Becoming a social work manager & the value of supervision with Kyrene Darko

If you haven't met Kyrene before, you should know she is one of the kindest, caring people you will find!

In this episode we talk about:
-Her social work career journey
-The challenges of becoming a manager
-Being an introvert and managing others
-The value of supervision

To find out more, follow Kyrene and get her latest guide:

https://www.thesocialworkmentor.co.uk/

A guide to your first 4 weeks as a manager 

Social Work Leaders Podcast 

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Transcript

 Kyrene 

Kyrene 

Headset Microphone (Sennheiser SCx5 USB MS): [00:00:00] Hi and welcome to Social Work Sorted, the podcast. I'm Vicki Shevlin. I'm your host, and I founded Social Work Sorted, an online platform for newly qualified social workers.

I'm an experienced children's social worker, previous Child Protection Conference Chair, and I started Social Work Sorted so that newly qualified social workers could connect theory to practice.

 My mission is to help you bring confidence and calm to your first year as a social worker.

Headset Microphone (Sennheiser SCx5 USB MS): Because I know that when that happens, you are able to positively influence so many of the people around you, including the children and families that you work with.

This podcast is all about practical guidance, realistic advice, and amazing insights from the wonderful guests that I have joined me.

So whether it's a bite sized episode, something to reflect on, 

or an entire conversation for you to soak up, you are so welcome. If you want to know more about the ways I can help you as a student or newly qualified social worker, or even a workforce development lead, then make sure you go and have a look in the show notes. And I'll also be reminding you at the end of this [00:01:00] episode.

Before we get into it, just a reminder if you find this episode or any of the other episodes helpful.

Headset Microphone (Sennheiser SCx5 USB MS)-2: Please take two minutes to leave a rating, a review, get in touch with me and share it with somebody else.

Headset Microphone (Sennheiser SCx5 USB MS): I'm so grateful that this podcast is part of your social work journey.

Vicki: Welcome everyone to the podcast slash YouTube. I'm Vicky from Social Work Sorted. I'm with Corrine from the Social Work Mentor. Do you want to introduce yourself to everybody watching slash listening? 

Kyrene: Yes, yes. So yeah, thanks Vicky. I'm Kyrene from the Social Work Mentor. Like you said, I am a social worker.

I am the owner of the Social Work Mentor and the creator of the Social Work Leaders podcast as well. 

Vicki: And I've been on the podcast. So this is like the reverse of it. And that must have been. Over, over a year ago. 

Kyrene: Over a year, Vicky, yeah. Because you were one of my first guests. So, yeah, over a year ago now.

Vicki: Yeah, which is really nice. Because I just, [00:02:00] I was on a different sofa in a different house where my house before, but I remember It was just like a chat and then after an hour, we're like, Oh, better stop.

So we're talking today about your work, your podcast, your sort of mission and drive around helping social workers who move into management. So I wondered if you could share some of like your experience in social work, your social work journey, be helpful for people to listen to. 

Kyrene: Yeah, definitely. So I'm, as I said, well, I've been a social worker now since 2011.

So it will be 13 years this year. So a long time. And I've always been within children's services. So child protection teams, assessment teams, quality assurance. Child Protection, Conference Chair, Independent Reviewing Officer. So social work roles and [00:03:00] managerial roles all within Children's Services. Coming into social work was interesting because I was one of the social workers that came in straight from university.

Straight into the course. So we, some would say not much experience, no life experience, which was definitely frowned upon a long time ago. But I was so sure that that's what I wanted to do. I knew that I was going to be a social worker. My mum was a social worker, is a social worker. It was, it was in me.

It was just something I was going to do. So I went, I did the course. It was a good experience. It felt like a really good experience. Jumped straight into practice afterwards. Again, a great experience. However, was not as prepared for the reality of being a frontline social worker. As, as I believe I should have been, especially when I look back now, and especially when I look now at the support available from platforms like [00:04:00] yourself, Vicky, I just wish I had that support available.

But I did have some really good experiences I had some really great managers who kind of got me on the journey of where I needed to be and just allowed me to continue to enjoy my role. So, through social work, like I've said, it's always been within Children's Services. mainly child protection teams as a manager and as a social worker and more recently have stepped into a role as a child protection conference chair and independent reviewing officer.

Vicki: That's the first thing that's interesting that I didn't know is that your mum is a social worker as well. And I always think those like people's journeys are really interesting. So my mum's a but my auntie was a social, is a social worker. And it's funny how You, well, I don't know. I, I was very aware of the job that she did to some extent.

