046 Surviving Against Odds: Danny's Lifelong Journey with a Heart Defect

In this inspiring video, Danny Covey, author of Scar Tissue, shares his incredible journey of overcoming a life-threatening heart defect that nearly took his life multiple times. From facing countless surgeries and setbacks to finding the strength to keep fighting, Danny’s story will motivate and inspire others to never give up, no matter the odds. Join us as Danny recounts the challenges he had to face in his journey of survival and resilience. Let's spread positivity and hope together.

Website (His book can be purchased here): www.dannycovey.com
Amazon link to book: https://www.amazon.com/Scar-Tissue-Danny-Covey/dp/199086760X

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Check out the Redacted Podcast, a podcast that unveils taboo and dark stories by silenced voices

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Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Danny, as your cardiologist, you'll never be able to do this. And there's just something in me that's like, watch, I am not a victim. I'm going to do it. We can play it safe, but we're not meant to live safe. We're meant to do things and challenge ourselves.

SPEAKER_04 0:17

Hi guys, Danica here from Multispective and I'm here to share with you a new episode. I interviewed Danny Covey who was born with a congenital heart disease and he had eight heart surgeries, four of which were open heart and defied against all odds to make it to where he is today. He was told that he can't exercise, he shouldn't be doing any kind of strenuous activity and yet he managed to achieve getting a black belt in jujitsu. He turned his entire mindset around to have the wonderful kind of mindset that he has today. And he's on air today with us to share that with you. So please stay till the end for the wonderful messages that he's got to impart. And don't forget to drop a message or a comment below letting us know how you feel about the episode. Hi, Dani. I am so excited to have you on the podcast with us. Can't wait to share your story. You have such a unique story, a story full of miracles. And I can't wait for our listeners to hear in and learn something about your journey. How are you doing today?

SPEAKER_01 1:29

I'm doing great now that we're on and everything's working great.

SPEAKER_04 1:34

So Danny, why don't we start off a little bit by you just telling us a little bit about your childhood, you know, growing up and sort of what that's been like.

SPEAKER_01 1:41

Yeah, so I usually say I'm the husband to one fantabulous wife. I'm the father to three amazing kids. And I'm also the survivor of eight heart surgeries. And really, the story, I call it my open heart journey. That really didn't begin from For me, it started with my parents. And so my first... Surgery was actually at 11 months old, and I was having issues where I was flopping over, I wasn't breathing. My parents rushed me to hospital multiple times. I'd get to the hospital, they'd revive me, and that repeated six, seven, eight, nine times over the course of several months. The doctors determined that I had two problems with my heart. It was what they call subaortic stenosis and supramitral valvular All I have to say, one of the leaflets in my heart was too small and constricting, and the other one was leaking. And at 18 months old, I was flown across the country for an experimental surgery where I was given a 20% chance to live. And I won't spoil it, but I made it. Here you are. Yeah, that first surgery, obviously, I don't remember it. I grew up with scars that I'd heard stories about how they got there, but I didn't really understand. But that really was my parents' introduction to what would become a lifelong journey with heart issues.

SPEAKER_04 3:12

Eight heart surgeries. Let's just sit on that for a minute. That is a lot. And this is a heart. What are the percentages? Do you know approximately how many people have actually lived through eight heart surgeries? Is this a very, very rare occasion?

SPEAKER_01 3:31

To be candid, I'm the I haven't met other people in similar situations to me. And so part of my journey was just I had grown up with surgeries. I had surgery again when I was eight to try and correct my aortic valve. I had surgery again at 12, then 13, then 14. And then my last surgery was at age 40. So I had just grown up as a kid thinking, well, this is just normal for me. Not realizing now is not looking back, that's not normal. Eight heart surgeries is not normal. Four open heart surgeries is not normal. And it really sunk in between the years 1985 and 1990. I had five heart surgeries in five years. Wow. So it's been a very interesting journey. And part of it, I just, I didn't know. Obviously, this isn't normal. And I grew up very differently from other kids and had to watch my health and be careful about my health. I never Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_04 5:03

Let's go right back to the very, very first experience. Of course, you mentioned you don't remember it. You were very, very young. I'm sure your parents have talked a lot about this with you. Do you have any siblings as well?

SPEAKER_01 5:19

Yes, I've got two older brothers and a younger sister.

SPEAKER_04 5:22

So the impact that it had on them too. What have they said to you about it? That very, very first time they discovered that this was a thing.

