Morocco - Travel with Lamya to the North African Jewel

Embark on an enchanting journey through the heart of North Africa as Lamya Alaoui guides us through the colorful tapestry that is Morocco. With her insider's perspective,  Lamya brings us tales from the crossroads of African, European, and Eastern traditions that define the nation's captivating architecture and delectable cuisine. From the romance of Casablanca to the serenity of the Blue City, we discover the harmonious blend of the old and the new that pulses through the streets of Morocco.

Venture with us through bustling marketplaces and tranquil landscapes as we lay out an essential itinerary for any traveler yearning for the Moroccan allure. We'll venture past the economic heartbeat in Casablanca and dive into the historic grandeur of Rabat, Fez, and Meknes, punctuating our travels with the stories of Morocco's dual judicial system and the influential Jewish community. 

To wrap up, we feast on the culinary masterpieces Morocco has to offer, from tagines to honey-laden bread, while mixing in invaluable travel tips that will have you navigating the country like a seasoned local. Whether you're curious about navigating transportation, keen to experience traditional music and dance, or eager to catch waves at renowned surf spots, this episode serves as a treasure map to the countless wonders hidden within this North African gem. Join our conversation for cultural insights and practical advice that will elevate your Moroccan adventure from a simple getaway to a journey of a lifetime.

Map of Morocco

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:15

Hi, welcome to our podcast. We're Next Travel with Kristen and Carol. I am Kristen and I am Carol, and we're two long-term friends with a passion for travel and adventure. Each episode, we interview people around the globe to help us decide where to go next. Today, we are learning about Morocco, in Northern Africa, from Lamia, who is from Morocco and now living in California. Lamia gives us insights at the various areas of her home country that you may have heard of, including Casablanca, marrakesh, the Blue City, plus some hidden gems. It is a very inviting country. If you have a country that you'd like to learn more about or like to be a guest on our podcast, please DM us on Instagram at where next podcast. Enjoy. Thanks, lamia, for joining us today, and we understand you're going to talk to us about Morocco. Thank you so much for joining Yay.

Speaker 2: 1:10

Thank you so much for having me.

Speaker 1: 1:12

And I guess I'll start from so how do you pronounce your last name?

Speaker 2: 1:17

The French way or the Arabic way, whichever both. So in Arabic it's Lalaoui and in French or English it would be Alaoui.

Speaker 1: 1:27

So you were born and raised in Morocco, correct?

Speaker 2: 1:32

I was born and raised in Rabat yes, in the capital.

Speaker 1: 1:36

And tell us all about growing up. And I know you came here. How many years again growing up. And I know you came here. How many years again, 11. 11 years Okay, that was not long ago. And then do you go back and forth too, to see family back there?

Speaker 2: 1:53

Yes, I fly at least once a year to go see my dad and my friends. I'm an only child and every year I take one of my daughters with me, so it's our annual international trip. I have three daughters, so every year it's one of them going. This year it was quite different, because I went twice, and then your husband's from there as well. My husband is French.

Speaker 1: 2:22

Oh, he's French. Okay, got it. Okay, excellent, you just like the romantic allure of just the word Morocco. I haven't even looked further into you know just some of that, right, and where does that come from? And you know, I don't know if it's a Hollywood thing, but it, you know, and I'm just glancing at the pictures and the Sahara Desert and just the architecture, it's just, it's beautiful landscape and everything what.

Speaker 2: 2:45

I guess I'll kind of start with that and let you open so I think the the meaning in arabic some morocco, in arabic is called al maghrib and because it's where the sun sets and it's at the the end of um, you know, of the peninsula, or yeah, the whole, like the southern or, I'm sorry, the the most northern tip of africa like that, but it's all the way to, to the west.

Speaker 2: 3:13

when you're looking at it, you know, from arabic speaking countries perspective. And, yeah, the country has been around for quite some long time. Actually, you still have this place near Fest, or you still have Roman ruins from God knows how many thousands of years, but in a really great shape. So you have the mosaics. Everyone stopped by, we had the vandals, the Romans, the Ottoman Empire didn't make it there for some reason, but the architecture is a result of all these influences.

Speaker 2: 3:49

We're really at the intersection of a lot of places. We are at the intersection of Africa, europe and the East, and we had a lot of routes many centuries ago for commerce, so everyone had to go through a lot of routes, you know, many centuries ago for commerce. So everyone had to go through a lot of influences, including, you know, a lot of Moroccan spices are actually Indian spices, for example, that we use in our cuisine. So it's a melting pot at the intersection of a lot of cultures, including the Mediterranean one. The joke is like we're a little bit of everything, just because of where the country is.

Speaker 1: 4:29

in itself, Well, it's almost like at the mouth of a whole peninsula or an inlet, a body of water that spans many countries. So it's like right below, it's like you and Spain right, and I'm assuming then there must be. I don't think things are connected. It looks like it from far away. So the waterway that's the Strait of Gibraltar, yes, who manages it? Who governs?

