The Bamboo Lab Podcast
Be More "Interested" Than "Interesting": Brian Fretwell's Guide to Authentic Interactions and Potential Unlocked
Has the quest for authentic connections in a digital world ever seemed like an uphill battle to you? Then you'll find solace and inspiration in our conversation with Brian Fretwell, an enchanting storyteller and the brain behind Finding Good. Brian takes us through his own transformation—from a small-town Idaho kid influenced by a pivotal football coach to becoming a guiding light for countless individuals seeking to unlock their potential. His journey is not just about personal triumph but also about the power of stories in building trust and fostering supportive environments.
Picture this: a world where sharing our successes is as natural and accepted as admitting our faults. That's the world Brian hopes to cultivate, where vulnerability is not a weakness but a bridge to deeper connections. Through discussions on the psychology of sharing achievements and the dynamics of meaningful conversations, we discover how to approach others with genuine curiosity and the right questions—turning even the briefest of exchanges into opportunities for growth and understanding. As we peel back the layers of creating authentic connections, Brian's insightful anecdotes provide a roadmap to a richer, more connected life.
By the end of our journey, we're equipped with Brian's innovative tools like 'success mapping' which promises to revolutionize how we think strategically and take ownership in various aspects of our lives. And for those seeking to enhance their connection skills, Brian offers a sneak peek into the upcoming Finding Good certification course. Reflecting on untapped potential culminates in a tender moment relating to Brian's grandson's experiences, leaving us with a poignant reminder of the endless possibilities that await when we foster genuine connections. Join us as we celebrate the stories that shape us and the bonds that propel us forward.
Check out Brian's work and services. CLICK BELOW!
https://www.findinggood.com/
https://bamboolab3.com/
Has the quest for authentic connections in a digital world ever seemed like an uphill battle to you? Then you'll find solace and inspiration in our conversation with Brian Fretwell, an enchanting storyteller and the brain behind Finding Good. Brian takes us through his own transformation—from a small-town Idaho kid influenced by a pivotal football coach to becoming a guiding light for countless individuals seeking to unlock their potential. His journey is not just about personal triumph but also about the power of stories in building trust and fostering supportive environments.
Picture this: a world where sharing our successes is as natural and accepted as admitting our faults. That's the world Brian hopes to cultivate, where vulnerability is not a weakness but a bridge to deeper connections. Through discussions on the psychology of sharing achievements and the dynamics of meaningful conversations, we discover how to approach others with genuine curiosity and the right questions—turning even the briefest of exchanges into opportunities for growth and understanding. As we peel back the layers of creating authentic connections, Brian's insightful anecdotes provide a roadmap to a richer, more connected life.
By the end of our journey, we're equipped with Brian's innovative tools like 'success mapping' which promises to revolutionize how we think strategically and take ownership in various aspects of our lives. And for those seeking to enhance their connection skills, Brian offers a sneak peek into the upcoming Finding Good certification course. Reflecting on untapped potential culminates in a tender moment relating to Brian's grandson's experiences, leaving us with a poignant reminder of the endless possibilities that await when we foster genuine connections. Join us as we celebrate the stories that shape us and the bonds that propel us forward.
Check out Brian's work and services. CLICK BELOW!
https://www.findinggood.com/
https://bamboolab3.com/
Hello and welcome to the Bamboo Lab Podcast with your host, peak Performance Coach, brian Bosley. Are you stuck on the hamster wheel of life, spinning and spinning but not really moving forward? Are you ready to jump off and soar? Are you finally ready to sculpt your life? If so, you've landed in the right place. This podcast is created and broadcast just for you, all of you strivers, thrivers and survivors out there. If you'd like to learn more about Brian and the Bamboo Lab, feel free to reach out to explore your true peak level at wwwbamboolab3.com.
Brian B:Welcome everyone to this week's episode of the Bamboo Lab Podcast. Folks, we have an amazing guest on here today and we've been working on getting him on for the past couple of months. So we have Brian Fretwell on, and I do want to read Brian's bio and I haven't, in the last few episodes, been reading bios, but I was so impressed with it I thought I got to share this. So, brian, while most speakers are focused on being thought leaders in their areas of expertise, brian Fretwell strives to be an application leader. He's constantly creating new tools that people can use right away, whether or not they understand the science behind it. As the founder of Finding Good, he works with his team to build these tools every day. And, ladies and gentlemen, he has spoken all over the world, from Istanbul to Perth and all points in between. His TEDx talk has generated over 2.4 million views. His TikTok videos are viewed by millions monthly in his book titled Experts of Our Potential, which we will include a link in the show notes today, folks, so please check it out. It's widely popular because Brian is a natural, compelling and engaging storyteller.
Brian B:He lives in Boise, idaho, with his wife, jamie, who just happens to be a transpersonal counselor. They spend their time taking walks and doing behavioral experiments on their dogs, hank and Daisy. I love that, brian. And also a little side note also, brian played rugby at the University of Idaho and we played the same position, two positions. We both played and we both share the last name and we're both in a very similar industry, so this one's an honor for me. So, brian Fretwell, my new friend, welcome to the Bamboo Lab podcast.
Brian F:Yeah well, thanks for having me. I look forward to the conversation and to be chatting with another rugger. Sounds like a lot of fun too. Yeah, we're still around, Right yeah?
Brian B:We got to give a shout out to Brandon Mullix for connecting us.
Brian F:Yeah, which is funny. I saw him today. We did a little lunchtime webinar on one of our new um uh conversation guides and he joined us. So I got to say hi and I got to see him in person a month ago at the uh, some big chicken convention.
Brian B:Yeah he told me convention yeah, he's, he's quite the character. I really really really like that fella and I know he's gonna listen. So I really really really like that fella and I know he's going to listen. So he thinks I'm going to be blowing smoke. But I've got to share one thing. Yesterday I was talking to him on the phone and he said something and I said I agree with you. He goes I don't care if you agree with me. I said Brandon, you wait with bated breath on every word. I say Don't you try to convince me. You don't care what I think. So we had a little fun with that one for a while.
Brian F:Yeah, it's a nice response. That's funny. Yeah, Well, Brian, I've got the.
Brian B:I learned a little bit from Brandon about you and of course it's kind of hard not to find you on social media, on YouTube, and I've done a lot of research. But can you share with us, in the bamboo pack, a little bit about yourself, where you're from, you know, share with us your childhood, whatever you'd like, maybe what inspired you growing up?
Brian F:yeah, um, so I was born and raised in Idaho a couple different parts. My I was born in northern Idaho, my father worked in the uh, the mining industry up there until the mine shut down and then we moved to southeast Idaho, which he drove a potato truck down there. And so small town one to small town two. And then I grew up in small town, american Falls, but in that small town and it's interesting because I'm working on a book right now, so this story is real fresh in my head, like everything I'm doing right now can actually be, you know, like tied back to some of the experiences there, and specifically one with a coach who essentially, through the questions he was asking, really got me to see myself differently.
