This is Messy Can't Stop Her. And I am your host, Judith Kambia Obatusa. J-K-O.
JKO: Welcome to this episode of Messy Can't Stop Her, the podcast where we share the stories of women's resilience through chaos, crisis, and the challenges of life.
We started a new series on domestic violence where we're sharing the different types of domestic violence. And we'll also share the stories of people who have directly or indirectly been impacted by domestic violence will also be sharing conversations with experts in domestic violence support services, either housing, shelters, psychotherapists, all of that.
Due to this series that we started. The person that we have on today's episode reached out to me because she has a story to share. Today we have Andrea Henning. Andrea, welcome. Thank you for being courageous to step up to the podium to tell the world how domestic violence has impacted you and how they can play a role in changing the trajectory of domestic violence in our world. Welcome, Andrea.
Andrea: Thank you for having me.
JKO: Tell us why you reached out to me.
Andrea: Last week, I received a letter from the Department of Corrections here in Michigan stating that the offender who murdered my sister would be up for parole hearing on June this year. As the end of his sentence has come. He's served his time, and now the board must decide whether to release him or hold him.
JKO: So you said the offender who murdered your sister. And just to be clear, this happened 22 years ago. Correct. How old was your sister?
Andrea: Nicole was 17 years old.
JKO: And what was the relationship she had with this offender?
Andrea: A new relationship as boyfriend and girlfriend.
JKO: So he was her boyfriend. So can you just tell us what happened?
Andrea: This was month four of their dating. And the last night I saw her was the day before she was murdered. And that conversation while we were getting ready for the day, she thinks it's time to move on. And she's going to let them know tonight after their outing with friends, she was ready to find somebody closer to her age. And she made the comment that he's a little too controlling and possessive, and it's really stressful for her. So the best thing she thought to do was move on.
JKO: So when you say she wanted someone closer to her age, what was the age difference between Nicole and this individual?
Andrea: We were told, my family and I, that he was 20 years old. Later, once he was arrested, we found out he was closer to being 23.
JKO: When you say you were told, was that Nicole told you that he was 20 years old?
Andrea: Yes. Just so nobody would be so alarmed that she was dating somebody so much older. This is what she told our family.
JKO: Okay. So she wanted to break off a four month relationship. Do you know why? Apart from the fact that he was controlling, did she tell you other details or did you notice something about her when she was in that relationship?
Andrea: She was becoming more risky with behavior. So there was probably more times than I can count that she wanted to be with him. And these older people that they were around and those people would like to drink and go to bars. He was basically in my mind at that time. I thought he was the guy from the other side of the tracks.
JKO: Can you just break that down a little? Because some people are listening to this podcast from different parts of the world, and even some people that are even in North America may not know what you mean. Different side of the track. Can you just paint the picture so that we can be in this situation even though we are not there? Just from your words.
Andrea: He was rough around the edges. He looks like he came from a different type of lifestyle than my sister and I were raised in. My father was a homicide Detective at the time, working in our city with the FBI. My mother was a nurse at a local hospital, and we did not see signs of abuse verbally or physically when we were around her or when she brought him around the home. I didn't think they were well matched. He seemed to like a lifestyle that we weren't accustomed to, maybe being from the wrong side of town or not exactly a gang member, but a rough crowd was his type of crowd to hang with.
JKO: Okay, when you say rough crowd, can you describe a little bit more about what made the crowd rough? Is it because they were very loud or noisy or … When you get worried as a sister or as a friend or a family member or a parent and you get worried about your child when you say a person is part of a rough crowd, what do you mean? Can you give us some examples of the things that your family or yourself saw in his interactions or the kind of people you hung out with that got you worried about the fact that she was with him.
Andrea: Just he looked like he might have had friends who were gang members. He liked to go out and party late at night. So those are things we don't do in our family. Those are things that we weren't accustomed to. A different type of crowd. Prior to meeting him, she was in Bible studies. She was in Bible groups, going to school. This individual, at 20 years old, was not in College or holding a fulltime job. So when she started the relationship, she stopped doing the things those things that she did like going to Bible study. Within four months, she changed.
