Growing Destinations
Your go-to source for insightful discussions on destination development. The Growing Destinations podcast delves into the strategies, challenges, and successes that drive community growth. Each episode features in-depth conversations with local and national experts, uncovering universal themes and innovative practices that can be applied to any city or region.
Growing Destinations
Inside the Minnesota Zoo with John Frawley and Jamie Flaws
Created by the State of Minnesota, the Minnesota Zoo opened in 1978 with a mission to connect people, animals, and the natural world to save wildlife. Cutting-edge exhibits provide exciting experiences with animals and their habitats, introducing guests to species from around the globe. Education programs engage audiences at the Zoo, throughout the region, and around world. Conservation programs protect endangered species and preserve critical ecosystems. Meet John Frawley, Director of the Minnesota Zoo and Jamie Flaws, Executive Director of the Minnesota Zoo Foundation. They bring us inside the Zoo and share their insights, the success of the new Tree Top Trail and why Zoo’s matter.
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Jamie Flaws:The treetop trail. We worked with community designers to let the community tell us what their relationship to nature was, what their expectations were as they were going to engage in that trail, what safety meant, what welcomeness meant.
John Frawley:The thing that I remember the most is I'm on the treetop trail and I have never seen so many families with special needs, people with disabilities, people with mobility issues flooding to the Minnesota Zoo because something was built with them in mind. They got to go 1.25 miles the longest treetop trail in the world and everybody could do it.
Bill Von Bank:Welcome to the Growing Destinations podcast, where we take a deep dive into destination development and focus on a wide range of topics, from tourism and entertainment to economic development and entrepreneurism and much more. I'm your host, bill Vaughn-Bank. We're on location at the Minnesota Zoo in Apple Valley, minnesota. The zoo has been part of the Minnesota landscape since 1978 and is known for its award-winning, cutting-edge exhibits, immersive educational programming and is a recognized leader in worldwide conservation efforts. Today, I'm joined by the Minnesota Zoo Director, john Frawley, and the Executive Director of the Minnesota Zoo Foundation, jamie Floss. John and Jamie, welcome to the Growing Destinations podcast.
John Frawley:Thank you. Thank you, thanks for having us.
Bill Von Bank:We're going to talk all things Minnesota Zoo, but first I'd like to learn a little bit more about each of you and your background, john.
John Frawley:Yeah well, I'm a born and raised Minnesota boy. So, born in St Peter Minnesota, grew up in Stillwater and Red Wing, went to Red Wing High School, even stayed for college, went to Minnesota State, got degrees in wildlife management and park and rec, and so got a great background right here in Minnesota. In college I actually went and left Minnesota for my internship at a zoo in Brownsville Texas. And so I left Minnesota for part of my college, my internship, and actually got a job in a zoo down in Brownsville Texas as a zookeeper. So that was my first stint in the zookeeping world. And then obviously my wife and I started raising a family and our goal was to come back to Minnesota and came back and my first job here was a zookeeper at the Minnesota Zoo. I was 22 years old, so kind of fun. And now here I am as a director full circle.
Bill Von Bank:Full circle.
John Frawley:A lot happened in between then, but it's fun to be back. Came and joined the zoo about eight years ago.
Bill Von Bank:And you pretty much stayed within this realm of an industry in terms of working within conservation and animal management and the like, and I believe was it in San Francisco.
John Frawley:Yep, my whole life was dedicated to environment conservation, animals, connecting people to nature, and I was lucky enough to go to San Francisco in the Bay Area. I was going to go out there for connecting people to nature and I was lucky enough to go to San Francisco in the Bay Area. I was going to go out there for one year just to consult. I spent 20 years there, so it was great. Though, northern California Bay Area worked with a lot of nonprofits merging nonprofits all focused on the watershed of the San Francisco Bay, that ecosystem, but also worked with nature centers, aquariums, so it's just been a great journey and I was so excited to get recruited back to this property, this zoo. My heart was always here in Minnesota and glad to be back.
Bill Von Bank:Great to have you back, Jamie. Give us your background and your history. I've known you quite a while.
Jamie Flaws:We've known each other decades almost.
Bill Von Bank:For sure yes.
Jamie Flaws:I have a very non-traditional background, so not parallel John's path at all.