Brian F:And I was 14 years old and I'm six foot four and, uh, I kind of got all of my height at the same time, which also meant that I was really awkward and uh and uncoordinated and um, and at that time, at 14, uh, I was around some friends that were, you know, doing drugs, doing things, you know, leading one kind of life, and then I was also going to these workouts every day with the football team and sort of, and then I'd go to these workouts and I wasn't very coordinated, so I was getting laughed at, made fun of a lot, and I was in one of these inflection points of like, well, what am I going to do next? And uh, and I went to this practice with this old coach Bob is what we call them. He's he's since passed on, but he sent everybody in a group and started asking you know which, which position are you going to play? And I remember being kind of the last one in the the circle of people to answer, and I had no answer for him because I didn't, I just had zero confidence. And uh, and at that moment I remember and I can still, you know, picture it in my head clearly he looked and he said you know, uh, I saw you in there working out in the gym and and hitting the punching bag, and, just like he said, I, I talked to kids about giving all their effort all the time and I wondered, like what caught you know what?
Brian F:What has you working as hard as you do in there?
Brian F:And and it was the first time somebody had, like, actually asked for my opinion, or I'm sure it happened before, but it was perhaps one of the most memorable times and I got to share with him how my grandfather was a, uh, a boxer in the Navy and how my father had taught me boxing and also taught me this idea of, like you know you, you don't do anything unless you do it 120%.
Brian F:And, and I just remember in this interaction him, he wasn't trying to change my opinion or my mind, he was just literally, you know, listening to me and and helping me feel as though my story has value and, um, and that was such a that and similar experiences I always say, cause there were other coaches, there were other people, but it was experiences like those that, um, that really sort of formulated the direction of my life, because, uh, a few of the other people that that you know I'd hung out with in the other group, some close friends, um, you know, I had a couple of friends that died before 18 and then my, uh, my stepsister ended up, um, you know, up, spending the majority of her adult life in jail.
Brian F:And so I have a real stark contrast of which path I could have taken in my professional life, trying to understand what allows that, you know, what, how, how people can do, essentially what Bob did Right and um, and what works and what doesn't and specifically, and so a lot of that is behind why I've spent so many years focused on questions and uh, and then questions with brain science and then now the overlay with the the science of connection is is all in some way rooted to really trying to um again figure out and quantify what, what happens in those, those situations.
Brian B:Isn't it an amazing how some one small moment like that that you could remember what 30, 40 years later, um, you can remember one question someone asked you, or one piece of inspiration, or even a little bit of confidence somebody's just you know lent to you at that moment can just be a a little jolt or a nudge to a different path in life. And we, I wonder how often I look at that. Sometimes, brian, and I think I wonder how many times I've missed the opportunity to do that with someone. You know, maybe I'm busy, I'm stressed, I'm going to, I'm going to follow a mood or, you know, tired, and you just wonder how many opportunities we have and how many opportunities we missed to do that for other people, because I know that's what happened to me opportunities we missed to do that for other people, because I know that's what happened to me.
Brian F:Well, there's another interesting thing about what we missed and it's not so. We tend to go there and and, just as you sort of identified, because our brain has this negativity bias, we we tend to think of it and like what? What conversation like that did I miss? But there's another conversation that I found through you know so many conversations about. Well, for instance, when I talked to Coach Bob about this years later, before he passed away, he didn't remember that interaction and I think that you know, for folks like you, but for everyone you've likely had the conversation, had no idea you were having it. That's true, Because what we understand about connection and about you know, in the sort of the research and work I've done for the last 15 years, is that those we tend to think those conversations happen because somebody asked a brilliant question.
Brian F:Conversations happen because somebody asked a brilliant question, or they had a brilliant insight, or they were very charismatic, or they had this real joie de vivre or something like that. But the reality is, and what I would say that the science more points to, is they happen when we're experiencing high levels of connection. They happen when we feel like we trust this person, that this person understands us, that this person sees us in a way we may not even see ourselves, and when that happens, then we're exponentially more open to advice. We're more open to you know advice. We're more open to you know like new direction. We're more open to you know, whatever suggestions they have, we're listening at a higher level and they can feel, as you've described, very you know, just life-changing affirming. They can be very memorable, but the thing that's making a memorable is this high level of connection that our brain is, quite frankly, looking for all the time can I ask you, talking about connection, have what?
Brian B:how have you seen the need for high level connection change over the past three or four years, since covid in the pandemic?
Brian F:yeah. So I would say the need has not changed at all. The need is biological. We need connection at the same level as we need food and water. And when I say that to people they're sort of like, well, what are you talking about? But it's an easy thing to actually explain, because we can explain it through disconnection For people, that all of us, when we've had somebody either pass away or leave us suddenly, when there's a disconnect, when there's a break in a relationship that was important to us, that suddenly and especially if it's unexplainably goes the other way, we say things.
Brian F:We say I can't eat, I can't sleep, I can't focus, I can't think, and what is coming out of us in our verbiage is actually an explanation of what's happening in our head. Our brain is literally reprioritizing connection above food and water and sleep. And we're not the only mammal like this. We see this in wolves, we see this in elephants, different mammals that prioritize reconnection with the quote-unquote pack over food, water and shelter. And so like we tend to experience it in these really negative situations, Like we can experience it when we have the disconnect, what we don't do is then understand, like understand how much we need it consistently.
Brian F:Now, the thing that has changed. Again, it's not the biological need. What has changed is how we get it, and in an environment that is replete with distractions, there's so many different ways of pulling our attention, there's so many ways of communicating, there's so many different environmental stressors and, if you will, danger, because that's how our brain sees it. How we connect and this is a lot of the thesis behind the company I've been building for four years how we connect has to change. We have to be better at it, and I think we're all experiencing the effects of this environment changing, making it harder to connect. And then we see our inability to work together, as you know, to understand each other, to, you know, to be effective with each other, is eroding because we're not meeting that fundamental need for connection.
Brian B:So when you look at social media, texting, even emails, obviously it probably and I'm talking more about communication, not necessarily connection. I don't know if there's, I don't think they're synonymous necessarily. No, they're not. There seems like there's more communication, Like I remember before texting, I could sit at my house all day and maybe get one phone call on a Saturday, maybe two, now texting and email and you know FaceTiming. So do you think, with this the new, with this the new technology, the new form of communication that we tend to be taking over, how has that affected connection when we have more communication? But is it less connection?
Brian F:Well, kind of. So what we know, I mean, I think a lot of the research shows that like and I try to tell people this softly because there's a lot of like really ingrained sort of ideas on the effects of social media the effects of social media are to, to, to put it, you know mildly that that are are very overblown. This is just a different communication medium that is replete with the same drawbacks and benefits of communicating in person. What we miss and I think like the real thing that we miss that does not lead to connection, is how we used to get connection. I'll say it this way so you, well, you, you told me before the show your age I'm 45.
