Episode 17: The Marketing Mindset

Are you tired of the 'if you build it, they will come' myth? It's time to shake things up in your business's marketing game! Join us in this electrifying episode where Kristelle Siarza Moon and Jace Downey roll up their sleeves and dive headfirst into the dynamic world of marketing. No more sitting on the sidelines wondering if your business will attract attention. It's time to take charge and master the art of self-promotion.

In this riveting conversation, we strip away the fluff and get real about the challenges every business owner faces. Camera shy? Uncertain about how to showcase your talents to the world? Fear not! We're here to equip you with insights and strategies that will smash through your marketing obstacles.

Prepare for a paradigm shift as we turn the spotlight on the pivotal role of authenticity in marketing. We debunk the idea that marketing is a manipulative game, advocating instead for a transparent and honest approach. Discover how authentic marketing forms a powerful connection between you and potential customers. Learn why sharing your craft with the world is not just beneficial but essential. We'll even guide you on staying true to yourself, refusing to bend to the pressure of others' expectations.

From dissecting key concepts to sharing tips on maintaining authenticity in your brand, this episode is a treasure trove of practical guidance and hard-earned experience. Don't miss out – tune in and empower yourself to elevate your marketing game to unprecedented heights!

And grab your guide for choosing the right marketing agency for your business here: www.siarza.com/marketing/choosing-the-right-marketing-agency/

A Siarza Production
Hosted by Kristelle Siarza Moon & Jace Downey
Executive Producer: Kristelle Siarza Moon
Producer: Jace Downey
Video/Editing: Justin Otsuka

Watch episodes at siarza.com/siarza-podcast
Follow us on FB, IG, TT, YT and TW @siarzatheagency
Follow Kristelle @kristellesiarza
www.misskristelle.com
Follow Jace @jacedowneyofficial
www.jacedowney.com

Chapters

• 0:00 Marketing Struggles for Agency Owners
• 10:06 The Importance of Authentic Self-Marketing
• 19:14 Authenticity and Success in Business
• 25:44 The Importance of Authentic Marketing
• 33:38 Finding a Good Fit in Outsourcing Marketing

Transcript

Kristelle: 0:00

Yes, all agency owners struggle with marketing themselves as individuals, as the thought leader themselves, as well as the agency as a whole. They think that they can lean on that, or they sometimes forget the agency needs to be its own client. Welcome back to Story Success and Stuff. Crystal here, jace here and we are talking about a topic that makes so much sense. We thought fully did not put this as topic number one. Very true, because there is more to Story Success and Stuff. Indeed, the topic is marketing, marketing success, the importance of marketing in success. My favorite phrase that you put in our guide for today is if you build it, they won't come, they won't come.

Jace: 0:48

Yes, I look forward to explain more and if you're listening and you're like I'm not a business owner, I'm not an entrepreneur, stick around anyway. Marketing is for everyone and we actually all do it all the time and even if you don't do marketing, you are being marketed to all the time, just constantly. Marketing is so ingrained in our life. Even the way we think nowadays comes down to how things have been marketed our one-liners, the way we do storytelling nowadays. Marketing is our culture and people have a lot of fear on that. I did. I had a really big negative view of marketing for a long time and I've really changed my relationship. So hang with us. Marketing is for everyone. This episode is absolutely for everybody.

Kristelle: 1:35

So this episode for me, in terms of points, takeaways, etc. This podcast is a major shout out to all of the counselors in the Counselors Academy of the Public Relations Society of America. The Counselors Academy is a special section where we are all agency owners and why I think this is a very good topic for them. Not because they're going to take this content back to their teams, this is, to that owner that doesn't realize how important it is to market themselves. And yes, I'm looking at you, all of the C-levels chief creative officers that are listening to this one. Of course, I am going to shout out that the Counselors Academy conference is happening in April in Palm Springs, that I hope that you all can make it. For more information, go to PRSAorg and find the Counselors Academy section. Boom Marketing, boom Marketing.

Jace: 2:37

Boom Marketing Right there.

Kristelle: 2:39

Marketing. So the reason why I really love this episode for them is because agency owners, public relations owners, marketing agency owners, advertising agency owners hate to market themselves. They love to do marketing for other businesses, but they fail at marketing themselves.

Jace: 3:01

That is true across the board for everyone I've ever encountered. Yeah, and it makes sense. We have a pretty negative view of what marketing is. It's something. When I did more entrepreneurial consulting in Austin, people would have great ideas and they would be really, really, really excited about their idea and they'd be like, yeah, that is, that's a really cool idea. What's your marketing plan? And if your answer was about to be you, let me break it to you nobody cares.

