Dead Drifters Society: A fly fishing podcast
Tying Tales: The Art and Precision of Crafting the Perfect General Practitioner Fly with Ryan Morgan
If you've ever wondered about the alchemy of transforming feathers and tinsel into a lfly that outsmarts the wiliest of fish, then you're in for a treat. Reel in some wisdom with fly-tying virtuoso, Ryan Morgan, as he rejoins us after a significant hiatus to weave through the creation of the General Practitioner fly. Step by step, we'll unravel the secrets behind thread placement, the strategic selection of hackle, and how the right touch of tinsel can bring your fly from mundane to masterpiece. It's a blend of art and science, with each twist and turn meticulously designed to culminate in the perfect lure.
The camaraderie of anglers is often found in shared tales and tips, and this episode is no exception. Brian and I swap anecdotes from riverside misadventures, infusing humor with practical advice on the fly-tying techniques that ensure a catch you'll be bragging about for seasons to come. Delicate feather alignment, the correct use of wax, and why the eye of the hook should never be crowded—these are but a few morsels of the feast of knowledge we lay out. Our discussion isn't just about crafting flies; it's about crafting experiences that resonate with the heartbeat of the river.
Tune into this episode as if joining old friends in a cozy riverside cabin, the air rich with the scent of wax and the promise of tomorrow's catch. From the historic lineage of the General Practitioner pattern to innovative solutions for stubborn feathers, every minute is packed with the insight only years of dedication to the craft can provide. Forget about simply listening to a podcast; join us at the tying vise, and let's create something truly enchanting together.
•Ryans Instagram
https://www.instagram.com/0ryan999?igsh=cWpsZng2OWk1bjBm
If you've ever wondered about the alchemy of transforming feathers and tinsel into a lfly that outsmarts the wiliest of fish, then you're in for a treat. Reel in some wisdom with fly-tying virtuoso, Ryan Morgan, as he rejoins us after a significant hiatus to weave through the creation of the General Practitioner fly. Step by step, we'll unravel the secrets behind thread placement, the strategic selection of hackle, and how the right touch of tinsel can bring your fly from mundane to masterpiece. It's a blend of art and science, with each twist and turn meticulously designed to culminate in the perfect lure.
The camaraderie of anglers is often found in shared tales and tips, and this episode is no exception. Brian and I swap anecdotes from riverside misadventures, infusing humor with practical advice on the fly-tying techniques that ensure a catch you'll be bragging about for seasons to come. Delicate feather alignment, the correct use of wax, and why the eye of the hook should never be crowded—these are but a few morsels of the feast of knowledge we lay out. Our discussion isn't just about crafting flies; it's about crafting experiences that resonate with the heartbeat of the river.
Tune into this episode as if joining old friends in a cozy riverside cabin, the air rich with the scent of wax and the promise of tomorrow's catch. From the historic lineage of the General Practitioner pattern to innovative solutions for stubborn feathers, every minute is packed with the insight only years of dedication to the craft can provide. Forget about simply listening to a podcast; join us at the tying vise, and let's create something truly enchanting together.
•Ryans Instagram
https://www.instagram.com/0ryan999?igsh=cWpsZng2OWk1bjBm
Welcome to death Directors Directors Society. So, um, yeah, let's get my thread started there.
Speaker 2:No worries.
Speaker 1:So, on these return I hooks, I like to uh, I like to uh, with my thread hanging just past the return, you know where, where the eye returns to the hook. You know what I'm talking about.
Speaker 2:Yeah, okay, so back.
Speaker 1:No, no, no, just take your, just wind your thread back up. Okay, so return. Yeah, take off a take off a pretty good length of let's restart here before we get too ahead.
Speaker 2:Um, it's doing the weird like visual thing. I'm like I'll take a screenshot and send it to you later. There we go, it's clear. Yeah, I think it's when you move a lot like freaks out a little bit. But I see, yeah, it is.
Speaker 1:Well, welcome, brian Morgan. How's it going, my man?
Speaker 2:It's good man. How are you Not too bad?
Speaker 1:Um, yeah, I was just looking at it.
Speaker 2:What's the trouble? I expect Yep, Always. Um, yeah, I was just looking at it. I was like damn. Episode 15 was the first time I was. I guess it was the only other time we did one of these. But uh, yeah, it's been a while since you've been supporting me, so appreciate it. Hey, man, yeah, and then as far as today, um, we've been talking about doing the general practitioner fly and whipping that up for a while.
Speaker 2:So now that's our plan. So I'm going to go ahead and do a little bit of the. I'm not sure if I'm going to be able to do that, so now, that's our plan.
Speaker 1:Let's see how it goes.
Speaker 2:I don't know, I'm not that good of a. Yeah, I would say you're better at fly tying than I am. Um, yeah, I know A little bit, just a little bit. You got some skills and you, you're pretty new to it. Considering it must be like what? Five years now, or Five years, I've been doing this for almost over five years.
Speaker 1:Three, three See, yeah, I just passed three years.
Speaker 2:That's great, all right. So yeah, general practitioner, um, we've got our hook, we've got some thread going and we've laid out the materials, so we'll go over that one by one. Um, but yeah, you said that we're starting from Just behind the return of the uh, the eye.
Speaker 1:I'm going to do my threats started and then kind of leave it hanging just like a mill behind the the uh, Like an eye length or a half an eye length behind the return.
Speaker 2:Okay, I can do that.
Speaker 1:Um, and then I take a Take a pretty good length of Um, a little tinsel. Okay, this is small, simple fly gold and I like to take. I like to take more than I'm I think I'm going to need, Because it's just easier to work with more than less and you don't want to get to the front of your fly and have have to hook up your hackle pliers because you Too much of a cheap To use. Enough tinsel, Right.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's a. It's one of those things that, uh, you know, it's not the most expensive material out of there.
Speaker 1:Um, so I just tie that tinsel in right there With the threat is hanging and then run my thread back up to the return I, so that the tinsel kind of lays up against it and sort of fills that gap a little bit. Okay, and then I just run my thread back to the back and I kind of let the thread carry the tinsel under the hook shank. Okay, um, I've been tying these salmon flies and things lately so I've kind of gotten in some of the salmon fly habits, I guess.
Speaker 2:They're not.
Speaker 1:I mean, oh, because you have to be super precise with all that stuff, or you wind up with a big ball of snot on your hook.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, it works too. I definitely been fishing them a lot more and even going for steelhead. I'm still getting other trout grabbing those, yeah.
