1. Introduction to Flood Risk Management

In this series, you’ll hear from the different Natural Resources Wales teams who work together to reduce the risk of flooding to communities in Wales.

This will give you a good overview of what flood risk is, what we’re doing to manage it in Wales, and what impact the climate emergency is having on flood risk in Wales now and in the future.

If you have any questions or comments on anything covered in this podcast series, contact us at FloodRiskManagement.Strategic@naturalresourceswales.gov.uk

Cerian: Hi there and welcome to the Natural Resources Wales Podcast mini series on flood risk management. My name's Cerian Gingell and I work here at Natural Resources Wales. In this series you'll hear from the different teams who work together to reduce the risk of flooding to communities in Wales. This will give you a really good overview of what flood risk is, what we're doing to manage it in Wales and what impact the climate emergency is having on flood risk in Wales both now and in the future.

So in this first episode we'll be joined by Jeremy Parr, who heads up the flood and Incident risk management teams here in Natural Resources Wales. Jeremy has a wealth of experience which you share with us today. We'll hear a little about his background, education and career to date. Before we dive into some questions like what is flooding? Why and when does it happen and how can we stop it?

So I think to start it would be really good to hear a little about your background and how you've come to be the head of flooding incident risk management here in Natural Resources Wales. So can you tell us a little bit about your education and career path, please?

Jeremy: Yeah, sure. So I've always been interested in the natural environment and water things in particular, and have always been interested in natural processes such as, you know, earthquakes, volcanoes, hurricanes, weather, all those sorts of things from a school age. Really. So, you know, at school I did science subjects, I did maths, physics and chemistry. But, you know, one of things that strikes me is I could have easily done other subjects like geography and French or all the things that interest you.

So I think it's important to do things that interest you at school. After school, I, I did a degree in civil engineering at university and I did that because I was interested in sort of building things and sort of working outside and again, working with a kind of natural environment. I quickly sort of you know, a lot of civil engineering is about building skyscrapers and structures and bridges and roads and that sort of thing.

That wasn't the bit that interested me. It was more the watery subjects, you know, the hydrology and hydraulics and stuff like that. So, you know, I think one of the things that even with a sort of sounds like a specific degree in civil engineering is a wide range of different subjects you can do in that area. I enjoyed being a student and I sort of wanted to carry on, so I did a PhD sort of straightaway after that and I was lucky enough to do a PhD in water supply and sanitation in developing countries.

So that was, you know, kind of also because I was interested in overseas development and helping people, really. I was lucky enough to do that abroad in Mauritius, which is great. Yeah.

Cerian: Sounds great.

Jeremy: It was brilliant when some time in the Indian Ocean there. And then after that, I sort of stayed in academia for a bit, got a job at Sheffield University, and then I moved quite quickly to Loughborough university because there they got a specialist unit that deals with water supply, sanitation type of things in developing countries. So I spent three or four years doing that, which was which was great, you know, travelled a lot, travelled to Africa, travelled to South Asia, based in the UK, teaching and training and research and consultancy type work.

But then I decided after that that I wanted to really sort of get my hands sort of dirty and get stuck in with a with a project, really. So I applied for a job in the UK Department for International Development as it was then. So this is a UK government department and it was working. It was working. It was working abroad in the Caribbean.

Oh nice place again. Was, was great. I picked all the tough gigs didn’t I? And it was, I spent three and a half years in the end in an island called Anguilla, which is a British overseas territory in the in the Caribbean. And it was as an environmental health adviser advising on water quality, solid waste management and really sort of institutional development, you know, the structures and the governance which is in place.

And that was that was great. But I was getting on a little bit by that point and I went out there, I just got I just got married, had no kids by the time. So three and a half, four years later, we got three kids and no house and in the UK. So really sort of made a choice as to whether to carry on with that contract sort of work abroad or get a job in the UK.

Cerian: Yeah.