Jace: 3:34

And now and I don't mean that in a harsh way, but one no one's ever going to be as excited about your ideas you are. It's not their idea. They might go, that's neat, whatever, Most of us aren't as big of a draw as we think we are. Yeah, we just aren't, because most of the world doesn't know us. Right. And even if you have the absolute best idea and this is what this is why this is important to me, because so many people do set out on their own to do their side hustle, to start a business, whatever and without a marketing plan, you are going to fail. I'm sorry you are. If you have the best idea and nobody knows about it, you're going to fail.

Kristelle: 4:08

Yeah, and from the perspective of an agency owner along those same lines, we feel that sometimes we can put our team out there or we can put the case studies of the agency out there. Well, if you're an agency that only has about two or three case studies in a particular industry or scope of service and you want to branch out into new industries or new services, well, that marketing approach won't work anymore. And or being methodical about you know what, what are we going to put out there about ourselves? I think one of the greatest compliments that we've received you and I have received about this podcast so far is another agency going up to us and saying we got to up our game because they're crushing it right now in terms of marketing the agency.

Kristelle: 5:01

But we're not saying go buy CRS services at CRScom. What we're saying is this is what it's like to be behind the scenes with us and just get to know us. Right, that's definitely a marketing strategy, absolutely, but you know so. So what we? So going back to the the, what are the challenges that we see from agencies that run into the? How do I market myself? The first step is just opening the door and letting, letting your heart be open to marketing the C level, the headshots, the speaker bios, the resumes, the vulnerability of meeting new people Like you. Just got to go and do it.

Jace: 5:39

I'm going to say that's step two. Yeah, step one. This strategy Nine, nine, that's not step nine, that was German, for no. We have to be comfortable enough with ourselves to be vulnerable. Yeah, to put to put yourself on camera, even if that's just a headshot and I'm sure Justin could attest to this, it's very young, it's. You're just out there, basically naked right From from a, being looked at. Yeah, you're exposed and allowing others that you cannot control look into you. Yeah, that's a. That's actually a really scary thing. When I used to do coaching for people on camera, they'd be like, why is this so hard? And I'm like cause you're exposing who you are out into the world with and then you just let it go. Yeah, that's a really scary thing. And so if I'm not confident enough to at least know like I'm, I'm safe in who I am and it's okay for people to look at me, then those steps are going to be really hard. So I think there's some inner work to be done as step one before.

Jace: 6:48

All of that is in the mix or along with it. Cause it's an ongoing path, right Like. Authenticity is not a switch, it doesn't go on and off, it's a spectrum.

Kristelle: 6:54

Yeah, no. So when I was a part of counselors academy, I met a lot of other or still part of counselors academy. One of the cool things that I saw was, you know, as an individual, I would see people that look look, not look like me like there was definitely a diversity issue that's being solved right now but they had a lot of the same skill sets as me. They had a team of less than 15. They had an income of two million and below. They were once public relations, digital advertising people that got into the game and wanted to be their own boss Same thing as I am. But the one thing that we all shared was that awkwardness of saying I don't know anybody here. I know we all have a common bond. I know these are my people, but how do I get myself out there and market my own agency?

Jace: 7:46

A video is going through my, because I'm actually I have social anxiety and I can be pretty socially awkward, and I usually have some weird joke going through my mind that I'm just trying to hold Like. They just asked me do you want anything from sushi, freak? And I just stared silently because I was shutting down multiple inappropriate jokes that were going through my head To which I just went.

Jace: 8:06

Nope, I don't, but I'm here. I sent a video to a friend I'm like this is me and it was a woman practicing things to say at a social event, and one of them was I've got a pocket full of spiders and I was like yes, that is some weird song I would break out into in social footing.

Kristelle: 8:24

Well, just, hysterical Cause in another previous podcast that we did. You were like. So what do you do for fun, like you had asked that as your social anxiety question right, I have a skill set around my awkwardness.

Jace: 8:36

Now I know how to go and be in the world as me and even as awkward yeah.

Kristelle: 8:42

Well, I remember my first counselors Academy, right, and it was in Scottsdale, arizona and you know. Staying on the topic of marketing and marketing yourselves Like, I remember specifically going up to somebody and be like I'm sure you're probably as uncomfortable as I am when it comes to getting myself out there, but I'm crystal, I don't know anybody here and I have no idea what I'm doing, and they were like you're in the right place?

Jace: 9:04

Yeah, and speaking we call that acknowledge the obvious. Yeah, and it's a killer? Yeah, absolutely.

