Moxie Matters: The Power and Magic of Personal Stories with Karen Brothers

Definition of "Moxie":
Force of character, determination or nerve. "When you've got moxie, you need the clothes to match."
Synonyms: energy, pep, determination, courage, know-how, fortitude, savvy, skills, strength of mind, guts, fearlessness, heart, gumption.**

We could all use a little more moxie! Karen Brothers' book,  "Moxie Matters: True Tales of Rolling Through a Messy, Muddled and Magical Life" is an entertaining, enlightening and inspiring story of growing up in the 70s, with unstructured outdoor adventures and the simple rule of coming home when the streetlights flicker on. Karen is a professional writer and storyteller, and I thoroughly enjoyed experiencing her life lessons through the lens of her younger self, at each age.

Karen  shares her motivations for writing her memoir from the perspective of her younger self, reflecting on how her childhood experiences and subtle family dynamics shaped her journey. It's fun to be reminded of memories from our youth including moon boots, Pop-Tarts,  Hi-C! At the same time, Karen walked through difficult and painful family circumstances that shaped her character.

We talk about the therapeutic power of sharing personal stories and the raw honesty required to connect deeply with others. Her practical advice on overcoming the fear of writing, the benefits of consistent journaling, and even using voice memos is invaluable for anyone looking to document their own narrative.

**excerpt from Karen's book, "Moxie Matters"

Invite Karen to your book club! Reach out to connect with Karen and order her book at www.karenbrothersauthor.com

Order Moxie Matters HERE
https://moxiematters.myshopify.com/

Order Stephanie's new book Imagine More: Do What You Love, Discover Your Potential

Learn more at StephanieNelson.com
Follow us on Instagram @stephanie_nelson_cm
Follow us on Facebook at CouponMom

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:24

I'd like to welcome my friend, karen Brothers, to the Pivotal People podcast, and this is exciting because I met Karen at our very first Bob Goff writing workshop about three years ago. She's the kind of person who you wish lived down the street because you know you would be friends. And she's written a book and it's come out and anyone who reads it is going to have that same feeling. You're going to feel like I know Karen. She is a person I want to be friends with. I read her whole book. Of course it's called Moxie Matters True Tales of Rolling Through a Messy, muddled and Magical Life. I loved this book.

Speaker 1: 1:02

Karen is younger than me, but it's kind of a very fun memoir. She is a professional writer, so it is great writing. You know how sometimes you read a book and it's written by a person who isn't a professional writer. But they have a great story and the story is good, but the writing you have to wade through it. But when you have good writing it's kind of like writing down a river. You're floating down, you're not. The writing is carrying you through the story and that's exactly what this is. I don't know how else to describe it. So it's well written, it's a great story. I've done too much talking. I want you to get to know Karen. Welcome, karen.

Speaker 2: 1:42

It's great to have you. Thank you, I'm so glad to be here and to see you. This is wonderful.

Speaker 1: 1:48

It's great to have an excuse to connect with people you haven't seen for a while. That's why I do this podcast. I loved your book. It is Karen's life story, a part of it, her childhood, starting from the day she was born to the day she got married, and so and you got married relatively early out of college, just during your 20s yeah 22.

Speaker 1: 2:12

22. So she's 54 now. Clearly there's going to be a sequel because we're not done. But what I loved about it was it was like a fun adventure through the pop culture of the 70s and 80s, Because Karen is so good with detail, so many things I forgot. We'll get into that in a minute. But first could you tell us about yourself now, Tell us who you are, who you do life with, what you're doing now?

Speaker 2: 2:40

Absolutely so, wow. So Karen Brothers and I live currently in Charlotte, north Carolina, with my husband of. We just had our 32nd anniversary. Congratulations, thank you. Thank you, yeah, so big reveal, right? That's not a spoiler in any part of my story, and we've been here in Charlotte for almost two years. We moved from the Chicago suburbs after we have raised our three daughters. We have three daughters who are in their 20s and they're each living on their own. They have jobs, moving forward with life, doing amazing. They are all fantastic women, and so my husband and I thought it felt like time to downsize. My husband didn't even know it, but he came home Actually it was.