Jamie Flaws:I grew up in Chicago, so Brookfield and Lincoln Park were my zoos and I came to school here, went to St Olaf and just loved the state, the values surrounding nature, and first came acquainted with the zoo because my college roommate was actually studying to be a primatologist and so she would bring me along when she would come up and observe the snow monkeys, the macaques, which are now right outside my office.
Jamie Flaws:I spent most of my career in media organizations actually helping many of our customers all of our customers actually to grow their audiences, grow their messaging and make an impact in the Twin Cities. Many of my customers were nonprofits, a lot of them in the destination visitor marketing space, which is how you and I got to know each other. And many years after that I decided that I wanted to apply my skills of helping businesses grow to nonprofits. I saw a lot of nonprofits that were stuck, that had a lot of potential, and so I went out on my own for about five years helping nonprofits really realize their true potential and grow impact. And one of those clients was actually the Minnesota Zoo and Minnesota Zoo Foundation. And so I find myself here in a very, very enjoyable capacity.
Bill Von Bank:John, can you share with us the mission of the Minnesota Zoo?
John Frawley:Yeah, we have a great mission. We have a mission. I know our team just is passionate about it. It's connecting people to animals and the natural world to save wildlife, and I think the zoo is, you know, in our history. We've really achieved all of that. We have an animal collection of almost 5,000 animals. We've really achieved all of that. We have an animal collection of almost 5,000 animals. Wow, over 65 of them are critically threatened or endangered in their habitats.
John Frawley:We are known for our conservation programs worldwide. We have programs that we've helped Asian wild horses, amur, tigers, black rhinos in Namibia and then bringing it closer to home, we really are focused on a lot of Minnesota conservation right now with butterflies, mussels, turtles, our bison here in Minnesota. So just some great programs, great history and right now, that middle of our mission is something we're really focusing on and that is connecting people to the natural world. So I look at it like three pillar, a three pillared mission Animals we're doing a great job Saving wildlife. Great conservation, known, award-winning conservation programs, and then that middle of our mission, connecting people to nature, which I think we're focusing a lot on that right now. I think the world needs connection to nature. We're starting to see the value of nature and we're a 500-acre zoo.
John Frawley:We're the fifth largest zoo in the country. The average zoo is less than like 30, 40 acres, so we are a significant zoo. Most zoos would love this land Definitely, definitely. And here's the thing not only is it almost 500 acres, but 70% of the population is within an hour of the zoo. Rochester is within an hour of the zoo. We really can serve and be accessible to all here, and that's what we're really striving for is building a zoo that's for all.
Bill Von Bank:And while created by the state of Minnesota in 1978, the zoo is not solely publicly funded and is a unique blend of public and private funding. Walk us through that model.
John Frawley:Yeah, I mean I love the model. We are a state zoo and we're proud to be a state zoo and serve Minnesota, so we embrace that. A little over one-third of our funding comes of our general fund, comes from the state of Minnesota, but two-thirds we have to raise like a Main Street operation. We have to have a good business model. We do that through people coming to the zoo, through our food programs, through our retail events, but we really have to work hard to be a smart business model. But the two together really allow us to be that world-class zoo, that fifth largest zoo in the country. It's the partnership that makes it happen. The other thing that we have is and Jamie is sitting right here is we have an amazing foundation that really does allow people to become part of our zoo family, and so we have thousands of donors that help us on our journey and help really deliver our mission, and that's a special relationship that we have with our foundation.
Jamie Flaws:The foundation really serves to accelerate the zoo's mission right and by providing much needed funding for educational programs or, again, conservation programs, things that wouldn't necessarily make as much sense to be funded by the state. So you know, an example of that is we actually employ a field biologist in Namibia. That's something very appropriate for the foundation to do but wouldn't be an appropriate use of state funds.
Bill Von Bank:And what strategies do you employ to engage donors and foster the philanthropic support?
Jamie Flaws:Gosh, what don't we do? We have. We have been, over the past many years, really growing our team and our discipline in terms of fundraising. So we work directly with donors one-on-one. We speak to the zoo's audience of members and attendees to help them understand that the zoo needs funds, and we do a lot of outreach in that manner. We have traditional fundraising galas like the Beastly Bash, and we just started a conservation fundraising event where the messaging and the fundraising is specifically dedicated towards the conservation efforts.