Jeremy: So I thought it was time to get a job in the UK. And what I did then was really look at what sort of job did I want to do. I didn't really want to work for a consultancy kind of organization. I wanted to work in the public sector because you know, this whole thing about, you know, kind of giving back to society and public service is something that motivates me.

And I looked at the Environment Agency had jobs on the on the go location was important to me. I do like the sea I do like hills. I do like these things. So it's all on the west to the west of Britain, I was looking. There was a job in Devon and Cornwall and the job in Wales and I got the job in Wales.

Cerian: Although Devon and Cornwall also lovely part of the world.

Jeremy: It is. It is indeed and other parts are available as well. But, when I went into the Environment Agency I went into a role which was about water quality and I did that for about five years and then I got a great opportunity to work with our regional director in Wales, which gave me great insight into the whole range of stuff that we do in the Environment Agency at the time and now in NRW, Natural Resources Wales.

Cerian: Yeah.

Jeremy: And after that period I got, I got a job in flood risk management for the first time. So this was about 2007, 2008, something like that about, you know, 13, 14 years ago. And I decided, you know, I wanted a job in risk management because it was such a such an important area. I mean, it's all important, but such an important area in terms of challenges around climate change.

You could see it happening more and more. And I wanted to get sort of stuck into that area. Yeah. And I thought various roles since really. And you know, now I'm the head of the and Risk Management and Natural Resources Wales.

Cerian: Yeah. So you know it was a slight step up there, you just, just covering the whole of Wales but you know. But you've, but you've had a really interesting and varied passage to come in to flood risk management by the sounds of it and lots of travel which is always nice as well. And I noticed you picked the, the warmer places to go generally before settling in Wales, but we do get a lot rain in Wales, so I suppose that makes sense if you're wanting to do some flood risk management work.

But on the topic of flood risk management, then I suppose let's start with the basics and ask you to explain what is flooding and why does it happen.

Jeremy: Yeah, you're right in coming to Wales was an eye opener in terms of the weather actually.

Cerian: in terms of coming from the Caribbean, yeah.

Jeremy: Yes, absolutely. And I just rained and rained or it seemed like it for the first the first few weeks that we were back. But yeah, no flooding is a is a massive it's a massive topic. And at its base, you know, flooding is a natural thing that happens always has and kind of always will. And it's when we get excess water really on land or any area and it means there is a submerged with water or under water And that's you know it's in its simplest form and it can it can happen.

And the sources of flooding can be from various sources and various reasons. So it can be from rivers, it can be from the coast. You know, when the coast is stormy and levels are high, it can be from what's called surface water. So this is really when it when it rains in the water, you know, hasn't got to the rivers or to the or to any watercourses.

But it's flooding anyway. So, you know, this is often associated with drainage and drainage issues, but it can be clearly just sort of natural and on fields, etc. You can also get flooding from groundwater. So this is when it rained along the groundwater. That's the water underneath the surface of the land that you can't see.

But there's a lot of water under there. It's rising and rising and rising and then going back and giving rise to the flooding. Yeah, you can also get flooding from sewers. So, you know, if sewers aren't working properly and drainage isn't working properly, then you can get something from there. And you can also get flooding from reservoirs.

You know, in its sort of worst case. If a reservoir wereto fail, you'd get this massive inundation of water and really, you know, obviously really quite serious and quite severe flooding from reservoirs. So it can come from a a range of sources. It's, you know, I think with climate change, one of the things is we're seeing more and more of this, more and more of this happening.

We are experiencing more and more heavy rainfall, heavy rainfall events. You know, it can be over a long period or it can be short periods. But it's really when we've got in excess rainfall, water isn't able to drain away as it would naturally. And clearly it can be serious. In the most extreme cases. It really is a threat, a threat to life.

You know, people have and do die from flooding. But not only that sort of extreme end of it, it can cause a lot of disruption to travel, to transport, to get into school, get to get into your job. It can cause damage to properties which can be long lasting. And one of the really, you know, things that we see regularly and it's awful to see is just the disruption it can cause to communities if your house gets flooded, it can take ages to get back into your house.