JKO: What are the other changes you noticed to her? Because she said he was very controlling. Did you see any signs of his being controlling in any way? Maybe, he always called her several times a day when she was with you, or did you see anything that gave you any indication that there was something not quite right apart from the fact that he was from the other side of the tracks?
Andrea: I thought that for her having a new relationship, she didn't talk much about him and she did not bring him around much. So that kind of gave me the impression that maybe she wasn't happy with him. Okay.
JKO: So prior to the relationship with this person, had she had other relationships that she was free with the family about?
Andrea: Yes.
JKO: Take us back to the day she told you that she was going to go and tell him that she no longer wanted the relationship. You said in the morning when you were about to start your day, she mentioned this to you. And then the next time you heard about your sister was when the cops came. So tell us from the moment so you didn't see your sister all through that day. And then the next thing was the police. Can you walk us through that day when the police came, what did they say to you? And just give us a little snapshot into that day?
Andrea: Yes, it was September 25. We were getting ready together like sisters do hair and makeup and trying to share the bathroom at the same time to get out the door on time. And I asked her what she was doing that day and she said she would be with him and that it's on her mind to break up with him for the controlling, the possession, everything else that is going on. She wasn't really open with it. And I told her was that a good idea to do? And she said yes, he was just too controlling and possessive. She couldn't hang around with friends that she had before him. She couldn't talk to guy friends that she had before him. He told her what to wear, how to dress, where to go, how he liked her to look. And I guess it was just too much pressure for her at 17. So I told her good luck and I would see her tomorrow because the next day was a baptism plan for my two year old sister. I want my day with my then boyfriend. She went on her day and it was a friend's gathering who were all staying the night at one house to watch a boxing match on pay per view. Back then, that's where you pay for your cable showed to be aired. And it was a big deal. They were all going to be there about eight people. They were going to order in food and do whatever kind of socializing, whatever kind of party they were going to have. We are awoken at six in the morning, the next day by the chief of police, who at this time is my father's boss because he's a homicide Detective himself. He's knocking on the door, telling my father that there's been a horrible accident and he needs to go with him right now.
JKO: So your Daddy now left with the chief of police. So the chain of events unfolded. Give us the story from there.
Andrea: I do not know what happened while my dad was with his boss, but he was taken directly to the hospital where she was at in the middle of the night. Maybe it was three in the morning, four in the morning. They started arguing because I'm pretty sure she had told him that this was their last day together as a couple. And I don't know how that conversation unfolded, obviously, but at some point, they got loud enough for the other people to hear. And before somebody could intervene, gunshots were heard from other rooms in the house. They could three gunshots, but one had hit her intentionally. Where he placed it was where he ended her life. The last thing they heard in that house was, If I can't have you, no one else will. They hear a gunshot and they hear somebody scream, oh, my God. And everyone comes running down.
JKO: Oh, you said something. You said three shots were fired, and the one that killed your sister or the one that hit her was intentionally placed where it will be sure to harm her. Are you able to tell us what he did with that one shot? Where did he shoot her?
Andrea: The first shot or two. Apparently there was a struggle and she was fighting him, but the first shot missed and hit a wall. The second shot hit the couch. The third shot as she was trying to defend herself on the couch with her legs in the air, trying to fight him off, he placed right in her vagina and shot her through the vagina. Correct. And it traveled through her body and exited out of her back.
JKO: The bullet exited. Wow. Oh, my goodness. I'm so sorry that I had to retell that story. So your dad had to go and see this. When my dad arrived, they had just been working on her for the last hour. She did not have her identification immediately on her, so it took a while to secure the scene at the place of the shooting. It took a while to get all of the witnesses in the house in separate cars. I guess they were looking for the gun in the backyard. Nobody had a cell phone. And somebody ran down the street to use a pay phone at that time to call the police. So they are not exactly sure how much time was taken with her lying there bleeding out before the police call was made. When my dad reached the hospital, the doctors had said they worked on reviving her for nearly an hour, and there was nothing to save by the time he went to the hospital and all of that.
JKO: And then you had to go through the process of going to court with this person and he went to jail. How long was he supposed to spend? How much time was it meant to spend in jail for what he did?
