2. Coastal Adaptation and Climate Change

In this series, you’ll hear from the different Natural Resources Wales teams who work together to reduce the risk of flooding to communities in Wales.

This will give you a good overview of what flood risk is, what we’re doing to manage it in Wales, and what impact the climate emergency is having on flood risk in Wales now and in the future.

·        Flood Risk Management Web Pages

·        Nature Based Solutions for Coastal Management

·         Shoreline Management Plans

·        National Flood Asset Database

·        Natural Resources Wales / Check flood warnings

·        Natural Resources Wales / Check river levels, rainfall and sea data

·        Natural Resources Wales / 5 day flood risk outlook

·        Natural Resources Wales / Check your flood risk on a map (Flood Risk Assessment Wales Map)

·        Natural Resources Wales / Flood Map for Planning / Development Advice Map

·        Natural Resources Wales / Jobs, apprenticeships and placements

If you have any questions or comments on anything covered in this podcast series, contact us at FloodRiskManagement.Strategic@naturalresourceswales.gov.uk

Transcript

CG: Hi there and welcome to the Natural Resources Wales podcast mini-series o flood risk management. My name is Cerian Gingell and I work here at Natural Resources Wales. In this series you’ll hear from the different teams that work together to reduce the risk of flooding to communities in Wales. This will give you a really good overview of what flood risk is, what we are doing to manage it in Wales and what impact the climate emergency is having on flood risk in Wales both now and in the future.

Hello and welcome to episode 2 of the Natural Resources Wales Flood Risk Management mini-series! Today I’m joined by Dr Richard Park who is going to talk to us about Coastal Adaptation and Climate Change. 

CG: Just one thing before we start, near the beginning this interview was very rudely interrupted by Rosie, Rick’s 23-year-old cat, so we do apologise for her interruption.

Welcome Rick, and thanks so much for joining us! 

I wonder if we can start off by you giving us a little insight into your background, your education or career path but you know essentially what’s led to you being here today managing the national habitat creation programme and in Natural Resources Wales Coastal Adaptation Programme too?

RP: Hi Cerian, well thanks for having me! A little bit about myself then, I’ve got over 30 years of experience of conservation and coastal management. I’ve always had lot of motivation, and a passion and enthusiasm for marine conservation and protecting marine life. It’s fair to say I didn’t get an awful lot of career advice at the time when I was in school but that enthusiasm I have for nature combined with a bit of independent research helped me to realise that I had to focus on doing the best I could at school and in particular in studying the classics, you know the sciences, maths and English for what you call GCSE’s these days but back in my day were called O levels.

CG: Ahhh

RP: I’ve been, you know, interested in subjects like geography and biology and chemistry and the like and after than I decided to focus my attention on doing those main exams and then moving on to do a focus on working with sea and conservation and opted to study a joint honours degree, that was after doing A’levels of course.

CG: Yeh…

RP: For those of you who are not aware, a joint honours degree is basically doing two main subjects as part of your degree and I studied zoology and Marine biology and that was then…

CG: Oooh…

RP: Bangor University and the Menai Bridge labs there.

CG: Nice! So a nice bit of the world to be studying in. North Wales is beautiful.

RP: Very nice yes. So you know once you’ve got your degree, you really good to go and join the workforce at an entry level at an organisation like Natural Resources Wales but for me I was headed on a slightly different path and I decided I wanted to harness that enthusiasm and passion and really zone in on specific specialisms in marine science. So I decided to study further and I gained a Phd in marine science and Edinburgh University during which I focused on Scottish marine lochs in remote parts of western Scotland.

CG: Another lovely part of the world

RP: Yeh. So I have worked in a variety of environmental organisations over the years including working (cat miaows in the background) as a marine biologist for the Scottish Environment Protection Agency (SEPA) leading the Gwent Wildlife Trust and the living Seas agenda for the Wildlife Trust Wales and finally in my current role on coastal adaptation and leading on habitat creation in response to sea level rise here at Natural Resources Wales. In between all this I did a fair amount of global travelling which really helped get a wider perspective and helped develop my self-confidence.

CG: And I guess, I guess it’s sort of useful that you get to see other parts of the world and other parts of, you know, other coastlines then, so you can sort of see the similarities and the differences kind of around the world really which I guess is interesting when you’ve got that kind of specialism in mind.

RP: Absolutely!

CG: Yeh… but it sounds like a really varied career history and really a wealth of knowledge that you’ve brought with you! So I think before we get on to the big questions, perhaps we’ll start with the basics and ask you to explain some of the things we’ll cover today. So maybe we’ll start with What is sea level rise?  