And sometimes the mental health impacts a long lasting as well you know that worry that is going to happen again. So you know this this is all reasons why we take it also seriously and why we work so hard to try and manage that risk as much as we possibly can.

Cerian: Yeah, absolutely. It's a serious thing, isn't it?

Jeremy: Totally.

Cerian: And so we've talked about what flooding is and what causes it, but what is flood risk.

Jeremy: Okay, so flood risk is looking at you know, it's really accepting that flooding is going to happen. There's a risk it's going to happen. So what can we do about it and when we think about risk, there's two elements to this really. What is the probability of it happening? So, you know, how often is it is it likely to happen?

But it's also the consequence of it happening. So if it is going to happen, how bad is it going to be? So you combine those two things, really the probability and a consequence to think about. I think about what the risk will be. So for example, you know, if something if an area floods maybe fairly frequently, but it's really shallow depth.

That's maybe not as bad a risk as somewhere that maybe floods less frequently, but it's really deep and it's really fast. You know that’s a bigger hazard and can cause more problems and the greater risk really to people's lives and to property. So what gets talked about all the time in this is the is the probability side of it.

And it's really important to remember also that consequence side of it. And when people talk about that probability, you know what you'll hear and people will be familiar with people talking about a one in 100 year event, for example. And you got to be careful with that because often people think, oh one in a 100 year event, that means it's only going to happen once in a hundred years and I've got a hundred years until it happens.

Cerian: But that's perhaps not quite right then.

Jeremy: No, no, no, no, it isn't. Because it's a it's a probability really. And that means, you know, it could it could happen tomorrow. It might not happen for a hundred years, but it's probably going to happen in those hundred years. And it could happen tomorrow. It could happen twice. It could happen three times this year. So it's no guarantee of anything.

It's just an indication of the sort of severity of the of the risk. And another important thing is that because the climate is changing, then these probabilities are changing as well. So what was a one in 100 year event maybe ten years ago isn't anymore because the climate is changing so, so, so quickly. So this is I think, you know, one of the reasons why it's important people understand what that what their flood risk is.

And we've got all sorts of tools and techniques to share information about that that, you know, we'll talk about maybe later in this podcast and in other podcast.

Cerian: Yeah, Yeah. We definitely will, we've got plenty of guests that we're willing to talk to us about, all these things that we've put in place in Natural Resources Wales that can help inform the public and advise them and have them prepare as well as the flooding. So can we stop flooding from happening then, or is it kind of we can manage it, but we can't fully stop it?

What what's the kind of how does it work? I suppose?

Jeremy: Yeah. Yeah. So, you know, as we've said, this within is a natural thing, a natural phenomenon. It it always is going to happen and you know, kind of always will. But we can do things to try and help and, and manage and reduce that risk. Really that risk to people at risk, the properties being flooded. So we can do we can do things like build flood defences.

And there's, you know, networks of flood defences all the way across Wales, built by us and built by local authorities as well, which are there to try and reduce the probability of flooding or they're not going to stop it all the time in all situations. Um, but constructing and maintaining those defences is important so that they are, you know, fit for purpose when, when needed.

But it's important. We also do other things to manage flood risk, and that's about having information about flooding. It's about having flood warnings that can go out to people. It's not always about building, you know, hard defences, what gets called sort of hard defences. That means sort of structures and walls and concrete things. It's also about some of the softer things that we can do.

What's meant by that is natural flood management is one of the things which receives a lot of attention, and that's really trying to manage the water in the uplands before it gets downstream. It's sort of trying to slow the flow and retain water, maybe in the ground, maybe in the in the area or on land before we get some before it gets downstream.

And another really important this is you know, not building houses in locations which are at flood risk in the first place.

Cerian: You know, which makes sense.

Jeremy: Oh, absolutely. And you know, I mean, part of the trouble is that quite a lot of the time, you know, the front line is next to the river, but that land is on the floodplain. And, you know, the planes are there for a reason because rivers do flood. As I've said, you know, a couple of times, they always have and they always will.