Speaker 2: 4:58

that that's a very loaded question. It is for the longest time.

Speaker 1: 5:03

Depends who you're asking, huh.

Speaker 2: 5:06

Because Tangier had the status of international city. So if you look at the history of Morocco in the early 1900s, the country was split between the French and the Spanish. It was not occupied, but it was placed under protection. So it was not fully occupied, but they still have a lot of power. I will spare you the details of history. Where they even tried to, they exiled the actual king, placed somebody else, from the same dynasty still, but not from the family that has been ruling for quite some time, because you know, the dynasty has many branches. But they did this whole thing. And now you just take the ferry from tanger, which is moroccan, uh, but you would have to have a visa to get, um, so when you get to lgs us, it's 30 minutes by ferry from morocco to spain, by the way well, I was going to say it looks really close.

Speaker 1: 6:10

And what's so interesting is you said the spanish influence, but that the french influence and france is above spain. So it's like morocco, spain and then france and it's, you know, all of spain. But it sounds like there's a lot like where was france trying to take it over or something or a lot of influence of, and maybe they were just going through through Morocco.

Speaker 2: 6:30

They, they divided the country. So when you go now you can see the results of that step. So from Tangier there is a coffee called Le Haffa, which is literally means the edge. So when you're having your coffee or your tea there, you can see Spain.

Speaker 1: 6:47

Oh wow, that's neat.

Speaker 2: 6:49

It's really close and I have a former colleague of mine who actually crossed the Detroit Swimming oh, I wonder, how long did it take? Oh, that I don't remember. It was many years ago.

Speaker 1: 7:05

I could see Kristen doing that. No, that, no, no, no. I was just curious, like how many miles is it? Did you? Do you know how many miles it is? No but I think that big deal 10 or something.

Speaker 2: 7:17

It's really not not that close but not far from ferry no, yeah, not, not quite.

Speaker 1: 7:24

What's this dotted line in throughout that splits Morocco? And it says it says Lawin Saqiyah al-Hamra.

Speaker 2: 7:35

Yeah, so Saqiyah al-Hamra is the dotted line. It's the national cause, because there was a separatist group that wants the Sahara to be independent and for many centuries it has been Moroccan. When you look at the old maps, even Mauritania at some point was Moroccan. Of course, you know, with the dynasties changing and the world evolving, the mapping or the zoning changed out a little bit. But yeah, there have been a lot of talks about referendums. It has been discussed in the UN for a very long time. There is a separatist group that they want to have a republic. Morocco is a monarchy and it's a longstanding issue.

Speaker 2: 8:29

Yeah, and that's why, and depending on the countries, you will either find the map with the dotted line or without.

Speaker 1: 8:36

Oh, interesting. So I have not heard of. Let's see, what was that country? Mauritania I'm not familiar with that country and it's pretty big, and so you said Morocco was all of that. Atitania I'm not familiar with that country and it's pretty big, and so you said Morocco was all of that at one point.

Speaker 2: 8:49

Yes, not the current zoning that we have, but it was. I mean I can try to find some If I was in Morocco. We have few in our homes of the old maps. There was a lot of movement in that region, especially when the Ottoman Empire was coming in and out, Because, for example, algeria, if you look in Tunisia and Libya, it might have been smaller or bigger depending on the time. It's the desert, it's not like you can have, it's the Sahara. You can have a strict, you know um frontier between countries, dunes of sand, like how are you gonna divide it properly? So things are always in motion for for a little while. Um, I mean that the joke even is, on the east of Morocco there is this city. It's so close to the Algerian border that you don't really know, or you haven't known for years, until there was military presence, and now you can see the clear line between both countries.

Speaker 2: 9:59

But, for many, many years, there was nothing. So, are you in Algeria, are? Are you in Morocco? You don't know. Now there is heavy military presence on, presence on both sides, and and therefore it's a complicated region.

Speaker 1: 10:14

That's all I have to say, wow, that's so interesting and that's and I was just looking at the Sahara desert because I didn't know. But if I guess it, because Africa yeah. North Africa goes across the whole thing, right, and then it's it's also the tail end, I guess. It goes across the whole thing, right, and then it's also the tail end, I guess would be through Morocco.

Speaker 2: 10:30

So because if you look at the other countries, they're wider and they're closer to the Mediterranean side, including Libya, where Morocco is we're really like on the edge of it, so the country goes a little bit farther. But also, since we're the closest and I will get a little bit like into the politics right now we are the gate to both Europe and Africa, and so a lot of people from you know Europe and Africa and so a lot of people from you know Central West African countries who are trying to immigrate will stop by Morocco and even the rest planes-wise, like people that live in France or in Netherlands, germany, and they're flying to West and Central African countries. They will have their layover in Morocco. So we're kind of this route just because of how close we are.

Speaker 1: 11:39

You have beaches, deserts and from the topography it seems like mountains.

