019 in a minute. Yeah, because there's a really big thing that happened in 2020. All right, so I can't remember. Yeah, it doesn't matter, it's old thing and, by the way, uh, it was literally a year to the day before everything shut down yeah, uh huh, how about timing?
Speaker 2:timing is everything. Did I mention I started my business in 2008? Yeah, did I mention I had to live through covid? Yeah, timing is everything. That's why I'm bringing carl in and that's why I want to talk to carl, because I don't know timing. My timing sucks. Did I mention my only two stock picks I ever made?
Speaker 3:you have been. Let's uh for our new listeners, because now we are, you know, top five percent. There's a lot of new folks on the bandwagon. Yeah, tell them the two genius moves you made stock picking all right.
Speaker 2:So back at accenture, I chose not to go with a dot-com startup. I said you know I'm gonna be smart. But then somebody told me, read the book called peter lynch, invest in what you know. So I took five thousand dollars of my money at the time which, by the way, at the time might as well been five hundred thousand. My wife's like you're nuts. I'm like no, no, we have this new thing with e-trade and, uh, I get to do it without broker fees. No problem, babe, I got, I'm saving this money right, watch this, watch it. So I take twenty five hundred dollars and I put it in um, oh god, this hurts loosen, because at the time I was sticking all kinds of call centers you can laugh out loud I.
Speaker 2:I was putting call centers in across the nation on the way out, and then I took the other 2500 and I put it in nokia, because all the phones we were putting in were going into these call centers.
Speaker 3:I'm like invest in what you know. All I phones.
Speaker 2:We were putting in were going into these call centers. I'm like, invest in what you know? All I kept doing was putting all these loosen, all right. So I put my money in. And then I find out, the day I put my money in was exactly one week after lucent had spun off alcatel, which was really the switches I was doing. So my money was in the one that was dying that they were killing off.
Speaker 2:So, and then, uh, nokia, uh, no, uh, it kind of just lost my mind on it. Um, because it makes me so mad to think about the words, your hands are actually shaking, they are, I'm so mad. So, and then they went bankrupt because they were canadian. Uh, so that was, that was the whole. That's one of the problems, that's right, I'm from michigan, I can say it. It was the root of the problem. So I lost all $5,000. By the time I sold everything off, it was like $100 on this one and $75 on this one. Closed the account. Done, done, done, done, boom, goodbye. So Chris does not need to be your stockbroker, chris needs to go to work in what he really does.
Speaker 3:Scratch on the surface on has made I've made a lot of like starting a podcast.
Speaker 2:Yes, and here, well, actually this is actually turned out to be all right.
Speaker 2:You know well, you know what I said. I hit the goal every once in a while. And convincing alan to come on, I I mean, I might be a little bit of a salesman, huh, hey, how much I'm gonna make? Uh, nothing. Well, what I have to do to show up first podcast, what, uh, you're gonna? You're gonna feed me beer. I'm like, yeah, hey, alan, I don't have any beer. Can you bring some beer? Yeah, he goes. Okay, I'll be a little late. I'm like I'm perfect, all right, yeah, how cold do you want? Which ones you want? I'm like, hey, we'll make sure they're crap beer. I mean, I'm a good beer. So, yeah, so I got alan, uh, hooked in on the train. But back to carl, because this story I think it's just fascinating going through navigating a family business to get them to where they were able to exit at a very great number. We'll talk about that, no, but here's the thing.
Speaker 1:I actually I can't take credit for all that because without Cheryl so Cheryl is the professional money financial manager that we brought in from the outside, outside the family we would have never happened without her. I learned so much from her. So I mean, I did my MBA, I got my real MBA from Cheryl, all right, so love talking about that.
Speaker 2:Everybody says that Give us some examples, a couple like one here, one there. Example things that you learned. You're like shit, I didn't think about that. She said this bam it worked, okay.
Speaker 1:Well, one of the big things was she said, let's really do an exercise to figure out where you're making the most money. Now, we all thought we knew. So we had three divisions. We had a retail division right, that was the men's retail. We had a wholesale division that was us providing tuxedos to, you know, bridal shops mom and pop bridal shops throughout the Southeast as their backend, and we had the bridal division right. So three divisions, and we all thought we knew what was making the most money. And and she forced us to go through a six-month exercise of allocating every single expense to one of those three divisions. Now, what was really super hard was that all these were running through the same warehouse, so the same individual people that were making these things happen just at different points in the day, and we had to now split these up so we could accurately understand what our cost of goods was. Lo and behold, the division that was like the sleeper division we had no idea was the one that was making all the money.