Speaker 1:So, like with those, space flies even time.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:I've been seeing those on your stories. That's pretty cool. Yeah, those are looking good man.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and they're working. They're sitting upright. I mean there's plenty I could improve on, but as far as like fishability, they're definitely fishing nicely and doing what I want, which is catching fish. Yeah, they're putting fish in the net. You're doing something right. Exactly, it's not egg season anymore, so I need, like, all the help I can get.
Speaker 1:You know, I just I've never been able to get behind the whole egg thing. I tie them, I put them in my box, but I don't know, I feel like the fish gods like laugh at me when I put them on my tippet.
Speaker 2:Yeah they, they were never catching anything with them. That's funny. I, you know, I started the same way where I was always like oh, I never catch fish on these until I hit like an actual egg season and I would watch like eight fish come to my one egg. But now I do a lot more like streamer fishing, like egg sucking leeches Did. You might not get all those, but you'll get the big guy to come out and play. So, Dude, I love eggs.
Speaker 1:I can leeches in like black or olive in the fall, for a sea runs. Holy smokes, yeah, they hammer those things so hard. It's, it's weird, like those are like a little sculpting pattern, like a little inch and a half or three to three inch sculpting pattern, in any color. They just hammer those things, dude, it's so fun, yeah.
Speaker 2:I like coastal cutthroat as well. On those and every fish basically every year. Like if you're fishing you can get a little bit of a fish. Like if you're fishing and there's, you know, salmon around, you can get coho, pinks, whatever, um, all the trout species and yeah, they just climb on. It's like no fish fish, which is always my preferred method.
Speaker 1:Yeah for sure this is a good one. Um, I caught my first coho on the fly on one of these, a general practitioner, yep, actually, I've caught my first three coho on one. Yeah the same the same fly.
Speaker 2:It's a pretty classic fly in terms of, like, how many people have written about it and how long it's been in. Such an effective fly, like it seems a lot of people start tying that fly when they're going kind of more traditional.
Speaker 1:Um, oh, it's a shrimp. It's a shrimp pattern technically, um, and a lot of people like um like to tie. There are a couple of different. I think one of them is called the alley shrimp. Um, I can't remember all of them. There's like two or three other ones that people prefer to tie because they're faster and a little bit easier than this fly, but I think this fly just swims, so cool, plus, it's classic and I'm into that. So, yeah, you know. Yeah, so I take my um, my thread down, like in between the point and the barb, maybe a little bit closer to the barb, the point of the barb, and then I wrap my thread up in touching turns about as far as I think it's going to take me to make four to five wraps of the tinsel, right, okay. And then I just bring my thread all the way up to the front Um, so I have more room to like maneuver with the tinsel, all right. And then I just wrap my tinsel up in touching turns. I should probably put my other glasses on.
Speaker 1:Over here, but one small tag in terms yeah, it really is a small tag, um, but just a little bit of flash. I think is is good on a fly like this. So I'm going to do five wraps and then I just bring my thread back to right in front of the tinsel. Yeah, just unwind it.
Speaker 2:That's a good trick, too, is just getting your thread out of the way and coming back to it once you're Mm. Hmm, that's definitely Something that I've been doing a lot more of, just to Put less things around.
Speaker 1:And then when I, when I Tie the tinsel off, I just bring the thread in front of the tinsel and leave it hang like behind the Like look at over one of the knobs in my vice or something to get it out of the way, but leave it hanging there. After you get the, get the tag put in.
Speaker 2:Okay, so don't cut it off or go and keep using it.
Speaker 1:I mean you can, but you're just going to put it right back in.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I guess, like I was wondering about that because like I guess it's just the tag end, that's why they call it the tag, and I think it's just like a little Little tag, little tag, okay, not complicated. The first time someone said it I was like what is he talking about?
Speaker 1:Well, there's like there's a tip and there's a tag, and it's hard to keep up with which is what, and I think it just depends on. Honestly, I don't really know. I know this is a tip. I mean, I don't know if you have a like a floss tag in front of it or vice versa.
Speaker 2:I'm not really sure.
Speaker 1:I don't know. I should know as much as I read up on the crap. Yeah.
Speaker 2:I definitely know enough to get tying, but when it gets into logistics sometimes I just nod my head and wait to see if I'll figure it out All right.
Speaker 1:All right. So, uh, next you need your bucktail and I try and find. Well, this one's pretty straight, but I typically try and find like bucktail that's pretty like wild looking. And you don't necessarily want the tips lined up, I mean, you kind of want them a little wind up, but once you cut your lump out, you don't necessarily want super straight pieces.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you can. You can take some of the shorter stuff out, okay, like, get it up by the tips and just some of that shorter stuff out. You don't need that much really, and you can uh, you can kind of stack it a little bit, just grab the longest fibers and then pull what's under them out and then grab it again. Kind of wind the tips up and grab it again.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's a good one, instead of putting a stack.
Speaker 1:But again, you want it kind of wild. Yeah, it's supposed to, maybe, uh, maybe about a third of that, third of that. Okay, let me see again. Yeah, that's a lot, so half for so.
Speaker 2:There we go.
Speaker 1:You can always put more into and you want. So, you want your, you want your bucktail about the length of the whole, the whole fly, so From the eye to the to the tinsel basically, and then you just tie it in at that point right in front of the Right in front of the tag, and I like to tie it in a little bit In front of where I want to tie it in and then, uh, wind my thread back to it, yeah, and then I'll take a, because we're tying on a space like this, yeah, and it's got that that drop in the bend. I'll put a, I'll put a rapid thread under me, or two some times, just to kind of prop that tail up and keep it in line so it'll swim Right once you get going and then just take collecting wraps to grab that book tail and just collect it up about halfway Because we're tying a shrimp. So this is the head and this is the tail, right, yeah?
Speaker 2:Yeah, it swims backwards.
Speaker 1:Yeah, like shrimp and crawfish, do so. This helps you build your taper in the fly by only wrapping and collecting your book tail back this far.
Speaker 2:And you just do it Sometimes.
Speaker 1:I'll even.
Speaker 2:Oh, sorry, what's that? I was just going to say. Do you ever cut it on a bit of an angle to kind of taper it out?
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, for sure. Okay, you can't really tell, but I did Okay, and then I'll just. I mean, because it's a dub body, you don't really need your thread wraps to be perfect. But I was going to say, sometimes I like to take either a root beer color or a red color of book tail and just throw it like a take a couple of. I'll use red.
Speaker 2:I got black. That's my only other option. Didn't you say a root beer or something? Oh yeah, that's what that is, I guess so.