Kristelle: 9:10

Yeah. So I do want to say, though, when what I also found out at that same conference in Scottsdale, one of my first counselors Academy, is that, yes, all agency owners struggle with marketing themselves as individuals, as the thought leader themselves, as well as the agency as a whole. They think that they can lean on that, or they sometimes forget the agency needs to be its own client. Yeah, and I find that very common with other marketing agencies, where they they and I've even had conversations with other counselors where they say I'm getting out of the game. And I said, well, why, why, why? Like I don't want to, I don't want to discourage you from from putting in the or throwing in the towel, but like I hope everything's okay. Yeah, and they said, well, I don't like to market myself and I don't want to do the business development. And I said, well, there's then see you later.

Jace: 9:56

Yeah, 100%. I'd say that for any industry. If you're not going to be willing and go back to our episode, check yourself before you wreck yourself. Where we're talking about ego but a lot of us get caught in this notion. If I am talking about myself or if I'm saying like, hey, I do this, well then I'm being egotistical or self center. We have a real negative view around that, and even when you said market yourself, oh, I could feel cringing, yeah, happening, and I watched, and I used to do it too where I just it was like oh, no, no, no, no.

Jace: 10:30

But when you're the product, and especially if you're an entrepreneur sorry folks, yeah, you are the product, yeah, you're the product, you're the service. You have just put yourself in a sales position. You are selling yourself, and then you also do something you love. Yeah, but you are now in marketing. Yeah, welcome to it. That's your main job now, not something that we talk about nearly enough. But this idea of marketing yourself, the language, I think, has gotten really sticky because you, as you know, you know better than anyone. In the past, the marketing realm and the advertising realm was pretty gross. It was about learning human psychology to manipulate it for sales for money. That that was the original like, or that's what it became. It became about manipulating for money.

Kristelle: 11:15

Yeah, and that's where I think people, that's where we disagree. Like I love marketing, but I love responsible marketing right, and I love the like, the definite, the textbook definition of marketing is product place, price and promotion right, and here we see that there are things that have been taken to the extremes of some sort, where I understand that people take advantage of it. But good marketers and good, responsible marketing I think call me an optimist if you will, and I think that's very valid. I didn't mean to interrupt, but I say that when it comes to the right type of subject matter, experts when it comes to marketing themselves are the ones that obviously are authentic, right, who they are behind closed doors or who they are in a public setting. I think really good marketers are the ones that are willing to have conversations that are transparent and transparent enough and honestly like, if you're a good human being, you're going to be a really great marketer for yourself.

Kristelle: 12:14

I say this because there was a team member of ours a long time ago. Justin remembers him I think you might have inter-counter with him. His name was River Marquez. River was. It was really great to the team.

Kristelle: 12:25

And I remember having this very candid conversation with River while he was in a role of business development and I said, okay, let's, this is version number two of our business development strategy for CRSA. And I said I hate being the center of attention and he goes you're going to have to. And I said I don't like being egotistical and I want to stay humble and he goes I understand that, but the company needs you. And he was like 23 when he said that and fresh out of college under got his marketing communications degree and I was like, thank you, I really needed that reminder and I think every agency owner, every, every small business owner, needs to remember that even this, even this podcast, is a major vulnerable element of understanding Like we have to market CRSA in a way where people know who we are and they're willing to work with us because they see the stories and success, hopefully down the road right.

Jace: 13:18

Then they can create their own. And, yes, we do ethical market. There's a reason I work for this company.

Kristelle: 13:23

I know, and it's because we do marketing within integrity.

Jace: 13:26

Yeah, that, like I love. We were on a on a sales call this week and I and you I was like which sales call did I write this down? Yeah, and you, multiple times you said we are not your best fit for this section, but let me recommend some people who are. And I went that's integrity. That's how you do marketing. Well, because you're marketing your true self, which is that authentic self. But millions, if not billions, of dollars are spent on the psychology of marketing. What colors are going to make you feel what? When you walk into the store and it's placed here, how is that going to get you to buy it? It is manipulating human emotion and not all do that. We're seeing a real trend away from that because people have gotten wise and going no, I'm not playing into this anymore. We want to know your principles, we want to know your authentic self. They want to know the people.

Jace: 14:15

I'll find things now, but all of that is fairly new. So when we hear market yourself, what I used to interpret that as is trick people into buying my thing, like there was a Make them like you.