SPEAKER_01 5:32

So I've called my my siblings the unwatered plants in the shadows. Because when I was going through trauma, I received a lot of attention, a lot of gifts. People took me out to do things. They were neglected. And when we were younger, it did create some jealousy from my siblings because they didn't understand. They're a kid seeing their younger brother get all this attention. And they're saying, well, why don't I get this attention? And when I was eight years old, my parents made an interesting decision. They flew my older brother to the hospital and had him stay with me for a week. And he helped take care of me. I was eight. He was 13 at the time. But him seeing what I went through, he saw what it cost me to get that attention. He saw everything that went on behind the scenes. And really, once he came and took care of me, that jealousy, that dynamic really died away because it helped put things in perspective.

SPEAKER_04 6:31

Yeah. No, that's crazy. And I I can totally imagine the sort of conundrum that your parents were experiencing at the time because of course they want to look after you and be there and they have to but at the same time you know understanding and knowing that yes the siblings are going to also be impacted by that how can we you know manage this sort of situation so that the siblings can still feel and understand sort of where we are but they're young so it's just a really really tricky situation to navigate and you know that's That situation where your parents decided to send your brother over could have gone one of either way, right? It could have either gotten you much closer or, you know, could have had a very differing kind of impact, right? But it seemed to have worked out in your situation. It helped bring you both closer and maybe even have some of the conversations that you would have never had with him otherwise.

SPEAKER_01 7:24

Yeah, no, it was, I look back, it was a very wise decision. At my next surgery in 1990, my other brother came to visit me and took care of me. And even comments that he made, he said, wow, you know, I tried to make you laugh. I tried to joke around with you, but you were just so sick. You were just not there at all. And I think just them being there, seeing me at a very difficult time, it does have an effect. It has changed our relationship. Even to this day, I know if I called either of my brothers and asked them for anything, they'd drop everything to help. So it has had a lifelong impact for sure. And I credit that to my parents.

SPEAKER_04 8:02

Yeah. When did you and your siblings have that first conversation, that breakthrough conversation?

SPEAKER_01 8:08

Well, we were kids. So I don't know that it was a conversation per se. But what's interesting in adulthood, me looking back and understanding things better. And for them in adulthood, I recently wrote about my story and I asked them to contribute different thoughts. And that's where as an adult, when they look back, now they're seeing it through an adult lens. And they understood better. So most of these conversations happened more recently in the past five years, because we're revisiting it and

SPEAKER_04 8:43

we're seeing it through a different lens. long-lasting one. You said that there was a 20% chance of making it through. What was going through their head at that time? What were they going through at this point? How did they come to terms with this?

SPEAKER_01 9:16

It's a good question. It was a rollercoaster for them. My parents, I was having these episodes where I was fainting and basically turning not just blue, but black. My skin was just, they thought I was dead several times. They saw 11 different cardiologists And the 11th one said, go to Sick Kids Hospital in Toronto, Ontario, Canada. And so they flew me. And the doctors were very reluctant to give me any kind of hope of survival. That was their introduction into it. And they were up and down. I mean, one day they thought he's going to make it. We're trusting that everything will be okay. The next day, everyone's telling them, well, it's hopeless. So I think for them, it's a roller coaster. And again, I You know, you talk about looking at things from an adult perspective. For me, I don't remember it. But being a patient, it's one way of experiencing the surgeries. As a dad now, and having to look at one of my kids going through this, I don't know as a parent that I could do that. I would rather be the patient 100% of the time.

SPEAKER_04 10:24

Did they ever talk about what could cause this? What could trigger this? Was there anything that happened? Is it genetic? Yeah. Where did this stem from?

SPEAKER_01 10:32

Yeah. Yeah, this was a congenital heart defect. So, you know, a bit of an anomaly, a fluke. And when my wife and I were pregnant, just to be sure, we had our ultrasound done by a cardiologist, just looking for anything. But they've been healthy in that respect. But really, it was just, I don't want to say a fluke or an accident, but it was atypical.

SPEAKER_04 10:58

Interesting. Very interesting. So, you had your first surgery when you were 11 months. And you mentioned your second one happened when you were, how old were you? Eight. Eight.

SPEAKER_01 11:08

My second major open heart surgery was eight years old.

SPEAKER_04 11:11

Wow. And at this point, you have a sense of the world. You have an ability to communicate and understand the world. So what was that experience like for you? Do you remember it yourself?