Speaker 2:I don't know which one. All right, alan, you go first. Which one do you think?
Speaker 3:I'm gonna guess yeah, wholesale men's retail bridal bridal's too easy, I'm gonna say the wholesale side shit, I, I uh.
Speaker 2:Well, I think it's where you guys started, men's yeah.
Speaker 1:So, alan, you're right and we didn't see it coming. But we had the proof and now we understood. The dollars we invest there are making more money than anywhere else. So what do we want to do? We want to grow that division as much as we can, your wholesale division.
Speaker 2:That's right. But the hard part for the fam and for me as a person, and for you as a person, is that that's not the sexy one. It is not the sexy one You're right, it's not the one where I get to get bridezilla to go bride lover. I love you. Oh, my god, you're the best ever. Oh, come here, give me a big kiss. You, bridezilla, you know none of that. It was the wholesale stuff, which is not sexy?
Speaker 1:it is not. It is all just about, you know, like old school relationship building. Yeah, you know, and because, right, these mom and pop bridal shops are small towns throughout the southeast. They do business the good, old-fashioned way, um, and but at the same time, we got to educate them and help them stay alive, because some of them did business the old-fashioned way enough to put them out of business and that's not good for ours oh, talk about that.
Speaker 2:So, and this is where, damn it, carl does it again he always.
Speaker 3:What did he do?
Speaker 2:he's just got great ideas. So he realized that his end consumer, the person buying, needed more education. So he didn't go in their cell, they didn't. They went in there educated and said hey look, we can help you with your business, we can keep you alive. You want to keep Men's Warehouse away from you. You want to keep whoever your big competition Walmart, I don't know but you want to stay alive. We're going to teach you how to stay alive. So you guys probably did that, didn't you?
Speaker 1:Well, we had some great folks that were out on the road and and really, man, they, they did it, they they took them through. All right, here's what's working, here's what's not. Let me. And they were willing to explore areas of their business that we didn't play in at all. So most of these were bridal shops, and here we are providing tuxedos in the back end. Those folks who are out there on the road for us they didn't do a lot with bridal division, but here they were, teaching these folks how to buy better for their core merchandise Got us absolutely nothing except for a business that was strong and healthy and bringing in their core customers, so we could then provide on the back end the tuxedos. So how many accounts did you have out in your territory? Uh, ish, I mean real good, active ones 300 that's amazing.
Speaker 3:I mean, that's two totally different businesses. Yeah, you've got your 14 stores and wow, that's impressive, right yeah, I again.
Speaker 2:I think you know, when you think about it and you have somebody who sits there and does the unemotional analysis, or makes you do that unemotionally, the fam sits there and then next thing you know, godfather says let's hear what our family says.
Speaker 1:And, by the way, all the way through this, we're all just kvetching about what it is to have to go through the exercise of really figuring out, exercise of really figuring out. Oh and, and every one of us, all, four of us, the owner, you know, my mom, her brother, my cousin, his son and me, the four of us, we're all, just like you know, spitting bullets about having to accurately reflect where these expenses are going. So, cheryl, right, you're pissed.
Speaker 2:Oh, you're like, and you're like, his name was a bad word afterwards, she Cheryl's afterwards.
Speaker 3:She's just going uh-huh, uh-huh, uh-huh. Can you imagine that?
Speaker 2:You see Carl out there in the warehouse going Cheryl, cheryl, cheryl, cheryl, cheryl. It was hot enough. I use one F-bomb and I get in trouble, but you say Cheryl, no problem, that's right. I think that's where we go wrong. I totally disagree with the swear words today, because the F word was never in the Bible. I could say it all fucking day long, but no.
Speaker 3:Because the Bible didn't specifically say not.
Speaker 2:I say fucking Sam.
Speaker 3:So since Carl actually trained to be a priest, let's ask an expert. Yeah, all right.
Speaker 2:Well, forgive me, father, we're back at the part of him. Forgive me, father, we're back at the Temple of Curl. Bless you, michelle, thank you.
Speaker 1:Go and sin, no more.
Speaker 3:That ain't going to happen. All right, I got Saturday boarded 30 seconds.
Speaker 2:That's what I tell everybody. I got Saturday boarded. I don't even have that far but back in the day.
Speaker 3:How often do you go to confession, Chris? Let's not get there right now. How often should you go to confession? Well, back in the day For hip daily.