Speaker 1:I'll just you can do black too, I guess. So I'll just take like a really, really sparse amount of that darker color and lay it in just short of just short of where the other tail extends to yeah, and tie that in Just to give it a I don't know, I don't know that it doesn't eat anything. I just I kind of liked a little bit of contrast in the, in the flat. I think it looks kind of cool, and then I'll collect that up too.
Speaker 2:And you go all the way to the end, or almost to the end, matt.
Speaker 1:I go almost to where I cut the other one and cut it off there, so it, like you were saying, cut it at an angle. It creates a little bit of a taper.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I was more talking about if I'm trying to make those tips match, but I just went a little bit.
Speaker 1:Oh, like a little bit shy, like about two thirds or three quarters of the way in Perfect that's what I did.
Speaker 2:Yeah, a lot of the times when you're tying flies, like you kind of got to separate things or else it just becomes a mess in the water yeah, I like a lot of my tube flies. When I first started, all the materials ended at the same place and my hope was to get that teardrop. Look Before, I knew about, you know, arctic fox and dubbing balls and such. So now I definitely you know if you can tie a fly and it looks like there's not enough material, but in the water it looks full. That's really the goal of it.
Speaker 1:I guess that's a good fly.
Speaker 2:And those are way easier to cast, especially with this Bay rod. You know, a single hand get away with a lot.
Speaker 1:Well, that's the whole idea of an intruder is to create a fly that looks big and full in the water but uses as little materials as possible. Yeah, that's one of the reasons that flies, so it's successful that it's got a lot of movement.
Speaker 2:I don't know. Well, and that's the other thing is, when you separate your materials, they actually move. You have either a lump of marabou, which was 90% of my flies for years yeah, you know, nothing's really moving, it's just like all stuck together. So we've done bucktail, we did two different layers of bucktail, or with our gold tinsel tag for wraps. That's pretty easy to remember so far.
Speaker 1:You can even use anything for that tail. You can use Arctic Fox or pig bristles or tackle fibers yeah, you know really anything that just makes that. I think bucktail swims better. But Arctic Fox works pretty good too.
Speaker 2:Yeah, when we were talking, it was potentially, I do. Funny enough, I do have a bunch of different colors of Arctic Fox white, purple, pink, blue, orange so I could have used that as well, yeah.
Speaker 1:It's just another material you can sew. You know, if you find that you don't have the material that you want to, if you find a material that's similar and it has similar properties and look, you can basically sub it. You know, yeah.
Speaker 2:So now you're cleaning off a golden pheasant tippet, or, yeah, tippet, tippet. What are you looking for in the feather? That's always something like when you're picking through your feathers there's a lot.
Speaker 1:I look for like a medium-sized feather. I don't a lot of people tie it in by the stem, but I don't think that's quite as durable, so I'll find a feather. That's a little bit. Oh crap, did I lose you? Nope, okay, give me just one second.
Speaker 2:No worries, I'm just putting a little pause on Laptop was going into our phone, yeah yeah. I'm using my phone so I have more room. I could play some elevator music here while we wait. Do it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think I've got it. Sorry about that. No worries, I'm going to pay attention. All right, where were we? Oh, yeah, I like to take a. I'm taking kind of a medium-sized set, yeah, mine's about the length of the body, but I'm going to tie it in. You owe me. You're only going to tie it in about halfway down the bucktail, not even Just half halfway down and can too thick be a thing.
Speaker 2:So I can just pull off some of the side feathers and kind of shoring it up.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, if you want. But what I do with mine is I kind of I ring the feather, I just kind of roll it in my fingers and turn it into like a little tube and I try and roll the fibers down so that when I tie it in.
Speaker 2:Oh, it kind of does like a cape over top of it, exactly, okay, yeah, this golden pheasant definitely has like this interesting property when you kind of roll it around.
Speaker 1:And well, it just makes it more manageable. And then once you get it tied in, like do a pin trap to tie it in, yeah, and once you tie it in, just kind of give it a little tap, tap, tap, tapro, and it'll drop over the sides of that bucktail. A little bit Trim, some of these, okay, so that works.
Speaker 2:Okay, mine laid down. Quite nice, it's pretty. Even along the shank Looks like a fly Must be a fly.
Speaker 1:It's, you're working on it, and then I trim that just a touch longer than where I trim the bucktail. Okay, but I don't collect it yet, because now you're going to go to your golden pheasant.
Speaker 2:Nice little cape, little bird.
Speaker 1:Whoa.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's kind of amazing how many different like feathers are on this one bird. Yeah, they're great dude, I love them Fatically different. You know, Are we looking for a super long hackle here?
Speaker 1:No small to medium, Okay. And then, of course, clean off the lower. Perhaps. All the fuzz, all the flu, All the flu.
Speaker 2:Mine is definitely. I'm calling it from now on all the flu.
Speaker 1:And so it's called.
Speaker 2:Is it? Yep, I like it all the flu, it's all UE All right. See, we're learning. We're out here just learning a bunch.
Speaker 1:So I am. So now, this feather, when you tie it in, you're going to tie it in just longer than the tippet, so you want it to come just past where the tippet tip of that tippet Tip of the tippet. So that's 10 times fuzz.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:No, thank you. All right, and I do the same thing with this feather Roll it Get it into a manageable state and then give it a pin trap in.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I guess shrimp aren't really going for any beauty contests, as the creature they are.
Speaker 1:It's not really spread down like all that too. It's just a color change. Really is really one of those.
Speaker 2:Yeah, there's not a ton of hackle there.
Speaker 1:That's fine, though it's just like a little just a little whisper over the top of that tippet. Okay, and then collect your.
Speaker 2:Definitely tied some tube trims, and this is like very much looking like the beginnings of that as well. So it's definitely a shrimpy pattern for sure. Do you know where it originated?
Speaker 1:He had to ask me that Well.
Speaker 2:I was curious. We could Google it and then cut it out and no one will ever know. It'll sound super fan, except I know where it came from. Oh God.
Speaker 1:It's even on my Instagram. I can't remember it, man. If you hadn't asked me, I would have told you. Yeah, I wouldn't have to remember you know.
Speaker 2:Yeah, whatever, bro, that's the story of my life, when I like want to sound smart or say something or like, oh, I know the, and then it's gone. She's not sure it's a British pattern, though. Yeah, I mean it's an old one, so that would, that would line up.
Speaker 1:I'm actually 100% sure it's a British pattern. We could get the Bates salmon flybook out. Let's do that. No, my stack of books just almost fell over. Here's the book. This is a great book If you like classic patterns, salmon flies.
Speaker 2:Who's the author? Joseph?
Speaker 1:Joseph Bates and Pamela Bates Richards. My buddy Mike actually has flies in this book. Just a little name drop there. He was friends with the Bates. That's pretty sick.