RP: Ok, so I mean climate change related sea level rise, because there have been other sea level rises over the history of the world related to glacial periods and the like, climate related sea level rise as the name suggests simply means the level of the water in the sea rising in response to the global warming effects of green-house gasses and that’s primarily the carbon dioxide and methane. The rise in global sea levels is caused primarily by two main factors related to that global warming: the addition of water from melting ice sheets – that’s ice sheets actually on land, such as glaciers and the like, and also the expansion of sea water as it warms up in response to climate change – the scientific term for that latter element is thermal expansion.  If you think about a glass of water in your warm hands and then you add ice cubes, now, you know, it fills up as the ice cubes melt and maybe the water spills over. Now as that water warms more, it continues to spill over further so in a nutshell, that’s thermal expansion at work. 

CG: Ooooh that’s interesting

RP: Yeh that’s essentially what’s happening to our seas when the glaciers and ice sheets melt, and the water warms up.

CG: It’s an interesting analogy as well and I think helps to sort of picture it more you know

RP: Yeh 

CG: So that’s good, thank you, that was a good explanation I think.

RP: Well I mean for the Welsh coastline that could mean a significant change in mean sea level rise of somewhere between 50cm to well over a meter over the course of the next century, so this is a very serious challenge for coastal communities and farmers working in low lying coastal flood plains. The range in predictions that we have reflect how mankind responds to this challenge of climate change primarily by capping our emissions of CO2! Sea level rise has also a negative impact on vulnerable marine life of course as the shallow water habitats are squeezed against man-made structures on our coasts – a process known as coastal squeeze. 

CG: Yeh it’s not just about the rising sea level and the effect that has on people and properties but also the biodiversity angle and the habitats and wildlife and all of that sort of thing

RP: Yeh it’s a bit of a gloomy picture really and a massive challenge for mankind in terms of our biosphere because there are more profound changes related to sea level and sea changes relating to sea level rise and also water temperatures too such as shifts in the natural distribution of marine plants and animals, sort of alien species if you like, the exotic species moving into our coastal waters and also the acidification of our oceans from dissolved carbon dioxide which means that more acidic water dissolves things like coral reefs or the shells of molluscs such as snails. And coupled with that, I mean coral reefs are also threatened by rising sea temperatures that bleach the corals by removing their symbiotic little algae that live within their cells, so this is another impact. This is a major impact on the ecosystem, the global ecosystem, and many of the impacts are pretty significant particularly in relation to things like coral reefs but also the mammals the sea mammals, the whales that rely on a lot of these microscopic, shelled creatures that are potentially threatened by rising levels of acidification in our oceans.

CG: Hmmm

RG: I mean there are also impacts on homes and infrastructure – roads, railways, electricity, gas and water distribution as well.

CG: Yes… so as you said it’s that kind of impact on people but also the impact on nature. It’s two-fold really isn’t it. So what about coastal adaptation and habitat creation, what is that? 

RP: Well… Coastal adaption is about planning and subsequently implementing sustainable flood protection and the inevitable changes in low lying areas are vulnerable from the rising sea levels and in our context our focus is on Wales for Natural Resources Wales. And for large communities at risk from flooding this means providing the best standards of flood protection for the medium to long-term that can be achieved. And for more rural areas where isolated properties are at risk as well as roads and services like gas and electricity for example – the focus is to explore all options for providing the best outcome for those affected whilst still planning for change because the primary focus for Welsh Government is communities at risk and putting that right at the top of priority if you like. 

CG: And rightly so you know, it’s important to protect people and properties isn’t it

RP: So realistically apart of that change that we would be planning for could be a shift in the coastline in response to rising sea levels. Many parts of the Welsh coastline and indeed, around Britain and the wider world are low lying. Some of these areas which we farm today for example or have roads or houses on land that used to be part of the coast in fact over the history over that strip, that coastal strip, and has over time, over the years been reclaimed, and is subsequently very vulnerable. Therefore, as a consequence of climate change and sea level rise some of these areas that have previously been protected are going to be subject to change. 

CG: So, I guess perhaps they won’t be protected potentially then in future you know if the sea reclaims that bit of land as you say, I supposed there is only so much you can do to fight against nature.