Brian F:I lived in a period of time and had an experience unique to both the time and where I was at, where I would go to dinner and sit and we would be there for 45 minutes. Or I would go on a car ride without any other mode of communication and be forced to talk to people, the same people for three to eight hours. And in those processes we have moments of what I call accidental communication or, excuse me, accidental connection, and we define connection here by the mutual exchange of value that is created when an individual shares part of their story and so, meaning, like in this long car ride, I might hear about your actual lived experience in a way that has value for me because I reflect on my own experience that's actually the mechanism that creates connection. We tend to think of connection as like we have something in common, but it's actually it's. Until our experiences are shared one way or the other, or both, connection isn't actually happening, and so we used to have those experiences.
Brian B:Can you say that again please? Yeah, yeah.
Brian F:Okay, yeah.
Brian F:So, I Okay, yeah, so I'll explain it, unless until, if you will, I know something about your actual lived experience, that you're in by by know something you've told me, okay, and told me largely in story form. Until, until I get, I don't actually know anything about you. So, for instance, like, if you told me what your goals are, I can assume things about your actual lived experience through that. But neither of us are actually going to leave feeling much more connected If I switch into like hey, how did you come to those goals this week? Like, walk me through the process.
Brian F:Now I'm in your actual experience and that experience is actually providing me value, because there's a likelihood that I might be, you know, utilizing that experience, that process that you actually did in your life in my own right. So that's kind of a simplification of it in my own right. So that's, it's a kind of a simplification of it. But, like, until there's a, until one person is able to share a story of an actual lived experience, the level of connection is much, much lower. And then how and where we share the actual experience, we call the, the, the mutual exchange of value, or the in, in this case, the swapping of experience. Um, then that's where the those deeper levels of connection uh are actually experienced, because that's how we've been designed, if you will, to to um, to get that, because it's a again, it's a survival.
Brian B:Now I can see why like your book as well as your your the videos I've seen on YouTube. You tell a lot of stories in those. Ok yeah, yeah, and.
Brian F:So we learn best through stories, and I think most people know that what we I think what we, what we teach, is that connection happens not necessarily, like it's not about me telling my story. Can I, I control connection happening much more when I'm able to help somebody else tell their story yeah and and and find my interest in that story, and so an easier way to remember this is we call it the blueberry story. So if you think about why we need connection at what a neuroscience would call as an adaptive function, the reason our brain was created this way and this is I stole this from a neural anthropologist, but I think it's just a good metaphor If you and I were in the same pack, right, we're sitting around the campfire, we know we rely on each other for survival. Well, if you go out today and you find a bunch of blueberries and you come back, I'm super excited, we get to eat and I congratulate you and that's awesome. Well, for most of us, that's where the whole situation ends. Right, At work, you did something good, we say good job. But if you and I are in a pack, sitting around the campfire, relying on each other for survival, the blueberries are important for survival.
Brian F:But the moment you bring the blueberries back, the thing that I actually need to increase the chances that I'm going to survive, whether you're there or not, and especially when I'm out getting blueberries on my own is the story of how you found those blueberries. What strength did you use? How did you push through? How did you keep going? Everything about that experience has value to me. How did you keep going? Everything about that experience has value to me. And it's this interesting process because when you came back with the blueberries just like you've likely done in any goal you've achieved is you sit down and start thinking about what you could have done better, what you missed or what you need to improve, Because your brain by itself has a negativity bias. But when I ask you how you found it, your brain amplifies the story of your success.
Brian B:And so a connection is about how we create these shared stories of success. Okay, so, you know, as you were talking, I was thinking last night I told you, prior to the recording, the speech I've been working on this week and last night I, you know, I I rewrote it, shortened it and then last night I and I did a run through, took an hour to go through. Well, took more because it was a two hour speech. I had to condense to one but, and I sat down last night at my chair, I don't know five o'clock, perhaps five 30. And okay, now let's get through. Let's get through this. It's, you know, go to the next level with this thing.
Brian B:And I look outside. Here comes a friend of mine pulling in. Now, I've lived in this house for almost two years. I may have had four people pop in unannounced in my before. I live a little further away from all my friends, I'm seldom home. He drove by, saw my Jeep in the driveway and pulled in and I'm like, oh man, you know. All right. I just said, okay, you know just a distraction for me.
Brian B:I got all this work to do. He came in, he stayed for two and a half hours and what we did in that two and a half hours is we shared our stories. He's a really good friend of mine. I love him dearly and he walked away. I thought you'd think I would have been more stressed because I just killed two and a half hours of prep necessary prep time. I felt so much more relaxed and I said to myself I'm putting it down, I'm going to bed, and I woke up this morning so refreshed because we just sat and connected.
Brian B:You know, we haven't been able to do that a lot in the last couple of years, Little bits and pieces here and there, but it was like you know, I wouldn't have wanted that, had somebody said you want somebody coming in and staying two hours, and I would have said, God, you know I don't have the time, but I felt so much better. So I have a question for you when you're making these connections with others, you know through story where does vulnerability come in? When you can be vulnerable, what does that? Do for connection.
Brian F:Yeah, it's. Yeah, that's a fantastic question, because I was wrong about this in the first two years of the first year or so of like. We have a framework for how to ask questions, how to use them for problem solving goals and all those things that we felt in the four years. But and and in the first year we were just practicing these questions and and people kept saying like, oh, you know, we would use a question like, um, what went well in the last week, which is a question I do with a group of four friends every week, and we've done it for one hour every week for the last eight years, right? Or we would do what was most interesting part of your week how did you get over a challenge this week? They're all positively oriented questions looking at your experience, and people would say, like, boy, there's a lot of vulnerability required in there and my wife is a counselor, and so I've been very specific in this process of like. I don't ask questions like you know, uh, tell me about the most traumatic event in your life, because I don't have the skills to to respond to that if that, that that re-traumatizes you or that you know that triggers you into an emotional spiral or something, and and and we actually that is not the question you would ask you know, like, uh, the person in your pack, because you're not trying to recreate that right, um, but so I was like, well, we're not, I'm not asking people to be vulnerable. At least initially, I thought. And then, once we really dug into it, what we realized is that it's actually easier from a psychological safety standpoint. It's easier for me to tell you about a problem, even a problem I created, even something I did wrong. It's psychologically less dangerous for me to do that with a stranger or somebody I know than it is with the stranger or somebody I know to say here is what I really care about, here is what I did. Well, here is the thing I did that really matters and that I think had an impact on others.
Brian F:The vulnerability required to share the things that we care about, that we think we're good at, that we believe in and not believe in like in terms of ideology, but like that underlying value that's driving it, that puts us at a much greater degree of risk.