I was aware of the late nights. I was aware, again, to an extent of how much of [00:05:00] herself she put into that and yet still chose to do it. And I wonder, is, is it the same for you? Did you kind of have that balance of it? 

Kyrene: Yes, absolutely. I was so aware of it. It was, I saw the late nights. I saw the times where my mum was exhausted, tired.

But what was interesting is that I also saw her love for her work and her passion for her work. So whilst I was really aware of it, I thought, yeah, this, it seems like it's going to be hard work, but she also really loves it. And I think that's what just continued to push me in that direction. 

Vicki: And then thinking about like you saying that you kind of had kind of supportive managers that, and I had that as well.

So I've, I don't think I experienced bad management. I've experienced. At some points in my career, my managers come and go, rather than it being a bad manager, it was just kind of an insecure service, but [00:06:00] kind of mostly had good managers. How, is there anything that you've taken from the good management that you had that you now do as a manager or you have done in the past?

Kyrene: Yeah. Like you just said, Vicky, I think I was lucky. I was very lucky. I've always generally, yes, I've had experiences of not so great managers, but on a whole, I've been really lucky to have good managers. And I think for me, that was everything. One of the biggest things that I found was having managers who believed in me.

And I've not, I've not been perfect. I've always been learning on the journey, but having managers that have believed in me, have kind of supported me to learn rather than kind of making me feel less than is a key thing. And I think for me, that's the most important thing or one of the most important things.

Being that support system, because you spend a lot of time in your, in your work, you spend a lot of time with your manager. So being that support [00:07:00] system for your social workers, for your team is really important. And that's something that I've carried with me as well. 

Vicki: And it's a massive shift, isn't it?

Because I think, and I've never been a manager. And I always thought. That's what I would do, but from being in ASIE, I thought that that would be the path that I'd go down. And then a conference chair job came up and I did that and loved it. And, but it's not, I think some people underestimate the shift from social worker to manager.

Cause you kind of see some of the things that your manager does and you think, Oh, I could do that. What were some of the things that you were maybe not prepared for or kind of what were the expectations that didn't actually add up when you became a manager? 

Kyrene: Yeah, it's 

Vicki: a 

Kyrene: big jump. There's not a question about it because I remember thinking on a practical level, I think I can kind of do this, you know, that that's how it felt beforehand.

Because within a senior social worker role, I was at a point where I was able to support social workers with their [00:08:00] assessments. I was able to have a look over their court reports before they went to a manager. So in my mind, actually, I can do a lot of this role, but actually stepping into it, the reality was different.

Having the Those skills and being able to do that is great, but that's only one small aspect of the role. I think the biggest thing for me was that I wasn't prepared for was what it's like being a middle manager. And having those pressures from your operational team, but also having to meet the needs of a strategic level, and actually the needs are often not the same.

So really having to be in that middle manager position I think was the, the biggest shock for me that I wasn't prepared for and how to navigate that and understand. Where I sat within this, how, how to advocate for my team, but making sure that things such as audits were being done timescales were being met, and how to encourage my team in a way that they didn't [00:09:00] feel that it was a tick box exercise because I remember.

As a social worker feeling like your managers just ticking boxes, but how into having to learn how to translate that into real life. So that social workers felt actually this is a benefit, and not just tick box exercise so that for me was a real, a big part of my learning journey. 

Vicki: It's a real skill, isn't it, to be able to do that and I'm like thinking back to my, especially my manager when I was at ASYE because she had such a big influence on me and she'd been a teacher before, she was a social worker as well, so everything was like a teachable moment and she really kind of, and I think because of an age difference, I don't know if you've found this before, but I was the same age as her daughter, that you almost kind of fall into those like, sort of relationship things with managers.

Do you find that? I don't know how you can kind of step away from that, but because you're working with somebody, the dynamics are similar. I'm not saying it's the same work isn't a [00:10:00] family, but. 

Kyrene: Yeah, do you ever get that? Definitely, definitely. I do think, like you said, it's not a family, but there is a family.

I think within a team, there are often, especially a well functioning team, there are roles within that team. You know, you, you get the, the kind of the mummy figures as they can be called. You know, those who check in to make sure people have had their lunch, those who make the tea, those who, you know, you do, you do get those roles, definitely.

Definitely. 