Jace: 14:27

Yeah, there was a real yucky griminess around marketing and that cringe factor that I see with so many people and so many entrepreneurs. When I was working with them it'd be like, oh no, I don't want to do that, I don't want to do marketing because it's gross. And so I had to learn for my own success how to completely change my relationship with marketing and recognize that all it is for me. This was how I was like OK, it is a bridge. It's the bridge between I have a service that I do particularly well For a certain group of people. I'm going to be a really great fit for them. Marketing is the bridge that lets the people who I am a great fit for, who a business is a great fit for, know that it exists and can be valuable to them. That's it.

Kristelle: 15:16

That's marketing. I have a story to support that. There was to kind of change gears from agency owners. I'm happy to take a phone call from anybody that just wants some advice on how to market themselves, themselves, their brand, et cetera. Whether they hire us, great. If they don't, that's OK. I had to share a craft and a talent that I love, and marketing and advertising is definitely obviously public relations too.

Kristelle: 15:39

So there was one person who called who had been a longtime client of the firm and while this individual was changing roles and organizations, leaving organizations joining new ones, this individual decided to go ahead and run for office, talk about marketing and be incredibly vulnerable. So I was talking to this individual and this person said Crystal, I don't know if I'm going to win. And I said well, you better get your head in the game and have that winner mindset if you are bud, because this is going to be a long road. And this person said I just see the parties Democrats and Republicans working to my disadvantage. I see and understand the systems behind the scenes. Some of it I like, some of it I agree with. Some of these policies I think is great policies, some of this I don't. And I said how do I stand out from the rest? And this person's race is not just one. If I tell you which race it is, our Albuquerque friends would be like oh, I know exactly who you're talking about because it's Albuquerque, but this particular race has a lot of candidates, a lot of candidates.

Kristelle: 16:55

And this person said what do I do? And I said what do you think you should do? And the individual said I think I should just say fuck it and just be myself. And I said well, here's the case in point of how this candidate actually did that. And while this candidate didn't run another candidate for a different race, a different year, even a different age, demographic than the person that I was talking to for $19,000, this person got 10% of the vote. And this wasn't just a little district vote, this was a city-wide race that they got 10% of the vote on $19,000, because that candidate was authentically themselves.

Kristelle: 17:34

I think that marketers, or people that are marketing themselves, absolutely need to just say fuck it, I'm going to do what I want to do. It might be wrong, but am I going to regret it down the road? And the one thing that he had said to wrap up this story, he she said talk about trying not to be inconspicuous. I said here she said I noticed that my competitors I know them really well. I'm starting to see that they're just losing themselves and I don't want to do that. And I said then that's your answer, bud than don't, yeah, absolutely.

Kristelle: 18:08

Like if you have a fucking I'm done moment, if you have a moment where you said I'm just gonna be authentically self, I'm gonna be relentless, those are the people that can live with themselves after the loss yeah, either which way.

Jace: 18:20

I remember my first company was a production company during media and my business partner was older and was a man which was we're not man-shaming right now.

Kristelle: 18:29

No, no, no, that wasn't the problem.

Jace: 18:31

The problem was it's an industry where I was often the only woman in the room and so I had stuff already built up around that. Or I remember when I worked for PBS, I hauled in all of the equipment. I set it all up like hundreds of pounds of gear and I'd hauled it all in myself. I set it all up whatever, and then the subject that we're interviewing comes in and starts telling me how he likes his makeup done To you, the only woman in the room and the producer who's this huge guy stepped in and went I'll actually be doing your makeup, and because it was like but that was the assumption, right, so I was always underestimated in that field. So I already had that complex going on when I started my own company and so we would go to meetings and things that I would be like super dressed up and just trying to be like I'm a professional, like I'm an adult. Take me seriously.

Kristelle: 19:27

My favorite phrase you ever gave me was the CEO costume.

Jace: 19:29

Yes, I would put on my CEO costume and my business partner just had on like whatever Texas T-shirt he was wearing at the time.

Kristelle: 19:38

Yeah, whatever right.

Jace: 19:39

And I would go in and I'd be like, oh, official, and I felt so uncomfortable and I hated it Because I was like, take me seriously. And finally he was like Jace, because they would. They would at first, they would direct all questions to him, Like I was his assistant, which is what I was trying to avoid. Can you see? Just the fire just being built up.

Jace: 19:58

Well, except then they'd ask him questions and he'd go Jace, because I was the producer, I did our business side, he was the creative side. So he didn't know the answer to those questions. So he told me one day. He said Jace, wear whatever you want, show up however you want. Who cares if they think I'm the boss In five seconds, they realize what's going on here.