SPEAKER_01 11:19

Oh, yes. So this was really my first experience going through heart surgery. So being it was my first, I was terrified. I was scared because I've heard stories or the stories that parents would tell their children, but now I was actually going through it. And believe it or not, one thing that made the surgery easier was the fact that before I was going into surgery, I started experiencing congestive heart failure. So I would, I gained a lot of weight from fluid retention and I would faint a lot and I couldn't breathe. And it got to a point where I had to carry an oxygen tank around with me everywhere I went. And then it got to the point weeks before surgery where my dad would literally have to carry me up and down the stairs because I just didn't have the strength. So in some ways, as dreadful as the surgery was, I was looking forward to getting it over because my quality of health was so poor. And it's quite a thing as an eight-year-old to be laying on a hospital bed and then you're put onto the operating table. And just to have these thoughts like, I could die in a few moments. And, you know, you understand that at a certain level at eight years old. But then for me at 13 and 14, and then again at 40 to be laying on the operating table, having those same thoughts, like I could be dead in just a few short moments. And that's been, oh, interesting is not the right word, but it's been very illuminating or challenging because you have these very life or death encounters at different ages in life.

SPEAKER_04 12:59

Like constantly having to grapple with the idea that you may not make it this time and so it's not only coming to terms with the concept of death but also maybe like looking back and thinking have I done what I wanted to do or maybe at eight years old maybe you hadn't thought of it quite that way but it's you know I wish I could have done this or I wish I could do this and now looking where you are right now you know have I done whatever it is that I wanted to do in my life have I lived a fulfilling sort of life right so that if this time comes where I'm not going to make it, I'm not going to have any feelings of like, I don't know, I wish I did this, right?

SPEAKER_01 13:40

Well, it is interesting that you say that. At eight years old, from a hospital bed, I'd watch Jackie Chan or I'd watch Bruce Lee. And I'd look at them and I'd marvel because I'm looking at them doing these amazing things that I'll never be able to do. But that sparked something in me. And even at a young age, I had this desire, this dream of doing martial arts, despite the fact that I can barely walk sometimes. And so that did spark something. And I think being in such a vulnerable position time and time again, really challenged that sense of personal agency, like, what can I control? What can I do, given my limitations?

SPEAKER_04 14:22

Yeah, I like that. Because actually, what would lead me to my next question, which is, you know, this almost becoming a part of your identity, to an extent your life is driven by this, but at the same time, being so free mentally, telling yourself that, hey, I'm not going to let this take over me. I'm going to live to the maximum of my capacity so that it won't matter. None of it is going to matter at the end, right?

SPEAKER_01 14:51

Yeah. And you're really touching on something like, it's the natural human question to ask why. And I've asked why. Why did I have so many surgeries? Why Why couldn't I do this? And I've asked that, but I've found you will never get a satisfactory answer to the why me question. What I have found is that when I say, okay, I don't like this situation, I don't understand it, but what can I learn? Instead of asking why, ask what? And when I focused on what can I learn in this surgery, there's all kinds of things that I learned. And even with that childhood dream of, I want to do martial arts someday. Well, I I can barely walk. So what can I do? Well, you know what? Maybe I can stretch. And some days that's all I can do. And stretching gets me limber so that I can walk. And walking gets me to a point where one day I can run. And running gets me to a point where one day I can suddenly start doing more cardio-centered things. Maybe I can lift weights one day. So that was kind of my thinking. It's just the tiniest of baby steps sometimes.

SPEAKER_04 15:59

Isn't that just amazing, though, how you found that willpower and that strength within you. It was like you didn't really need too many people to be that voice of reason, but you found it somewhere within you. And I wonder whether that is still that kind of like youth, that hope that is instilled within a youth that, you know, if you had come across this for the first time as an adult, would you see it quite this way? Or was it that hopefulness because you were young? I

SPEAKER_01 16:29

think when you're young and you see something like Jackie Chan flipping and jumping, it sparks something in you. Where maybe as an adult, I'm set in my ways. If I'd been introduced to surgery, maybe I wouldn't have had that spark.

SPEAKER_02 16:42

Right.

SPEAKER_01 16:43

But it's definitely one of those things where it's challenged me, where I actually found, you know, people cheering me on didn't help. Like, you can do it. I found I actually responded more to, Danny, as your cardiologist, you'll never be able to do this. And there's just something in me that's like, watch.

SPEAKER_03 17:02

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_01 17:02

I'm going to do it. The term I use is I'm going to risk responsibly, but I'm going to try something, not be stupid about what my actual limitations are, but actually just try within my limits. And that's what I found when you do things, even little things, you can do so much more than you think you ever could.