Speaker 2: 11:45

We have one of the highest peaks in Africa. How high is the highest in Africa? So I think it's the Kilimanjaro. Okay, we're right behind. The Tupka is the second highest peak and we have eternal snows. Believe it or not, it does snow in Morocco and people go to ski there.

Speaker 1: 12:09

Wow, that's surprising. Yeah, I think of it like like southern spain, very tropical. Yeah, it says mount tubcal, yes, and it's 13 665, so 13 165 feet, that's pretty tall so, but I think that's the beauty of morocco.

Speaker 2: 12:28

Like you have everything that you need in one country. You want in the mountains, go for hikes or go ski, and you can do that. Uh, you want to explore the desert. You have two types of desert.

Speaker 1: 12:40

You have the one which is like more rocky, and the one with, you know, dunes of sand everywhere uh you have both the ocean and the sea, because we have the mediterranean sea but also the atlantic ocean okay, and so I'm seeing on the the pictures, a lot of like buildings like sandstone or red rock buildings like built into mountains. What town is that? Is that marrakesh, or is that a small town or?

Speaker 2: 13:10

that's a little bit outside of marrakesh, so you're the ones that are um, you know with with the reddish, with the terracotta color.

Speaker 1: 13:18

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 13:19

That's a little bit outside of Marrakesh, on your way farther south Very pretty.

Speaker 2: 13:27

It's gorgeous, but this is the beauty of it you have the ones in the mountains where often you can also see them. You know, because they make rocks, where often you can also see them. You know because they make rocks. So when you're driving by in the mountains to get whatever you want to get, there's this small town that I love going to. It's called Imlil. It's in the mountains, but to get there you have to drive and you can see all the rocks being, you know, displayed because they're making them dry.

Speaker 2: 13:54

It's just like Is it clay? It is I don't know the word in in in English, but it's like, um, almost like I think it's mortar. Okay.

Speaker 1: 14:10

Yeah, yeah. And what was the town in the in the mountains that you like? But how do you spell that?

Speaker 2: 14:15

Uh, I M, l, I L. So you drive in the mountains that you like, but how do you spell that I-M-L-I-L? So you drive through that and then you get to this town where you have waterfalls. I mean, you have to hike to get to it and it's very green and you know it's really beautiful. But you're going through places where you think there's no water and then you just hike for another hour and you have waterfalls that are gorgeous. You can also decide to go farther south to this ancient fort called Qisbet Eid al-Bin Hiddur.

Speaker 2: 14:53

I wouldn't recommend doing what I've done not so long ago, which is going there during the month of July, while I came there because it was insanely warm. Again, the riverbed is dry, but during spring it's all green everywhere, and then you have the fort. You know that is red. You know that is red and you're not expecting that. Uh, I mean that whole region is just beyond beautiful. Because it's rough, uh, the elements like during winter. You really don't want to be there. Uh, it's really cold. Kids cannot go to school when it's snowing, but during summer it's really nice. The people who live there are just beyond generous and hospitable. They don't have much, but they still take care of whomever is visiting. The kids are helping their parents. You can see a way of life that almost doesn't exist anywhere, and for me, I was born and raised in the country but it has something magical because it almost feels like the time stopped and you're and you're stepping back and it's yes, for me it's magical.

Speaker 2: 16:12

I know I have a lot of my friends, moroccan, say what would you like? What would you rather go there instead of going other places? I say I don't know. It's just beautiful. You have a lot of forts that have been abandoned but still in great shape. You can just wander around and you can look at those beautiful ceilings. The craftsmanship is insane.

Speaker 1: 16:40

nobody lives there anymore, but it's still standing oh really, and we're still talking about Imlil right oh, it's the whole.

Speaker 2: 16:48

Imlil is one of the most known villages oh, with the whole area there of the whole area and it's, I think, three hours ish from Marrakesh okay, got it.

Speaker 1: 17:00

That's so neat yeah so if someone's gonna go to like say you had, like, you know you're in europe, you want to go to morocco for a week or two weeks, is it like? A month or two, like a couple, like slow travel. I would say, yeah, right, where is where like must go to?

Speaker 2: 17:17

Where to go. That's a great question. I have some friends that come with me almost every year. I told them, if you really want to know the country in and out, we can go for the next 20 years every year.

Speaker 1: 17:32

What would be the top places to visit for beaches, for things to do at the desert?

Speaker 2: 17:40

So I think two weeks is a pretty decent amount of time. Casablanca you know, thanks to the movie, everyone romantizes Casablanca. Yep, I lived in Casablanca, it's. I mean, there are a couple of things that, yes, you want to see over there, but what I always recommend is you land there, you spend one night.

Speaker 1: 18:05

Okay.

Speaker 2: 18:05

And you can like spend the day over there. You have amazing food scene. Think about Casablanca as New York, it's the largest city in Morocco. Oh, it is York, it's the largest city in Morocco.

Speaker 1: 18:19

Oh, it is.

Speaker 2: 18:20

It's the financial center, it's the economic center.