Speaker 2: 3:28

We met at the airport after the Bob Goff Writers Workshop where you and I met. He had a business thing. We met, we were at the airport and he had just talked to his boss who had offered to move him to Charlotte, and he said what do you think? And I had just come off at the Writers Workshop where my brain was just on fire and I was getting so excited about my next steps and what I was going to do, and he had no idea. But I had been getting the house ready for about five years to sell. He had no clue, and so I said an immediate yes, having never been here to Charlotte, and we've loved it. It's been a great adventure, yeah, so we're loving life and yeah, that's great and so okay.

Speaker 1: 4:07

My next question is always what prompted you to write this book? Tell us about your writing experience. I loved your writing experience.

Speaker 2: 4:14

Sure, sure. So okay, I started as an elementary education teacher many years ago. I taught in the Detroit public schools, loved it. Then we started having our family. I stayed home and then I started working part-time, got an actual full-time job as director of children's ministry at our church and had no plans on that being what I did with my life. But I have always tried to follow my gut and so I took the job. That job led to me meeting the folks at Big Idea, which is the company that started Veggie Tales. They're most famous for the VeggieTales brand and together with them we produced two of their vacation Bible schools for their marketing videos. And then I will just say they kind of poached me away from the job.

Speaker 2: 4:59

I was ready to move on. I had been there about three years, very full-time with very small children, and so now I got to work part-time with the Veggie Tales team, which was a dream, because I love the humor. It was so much fun. So I started writing with them developing. Actually, first I started on a creative team to help them develop their next Vacation Bible School, and then I just was mentored by their fabulous senior managing editor and writer, cindy Kenny, and she taught me so much. We worked together for many, many years my gosh, 15 or 16 years, maybe, I don't even know Well, over 10 years, and I'd done various projects for different publishing houses Sunday school curriculums, vacation Bible schools. I went on to write the Veggie Bible Dictionary that was my first ever book. That was so much fun and I did a Boz the Bear devotional book for parents of preschoolers that was a product from long, long ago and then most recently worked on the Action Bible products with David C Cook. So I've worked as a freelance writer, developer, creative team member, writer developer, creative team member, turned into editor for almost about 20 years and then I pivoted.

Speaker 2: 6:14

A few years ago I took an online writing course with author Martha Beck, who I really admired, and she pulled in her good friend Elizabeth Gilbert, another author that I really admire, and I just loved what I learned. And I learned in that course that I had a different story to tell. I had been retelling Bible stories for a couple of decades, right For children. I loved it. I had a great career, but I realized I remember so much in such detail, going back, so much in such detail Going back. The first real memory I have is in my crib and I just thought there is a reason I'm remembering this.

Speaker 2: 6:55

And then I ended up going to. I did Bob Goff's online writing course during the pandemic, which I loved, and I've submitted writings, you know, through the course, and Bob actually read what people wrote in that course, blew my mind, then went on to his workshop, which, again, was just really encouraging. I went into the workshop with a fiction book in mind and then I realized, oh, all this woman's, all her stories are my own and I just started writing them down as essays. I had a conversation with a friend, my friend Corey Reed, who you met and worked with for Men in the Middle, and after our conversation, which was just super encouraging, I looked at my notes and the word moxie I had written it down during our conversation it literally floated up off the page and I was like, oh, that is the thread, the thread that pulls all of my stories together, and then within two months I think I had 100,000 words. It just poured out of me All the stories.

Speaker 1: 7:58

I love that. Well, I want to talk later after I have questions, because I'm about writing the story, because I think you have a lot of really good advice for other people on writing their stories, because I agree with you, writing your own stories is so important. And can I do this? Can I read? She wrote that she included the definition of moxie in her book. First of all, I love the word moxie. I have a little experience with it. I have a friend whose business is named Moxie Burger. They named their cat Moxie because their cat had so much personality. So when the family started a restaurant, they named it Moxie Burger after the cat.

Speaker 1: 8:40

But here's what Moxie actually means Force of character, determination or nerve. Here's an example when you've got moxie, you need the clothes to match. Synonyms include energy, pep, determination, courage, know-how, fortitude, savvy, skills, strength of mind, guts, fearlessness, heart and gumption. And that's why you want to read this book, because Karen's stories through her childhood embody all of those characteristics. And as I was reading your stories about your childhood, what kept going through my mind was what an incredible family you had.