SPEAKER_04 17:23

Wow, I like that. I really do. And even like, you know, you're in a situation where there's like a bit of an irony, right? In the sense that they always say that exercising is good. good for your heart. The more you exercise, the stronger your heart is going to be. And then, you know, you were living this sort of ironic life where, you know, probably in school they were, you know, everyone was taking PE classes and exercise classes to strengthen their body and their muscles and their heart. And you were being told quite the opposite. And there was like a part of you that's like, no, I don't accept that. I am one with everyone else in this situation.

SPEAKER_01 18:39

Yeah. Actually, there's an irony that's not lost on me. I've kind of butted heads with my cardiologists for years because they will say, well, you got to be really careful, take it easy. And again, that idea of risking responsibly where I'm going to push up to my limits but not past. The irony is because I have pushed over time, it's actually made my heart stronger than if I just played it safe, never challenged it. But because I willfully put it under that pressure over time, it's made it stronger. So I'm kind of torn like I I've never said this to them, but I've often thought, well, how much of your advice should I

SPEAKER_03 19:18

actually give?

SPEAKER_01 19:20

But I think that's true with anyone. To live is to risk. There are risks everywhere. You make calculated risks. And that's what I chose to do. I have a certain amount of health that I'm responsible for. How much of that can I risk responsibly, not to overdo it, not to cause damage, but just to push just a little bit each

SPEAKER_04 19:41

day? And that's a very healthy sort of way to look at it as well. How are your parents responding to this, though, this kind of mindset that you had when you were younger?

SPEAKER_01 19:48

Again, I look back as an adult. I was shocked. My parents were not helicopter parents. They didn't try and control every little thing. They realized there's a measure that we can control. But some of this, whether I lived, whether I died, whether I have another surgery, whether I don't, they have zero control over that. And that's where I think even for them, they were looking at it more in terms of, well, why did this have to happen to my son, they were looking at it. Well, what can we do in this situation? So just to answer your question, they were very, very, very, very reluctant cheerleaders. So anytime I would try and say, Dad, I think I'm going to try running. Well, don't push it. And then I would do it. And then it was always, well, just be careful. So they were okay with me trying things, but they're always the voice of caution, even still to this day.

SPEAKER_04 20:39

Really? Oh, no, of course. I mean, that makes sense, I guess, especially at that time. And then also on top of that, every time you'd go to school, you'd have that sort of voice of caution from your teachers and the doctor. And it was just like you were surrounded by that, which in a way is it's it's nice to have, like to know that there are people, your caretakers genuinely care for you and they're looking out for your best interest. But there's like a part of you that's like, yeah, I appreciate it. But no, I'm going to

SPEAKER_01 21:07

do me. I look at it this way. There's a lot of people, you know, wanting me to stay safely in the nest because they are genuinely concerned and but i mean you're in the nest you're meant to fly

SPEAKER_03 21:19

and

SPEAKER_01 21:20

so even if i you know step out of the nest and i fall i still want to try

SPEAKER_03 21:25

right

SPEAKER_01 21:25

and i think that's the challenge too is you know we can play it safe but we're not meant to live safe we're meant to do things and challenge ourselves and try and fail and grow that's that's what we're supposed to do for sure

SPEAKER_00 21:38

many portions of this heavily redacted anonymous sources when are we going to say that enough is enough. Aren't we tired of hearing the same celebrities and influencers telling us that same manicured story over and over again? What about everyone else? What about those who don't have a voice just because they don't have a book deal, a TV show, or a million followers on Instagram? Their stories matter too. This is a place where we can finally shine a spotlight into the and give a voice to those who would otherwise be silenced. Real people, real stories without censorship or fear of backlash. This is the raw, unvarnished truth. Welcome to The Redacted.

SPEAKER_04 22:41

So you're eight years old. You've done this surgery. It's an absolute success. What then?

SPEAKER_01 22:47

So the surgery was a success, but... It really bought me time. And what was going on was my valve would constrict. And so when they did the surgery, they would try and open it up and it would constrict. And I'm turning eight, nine, 10, and puberty is coming soon. And that means that my body's going to grow even more. And so what's going to happen to that valve? They tried another surgery, a small surgery when I was 12, where they put a catheter up into my heart and expanded the valve like a balloon. And they thought maybe that'll buy me some time. It bought me about a year and that valve kept constricting again. And finally, and I would say this was the turnaround point in my childhood. Finally, at 14 years old, they cut out the valve completely and they put in an artificial valve that's mechanical. And once I had that mechanical valve put in, suddenly there's no more constriction. Once I was healed from that surgery, that was like, wow, now I actually feel different. Now I can actually try things. So 14 was very liberating for me because it was the first time in my life where there were no longer more surgeries on the horizon.