RP: Yeh, I mean over the next century these areas are going to be subject to some very difficult decisions otherwise they may face changes such as the sea reclaiming large low-lying areas and affected properties and infrastructure being protected the best you can or ultimately moved entirely to higher ground! This is a studied and looked at and planned for at a local level and it is the opportunities that arise in respect to these changes that also offer some opportunity for new habitats that is also a focus for NRW. So, it’s as if you like, exploring possibilities for this shifting flood risk management and how that may help support not only the communities that are affected but also the possibilities of managing their conservation management through sustainable management of natural resources.

CG: So, it’s a bit of a balancing act really isn’t it?

RP: Yeh that’s right and when these areas are subject to land use change through reduced coastal protection then habitat creation, restoration, or enhancement opportunities just simply may arise. These new areas of habitat will help to protect the resilience of the marine environment to the effects of climate change, so you know adaptation management also addresses the impacts and possible mitigation measures for a whole host of things including properties, roads, infrastructure as well as habitats that are affected by these changes.  

CG: Yeh and I think from my understanding the evidence shows that we’re already on path to some fairly significant sea level rise and the associated challenges that that brings, so how do you see that impacting your work in future?  

RP: Yes, if we think about sea level rise, we’ve already talked about how global warming and climate change are increasing our levels, tidal levels, and that’s only going to happen more as our planet warms further over the coming decades and beyond. So that naturally will mean more coastal communities will become vulnerable to flooding, tidal flooding in particular, and those that are already vulnerable to this sort of factor are likely to see increasing levels of flood risk. It’s a real concern with far reaching impacts now and in the medium to long-term not only to communities but also to farmland and the environment. 

CG: What are we doing then in Natural Resources Wales to help with this? 

RP: As I’ve already indicated the planning side of things, so there are a lot of areas vulnerable to sea level rise around Wales and this is going to be a challenging problem to solve so Natural Resources Wales have identified and prioritised many of these areas, these are particularly vulnerable some of them are subject to our flood protection assets which are keeping them safe at the moment.

CG: So that’s the defences and things

RP: That’s right 

CG: The sea walls and all the other defences that we’ve built and maintained over the years.

RP: Yes and we have permissive powers to maintain these levels of flood protection but some of them have also been identified as no longer viable and if you like, a priority in the future, particularly in areas where there are low communities at risk being protected by these assets. So we’re looking at these areas in great detail and that involves engaging with and working with other organisations as well as those affected by the changes that could happen including local authorities, landowners, and property owners. It’s really important that we try to establish some very sound evidence for the costs and benefits of providing solutions to this rising sea level problem. This could include protecting or decommissioning assets and improving them, allowing them and accepting change – allowing them to deteriorate and accepting change is another possibility. In some ways we’re guided and steered by the Welsh shoreline management plans which act as a bit of a roadmap for this area of policy. These policy areas help us in our evaluation and assessment of options at various locations but the crux of it is that we aim to do the very best we can in protecting the interests of the environment, the people, and the wellbeing of properties on behalf of Welsh Government in these areas where our assets are currently providing that level of protection but that may not be guaranteed in the future depending on their sustainability. Ultimately, we’re aiming to provide sustainable flood risk management. Of course, the responsibility for managing all this change doesn’t just fall upon Natural Resources Wales and as result we are working with local authorities, Welsh Government and 3rd parties in trying to address this challenge.

CG: So it’s a bit of team work really, its NRW of course as the national organisation for Wales but you know there will be a need clearly to work with local councils as you say Welsh Government and potential third parties, it could be landowners, it could be those who own property, it’s everyone pulling together really and pulling together to come up with, as you say, sustainable flooding risk management. So you’ve mentioned Shoreline Management Plans there and how they act really as bit of a roadmap so could you explain perhaps a little bit more about what that means? What are they and what do they do?

RP: Of course – I mean Wales has got four Shoreline Management Plans - which are as the name suggests, plans to sustainably manage our shorelines. These have addressed some of the priorities for coastal protection in the face of rising sea levels over the coming century and also highlights areas where investing in flood risk management is a priority for Welsh Government, and for Flood Risk Management Authorities (such as Natural Resources Wales and local councils), it also identifies areas that are not priority. There are many reasons as to why one location is a priority where another isn’t – funding availability for example, how economically viable a flood defence scheme may or may not be, or other measures such as you know whether not there is a large community at risk so it’s a complicated picture. And there are no easy answers unfortunately and every extreme weather event also produces sometimes tidal surges which can add a metre or a couple of metres of tidal level coinciding with storm events or spring tides and low atmospheric pressure and you also get fluvial, which is river flood events which combine with that. So assets can get damaged and the reality of these shoreline management plans, and the effects of rising sea levels when these extreme events happen, quite often suddenly come into focus. The cost of repairing these damaged assets are very much dependant on the shoreline management plan policy for that particular area of coastline, where the thinking is already happened if you like as to whether or not they should be invested in.

