121. Women, Wealth, and Social Change

How can aligning investments with values drive positive social change? Through conscious investing, individuals can leverage their financial resources to advocate for positive change and contribute to building a more equitable and sustainable future for all.

In this episode of the Power, Purpose & Prosperity Podcast, Sabine discusses with Janine Firpo the significant role women can play in the finance world. Janine is an experienced investor who prioritizes values, and has a rich background in empowering women to manage their finances. She's also a leading investor in Next Wave Impact, a fund aimed at encouraging more women to become angel investors.

Tune in to discover how joining supportive communities like investment circles can empower women, giving them the knowledge and confidence to invest with purpose. You'll also hear real-life examples highlighting the importance of paying attention to your investments to ensure financial growth.

Key Takeaways

• The potential for women to influence the economy significantly by 2030 through wealth control, and how this can lead to a more equitable and sustainable economy.
• How joining investment circles can empower women to confidently discuss and manage their finances.
• The importance of actively managing investments to ensure financial growth.
• The benefits of having a supportive community of women to overcome financial fears and gain investment knowledge.

What You Will Learn in This Episode:
 

• [02:24] Janine’s career evolution and the pivotal moment that led her to shift towards impact investing.
• [05:51] She describes her collaboration with Ellen Remmer and the founding of Invest for Better to help women invest with their values.
• [10:09] Understanding investment circles and how they empower women to confidently discuss and manage their finances.
• [14:09] The shame and guilt women feel around money, plus statistics and societal messages that discourage women from engaging with money.
• [17:46] Janine shares some real-life examples of women missing out on significant financial growth due to a lack of attention and knowledge. 
• [23:09] The importance of seeking help to deal with your money trauma and taking small steps towards experimenting and gaining knowledge. 
• [27:30] Tools and resources like robo-advisors (Betterment, Ellevest) for beginners, plus a few things to keep in mind.

Connect with Janine:

• Website: https://investforbetter.org/ 
• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/janine-firpo-047282/ 

Book Recommendation:

• Activate Your Money, Invest to Grow Your Wealth, and Build a Better World
• Designing Your Life by Bill Burnett and Dave Evans 

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HOST INFO:

Sabine Gedeon is a transformative figure in leadership and personal development and serves as the CEO of Gedeon Enterprises. With nearly two decades of experience, she guides clients in startups and Fortune 500 companies. Sabine's unique approach combines human-centered principles with tech-enabled solutions, delivering customized programs for leaders at all levels to tackle crucial leadership and talent development challenges.

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ADDITIONAL SUPPORT:

Download Free Resources - https://sabinegedeon/gifts
Get Coaching Support: https://meetwithsabine.as.me/Discovery

Transcript

0:00

Are you tired of playing small and ready to step confidently into your greatness and share your unique brilliance with the world? Well, you're in the right place. I'm your host, Sabine Gideon, and I've dedicated nearly two decades empowering individuals and leaders as they confidently navigate the twists and turns of life and career transitions. If you're seeking direction, connection, or just a little push to play bigger, consider this podcast, your VIP path to a community that genuinely understands your journey. Join me every week for candid conversations and practical guidance designed to help you navigate the challenges of life and business, foster a growth mindset and cultivate meaningful connections. It's time to embrace your inherent power, define your unique purpose and prosper in every aspect of your life. Let's get started.

Sabine: 0:55

I am your host Sabine Gideon. and I am excited to be here to bringing you another amazing, uh, woman as part of this power Of money series, Janine Ferpo. And so real quick, I'll read Janine's, uh, bio and then have her walk you through her journey. And then we'll get into some of the juicy questions that I know that you are excited to hear. So Janine is a seasoned values aligned investor and social innovator with a long history of working at the intersection of women and their money. Her book, activate your money, invest to grow your wealth and build a better world has a collaborative effort with almost 150 women in 2021. She joined forces with Ellen Remmer to co found invest for better. Janine is also a lead investor in next wave impact and impact fund designed to help more women become angel investors. With that, welcome to the show.