Brian F:So it requires more vulnerability, but it's a different experience in vulnerability, right, and that's one of the things we really teach is like how do you create that level of vulnerability that is counter to how we've likely been taught vulnerability Like you don't fess up to your problem, versus we just get done as a company with over you know, overcoming a big challenge or overcome or achieving a big goal, and now we sit down and objectively say you need to identify your part in the achievement of this goal.
Brian F:You need to identify your part and we need to map out so we know exactly how this thing happened and that and and the vulnerability record that the trust that is required in a team to be able to do that objectively is a much higher level of trust than a team that can sit around and and and, while it's good to be able to honestly talk about the problems and the things we did, is simply not doesn't have the. It doesn't require the, the the level of trust that that being able to really identify each person's part in the success does so, so okay, so it's.
Brian B:You're saying it's more vulnerable or maybe more challenging, but uh, regarding our vulnerability to share what something that we did that had a positive impact on a project or a person potentially than it is for us to share a problem we created.
Brian F:Yeah, it's interesting, think about, think about just going home right after. So you got this speech coming up right and if you I didn't sorry, I'm assuming um, uh, are you? Are you who do you go? Do you have somebody at home waiting for you?
Brian B:No, not when I'm home here at my house.
Brian F:No, I'm an empty nester now.
Brian F:Okay, so we'll use this person that showed up to your house the other day and you come back and I want you to think through both. You come back and you tell this person I did not do very well on this speech, like I kind of screwed this up in this one, right, and you think about how he might respond to that. Then I want you to think about if you go and do this speech and you come back and the first thing out of your mouth is like I want to tell you how awesome I did on this speech and how much it changed the other's life. Which one of those do you think puts you at more risk for rejection in that moment?
Brian B:Well, I can tell you, because when you said, when I if I went in there and said you want, I want to tell you how I rocked this speech, I cringed.
Brian F:Yeah, yeah, a hundred percent. A hundred percent Because, because I there's a level of arrogance I would need right To do that. So what that shows us is that, like, oh, to be able to share that required, like we had like, requires a different well, it requires them reaching out and asking for it, for one, but also, I've got to trust what you're going to do with that, right, right, you know, yeah so vulnerability requires us to be able to trust the recipient of our vulnerability and what they're going to do with a thousand percent.
Brian F:So yeah, is vulnerable because everybody's had the experience of whether it's in high school or even as adults, of coming out and saying I really like this and people looking at them like they're farts or that I really care about this, I think I want to try this, and we get that rejection. Those moments are actually like they're crystal for people. I've never been in front of a group and said, hey, think about the moment that you told people you cared about, about something you cared about, and you got rejected. And every one of them know the experience, like almost immediately Right, about talking about the things we like, we care about and, specifically that, the contributions we believe we're making to the world.
Brian F:But those stories are vitally important because how you're contributing to the world, your story of how you're contributing to the world, helps me believe in my own. It's the information that I need to be able to a believe I could do it, but also see there's a path to do it. I may not follow the same path, but but again, the more stories like that that I hear, the more likely I can do it. But if everybody's afraid to share their story, if there aren't places for those stories to be shared. Then think about how much potential we lose right?
Brian B:Yeah, because what I think it was, you know when, what you just said, when I've done what you've said you know I shared, you know this great experience I just had, or something that you know, something I was incredibly proud of, of something that you know the way I impacted somebody. I you know I have moments of that and, based on the reaction of the of the recipient, I then shut myself right down.
Brian F:Yeah.
Brian B:And I and I literally get quiet and I kind of sulk in a corner and kind of I go, you know, lick my wounds like a, like a kick dog.
Brian F:Yeah. So there's a. There's a real counterintuitive strategy when this is happening. And it the same strategy.
Brian F:Um, if I'm like, if I'm like having a real struggle with something and I don't really feel like talking about it, I can ask somebody else how they're getting over a challenge right, and I actually, through their story, get like my need to tell about my challenge actually goes down.
Brian F:But it's actually you can actually use the same tool in what you're doing. So what happens is my brain says, oh, I did this thing I'm proud about. And so what's it looking? What it's kind of broadly looking for is is it okay to be proud about? Right, Does the pack accept that I'm proud about? Do they see value in this thing I do? That's the feedback loop we need and if we know that's the loop we need, what you can do in those situations that is actually like you'll find it's surprisingly gratifying is go and ask somebody about what they've recently done that they're proud about and get the detail in that story. And get the detail in that story. And what your brain is doing is it hears their story as your own and it says, yep, through this person saying what they're proud about, my brain now knows that it's okay to be proud about the thing I'm proud about.
Brian B:I think that's exactly what. I think that's one of the videos I watched of you recently about the old man and the kid. You did a video. I don't know when you shot it, but I think that might have been just yesterday or the day before. I listened to that Recently anyway. Oh right, let's say a person doesn't feel out there in the audience. There's a person out there that says man, I'm really bad at telling stories. I'm very fact-based, analytical, rational. Is there any hope for them?
Brian F:Yeah, you don't have to. So our framework is actually based on questions. What we're teaching people is that you don't actually have to tell your story to get connection. Your brain experiences the other story is your own. So when you ask questions and help somebody else tell a story, that gives you so much of the same that you get from telling your story.
Brian F:A really good example of this is like everybody has a like their movie, like there's a movie that, like you, really related to the main character, was like your hero, like you're on the edge of your seat, like for me, I always tell people when I was a kid it was rudy right, rudy rudiger at uh, you know, the notre dame right.
Brian F:Like people that really connected with that movie saw themselves as rudy right and you probably had an emotional response at the end because your brain doesn't really differentiate Rudy's story from your own and when you see Rudy do the thing you want it to do, your brain gets not the satisfaction of having done it, your brain gets the satisfaction that it's worth doing, which is exactly what we're looking for when we tell the story. And so my advice to the person that doesn't feel like they tell their story well or it doesn't even like. That is, find the story and other people and and and. In doing that you get so much of what you need. But also, the more you're able to get the other person to tell a really good story, the easier it is for you to tell story, to tell a really good story, the easier it is for you to tell a story.
Brian B:Okay, Wow, that's great advice. As you were saying, mine was always the Rocky movies and they still are. At 57 years old, I still think. Once I watch Rocky 1 or 2 especially, I feel like I could go out there and box. I want to put my fist through the wall. I want to go work out. I want to shadow box. I live vicariously through it.
Brian F:Yeah, yeah, and and and we all do, and, but what, what we sort of have been conditioned to, is like waiting for the story, or waiting for somebody to tell us a good story, and, and I think for us, and really a lot of the philosophy behind finding good is, is this belief that everyone has a, an inspirational, valuable story. Every, every, the person you're sitting by in the on the bus, like. I first kind of dabbled in learning to do this when I was really had high levels of anxiety on planes and I would get people into telling their story and next thing I know the plane is landing Right. Like, if, like we've spent a lot of time trying to learn how to tell our stories, and I think if we spent half as much time as we spend worrying about and trying to improve the story that we're telling others and applied half of that time to helping others, like getting really good at helping others tell their story, like so much of there's just an endless list of problems that we would, that we would actually solve.