So it's not really not a great idea to build more properties in in locations that, you know, are susceptible for flooding.

Cerian: No, no, It certainly seems a sensible thing to do to advise against that, doesn't it?

Jeremy: Yeah. And that's one of the you know, that's one of the things that we do look at that risk and provide advice to the people who are making the decisions about development and planning.

Cerian: So is Natural Resources Wales then responsible for all types of flooding? Do we cover all of those types of flooding that you mentioned right at the start of the episode, the sort of sewage, the groundwater and the reservoirs, the rivers, the coast? Do we cover all of those?

Jeremy: No, we don't lead on all of those. You know, because there's such a range of different types of flooding and where flooding can come from and what causes it, there's a range of organizations which are which are involved. So, for example, you know, water companies are involved because of the drainage networks that they manage and the sewers that they that they manage.

Local authorities are heavily involved and lead on what that's called local flood risk management. What's meant by that is that that's the local watercourses and the on the on the local drainage, you know, off of roads and highways, for example.

Cerian: Okay.

Jeremy: In and out would be I guess the easiest way sort of thinking about it is that we take the lead for the kind of bigger rivers and the big end of flooding because we're a national organization across the whole of Wales. So you know, the big rivers that flow throughout the whole of Wales, we, we we're the lead organization for and also for the coastal flooding.

And the reason for this as I say, is partly because we are a national organization and when you're looking at things like coastal flooding, it can affect, you know, the whole coast, it can affect different local authorities and different organizations.

Cerian: Yeah, that makes sense. You've got that kind of overview then of all Wales to be able to coordinate that with all of those different authorities as well.

Jeremy: Yeah, Yeah. And that coordination role is a really important role for us because you know, quite a lot of the time is about making sure that we got good information, we got good information on a on a national scale. So we spend a lot of time working with local authorities and water companies in collaboration, in partnership in what we do to manage flood risk.

And, you know, as we say in there, really, we take what's called this oversight role for flood risk across the whole of Wales.

Cerian: Yeah. So how do we manage that risk then?

Jeremy: Well, you'll hear, you know, in podcasts from colleagues talking about different areas of what we do and go in into greater detail about what we do. But you know, kind of in simple terms, we've got a range of teams who are dealing with a range of topics which all really into Interlink. So I'd say almost a starting point is understanding where and what is flood risk.

You know, you can only manage it if you understand it and understand where it's happening.

Cerian: Yeah. that make sense.

Jeremy: Yeah. Yeah. So, you know, we've got teams that kind of, you know, technical people who do the mapping of flood risk and the and the modelling of flood risk to predict, you know, what's going to happen, what could happen in different scenarios. And that's really at the core. You know, if you've got that good understanding, then you can take action and you can do things around it.

I think, you know, another key area that is sort of about preventing it getting worse is that area which gets called, you know, development control and talked about earlier. So this is about the planning advice, making sure that we, you know, don't really put any new homes further, further risk. It's, you know, the planning decisions are made by local authorities.

We provide advice into that into that system. And there's a whole host of other areas. One area that doesn't often get a lot of direct attention but is so, so, so fundamental to what we do is the teams who look after our river gauging stations and our rain gauges. And what this is, is again, making sure that we've got the information and the data about what's happening on our rivers, what's happened historically, what's happening in kind of real time when the flood waters and the river waters are a rising.

And what that means in terms of what's going to happen with flooding. So this is this is this will a name for it is hydrometry. That's the name for all that network of infrastructure that we've got out there. It needs maintaining. We got people who work in what's called hydrology, you know, hydrological services, and that's interpreting that data in terms of what does it mean is going to happen and all that data needs to get from the field back to base.

And that's really you've got teams of people who were involved in that telemetry system, which is about getting the information from one place to another that all of those things are so, so important in terms of in terms of what we do and how we do it. And then, you know, all the things happens. So we use that data.