John Frawley:Yeah, but when I talk to donors, I think what's special about the Minnesota Zoo is there's just so much for everybody as far as where people's passion are, where their hearts are. Obviously there's people that love animals. That's a big group. We have amazing animals that need help. We have amazing animals that are telling stories for their animals that are still out in the wild trying to survive. The animals the conservation is important, but we also have a lot of people that right now are rising up saying we need to connect people to nature.
John Frawley:Technology is great, but people are on their phones and on their devices a lot and we're worried about our kids. There's a lot of positive that comes with technology, but I think it's a balance and there's also a lot of science coming out of how nature really helps us and it needs to be a part of our life. And nature is unbiased. Nature is for everybody, all ages, all abilities so we're really embracing that. I think our donors are seeing that there's something here for everybody. If you believe in connecting kids to nature, the zoo is a good place to work with. If you want to help save animals, the zoo is a good place to work with.
John Frawley:We're very community-orientated. We have programs that allow. We have a program called Free to Explore where I always say the Minnesota Zoo is a free zoo to those who need it to be free, Because if you qualify for general assistance in the state, you come to the zoo for free. We used to have those old free days but those weren't really accessible. Now if you're on general assistance, you can come to the Minnesota Zoo. Since making that shift to that new program, Free to Explore, we have over 200,000 people coming to the zoo for free. Wow, to the zoo for free, Wow. So the zoo really makes a difference Much more accessible.
John Frawley:And this year, you know, after all these years, we're on track for one of the biggest years in the history of the zoo. So I think people are really embracing this mission, they're supporting it through the foundation and everybody's feeling good and, by the way, having fun. You know it's a fun place.
Bill Von Bank:We already are speaking to this. Maybe we can dig a little deeper in terms of local community engagement, and how do you engage local audiences to support the zoo mission?
Jamie Flaws:It's multi-tier. I think one is that we, as John said, we have to offer programming that speaks to community members authentically, and that means engaging local community members as we develop that. For example, with the treetop trail, we worked with community designers to let the community tell us what their relationship to nature was, what their expectations were as they were going to engage in that trail, what safety meant, what welcomeness meant. So we need to engage on that level. We have to create programs like Free to Explore that allow people to come in. We have programming that helps people who have sensory issues, so we offer Dream Night and we have specific programs where we're very mindful of the noise and the lighting, and again, it's the community that tells us that. So you have to be deliberate, intentional and put yourself out there and ask questions and then respond.
John Frawley:Yeah, I think one of the biggest relationships is our education programs as a whole. This is the Minnesota Zoo is probably the biggest environmental education destination in the state, serving almost 100,000 school kids every year and parents and teachers and chaperones. And when I say that, all different types of schools, you know home schools, charter schools. We welcome everybody and so that's you know. That's really a big part of what we do and I think we have a great reputation on delivering quality education and making sure that it's accessible.
Bill Von Bank:That's one for sure a big community relationship we have to an existing monorail track, a decommissioned monorail track, and turned it into something incredible. And you know you hear a lot of talk right now about communities and cities looking at repurposing commercial buildings. Maybe they could take a lesson from what you've done here at the Minnesota Zoo with this monorail track. So let's talk all things treetop trail. Tell us the vision behind it and the elevated experience with it.
John Frawley:Yeah, it's a fun story. So eight years ago I came to the zoo as a new director and I literally was walking the zoo with the old director that was predecessor and I said to him I said what's the plan for the monorail? And jokingly he goes that's the next guy's problem.
Bill Von Bank:Which was you which?
John Frawley:was me. Funny enough, we had planned a trip to New York. My bride and I went to New York just shortly after I had started to visit some friends and they took us on the High Line in New York City. The High Line is a railroad trust that was converted into an elevated walking tour. Well, the High Line in New York City is spectacular. It's turned into the biggest destination in New York City other than Central Park. So I'm on the High Line going. Oh my gosh, you have thousands of people enjoying it, safe, that education, programming, arts, cultural events on the High Line.
John Frawley:We came, came back, hired engineers and started looking at our monorail tracks. And could we do something like this? And first we structurally wanted to answer that question. They came back and said the substructure of this monorail track is really well done. It's going to last for hundreds of years.