Brian B:How does that equate to the old? I hear this quote. I've heard this quote many times and I've shared it with clients Always be the most interested person in the room, not the most interesting.
Brian F:A thousand percent, a thousand percent, a thousand percent. So that's where you, like, you really get the, you know, the social media kind of, you know, reverse. It's like everybody's on social media trying to tell their story. So in a world of everybody trying to tell their story, if you're the person that can help people tell their story, right, you're absolutely invaluable, right, you have, you know, there's no limit to that, right I was telling my, I have a really good friend, todd.
Brian B:todd and becky are two of my closest friends. I, when I travel, I often stay at their home. And um, he played rugby he was second row with me back in 30 some years ago and um, I've known, so I've known both of 30 some years ago and I've known, so I've known both of them. They met in college, so I've known them well. I'm close to their children and he is one of the most.
Brian B:He's one of those people, at least for me, and I told him this when I was at his house a couple of weeks ago. He seems to find me incredibly interesting and not that I am, and I don't even know if he does, but he does such a good job at asking pointed questions. And remember, when I go back two or three weeks later he will pick up on okay, how did that go? Did you reach out to so-and-so, tell me how this is doing for you, and we can sit for hours on a Sunday and just he'll fire questions off that aren't. They're not intrusive questions, they're questions that he wants to know and it mesmerizes me and that's the that's actually like you.
Brian F:You outlined that. One of the one of the key things that we teach that it's actually some of the hardest things for people that conceptualize is that we're used to asking questions and letting the other person decide what they want to say, and then in that process we have to find what we're interested in. And what we teach is that as soon as you start asking questions based on your own interest, then the whole situation changes, because nobody likes telling their story to somebody who's not interested, right. And so if I just say, hey, how was your day? I haven't told you what I'm interested, so I may or may not like I probably am going to have to work a whole lot harder to find the part I'm interested.
Brian F:But if I change just from how is your day to say like, hey, brian, what was the coolest part of your presentation with the client today?
Brian F:A, it's easier for you not to tell me the story because you have very specific.
Brian F:It's easier for you also because, oh, wow, somebody is interested and I know they're interested because they're more specific here. Right, and now it's easier for you to tell the story because there's less danger. I've identified why I'm interested. I can even add on to that like tell me the most interesting time with a client, because I just had a real crap time with mine and I want to believe that there's light at the end of the tunnel. Now you know your purpose, the value you're giving to me and telling the story, and now I've created this platform for you that you get to tell your story to somebody who's interested and recreate just what you described with your friend, that what he's learned is. I think what many of us have sort of not been taught in how we approach listening is that like it's not, you know, it's not on the the person's talking, it's, it's not all their job to say something interesting. We can make it exponentially easier for both people by identifying and asking about what we're interested in.
Brian B:Wow. So one of the things when you said that I was going back. You know I have two biological children and three bonus sons. My oldest daughter is 37, ashley, and my youngest son is 21, dawson. And I had the privilege and the audience knows of raising Dawson from primarily when he was about two years old on by myself. And you know, every day, when he was in, you know, kindergarten through fifth grade, maybe I would walk him to school every day and back. It was about a mile to and a mile back and I'd go walk and pick him up and I would ask him on the way home how was your day Good?
Brian B:And so I read Dr Carol Dweck's book Mindset, and I don't remember what it's. A great book, isn't it? Growth, mindset, praising, and one of the things I don't remember. I don't know if I got it from the book, but at this time I rephrased my questions to him and I would ask him things like you know, who did you make smile today? Did you make anybody smile today? Um, did you make anybody laugh today? Or what was something you, what was a cool thing? You learned that you didn't know, and I would get an answer and it would be a conversation.
Brian B:And so what I started doing is when I packed his lunch and every day we still have what we call lunchbox lessons or something, lunchbox love or something I would have an index card and I would write on there hey, remember, there's somebody in your school who's probably not feeling really well today. Make somebody smile today, or make somebody laugh or something you know, challenge yourself. And I right. And he said when he'd be sitting on his uh cafeteria after a while, his buddy would say what did your dad write today? And that would spawn him to do something. And then I would later on it would. He would be thinking of that consciously throughout the day of okay, let's make somebody laugh now. I'm sure he didn't do it every day, but at the end, when I would ask him what was interesting today, did anybody make you smile today? He would have a basis for the conversation and we would just talk. And it was just a different shift, because when you ask how was your day, what does everybody say? Good, Right, it's basically a close-ended question.
Brian F:Yeah Well, so what happens is we match effort to effort, and what I mean is like calorie burn. And so what I tell people is like when you ask how was your day? Because you've asked it a thousand times, it requires about the same mental effort as like drooling on yourself Like it's just above, it's just a like a level above a grunt, right. So you get a grunt back because you grunted it. That was your day, right, right, like that's the. But the more thoughtful then of like, hey, you were at practice today and like every time we go to practice there's something new and cool. What was the new and cool thing today? Now that I had to think about where you were at, what you were doing, why I want to ask you what I might even see that's a lot of processing into this question. It's not that much processing when you think about it, like it's just a second of pause of like, oh, what part of this person's day am I interested in? And then I make it easier by clarifying that for them and all of a sudden, the level of engagement changes because they're going to match that. It's really interesting.
Brian F:I've been playing around with ChatGPT and using our questions because the chatbot is trained to act like a human and you can test out the quality of your questions on chat GTP and get the predictable outcomes. If you ask a really broad question, you're going to get a short answer. If you ask a specific question, you're going to get more detail. That's almost a one-to-one correlation between the uh with how it works for humans. It's just sometimes you have to ask a specific question two or three times before the level of trust is built up for you to get that um level of specificity. But um, but that that model is um is consistent, right, um?
Brian F:And I think what you were and I think what you were doing with this kid all of those years is and I used to be a teacher in a juvenile corrections facility and I've seen kids in gangs and I've seen kids go down drugs and for years people would ask me well, what's the difference?
Brian F:And I said, well, gangs just do a really good job at connection, because what they do that a lot of parents miss is a kid is going to go towards the person who is interested in them, not the person who is interested in changing them, and parents can fall down the trap without it with coming from the most caring place, they can fall into the trap of, or into the category of, the kid thinking you're only interested in changing me, you're only interested in me if I'm doing this, versus this authentic interest, that, um, that, quite frankly, gangs do fantastically right, there's accepted, there's a level of acceptance there that is, you know, it's, it's counterintuitive because you have to put your life at risk, you have to do all of these other things, but like it's actually in that, that that you have this unequivocal acceptance, that you have this unequivocal acceptance, right, and those are the things that we tend to take for granted, that we tend to assume that they experience this level of acceptance. But it's not in what we're saying, it's how we're engaging them.