Jace: 20:19

And I was able to just let that go and actually show up as myself. And that's when we started having more success, when I just said fuck it. Because it was so uncomfortable To show up that way, because I thought I had to market myself in a particular way, to like match what they were expecting and like be business. Like I'm not business, I'm gonna have my shoes off. Like this, like I finally bought a blazer so I could come into the office with a blazer on, but I'm wearing ripped jeans and then a tank top right now. Like, so I'm not, I just can't, I'm just not very businessy, that's not who I am. And when I try to show up that way, people feel it, they feel that disconest.

Kristelle: 20:54

I think this is the first time I've actually seen you wear a blazer.

Jace: 20:56

Yeah, yeah, yeah. So I used to have business attire and then I was like I'm working on farms and I'm a nomad and I got rid of all of it. And then I was like a crazy lady living in the woods, which was one of my happiest times, and I was like I don't need any of this stuff anymore. Jokes on me.

Kristelle: 21:10

Yeah, jokes on you Back in the world.

Jace: 21:11

And even bigger. My mom loves that. She was like how you ended up working in marketing is one of the best cosmic jokes because of how much disdain I had for it originally and how a big part of my second business failing was because of the not marketing Myself component. Because of how uncomfortable it was and how yucky I thought marketing was.

Kristelle: 21:32

Yeah.

Jace: 21:33

And then I came to learn I just had it all wrong.

Kristelle: 21:37

Yeah, I giggle because I remember a story in my life where, in a roundabout way, a team member told the big boss in the place where I worked and the big boss came down to me and said who are you? So-and-so is just a little disgruntled that you didn't brush your hair today and you didn't dress up today and it was the day after a long trip and obviously, like what we talked about in the celebrate episode, celebrating the fact you took a shower today, and I don't think I did, and I was so offended by that. It wasn't by the fact that it was a comment about my race, wasn't a comment about my education, my socioeconomic level. I was offended by the fact that she criticized how I didn't brush my hair that day, and that's when I knew that success is not modeled by the way that you look. I look at people like Alicia Keys. Alicia Keys is the singer, not the former economic development secretary, satan in Mexico.

Kristelle: 22:49

I look at Alicia Keys and she had a moment Like today is a no makeup day. She said you know what? I've been living my life in a way where I wear a lot of makeup. As long as I have a good skincare routine, I'm fine, I'm not going to wear makeup today. What's her talent? Singing Right. What's her talent being in the industry. What's her success being a mom Married to Swiss Beats, one of the most successful hip hop producers in the world? She's successful. Did she have to do it wearing makeup?

Jace: 23:16

No, Maybe she did, though, if she came out of the gate.

Kristelle: 23:21

She did in the beginning.

Jace: 23:22

There is something about like when you have to wear your CEO costume, because sometimes it's harder to hear the message if the package is so outside of our expectations. So as much as I want to say like, be like we have a big presentation with a client tomorrow, I will wear shoes, right. Like Ed knows when to wear pants, he wears shorts. He doesn't walk around the office pantsless. I just want to make that very clear. But like he knows when he needs clothes toed shoes, I know. When I need a blazer, I'm like is this a pants thing? Why is Crystal?

Jace: 23:54

running a company where people don't wear pants. They all wear some form of bottoms that cover. Everything that needs to be covered is covered in the office.

Kristelle: 24:01

I'm not wearing pants today.

Jace: 24:02

It's a skirt, it's covered, everything is appropriately covered. I assure you all fear not. But if I didn't and people got so caught up in the like, this isn't what I'm expecting. We can lose the message, and the message is so much of what marketing is.

Kristelle: 24:18

Sure, and I do ask myself that question when I get ready in the morning and I said I'm about to do a very big presentation. I have an oversized closet. Right now it's a regular closet, but it's just oversized because it's overstuffed, it's packed, it's packed right and it's got the CEO costumes on the left, the golf and the long seeds at the top, and then my pants and my sweaters on the bottom, my hoodies. That's part of the CEO costume. Is that iconic hoodie from the social network movie, right? Whatever, I'm gonna get that out of it and I say I'm gonna put this on. If they can't see my message, the team's talent, my talent, and if they're so distracted by what I wear or the pimple on my face, they are definitely not meant to be a client. That's what I say to myself every day, you know.

Jace: 25:09

And sometimes that makes sense and sometimes that's a luxury component, right, like we don't have to land every client, we don't have to force every client at this point, like that's a sign of success in a business. I remember my first client.

Kristelle: 25:21

I turned away and I was like oh shit, I'm here.

Jace: 25:24

Like it's a big deal to be able to do that. So even that is a luxury to do it. And there are some things where have we had an episode about saying no?