Speaker 2:Yeah, back in the day we were weekly. That's old school. Yeah, I was old school man. Yeah, I mean, that was old school, catholic. Uh, grade school, the whole thing, yeah. And then, uh, high school, we went monthly and uh, and it was a long list, um, but there there's a movie out there about the whole thing. Uh, it's called heavenly scent and you don't have to watch it, but I'll give you the gist of it. And that was you uh usually had to have all your sins written down or ready to go so you could stand and deliver. You know, you did all. Nobody's seeing you and you, you do it.
Speaker 2:And um, they, they had this scene where you go as a freshman in high school and you went into the? Uh bathroom and the seniors would go all right, what'd you do? And it's like, you know, I I thought bad about somebody. You know, I swore I took the god's name of fate, I uh abused myself sexually. And then the guy that one of them had like 25, and there he goes no, no, let's move that down to five. And uh, he looks at the kid and goes really, okay, yeah, that's five, but let's move lies up to six. And uh, he goes, then he'll put you off with a good sentence and I was like, oh my god, that's exactly what we did in high school. You're like, yeah, I'm gonna do that one. I what we did in high school. You're like, eh, I'm going to do that one. I'm going to pull that one Because we had to use numbers and activities Back in the day we were told that's what we had to do.
Speaker 3:You mean, like, how many times you did something? Yeah?
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, Disrespect your parents, especially the top 10. You hit the 10 commandments. You know I did not kill that guy. No, I'm kidding, I never did, Never in my life. They never found the body Right. And the top 10, I feel pretty good about. But then there's the other ones and they really man, it's just lord over you. You're like, oh All, right. Anyway, back to Carl Cheryl.
Speaker 3:Damn it, Cheryl.
Speaker 2:What's funny is For a minute there, chris forgot, forgot that we were in the room. Did you see that? Yeah, I did too. I actually. I mean, I actually was transported right back to, uh, grade school. You want me to smack something and make you know? I just did that this morning in training. Uh, we talked about it's okay to fail. We're in a failure friendly environment. We want you to fail. I said I grew up in grade school I brought my ruler. I said my failure environment was wrong, wrong. You know I? Why is shut up such a bad word? I never knew that, I mean, but I had to write that thing a thousand times on a chalkboard. I will not shut up. I will not say shut up. I will not say shut up. I will not say shut up. I couldn't leave until I wrote it a thousand times on the chalkboard and Mr Scrockett came back and checked it and I'll be damned if he, if you didn't count it, I was just gonna ask how do they know if it's a thousand right?
Speaker 3:and guess what? I was short, I was making it bigger, I was trying to figure out a way to get out of there.
Speaker 1:Well, I will not cheat and sage that up in sixth grade I thought the way to survive with the nun sister eileen, was to like get on her good side, right, well, and so here I am in the middle of, and I'm on our good side, and that means I get to do the errands in Catholic school. That's a big deal, right. Right, like you were that kid, what errands. I was Like can you go to the office?
Speaker 2:And you got the magic hall pass. That's right, so you?
Speaker 1:walk down the hall. You know what the really best errand is. What's that? I need you to go to the teacher's lounge? Yeah, well, no. But at one point in the middle. Do you even remember film strips? Yeah, yeah, right. So we're in the middle of a film strip and I'm sent to the office to go get something for Sister Eileen. Now Sister Eileen's door, it's a little loose.
Speaker 3:They should have had the trusted toolbox there to help fix it. Oh, way to way to bring it around beautiful love that one trusted toolbox also very wholesome, so so I, I'm, I'm, but I'm in a rush because this has to happen fast.
Speaker 1:so I go out and I and I close it. I pull the door behind me and it slams, makes a loud noise, and Sister Eileen yells Carl, and it's dark in the room because the film trip is on. So I peek the door open and I pop my head in just around the door and the rest of my body is hidden behind the door. And what do I see? But flying at my head is an old-fashioned metal trash can. Oh my God.
Speaker 1:Oh, my God, and she says do not slam my door. It slammed again because I got my out of there and I was like heading out like ah.
Speaker 2:Oh, I love that. See, you know what? You've never forgotten that story. I haven't.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:How about the nun where, sister Maria Louise, she always had a napkin or a Kleenex? I mean those habits, had these sleeves.
Speaker 2:I don't want to know what was up those sleeves, but I swear to God, everything I mean. I wish they would show something. She must have had five boxes of Kleenex in there, because it was like a magic trick. And then the minute I you know, I didn't do anything, it was always Jerry, it was not me. And then, next thing, you know, here comes the ruler off the left side. Oh, I mean, I was good at ducking and in fact I feel like the matrix.
Speaker 2:I was, I was my head, it was coming swinging. I was. You can't see that in the podcast, but, uh, just imagine me with my head contorting all the way down to my navel. So the good old days, those you know what bring it back we need.