Janine: 1:54

Hi, Sabine. It's so nice to be here with you.

Sabine: 1:57

Same here. I'm excited to have this conversation. And so before we get into, uh, details about invest for better and what Allowed you to make this shift and the impact that you're making. Walk us through your, your journey because you also have, you know, your 1. 0, if you will, was also an amazing journey. So tell us a little bit about that. And then what was the catalyst to make you say, okay, you know what, it's time for a shift.

Janine: 2:23

Yeah, it's a great question. So it's actually 3. 0. So I'm a great example of somebody who's changed my career multiple times. And I actually started my career in the early 80s in the Silicon Valley, um, in the tech industry kind of before there were even personal computers. So I was having this amazing, um. Journey through that industry for about 14 or 15 years. I'd always been a huge traveler and I quit a job and went solo backpacking through sub Saharan Africa for about four or five months in 1995. Left when we were in the CD ROM industry and came back five months later and something called the internet had emerged. It was absolutely amazing that it flipped while I was gone. But what also happened to me while I was gone is I'd seen poverty. Like I never saw it before in Africa. And it really moved me, and I decided I wanted to figure out a way to create a career where I could work on the kinds of problems I saw and to help the people that I was seeing across sub Saharan Africa. So it took me about a year to figure it out. I re Made myself and started a second career in international development, which I did for over 20 years, looking at the role that technology and business could play in solving poverty. And because of that, and because of the fact that I lived in the Bay Area, I was part of a lot of the early conversations about what became known as impact investing. And at that time, and still to a large degree, that is a type of investing that's really for high net wealth individuals, institutional investors, foundations. I was none of those, but I've made these huge changes in my personal life to live my values. And I realized my money was working against me. It was investing in the very problems that I was trying to solve. And so I made a commitment to myself over 15 years ago that I would figure out how to invest all of my capital, starting with my cash. In ways that actually align with my values and created the world that I want to see, which is a more sustainable and and, um, equitable economy. So that's what I, the personal decision I made about 6 months, 6 years ago, I retired from my 2nd career. And I put more of my effort now into not only doing this with my own money, but helping other women do this with theirs.

Sabine: 4:49

How awesome. I love that. I love the stories, right? We always see people when, you know, wherever they are. Right. And we never know what were some of the. Uh, decisions that they made, or maybe even some of the experiences that served as catalysts for them to step into who they are today. And, you know, uh, having just, uh, connected with you, maybe not just, maybe in the last six months or so, uh, through Innovation Women, um, your profile, the, the, the stuff that you speak on in that space that you're in, I, I would have never have guessed that this was, First of all, 3. 0 or the thing that moved you to step into the space was you seeing, um, how much impact you could make and, and the opportunity that was out there. So talk to us in terms of invest for better, um, you know, the organization that you are, you know, working through and looking to grow right now. Talk to us a little bit about what you and your partner do and, you know, who, who it is that you're looking to serve and how you serve them.