Brian B:And so I would say, with this kid, it's how we're engaging them, and so I would say, you know, with this kid, like that level of acceptance allowed him very likely to not be pulled down the path of people that were showingT for testing questions on it. That's pretty interesting. But a question for you like when you know we have a lot of very micro connections throughout the day, or micro at least. You know I check out at the gas at a grocery store. You know I buy a pair of shoes, can you? Is it disingenuous to try to make a connection with somebody like that when you really don't necessarily care that you don't know them, but you'd like to make them feel a little better, other than saying how do you like?
Brian F:So here's the switch that in listening, we're taught that I'm listening to make you feel better. It's actually turning that around Again. We want them to feel interested. If I'm trying to make you feel better, I'm trying to change you, I'm interested in changing you versus I'm interested in you. And it's not that we're coming from a bad place. We do want to make them feel better, but if we know that what makes a person feel better is this authentic interest, then it's actually approaching those people and being like and I do this, I virtually live in coffee shops.
Brian F:I am I am endlessly surprised, amazed, inspired by the answer I get from a barista to what's the coolest client you had today? Wow, you know what? What is the what? What is the coolest drink you made today? What? What is the? What is the best interaction you had? Right? Or, if I can see they're struggling like what's the least crappy customer you had today? What's the least bad thing that happened in your day?
Brian F:They're all positively oriented questions. I'll adjust them. We call it using the safety ladder, but I'll adjust them based benefit that I'm that I know there's cool stories. If I can show this person that that I'm not doing this to make you feel better. I know you have a cool story and what feels better than somebody approaching us knowing we have a good story, knowing that our story has value? But it requires this like counterintuitive switch of and we call it selfish listening at first, because that's initially how it feels. Once you get over the selfish feeling, you realize oh, this is so much more consistently impactful to both people than trying to make them feel better.
Brian B:Wow, that's interesting Cause if I'm trying to.
Brian F:it's really counterintuitive. Okay, what's that?
Brian B:So when, when, the way I've kind of been going about it with this cause, I do this thing of practicing seven random acts of kindness a week, and sometimes it's something small, you know, mostly it's always something small, um, but in a lot of ways, what I've been doing, whether consciously or unconsciously and I just aired it consciously, so it must be a lot of my conscious level is I'm trying to make them feel better, which is a form of trying to change them.
Brian F:Yeah, and it's not your like, there's nothing bad.
Brian F:Yeah, it's not nefarious, of course, yeah, but what I tell people, what I ask people and there's some really good research behind this is I just ask it this way, like if you think about the times in your life where you were struggling or if you were dealing with a really overwhelming problem, like, how much do you enjoy asking for help in those moments? I don't you hate it, I don't, yeah. And yeah, the research shows 80% of people wait until the last minute to ask for help, and the majority of those people report not enjoying the process when they did ask for help. And so what happens when we're trying to make somebody feel better is we're literally putting them in a position of asking for or receiving help, and in this case, receiving help that they may not have asked for, which again puts them in that position, and that wasn't our intention. What we do know where we are being helpful in here is that we do know that people the opposite is true, like 75% of people report enjoying giving help right, enjoying giving help right.
Brian F:And so how we rephrase this in our brain is I am going up to the barista and asking them to help me. Yeah, help me feel better by telling me the cool thing that happened. Help me get inspired by telling me how you got over a challenge. Help me figure out this problem on my head by you sharing with me how you've solved a similar problem. Yeah, and in asking them for help, the thing that we're giving them is the thing that we know we like, and it's the experience that we feel, when we are helpful, that we're providing value.
Brian F:So, again, it's counterintuitive, but it's asking them to provide value, which, for many people and especially I love using baristas and service people. They do things to provide value all the time with often very little validation, and so I can't tell you how many times I've asked a simple question like that and I've got the response I've got. It's like you're the first person that, like, consistently made eye contact with me today. You're the first person that even asked about you know anything, and what they're saying is you know. You're the first person that saw value in my story, and so I think the most helpful thing we can do is is again find value in the story and provide an avenue that that value gets to be shared.
Brian B:And when you say that, when I think of the baristas. When I go into a coffee shop or even a restaurant restaurant may be a little different, because servers are paid on tips, but a clerk at a retail store, grocery store, gas station, when you go in what I've noticed the last two or three years, I really started noticing how unhappy they seem to be. When you go in what I've noticed the last two or three years, I really started noticing how unhappy they seem to be when you walk in they're they're almost ready a lot of times for a conflict and that's when I started thinking well, let's just do something to make them feel like, okay, there's a little bit of difference here. I see you and I. Now I can see why they do that, because the best they're getting all day is how's your day going, you know, and they're getting multiple interactions and they're getting it.
Brian F:They're getting hundreds of days for people yeah, and they're getting it without, like it's in, and I tell people, I tell people, I actually obvious, I, I almost always uh, throw the caveat. Like you know, I'm not going to ask what was the most interesting part of your day when there's a line of four people behind me, because in those cases we call it the transactional interaction. The transactional interaction is okay because hey, how are you? Is essential, like, hey, unless you're on fire, or make your order and move along Right and and so there's a, there's a time for those, for sure.
Brian F:But but I think what you're outlining is that, like, we become very, very sort of um performative in our interactions and, um, you know, here's the thing I'm supposed to say. I'm conditioned, conditioned, to ask or I'm, you know, I'm, I'm, I'm. I'm saying this thing to cheer you up again, which is coming from a good place. I'm not saying that we shouldn't do that, but I am saying what is lacking is like, hey, tell me about what you care about, tell me about what's interesting to you. And I'm going to make it easier by saying, by being really specific, what's coolest drink you made, right? What is the? You know what's the best? You know response you got from a customer today, right?
Brian F:Or just simply what I like to do right at 6.30 in the morning when I am off in the first time in the coffee shop what was the best part of your day? And they be like it's 6 30. I've been up for a half hour like yeah, yeah, whoa, so what's your answer? And they'll laugh and be like, well, only hit the snooze button once. And those are such like really cool interactions because it allows it, like it's actually about them expressing gratitude, right, yeah, like that, that's actually what I'm hearing. Like, what are you grateful for? But I don't ask what are you grateful for, because that's a performative answer. I asked for the experience. Where did you feel grateful? What was the best part? Like, tell me the experience, right, cause it. Cause that is the only thing that allows people to have to feel as though their story has value.
Brian B:You know, Brian, I've been doing this for twenty seven and a half years. I've never heard this before. Yeah, we invented it Well that's tell us about finding good a little bit.