Speaker 1: 9:19

And I'd love for you to talk about your family because Karen, from a very young age, had confidence, the kind of confidence we all want our children to have. And she was an individual. Your parents let you be who you were. So I looked at that and I thought what an example of Bob Goff likes to use this. He says this I've held on to it is don't get in the way of God's plan for someone else's life. Let our children be who they are, because God might have a better idea than we do. So could you talk to us a little bit about your relationships, your family and how that impacted who you were as a child?

Speaker 2: 10:01

Yeah for sure. So I'm the youngest of three children. My parents they married fairly young, very much in love, always saw their marriage as a love story. It was obvious, I heard, I love yous. We were told that we were loved, not as effusively as we say it now, with our children and our family, but grew up knowing that I was in a loving house. I have an older sister and an older brother and they are my sister's six years older, my brother's four years older. So my brother and I were playmates a bit.

Speaker 2: 10:36

When I was little. My sister and I were just enough of an age difference that we didn't really play with each other. You know, I tagged along, I hung out, I wanted to be like right. But also I lived in the time of the 70s where we literally were told, in the summertime especially, just come home and the streetlights come on, like you would just go out the door, I would go find all my friends, figure out our plan for the day, which I often determined, and then we would just have our adventures. And then at lunchtime you'd land at someone's house. It might be one of your friend's houses, it could be a completely other neighbor's house, and we would just say, hey, do you have any sandwiches or do you have some Doritos or Pepsi? And we just kind of.

Speaker 2: 11:22

But our little zone was small. It felt huge. As a girl right Like, couldn't really cross any busy streets. We could only go within a couple of block radius of the house in the summer. That was everything, because the streetlights didn't come on till almost nine o'clock at night so we would just free rain and in the winter we had great adventures in the snow and we just so much to do.

Speaker 2: 11:45

So I feel like my family. I knew it was a place of comfort. I had a very comfortable, wonderful home. We had family routines, dinner was always at 6.15. We had our assigned seats at the table, a definite routine, and I think that helped kind of give me the confidence. And plus, I was one of the youngest kids in the neighborhood, like in our small little zone that was full of kids. And one thing I did not talk about in the book is that in first grade I started seeing a speech therapist because I had such intense nodules on my vocal cords because I was always a little bit loud, always kind of demanding attention, and our one neighbor used to laugh because I was this little tiny blonde wisp of a kid and I would open my mouth and I sounded like Froggy from Our Gang. You know like I was a 50-year-old smoking man. So yeah, I definitely was not a quiet little kid.

Speaker 1: 12:43

But what came across to me was that you knew you were loved, you knew you could be who you were, and I love that. And her stories are so hilarious and talk about remembering detail. Karen really remembered detail. I mean, some of your lines were so funny. I see the elixir of the gods.

Speaker 1: 13:02

You talked about moon boots and her sister. They had to go to church on Christmas Eve and Karen had a cute outfit and she had cute boots and it's Chicago in the winter and there's snow and her mother says go put on your moon boots. And this was not her plan, it was not a cute outfit she did not want to wear. Her older sister got to wear the cute boots. She didn't understand this. So Karen's describing walking to church, they walk to church, they walk to school. It's just the most charming. Walking to church, they walk to church, they walk to school. It's just the most charming Americana story. And Karen's like here I am taking one big leap for mankind in the back. People our age are the ones who understand all this. The moon boots, the pop tarts for breakfast. You know I was thinking about the young moms today. I mean, my gosh, do they have organic pop tarts? If they don't. They're not doing Pop-Tarts.

Speaker 1: 13:48

I can't imagine, I don't know. So I so loved all of your references to all the pop culture stuff, but it was also a really wonderful reminder of the freedom that we had.

Speaker 1: 14:03

I mean, you know, running around with your friends you joked about we solved crimes all day long. You know, like Nancy Drew, we just solved crimes. You said you had an incredible mind for detail. You obviously did if you wrote all those words in just two months. But in writing a story you also had some really hard times and we'll talk about that. But as you went through the chronology of your story, were there any surprises or revelations that surfaced for you? You know now from this distance that you look back and said, wow, yeah, for sure, absolutely, and I did.