SPEAKER_04 23:58

Was that the surgery though that they've done many times at that point or was this fairly new at that

SPEAKER_01 24:03

time? So I had a mechanical valve put in and to that date, this was 1990, the longest that they've had a valve last was 12 years. And all that meant was somebody 12 years before me had had a valve put in and theirs was still working. So it wasn't experimental but the long-term effect of how long that valve would last was unknown or uncertain at the time. Now, I've had that valve now for 34 years and it's going strong. And they're saying that that thing can last indefinitely as long as you take care of it. But 14 was really that. It's just like this was a surgery that kind of ended future surgeries for a long time.

SPEAKER_04 24:44

Interesting. And so as this artificial valve has been put in, there were no complications. You were able to actually start exercising and running around and doing more cardio related things?

SPEAKER_01 24:55

Actually, there were a lot of complications. So I say I've had eight heart surgeries, but I've nearly died three times. The first one, I was 18 months. And then this surgery, the valve was put in, but I had internal bleeding that just would not stop. And the doctors were getting very concerned. Their fear was they'd have to reopen me up and try and stop the bleeding that way. But eventually that bleeding stopped. And then when I started healing i'm noticing a different a definite improvement in my health where i'm suddenly ambitious and wanting to try things and not told no you can't i'm now told we'll be very careful

SPEAKER_04 25:33

Did you actually feel quite different in that moment? Could you feel

SPEAKER_01 25:38

it? Yes. Yes. And I'll tell you why. I didn't know. I had a mechanical valve put in. I didn't know it actually ticks like a little clock, like a watch. So I remember waking up from surgery and I hear the beeping of the monitors and you're very groggy. I kept hearing this ticking sound.

SPEAKER_03 25:59

I'm like,

SPEAKER_01 26:00

what is that? And then I realized that's me. And then it was well that's inside of me this ticking is inside of me so i was shocked and of course no i don't know why nobody thinks to tell the patient but yeah these valves tick and it's the blood flowing going in and out and it just these little doors tick tick tick like this and what i found is the byproduct from that um my heartbeat different it's like heavier and if i'm running you'll hear this tick tick tick tick like that but the one the one interesting thing i found is since that surgery my sense of time is actually much better because you've got this it's white noise to me now where I don't really notice it but there's this constant ticking always there that you just kind of tune out

SPEAKER_04 26:48

that's so interesting and almost it's like without even realizing it but then it's almost giving you a concept of like yeah what time it is how long something has been or how many ticks it takes to get to from one place to another for example as opposed to how many steps it's how many ticks for you

SPEAKER_01 27:03

Yeah, it was great when we were raising our kids because when they were babies, I would just hold them on my chest and that constant gentle ticking kind of helped roll them back to sleep.

SPEAKER_02 27:15

Wow. Who would think?

SPEAKER_04 27:17

Who would think?

SPEAKER_01 27:18

The byproducts of heart surgery makes for better parenting.

SPEAKER_04 27:24

So what was it then that changed after that that required you to have another surgery, another big surgery?

SPEAKER_01 27:31

Oh, I'm going to give you the short story. But the The long answer was I went from a kid who was always in crisis to life went on. I graduated high school. I went to college. I got married. I got a job. We started having kids. And instead of surgery being something that I actively faced, it became something that I went through as a kid. And I would remember, but really life, for lack of a better term, was just normal for me now. And really what happened was it looks like an accident on the surface, but I don't believe in accidents. Because I've had a mechanical valve, I have to take blood thinners, keep my blood thin so that there's no clotting. And I noticed severe bruising on my body and it kept getting worse. And I thought, what's going on? Well, long story short, the pharmacy that provides my medication had made a mistake on the label. And I'd actually been taking a double dosage of my blood thinners, which meant my blood was extremely thin. So I went to the hospital I got that taken care of. They gave me vitamin K and that brought my levels down and heparin. But then as a precaution, my cardiologist said, look, why don't we run? We'll do an MRI of your heart. We'll do a few tests that we haven't normally done just to make sure everything's good. And the VEM testing revealed that my aortic arch was drastically enlarged. If this incident with my blood thinner had not happened, likely I would be excess or doing something, it would have burst and I would have died. So the fact that this accident, and I use air quotes, happened, actually revealed a problem that had been growing undetected for a certain amount of time.

SPEAKER_04 29:17

What was it that was triggering this enlargement or this inflammation?