Kristelle: 25:32

No, no, that's gonna be a good one. Okay, we got it right, but we're going to. I love no.

Jace: 25:36

No is like the most empowering word of all time.

Jace: 25:39

I was like nine, nine and any which way you wanna say it Nope, nope, nope, sir. So there's something about packaging for marketing and even for ourselves, but I do agree that there's a way to do it. That's true. Right Like, yeah, I got my blazer on, but then I have ripped jeans on Right Like. Then I'm like I still got my tats, like everything. So it's like, it's not like I've completely transformed. I can't not have them. I was on a TV show and they put makeup on my foot tattoo. Oh, because of the like. What will people think?

Kristelle: 26:10

The perception.

Jace: 26:11

If you have a tattoo, thank God. Like this was years ago, so I didn't have any of my other visible tattoos yet I remember thinking like really, your audience can't handle a flower on my foot.

Jace: 26:20

That's gonna really throw them off. So like there's extremes, right. But if packaging didn't matter, then all of the products would just come in clear plastic wrap or brown paper sacks or whatever Like. Appearance is part of marketing and I think it's important to be true to who you are, but also live in the reality of the society we're in today.

Kristelle: 26:42

And I think, along those same lines, tone right. When we look at marketing. You know the kind of going back to what you were saying about an individual. Let's take it from a brand perspective. Whenever we work with a client and we talk about starting, what is their foundational four pillars of how a strategy is drafted by Ciarza? It's voice, visuals, relevancy and target audience, right. Those are the four that we look at. Of course, classic marketing has more to it, but to keep it simple, so we talked about visuals, right, the appearance is exactly what you just said. I think marketing ourselves also talks about tone right.

Kristelle: 27:22

We talked about being Our voice, our voice, et cetera. I do find, though, that the successful entrepreneurs agency owners, businesses they're really able to insert themselves when it's a time, to be relevant, right Like it's great that channel four calls me once in a while and says, hey, can you give us an idea about crowdsourcing for fundraising for families? Recently, I was on channel four talking about threads as a new social network and what is the impact of that upon the social community, and I think that's being relevant to the conversation when you're marketing yourself is really key. I love and hate Gary Vaynerchuk.

Jace: 28:11

Perfect example.

Kristelle: 28:12

Gary Vee was really critical for me to learn how to be authentic, because the fact that the guy can pretty much say the one time I don't work is when I'm watching a Jets game. I'm like, okay, I'm down for that. Jets is sports ball, it's football Okay, good.

Jace: 28:30

I know I assume he's not watching Jets like overhead. Look, I'm gonna stop work.

Kristelle: 28:35

I love it. Maybe I should know I will do that. I might be deaf by the end of it, but I love Jets. Okay, when are they from?

Jace: 28:44

No, I'm like it's not the New York Jets. Yes, it is yeah, knew it. See, I know the things. Hey, sports ball Fancy feast.

Kristelle: 28:53

Fancy feast. So you know, when I look at Gary Vee and he talks about a lot of topics that are just not relevant or you know they might not be, or I might not just be in the right space or in the right mindset to hear what he's got to say he talks about success a lot His success, his failures, how he motivates people in a very tough love type of way on how to get there and, as great as that is, like, sometimes it's just not relevant, right, like the conversation. And, granted, I don't like actively seek out his content anymore, but when I do come across it, sometimes I'm like, no, I'm just gonna, you know, scroll up right, Just pass on the content, whatever that might be. And I think it's important that finding and it's just a very good PR trait right From a public relations perspective, if you are going to be marketing yourself and you want to insert yourself in the conversation, obviously know what you're talking about, be the subject matter expert that you are, also be relevant to where it's timely, right, there is going to be a factor, it is the right time to comment and make sure you're doing it at a timeframe where, if you say it too late, nobody's gonna care at that point.

Kristelle: 30:12

Somebody's already made their mark, somebody's already said it before you, or somebody's capitalized on the opportunity. I think marketing yourself really is important. It's really important to find the relevant factor.

Jace: 30:24

Yes, and I'm gonna put a twist on that. We're being relevant and, like somebody already said it, gary Vee's voice just goes in and out one ear for me. He is not my jam. His style does not resonate with me. Someone else saying the exact same thing in their own voice. That's relevant to me, that I can hear that has the visuals and the tone that resonate with me are going to be the person that I move towards Somebody with a similar, like calm and fun tone, yeah.

Jace: 30:57

So I was like just like down to earth, like my mentor is like I always joke but it's not a joke Like she's the most connected person I know to like intuition and I mean she's, it's amazing. But she'll also be the first person to make fake fart sounds when we're doing a silent group meditation.