Vicki: Yeah, I kind of remember myself because I was so, like, naive and emotional and you know when some things happened or we were in court and I was kind of deeply like passionate about things that I'd worked with and she would always be kind of really calm really rational but there were times when I was really angry as well and like but why can't we do this why can't we do that and she would kind of be really kind of like almost it was almost like that kind of strict boundary.

That she would have with me, and it wasn't necessarily equal to what [00:11:00] it had been like with my parents, but I just remember that feeling of kind of felt like I was being really defiant sometimes, and she would just be like, no, Vicky, like, this is what it is. This is the legal procedure. This is the process and you feel this way because you've been with this family.

But it is a skill to kind of harness any social worker, but especially ones who are kind of deeply feeling and I guess like newly qualified social workers as well, isn't it? 

Kyrene: Yeah, definitely big time and I think it is a skill that takes time and you're not always going to get it perfect because every social worker is different aren't they and they need different things.

I've worked with social workers who do need that deep emotional support and actually as a manager, as you get to know people, you, you know, okay, that social worker's in court today. I'm going to need to be on the end of the phone at the end of this. And if I, you know, if you're not in court with them, I'm going to need to be at the end of the phone.

Well, let me just check in beforehand. You get to know them over time. Yeah, [00:12:00] absolutely. 

Vicki: How do you use supervision then? Because again, supervision gets a bad rep. So how would you use supervision with a social worker to learn those things about them. 

Kyrene: I think one of the key things for me, and I learned that in my last, in my last team manager role, actually is separating personal supervision and case supervision.

I think lots of us would have experienced kind of having it back to back. How are you? Yeah. Okay. Right. Let's move on to the families you're working with now. So actually what something I learned separating them for me was a really, really. a brilliant skill and it really helped me to understand my social workers through who they were, what meant a lot to them, what were the things that lit a fire in them, what were the things that actually they were more sensitive to because we were able to have that hour that was just about them their own development, their well being.

That, I think, is a key [00:13:00] thing for, and I know we talk about capacity being a real issue for social workers, for managers, but where you can prioritise having that separate wellbeing supervision, I honestly would encourage everybody to do that. And that's where I really believe I've got to understand and know.

The social workers I was working with what the things that were going well, I was able to identify a lot more when they were struggling, when things weren't going too well. And that was really important for me also, because within my last role, it was after COVID and we were very much used to a time where lots of things We're virtual.

And I think at least for the first three months in that role, we were just virtual and I hadn't really met many of them face to face. So being able to have that one to one time was so important because I didn't know that their cues. I didn't know much at all to just have one to one time is, is [00:14:00] important.

Vicki: Yeah, and it makes such a difference as a social worker, doesn't it? When you, and when you know it's that personal time and you know you're not going to get asked about cases and you're not having to answer things or kind of make lists, it's almost the weight off your shoulders, whereas if you think when you know you're going in supervision and it is going to be the, Hi, how are you?

Yeah, great. Okay, next case. I know I'm not going to go in and let out. Everything that's going on, because I'm on a bit of a mission to like, right, I know that we need to get through this case, this and I've got these questions. So I think the preparation for it as a social worker is different. And I guess for a manager, it must be like, you know, you're going into this personal supervision, you kind of set your energy up.

Kyrene: Absolutely. And sometimes with case supervision and let's, if I use an example of a case supervision where maybe actually this particular social workers really struggling at the moment, there's lots of things that aren't in timescales. That's just an example. Actually, you might go into that, that [00:15:00] supervision preparing for somebody who might be feeling quite defensive or somebody who might Already be ready to have a quick response to all of that, they're not going to be in a place to then have a conversation about their genuinely open conversation about how they're feeling their well being what's working really well what's not.

And so I then think that that personal supervision was really important. not really worth much at all. Whereas, so I think you prepare for them both completely differently. And you're able to give more time in that case supervision, thinking about what are the kind of questions are gonna, am I going to ask to get the most out of this social work today?

What are the things we need to explore a little bit more deeply today? And you're, I think, yeah, you prepare for that really separately. 

Vicki: What I'm interested to know what you, because you obviously work and help at the moment, social workers who want to be, or who are looking at management and making that shift, and [00:16:00] you have a guide, which is literally, you know, everything that you need to know about making that shift from social worker to manager, I'm thinking about the work you do and the work that like you one day does young black social worker about how important it is for.

Black female social workers. Or black social workers, male or female, to see people who look like them in social work management. Because I think it was BASWA did, like, it was like a six page like pullout. And in that, I hope I don't get the statistic wrong, but I think it was around 6 percent of either senior management, or it was, or maybe it was the directors of children's services, were, they, I think they used the But we're, we're black or global majority.