Speaker 1: 18:24

Okay, gotcha, it looks like they have a quaint tower similar to what made me think of it. It looks like a church tower or something.

Speaker 2: 18:32

Yes, that would be the cathedral. It's a cathedral that we have over there. There are a few of them, but that's Sacred Heart and it's the oldest one that we have. It's a beautiful piece of architecture, that's for sure. And then you can have three different directions in which you can go. So you can go up north Casablanca is right in the middle, on the coast so you can decide to go up north and therefore what you're going to do is you're going to stop by the capital, rabat. You know it's my hometown.

Speaker 2: 19:12

We do have beautiful monuments from, you know, including old Portuguese forts, like right on the delta between one of the Moroccan main rivers and the Atlantic Ocean. You can again and I'm not kidding, we love things on the edge or at the intersection, but you can have your tea, like sitting right above the delta and you can see it. You can see another small town from across the river. From there. We have two other imperial cities close by, which are Fess and McNeice. What a lot of people don't know is Fess has the first university that was built ever, and it was built by a woman. Wow, that was built ever and it was built by a woman Wow.

Speaker 2: 19:58

I think in the 1100s, and it never stopped operating so universities as we know now. It stinks to her.

Speaker 1: 20:06

Wow, that's so cool. You said Fez, f-e-z. Yeah, I see it right there, okay.

Speaker 2: 20:12

So, fez, yeah, it's the oldest university in the world 1100s, you said it was was built. I think it was 1100. Wow, 80, yeah, and it was built and founded by a woman wow, and it's still going to this day.

Speaker 1: 20:26

Oh yeah, that's incredible.

Speaker 2: 20:28

I'm actually looking at it okay, I can try to find the name for that. So fez is one of the imperial cities and it had you many, many dynasties throughout Moroccan history. It was their capital throughout Moroccan history, for centuries and centuries. It also has one of the oldest synagogues in North Africa. But, morocco, we have two judicial systems, because we used to have an extremely large Jewish community. So we have the secular court, which is mostly inspired by French law, or clause enough anyway, with a mix of, you know, muslim law when it comes to inheritance and other things, and then there is the hebraic law as well. So for marriages, divorces and all that. So there are two different systems that have been existing in the country for god knows how long.

Speaker 2: 21:34

Um, so a rabbit outside the fest, or between fez and mcness, which is the other imperial city, you have volubilis, which is totally worth going to because a lot of people don't realize that romans were really everywhere, and it's one of the rare places outside of italy where you can still see what they built. How do you spell it? What's the city? Volubilis, v-o-l-u-b-i-l-i-s.

Speaker 1: 22:08

Okay, I was like Volubilis, not quite, but Volubilis, oh. Oh. No, there it is, yep.

Speaker 2: 22:17

I'm sorry, yep I was just looking at.

Speaker 1: 22:19

Did you have it? Oh yeah, I did. Oh wow, it's a partly excavated Berber Roman city in Morocco, in the city of Meknes, M-E-K-N-E-S.

Speaker 2: 22:34

Yes, that's the other imperial city. There are three imperial cities in Morocco Fes and Meknes, close to each other, and then Marrakech. Marrakech is that. So we're going to continue on our north itinerary where, once you're there, you can go to the Blue City, which is right in the middle of you know the mountains, but close enough to the water still of the mountains, but close enough to the water still, and from there you can keep going north and do the Mediterranean side, which have Tangier, guadalajara, cosima, and when you get to there it's like you're not in Morocco anymore.

Speaker 2: 23:13

You were talking, carol, about, oh, you think about Spain. So when you're in Josima, in Puerto Banos, you're almost like feeling you're in the same spot, even though two different countries, but you have to get through the mountains to get there, which makes it really beautiful, like a trip or road trip. So that's one direction. The other direction you can go is like you're going to go south, but not too much, because, like, if you want to go to, for example, rizani or, you know, le'yun, you would have to fly from Casablanca it's not a long flight but it's still a decent one and you would have to take a car to get to Merzouga, where you have a lot of desert camps.

Speaker 2: 24:03

But you can do the other side, which is do Casablanca, marrakech by car. It's about two hours and a half. Marrakech becomes the home base and then you can visit all these cities and the mountains. You can go to Imlil, you can go to Tluwet, you can go to the lake. So, not very far from this lake, which is right in the middle of the mountains, is where Branson decided to build his own casbah that he made into a hotel, because, again, the nature is just the scenery. I don't even know how to describe it.

Speaker 1: 24:40

Did you say Richard Branson? You said Branson, yes, oh my gosh, and then what city is it?

Speaker 2: 24:47

So it's not a city, it's in the mountains, but it's called Kasbah, so K-A-S-B-A-H. And then Tamadot, that's the hotel that he built, but he respected the actual architecture of Moroccan villages. It's T as in Tom A M as in mom A D as in Daniel O and T as in Tom.

Speaker 1: 25:12

I looked it up. It looks like a palace. No, it's beautiful. And then you said that there's some lakes as well. Paints their buildings.