Speaker 2:How old is that book?
Speaker 1:Oh look, you're asking me all these facts that I should know.
Speaker 2:I'm sorry it's, they pop in my head and then I'm like mine's. What's the guy that's? You know, reads and stuff.
Speaker 1:Yeah, let's see there's no copyright 1996. He did another book, it's fishing streamers and it's a. Really it doesn't have as many. I mean, this book has beautiful pictures in it, beautiful pictures. When I find the one, I'm sorry. This is the general practitioner.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, those are the coolest pictures.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Very detailed to see what's a glare. All right, esmond Drury, it originated in 1953. The Bishiles, so it's not that old. Old enough, though Old enough Older than me? Yeah, a little bit.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know, I've been working that long.
Speaker 1:If you look at this, this, can you see that one, yeah, here at the top. Yeah, it looks nothing like the general practitioners you see in, like on people's YouTube channels, I think. I think maybe David McPhales is probably the closest, but, like in the riffle, and some other ones have done it too, and all you see is the tippet, which isn't the idea. Anyway, david McPhales, such a cool cliente, that guy's amazing. All right, so now you're going to need a saddle hackle. If it's a little bit webby, it's not going to hurt anything. I like to tie a webby one in the back because it gives you a little more length and a little more movement, I guess.
Speaker 2:It doesn't have to be super long.
Speaker 1:I guess saddle hackles aren't usually crazy long anyways, but I just think you know a little bit longer than the hookup probably is good.
Speaker 2:Okay, yeah, I got that.
Speaker 1:You remember that trick? I showed you.
Speaker 2:Yes, I do. It's a good trick, like we're going to tie the guinea feathers.
Speaker 1:We're going to do that to the saddle hackle, the hackle player is good.
Speaker 2:Okay, so this trick you're talking about is just pinching both sides of the stem of the feather. I'm going to show you again.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you get your hackle and you get the tip, and then you just use the pliers to hold the feather and all you're doing is folding the feather down either side of the rake and rocking the fibers back and forth, and all it does is it breaks the fiber at the rake so that it actually folds down.
Speaker 2:Yeah, this is definitely one of those tricks that you know tying in guinea feather I'd usually strip off half, but then you can never have the fly have that kind of full feeling.
Speaker 1:Right? Well, sometimes you want a sparse throat hackle and other times you want, like a really thick one, yeah, or at least a noticeable.
Speaker 2:Well, and then if you do the guinea hackle, since the fibers stick together so well, you tend to get like clumps of them versus like you know. Obviously, if you wrap to slap in or a marabou, you'd get that, you know, even spread all the way down. But this is a really good one, for I was trying it with Heron earlier today.
Speaker 1:If you pinch it, if you pinch it, pinch the fiber and then just kind of wiggle your fingers back and forth over the rake, it'll break the base of the feather. Just break the straightness of that feather and make it possible to fold. It works really good for body hackle and samplers.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and it sounds very nicely. It like forces it to sit upright, which was the aspect I was going for when you showed me that trick last. All right, well, it feels pretty good. There's a little more I can work on, but you can start tying it in and I'll just keep working on this.
Speaker 1:So in this one I tie it in by the base.
Speaker 2:And are you wanting the small fibers to the back and the long fibers to the front, or vice versa? Yeah, I'm tying it in back to the back of the fly or the hook and the front of the hook as the front.
Speaker 1:I'm tying it in by the base of the feather.
Speaker 2:Okay, so we want the longer fibers to the back, and so it kind of tapers off to small.
Speaker 1:Like you would tie in a spay hackle. Yeah, yeah, I mean if it was like half bronze cock or or a slopping and then for like a purple king or something.
Speaker 2:When you tied in. Would you want the hackle facing you or facing away from you for it to fold down or lay down and kind of swoop back, or does it not matter so much?
Speaker 1:It does matter. You want to tie the fold toward the hook? Okay, so like if you laid the feather against the hook, it would go around the hook.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'm picking up what you're putting down, I think. Oh no, I kind of did it upside down in a sense. This is one of those things that gets me once in a while is trying to make those fibers stick up but also stick back when I'm tying the fly.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so you're tying it in so that the shiny side of the feather is facing you, which would be the other, and right in the underside of the feather is facing the hook. It's so much easier to do this when you have somebody in front of you, not on video.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I bet. So this is now facing towards you, so I want to face it towards you currently, exactly.
Speaker 1:Okay, boom. I haven't decided if I'm going to cheat or not. No, cheating.
Speaker 2:But what is the cheat? I need the cheat code, man.
Speaker 1:So I was thinking of using this, this collection, neil, from a Semperfly. It's just a like this, a long Chanel, like a long fibered Chanel with kind of a tinsel in it. Yeah, the traditional pattern calls for seals for which we aren't allowed to have here in the States, but I think, wrapping this up, it looks kind of all stick, all stick, traditional and work with seal.
Speaker 2:For You're just wrapping a Chanel, so you don't really need to explain that, because that's just a wrap that you go around.
Speaker 1:I'm actually going to use this pearl Chanel. It's just like a ice dub Chanel kind of thing.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I probably have that. Oh, I see it, I do, but I'm going to stick to the seal. Yeah, classic.
Speaker 1:Classic. If I was allowed to use seal, I would Okay.
Speaker 2:As far as do you line the fibers up? I guess, with dubbing all dubbing I usually do anyways, just kind of on old stack it.
Speaker 1:Kind of I just when I use dubbing, at least some of the scud from, since it's lying. This is really good stuff. It's like it's almost like seals, fur the scud, dubbing, skid, dubbing from. Yeah, what I do with that is I'll kind of get it lined up, get my thread back here, get some wax on it. Oh, I'll kind of get the. I'll kind of get the dubbing started and leave a big blob of it on there, right, yeah, and then I'll start wrapping it and see how my body's going and just kind of, you can kind of stretch your dubbing out so it's not so thick as you're wrapping Right, and then it makes it way easier to I mean seals not hard to take off the thread, but it makes it way easier to Take it off if you decide you don't want anymore.
Speaker 2:Yeah, okay, I see you. So you kind of like spin the top nice and tight and just leave a bit of a clump of yeah, and just dub it on the thread as I, as I, as a roll. And we want it to start off pretty thick and then go pretty thin. Um or just keep the tape that we've made.
Speaker 1:Yeah, just uniform is pretty good. Okay, I'm gonna wrap my chenille. This is actually gonna look really cool. It's gonna give me almost the exact body size I want.
Speaker 2:Mine's pretty thin, should I be going thicker Um?