Jace: 31:14

Like she doesn't take any of it seriously at all and she just keeps it real right, and that speaks to me. And she's not professional even though she's very successful. So that authentic piece is a super important component, cause, even if someone said, or even if you're supposed to look this way, that's not going to vibe with some people. And I really think and we talked about this a bit during our competition in it to win it episode that when it comes to branding and marketing yourself, there isn't competition. That's there because some people are going to love Gary Vee and they're going to go right to him. Then some people would gravitate towards you and I as a speaker or as a consultant, right Like it's going to be very different. So that authentic piece is super important, whether that's your business or yourself, or your product or a service, or even just out in the world at a social event.

Jace: 32:06

We're marketing ourselves. You out in the dating world Guess what you leave. Marketing yourself. This right now, this podcast you guys maybe don't know it. This is content marketing. This is marketing, but we do it in a value based way where we're not asking y'all for anything. We never do right Except to subscribe. So we know you like it.

Kristelle: 32:24

When we first started the podcast originally, the concept was just me right. Me and Justin, but do you remember when I asked you, I said will you do it with me? Because I need somebody to feed off of or somebody to help narrate and navigate the conversation. At what point, as you kind of put as a potential takeaway too, at what point is it right for somebody that's marketing themselves to actually bring in a team?

Jace: 32:57

Yes, I love this question.

Jace: 33:00

Someone said at one point to not put your original dollars like if you're starting business, resources are limited for most of us to not put your original dollars towards marketing, and I think that that is wrong all the way.

Jace: 33:13

When I look at, when I look at my first business, we put our money towards equipment, all the stuff that was dumb. One of my big lessons that I took away from my first business was how to invest initial resources, and so not having brought on someone who knew what they were doing and was willing to do it was a mistake that I made. So I think for me, when I look at when is it time to bring on a team One? If you will not do it, if it's like I can't market myself, I can't speak on my own behalf, it makes me super uncomfortable, or it's just not getting done because there's that inner resistance, then bring on someone who can. Not having it done is not an option. So if you can't do it, or if you don't have time to do it, or if you're bad at it, we have this notion that I don't know how America came to this, that we're all supposed to be excellent at everything.

Jace: 34:07

Like do you know how many you know components go into running a business and as entrepreneurs, we're supposed to know how to do all of it ourselves and do it well.

Kristelle: 34:15

And function. Yeah, I'm really good at napping because I'm they're terrible at a lot of things and I'm terrible at napping.

Jace: 34:23

I just can't do it. I gotta outsource my napping. So, the truth is, some people just are not good at marketing. That's totally okay. You don't have to be. Bring someone on who is so. If you can't do it, you won't do it. You're not good at doing it or you don't have time to do it. Bring on a team that resonates with you.

Kristelle: 34:40

When we first started the company, it was very easy to put our initial presentation deck together. I would have photos of myself talking about myself as an agency owner, my experience in marketing, and then the second slide would be who's the target audience for CR's social digital? And it was this diamond split in half, it was our diamond split in half, and it would be those who understand it but don't have time to do it, or those who don't understand digital marketing at all.

Kristelle: 35:07

And that's how we had actually started the organization and people got it right away. They're like oh yeah, no, we don't have time to do it and I actually it's funny just to kind of defend some of the decision making or the nose that I've given. They're actually having companies that have came to us and said I'd like to work with you guys from the gate, and I said I don't think that's a good idea. I said why? And I said I don't actually think that you're ready. They don't have a fleshed out business plan.

Kristelle: 35:37

They don't have a financial model, I said no. Well, I'll never forget one of my favorite sales calls. It was a person that never hired us and it was crazy, right, like why would that be a great sales call? But one of my favorite sales calls was the fact that this gentleman had found us through search engine optimization Like that worked which we offer as a service.

Jace: 35:58

by the way, we're far more than a marketing firm. This episode brought to you by CRZ.

Kristelle: 36:04

Shameless plug. Yeah, this guy had found us through search engine optimization and he said you know, I just need some advice. I'm about to buy a business, a piece of a franchise, and I just want to know how much it would take, like, what should I be doing for marketing right away? And I said save your money? He said, oh, why, really? And I said well, first off, you know, this particular franchise might actually have some marketing tools and resources as a part of their vendor fee, so why pay for double right Totes? And then, on top of that, I said also, you know, you're going to be having to spend a lot of time on infrastructure If we get you the business and this has happened, yes, if we get you the business right away but you're not ready for it operationally or infrastructure wise, you're actually going to hurt your reputation.