Speaker 2: 25:19

I mean there's mostly blue, it's it's beautiful yes, it's the same way as marrakech is all red, casablanca all white. Even though that was is not respected anymore. Even in Arabic, it means like the White House oh okay, Casablanca. Many years ago it was all white.

Speaker 1: 25:43

You've got red, blue and white.

Speaker 2: 25:46

The Blue City has a name. It's called Shefshawan, but everyone refers to it as the Blue City because Shefshawan, I think for non-native speakers might be a tiny bit.

Speaker 1: 25:58

Oh is it like chef? Yeah, it's like it says, start with chef. Okay, got it, chef. Okay, got it, thank you. And then how do you pronounce it with no F?

Speaker 2: 26:10

it's just. You know the emphasis is quite different because there's none in Morocco, but yeah, you can do that portion, which usually takes a good week to do. And even in marrakesh itself, in the city, because it's an imperial city you still have a lot of the palaces from previous dynasties. Some are being restored currently. Um, some actually saw. Oh oh, by the way, carol, it was founded earlier than when I thought.

Speaker 1: 26:41

The university. Oh, it's 859. 859. Whoa, okay, and so I can't get my head around that. That's crazy, Wow.

Speaker 2: 26:51

It started as a mosque but you know, mosques in Islam are also a teaching place and then it started evolving because people started coming to learn and it's still mostly theology studies and the university. But, yeah, it never stopped functioning since it was founded.

Speaker 1: 27:11

That's incredible country. It's amazing how preserved it is right Of so many. It's like stepping back into history with so much of it and yet at the same time In Morocco the previous king, hassan II.

Speaker 2: 27:28

He was very probably great interviews at all times there was always an emphasis in Morocco, the past is present. There are constant reminders of it, because if you don't know your past, you cannot build your future. If you don't know where you're coming from, you don't know. Moroccans are very resilient people. We went through a lot of things, a lot of change. We had so many dynasties I can think of at least five that went through in the last maybe 1,000, 1,500 years, and change is the only constant that we know in that country. So it hasn't been the case, you know, for the last maybe 400 years it's the same dynasty that is ruling. If we kind of look past that French and Spanish protector, I think, but it was so short because I think it was under 20 years.

Speaker 2: 28:32

It didn't certainly have a lot of impact, but the world change popo has been, uh, you know we're we're very focused on agriculture, uh, and tourism, but then the technology started happening. It became like also financial help for africa, technology help for africa. There is the evolution, maybe not anymore on the structure and political side of of the country but, you know, on the structural and political side of the country, but on the economic side and the traditions are still very important. In Morocco the family units are very strong in general. It's a high-context culture. The group always comes before the individual. It's unique.

Speaker 1: 29:17

Strong, yeah, it's unique, yeah, community and belonging. So I think kind of the stereotype and I just heard this from my friend that's very well-traveled and she's like well, morocco, we're a little nervous about going there because of political unrest. Do you feel there's any concerns or preparation we need to do as Americans come in there?

Speaker 2: 29:38

What political?

Speaker 1: 29:39

unrest. I don't know Anything either. I know I was like what.

Speaker 2: 29:43

I don't know. I mean, we're probably one of the rare, you know, arabic-speaking countries that didn't have an Arab Spring. Right, arab Spring was happening. What's that?

Speaker 1: 29:57

I don't know what that means.

Speaker 2: 29:57

I didn't know what that is so remember, when there was like a whole bunch of Revolutions in Arabic speaking countries and they kind of they were not happy with the current Power structure that was in place. Some of them were not monarchies, but felt like it Because whomever was at the head of the state Was staying for Many, many, many years. So there was A lot. Head of the state was staying for many, many, many years.

Speaker 2: 30:21

So there was a lot of unrest, but Morocco was probably one of the rare ones that were not touched by it. But the king Mohammed VI still, you know he heard his people. There was a whole revision of the constitution. We do have an active monarchy. It's not a constitutional one like in the UK or in Spain, so the king still has executive power. But there were like significant amendment made to the constitution because, you know, the people were asking for change and that happened. But from a us morocco perspective, the relationship have always been good. Uh, I think, if my memory serves me right, one of the rare countries that has an actual us monument outside of us soil is morocco, and it's in tangier okay so there are.

Speaker 2: 31:22

The countries have been very close and one of the things I learned when I came to the us is oh, france was the first country to recognize the us. You know the original 13 and I'm like I'm pretty sure they weren't, because the first correspondence ever was with Morocco and the king at the time 1700s I think answered the 13 colonies, which means that that was a diplomatic exchange and a tacit recognition of the 13 original as a country or as a state, of the 13 original as a country or as a state. And, yeah, we were one of the first allies of the U? S and that relationship has been always great. I would say it's like in any other country for women traveling alone. As unfortunate as it is, it's not worse than you know Spain, croatia. You want to be careful, like when you're in the cities. You're totally fine. I travel a lot by myself. I had friends that went on their own. It's really safe. You just need to be cautious, like anywhere else. Yeah, okay, your drinks at a bar on the day, right for sure.