John Frawley:That began the journey. We then we brought our team in. We started looking at it creatively. We started doing some design concepts. Once we had design concepts, funders started. Some of our initial funders started to look at it going. This could be really a gift to minnesota. And then the journey just began. And then it just snowballed with ideas, great people surrounding it. Jamie, sitting right here, took the lead as a project manager, which really was critical, and it's just been a spectacular project because, like you said, it's a meaningful project. Jamie can talk a lot about the nuts and bolts of it because she was right there. I will tell you the grand opening, bill. The thing that I remember the most is I'm on the treetop trail and I have never seen so many families with special needs, people with disabilities, people with mobility issues flooding to the Minnesota Zoo because something was built with them in mind. They got to go 1.25 miles the longest treetop trail in the world and everybody could do it and it was really, really heartwarming.
Jamie Flaws:Yeah, it's been amazing. We built it very intentionally to be welcoming for all. All the entrance ramps are ADA accessible, we have elevators that we put in and it's even footing. It is a very predictable, controlled environment, yet completely surrounded in nature. So it's really inspiring and heartwarming to see the usage from people that are wheelchair-pwned or just have physical instability, but this ability to actually experience it and it's wonderful.
Bill Von Bank:It's a public-private project. How did the funding play out on this?
Jamie Flaws:Yeah, actually it is the largest fundraising campaign in the's history and we're very, very proud of that. As John said, we were fortunate to have a number of lead donors step forward very early on, very inspired by the going to the state to say we have people, they're interested in this, they're behind this and they're putting their dollars on the table. And so once the state stepped in with their funding, it really gave us the momentum we needed to continue to fundraise and close that gap.
Bill Von Bank:And how long of a process from idea, John, to grand opening.
John Frawley:Good question. I didn't want to bring up the word pandemic, but that did happen.
John Frawley:I tried to block that. But without the pandemic I think it would have been a normal process, but with the pandemic it probably stretched over five years into six years of start to finish. But well worth it, I can tell you it's changed the feel of the zoo. It's a destination and that's one thing that the zoo is. You know, we're really in a place right now with the Minnesota Zoo. It's served the state so well and so many people so well and so many people have served the zoo.
John Frawley:Board members and legislators and governors have really helped build this zoo. But now it's in a place where it's ready to, I think, reinvent itself and broaden its mission. And that's where we talk about nature and bringing more people to the zoo. The numbers are growing. We have to build for that, we have to get ready for that, and the treetop trail was an extra mile and a half walk in the trees. That really helps. And I think that's where we're going is let's get more people exposed to nature, exposed to animals and fall in love with nature, because if they do, then they are more likely to help us save it.
Bill Von Bank:And that's a journey we'd like everybody to get on. Congratulations on the success of Treetop Trail and also congratulations on achieving accreditation from the Association of Zoos and Aquariums, also known as AZA. Can you walk us through the process the Minnesota Zoo underwent to attain this prestigious recognition?
John Frawley:Yes, so AZA is our association. It is a gold standard association for zoos and aquariums at the national level. Actually, we have members that are international as well. There's approximately only 225 zoos and aquariums that are accredited, I think, in the US. There's over 3,000 different animal encounters in the United States, but only 225 to 230 are accredited.
John Frawley:It's a rigorous accreditation process. They sent five inspectors out to the Minnesota Zoo for three and a half days and they look at all areas of operation. They look at your finances, they look at your education, they look at your conservation, your animal care, your animal welfare, your veterinarian programs. Then they do a full assessment to make sure you're not only meeting standards like USDA and others, but exceeding them in many cases. So it's self-regulated, a higher level of standards that you can ensure that these animals and these people are safe in this environment, and so we're very proud of it. We're very proud to be part of AZA. That is a focus for us and it's an accreditation that you have to reaccreditate yourself every five years, so they really keep on top of it, and we're really proud that the team worked really hard and we're proud to be part of.
Bill Von Bank:ACA. What role do you believe zoos play in wildlife conservation efforts, both locally and globally?
John Frawley:You know, a lot of people sometimes say to me oh, you work at the zoo and do we really need zoos anymore? I mean, what's the future of zoos? And if you think about it, the real question is and a lot of times they'll say, you know, maybe the animals should be left back into the wild. Let's put the animals back in the wild. The real question is how is the wild doing? Right? Nobody seems to answer that question.