Andrea: He was sentenced to a second degree murder and received 20 years for that. Here in the state of Michigan. He was sentenced for 20 years.
JKO: So he's been in jail for 20 years now.
Andrea: He's been in a security high Max security prison, I believe, for 22 years because they added on two years for him having unregistered weapon that he committed the crime with.
JKO: Wow. And when you were talking to me about this, you gave me an idea of what it did to your family, apart from the fact that you had to go through the motion of the court case. So you had to go to court and sit in through the process and then got him. So you reached out to me because of the impact on your family and the next steps that's going to take place now that he spent 22 years in jail. So before we go to the 22 years in jail and the next steps, your sister was your closest sibling. According to what you told me,
Andrea: we were 18 months apart, and I had not spent time without her prior to them.
JKO: And you said something about how your dad is a homicide Detective and his daughter died by homicide. Correct. What was the impact of your sister's passing on your family? So talk about your father, your mom and yourself.
Andrea: With my father, there's a shell of a man I used to know. He struggles the most being a police officer of almost 40 years now, closer to 50, maybe. He had once said during grief counseling that his greatest failure was that he could not protect his own daughter. He failed to protect his own daughter. And my dad was always our hero. He still is. He treated us like princesses. We were not or spanked or raised a hand to by our father. So it's really shocking that she stood for any kind of mistreatment from a man that she was dating.
JKO: The Challenge of Domestic Violence… One of the things that’s said about domestic violence is that it's not a respecter of status. Now, we know that it's not even a respect of upbringing because your sister was not raised in domestic violence. She was raised as a cherished daughter of a man who cherishes his wife and children. So she never saw abuse, but yet her life succumbed to abuse. And that's why we're talking about it here. If you're a listener, we say, oh, when we raise our children's right, then we'll protect them from these kind of things. But from what Andrea is telling us, it's not just about us raising our children. Right. It's about each and every one of us saying “No” to the perpetration of domestic violence. It's about each and every one of us standing up against this pandemic. It's about each and every one of us saying that those who refuse to change and who harm people should pay for what they've done. Because when we see one person pay, then the next person isn't going to be that foolish to want to go through the same experience. So you said your dad kind of blames himself in a way that he could not protect his own child. I'm a mom of five children. My first born is a twin and one of my twins went to heaven a few months after she was born. Until today, I still feel the loss of my baby, but I did not have 17 years of memories with my daughter. I had a few months, about two and a half months. I cannot imagine what it is to lose a child with 17 years of memory. Tell me how your sister's passing has impacted your mom.
Andrea: My mom was inconsolable for the first ten years. Any mention of somebody with the name Nicole, anybody asking how she was, would just send her into hysterics. I would hear her cry in the shower, wailing out of sorrow and there's nothing I can do. She fell into a depression where she doesn't sleep. She doesn't have a regulated sleep schedule. She still mourns her almost every day like it's fresh. If she did not have me, I'm pretty sure she would have given up on life by now.
JKO: Wow. That just tells us a little bit more about how domestic violence is insidious. It moves beyond just the two people, the abuser and the victim. Everyone is a victim. This family is a victim. Everyone related to Nicole is a victim. Everyone who is a friend is a victim. Our world is a victim because this person costs us her goodness. All that she could have brought to the table on Earth we never got to experience because her life was cut short. So you are her closest sibling and you are the one who has had to support your parents. How has this loss impacted you?
Andrea: I would say that I still have a lot of anger for what this monster did. He robbed our family of so many memories that were sure to come with children as a parent. The milestones, the 18th birthday, the graduations, the marriages that parents get to experience with their young children, the birthdays anniversaries children. I don't have any nieces or nephews from her. We've missed out on so much because he could not control his rage. He could not control his actions. And I believe all of those are fueled by an evil that cannot be rehabilitated and it's caused a lot of trauma. I've done counseling. I find it hard to trust men. I am married and I have four beautiful boys. I don't see how anyone in this world would want to hurt a woman or female or even a man, his girlfriend and intentionally. And now my children have come of age they’re in College, I let them know how she died and what kind of circumstances led to her death. And I am really sure that my boys would never, ever behave in this way with a partner. This is such a preventable death, preventable type of violence. If men didn't raise their hands and their fists or use weapons, we wouldn't have so many abused and battered women and children.