Brian F:Yeah, and when I say we invented it, it's all we did was take a lot of the science out there and I was consulting in neuroscience and neuroscience of change for 10 years prior to this and there's just so much research out there on social cognitive neuroscience, what's going on the brain and this understanding connection, but nobody was kind of putting the pieces together. You discovered it, yeah, um, you discovered it, yeah, well, we uncovered it. I think is is really what was happening. So I'll, I'll, I'll share the whole story without getting you know all the detail, but I think I mentioned briefly eight years ago my friends and I started, um, we wanted to, we were interested in like sort of this kind of mastermind idea, right, like the four of us are going to, you know, call each other each week. But we quickly were like, and very much for me, I had the background of positive psychology, but also, like I have always kind of approached accountability, like there's people I accountable to, but I don't need extra mothers, right, like I don't need, I don't need to call my friends each week to tell them the crap I didn't do, right. And we also, and I also knew at the time that, like, the more we actually talk with others about the good things in our life, the more we see them, so we're essentially affecting the reticular activating system in our life, the more we see them, so we're essentially affecting the reticular activating system in our brain. So we started eight years ago just having this one hour phone call where each of us get a specific amount of time to talk about what went well the prior week. We can talk about nothing else. No one on the phone can give what we call SOFA suggestions, opinion, feedback or advice. The only thing the rest of us can do is ask questions and if we want to talk about anything else, we talk outside of that call.
Brian F:Well, we did this for about four years and what we found is in the first four years before the pandemic, is that this call became this lifeline in helping each of us through some pretty major life events rehab, divorce, deaths of parents, some pretty critical things. And as we were going through those things, we started to notice that, like I, absolutely like, this weekly phone call is one of the most important things in my life in terms of keeping me on the path. And so what we realize is that, like that, what went well question is really about, like each of us sharing every week. Here's what really mattered this week. Here's what was really important every week. Here's what really mattered this week. Here's what was really important. Here is an example of me being the husband I wanted to be, or me being the father I wanted to be, or me being the friend I wanted to be. And so what happened is that when the pandemic started, I was traveling all the time. I stopped overnight and we just opened up a zoom call to people from around the world and we had well over 200 people in the first six months and we would put them on a on a zoom call with a stranger and they would use a similar question and they could only ask the other person a question or they could. They had 10 minutes a piece, so one person would ask the other person questions for 10 minutes and then the other person would return the favor. And what we started to notice is that, as we started adding questions and we started playing with the how to frame questions, that people were having improvements in personal and professional development, things like growth, mindset, locus of control at a level that I hadn't seen as a facilitator specifically, given we weren't teaching any of those concepts.
Brian F:And so fast forward the four years. About eight months after the pandemic started, I told my wife like hey, this is what we're doing, like I've got to figure out what this is, how we can use it, how we can replicate it and what's actually going on here. And the last fast forward, the last three years is like now we have this as a more formal like here is how you would use this process to create connection when we're talking about problems. So when somebody brings us like hey, can you help me think through this that the first thing we don't do is give SOFA, we actually stop and we would ask a question like what do you actually want If this problem were solved? What would you have more of? And where have you had that thing before? So we're pulling into the positive part of the brain and then we're also getting experience and so connections happening. So now our ability to solve the problem increases exponentially.
Brian F:We use this process also for like, strategic planning and increasing like ownership. So at the end of a like, maybe before a strategic planning, and increasing like ownership. So at the end of a like, maybe before a strategic planning session, we'll have the group outline. Here are the three biggest successes we had, which is a fun argument, because getting everybody a degree what the three biggest successes were, uh, like outlines where we might not have clarity. But then we build these maps of how did the success happen, what was the impact on the community and then, from there, what are we going to do in the future. So we call this process success mapping and then we have a different model for then.
Brian F:How do we use this process to drive growth in an organization, using what we call the FIRES model? Using what we call the FIRES model, and so we've taken this simple question-interaction process that we know is helping us experience connection and saying how can we infuse this to improve our ability to solve problems by building trust quicker, to improve our ability to work together by creating ownership and interaction, and improve our ability to work together by creating ownership and interaction and improve our ability to grow, all because we're increasing our, our level of connectedness, in a very objective and and efficient way, right like um and so our our. We run trainings on on each of those. We call it level one, level two and level three. Level one is problems and trust, level two is strategy and ownership, and level three is growth and engagement, and so it's a very applied like how we can use this process in the things we're already doing to increase our efficiency in reaching the outcomes we want, while getting the connection we need.
Brian B:Now, I can see this being applicable to so many different people in so many realms of life, but who, would you say, are the people that you serve the most through Finding Good? What industry? And what types of professionals?
Brian F:Yeah.
Brian F:So it's really like we've been across industries, like been at the Air Force, we've been at large sales organizations, we've done contracts with entire school districts, but the person that we serve the most is actually the person that looks at this and says I want to teach it Because we.
Brian F:So how we've designed, like our certification program, how we even approach organizations, is let's find a handful of people that can be the people delivering this and let's give them the tools to be able to bring this into their organization, bring this into their community and affect change with it. Right and so. So, while we do, you know, large contracts and keynotes and and one on ones, really the, the person that we're trying to equip the most is the one that is trying to, you know, improve their, their organization or even their family, or even their school, and can use our resources to make those improvements, using the science of connection and a framework that is very replicatable, that's kind of like very specific and can solve a lot of those sort of underlying challenges through learning to engage, questions that again build, that give people's brains what they need to function fully.
Brian B:So I think anybody out there listening right now I'm going to include the link to Finding Good, the website. On here. There is a section on getting information on Finding Good certification. I would click on that. I mean, I see this, you know, and I'm looking at your website and what it shares is like salespeople, leaders, parents, teachers you know other coaches, therapists, counselors I mean anybody in a role who wants to, like you said, improve. I hate to use that because I don't want to be changing people, but I mean wants to make those connections with other people.
Brian B:I mean, I could see this. You know, at this point my children are grown, but you know, I do have a grandchild and I have a couple of grandchildren one bonus granddaughter and a grandchild and another bonus grandson coming, and I'll have more coming. I'm going to explore this a little bit. I'm going to, I'm going to hang around with this a little bit.
Brian F:That'd be fantastic, and I often direct people. We have the level one certification and we have one starting in June and and we've decided, over the summer we're going to we're going to offer that for 500 bucks. So, like it's, uh, it's, it gives you six hours of live instruction uh, some somewhere in the neighborhood of like two and a half hours of of um of you know, uh, self self-directed instruction, and then a bunch of resources and material behind it and that's sort of the introduction course that people can take. And what I tell people is this isn't about changing your leadership style or your teaching style. It's about giving yourself a tool that's going to make what you're already doing happen at the level you know it can. It's about, like, well, we just add this little piece, what I'm trying to do is going to happen much faster, yeah.
Brian B:And I know we have a lot of coaches that listen, other coaches in different fields. We have a lot of leaders no-transcript, I'm sure. We have teachers We've had teachers on here. We have a lot of salespeople, so we have a lot of the people who you serve most effectively listening right now to this show and this episode. So, please, everybody, click on, check it out. I mean $500 for level one. I mean it's a great start. Um, yeah, before we wrap up, I want to talk a little bit about your, your book. I know you wrote the book in 2017, but now it's as of this year, it's it's you have an audible version of the book oh, yeah, um, uh, so that was, that was a experiment.