Speaker 3:We need more wastebasket chucking in school.
Speaker 2:I love those stories I'm not scared, no, but man, that woman could move right, she was scary, she could throw.
Speaker 1:Yeah, oh, no, that was, that was a kick. Oh, that was a kick, that was a kick oh, yeah, wow, oh, that's a boot.
Speaker 2:They used to play kickball with us, and so I grew up in a small town. However, our recess was on a uh, parking lot. So I grew up because my dad grew up in inner city, buffalo, and he thought that was perfectly normal To play in a parking lot. Yeah, and so our recess was in a parking lot, but the nuns would come out there, and we had one nun she was a little bit younger, I can't remember her name, but she would come out and play with us and that leg would swing out from under that habit and that ball would fly.
Speaker 2:I like what in the hell's underneath there? I'm like holy shit, because you're thinking that's a nine. You know, we're all creeping in, creeping in, and that ball comes whizzing out. You're like, whoa, it was those old. Remember those old red balls? Oh, yeah, that when you hit somebody because we play dodgeball too, right, bring back back. Because you dodge a red, you dodge a ball. If you can dodge one of those big, thick rubber balls. I mean when you didn't see it coming to hit you off the side of your head, the slobber knocker, slow-mo. Oh God, yeah, you kept your head on a swivel there, boy, you're playing dodgeball in the auditorium, which we did the same thing. All right, back to Carl. Where were we? I don't know. Let's go. How about Carl growing his business? So he brought the family in. The godfather says do this, do this, do this, you guys continue to grow. So from two, now you guys are, you have the big recession well, well, so, so, okay, well, yeah, that that happens.
Speaker 1:But, uh, we get through it all, right, and and now, at this point, now, I've been resisting taking over the family business, right, I'm third generation, been working with second generation for the longest time and I'm, you know, very happy to be the one to run the business without having the one to be the one that signs my name on the line of credit and on the 401k at the end of it, like all that stuff, right, but I, I get to call the shots. It's a great place to be, but it can only go on for so long.
Speaker 1:Okay, so you were actually the boss, but without having to be the cost paying the cost to be the boss well, yeah, I mean, and my mom and uncle were there and they you know, but we were kind of like saying we were running to say this is what we should do, and mom and uncle would say, all right, let's do it. So, uh, here, here now, my mom and uncle are are starting to think about what is our, what is our exit strategy. Here we go, and, and so a couple of things happened. First of all, we had the business valued and we went to see an m&a advisor how early before 2019 did you do that?
Speaker 1:okay, so this was like 2012, seven years before we actually got, but this is not what actually led to. This is not what actually led to the exit, right, but but what did this did lead to? Was our despising the industry of exit planning? Yes, we, because we met. We met up somebody who was referred to us by somebody I really trusted and and it was like walking into old school Miami with the shirt unbuttoned and the tan and the gold chain and and we all walked out of that feeling like that was sleaze.
Speaker 2:All right. So you went to get your business valued at 2012 and you walked away going I'm not selling my business, Right?
Speaker 1:No, at this, this point, I'm trying to just take care of my parents. We wanted to get them taken care of, and so when that doesn't happen, we start talking about, all right, my cousin. I kind of feel obligated to take things over so that my parents my mom and his dad can retire, okay, and so we buy the business from them.
Speaker 2:Because the easiest transaction is to sell to your family. That's right, right, so you had it valued or ish, and you guys knew a number. But but and this is why I again, the tapestry of his story gets really good. Thank you.
Speaker 3:Did you go to a new seminar? I need to use like poetry power. Thank you, did you go to a new seminar Until? I need to use like poetry power hand gestures.
Speaker 1:I do no, I have that.
Speaker 2:Poetry and podcast. You know, it's just innate in me.
Speaker 3:You know, I'm just so good at that. Yeah, it is an audio. That's exactly how I got.
Speaker 2:Mr Marie Pauline, to not dispel me from school, by the way, but that's a different story.
Speaker 1:So my cousin and I buy the business from our parents and we look at each other and we say, all right, what are we going to do? And this took some time, when was this? But we realized this is like now 2017, 2016, 2017, somewhere around there. So you bought them out, 16, 17. And we look at each other and we say, all right, we are a regional business in a world that either needs to be hyper local or national. So you guys are in right in the middle, we're right in the middle. It's like no man's land. It's a bad place to be right. What are we going to do? We have two choices, three choices shrink to like hyper local, bad idea right. Or grow it to a national footprint on our own, or sell it. Let somebody else do it. And we thought you know what? Let somebody else do that on their dime. Okay, and that's how we made the decision to sell. It sounds easy, but making the decision to sell.