SPEAKER_01 29:23

They're not actually sure. They said sometimes with heart patients, over time, the aortic arch will enlarge. And there's a certain threshold where they'll say it's okay if the many millimeters. Mine had grown well beyond that. And what I noticed was certain activities like running or I was getting into martial arts became very difficult. And I just assumed, well, I'm a middle-aged guy. Maybe I need to get in better shape. I'll just run harder. I'll do more. And then I found, wow, this is really hard. So I wasn't attributing it to heart problems because of course that was something I had way back when I was a kid.

SPEAKER_04 29:59

Wow. What are potential dangers of this though? You You mentioned that you could just drop and that's it. Are there any other kinds of dangers of this?

SPEAKER_01 30:13

It's what they classify as an aortic aneurysm. So people will be doing something, the aortic bursts, and they have an aneurysm on the spot. So once they determined that that was there, I was scheduled for surgery. And now after a 26-year absence, I'm going back into surgery. And this is why I talking to you about perspective because now I'm a grown man going through this thing that I remember going through as a kid. So in some ways, it was very familiar because I knew I'd tell my wife, well, this is going to happen, then this, we'll talk to this doctor. So what really triggered that I knew there was a problem, I had all these testing done and they had set a follow-up date about three months later. Okay, well, we did all these tests. We'll review the results with you in three months. They called me a week later and said, you need to come in. And I told my wife, I'm like, this is not good. They don't call you. In medicine, no news is good news. If somebody's reaching out to you to come in early, it's not good news. So we went in and I was 40 years old and they said, all right, we're going to schedule a surgery. This was in 2017. And I have a hard time talking about this one because that is the surgery where, Jenica, I should not be sitting here talking to you today because what had happened, I was scheduled for surgery. They started to open me up and they discovered that my aortic arch had already burst. When did it burst? They don't know. Was it minutes before, hours before? They don't know. But that surgery then became this mad dash to save my life. And for nine minutes, I had no blood or oxygen, nothing running through my body. And it was just a fight just to get me back to living again. So it was a very difficult surgery. It was challenging. I know in medicine, we say look at the marvels of medicine and all that it can do my surgeon was being called the miracle doctor because it wasn't because of his efforts but they were saying look in spite of what you did he lived and so that that surgery really challenged me because you know i shouldn't be here but i am and that that took me a while to really sit through and think through because i haven't really talked about it but survivor's guilt is kind of an issue that's kind of plagued me over time because I've gone through surgery. You know, I have escaped death several times. And you begin to ask, well, what about that other person? I know many people that have gone through cancer and they're no longer here. Why am I here? Why was their story cut short and mine still going? So I really, really wrestled with that, especially this last time around.

SPEAKER_04 33:35

Especially when it's one of those things where there's really no explanation, no scientific explanation, no medical explanation. Everyone was equally amazed by it. So it kind of gets you to even think about this even further. And

SPEAKER_01 33:51

the short answer, because I wrestled with it, and I thought at one point when I was younger, maybe I should be a doctor. Maybe I need to give back to medicine in some way. I'm not. I would have been a terrible doctor. But what I... The simplest answer, and it's one that's given me the most peace about it, but it's such a trite answer. I'm still here because my story's not done yet. And beyond that, I don't know why other people who've fought so hard, they're not here. I don't have an answer for that. I just know I'm here. And really what I've tried to do in my own friend group and the people that I know, if I know somebody's going through surgery or they're going through cancer, they're in the hospital, I want to go be with them. I want to move towards a messy situation and just be there just to be a comfort to them. Because you know what? Maybe I understand just a little bit of what they're going through. And that's part of why I feel like I'm still here is to help others who are struggling. And I will say this. There's a quote that I came across a few years ago. And the first time I heard it, I actually started crying because I thought this is powerful. This is why I need to share my story. And this is why people need to have help. And the quote is this. One day you will tell your story of how you've overcome what you're going through now, and it will become part of someone else's survival guide. That's why we suffer. We go through hard things because others are going to go through hard things. They'll need our help. I needed help. And we pay it forward in that respect.

UNKNOWN 35:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 35:27

It seems like you went through quite a spiritual sort of like enlightening journey through all of this as well.