Speaker 2: 14:38

I made a choice early on and, I have to say, soon after I discovered Moxie was my thread, I started working with the team at Blue Hat Publishing and that was amazing because they helped, you know, form things in. But I made a choice early on and I remember writing an email to my editor saying, okay, I'm in this, I'm going to write this book from the perspective of Karen at that age, and I think it's a risk, but again, my gut, which to me is God, lives in my gut, like I hope I'm having enough probiotics because God's right there and so I wrote everything from the perspective. So kindergarten Karen is kindergarten Karen. And with my background of working and writing for children for 20 years, I knew there were vocabulary words that I had written maybe the first time around. And then I was like, oh, fifth grade, would a fifth grader really use that word? And there were a few times where, yeah, I did. Your typical fifth grader might not have, but this girl who was full of moxie, used those words. So I really tapped into that.

Speaker 2: 15:43

But a few things that surprised me for sure was, as I was choosing which stories to use right, and there were many that didn't make it into the book. I did see a pattern with my mom of what I thought was normal, was likely anxiety, likely depression, in a time where those words were not even in our mouths, you know. And if they were, it was not in any kind of a positive or kind way, right. And so I saw that from the big bird's eye view, right Of oh, interesting, right, and so that was probably one of the biggest revelations.

Speaker 2: 16:25

In all honesty, I have shared these stories. I have been in these stories not every single one, but I'm a firm believer in therapy. I worked with a great therapist for a few years, kind of went in because I was having a lot of anxiety and then just realized, oh, you know, and talked through, and that's one of the reasons I knew it was time to write the book, because I felt like I was in such a good, healthy place. I didn't. In my opinion, there's not many things worse than a memoir that feels like, oh, this person needs help, you know when you're reading it, and I hope that does not come across in Moxie Matters. That, you know, was kind of my hope.

Speaker 1: 17:03

No, and that is what is so unique. I emailed Karen or maybe it was on Facebook in. No, and that is what is so unique. I emailed Karen or maybe it was on Facebook in the process of writing this book, because what struck me I mean, I talk all the time, I love to write, but I love to read and I really love to read everything and I love to look at different writing styles, and what is so unique about Karen's is exactly what you articulated far better than I could have is that she wrote it from the child's age at the time, which is why it's so funny, because we don't realize the things that our kids, like she, would repeat, things her parents said which obviously were not, things that her parents ever thought would have ended up in a book.

Speaker 1: 17:45

Right, and these are the kinds of things that my adult sons love to repeat back to me and I'm like, oh my gosh, did I really say that? Yes, mom, you did say that. It's so funny. It's so funny. So, just even walking to church, walking to church on Christmas Eve and her dad's worried that their or the family's worried their seat's going to be taken, because this is when the creasters come, people who only come on christmas and easter. I was like oh yeah, that's good, oh anyway.

Speaker 1: 18:14

So so many cute things, but you, you managed to take some really hard experiences, couch them with humor and lightness, but it speaks to the reader. I've said many times my greatest loss was when my mother died, but she died when I was an adult. Your mother died when you were 18, 19?, 18, yeah, 18, right before she went to college. And you talk about that but you don't like. You said you're in a healthy place. You didn't bemoan that, but you were super honest about what that felt like. And back in the 70s or 80s you weren't able, we weren't. No one was saying oh, here's your therapist, oh, yeah, yeah. No one was saying let's talk about how you're feeling. They were like you know, now's the funeral and now we're going to do dividing your mother's jewelry, all these things that are so painful and at your age you couldn't even really articulate it.

Speaker 2: 19:13

No, and there was no thought. And because I was so outgoing right, that was a word to describe me as a teen oh, she's so outgoing, and it was true, but because of that I don't think anybody in my realm at the time thought, oh, maybe she's being crushed inside, you know like, because I was always trying to. From the time I could maybe talk to, I enjoyed making people laugh, right, and that became my role, that became who I was, maybe in the family a little bit, and in the neighborhood for sure. And so as a teenager, you lean into that and I think everybody in my life always did the very best they could with what they had, right. I have no hard feelings for any of that, but yeah for sure, because I was happy and had a big smile and sparkly eyes. Maybe, oh, she's okay, she's okay, she's strong, she's got friends, she's got this. But nobody ever asked.

Speaker 1: 20:15

I don't think really, you know what I loved, I loved. It was like just a couple of weeks after her mother's funeral. You know what I loved, I loved. It was like just a couple of weeks after her mother's funeral and her mother's dear friend took Karen to Bed Bath Beyond to buy everything for college. That just makes you cry, oh my gosh, yeah yeah. You look back at that and you think what a wonderful they were. All like this is what we're going to do for our friend who passed away. We're going to take care of her daughter. And on your wedding day you said tell me your mother's friends involvement. You got married just a few years later. Really, I was like, okay, that had to be hard. Your mom wasn't there, but your mother's friends stepped up.