Speaker 1:You can see that.
Speaker 2:Can't see it because it's this is definitely Thicker than mine minus. Yeah, just like the chenille. I mean I can make it a little more more thick than that. Yours looks pretty good. Okay, well, I'm just going to run with it. It's going to be a skinny shrimp. This shrimp had a hard life. That's my story. Work, let's skip Thanksgiving or whatever. Yeah, I Couldn't afford to eat out in this economy, so it is about the truth. Hey, it's starting to throw out the 30% tip on your meals out there In Washington, do I? When you go out to a restaurant, do they ask if you want to tip 30%?
Speaker 1:No, I just do.
Speaker 2:It was like a weird transition from it was never about 20 and then it was like one day there was 25 and now there's 30%.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, my, my lady works as a server and you can probably stop your body right there. Okay, you know you don't want to go past halfway.
Speaker 1:That's a little past halfway back in her off right there and and because, well, I worked in the food service industry, you know, years and years ago, and here in the States at least, the servers don't get paid. They don't get paid really, and so when you leave a tip, you're paying their salary, more or less, yeah, and so, and the other thing is, a lot of these restaurants charge the servers but tip out, great, and so, whatever that, whatever number they sell say, they sell 2000 they have to tip out a Percentage of that to the, to the bar, to the kitchen, yeah, to the host staff. And so, you know, I talked to people that don't leave tips, which at least Something, right? Yeah, because if you don't leave a tip, then that server ends up paying for you to eat. Granted, it's five, ten bucks or whatever, but that's five or ten bucks out of their wallet that they're paying because you were too cheap to, yeah, not you, the, the person, yeah. And so we just, we just make a habit of Tipping them, you know no, that's fair.
Speaker 2:I worked at the keg, so I was, I was kitchen staff and, getting you know, once a week we got a tip out. It was never huge, unless it was, like you know, christmas time or something when tips were generated. So, yeah, no, I get the tipping thing. That's that. It was just a random thought that popped in red moving on though. So Now we've got everything kind of hanging off and we've got the dubbing body going Mm-hmm. Now it's on to some hackle wrapping.
Speaker 1:Yeah, or so there, there are a couple ways you can do this one. So there's a couple ways you can do this. You can wrap the hackle first and then the old pencil. Or you can do it like I'm gonna do it Interrupt the oval tinsel first and then the hackle. You can do like man I really like this for old chenille, for this great use of it. I Want to do five wraps because it looks good to me, okay, and then, after I get the old tinsel wrapped, then I'll come up with the Saddle hackle Hackles twisting on me and I'll just wrap that up behind the yeah.
Speaker 2:Long as the Hackle isn't Hackling me, I'm okay when I draw the line.
Speaker 1:Let me just wrap that up behind, behind your tinsel wraps.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that trick of flattening out your saddle hackle Definitely really helps in this type of scenario.
Speaker 1:You didn't help me much. My hackle twisted and it would not Wrap right, and I wasn't gonna go all the way back, so we got. There's a trick for that too, though If you just take, take the fibers down the side of the hook and just squish your fingers on the hook like that. You know that one.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, I force. I mean I want a lot of the times, but this time it worked out really really well.
Speaker 1:Oh, I disturbed my tinsel. Now, oh you.
Speaker 2:Thread wax. You know what I have? This like really non, like it's so bad it doesn't really do anything. So, no long story. No, it's something I would like to To purchase because I've come to see In some youtube videos and stuff how, how useful it can really be. It's great.
Speaker 1:Yeah, walks that makes science so much easier.
Speaker 2:Definitely for like dubbing or like setting wings. It seems like that would really help. But yeah, I like it because you can.
Speaker 1:You've got more control of your thread. Your thread will stay where you put it, you know, and if you break your thread it doesn't come unraveled, it'll just stick there and then you can retire thread in Super easy. Oh, that is a bit of a hack. The, the one I've used basically the whole time I've been tying. Okay, dakota flying where? Yeah, dakota angler Sent me a cake of Semper fly prepared. Sent me a cake of Semper fly prepared, tires wax, mm-hmm, and I've been using it ever since and it's great. You, I mean, you have to warm it up to get it soft, but if you keep it on your finger or like, I'll keep it on top of my light sometimes if I don't want to have it in the way, yeah, makes tying a lot easier. All right, now you want another Tip? It feather.
Speaker 2:Why is there, like ogres, which are like onions, just a bunch of layers?
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Like ogres. Yeah, it's just from Shrek. He's like I'm like an onion, got it? I always think that I'm like I'm just doing layers right now. Okay, so same kind of thing. We want it to Be about the length of the shank.
Speaker 1:So here's, here's where you start getting into some technical stuff, not really technical, just the detail, right? So this bar, yeah, on the tip of the tip, it Should come to the first bar on the last tip of the tie. Then, okay, like so.
Speaker 2:That makes sense, kind of lining it all up. So I guess. For if you're grabbing the hackle, um, grabbing from the middle of your, of all your feathers, or the tip it, I should say grab it from the middle, it'll be like a straight stem and run all the way down, kind of straight Versus going. Yeah, wide ones which are kind of more curvy.
Speaker 1:I just pick an extra large feather, or not an extra, just a large feather, yeah. And again I roll it. So I have that out of control when I tie it in and, um, you get it lined up with that bar. You're a nice little pin trap. Tie her in.
Speaker 2:Mmm, I just tried to tried to tie it in without kind of With laying down those fibers, and it just rolled hard. So I guess that's kind of why you do it.
Speaker 1:Just that's one of the reasons, yeah, my feathers going kind of wonky.
Speaker 2:Tied it in again. It's down medium, mine laid, down medium, mine went wonky. I lined it up, so I'm not going to play with it more and won't walk this down. Oh, when I did that, it did some shit.
Speaker 1:As long as it swims right, it doesn't really matter what it looks like.
Speaker 2:Yeah, the fish don't care. Your friends on instagram might, but the fish don't usually care if it's swimming proper. You know what? That is actually pretty damn good Laying down flat. It's sticking up because of the hackles, but I'm assuming that's normal.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so normally this fly, like I said, is a lot smaller, so it's tying another.
Speaker 2:Oh, doubling.
Speaker 1:You can, doesn't hurt anything. Just trying to get this feather to sit right. Sometimes they don't want to.
Speaker 2:No, I was going to ask you if there's a bit of a trick for getting it to like lay flat on a fly.