Maybe I should check that, but I think it was 6%, which is, I don't want to use the word shocking. So it's not shocking. It's reflective of [00:17:00] a white supremacist system. How important do you think it is for. social work managers to be black global majority to not be a bloody white majority in, you know, 2024.

Kyrene: Yeah. It's so important, Vicky. And I think it's you hear this term a lot, but I really, really believe it is very difficult to be what you can't see. And I was lucky enough to have a parent who was in a managerial position because actually She was my role model. I knew my mom's achieved it. She can do it.

I can absolutely do it. And I had all of that kind of one to one mentoring encouragement on my doorstep, but that is a blessing that that's the reality. Within the workplace more often than not, I didn't see that. I wasn't able to see people that looked like me, in managerial roles. Whilst that I had a, I did have some black managers and that was a great experience [00:18:00] for me because I was able to see what that looked like, how they navigated it, because there were a few things that they did navigate quite differently.

And whilst we never actually at that time had open conversations about how, you know Their race has impacted their social work journey is only on reflection. Now I've been so curious about that, actually thinking, what was that journey like for them, but it is really important that as many black social workers that we see in in practice, we've seen them in managerial roles as well.

And because there are, it's just, it's important that we're able to see that it needs to be. I think our. Senior management needs to be reflective of the communities that we're working with. That, that is so important. 

Vicki: It's not something, and I don't think it's talked about enough still. I know it was like that was covered in, in Basma magazine, but kind of seeing those statistics should be that wake up call that, [00:19:00] We can't ignore the racism in social work and the, the kind of difference in opportunities that are there.

What do you think the steps are that local authorities should be following to kind of see more black social workers moving into management? How, how can those spaces or how do you think those spaces need to change? 

Kyrene: I think there'd be a real benefit to creating separate spaces and pathways for black managers or black aspiring managers when black new managers and actually having separate spaces for them to be able to come together.

And, and there are not that many, but there were a few maybe networks for. new managers for aspiring managers, but I do think there's definitely something about having a separate space and a separate pathway for black aspiring managers. And I think that would be really important. [00:20:00] And actually hearing the experiences of black managers within their roles.

Again, I don't know the statistics about. Managers, black managers who stay within those roles, but having conversations about that, understanding their experiences, when they're not staying, what, what has led to them moving on so that we can learn from those experiences to encourage social workers black social workers to step into those roles.

I remember when going into One of my first managerial roles, I had lots of conversations with black social workers and managers who actually were telling me, You won't last there. There's so much racism. It's a nightmare. You're going to be the only black person in the room. All of those things that did create anxieties in me and actually could have prevented me from going in that direction.

And there needs to be more conversations about that narrative and those experiences of black social workers. 

Vicki: And I guess that's the thing, isn't it? When we're [00:21:00] talking about the challenge of moving to be a manager, it is then another thing to then have to navigate racism in that, because you are then in a position where you've got senior management who statistically majority white kind of on your case, as with every manager, but again, the dynamic of racism added into that, and then you are also having to manage, you know, A team who, you know, depending on who, who your team is, it changes that experience, doesn't it?

And there's, you know, worked with colleagues where they have experienced microaggressions from team members when they're trying to, manage them and I guess that experience may be kind of the feeling or the experience of being undermined. And yeah, it's, it's another layer that isn't covered when people talk about moving into management, is it?

No. 

Kyrene: And how that's dealt with, because as a black social [00:22:00] worker, experiencing microaggressions from your team, you know, depending on your relationship with your manager, it can even be a great one, but there is that underlying feeling of, but they can't get it. Is it worth me having this conversation with them?

Did I get that right, actually? Was that a microaggression? Starting to second guess yourself? You know, so many dynamics that come into that. And often it's then left, it continues, it builds up and builds up, and it creates a real, real challenge for, for Black social workers and Black managers. 

Vicki: Yeah, and I think, I'm like, we have, we're in a profession where there's a bloody process around everything and I don't think processes is the answer to everything, but that often in local authorities, there isn't that process of who do I go?

Where do I, who do I speak to? Where is the safe space? How can I make sure that what I'm saying is being taken seriously? And like you said, it's not that dismissive thing. So then social workers end up, like you said, in that spiral of, oh, was this me? [00:23:00] And that kind of self doubt really. 

Kyrene: Absolutely. 