We use that data in real time to look at what's happening to forecast floods and then issue warnings, which is such a crucial part of our service. You know, a lot of some people say, oh, you know, I didn't realize it could happen to me. I didn't realize it would happen so quickly. So getting good warnings out to people and working with people to understand what those warnings mean so they know what to do.

Because a lot of the time you haven't got much time to react and you do need to really think about it beforehand.

Cerian: Yeah.

Jeremy: And then we've got a whole, whole area and it's a massive area around looking after the assets that we've got. So by assets I mean those the defences and all the gates and valves and various bits of kit that stop places from flooding. So we've got lots of people who, you know, we're doing that day in, day out, maintaining that, inspecting that, making sure that it works, operating it when we've got when we've got flooding.

So, you know, you can see there's a wide range of different sort of skills and different people are involved. And those are the other bits of it too, in terms of the community engagement type work that we do to try and explain this to people largely through the information on our website. But you know, also all sorts of all sorts of different bits of good risk management that need to come together.

Cerian: Yeah, and I think we'll pop all of the links to those web pages as well in the show notes for this podcast. So yeah, that would be a nice easy way for people to find all these things that we've talked about today.

Jeremy: Yeah, great.

Cerian: And so we, we know that flooding is a natural phenomenon and, you know, you've, you've already sort of covered that it's always happened. It probably always will happen, but it sort of goes without saying and that because it's a natural phenomenon, it could happen really anytime sort of day or night. So what happens then if flooding does happen and it's, say, night time or, I don't know, Christmas Day, a bank holiday?

Jeremy: Yeah, No, absolutely. You know, not that that's the thing with natural things and it could any time You're absolutely right. You know this flooding could happen any time, it can happen in the middle of the night. It could happen on a bank holiday. So we operate, you know, on a on a continuous basis. We've got people who are on duty looking out for this through the night, working on bank holidays, working at weekends.

It's a continuous thing. Yeah. If they see something that's going to happen, if we if we get that advance warning through the weather forecast and we work really closely with the Met Office, for example, on the weather forecasts, then they'll then the whole machinery really kicks in in terms of having people who are doing that forecasting, issuing those warnings out and about, clearing trash screens on watercourses and also, you know, operating our assets.

So, you know, it's important we're ready to respond any time with a whole host of other organizations, you know, working within that network. As you can imagine, you know, the local authorities, the fire and ambulance services, the police services, working as a network, working as a team.

Cerian: Yeah, absolutely. But good to know that there's always somebody ready to respond.

Jeremy: Yeah. Yeah, absolutely.

Cerian: We've mentioned climate change as well earlier on an increasing threat that that poses so do we think then that climate change is already impacting the work that is happening in service management here in Natural Resources Wales or if not, do we see it affecting Wales flood risk in the future?

Jeremy: Oh, there's a lot of evidence out there and all the evidence from the climate change scientists, the people that are looking at this say is irrefutable climate, climate change is here, it's happening and it's set to get worse. It's really important that we all take these, you know, clearly, massively, massively, massively seriously. And clearly there's a big link into what we do, what I do, what my teams do, what we all do in terms of good risk management.

You know, we've experienced some really significant and devastating storms in in Wales, the February 2020 floods, you know, really stick in the mind, in terms of recent memory storm Dennis particularly over the South Wales valleys but also other named storms in that month affected other parts of Wales. You see it, you know, clearly on a national or international rather, you know, scale as well that people remember.

Absolutely severe floods in Germany and Belgium, a few years ago where, you know, a lot of people did tragically die. And, you know, this was this was in a European country as well. It just shows you how severe and the risk that it can pose. And it's all over the place and it's in the news in Pakistan fairly recently, Australia, you know, all over the world.

So I think there's no doubt that we're seeing more and more impacts of extreme weather. And it's important, I think, to talk about extreme weather because it's both ends of the scale is both flooding and also in terms of in terms of drought as well. And, you know, extreme heat to the cause of the other impacts. Yeah, but when, you know, when it comes to flooding, we are seeing more extreme weather events.