Speaker 1:The rolling the feather is usually my trick, okay.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it has to do with like. Also, I've noticed when you, whatever you're laying it onto, if it's not kind of perfectly even, and if there's a little bump, it just like flares things whatever way it wants to. That's where I've been like trying to do much more consistent thread wraps and like really trying to make things nice and smooth. So I don't have that issue, um, which does pay off like it's. It's sitting pretty damn flat, a couple grown men playing with feathers. It's normal, it's very normal.
Speaker 1:Right, yeah, I think it's normal.
Speaker 2:It's hard to explain to other people and make them see that as normal, but for us as anglers, I think it's very normal.
Speaker 1:Sure, so I'm just going to leave that for a minute. It's like turn Under twisted or something. I'm going back.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's another good.
Speaker 2:You know Kind of tip about tying flies. That took me a while. Is it's worth it to unwrap and just reduce something if it's not sitting right? You can get into these motions like earlier. I was tying a fly and I Tied in the um the feather Quite well, but I wanted it better and I never got it back to that state again. So eventually I just gave up and Finished her off. Um, we'll still swim properly, I know that. But I was kind of sad and when my first attempt went so well and then I thought I could get it better, that one seems like it's sitting better yeah.
Speaker 1:It was.
Speaker 2:Can you guess who's going to be the next episode? Someone you know.
Speaker 1:Uh, your next step is like the next one. You're gonna release yeah after this one.
Speaker 2:I'm going to release this one this week and then the next one after that's going to be Leonard Leonard. Oh, nice, yeah, then she goes. Then she goes, do it like we did. But we're going to rerecord it because there's some issues with the Video and he had some really cool stuff he was trying to show me, so it just made more sense if we redid it, then Put out. You know that, right, like I'm redoing this, five forty seven ten.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, and that's that's the main issue with Doing the YouTube thing is there's a lot more Room for error when it's not just audio. Right, because before, if you know someone's audio wasn't doing too good, we could just cut the video and just record audio and that would generally fix the problem because it would be using less, less internet to do it. But now, because we're Needing both, needing both. But you know, that being said, things will maybe improve on my end, but you can't really expect everyone to have top of the line cameras and stuff going on and Obviously talked to so many different people that you know Only a percentage of them would have really done YouTube stuff before.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah yeah, so. I can't get this feather right.
Speaker 2:I'm just sitting here with this perfectly laid feather. Don't know how that happened, but it did. Yeah, blow it out your ass, howard.
Speaker 1:This, this is gonna work. Maybe it's the chenille is it?
Speaker 2:so much like such a Bigger bump that it like kind of doesn't lay no it's the it's.
Speaker 1:It's not even that. It's the fibers that aren't Like they are spread out, like they are Spreading properly, like there's. They're spreading like this instead of Altogether. It's like a split in the middle.
Speaker 2:I'd pick up what you're putting down.
Speaker 1:I can take a bodkin and fix that bump situation.
Speaker 2:Oh, that's a good little technique. So you grab the hackle and then you put your bobcane between the shank and the hackle, right behind the thread wraps, and you kind of rub it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, just kind of back and forth, just kind of warms it up and relaxes it so that you can kind of form it where you want it.
Speaker 2:Oh, you're back to that Van Gogh painting style. It honestly looks good. I'm going to screenshot this. I'll send this later. It looks cool. It looks like you're in an oil painting. It's pretty cool. And then it clears up after a bit.
Speaker 1:Weird.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean, there's just like super pixelating. Not even pixelating, it's kind of like an oil painting, like it looks like there's brushstrokes.
Speaker 1:Then you're going to want to put another one of those red breast feathers.
Speaker 2:Okay, over that I can do. That I can do. I kind of throw out the feather a little bit. Shout out to my friend Zach who came through with this this.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that was cool of him.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I asked him and he was like dude, I literally got one in the mail today. I was like wow, the same kind of thing, just stopping it, just passed.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I went a little bit long on this one, but as long as it's not longer than the tail, you're good. Yeah, I like a little hook on my thumb that's creating my threat and breaking it. Memory board Hmm, riceless smoothies thumb right out.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, definitely when you're working with metal, because that's what you do you weld right. Yeah sometimes, sometimes metal fab and welding, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:Technically, I'm supposed to be welding. No, I do my job.
Speaker 2:Careful because your boss might listen. Yeah, he's definitely going to listen. Your boss is the person that's coming on next.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah. He's a good dude man. He's solid, he's a super smart dude too.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that I've, noticed.
Speaker 1:He's the first person I ever tried to fly with.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah. Yeah woolly bugger, woolly bugger.
Speaker 1:You got to start. And then there's another fly called an olive willy. Technically I think it's a bass fly, but it's a Washington original pattern from a guy out in like Spokane or something. And I caught my first fish on that fly on the fly. And that was the second fly tied.
Speaker 2:Crazy.
Speaker 1:It's a cool fly, super easy to tie to, all right. So then you just repeat the body process. You tie in your tinsel what the hell Okay.
Speaker 2:So we're back with the tinsel and primitive feather. Do you want this one to be less bushy now that we're working down, or that doesn't matter so much? Oh, you saddle hackle, yeah, sorry.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I usually pick one that's a little bit smaller. Okay, not considerably, I think, I don't know. Yeah, mine's a little bit smaller, but I've got more like it's less webby.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, Mine's a little more webby.
Speaker 1:It doesn't matter what Dude webby feathers are good, they need love too. Man, I'll send you some of this threadwax. Yeah, I would appreciate it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, for someone that's never used threadwax really definitely makes me think like what have I been missing out on?
Speaker 1:Everything and once you use it, you'll be like what have I been doing with my life Speaking of bosses and work. I have to get up super early in the morning.
Speaker 2:Well, that being said, I appreciate you taking the time and running through this fly.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's kind of what I was getting at.
Speaker 2:We talked about the YouTube thing for a long time, yeah.
Speaker 1:I suggested that when you had me on that first time.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so episode 15 to 104. It took me a bit, but here we are.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, you're not some dude that makes a bunch of money on YouTube. All this is coming straight out of your pocket. Yeah, it's one of the cameras set up, or audio set up you have.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I've definitely spent a pretty penny to be able to keep doing all this. I mean, I had to upgrade on a laptop just for editing because my other laptop was super slow. But obviously it's nice just having a good laptop, Sure.
Speaker 1:I need to get a new one myself, now that you mentioned it.
Speaker 2:Okay, once I'm. I guess you're getting your hackle on at that same stage now.
Speaker 1:All right, and then dove your body up?
Speaker 2:Okay, Well, are we getting thinner or keeping the same kind of consistency?
Speaker 1:Well, Mark, can you see mine?
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:My, my underbody is tapered already. Yeah, and yours is too it looks like.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it is for sure.