Vicki: What would you say to people listening, whether they are like managers already or aspiring social workers, who are experiencing that, what would you say to them?

Kyrene: I'd say speak up would be the easy thing to say, but I know in reality that's really difficult. But what I would say is to find somebody that they have identified that they can speak to about it. It might not yet be that person in the managerial role that can actively do something about it, but someone that they can offload to initially have that conversation with and then be able to decide what course of action needs to be taken.

Because I think it is easy to say, speak up, report it. Is, that should happen, shouldn't it? But it is difficult. The reality is really difficult. And I think the key thing for me has been able to find someone that I feel comfortable to share this information with. And kind of let's brainstorm this together.

Let's [00:24:00] have a conversation about how, what steps I feel comfortable to take. Because I think it is about you as an individual taking the steps that you feel comfortable to take. 

Vicki: Yeah, that's a really good point about the kind of speak up narrative. Because if there's no infrastructure to support you, you've spoken up and you're still in that cycle and, you know, if your colleagues, if your white colleagues are being racist and not thinking about, not like reflecting, not making changes to behavior, not admitting that there is an issue, it then causes more harm.

And I guess it's like the emotional labor of the whole process, isn't it? That adds up to it. 

Kyrene: Absolutely. Because you still more often than not have to get up and go into that workplace again tomorrow and the next day. So I think it's about taking the steps that you feel able to and comfortable to with the support of somebody that you [00:25:00] can speak to about it.

Because I think holding it in, keeping it to yourself is a huge burden that I just would not encourage. Having somebody is, is really important. 

Vicki: Well, if. What was the one thing from your mom and her experience in management that you, there's probably more than one thing, but what is one main thing that you've taken from her?

Guidance into your management. 

Kyrene: That's a really, really good question. Actually. What's the one thing I've taken, like you said, there are so many different things that I've taken. One thing I've definitely taken it's probably because our personality types are really similar is that it's okay to be quietly confident.

And actually it's. It's not you don't have to shout the loudest. You don't need to be the person that has their hand up for everything to be competent and be confident. And that was really important for me because that is, that's kind [00:26:00] of my natural position to be more introverted, you know, as, as they say, so that was the biggest takeaway from me that you can be quiet, you can be confident and, and still successful and progress within your roles.

Vicki: That's it. That's interesting because you are like, obviously we met, we've met virtually, but we met in person at Community Care. You have like the calmest energy, I think anyway. You know, you say it to people and they're like, well, my kids wouldn't say that on my apartment. That is very 

Kyrene: true. 

Vicki: You do, you have the, it's, it's just this kind of like, Really grounded, like just standing next to you.

I was like, okay, I'm fine. 

Kyrene: Oh, that's amazing. 

Vicki: And that kind of ties in with you saying, like, if that is how your mum maybe is. And it's just more of like the presence. And I think sometimes I think I'm a waffler anyway. But definitely in social work, kind of the panic, if I'm panicked, I'll be like, whereas like the calm [00:27:00] confidence is sort of that it's I'm okay.

I can be in control of the situation. I don't have to be, like you said, 

Kyrene: like shouting the loudest. Yes, and it's funny you say that actually, Vicky, because I think, especially my last team, that's probably what a lot of them would have said, because that would often be the feedback, that actually, just you being calm, giving me the opportunity to offload and not saying anything in itself.

brought me down and was able, you know, would allow you to think rationally because I think we know the work we do is high pressure, is often high stress, and so just having that calm presence sometimes, yeah, it's a big help. I know that's what I benefit from, so I'm glad that I'm able to do that for others as well.

Vicki: Yeah, and how do you then, Because I often think of it of like when you're trying to, whether you are calm or whether you're trying to present calmly, for example, like I haven't been a manager, but as a conference chair, I'd often kind of [00:28:00] feel like I was just absorbing everybody's tension. So I was kind of doing it to kind of send out this like calm vibe.

How do you then go from kind of having a day where you, you're a manager, you've got social workers offloading on you, you're managing everything yourself, you've got your senior manager, how do you? Then de stress, like how do you maintain that composure Monday to Friday? 

Kyrene: It's, it's tough. And I think the reality is, if I'm really honest, within that team manager role, I, at that time, I did, I did struggle with that a lot of the time especially with having to, to manage that five days a week, and then actually having my own life outside of working hours.

Having to manage all the things that come with your own life, having young children, it was definitely difficult. What was helpful for me was to, as far as possible, because I know it's really difficult as a manager, is to create healthy [00:29:00] boundaries. And there would be times when I knew, actually, guys, I'm not going to be able to answer in the next two hours.