Speaker 2:No, the uh did, let somebody else do. It sounds easy. But back to every business owner that's ever owned a business and all three of us have sitting around the table and or or or do now. So you looked at it but you said, yeah, but we've had it valued. But yeah, he was way off. It's at least 15 times more than that. Is that what you guys were doing? Were you guys thinking you were not?
Speaker 1:unrealistic about the value. I mean, we were not. We were not, but what we were realistic about was the amount of work it was going to take to really make it what it needed to be to compete well, all right, talk about that, here we go.
Speaker 2:Now we're talking about the tapestry, the tapestry.
Speaker 3:Well so. I mean, here we are, there's the actual players, I'm going to look up a thesaurus real quick and come up with other words for tapestry.
Speaker 2:You do that while Carl tells you how to make a lot of flipping money.
Speaker 1:Turn the clock back. It's okay. And this is where industries change, communities change, and you got to look and say is my business still relevant for the time and we said, all right, well, our industry used to be that regional players were okay because think about it weddings most of the family was around. But Atlanta is this national city that lots of people coming in and out transient right and so when people would get married, they'd have friends coming from all over the place and they were thinking about how my friends coming in from Boston and Chicago and Arizona and Portland, how this is going to work for them and Arizona and Portland, where are they going to?
Speaker 2:you know how this is going to work for them and a regional firm taking care of them was really no longer the best way, right, and that's why we had to make a make a change, cause we, we the time, especially when you think about it. You, everybody, goes through transitions of life in your mid twenties, back in the day Today, I think it's getting older, but then you're being asked to go to weddings, and back when we all grew up, it was traditional weddings, and especially if it was Catholic, I mean, you had to have 10 bridesmaids and 10 grooms. And you're asking all the guys, we liked those.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I bet you did. Yeah, you guys were killing those.
Speaker 1:By the way, we used to paint this, so we used to. By the way, we used to paint this way back in the day, we used to paint the bottom of the men's shoes so that when the groom was kneeling at the altar, you didn't see this horrible mess of a shoe.
Speaker 2:You saw a black bottom to the shoe, so I did that to everybody I got. We got married up back up in michigan. Nicole and I met in, uh, north carolina. We went back to michigan god bless her, by the way. Yeah that she's still here. Yeah, uh, she would say the same thing. No, trust me, is she?
Speaker 3:still here. Uh, I haven't seen her in a couple of weeks. Well, carl just met her. Oh okay, yeah, that's right she let her in the front door because, I go through the service.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you get to go uh come in, but, yeah, no, we had, by the way, as you tell the story, the word would be mosaic.
Speaker 3:Mosaic instead of tapestry. Oh, I can put tiles together, mosaic, just patchwork.
Speaker 2:Quilt is another thousand points of light. This all right back to this medley. So I made my friends go to a full-on catholic mass in michigan in august by the water. I'm like beautiful, it's gonna be great. We did this whole thing record in uh back in the day and I had a kneel through the whole thing. But I made them all put up with it because, you know, a full-on catholic mass and uh wedding is an hour and a half and most of the guys had driven up from the south to go to this thing and they're like, what the hell did you make me do? I said, dude, I'm gonna pay it all back to you when you go to the reception, watch this. But yeah, I love that because you're right, everybody had to see my shoes the whole time.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so uh. But you know, eventually we make the decision that we're gonna. We're gonna make the sale and we started networking within the industry. Okay, here we go on the other side of this and say, please don't do what we did.
Speaker 2:All right, let's talk about that. Yeah, so you were really good at networking. You felt like you know what I get outside of the family bond. I'm ready to rock and roll. I know what I'm doing. I'm meeting all these other people. I know how to network.
Speaker 1:I'm a smart dude, and we found people that were able to actually make connections with good financing, to actually create the roll up. So you guys felt like, man, we got this, we got exactly and, and so they actually fly me over to scotland and I'm you know, there was there a bone in that bourbon.
Speaker 3:I put it on mute ellen, did you well? It came through our mic all right anyway.
Speaker 1:So. So they fly me over to scotland to see this operation, say we want to do this in the us, and you know I? I was like, oh my god, this is how. This is the future of the industry. We need this now and we need this here so they wowed you, they were like you.
Speaker 2:What you you got on the plane. You went over there you like looked at it all. Whatever they were doing, whatever you said, that's it, I gotta go. Came back, told your cuz that's it, we gotta go, that's right that's right.