Speaker 2: 20:53

Yeah for sure. So my mom's friends had a beautiful shower for me. That was like the neighborhood women, right. And then my godmother, who you just referenced, who took me to Bed, bath and Beyond. Her name is my Aunt Carol, who I love so much, and her and my Uncle Ron made it clear to me before the book came out that they wanted their real names. In the book there are a handful of real names, and Aunt Carol and Uncle Ron are in there, and she just finished Moxie Matters a couple of weeks ago.

Speaker 2: 21:21

She read it right away and she called me and we had the most beautiful conversation because she then remembered a lot of things about my mom. Of course she's always been my biggest cheerleader and has loved me since the day I was born, and so it was just such a nice affirmation. But she has said to me other friends, high school friends, reached out to me after they've read it apologizing for not being a better friend, and I'm like no, you were the best friend. That's why I remember it Like we were teenage kids. You know, we did our best. I had two friends stay with me through the whole visitation Teenage girls don't really maybe do that, you know and like. That was incredible and we are still in touch, you know. But my mom's friends for sure, especially my Aunt Carol, you know, she just really stepped in, took me shopping the first parents weekend at college. Aunt Carol and Uncle Ron came with my dad, as well as my dad's best friend from childhood, my Uncle Jack, and his wife, aunt Darlene he's also my godfather and so they came and they showed up, and when we all went to the mall does Karen need anything at the mall? And this is what 1988, probably fall of 88. And these two aunts, who are just close family friends, convinced my dad I needed that leather and suede jacket with the shoulder pads. You know, just always for sure, and I've been lucky that through my whole life, you know, some of these same people have consistently been there.

Speaker 2: 22:55

But yeah, I planned the wedding Our daughter's getting married next summer and I was on the phone with her last week and I actually started crying because, oh, it makes me emotional. I plan most of my wedding by myself. I'm pretty sure I went to buy my dress alone and I don't think anyone went with me. I found the planner when we were moving from the year we got married and I look at the weeks leading up to my wedding and it's you know to-do lists and it's me doing everything and it wasn't sad. I'm also kind of a take charge, can do Enneagram eight kind of gal, you know. So now that I get to do this with my own daughter, it's that is like blowing my mind completely.

Speaker 2: 23:40

Like what a privilege it is, blowing my mind completely, like what a privilege it is to walk with her and be a part of planning it for her.

Speaker 1: 23:47

You know, yeah, yeah, I love that, and you just hit on what I'd love to talk about next, which is the value of writing your story. I spoke to a group yesterday and we share a story, but it's also to let people know there is such value in writing your story, whether it's published or not. It doesn't have to be published. For me, the number one thing was reconnecting with people and in writing the story, you, as the writer, rediscover these super important relationships. But being able to share that with those people who you may not have been in communication with for a long time, to me, that's the greatest value. Can you talk about that?

Speaker 2: 24:29

Yeah, I mean, I absolutely. And this is where I kind of pivoted my whole writing career a few years ago when I realized, through the Martha Beck course, that and I wholeheartedly believe this I really believe that all of humanity is connected. I believe it's through Holy Spirit, and I respect that other people believe it's in other ways, right, but I believe, since we're all connected, when we tell our story whether it's to the person sitting next to you on the bench at the park or in a restaurant, or your best friends or at a writer's workshop when you tell your story, you make connections with people, right. The world then is not nearly as big as it can feel sometimes, and so when you tell just a piece of your story I did a blog, I think in 2018, just a piece of my story, and it was.

Speaker 2: 25:21

I got feedback every week and I talked about my mom and her cancer battle while I'm in high school. I just took a piece of what's in Moxie Matters and every week I heard from different people from my past who were reading it, you know and comments and, like, my husband has cancer. We have teenagers. I didn't know how to talk to them, but your story is helping me see how important it is to be honest, to be transparent, and I was like what, like I just that's me following my gut. I felt like I needed to get these stories out. I did keep journals from second grade I have one in second grade, middle school, high school, college, beyond but I didn't reference them. I don't think ever in any of the writing. I just know these stories. I just know myself, I guess.