I'm not going to be able to answer your calls. I'll call you back straight after. And sometimes for me, that was. To sit and do nothing and just kind of think for a little bit or catch up on little things that I needed to do. But having that space was really, really important for me to be able to, to manage.

But there were times where I found that that just wasn't possible for me. And I was completely burning out and feeling overwhelmed and not managing it. 

Vicki: Yeah, 

Kyrene: that's the reality. 

Vicki: I like that kind of that having that window of time though, and not having a. something assigned to it, because I would like block out my calendar, but it would literally, it would be like admin or this particular thing or this thing.

Whereas I think just having that hour of space. Yes. A week is a really helpful thing. 

Kyrene: Is, is so helpful because, and [00:30:00] that's how I'd always structure my calendar having what I'd call focus time. So that hour of focus time, it didn't, it wasn't minutes. It wasn't, it was focused time and. If it was Monday, I didn't know how I was going to use that focus time on Thursday because I didn't know what I was going to need.

And sometimes it was to catch up on, on admin, but actually other times it was to take a break that was needed. It wasn't necessarily yeah, any real structure around it, but I needed that time to then be able to come back 

Vicki: in 

Kyrene: my best form. 

Vicki: And yeah. And I think for people, Listening or watching as well, because I say that to new social workers, it's the same for anyone, but it feels like, if I'm saying, you know, get an hour out of your week and set it aside, and people are going, I don't have an hour, I can't do that.

And I'm kind of like, you will definitely spend more than an hour procrastinating because you are overwhelmed, burnt out, in an absolute panic. You will spend an hour kind of faffing about the off, I know I [00:31:00] do, I could spend an hour, we were just talking about it before we did, like scrolling on my phone and trying to zone out and.

That will stress me out more. When I, like, if you look at your screen time, I always think You know how much time you have, and nobody wants to admit it. I never want to admit it, but it's like a hard truth. And so I think, like, you are never going to have enough time in social work. So you might as well carve out that hour without it being completely assigned to anything.

Kyrene: I completely, you need to, I would really, really encourage social workers, managers to do that. You need that time. And it's exactly like you said. I mean, I think you can work 24 hours a day. Sometimes in this role, you will still have more to do. So finding that hour and booking it ahead of time. You know, sometimes I'd look at my diary three weeks or three weeks time.

I've got a gap here. I'm going to stick in that focus time right there thinking, you know, I may not feel like I need it, but no matter what I would take that opportunity to have that focus time. Of course, we know [00:32:00] if there's a crisis, you don't always get that. To take that, but more often than not, it helped me to create those boundaries for myself and then also be able to create those boundaries for social workers within my team.

And they were, they felt more able to take that time because in a way I was role modeling it, you know, they could see that I was taking that time. So it felt, they felt more able to do that as well. 

Vicki: Yeah, that's so, yeah, I've definitely. It's something I didn't always do and then have, like, built through my career.

And I think maybe you get the confidence to do it as well. And I suppose as a manager, or like, people who are watching who are aspiring to be managers, that's probably something they could do now and then take with them into the manager role. And then it's not going to be a shock to the system because they already I guess it's kind of like not fake it till you make it, but almost like I'm going to use that behavior because I know that's what I'm going to do and I'm a manager, maybe.

Kyrene: Yes. No, [00:33:00] absolutely. I think that's the key thing is to start doing if you know there are gaps in some of the things that you do now or could be doing that you don't I say start doing it now because then When you get into that role, it feels a lot more natural. You feel more confident to be able to implement it.

And that focus time, I think is a key one. 

Vicki: So let's talk about your guide then. So it is for social workers who are either going into management, they've got the job, they're moving or aspiring to go into management, or maybe they've got an interview coming up. Why did you write it? And what are social workers going to get from it?

Kyrene: So the reason why I, I wrote it is because It's in a way everything that I had and needed or had or needed when I first went into a, a managerial role. So it is exactly as you said, Vicky, it's for social workers who might have also might have just started that new role, because while it's about [00:34:00] the first four weeks.

The reality is you can't always cram everything within those first four weeks. So I would say don't feel like it's not for you. If you're more than four weeks into your new role, you could still benefit from it. But those who are thinking about going into social work roles and managerial roles, those exactly as you said, who might have interviews coming up and are thinking, you know, what is this going to look like?