Speaker 1:So it's definitely going to taper down, even if you don't actively taper it. Yeah, but if you want to put a taper in it, sure fly man.
Speaker 2:No, I need structure.
Speaker 1:I really like to look at this chenille under here.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's a good substitute that was one of the things we were wanting to talk about as well is just substituting fly or feathers and such Like. Yeah, totally, you know, especially if you're first getting into fly tying and you start going by each thing that something tells you to or a different fly pattern tells you to when. Oh right, substitute quite a bit.
Speaker 1:Yeah. So if fly isn't going to work any different because you put seals for instead of pearl chenille or pearl chenille instead of seals for it, just as long as the structure, the fly is right and it swims properly, that's all that matters.
Speaker 2:And then how far behind the hook I should I go.
Speaker 1:So you're going to.
Speaker 1:Most people are going to want to get it as close to the eye as they can, because they want their fly to end at the eye right.
Speaker 1:Well, usually when people tie, they push their materials toward the eye to get that head right next to the eye. So what ends up happening is you tie in, like say, the body material, you tie it in and you stop pretty close to the eye and then you tie your tensilin and you stop just in front of that and then you tie your hackle in and even though you're tying it off in the same spot, you're still moving forward just a little bit. And so by the time you tie your next set of feathers in and you go to put your head, you're covering up the eye. So I always leave about an eye length behind with my body materials, and that's more like three quarters of an eye length, and then as I tie in my other materials, like my tensilir, and so I'll probably get four wraps, but don't stop too far behind the eye, otherwise then you have, like, I guess you can put a turtleneck on it and it will make sense.
Speaker 2:When I used to end so far behind to avoid crowding the eye, but then I would be light years behind and it didn't work. But apparently that also affects the swim if you're too far back, because the weight ratio and all that and how it flows in the water changes.
Speaker 1:So that's. I don't know if you've noticed, as we've been tying, but I use my thread. I use where I end my thread as a marker, as a tool to mark where my next material is going to go. So I'm measuring my fly out as I go with my thread.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that makes sense, and then you eventually just get used to always ending it in the same.
Speaker 1:I don't know. I actively leave my thread where I know my next material is going to go. But just for me it's become a habit.
Speaker 2:Yeah, fair enough. Okay, well, that's starting to look like something. Yeah, well done. No, not even.
Speaker 1:Okay, this saddle hackle is not cooperating. Another thing you can do with these after you tie it up if you're, if you're hackling see how my hackle sticking out of the side like that, yeah, and it's going straight down instead of being swept back. Yeah, you can either take it and grab the grab the bend of the hook with a pair of tweezers and take it in the bathroom and turn the tap water on super hot and run it under that and just point it the direction you want the fibers, you know. So the water's coming over the fibers and it'll push the fibers back and hot water will actually relax the fibers into the shape that the water's flowing. Or you can take a hairdryer and just aim it right at the fly while it's in the vice. Be sure you don't have anything on your desk. Yeah, it's going to go everywhere, but it'll. It'll push all those fibers back and kind of line up the fly for you.
Speaker 2:That's a good little trick. It's a great trick. Yeah, Old dudes man, Old dudes dude.
Speaker 1:That's where all the tricks are All right. No, we're dip it. Dang, this bird is beat up. Man, I keep a I usually keep a steamer next to my tying desk.
Speaker 2:So same thing, touching that next or the previous tip it that we put in, we want the first or this yeah they. It's the first black line to match up with our second black line under next feather Exactly.
Speaker 1:Okay, see you in learning.
Speaker 2:Or you know, there's some things I can learn. Tying flies is definitely one of them. Tying flies and fishing yeah, I feel bad for my teachers that had to put so much extra work into teaching me when really they should have just gave me advice and said here you're going to fish a lot. That would have probably been easier for everyone.
Speaker 1:Right Dude, my lady bought me a fish pond bag for Christmas Right on One of the one of the submersibles. Yeah, I have the. I have the big backpack for like when I pack in Somewhere, like I can a long ways and have to cross the river a few times but don't put my smaller stuff in my food and drinks and whatever and that. But now I have a submersible day pack.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that is honest and I've got to use. It's so nice to have a wet pack or a dry bag that you know especially for, like your cell phone, when it's pouring rain or any type of weather, but there's knowing that everything inside is going to stay dry, assuming you remember to zip it up.
Speaker 1:Right, oh man, this weather stays there.
Speaker 2:I'm not going to lie, mate. The next fly I tie or the next GP that I tie up will probably be that much better. But now that it's kind of taking shape, I'm noticing that there's a bit of a lean to the feather that I tied down last, or the tippet that I tied down last leans to the side a bit.
Speaker 1:Oh damn it. Tippet is one of the hardest feathers to tell you to do.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I've heard that from more than just you it doesn't like to sit flat.
Speaker 1:Well, the stem is shaped in a almost a triangle. That's why rolling it usually works.
Speaker 2:But not today.
Speaker 1:Whatever reason, and I tied a couple in preparation for this and they look way better, it's because there's a camera on us. Yeah, plus now I can't. Oh, no, I put them. So it happens. When you clean up, you forget where everything is Stupid.
Speaker 2:Now another belly feather, I would assume.
Speaker 1:Yeah, another breast feather I can tie mine. I'll probably take the most one with a store. I did Sometimes on this one, I'll tie it in two.
Speaker 2:Okay, yeah, I can definitely. I'm glad that I backed off a little bit and gave myself more room at the eye, because it's definitely getting up there.
Speaker 1:They're pretty good, and the only reason I do two in the front is sometimes these feathers spread a little too much. Am I liking?
Speaker 2:Boom, fuck, that's turning out pretty damn good. Plenty of room for improvement, but pretty damn good.
Speaker 1:I am.
Speaker 2:I really wish that one feather underneath wasn't angled, but I will still fish it. You know it's still going to go in the water. My theory with flies that swim a little bit like upside down or whatever as long as they're not spinning in the water, I think the fish will forgive us.
Speaker 1:I think you're right.
Speaker 2:Boom. Oh yeah, two just darkens it up a little bit too, which is nice yeah.
Speaker 1:I'll do one a little bit longer and one a little bit shorter and kind of keep it layered. Another thing when you're doing a pin trap, if you I was thinking about this earlier and just remembered when you loop your pin trap around, get your thread there and then if you pull straight up, you know you do your pin trap, you loop your thread and then, instead of pulling back toward you, if you pull straight up, the physics of it, your thread loop goes straight down. If you pull straight up, your thread loop pulls straight down. You're not putting torque in the thread, so you can avoid torquing your materials around the shank that way.