CG: Yeh

RP: So I mean the focus of coastal adaption is planning to identify key areas where this challenge is greatest and help evaluate all the options for managing change, changing flood risk protection in consultation with those affected by this issue. This would include landowners, infrastructure, and other stakeholders. Planning for adaptation and developing the evidence for all the possible options to offer protection to communities while minimising the impacts on other vulnerable infrastructure such as roads and power lines and balancing that against the environmental needs for an area. It’s a high level of planning required and consultation and developing that evidence is crucial to knowing the best options for each vulnerable area and building a case for investment to either develop existing or alternative flood defences or indeed planning for change.

CG: Yeh, I imagine that those discussions and engagement with the public and other stakeholders that could be quite challenging, and I guess quite emotive too. I mean the need to get the evidence and facts for the different options must be really important? 

RP: It’s very important, I mean these assessments are far reaching and involve a lot of different evaluations and assessments including areas such as economics, environmental considerations, and the effects on ground water and land use and potential land use change, and of course the impacts of the various options that exist within for sustainable flood risk management and how they can affect people and properties. Another aspect is the cost verses benefits of flood protection measures is pure economics if you like and the impacts these defences would have on the environment and landscape.

CG: Yeh because again it is a balancing act, you know it is important to protect people and to protect people’s properties, but it is also important to protect the environment isn’t it so again it is that balancing act there. It’s a tricky thing.

RP: I think one of the primary things is to understand the current baseline condition and longevity of these flood risk management assets as they stand right now and then if you like comparing that with how that is going to change as sea levels rise and those assets naturally do deteriorate are all important factors. These assessments draw upon the expertise and knowledge of many specialisms within Natural Resources Wales, you know this harks back to what I said right at the beginning in terms of enthusiasm for a subject and people have an enthusiasm and develop their career in lots of different areas and I very fortunately we draw upon the many talented personnel within NRW, you know dedicated people who work in various teams, they have various expertise we draw upon during this kind of assessment work - people who work on groundwater, licencing of different discharges of various types of pollution impact, people who have expertise in marine or terrestrial environments, those who focus on managing public access or heritage, archaeology, protected sites... For me it is extremely rewarding working amongst a group of people who have their own passion and enthusiasm and who are helping to work on tackling this challenge of coastal adaptation and sea level rise on communities and the environment.

CG: Yeh because it is a big challenge isn’t it and as you say there are a lot of different specialisms there, lots of different people all working together to try to sort of figure out a way forward I suppose really. I know it’s an important challenge and it’s a huge challenge so it’s good to know we’ve got lots of people working on it really. Thank you really for giving up your time to talk to me today. It’s been really interesting to hear all about the work that you’ve been doing and continue to do to in our coastal communities here in Wales. I think before I let you go, I’ve just got one last question… and that would be what’s your favourite part of the work is? What’s the bit that you find most rewarding? 

RP: I mean as we’ve discussed today, the challenge from rising sea levels and planning for adaptation on the coast is far reaching and it’s far reaching in respect to social, economic, and environmental impacts so you know, harking back to my specialist interest which is the marine environment and so the natural focus is very much on that really and also working with others in Natural Resources Wales with their own enthusiasm and specialism. So for me it’s about getting the very best outcomes for nature, and in particular the marine and terrestrial and aquatic elements of conservation management and it’s without question that the threat from climate change and sea level rise in particular on our natural environment outweighs so many other problems that we have to face here in Wales so being part of this process of helping to plan and manage this element of natural conservation management is very rewarding, and you know it’s a very beneficial thing to do for those of you considering a career in conservation or something to do with the natural environment. 

CG: I’m sure lots of our listeners would agree that what you’re doing is very beneficial for our natural marine environment and I am sure there will be people listening who are now thinking, even if they weren’t thinking before than hmmmm this is an interesting path so thanks again Rick for joining us today and taking us through all of that. It was really interesting.

RP: You’re very welcome.

CG: I hope you’ve enjoyed today’s episode, if you have any comments or questions, you can contact us on Facebook, Twitter or Instagram or by email – which you can find in the show notes. You’ll also find links to our flood risk management pages where you can view some of the things we’ve talked about here today. Thanks for listening.