And that is, is perfect for you. And I created it because when you first jump in to that managerial role, there are so many things to think about. You're, you've got people who need you from in different directions. You may sometimes have a team who haven't had a manager for a while and need a lot from you.

And you can get so lost in thinking, okay, what do I need to do right now and what can wait? So I kind of created that guide to give a real starting point of the things that you really should be thinking about within those first four weeks so that you've got the best. opportunity to have a successful journey in that role.[00:35:00]

Things around the time you spend with your team, things around how you get familiar with the, the work within your team, all of those things that I've kind of put together to help you on that journey. 

Vicki: And it is, it's really simple and practical, but when you go into that kind of role, I would imagine, because I've not done it, it's, it's almost that like, Oh, where do I start?

Whereas this is like start here and it's got everything, you know, things like audits and stuff that maybe, you know, if you've never done the role before, there are things that you won't know or won't think about. So I really like the, I like the layout of it and I like that it is uncomplicated because when you're going into that role and you're like, ah, whether it's internally or externally.

It's just really good to have that kind of set out for you. And I'll put the links to it in kind of the bottom of the podcast or YouTube. What I wanted to ask, someone asked me this question. I thought it was a really good question. [00:36:00] What is one thing that. you would like people to know about you that they probably don't already know?

Kyrene: Oh, I like that question. 

Vicki: It's a good one, isn't it? Really good 

Kyrene: question. Makes me think, okay, what is one thing that I'd like people to know about me?

I've kind of said it earlier, so I don't know if it defeats the object. The fact that I'm introverted. I think that is a really key thing for me that I'd love people to know. And the reason I say that is because Sometimes people feel that introverted people cannot necessarily, or they will really struggle in managerial roles, or they're not able to get as far in managerial roles, but actually no, I would completely dispel that, that myth.

They absolutely can. And yeah, that's me. I am. Very introverted most of the time. 

Vicki: I think that's a good one because, and until you said it before, even though I've kind of, would associate you having that kind of calm energy, I don't know if I would, [00:37:00] I wouldn't have described you as introverted, I wouldn't have known that about you.

Yes. Yes. Exactly. Yeah. Which is, like I said, if you hadn't have said it before, it wouldn't be a word that I would associate with you, which is actually, it's an important thing, isn't it, to, yeah. It is. And it 

Kyrene: is, and it's about, I think, understanding that about yourself and knowing how to, to manage that. And that's why I came back to just going back to the focus time and setting that time aside, why that was so important for me.

Because yes, I'd be in the midst of doing it all. But I'd be exhausted after I've spoken to so many people that has drained me. You know, I need that time. So having that focus time aside enabled me to then look after myself and give myself what I needed at that time as well. So it's just about finding ways to manage it for yourself.

Vicki: Yeah, that is, I mean, I've got so many things like that, but it's, and it's so good for people who are introverted because sometimes there is this perception like leadership or management as an extroverted. [00:38:00] thing because of the kind of tasks that you're doing and it's that thing you can do all those things and still you don't have to change your personality to fit a role we just have this warped version of like when I do stuff about confidence most people think confidence is like the loudest person in the room often than the least confident person so yeah it's that thing of like you don't have to change your personality to fit this role, like you bring your personality to it, don't you?

Yes, 

Kyrene: absolutely. 

Vicki: Yeah. New favorite question I've got there. I wish people knew that I just don't have my shit together.

I've recently just been like, lots of conversations been having and people say that, Oh, this, you know, what you do is you like really professional. You seem to do all these things. I'm like, I need you to know that my shit is not together. I need you to know that it is like, I'm quite an organized person, but there's just chaos behind everything.

And , I panic about everything. I don't know if I'm [00:39:00] doing the right thing. So, and I think that question makes you. It made me think, well, maybe it needs to just be a thing that people know, rather than, I don't want someone to wait to ask me that question about what you wish people would know about you.

I really 

Kyrene: like it because I also think it does humanizes you because people have kind of ideas of what people are like and how they, based on how they present, but actually no, there's a lot more to many of us, to all of us. 

Vicki: So I think about it all the time now. I'm like, what would, what do I wish people would know?

And then it's like, well, why don't you tell them? Yeah, I wish you knew this about me. So yeah, I love that one. And then my final question, which I ask every guest is the piece of advice that you would go back and give your newly qualified self. 

Kyrene: Oh, I like that question as well. The piece of advice I'd go back and give my newly qualified self is, Just [00:40:00] to believe in myself and continue to believe that I can do it and you will, and you're, you're going to achieve it.