Speaker 1:There are a lot of people, especially when they tie in, like when they're stacking deer hair they'll pull the thread toward them To spin it. No, when they're stacking it oh okay, like when you stack it and you want it to stay on top of the hook shank or on bottom of the hook shank, they'll loop it two or three times and then pull directly toward them. Yeah, and for whatever reason, with deer hair that works, but with feathers that doesn't work as well because it causes the thread to torque. If you pull it straight up, your thread your loop will go directly down. That's another old guy trick. Yeah, that fly is looking good, man, it's not looking bad.
Speaker 2:Eh, not bad at all eh Eh, sorry for my Canadians. Canadians, eh Eh, buds yeah, I'm kidding.
Speaker 1:And then on these dude, I like to put a big head on them.
Speaker 2:Okay, do you switch color threads, or Well, I'm using orange already. Yeah, I switched to red.
Speaker 1:I guess I was using white, so and the reason I like to put a big head on it. I mean not like super big, but normally like I would put a smaller head than is already on there. Mm-hmm, like on space flies and stuff, I try and get my head as small as possible. I don't like to fly as quickly.
Speaker 2:I'm still fish straight, so I'm pretty happy about that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yours looks better than mine, I think.
Speaker 2:Beginner's luck. That's what we'll chalk it up to. Okay, Thanks bro, no worries.
Speaker 1:So, like I said, I don't put like a huge head on it, but I definitely put a pronounced head. If you tie this pattern and put in a couple strips of rabbit on either side in the back, you got to crawfish. And then, instead of putting a big thread head, put a big tungsten bead back here Boom.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'll be happy with that. You're right, the Fesin-Tippet is definitely a hard one to lay flat Like that could take you the most time. Everything else is pretty basic with a few tips and tricks, but that Tippet is a hard one. It always wants to roll and kind of lean to one side.
Speaker 1:That's where that pin trap really comes in handy.
Speaker 2:I wish I used it, but no one told me earlier. Sorry bro. Yeah, no, don't let it happen again.
Speaker 1:If there isn't again, I won't have it back now.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you didn't teach me this one trick. That's it, that's it, that's all for him.
Speaker 1:I'm just going to throw some Solaris bone dry on it for head cement. I love this stuff for head cement. It cures hard and fast. Dude, look at this. Can you see that? A?
Speaker 2:glow.
Speaker 1:Yeah bright. That little audience. Yeah yeah, that does look good. It's going to be so good in the water. I'm going to do the hairdryer trick. I found one handy Sure. Those are the trade.
Speaker 2:All right, I wasn't sure if you were muted, but yeah, I can definitely see how the hairdryer is like, pushing the fibers back and they're staying a little bit more. Oh, got the hook, wow, yeah, so under hot water or a hairdryer, and it will help rest those feathers back the way you want, yup.
Speaker 1:So it looks really good from my side, yeah.
Speaker 2:It looks good on my side as well. That definitely helped with the hairdryer. Just laid everything back. Yeah, I'm excited to see this in action now, probably going to tie up a few more in here, so I have it in stock.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yours looks good man.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it could. It's sitting a little couple of feet. Yeah, it could be improved, but I'm pretty happy with that. I know from past history with flies this thing is going to still sit relatively properly. It might lean a bit to one side but I'll still fish it with confidence, I believe.
Speaker 1:Yeah, dude, you can't go wrong. I kind of tinted my breast feathers in the front. I kind of made it tint instead of laying them one on top of the other. But I'm kind of like this.
Speaker 2:Just side by side. Oh okay, you kind of rounded it.
Speaker 1:Almost like a bronze and mallard yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, that was awesome, man. We set out to do this and we did it, so I feel accomplished. Okay, see you later. Yeah, well, I don't want to keep you up too much because, yeah, I know what it's like to have to get up early and go to work. What time is it? 9.30, which is pretty good, oh, that's not bad. No, yeah, that's probably average, I would say. But yeah, I mean, it's always a pleasure chatting with you and I'm glad that we're able to get this out of the way.
Speaker 2:If people like it, I definitely will be. Well, I like it. We'll still do a few more, but we should pick another pattern and eventually get it out there as well. It's just fine. Yeah, I know, I know, for maybe the audio it's not like the craziest episode out there, but maybe next time we'll do a bit of talking and just fishing and what we're up to, and then we can go on to time to fly. But we're on a bit of a time schedule tonight anyway. So we worked out the way we needed to work out. But, yeah, take a photo of that and I'll use it as the cover, okay, if you want. Or you could tie another one and say that it was that one.
Speaker 1:If I can find one of the other ones. I'll probably take a picture of that one.
Speaker 2:Well, no worries, ryan, I really appreciate you coming on and dropping some knowledge. There's a couple of really good tips in there, definitely the like pin trap, where you pull up to like lock the feather down straight, because I would always pull towards me and exactly where you're saying it rolls to the other side. So I'm going to practice with that, and then it still happens when you pull up sometimes.
Speaker 1:It's just not as often and it's usually not as bad.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I get that. I get that. Yeah, that's, I'm going to try that, definitely with bronze mallard.
Speaker 1:I've been doing it the other way and it's been a frustrating oh for sure with wings, man, okay Wings, bronze, mallard wings like duck, quills, slip wings, salmon fly wings. The less movement one way or the other you have on that wing, the more likely you're going to get it laid down the way you want it?
Speaker 2:Yeah, because it's nice, like I've gone it a few times where I'm trying to stand something up on its side and instead of rolling, it crinkles down on itself and sits. You know, it's amazingly. And then other times where it's just rolling and rolling and and it folds. It almost seems like once a feather is gone, one way that feathers, like tainted with knowledge of what's on the other side, mostly it's you, mostly it's in your head yeah, probably get tripped out by it.
Speaker 1:Dude, sometimes I have to like I'll try and tie in a wing and it just goes so wrong the first time and so just set it down and like walk away, go like eat a snack or something whatever, smoke a cigar or something, and then come back and try again and almost always that second time it's like money.
Speaker 2:Money. Yeah, sometimes walking away from a situation and coming back to it in a bit is just the best thing you could possibly do. So, actually, if you keep it in your tree when you're casting, take a break, breathe a little and by the time you go for your next cast, calculated, all the calculations have had to enter your brain and generally clothing swirling around it, yeah. So, anyways, awesome man, I'm sure we could ramble forever, but I'll let you go and, yeah for sure, appreciate it. Yeah, man, anytime, all right, buddy.
Speaker 1:Well you have a good night and I'll talk to you later.
Speaker 2:All right, buddy, I'll see you in the next video.