Janine: 5:51

Well, happy to do that. And I met my partner while I was writing my book, so I'm going to back up a step and talk about that because What I realized when I decided I wanted to help other women, um, invest their values, I decided a book was really important because there's a lot of information out there, but none of it's organized in a way that's really helpful. And what I learned in that process is that women not only don't know how to invest their values, a lot of us don't know how to invest. So I, when I wrote the book, I decided to write something that would help women understand both how to invest as well as how to invest their values. And I always have known that we do really well as women together. So learning this kind of stuff is hard. We're all super busy. We don't have the time for this. That's another issue that women have. And I've been in three investment clubs in my life, and I've learned more from them than I learned almost any other way. Learning from other women and sharing the experience of research with other women has just been really powerful for me. And so I wanted to bring that to other women as well. And as I was writing the book, I met Ellen and Ellen was doing that. She was working on a small project and putting women together into investment clubs, and they were teaching themselves how to invest with their values. And so she and I joined forces and we created Investor Better, which is a 501c3 nonprofit, and that's what we're doing. We had a third woman come in, um, who is a professional educator. And she took my book, and she helped create a curriculum for us. So we now have an initial core curriculum, women meet in their clubs once a month. And we have a core curriculum that takes them through six months, and we teach them. About how to invest this way, why it's important, what we as women have the potential to do by 2030, according to McKinsey and company, women in this country are going to control the majority of this is huge because we invest differently than men. We have different. Values that we want to see our money support. And if enough of us start to say we are going to pay attention to what our money is doing in the world and the impact that's having in the world, because every dollar you have, even the dollar you have in a savings account, a checking account, somebody's using it for some purpose and it is having an impact. You probably just don't know what it is and chances are it is. Invested in the things that you hate. So if we start being more intentional about this as women, we literally have the power to change the economy to meet the things that we want to see, which are livable communities, a safe, sustainable planet for our kids and our grandkids. Equity for women, equity for all minorities. That's what we want to see. We can create that with our money. So we're helping women through the circle experience, learn that. And we've been doing this now for a couple of years. We've had over a thousand women learn this material and we've also built on our curriculum. So we now have what we call deep dives, which are three month courses on special topics like If you don't really know the basics of finance, we've got a financial basics course. If you are focused on the stock market, we help you understand how to invest in the stock market in a way that really matters to you. We have a course on investing with a gender lens and uplifting women with all of your capital uplifting, um, closing the racial wealth gap. We have a course on that. So we have about 6 or 7 additional courses that we've built as well. And as a. Participate in invest for better. You can take any course you want. It's all part of the program.

Sabine: 9:51

That is awesome. Okay. So, so, so much. I want to dig in here. So, for those who are listening, wondering, what is an investment club or an investment circle? What is that? And, and what would, um, what would be the benefit of someone joining that? What will they gain?

Janine: 10:09

So an investment circle is just a gathering of women who come together to talk about their money, pure and simple. And there's one or two women who tend to stand up as the leaders or facilitators of that. So they do all the logistical kind of work. Work, which is gathering the women together who are going to be in the club orchestrating when the club will meet and facilitating the meetings. And we train the leaders how to do that and we give them all the course material they need to actually run a meeting. So they don't have to have a lot of prior knowledge about this. They don't have to be teachers. They just are facilitators and it's a series of conversations. So one of the things that we hear a lot is women feel. So empowered by this because they've never had a safe, trusted place to just talk about money. I mean, the first month, really what you do is you introduce yourselves to each other and then you talk about how you were raised around money. What are your stories? What, what are your beliefs around money? Because a lot of times we really, Think that whatever we think about money is absolutely true and everybody else had the same experience and that is not the case. And when we start talking to other women, and we create a space where we can open up and have real conversations. It starts to change everything. And so over a period of time, you strengthen those relationships. You go into deeper conversation and it really builds a level of confidence and also just, you know, in reading the book and and thinking about the material in it. Getting to know the terms that are used in finance, like there's some mysterious thing. And so we feel very uncomfortable around them. Once you start to learn those terms and you understand what large cap means or what, um, a global investment is, or what angel investing is, or venture capital is, you feel much more confident having conversations. With other people, your family, your, your coworkers, et cetera, around money, because you start to understand what these terms are and how the whole thing works. And that's part of what we teach through this curriculum.

Sabine: 12:23

Awesome. Thank you for that. You know, you, you bring up several great points and, and part of the reason why this series even exists, um, is because of, you know, this, this, this gap, if you will, of women feeling comfortable. money. And I didn't even know about the statistic around 2030 that women, you know, would be the majority. I knew that, you know, from a boomers perspective, a lot of the boomers would be retiring and, you know, majority of them who are in power, who are in seats of power, if you will, are men, right? And so I knew that there was like a shift happening towards that when it came to money, but didn't even realize that. No, literally we will be controlling most of it. So that's good information to know. And that's only seven years away, actually six and a half years, uh, at this point at the time of this recording. And so I, you know, one of the things as I've been going through the series, um, and just my own experiences, clients that I've, coached and supported. You know, there's a lot of shame. and guilt in in different ways, right? There's a lot of shame and there's a lot of guilt, as emotions that are tied that are tied to money that women, I feel women carry more than men do not to say that they don't, but we do. And so I'm curious, you know, from, uh, not that we need to go into the deep psychology of it. You know, why is it that we feel so uncomfortable? Talking about money or even bringing it up or even when we have it, just sharing with others. Like we have this money and this is what we want to do with it. Like, what, what are your thoughts and no right answers here, but just curious what your thoughts on, or what keeps us silent or what keeps us avoiding these conversations?