Speaker 1:And so you know, we start this process. Uh, it's eventually seven companies coming together as one in a roll-up strategy that happens over six months. Wow, and we were the platform. This goes back to the computer question. At the very beginning, we were the software platform. That everybody Hello. So you were the key to the whole thing.
Speaker 3:That's right. Without the technology, nothing works. So why are you so adamant about I'd never do it again without representation? Is it just kind of keeping the arm's length piece to it, or?
Speaker 1:or no, because I thought that that our industry only had one shot and we had found the one shot. And I was wrong. And the answer is there's many shots, there's many shots. But when you're in the middle of it and you're wondering what's really possible and you've found, like you know that, the bullseye, and you think you've got it, you're like why do I need anybody else to help me figure that out? I've already found the buyer. All right, let's talk about this. So what's missing in all that is any competition. So when the buyer knows that they are your only choice and that you're the one they've got your eggs in their basket, then you know you don't have any leverage.
Speaker 2:I mean, we get to. This is the part that I really want to get into, and we can do this for the rest of the podcast, and here we go. So why would I pay some business broker X percent, whatever the number is to do that for me? Because I'm smarter than everybody.
Speaker 3:Well, you are, but not everybody else is by definition. If you're smarter than everybody, then other people are less smart.
Speaker 2:Right. But look at Carl. He doubled his business. He got mom and uncle out of the biz. He's got cuz here. He did a great job and uncle out of the biz, he's got cuz here. He did a great job, and you know we're. But most of us are so egotistical, hypothetically not for money in theory, not not necessarily anybody in this room. I don't want to pay somebody to do this for me, because I can do this myself. That's right. So tell me why you get me.
Speaker 3:Why does that help? You get a man's got to know his limitations.
Speaker 1:So I have a friend who's a lawyer and he he'll emanate transactions, and one of one of his longtime business owners came to him and said I've got, I've got a deal and I just need you to now get me through it Right. I need you to finalize the negotiation, make sure that it's written down right and I'm protected. And the deal was like a $15 million deal. It was a good deal. And the guy was pretty wowed and he was excited and he thought man, this is good. M&a lawyer says to him you know what? I think that we should check out what your other options are. Why? Why, this is a good deal. I like the buyer, they like me, because I think you're leaving money on the table. Well, how do you think we fix that? We shop it, we create competition. So the M&O lawyer brings in an advisor this is while I'm still running my business, so this is a while ago and they end up with a 48 million dollar deal. Why? Simply because what was the offer on the?
Speaker 2:table one, five, one, five. That's one five, two, four, eight. Just for those, uh, who aren't good at math, that's a lot of fucking money, yeah now. So here's the thing. Look, I don't want people, I don't want people.
Speaker 1:I don't want the listeners to think that that is it's going to happen in every right. It's not great. However, it illustrates the point that you will leave money on the table if you just take the offer that is right in front of you, okay so let's go back to it again.
Speaker 2:A lot of us are very short-sighted and very egotistical. I'm not speaking, I'm one of them.
Speaker 3:Yeah, right, and so I gotta give him as soon as he admits he is. Then suddenly you're like okay, me too. Did you hear that?
Speaker 2:no listener, no so I I gotta pay you a percentage, I gotta pay you a cut. I'm like what you're taking a cut off my deal? Yeah, but you just took my deal from one five to let's call it three. Oh, you know, I just took your deal from 10 X to 20 X or 10 X to three X or 30 X. So do you want the 30 X portion, or do you? That's the hard part. So let's go back to your biz and what?
Speaker 3:you did. You validated 12. So mind alone is worth a lot of money, don't you think? I mean you know, I know Chris thinks he knows everything, but were he to sell his business and he thinks he has a buyer, you don't know. What you don't know and somewhere that's got to be just eating in the back of your brain absolutely kills me.
Speaker 2:Yeah in fact. So to have an expert to tell you. Thank you, alan, I will not be sleeping tonight and I'm the whole time going. I can't believe. He just said somebody knows more than me and they.
Speaker 1:There's the unknown, though, but but it's true that's one of the things that you well, yeah, it is unknown, but here's the other piece, and that is that we're really clear we don't sell the business. The business owner is the guru of the business. They're the star of the business, they're the hero of the business. They're the ones who are going to sell the business. All we do is bring the right buyers to the conversation and create the stage and shine the spotlight, and in the background, we whisper into the business owner's ear when is it time to reveal which parts of the data that are eventually all going to come out? We tell all the truth, but you don't have to tell it all up front, so you got to make sure you time that reveal to create the story that creates interest and has people get excited, drives up interest, drives up competition. Multiple offers- I'm sure.