SPEAKER_01 35:36

Yeah. My parents had faith and it was up and down sometimes as to whether or not I would survive. And I've come to the conclusion that when you have faith in something, it looks like stubbornness because it's a refusal to quit because you have a belief and you see it through despite what people say. And I'll be candid. I was okay if I'm laying on the operating room table and it's gone through my head, you know, multiple ages, I could be dead in a few minutes. I was okay with that. It wasn't like I was so clinging to life that I thought, well, I have to live and I'm terrified. I actually found the closer I got to each surgery, I had more peace because I don't control the outcome. All I can control, especially when I was younger, was my attitude towards it. And, you know, I kind of in my book that I've I talk about scar tissue, not just physical scar tissue, but as a concept, because scar tissue is actually a healed wound. Scar tissue is actually stronger than normal human ordinary skin. So if we have an open wound, it keeps bleeding. But if we allow it to heal, that wound becomes actually stronger. And so that's kind of how I try to look at things is, I don't know why, but I can have this mentality. Look, I can't control Yeah, I like that. Yeah,

SPEAKER_04 37:04

like, almost like that other quote where what doesn't kill you makes you stronger, right? Yeah. I can't control this, but I'm going to choose to live it the best way possible and do it while being careful. But at the same time, I'm going to do it and I'm going to live my life to the max. Um, because, you know, I think some of the hardest things that some people go through is, you know, it's, it's a lot of it is to do with their lack of faith in themselves or their lack of faith in, in this world, the lack of belief that this world can give them a good, fair, happy sort of outcome. And so, you know, uh, People maybe pass prematurely or they choose to make decisions that are very sabotaging for themselves because they don't have that sort of faith and that belief that they can overcome it and can find peace within it.

SPEAKER_01 38:13

Yeah. But I will say to your point, you cannot look at yourself as a victim. You are a victor. We've all been victimized. We've all gone through hard things. But I am not a victim. I am going to overcome what I'm going through. And part of that is just refusing to ask the why me question. And I've looked at it this way as well. I believe we go through suffering for a reason. If I act like my suffering has a purpose, I'm going to find purpose in it. If I act like this has all just been a terrible accident and I am a victim and this woe is me, how does that affect my marriage? How does that affect how I parent? How does that affect how I approach work and life? But when I assume there's a reason for it and there's something to learn in it, that changes everything. That changes the type of husband I am. That changes the type of father I am to my kids. When other people go through difficult things, I'm not just saying, well, too bad to be you. I'm saying, hey, let's fight through this. Let's go through this together. And that's been the amazing part for me is just to assume, maybe you don't always know what that reason is, but assume that there's something that suffering can teach you. Because the truth is, suffering is a human universal. All of us to some degree in varying degrees emotionally financially physically in different ways are going to have to endure hard things if we assume there's a reason there's a lesson to be learned in it we do come out on the other end of it stronger

SPEAKER_04 39:41

how how's your wife sort of and your children been taking it um have they been sort of assuming the same kind of uh mentality and perspective that you have had or was it a little bit harder for them to take it

SPEAKER_01 39:56

i told them about my surgeries growing up and it was all very theoretical and hypothetical to them they've now gone through a trial by fire but i think it has had a huge impact my oldest son he's now 20 he was recently diagnosed with type 1 diabetes and within a few weeks he mastered you know taking his injections measuring his food and i asked him about it i said you seem like you've come to terms with this very quickly and his only comment he's very quiet he said I didn't see the point in getting upset about it because I'm going to have to deal with it anyway. So I think there's a measure where things happen to us. We can spend years bemoaning it, being upset. Ultimately, though, we have to come to a point where we accept it and move on. And that's what I found. The more I focus on, well, why did this happen? And what about this? I have to get past that at some point and say, I accept it. What am I going to do about

SPEAKER_04 40:55

it? Yeah. You mentioned that When you were doing your last surgery at 40, that was one of probably the hardest ones that you have gone through. And you said for about nine minutes, you didn't get any oxygen in your body. Would you have to say that you were proclaimed not alive at that point?

SPEAKER_01 41:15

They didn't. I wasn't told that. All that they said was that your brain had no blood or oxygen, your heart had no blood or oxygen. So no one was throwing around that you were clinically dead. But I certainly wasn't living. I wasn't like there was not life happening.

SPEAKER_04 41:32

Right. So I've done episodes previously with individuals who've had near death experiences where they've actually had outer body experiences and seen sort of like the whole universe. And they've talked about that. Do you resonate with that? Do you have any sort of experience like that?

SPEAKER_01 41:48

I've researched near death experiences quite a bit. I feel a bit cheated of anybody that should have had one. I feel like I should have. To date? No, I have not. I had a strange experience during one of my surgeries, but I've never had a near-death experience. When I was eight years old, during surgery, I could actually hear the doctors talking while they're working, and I felt like a picking sensation at my chest. And I later told them, and I was told, well, that's impossible. But I've since researched it, and it does happen when you're in a You start to become more conscious and then it's regulated that you're put back down. So that was certainly not a near-death experience, but an interesting experience. So I don't know, none so far.