They are getting more probably say, unpredictable, particularly the sort of sudden downpour, thunderstorm type events. It will affect it will affect everything. You know, it will affect all bits of the environment. Alongside this, you've also got the nature, the emergency, you know, a real crisis in terms of biodiversity. And the two things are the two things are linked and it's important whatever we do, you know, we also take into account that need for doing things to increase our, our biodiversity.

So, you know, forests and agriculture will be impacted, we'll get more pests and invasive species becoming more common. We will see more, more flooding, which all sounds a bit terrible and doom and gloom. But you know, kind of there is the challenge, isn't it?

You know, so that's what we've got to that's what we've got to respond to and we've got to we've got to get on with it. And again, you know, I think that's why, you know, a lot of people I know work in an organization like Natural Resources Wales or the organizations which are involved with the environment and the natural environment, because it's the sort of thing that that motivates us to do something about.

There's no doubt, you know, the challenges ahead of a significant you know, it's important that we do talk about net zero and reduce the amount of carbon which is going out there into the atmosphere to stop it getting worse. But I guess you know, more so our jobs are about the adaptation side of it. And that means, you know, accepting that it's happening and accepting that it's getting worse and planning, quite frankly, and delivering against that, against the future, it does mean some tough decisions, but we've got to face up to them.

Cerian: Yeah. And perhaps thinking about doing things differently as well, you know, not just sort of doing the same thing that's always worked, but looking to, well, adapt. You know, that's clues in the title isn't it. Adaptation. It's looking to change and sort of adapt to those things.

Jeremy: Yeah, absolutely. And we kind of, you know, we've got to, we've got to get on with it. We've got to we've got a we've got to try things. We've got to implement those things. And so the time for action is now.

Cerian: Yeah, absolutely. Are you teams already adapting to tackle climate change and how do you see them adapting more so in future?

Jeremy: Yeah. Yeah. So we are I mean in terms of what we do as a team and what we do as an organization, you know, clearly we're doing things to reduce our carbon footprint, just sort of starting with that end of it. So yeah, reducing our travel, looking at our carbon footprint from our offices, more people working from home now using less energy intensive processes in what we do, you know, using solar panels on some of our kit out in the field, those sorts of things, using electric vehicles and all of those things are really important.

I think within flood risk management, as we sort of talked about, there's a massive agenda around that adaptation side and are doing things differently. I think one of the things here is that there's no kind of one single solution to the to the issues we've got. It's not like, oh, you know, if only we did this, then it'll be okay.

No, what's important is we we've got a range of things that we need to do. We talked about earlier in the podcast around how, you know, planning and warehousing support is really important. You know, I think things like building houses which are more resilient, what that means is, you know, accepting probably that they're going to get flooded at some point, building them in materials that will dry out quicker so people can get back in a whole lot quicker.

A lot of the traditional building materials are really rubbish when they when they get wet, you know, some of the plaster on properties, wooden floors, that sort of thing, you know, they take ages to dry out and you know, to repair. So sort of go into that a little bit to say, you know, that's also about what happens in the building sector, isn't it, then?

And so it's important that we influence the areas and also, you know, the agricultural sector, for example, you know, how our land is managed and how, you know, planting trees on farms or on land can help as well. So there's a whole range of different things. We've got a lot of services and which sort of touch on this area that give people information.

So, you know, we've got a lot of information which is available on the website. I'm sure, you know, as we said, we can we'll make that we'll make the links and make things available for people. If you if people want to tap in Natural Resources Wales into a search engine, that you'll quickly get to our data and the sorts of services that we offer.

So on there you'll see things like a five day flood outlook, you'll see things around those flood maps that people can put their postcode into and find out whether their property is at risk, for example, because a lot of times people think, Oh, I went up to me or, you know, no, it doesn't happen here or it will never happen, but you just don't know.