Speaker 2:I'm sure you thought of that, chris. No, actually I'm getting ready to take a snake bite. Is that what I think I'm gonna convert to baptist? Baptist, give me a snake. No, going to the altar. We're stepping out of the altar again. Oh my god, we've had so many altars we've stepped on. But back to what Carl said. You can DIY it. Sure, you want to build your basement. I did Sure, and you could. And do you feel good about it? You can. Sure, we did all right, you did right, and you know what You're going to tell your kids. You did, I mean.
Speaker 1:And not diminishing it by the way, speaking of my kids, all the way through owning the business, they didn't care at all about any of my work. As soon as I came home and said we're starting to work on selling the business, it was all ears around the dinner table and every day through the negotiation process and all that, they were like dad, would you talk today? Come on Really. For six months in my family, at my dinner table, I was relevant. Are you joking?
Speaker 2:No, he didn't milk that.
Speaker 1:So I was ready to get across the finish line. I was okay, not milking that anymore.
Speaker 2:But at that point you're like I don't want't. For the first time you're like they're interested and I'm so tired and I just don't really want to talk to you about this right now because I've been talking about it all day. Yeah, oh no, I know, oh, that's. You know what that's a hard back to his social work background. That's why I love the mosaic that he has pasted, okay, so thank you, that's done too.
Speaker 3:Uh well, it is highly emotional.
Speaker 2:The next one is going to be all right. So the emotions of selling, I think we, we watched, uh, carl and I are, have been part of our group. We talked about this and I I talk about so many of my friends who have exited and I've got now four and, uh, I had one of them actually call me and tell me he said, chris and this carl, probably the least the last guy you think he said he goes if you ever go through this and he goes. Well, when you go through this, he goes. I know you're gonna cry like a baby. He said. I started crying. I couldn't even talk to anybody for a day. He goes. I haven't cried in front of anybody in my life.
Speaker 2:Now, wait, which part of it was making him cry? The actual sale, the actual that he had culmination, the done, I've done it and it's over. And he said the flood of emotions came over him and it reminded me of something that actually the yoda chris hanks said again yesterday. Um, he said, you know, and we just had the olympics just finished, and after four years of training, you have arguably, in all of the sports there, you have five to five seconds to five hours to prove your worth after four years of training. Right, I mean, think about it. And the first question that comes out of the NBC and analyst's mouth is what are you going to do next?
Speaker 3:Let me revel in this for a second.
Speaker 2:I just killed the trampoline. Or I just killed the pommel horse, the kid with the glasses who was Superman Amazing story. He trained for four years for one event and he brought home the goal, bronze, bronze, uh, for the team, and then the silver in his personal and you're like you know what kid's awesome, but don't ask me what I'm gonna do next. Again back to, uh, this whole exit strategy. Um, we, we don't want to exit your. Your next word is potpourri. I said iri, is it? That's a hard one. Work that one in, damn it. I hate it when people do that. I've actually done that to people. I hate when you're on tv, if you can just use this word.
Speaker 3:A lot okay we used to do that all the time somebody's got to give a speech and we would give a word. My favorite one I gave somebody was periscopacity my God. Yeah.
Speaker 2:You, of course you did. Yeah, oh, not good. This is why Alan's my co-host. Guys, this guy challenges me every single day. I mean, there, there is a text message. There's always something, there's whatever. All right, back to Carl, can we please? I've been on Carl all day. I know he is amazing Am. I not joking, this guy kills it right. All right, selling your biz doing the whole thing. What's next? Yeah, so is that ever?
Speaker 1:in your mind no, and it should have been. But you know I'm like all right. What I knew was that the vision that I saw in Scotland needed to get implemented here, and I knew that a lot of tech needed to get developed in order to make that happen. And I was all about okay, let's start developing that. I took seven organizations on all separate systems and brought them together under one system in six months. It was ridiculously fast paced and at the end of that, like I had served my purpose and you know they're like we're good now and they let you go and I was like you know what? That's just fine, because this isn't fun anymore all right.
Speaker 2:So you did that. When you guys did the deal, you contributed the deal, you hit it, you uh, you blessed it, you're done, you're back. Did you have that seminal moment where you just cry like a baby, or you just didn't have that?
Speaker 1:I didn't cry like a baby, but I did like breathe a huge sigh of relief. I couldn't believe that we had gotten there. Uh, I had so many late night conversations with my accountant, more than my lawyer, um, uh, in that in that case, and, and so many, and, by the way, the firm that bought us, remember I mentioned scotland right there over in england. So time differences, this like whole thing is just going on and I was exhausted, don't?