Speaker 2: 26:09

But when you share it, it just brings people closer. When I first told someone close to me that I was going to write this book, their response was your story is no big deal, you don't have a big story. And they meant it in a loving way, I think, trying to protect me from maybe crashing and burning. And I just said no, I don't have a story that is like epic, but my story, other like pieces of my story other people will connect to because it's a universal story. Right, moxie? Initially my whole idea was I had so much Moxie middle school and high school that Moxie like started tanking right out of my engine. You know like, oh no, I know who am I from, this confident girl in sixth grade ruling the world, you know, at a talent show that I wish there was video for.

Speaker 1: 27:01

I wish there was too. It's a great story.

Speaker 2: 27:04

Thank you. But then to go into middle school, when then it was like oh, awkward, weird. And then high school, you know, I don't want to go in there I'm scared, like I think that's a universal thing for a lot of girls especially. I think it's not limited to girls. And then, kind of getting my moxie back back right and that's maybe the next part of my story is now being a woman in her 50s, right, like owning my moxie and my story, and maybe that's why it's such a good time to share it, right, because so many oh, you know, so many people in high school wanted a first kiss.

Speaker 2: 27:40

I really really wanted a first kiss, right. I really really wanted a first kiss, right. So I mean it was and it felt like it was a big deal at my house to have a boyfriend, you know, and I just think a lot of people relate to that, and it's been so fun, as people are reading the book, to hear from people who are in the book, who have recognized themselves and they're. You know, my one friend, who was Dina in the book, did a whole Facebook post, like. She took a picture of the story and she's like hashtag I am Dina and I was just laughing, so funny. I was like oh, my gosh, junior high friend, you know who? Oh funny, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1: 28:14

Well, and I always say, once you read someone's book, once you read their story, oh gosh, you understand them. And it is so vulnerable to write a personal story. But I say, once you read someone's story and you understand them, you can't help but like them, be compassionate, be less. It's so different than we think. We're reading people, we meet people, we see the top layer and we just assume the rest. If you read David Brooks' book, how to Know a Person, it's really eye-opening on how we do this.

Speaker 1: 28:49

But when you read someone's story, you're like, oh my gosh, I was so wrong and that connects us. That connects us because I'm going to see elements of my experience in your story and now, karen, you and I are connected and just as you said, and now I say everyone needs to write their own book and we all need to read each other's book, because if we really did that, if we were able to do that, we would be such a nicer world instead of what's so easy to do now, which is to judge and generalize and use labels and we dehumanize and all that stuff. So I feel like you know, karen, like I read people's books, we read people. I at least know Karen. There are plenty of authors who I'll never know, but I feel like we're friends because I just read the book and they opened themselves up. So I say to people all the time read, read, read. It is so fulfilling.

Speaker 2: 29:45

Absolutely, and for anyone thinking about writing their story. It doesn't have to be this amazing story, as was pointed out to me, right? But when you write it, don't just write it, don't think about it, don't go back and read what you wrote, just keep writing. I have so many journals everywhere. Keep writing, don't worry about it being perfect. I most recently worked mostly as an editor and it was so hard as an editor to write because I wanted to write a sentence, read it back, fix it, punctuation, all the things. But when you write out your story, just write it, because you can hire an editor to fix it, like now, especially in our world.

Speaker 2: 30:27

It's really easy to find people. We can point people to good people, right, to help edit your story. Just write it down. If you're not a great writer, do a voice, do a voice memo, like, say it out loud. There are many times where I would be taking a walk and one of my stories would come to me and I didn't have my paper, so maybe I would take a note on my phone or I would just speak the story and get it transcribed and then get it sent to me for a few dollars is all it costs to get it transcribed and so I don't know. I just want people to know truly that their moxie matters, right, and I don't need to be like, oh, isn't that cute. You know working the title back in here, but it's true, everybody's story matters and no story is insignificant.

Speaker 1: 31:14

No story. I could not agree with you more. It's like when I started to write my book, I was originally thinking well, you know, if you're going to tell your story, you just really want to tell the highlights. And I learned actually, no, that's really not the interesting part. The interesting part is the blooper reel. Yeah, yeah right, we're not going to connect with people on the highlights. Who cares about that? I want to know the vulnerable stuff. And now I spoke to group yesterday and now when I speak, I just tell the blooper reel. It is so much more entertaining and you know what. It's so much easier to be transparent than it is to try to keep up the.