Speaker 1: 32:42

I was curious also about like moroccan food and I, oh, I guess a quick, quick thing in terms of cost things are, are they very expensive? So if someone wanted to travel there, is it more expensive, reasonable, cheaper?

Speaker 2: 32:56

it depends where you're going. Okay, things are very reasonable. Things are inexpensive, um, and like, I mean, we have the best hotel in the world lemon one, yeah, which is his one as well. That one is not. I wouldn't qualify it as reasonable. Yeah, totally worth it though. Uh, though, if people can afford it, how is it spelled? M-a-m-o-u-n-i-a Memonio.

Speaker 1: 33:25

That's a nice hotel to stay at.

Speaker 2: 33:28

Extremely nice hotel to stay at.

Speaker 1: 33:29

Yeah, five star, at least Six star maybe. Oh, perfect, Excellent. And then the food. I was so curious about the food.

Speaker 2: 33:41

The best lamb you will probably ever have. Morocco is known for its lamb. I mean, everyone thinks about the tagine, but we also have a lot of fish dishes. What's tagine? Tagine is the traditional way of cooking, so it's interesting because the tagine is the actual dish that you cook in, but it's also the name of the dish you're eating, because it's cooked in that. Now things have evolved and you can cook a tagine in, you know, a pot, like I don't know, like a Dutch oven, and basically it's a lot of veggies. You have some savory and sweet ones. You have different variations of it Really good.

Speaker 1: 34:26

I just Googled it. It kind of looks just like a regular pan with two handles.

Speaker 2: 34:32

Yes, and it's made out of clay. It needs to be prepped a certain way when you buy a new one and then it has a cover that is triangular, everything is steamed and it's slow cooked. So you have to be patient if you want to eat a tagine, because it takes like an hour to two. One of my favorite one is the easiest one to make. It's with preserved lemons and olives. It's one of the most traditional ones.

Speaker 2: 35:00

You can make it with chicken, you can make it with veal, you can make it with beef, you can make it with lamb. You just cannot make it with fish. And basically you just have your onions diced or, you know, cut in lamellas with olive oil. You kind of make them sweat a bit, you add your meat, your spices. You kind of them sweat a bit, you add your meat, your spices. You kind of again let it cook for a little bit. You add water, more onions, but this time like sliced. And it's the only dish where actually I never put salt, because the preserved lemons and the olives will release the salt. And once the water starts boiling and the the meat getting tender, you just like put it on slow and for the last 15 minutes this is where you're gonna add your preserved lemons and um and olives and then cook for another 15, 20 and then it's ready. But you can the base is always the same almost into jeans and you can add veggies, carrots, sweet peas, um, artichoke potatoes, string beans oh, that sounds so good.

Speaker 1: 36:03

It sounds very healthy too. Do you eat healthy there? Generally speaking, yes we do okay.

Speaker 2: 36:10

Carbs, we love our carbs like we love so we are getting close to our time.

Speaker 1: 36:15

I have the rapid fire questions, but if there's some less burning question, kristen, I was curious in terms of some of the activities people like to do and what people do when they're there and visiting.

Speaker 2: 36:27

So a lot of shopping, because the fabrics are amazing. You have all the traditional things like trays made out of copper, but it's, you know, hand carved. The glasses, the Moroccan traditional, what is it called? It's just something you can sit on. It's made out of leather. Also a lot of spices.

Speaker 1: 36:56

Oh, okay.

Speaker 2: 36:57

I mean, we have spices for markets, olives too. We have whole markets dedicated to to olives oh wow, argan oil, uh, cosmetic.

Speaker 2: 37:05

So argan oil in morocco, we eat it, oh, but but not the one that is being sold for cosmetic purposes again. So argan tree only grows in Morocco until like a few years ago, where, like some families who moved to Israel found a way to do it, but it's mostly in Morocco only, and so we eat argan oil. You cannot cook with it, but you can use it as a dressing for salads or, you know as, to dip your bread in it, mostly. And then someone discovered that it was pretty good for your skin, your hair and all of that, and this is where they would start producing. It's not pressed the same way. It's not prepped the same way.

Speaker 1: 37:52

And how do you spell that Argon yes, a-r-g-o-n. No A-R-G-A-r-g-o-n yeah, no a-r-g-a-n, yeah, a-r-g-a-n, oil can you? Just buy that in the united states oh yeah, I've seen it everywhere like people for your hair. It comes in little bottles and not the same quality though no, yeah, I don't like to say it, but but that's where I've seen it. I haven't seen it where it's a salad dressing. I've seen it as like a hair product or something at my salon or something uh, the, the culinary one is.

Speaker 2: 38:23

I cannot find it here, I bring it for my face, yeah for your face. You can. You can find some, some good ones. You also have, uh, some moroccan brands that are starting to sell on amazon, so that one um would, would work, uh, but you can just like. The smell and the texture is quite different. But again, I'm biased yeah, good bias okay.