Speaker 3:don't use your accent. I can't use my accent unless you use it when you say potpourri more purple and I think it's a potpourri, yes, all right.
Speaker 2:Next word is fusion oh, I can do fusion.
Speaker 1:Okay, I got fusion, all right all right, that's what I got induced a really good scotch, by the way, oh, I bet you.
Speaker 3:Oh, what's your brand?
Speaker 1:you know, I don't have one okay, I know, oh well that's fine. I might have one by the time I'm done, but all right all right back to this can we please?
Speaker 3:all right, you shook the glass at me and gave me the little nose shrug a bit of a wink. I'm like, oh, do you want a new?
Speaker 2:I got the double double guns once in a while he gets it twice, but he got it again all right. So this story is fascinating because if, again, if you're in a family biz, or if you built your family biz and then you just heard from carl say his kids could care less about his family business, I can kind of identify with that one. All right back to carl. Can I identify with that one? All right Back to Carl. If we can, we're done. We sold it. Yep, your usefulness is done.
Speaker 1:Yep, now what Well? So all along I've been teaching in the MBA programs at UGA and they when did you start doing that? In Twenty two, oh nine.
Speaker 2:Nine, yeah, so you were that smart and they know that much of you.
Speaker 1:Oh, don't even get me started on how I got started with that.
Speaker 2:All right, but but again you get to. You get to give back to kids.
Speaker 1:Yeah, they're trying this or most of these are executives, so at the when I started teaching, almost all of my students were older than me.
Speaker 2:All this is so fun, yeah, but you had lived the world of again. People don't think about this as family business, but I just love this story. Chris has said this to us many times it is harder to be a CEO of your own business than it is to be the CEO of Coca-Cola, of IBM, of pick your poison, and I agree. What does he mean by that? And I think, to grow from nothing to this. I agree, what does he mean by that? And I think, to grow from nothing to this. Wherever you are is so hard To take on an existing concern, as it were, and then move it up. I have to agree it's hard, but it's not as hard as starting something from scratch.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, and that's the thing is that a lot of business owners they don't realize that there's one skill set that's required to take it from nothing to a real good concept that's making money. And then there's a whole other skill set that's scaling it right. And then there's a whole other skill set that's uber scaling it. And some business owners like that those challenges, and some business owners like that, that those challenges. And some business owners recognize that you know what I'm good at the first phase, but not the other two. Let somebody else do that. And knowing yourself is important. Writing it out to the end isn't always the best plan we just scratched the surface today.
Speaker 3:I know I love the fact that carl's the first one who's ever challenged you on. You've been quoting that quote quite a bit lately. Yeah, he's, he's like. Why'd he say that? I know I love it damn it.
Speaker 2:He's sorry. All right, guys, you gotta go check out carl, we gotta go. How do we? How do we find carl? Let's find carl, carl. How do we find you?
Speaker 1:yeah, so marsh creek, uh advisors m creekcom and uh linkedin carl nick pawn either one.
Speaker 2:You got to pick a partner. If you're thinking about exiting five years from now, because five is that magic number, right?
Speaker 3:everybody always says do you agree with that, carl? I don't believe, chris, anymore. Is that the right number? Five years, yeah. Why? What's the question? Planning the exit?
Speaker 1:because if you think, if, you say I think you should start as soon as you, actually as soon as you can. So for some people, their awareness comes and it's like I'm ready in two years. Okay, fine, great, let's do that. Let's make that happen. For other people they think oh, eventually I want to exit. Let's start now and use and put time on our side there you go.
Speaker 2:Because 10 is not time, because 10 years from now means I'm not exiting. And here's the other thing.
Speaker 1:If you're ready, you can play the market instead of the market playing you. You know, look, there are roll-ups that happen and right now, right, there's a roll-up going on in X industry whatever that was right when you listen to this. Whatever that industry the hot industry. Whatever that was right when you listen to this. Whatever that industry the hot industry. If you're ready for that roll up when it hits your industry, then you can say you know what? It wasn't my plan today, but it's popular and the multiples are high, let me do it now. Or if you're not ready, you are waiting three to four years until all the fanfare has happened and the multiples have cooled back down and you're just going to get for your business. If you're always ready, you take advantage of the excitement when it comes.
Speaker 2:He just makes me want to sell a business right. Get out there, Make it happen. You guys got this going on. Check out, Carl Nick Pond. We'll put this all stuff in the in the deets Marsh Creek. You need to make it happen. Keep going up that mountain top. Let's make it happen. We gotta go. We're out of here. Let's go cheers everybody.
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