John Frawley:Very often we have so much habitat destruction and so many ecosystem challenges that these animals are having a hard time. The wildlife corridors where they live, poaching, wildlife, trafficking of animals, climate change all these things are making it tough for these animals and their environment. So what's happened over the years is zoos maybe 50 to 100 years ago were more menageries. They've all good zoos and accredited zoos are transforming into conservation tools. So we actually are working to kind of make sure that we are like a Noah's Ark of animals. We're making sure that we have species and species survival plan for all the animals in the zoos.
John Frawley:We're keeping the genetics of these wild animals healthy and populations healthy in captive breeding programs, and all of this work allows our other colleagues that are protecting ecosystems to start to stabilize ecosystems around the world while we're making sure the animals are managed, and then we work together to reintroduce and repopulate animals back into the wild or save, learn about those animals so we can do better serving them in the wild.
John Frawley:So it's a really big partnership between zoos groups that are protecting the ecosystems. So zoos have evolved and they play this new role of, you know, taking care of these wild animals and taking care of these genetics, of these wild populations to buy time to make sure we can protect and restore ecosystems. So that's the story behind zoos. A lot of people don't realize and the Minnesota Zoo is a leader in conservation in situ and exit to so in the zoo and outside in the wild. So we're very proud of that and it really justifies everything we do here is how much we're giving back to those animals that are still out in the wild trying to survive and those ecosystems.
Bill Von Bank:You look at zoos as but for zoos We'd probably have more animals extinct, and I think of a really popular conservation effort that the Minnesota Zoo has been engaged in in years is the Asian wild horse.
John Frawley:Absolutely. I mean they're to the verge of extinction and the fact that we could play that part here in Minnesota of a horse halfway across the world shows the impact of what you can do in a zoo. It shows the impact of how important these conservation efforts are. So we are behind that, but it goes on. We're part of the Tiger Conservation Campaign. We're a cluster of zoos that raise money for tigers in the wild. We've raised over $2 million that have gone directly into the wild protecting Amur tigers in their native habitat. So now we're working on butterflies here in Minnesota, we're working on mussels, we're working on the turtles here in Minnesota. There's a lot of critical, endangered work that needs to be happened and the Minnesota Zoo is right in the middle of a lot of it and the fundraising behind that.
Bill Von Bank:Jamie, you just mentioned a successful first-time conservation gala. Can you give us a little more insight into that?
Jamie Flaws:Yeah, we just had that event on April 11th and we had over 200 people show up and say that they wanted to learn more right about the work that the Minnesota Zoo and some of our partners are doing with conservation, and our theme was on the illegal trafficking of wildlife and how that is one of the largest threats. It's the fourth largest illegal criminal activity in the world. It's a $10 billion industry. You know, the work that we and the opportunity that we have to educate people about how they can make a difference through their actions being responsible tourists, but also how they can support this work, you know, by supporting the Minnesota Zoo is an exciting opportunity and something that we're looking forward to continuing.
Bill Von Bank:One final question what are your long-term goals for the zoo and how do you envision its growth and impact in the coming years?
John Frawley:The real simple answer is our mission matters. We're seeing that, we're feeling that the growth of our education, the growth of our general attendance. So we want to build to that. We want to expose more people to animals, the natural world and help them be part of saving wildlife. So this year we're on track to reach probably 1.5 million visitors. So we are really a big zoo reaching a lot of people, but we think we can do more. I mean, we really want to be and we want to reach more people, but we want to reach all people and all abilities, all ages. So we're building to that.
John Frawley:Our strategic plan is heading in that direction. Our long-range facility plan is let's build the infrastructure so we can keep growing this zoo and we're hoping to reach 2 million visitors and really make it accessible to all. So I think our mission matters. We need to expose more people to the mission and if there's barriers out there that are keeping people from coming, we need to find those barriers and take those barriers away. And bottom line, we are here to serve Minnesota. We're a state zoo. This is your zoo, so we will just continue to serve you and make it open and make it a meaningful experience to you and your families.
Bill Von Bank:John Frawley, Jamie Floss. Thank you for the time today and sharing more about the Minnesota Zoo, its progress and what's to come, and thank you for being our guests on the Growing Destinations podcast.
Jamie Flaws:Thank you.
Bill Von Bank:Thank you for tuning in to the Growing Destinations podcast and don't forget to subscribe. This podcast is brought to you by Experience Rochester. Find out more about Rochester, minnesota, and its growing arts and culture scene it's international culinary flavors and award winning craft beer by visiting experiencerochestermncom.