SPEAKER_04 42:40

Very interesting. Now, I mean, you have such an interesting story. I mean, such an amazing story. And I just love the sort of things that you've taken away from this and the path that you've chosen to sort of, you know, follow. Tell me a little bit about this book. I guess I'm pretty sure your story inspired it. When did you start writing it? What made you decide to sort of like, you know, get on with it?

SPEAKER_01 43:06

Yeah, my friend of mine, we went for a walk. He was writing a children's story. And he just wanted to bounce some ideas off of me. So we walked for a while. And at the end of our walk, he turned to me and he said, would you ever write a book? And I thought, I'm too young. And I can't write. And more importantly, what do I have to say? But that idea kind of stuck with me. and I went home and I made some notes and I had about 12 pages of notes and that's when I realized maybe I've got something to say and so for me in 2020 I started to write and I spent about a year writing and then I spent another year editing looking for a publisher but that really challenged me maybe something of what I've gone through can resonate with somebody else just like I mentioned in that quote you share your story of what you've overcome because others need that that becomes their survival guide. So I was excited at the prospect of writing, but then equally terrified because I don't know if I could write. And I guess my publisher thought so. So I've written it. I've shared it. The response has been overwhelming because what I found is people read it and then the comments are, wow, this is really acceptable. I really enjoyed what she had to say. I've got a cousin who's going through heart surgery. Can I get another copy for them? And that's kind of how it's disseminated. Do

SPEAKER_04 44:26

you feel like it was also quite cathartic for you in writing it because you were actually reflecting and having moments of realization as you're writing through your journey.

SPEAKER_01 44:36

Yes, because again, you're looking at your life with a bit more emotional intelligence. You're looking back on things where as a kid, I'm like, well, this is surgery, where now I'm like, this was not normal. And I was understanding things better. Whether you can write or not, I think everybody should write about difficulties experiences because it helps you make sense of them. And that's what it was for me. And I find a lot of these details that were in my head for years. Now I've kind of let them go. Now I don't have to think about them because I've wrestled with them. Survivor's guilt, I've wrestled with it. It doesn't challenge me like it used to.

SPEAKER_04 45:14

Yeah, I like that. And I think like, you know, a lot of a lot of episodes I've done in the past, people have always recommended like therapy, talking it out again as a way of releasing, actually having that cathartic conversation or some kind of form of release. And so, this is why I feel like writing is another sort of outlet for a lot of people that may be struggling. And you mentioned that you only started sort of writing more officially or formally when you were releasing your book or like with the intention of releasing your book. Did you ever explore writing when you were younger or did you have any other form of release, you know, mental and emotional release?

SPEAKER_01 45:52

Yeah, I would draw a lot as a kid. I would do graphic design. I do video production now. So I had these creative outlets that I used that were not physical, but something that I could do. And so I had these outlets that really were good for me. My brain, my imagination was my escape. So writing, like as an adult, well, of course, it makes sense. That's how I'm going to take all this and just pour it out.

SPEAKER_04 46:21

I feel like we've covered a lot of really great stuff here. Great content. So one last question for you, Danny. Can you tell me something, one main message that either you've shared in your book or that you would like to leave our listeners with today?

SPEAKER_01 46:36

Yeah, I'm going to sign it. My niece showed me how to sign this. That means never give up. And so that's my message. Whatever people are facing, don't give up. Beyond that, the reason you don't give up is because there's a lesson. So move away from asking the why, ask the what. And when you assume that there's purpose in suffering, there's a reason you're going through something, it changes everything. Now you're in a position to grow and now you're in a position to help others. So the simple message, never give up.

SPEAKER_04 47:11

I love that. And you're really an example of that as well. So amazing. So great. I'll put your book's link and everything into the description as well and ways that our listeners can reach out to you if they do want. Thank you so much, Danny, for being on the podcast and sharing your amazing story with us.

SPEAKER_01 47:30

Yeah, thank you so much for having me. It's been a pleasure.

UNKNOWN 47:35

Thank you.

SPEAKER_04 47:36

If you enjoyed the episode and would like to help support the show, please follow and subscribe. You can rate and review your feedback on any of our platforms listed in the description. I'd like to recognize our guests who are vulnerable and open to share their life experiences with us. Thank you for showing us we're human. Also, a thank you to our team who worked so hard behind the scenes to make it happen.

SPEAKER_01 47:57

The

SPEAKER_04 48:00

show would be nothing without you. I'm Jenica, host and writer of the show, and you're listening to Multispective.