Speaker 1: 31:51

Let me tell you my success story. Oh my gosh, that's harder, you know. So I appreciate. I mean. Karen, by the way, was also super successful. She was I'm reading through your whole experience in high school all the cool things you did, cool things in middle school, cool things in elementary school. Everyone has to get this book. The cover is so darling. My favorite color pink with roller skates, because she roller skated so funny. The shoulder pads Could you work on bringing those back, karen? I love the shoulder pads of the 80s.

Speaker 2: 32:27

And the big hair. I'm laughing because you know, I like. I like tame and straighten my hair. I'm like, if I got a perm now, right, I mean honestly, the last perm I got was January 21st 1989. My first kiss with my husband that was the last perm I ever got was that day. So I mean, if I got a perm now, what magic could happen?

Speaker 1: 32:41

What magic Right? Oh my gosh, I had my share of perms too, so funny. Oh yeah, so I would love to tell people how to get in touch with you. How can people find you Learn more about your book? You're doing some book signings. I'm sure you could speak on Zoom for book clubs. What kinds of things are you making yourself available to do?

Speaker 2: 33:08

Yeah, for sure. I have a website. It's karenbrothersauthorcom and there's an icon you can click on to join my newsletter. I call it my VI people and I have been sharing kind of the behind the scenes of creating Moxie Matters and the elements of it and sharing that with my readers, debating Moxie Matters and the elements of it, and sharing that with my readers so that you can most easily access through the website. And then I'm happy to have anyone email me and ask me any questions at karenbrothersauthor, at gmailcom and it's K-A-R-E-N. If anyone ever debates it's so fun, by the way, to have the name Karen now, let me just say that right now. Debates it's so fun, by the way, to have the name Karen. Now, let me just say that right now. And I have a book signing in Berwyn, illinois, on July 20th which a dear friend from high school, a classmate, has a restaurant that is an amazing restaurant and we were chatting and she said I would love to host an event for you. So I am inviting personally. I've been inviting everybody who's in the book who's still in the area, my high school orcasist dance director teacher. We're still in touch and I'm hoping that she's going to be able to make it.

Speaker 2: 34:16

My first grade teacher wrote one of the endorsements at the beginning of the book. We had stayed loosely in touch over the years and I saw who I knew had to have been his son on Facebook and I reached out and I just said any chance, your dad was Jim Ellsworth, first grade teacher, hatch Elementary School, oak Park. He said yeah, that's my dad. He connected us. We've been emailing. I'm going to invite him for sure to the event. He lives in Chicago. He went on to become a really quite excellent and famous in his right children's author. He has many books, jim Ellsworth. He is amazing and when I asked him if he would write the endorsement, he said well, I'm the one who taught you how to read, so it would be my honor. Oh, my gosh, and I was like you did, like he. There's quite a chapter on first grade. He was a huge, so that he still gets to be an influence on my life Amazing.

Speaker 1: 35:11

Amazing, and that's what I'm talking about Reconnections. How beautiful is that? Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2: 35:17

So I'm hoping. So I'm wide open. We live in Charlotte. We also spend some time outside of Charleston in South Carolina. I'm back in Chicago a lot willing, you know, really interested in working hard to get the book in independent bookshops. I'm in three right now with applications in for more. That's what I've kind of been sharing with my VI people lately. You know, like, what it really takes to get your book when you work with an indie publisher and you know, like what it really takes to get your book when you work with an indie publisher and you know it's. I think it's fascinating. I'm learning so much. I have been on the other side of publishing for so long and now I'm learning the nuts and bolts, the publicity, the all the things and I work every day and I'm enjoying it.

Speaker 1: 36:00

You have found your thing and it's helping other people and it's entertaining other people. How cool that you can do both. Thank you.

Speaker 2: 36:08

And I'm also. I am popping into some book clubs, so I'm doing a couple in person in the towns that I live in and I've done virtual book clubs, so absolutely open to that. People can reach out to me again through the website, for sure.

Speaker 1: 36:23

Oh, that's great. Okay, we'll have it in the show notes, but again, karenbrothersauthorcom, you'll find everything there. I just want to thank you so much for taking time to be on the Pivotal People podcast. I met her before I even started it, so when I saw she had a book, I'm like she's not getting out of this. I can find her. I'm emailing support. It's just really outstanding. So, thank you. Well, thank you, I love it. I get to meet cool people. We'll talk to you soon.