Janine: 14:09

We don't even realize it. The subliminal messages or even some of the more overt messages that we get that we don't really ever dissect or understand what they're doing to us. So, for example, we are not trained. About money. We haven't been educated about this. And not only that is women articles for women about money are actually telling us to be afraid. So 62 percent of articles written for women tell us that investing is scary and dangerous. But the majority of articles written for men tell them how to grow their wealth and get rich and how to invest, right? If you look at most books that are written to teach people about investing, they're written for men. And I looked at over a hundred books on this topic before I wrote mine. They're almost all for men and the ones that are written for women in a 300 page book, 30 pages, 10 percent of the book tells us how to invest. So we're not taught and from an early age, we're taught. We're not good at math. We're not good at science. So we are actively discouraged through the societal messages that we're getting from thinking about this stuff and from thinking we're good at it. But here's the deal when we do invest research shows, and I'm talking about a recent study from fidelity that was conducted over 10 years and 5, 000, 000 accounts. Women consistently outperform men. When we invest, we're scared to do it. We give our money to men to invest for us. We run away from it and yet we do better and we put our money to work in more meaningful things. You

Sabine: 15:57

know, not surprisingly that you said that I've, uh, I've been devouring the books of, uh, Barbara Stani. And I think she's Barbara Houston. Now she is the heir or the daughter to one of the founders of H& R block. And so she talks about how, even though she had a trust fund, she lost it all because she trusted her husband, her first husband to invest it, and then she was forced to learn money. And to your point, you know, while she has been in this space for maybe the last. 20 years of like really empowering women, the book mostly focuses on the empowerment side and getting over the emotions and like the story and literally only one chapter of, I don't know how many in, in many of her books are dedicated to, okay, this is what an asset is. This is what a liability is. And so, and so you said that I hadn't even thought about like literally the books that I have. that are written by women specifically, um, are mostly focused on the emotional side of it and how we got there versus this is how you move forward. And these are the hard facts. And quite frankly, if I'm being honest, I probably have straight away from like the books that get into like the nitty gritty of this is what you need to do. I'll, I'll download them. But as far as making time to actually learn that, like that has not been a priority. So I can, I can totally see that. So as you think about the women, you, you know, you mentioned that there have been about 1000 women that have come through, you know, What do you see in terms of themes and commonalities from like the women who come through your program, they grasp it and they just continue to excel versus the ones that may get stuck or very early on, turn away and say, you know what, this is, this is really not for me or this is too much.