Speaker 1: 38:46

So that's a good thing to actually buy when you go there a lot of, a lot of hiking, horseback riding, swimming.

Speaker 2: 38:53

we do love sitting by the beach and just like chilling also, nice, nice, yeah, that would be it. I mean the cultural part. When you go for the first time, there's so much to see, especially in terms of architecture, you won't have time to do anything else.

Speaker 1: 39:09

Okay, just like be in awe. Sounds amazing. And then my last question also is desserts. What kind of desserts are a favorite of Moroccan?

Speaker 2: 39:18

So we eat a lot of fruits after our meals.

Speaker 1: 39:21

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 39:22

Then we have our tea with sweets. That would be the sequencing. One of my favorite dessert is made with the equivalent of phyllo dough, and then you make this custard with milk and orange, blossom water and a bit of like a zested lemon oh, that sounds amazing.

Speaker 1: 39:41

That's my favorite one. I know I'm looking here, wait what shebekia oh, shebekia that thing is.

Speaker 2: 39:48

So we eat it mostly during ramadan and it's basically flour. It's cooked but it's dipped in honey. Okay, I see it's fried, you dip it in honey and you have sesame seeds on it and you eat it. And actually it's mostly eaten during Ramadan, like to break fast after having dates, milk and all of that, because it has a lot of calories and it helps people kind of recuperate faster from their fast.

Speaker 1: 40:18

What's the one that you did with the phyllo dough and the orange blossom water?

Speaker 2: 40:23

I can type it in. It will be much easier.

Speaker 1: 40:28

How do you pronounce it? Just curious. I love it.

Speaker 2: 40:34

It sounds interesting, that's beautiful Corrector doesn't even recognize this.

Speaker 1: 40:41

Oh, it looks like pastila. Ole, it's just like a coffee drink. Oh ole, it sounds like pastila. Oh, that does look good. It looks like pancakes almost.

Speaker 2: 40:53

It looks like it, but it's so much lighter than pancakes, yeah it does. It's the equivalent of filo dough, but it's not really than pancakes, because it's the equivalent of phyllo dough, but it's not really. In Morocco we don't have phyllo dough, we have this thing that we call feu de brique. So it's much. Actually it's much more thinner than a phyllo dough yeah, it sounds.

Speaker 1: 41:14

It seems like a puffy baklava which you love, love, kristen, right. But like more spread out the kind of like same kind of concept. Yeah.

Speaker 2: 41:25

Because you cook each sheet like separately and then you add your custard, another sheet custard, another one custard, so you can build it however you feel like building it. Usually I have like five layers?

Speaker 1: 41:41

yeah, well, this one looks like it's got 10 layers or so it looks fantastic. Yeah, exactly. Thank you all right, so I'm gonna jump in the rapid fire now. So what's the best way to get around between either trains, cars, buses or fly for a tourist.

Speaker 2: 42:00

You can fly Casablanca, Marrakech or Tangier. Then trains are pretty good in Morocco. I would recommend traveling, if you're doing I don't know, Casablanca, Tangier, Casablanca, Marrakech, they're pretty good.

Speaker 1: 42:17

Would we ever rent a car, or is that like too many rules and too?

Speaker 2: 42:21

complicated. Um, I wouldn't. I wouldn't drive like if you're first time, uh, going to morocco, yeah, there are no rules. I mean there are rules, but you know, think about, in morocco we drive, like the whole mediterranean countries, like, know, people, think about driving in Rome, okay, everywhere, yeah, okay. But you can hire a driver, which I would personally suggest, because it's really not that expensive to have someone with you every day driving you. It might cost you like $80.

Speaker 1: 43:02

Okay, oh, yes, and then when you're staying in those cities, I've seen me just walk everywhere, like you know, in casablanca or rajat and the robot, you can walk almost everywhere.

Speaker 2: 43:11

But, yeah, marrakesh you can also walk, but it depends on when you're staying. If you're staying inside the medina, yeah, then you can just like probably walk everywhere, uh, other than that, you might want to have a car to just like move between the different parts of the cities.

Speaker 1: 43:28

It's not that small after all oh, okay, that's very big, okay. And then, when you're there, what do you have for breakfast? What's a typical breakfast in morocco?

Speaker 2: 43:35

I would have probably argan oil with bread honey, moroccan tea, because it has a lot of mint, and coffee. That's my favorite thing. Or we also have this cured meat that we use with eggs to make an omelet in the morning, but it's really delicious but also not the healthiest thing to eat every day. I stick to maybe having it when I'm in Morocco, once a week, maybe once a week.

Speaker 1: 44:06

Oh, okay, it's more like the weekend, sunday breakfast or something. And then how about the music? I feel like I can hear it in my head. Is there very unique music that is very popular there?