Kristelle: 36:47

Good point, and yes, it has actually happened where we've worked with a new business and they said you know what? The marketing was really great, but it didn't live up to the marketing expectations. It's happened to us. Sure, yeah, and it's like we try to help our client, you know, get to the point where they need to be. We try to help the individual learn. Like you know, if we're going to go full court, press, make sure the basketball hoop is ready, right, seriously, yeah, I know I love that.

Jace: 37:13

Yeah, yeah, no, it's a perfect analogy.

Kristelle: 37:16

And not only that, but also be ready to play the game. So we run into that from time to time that you know a client is new or they've gotten their feet wet. You know, a sweet spot for us is when a client has been open now from six months all the way up to 18 months. That's a really great sweet spot for us. Or they're a long time organization. That's just like we're done. We have new management, we just need a new way of thinking about marketing. Can you guys do this for us? Great fit, yeah, so you know, yes. Like when I say that the company is ready for us, we also say that the individual, the business owner, is ready for us, because the business owner always knows we got to put them at the forefront.

Kristelle: 37:57

Or we got to make sure that they're a voice in the conversation of their brand. I think of the people in a kind of a good way to kind of wrap up and summarize like why is marketing important for an individual? I think about the people that I look up to in terms of what success milestone do they do that? I want to be up. Even Longoria is a perfect example. Jessica Alba is another perfect example and the team might be super tired of me using this analogy Richard Branson and Virgin. I might not be an English playboy or own an island in the middle of nowhere.

Jace: 38:34

I was going to ask how close we are to that island money. Could we even have a jet? We've got.

Kristelle: 38:41

No, I'm going to go build one myself, I guess just the way that Richard did.

Kristelle: 38:45

Wait, think about it, though. Richard said as a little boy I knew that I wanted. When I looked up at the stars as a kid he said this while he was in the Virgin Galactic Unity flight said I always knew I wanted to get to space. I knew that I wanted to bring others to travel to the world's wildest adventures and that's why I created Virgin Galactic. I want to be just like him. I want people to dream just like I did, and I want to put myself out there. He, homeboy, did not have to get into that damn spacecraft, but he marketed himself by getting in the spacecraft, going through the space, training and getting up in the air Brilliant way to market yourself. I mean, I'm not telling everybody to go build your own spaceship, but that would be really fucking cool. I was like I'm going to need some time off.

Jace: 39:34

I wish we had enough time to go over things to look for and questions to ask when bringing on a marketing team or professional. But how about we get a blog post together and have that guidance for people? So if they are in a position where it is time to outsource their marketing, or even they're just needing help with a marketing strategy, they have those resources.

Kristelle: 39:58

I'll say that really quickly In like 30 seconds. The easiest way for you to find the right agency or the right team to help you build your brand as a marketer is the one that understands your culture and is a good culture fit for you. I said that on the sales call that we had recently. Right, it's the best way. We've lost a lot of business that way by me being authentic and saying like you have to find the right culture fit, yeah, yeah. And so I think that's the number one way.

Kristelle: 40:22

Like if somebody matches your tone, like if you're trying to be fast, they got to be fast too and you got to be willing to pay for fast too. If they want to be methodical and they want to be specific, and that's the type of tone that you are and that's the culture that you live in. That's the type of agency that you need to find. Not everybody realizes that in the beginning, and I think that's why agencies fail a lot too, so that they try to meet the expectation of the client, but the client and the agency need to meet each other's expectations.

Jace: 40:53

That's that bridge right. Are we a good fit for what you need? And then that marketing should explain that, so only the right people are coming in. We also have a blog post out this month Come to think about it on marketing metamorphosis the different transformations that have happened in marketing over the last 10 years. You can check that out at CRSAcom.

Kristelle: 41:12

Yep, we had a really great episode for today, but that's definitely going to be our last couple of words. If you should enjoy today's episode, don't forget to follow us on your favorite social network, subscribe and say hello to our two moms that listen to the show. We are looking forward to next week's episode we're going to be talking about motivation.

Jace: 41:34

Oh yeah, I don't know what to mean to sing that, but it felt right. I almost said metamorphosis. Metamorphosis, that could also be true.

Kristelle: 41:40

But going beyond motivation, yeah, how to stay motivated, or we can get a grasshopper metamorphosizing OK.

Jace: 41:48

Thanks for joining us. I was like who on our team does that, justin? Is that you? Do you get?

Kristelle: 41:53

the grasshopper? We're probably Ed. Ed, we're going to need a grasshopper, it's probably Ed. Thanks for joining us. We'll see you on our next episode.