Janine: 17:46

Right. I think it really comes down to desire. Right. It's sort of that thing about you can bring a horse to water, but you can't force the horse to drink. And I've seen that repeatedly. So a lot of the women who come to us because we are not just teaching about investing, but we're teaching about investing in a different way. They really do have a desire to learn. But I want to speak to. What you said about not going into the depth for yourself. And I want to give you a couple of examples. Um, because one of the things that you and I had talked a little bit about, um, before is where have I seen women who are kind of missing the mark? Um, and I think where women are missing the mark is they're not paying attention. So here are three examples of why this really hurts us and why women like you. You need to just suck it up and read the books that tell you how to do it. So I know of a 30 something who received an inheritance from her grandmother, um, that sat in accounts like a brokerage account for over a decade. She never looked at it. She never looked at what the money was invested in. She never thought about it. It was like, that's for my retirement. I'm not going to look at it. She finally looked at it and what she discovered was that 75 percent of that capital was in cash. And it had sat in cash over a decade when the stock market had gone consistently up. She left so much money on the table, I can't even begin to tell you. It would have changed her life if she had actually paid attention and invested that money. Another woman was in her late fifties. She was getting close to retirement. She had been dutifully putting her money into retirement accounts for her entire career. We're talking over 30 years, four different retirement accounts, never paid attention to it. Finally looked at it and realized that all of that money was in exactly the same fund. So she had no diversification and that fund had consistently underperformed by as much as three to five basis, three to 5 percent over 30 years. Again, she would have had double the money that she, she's struggling around how she's going to retire. She would have had no issue if she had invested, if she had paid attention. Another example, similar to the one that you talked about earlier, a woman who actually worked in the financial sector in the banking industry, high net wealth woman, um, over a million, a couple million dollars in wealth had left. All of that to her husband, he died suddenly and all of a sudden she was left with capital. She had absolutely no idea what to do with, and she actually had worked her entire career at high levels within the financial sector, but she had never thought about her own money. When your husband passes away, That is not, or your partner passes away. That is not the time to start having to learn how to invest your money. So not paying attention is not an option. And the other thing is you want to start as young as possible because of, um, the compounding of money. So if you started investing at 20, a hundred dollars a month, and you invested for 10 years. And then stopped, you would have more money when you were ready to retire than somebody who started at 30 and invested 100 a month for the rest of their working life.

Sabine: 21:43

Wow. Yeah. So the, the impact, uh, or the consequence, if you will, uh, Of us, you know, not paying attention or being afraid or not, you know, moving forward. Um, and or getting the help and support. I know this has been a reoccurring theme through the conversations with the other women that have been on the show is that there's this, there's this reluctance. I, I, I probably tied in with the guilt and the shame of not knowing what to do, but this reluctance to just simply ask for help or seek out the help. Um, because, you know, they may be seen as like, not knowing or ignorant or whatever the case may be. Um, but here it is. Help is available on so many different avenues, obviously in the organization that you, um, that you move towards. So what can we do? Obviously we, for the show, we have individuals who are in traditional corporate environments. We also have individuals who are entrepreneurs who, who listened to the show or who might be watching this. Um, what are, what's some of the first steps, right? If you're in that place where you're kind of paralyzed and you're like, I don't know, or it feels too scary. What outside of just, you know, doing it and sucking it up, what are some of the first steps that they can take to start to take control, um, over their money and, or healing that relationship? If there's, you know, some, some trauma there.

Janine: 23:09

So, if there's trauma, and there is for some women, I think getting help there first is really, really important. And I think there are organizations, I'm not familiar with a lot of them, but I know they're out there. If you do your homework, you can find them who will help you deal with the trauma. Because that's a real problem. block, um, that you need to get over as you're moving through that, or if you don't have the trauma, I think knowledge is power. It just is knowledge is power. So whenever we are facing something that we don't know, going out and learning about it is really helpful. Read books. That's a great way to do it. Look up information on the web. Start there. I actually think, and it's not just because it's my organization, but it's my organization because I think this is important. I actually think learning with other women is super, super powerful. So, what you said earlier about not knowing where to go to help feeling like they're going to be. Considered stupid. I mean, a lot of women feel stupid when they talk to their financial advisors. If they have financial advisors, those, those people often talk down to them, particularly if they're male financial advisors. So having the opportunity to just talk about this with other women and realize you're not. Uninformed, you actually maybe no more than you do, you think, or if you really are uninformed that these other women have, they're not going to make you feel stupid. They're going to help you. Um, and they're going to feel good about helping you and you're going to feel good about helping other women. So there's something really, really powerful in that. The other thing is if you feel really scared or you're thinking about investing in. an investment that you've never invested in before. Use small bits of money. Start experiment. Put a little bit of money in that it's okay if you lose and then see how it does. Or make up a make believe um, investment portfolio. You can do this online as well and just invest in that and watch it and see how it works. Try to make a game of it. Um, more than anything else.