JKO: So now that it's 22 years and the state is sending you an email or a letter asking what are they asking you to do?
Andrea: They are strongly encouraging my family and I to make statements at this parole hearing that he will have on June. Ok, so there's a parole hearing to determine if he'll be set free.
JKO: You came on Messy Can’t Stop Her because you really want the world to hear what happened to Nicole. What do you plan to do regarding the parole hearing?
Andrea: I'm writing a letter that will let the parole board know how much we have lost and how much we have suffered at the actions of his hands. Our community won't be safe with people like him who are pardoned for a murder they committed 20 some years ago. He silenced my sister forever. It's permanent. She doesn't get a choice. She doesn't get another chance. Why should he?
JKO: People who are not related to you, are they able to support your campaign for the parole hearing?
Andrea: Yes. I've had people in the field tell me that I need to make noise, and I need to gather support from family, from friends, from our community who protest his release because of his crime. I have looked up advocates and activists for domestic violence, and that's how I came across Messy Can't Stop Her. I have contacted shelter asking for advocates. And it's an uncharted territory with the release of a prisoner who committed murder. In his case, he didn't get a life sentence because it was not “premeditated”. He received second degree, and that led him in our state to 20 years, and I'm not ready to settle for that.
JKO: So what can anybody who is listening to this episode of Messy Can’t Stop Her that will air just before the 9th, I believe. What can they do to support you?
Andrea: They can help by writing letters of protest in the release of Mr. Villarreal. They can write letters of experiences they might have had with their own situation and how they believe it's unjust or unfair.
JKO: Okay, so Andrea will give me all the information where you can send the letters to. And in the show notes, I will have the links, the emails or the locations for you. Please check out the show notes of this episode to support Andrea's campaign to get justice for her sister. The truth is that it's most painful. Because Nicole was only 17, she did not even have the opportunity to have a child. So there's no more Nicole. If we are silent about Nicole's person and because Nicole is not here to speak for herself. Andrea and her family and anyone else who will step up Will become a voice for Nicole. I have felt your pain, and I've listened to you. Could you please talk to those young girls who are in relationship? Because now you're a mom of four and your oldest two, I think, are adults. So could you please just say a word to a child, A young lady who is in a relationship like your sister was? And if you could redo that day again, what would you tell her?
Andrea: First? I'd like to let girls know that love is respect. It is not name calling. It is not swearing and raising your voice. It is not a fist being thrown in the air towards you or onto your furniture and walls. It is not angry and evil, for sure. If you're feeling scared and intimidated with your partner, that's not love. That is not a place for you.
JKO: Thank you so much, Andrea. And one thing is that domestic violence experts will tell us that the most dangerous time for a woman Is when she wants to leave and when she has left. So when you want to end a relationship with someone who makes you scared, Someone who controls you, you feel worried about the relationship Because of the way they behave. It's not the time to go to places with them. You don't go to a place and say, I'm done with you there Because you're on their territory. You're on their turf.
Andrea: Yeah, I would have told my sister that maybe she needs to do this over the phone or in person with other people around, and that would have changed a lot. I believe she might still be here if he did not have access to her during that breakup.
JKO: Yes, there you have it. This is Nicole's story, and it's not just the story of Nicole. It's the story of Andrea, Nicole's mom, Nicole's sister, Nicole's dad. This has impacted his career as a police officer. It's impacting the relationship Andrea has with her husband and her boys, it’s impacting Nicole's mom. Life has never been the same in the last 22 years, Since Nicole was wickedly and tragically taken out from Earth. So if you're listening to this podcast today, Please check the show notes and send a letter of support So that Nicole's voice will not be silenced.
Thank you so much for listening to this episode of Messy Can’t Stop Her. We'll continue the conversation on domestic violence in our next episodes. Domestic violence is no good, and we all should fight against it Because when we do that messy can stop us. Take care and see you next time.