Brian F:Uh, amazon came out with a, um, basically an ai version of creating a. I tried to do the you know the the audio version and record and I, I just didn't. I, I my, a month after that book came out, my wife's mother passed away and so that took all you know for for the next year. A lot of the focus that was going to be on the book was in you know where it needed to be, and so I didn't follow through on some things like the audio version. So the audio isn't written, read by me, it's read by, you know, amazon's AI bot. Really, anyway, that's why it just came out Like they had a version of that. That said, do you want to try this? And I, I was like, well, that'd be interesting. And I, and it was. I just said yes, and all of a sudden it was up, so I haven't really paid attention to it have you listened to any of it?
Brian F:I have.
Brian B:Not okay, I'm going to after we're done here tonight, yeah I want to see what that sounds like I. I do see that now it says virtual voice narrator yeah, yeah, and you get to pick the.
Brian F:I know the style of the voice and that, but I I've not, uh, I've not taken the time to listen to it. Um, I kind of, because it happened so quickly. I I largely forgot that I did it.
Brian B:So well you know, for the listening out there, I'm going to include a link to experts of our potential. It's a story that will change the way you deliver value. I'll have included a link on that to Amazon. Feel free to check it out. I mean, everything that I've heard today from you, brian, has piqued my curiosity, because what I've seen is you've, you've, you've made me realize I have a kink in my, a chink in my armor that I was completely unaware of and the way I make connections.
Brian F:So, I appreciate that, yeah, yeah, no worries, and I and I like to reframe that in. Like you know, we get moments that we see more as available. Right, you weren't doing anything wrong. It's more that, oh, wow, if there's more available, why not explore that?
Brian B:Oh, I 100% agree. So the final question I'm going to ask you, brian, is is is there any question I didn't ask that you wish I would have? Or is there any final message you want to leave with the Bamboo Pack audience?
Brian F:I if, if, uh, my favorite question is you know actually what question, um what question you would want me to ask you?
Brian B:Are you asking me that right now?
Brian F:I sure am. Oh, my God.
Brian B:You could have prepped me.
Brian F:Fair, I kind of just did. Oh my God, you could have prepped me, fair.
Brian B:I kind of just did you know I'm going to tell you.
Brian F:The one that came out subconsciously is what made me smile today.
Brian B:Yeah, what would your answer to that be? It would be a couple, it would be two things that I heard that my grandson even when I'm answering this question, I'm sure I'm smiling is doing really well after his first well, now, three days at his new daycare, in that my, my son and his girlfriend both got new jobs today, um, college jobs, uh one my son will be doing hardscape, building decks and patios, and his girlfriend, audrey, will be working at, I think it's altata, a cosmetic store, and they both wanted to get these jobs for the summer. So, and honestly, as I'm telling you right now, I have a smile on my face.
Brian F:Yeah, can I ask you a follow up?
Brian B:You can yeah.
Brian F:Yeah, so, and this is good. This might sound a little odd, and so you think about somebody else and and like how you would describe somebody else. But how would you answer if I asked you like these things that made you smile your grandson, your, your, your kids getting a job, the fact that it made you smile, the fact that that you get joy out of that what does, what do you think that says about you? What type of person does that say you are?
Brian B:Oh, why do you do this to me? That's a harder one.
Brian F:I have the answer in my head.
Brian B:I don't want to share it.
Brian F:Yeah, so I can make it easier. If you were listening to somebody else describe that, how would you describe that?
Brian B:You are a very caring and loving father and grandfather.
Brian F:Yeah, yeah, that is crazy. That's what I heard.
Brian B:That is incredibly crazy.
Brian F:Yeah, and so it's this. So the reason I love that is like this you know when, when I hear that, if, like, like, while it sounds counterintuitive, you saying that just gave so much permission to the people hearing to own that themselves, to think about the things that make them smile and to consider the reason they're smiling is because, ultimately, they're a pretty good person. Smiling is because, ultimately, they're a pretty good person and you having the vulnerability, doing the risky thing of saying because I'm a good father, allows them to also have permission to own that themselves. And that's the importance of us being able to not just share our story but to provide environments where people can share the stories that matter to them.
Brian B:That's powerful. Because it was so. When you asked that question, I cringed again and I knew the answer. I knew the answer in my head, I knew what I wanted to say.
Brian F:Yeah, but it's risky right.
Brian B:But I like the way you rephrase that. If somebody else said that, what would you say about them?
Brian F:Yeah, you're a good father. Yeah, we call that a questioning sort of technique, we call it externalizing. It's much easier to describe somebody else as a good person than it is to describe myself as a good person. Um, and so when I do that, like the pressure's off and I say this, and then it's this weird like oh, I guess I am talking about myself.
Brian B:Right, yeah, that's, that's interesting.
Intro:Yeah, you got me thinking today man.
Brian B:So you got me thinking Awesome, awesome.
Brian F:Yeah, well, well, I really enjoyed the conversation and appreciate you having me on and taking the time and asking such great questions.
Brian B:All right, I know you're busy, but I'm sure we're going to get a demand to have you back on, so I'll pester you.
Brian F:No worries, no worries, I'm pretty open. So as long as we can find a time on the schedule, I'm happy to chat. It would be cool. Maybe we get people on board and ask them questions. That's really my favorite thing to do, we can arrange that Awesome.
Brian B:Thank you, my friend. I appreciate you. This has been an amazing time. It's been a great learning experience for me and, I know, for the Bamboo Pack audience. I'm sure that we're going to get a lot of texts, emails and letters coming in saying we get him back on. So people who are interested, like I said, click the links below the show notes today. So thanks again, brian. I appreciate everything you do and I appreciate you challenging me and teaching me something very valuable today, and I will be looking at the certification over the next couple of days.
Brian F:Awesome, fantastic. Thanks for having me.
Brian B:Thanks brother.
Brian F:Yeah.
Brian B:All right, Bye-bye, Bye, All right, everyone, Brian has signed out tonight. I just want to take all this time to thank all of you for listening in today. Brian's incredibly busy so I wanted to let him go so he could get back to doing his workshops and shooting videos. This was a great episode for me and I hope it was for so many of you. You know, whether you are a leader or a parent or a salesperson or a coach or consultant, a teacher, anybody who wants to make a connection with others. I would go back and listen to this episode again.
Brian B:Please click on Brian's FindingGoodcom website, Look at his book Experts of Our Potential and please share this with three or four people other salespeople, other leaders, other parents, teachers, et cetera. Please click the like button here, subscribe, rate and review us, but in the meantime, most importantly, please get out there and strive to give and be your best version of yourself, Show love and respect to others and yourself, and please live purposely, intentionally and consciously. I care about you all and I appreciate every one of you listening today. Take care.