Sabine: 25:22

Yeah. Yeah. And especially now, like, there's so many, um, the barrier to entry, if you will, like, feels really, really low now with, like, Betterment and even Acorn, like, just taking your change, um, from your, you know, whatever you're spending and putting it in there. So there are a lot of different vehicles, um, that we can support. Start with to dip our toes. Um, but I love the, I love the community aspect of it.'cause you're absolutely right. You know when you're, when, whenever you're stepping into something scary, whether it's, you know, investment or your money or like coaching or you're stepping into entrepreneurship, those first couple of steps are hard. And so to know that you have other people who are there to support you, answer your questions, guide you along the way, that is an absolute, and I think. We as women thrive in those environments where we feel supported, um, and where we feel like we're not alone. The, the, the opportunity here is to get more of us to think that way and more of us to see that. You know what? We actually are stronger together. And when we do come together, Like magic happens. I, I don't know how else to describe it, but magic happens. Um, so, you know, definitely for those of you listening, uh, be sure to check out invest for better, or, you know, do your research, right. Identify where. Some of your challenges are like for me, particularly, I've been on this journey for probably like the last three or four years, and I had to uncover a lot of trauma or process a lot of trauma around money to even get to the place where I can host a series, uh, talking about money with, you know, experts. So, you know, it's a process. Just understand that, you know, none of us. Um, it's a decision that we made at some point that, you know, this is, this is important to us and this is a place that we want to heal. So for those of you who are looking for support, um, on the, you know, just working through some of the emotional baggage, like, um, like Janine said, there's help and support out there. And for those of you who, you know, you don't really feel that way, you just need that support. Definitely check out Infectious Disease. Invest for better. Um, so with that, I want to be respectful before you go there. Just a couple

Janine: 27:31

things on that. So I totally agree with everything you just said. I think it's really important. There's also, you talked about betterment and robo advisors. So for people who want to do that, another great robo advisor is L vest. I don't know if you've heard of them, but they're great. It was started by a woman who came off of wall street. It was created by women for women. There's a lot of values aligned investments on it. There's also ways to be in community there. They have courses. So that's another thing. If you want to go that route to check out to check out Elvis. I think it's really great. The other thing you said that I want to double down on is this is a process. This is not a sprint. It's a marathon. It is a lifelong journey as women. And I see this in the women that come to our courses. They think they need to know everything before they do anything. They think they have to have everything buttoned up and tied. Right? And all pretty. And you know what? No. You don't. And guess what? You're going to screw up. You're going to make mistakes. Expect that you're going to lose the money. Expect that the stock market is going to dive and you're going to get scared. Expect that it's all okay. You know, you invest for the long term. This is a long play and it is a process that you take at your own rate as you can. Just start and don't expect that you're going to know everything right away.

Sabine: 29:01

Yeah, we don't even have time to get into this. But as you were talking about, like the, you know, it's a long term game, you know, I think about, uh, younger generations, right? Who have this expectation of like things just happening, right? Like, you know, that call it microwave, whatever expectation. And it's just like, these are some of the things that like, hopefully they're thinking through, right? Like 40, 50, 60 years from now. Yeah. But we also live in an environment where like everything is expected, like tomorrow, right? Like I invested in my a millionaire yet. Like, you know, so it's really a mindset shift, uh, that many of us need to undergo or at least be willing to explore so that we understand that it's not, it's not going to happen overnight. And even when we do see shifts, they're temporary. It's temporary. Awesome. Well, I want to jump into the blitz section real quick. I asked you some, some super rapid questions here. So, you know, coming from the place that you are right now today, when you look back over your life, if you could go back to a younger version of yourself and give her a piece of advice based on what you know today, what might that be?

Janine: 30:12

So when I was young and I see this in a lot of young people, my life felt like this up and down, up and down highs and lows, highs and lows, highs and lows. And, um, I've become more much more even keel. It's not a bad thing. What I would have told my younger self is when something really upsetting happens or something really exciting happens, don't react to it immediately. Just sit with it. Sit with it until the energy around it dissipates a little bit and then sort of listen to your inner voice to decide how you want to react to it. It will help keep you out of really bad, gnarly, like downward spirals. And it will also help you from going too much off the rails when things are In an upbeat mode as well. So I would just, I've learned to just sit with things a little bit and it has served me very well.