And I say that, and I said this, I think I had a conversation somewhere, somewhere else at some point where I was saying, again, going back to quiet confidence, what that also meant is that it also allowed people to underestimate me. Yes. You know, thinking that actually, are you ready for this role? Are you able to achieve this?

And whilst I think deep down, I believed I was, it did allow me to do a lot of second guessing. So I think if I could go back, I would tell myself that, no, you can absolutely do this. Believe in yourself and you're going to achieve it. 

Vicki: I love that. That's perfect. And I think for people, there will be people listening who actually need, needed that from you as well today or watch it.

So thank you. How can people, and like, I'll put all the links below, but how can people find [00:41:00] you if they want to know more or want to get in touch with you? 

Kyrene: So my Instagram is one of the best places to get me, which is at the SW Mentor. So yeah, feel free you can have a chat with me on there. I also that's my main platform to be honest.

My emails as well, info at the social work mentor co uk. So I'd say those are the best two places to get in contact with me. I do have a, mailing list as well, where I send out weekly newsletters which are focused on leadership. And again, it's not just for social workers who are Well, it is for those who are new and aspiring social work managers, but actually I think all social workers can benefit from thinking about leadership and just understanding things around leadership.

So 

Vicki: yeah, 

Kyrene: I'd encourage you to sign up to that as well. 

Vicki: Amazing. And people can listen to the social work leaders podcast. It's on [00:42:00] Spotify. Yeah. And it's on Apple. And on Apple as well. Okay, perfect. So I'll put all the links below, but thank you very, very much for coming on today. 

Headset Microphone (Sennheiser SCx5 USB MS)-4: Thank you so much for listening to this episode.

Headset Microphone (Sennheiser SCx5 USB MS): Like I said at the start, if you enjoyed it, if you took something from it, please take a couple of seconds to leave a rating or a review 

I always love it when I hear back from you about the impact of the podcast. So feel free to email me as well.

Anything specific mentioned in this podcast episode will be in the show notes.

And here are some reminders of how we can stay in touch,

along with the ways that I can help you become a calm and confident social worker.

Firstly, I have a free newsletter, The Space. This is a weekly email sent out to students and newly qualified social workers.

With curated links and recommended reading and listening that I know you will find useful in your newly qualified year.

Secondly, I have an amazing membership, the collective. This is an online membership for students and newly qualified social workers.

Headset Microphone (Sennheiser SCx5 USB MS)-6: When you join, you get access to a learning hub full of bite sized video resources [00:43:00] and downloadable eGuides. 

Headset Microphone (Sennheiser SCx5 USB MS): These are all specifically focused on the tasks, the policy, the legislation, the theory and the practice skills that you need in your first year as a social worker.

We have a private Facebook group where you can access a weekly Q& A thread for any questions, queries or reflections that you have.

Members are also invited to a monthly live zoom call with me, where we have a Q and A, but also take time for mindfulness, reflection, and meditation.

The collective is for students and newly qualified social workers who want solution focused, practical support, advice, and mentoring from me.

If you align with any of the values of Social Work Sorted, if you are looking for realistic, practical advice, if you are a strength based and solution focused person, 

If you often feel overwhelmed and crave resources that are bite sized, digestible, easy to access, available for you to watch again and again.

Rooted in the practical skills, but also [00:44:00] underpinned by theory, then the collective is for you.

Headset Microphone (Sennheiser SCx5 USB MS)-7: Head to the show notes where you'll find the link to join. 

Headset Microphone (Sennheiser SCx5 USB MS): Thirdly, I have e book guides and video courses available

For students and new social workers.

Who are looking for support and clarity in specific area, the child and family assessment guide, the home visit guide, risk in child protection masterclass and a home visit masterclass as well. Again, all the details are in the show notes.

As well as all this, I'm available to come and deliver training in person to your student or ASYE cohort.

Whether it's a skills day, part of an ASYE induction, a keynote speech, or a guest lecture, 

please don't hesitate to get in touch with me for an informal chat to find out more.

Thank you so much for listening. Like I do at the end of every single podcast, I want to encourage you to slow down

and take a pause with me before you go on to the rest of your day. Close your eyes if it feels comfortable,

or just soften your gaze.[00:45:00]

Take a couple of deep breaths. And enjoy this moment of calm. Know that you can come back to this at any time you need to. 

Headset Microphone (Sennheiser SCx5 USB MS)-8: Remember, you are doing an incredible job. Take care, and I'll see you for the next episode.