Speaker 2: 44:18

We have several types of music, so we have the more what would be the equivalent of classic music. It's, you know, poetry. There's being sung much longer songs. We have the things that we use for weddings, which is, you know, more upbeat from different regions, from the mountains. Dance is a huge part.

Speaker 1: 44:38

Oh, it is all the ethnic.

Speaker 2: 44:40

When they say ethnic, I'm looking at it from a tribal perspective. The way that people dance, like you know, in the sahara is not the same as in the mountains. The outfits are different. Uh, we have troops that are, you know, carry on on the tradition there. In terms of sounds, we use a lot of drums and violin mostly.

Speaker 1: 45:04

Okay, and so this dancing? Is there opportunities for visitors to like see people perform? Is it often like in a park or in the holiday?

Speaker 2: 45:14

You have to go to very specific places to see it. Okay, like you have to do your research beforehand, it's not usually for us. You're going to have an engagement party, a wedding, a baptism, something happening and you would have those people coming in to perform. But now you have a lot of restaurants are starting to go beyond having only belly dancers so you can get a glimpse of it, but it's not the same as you know going and you know experiencing in the right setting.

Speaker 1: 45:50

Okay, yes, I need to get hooked in with the local crowd and go to some events. All right, and what's the money called? Dareham, dareham, dareham. Okay, and is it easy to exchange, or do you always want to use a credit card, or what do you recommend?

Speaker 2: 46:05

So always you can have some cash on you, never more than the equivalent of $200. There's nothing that will cost that.

Speaker 1: 46:12

Okay.

Speaker 2: 46:13

Unless you're buying a rug. And when you're buying a rug you can use your credit card.

Speaker 1: 46:19

But most places yeah, you can just use your credit card, okay. Well, dear ham, d-i-r-h-a-m, dear ham, and then our final question what's the closest place to surf? Since you are in the western part of the ocean, I was saying there's some surfing there. Is it popular in any cities?

Speaker 2: 46:32

oh yeah, you can go to this, or you can go farther south to to Dakhla and Shbiket. Shbiket is one worth going to because you can literally see the desert meeting the ocean. The dunes are going into the ocean. How do you?

Speaker 1: 46:47

say that Tam.

Speaker 2: 46:49

Here.

Speaker 1: 46:49

Yeah, thanks. Oh, my goodness, C-H-B-I-K-A-T-E Like ch by Kate, ch by Kate.

Speaker 2: 47:00

B-K-A-T, b-k-a-t, b-k-a-t, b-k-a-t, b-k-a-t in Arabic it means the little nest T-R-A-Z-U-T that's next to Agadir. That's also a really good spot. I see Agad there is also this place, like if you like surfing, it's just absolutely go right here.

Speaker 1: 47:21

Oh my gosh, I'm looking at these really long, long beaches. It's very nice.

Speaker 2: 47:27

So this is also a place you can go surf at and it's not very far. So Agadir and Suera are the main, but then you have the little towns around where it's really fun to go, like if you're into kite surfing, surfing, paragliding, there is another city oh my God, I forget about it. What is the name? Okay, it will come back at some point and I will send you the info.

Speaker 1: 47:50

Okay, very good.

Speaker 2: 47:51

That one is a hidden gem. Not a lot of people know about it.

Speaker 1: 47:56

Ooh, that's what we like to hear. Yeah, so this is before. I'm just trying to see the general area. So southwest of Marrakesh just looks like some of the surf towns.

Speaker 2: 48:06

And.

Speaker 1: 48:06

I've seen camels resting next to a beach with like.

Speaker 2: 48:12

That's in the, that's here.

Speaker 1: 48:14

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 48:15

We did it with some friends.

Speaker 1: 48:17

They had their camel ride on the beach at sunset oh nice and then you go and grab a glass of wine and then one hump or two hump camels there uh, I don't know actually see, because I was somewhere, I think when we talked about mongolia they said there's actually two humps in those.

Speaker 2: 48:36

I never paid attention because you know they have the, their whole thing it's, it's prepared, so you don't see what's under, because they need to be comfortable.

Speaker 1: 48:46

It just looks like you're. Yeah, I can't tell by the pictures. They look just that way, like, just you know, a saddle dress dressed up, fantastic Well, thank you so much for this. And gosh, gosh you could talk a lot longer, for sure there's. It's so fascinating and it's very big. Wow, it's a magical place. It sounds like so. Definitely need to put that on my bucket. It's yes, it just sounds so amazing. Absolutely well, fanta well. Thank you so much for making this work. I know it was a little tricky, but I appreciate all your time and look forward to possibly getting that extra secret spot too.

Speaker 2: 49:28

I will text you that, Kristen Fantastic.

Speaker 1: 49:31

Nice, okay, thanks, alana All right. Bye. Thanks for listening. If you enjoyed the podcast, can you please take a second and do a quick follow of the show and rate us in your podcast app, and if you have a minute, we would really appreciate a review. Following and rating is the best way to support us. If you're on Instagram, let's connect. We're at we're Next Podcast. Thanks again.