Sabine: 31:05

Yeah. Yeah. Oh gosh. The pain, the pain that would be alleviated if we just sat with things for a moment. Um, and then, you know, looking ahead, right? Obviously, you've, you've built this organization, the impact that you're making, you're, you're allowing more and more women to not just be empowered and informed, but giving them the tools that they can, that they need to, you know, ripple effect that impact as well. So, you know, looking 50 60, however many years down the line, when you're looking back on your life and what you've been able to achieve, what do you want that narrative to be around your legacy?

Janine: 31:42

Well, in terms of the work that I'm doing now, I mean, our mission is to literally change the economy. So that would be wonderful if we can make that happen. But my whole life and career has been around leaving the world a better place than I found it. And so how I did that and the things that I worked on. Um, have changed over time. I started out working at an individual level with people teaching, um, adults how to read who had gone through high school and still couldn't read beyond a 4th grade level and now I'm working more at a systems level. So I think I just want to know that I. Made an impact in that in many ways and that I left the world a better place than I found it.

Sabine: 32:24

I love it. Love it. And of course your book, uh is is a prime read Um, but outside of your book Are there other books that you have come across that have been game changers for you either in your journey or as you've supported? your clients

Janine: 32:40

So one book that I really like is a book called designing your life. It was written by bill burnett and dave evans You Um, I have recreated myself multiple times, and I fully imagine there will be a 4. 0. Um, so I like them. These are 2 lectures. It's a place called the D school, which stands for the design school at Stanford. And basically what the book does is it takes design theory that has come from some of the best design companies in the world, and it applies. It helps us apply it to our lives. And how can we use design theory to create? the lives that we really want to live.

Sabine: 33:19

I love that. How empowering. All right. We will be sure to include those in our, to include that book along with Janine's book in the show notes. So be sure to check that out. Um, and so Janine, if people are listening or they're watching the replay and they're like, I need to connect with her, I need to learn more about the organization or, you know, maybe just, uh, push myself, uh, to step into, um, you know, a bit more empowerment. How can, what's the best place. For people to reach out to you

Janine: 33:47

so you can reach out to me on LinkedIn. That's one option. You can learn more about Invest for Better there. If you're interested in either being part of a circle, or leading a circle with your friends. Um, check that out, just go to invest for better and you can find information about it. And, um, you can find my book anywhere books are sold. Amazon, Goodreads, your local bookstore.

Sabine: 34:12

Awesome. Well, thank you so much, Janine. This has been, uh, So informational, action packed, even just in the short time that we've had a chance to talk here. So for those of you who are listening, you know, please, at the very least connect with Janine on LinkedIn, check out the website, you know, and if you, if you have questions or if you're, if you feel a little paralyzed, you know, don't, don't stay paralyzed. Just reach out, ask the questions that you need, uh, to help you make the decisions that you need to, and then, you know, get into community. with other women who are focused on, you know, not just money for the sake of money, but money for the sake of making an impact. And like Janine said, uh, leaving the world a better place than how she found it. So with that, we will be back next week for our final interview in this series. of money. Uh, Janine, thank you so much for your time and for this conversation, your knowledge and your wisdom. With that, have a great rest of the day Take care. Thank you so much.

35:13

Hope you enjoyed this week's episode. If you found today's conversation helpful or got a piece of insight that you plan to implement in your life, I'd love to hear from you. Connect with me on LinkedIn at Sabine Gideon and send me a message, or feel free to leave a review on either Apple or Spotify. I also invite you to share this episode with anyone in your network, another powerhouse, possibly. Who you think might benefit from today's conversation. Lastly, as always, any links, any resources, or any upcoming training is included in the show notes. So be sure to check that before you leave today. Until we chat again, have a blessed and powerful week.