So just because it hasn't happened doesn't mean it won't happen. So looking at that, those sorts of resources are really helpful. And then there's further guidance on our website about what you can do, you know, what to do around preparing for fall. It's not nice to think about, but it is important. And things like preparing community food plans, for example, is the important bit of what people can do.

But I suppose, you know, alongside all of that, some of the things that we've always done, there will be a need to continue with, you know, there will always be a need for food defences. It’s important where we do build defences, we build them with climate change allowances in mind. So that means, you know, not just thinking of what the what they will be now, but what it will be in 20, 30, 40, years time.

Cerian: Yeah.

Jeremy: But I think increasingly, you know, what's getting a lot of attention, quite rightly now, and not just now, but you know, for the last, you know, ten, ten years or probably more is thinking about the catchments as a whole. So, you know, a catchment is really, you know, the whole river system all the way back up from not just the community way floods all the way back up to the land upstream and thinking about how that land could be managed differently and you know, things like storing water upstream so it doesn't get downstream, things like trying to sort of alter watercourses a little bit to try and slow the slow the flow of the water.

Some of those things could come under the term natural flood management, and they have a place. But I think it's also important to say they're not necessarily going to stop all flooding all the time on their owners. And as I say, there's no there's no silver bullet. There's no one solution that fits everything. So we've also got teams that sort of think about the future and strategic planning.

And we've got we've got challenges on our Coast, for example, where, you know, some coastal communities are a severe risk of flooding in the future. And it's important that we think about that now rather than thinking, oh, it's okay now when we can think about it in the future so that, you know, a whole range of things that we're doing to sort of respond to the climate emergency and adapt.

And I think it's really important that, you know, it's not just responsibility of organizations like mine and ours. It's a big issue for the whole of society and all different organizations. We do need to we do need to work together on this.

Cerian: Yeah, absolutely. It's not something that any one person or one organization can fix. It needs to be, you know, all of us pulled together to do our bit, I suppose.

Jeremy: Absolutely.

Cerian: And it's a huge challenge. But, you know, reassuring to hear that this is something that Natural resources Wales and introduce management as well that we're you know already thinking about in adapting to. So before we finish up today, I'd really love to hear what your favourite part of the job is. What makes your role so rewarding? What's kept you here?

Jeremy: Oh wow. So that's a question, isn't it? So I think that, you know, what really motivates me now, and I think for a lot of people I work with them, you know, a lot of motivation from them, pleasure of the fact that we're helping, we’re helping people, we're helping people with what's you know, we've talked about there is a massive issue for society and it's horrible if it happens to you.

I've actually been flooded in the past and it's not it's not a pleasant experience and it is, as we say, sort of likely to get worse. So you can sort of think, oh blimey, what are we going to do about it? Or you can kind of, I don't know, you know, get involved and then try to do something about it.

So I, I like that element of it. I really like the kind of variety of the role. You know, I've, I've sort of worked up through the organization, I've done different roles, and I'm fortunate enough to be in a position where, you know, I oversee our work and I get involved with all sorts of different facets of it.

And I think, you know, that same is true for a lot of people in, in Natural Resources Wales. You know, you may start in one area and then you may move sort of slightly differently into another area as well. So I think it was all these things that motivated me and interest me and what, you know, what makes my role rewarding, what do I enjoy?

It's those bits. It's those bits that you think, can you make a difference? And it goes back to where I started in talking about, you know, interest in the natural environment and interest in natural processes. And this is a really good, good, good fit. You know, I really does make it worth it.

Cerian: Yeah, I can see that your passion really does come across. You know, it's easy to see. Thank you so much for kicking off our Flood Risk Management podcast. It's been really lovely to chat and to get an explanation of what flood risk management is all about.

I hope you've enjoyed this episode. If you have any comments or questions, you can contact us on Facebook, Twitter or Instagram or by the email address that you can find in the show notes.

You'll also find links to our flood risk management pages where you can view some of the things we've talked about here today. Thanks for listening.

Cyfoeth: The Natural Resources Wales Environment Podcast

1. Introduction to Flood Risk Management

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