Whether you're currently an investor or looking to invest, learn how sustainable investing can help you fight climate change and protect clean water, while also earning you money. Today's podcast features a conversation with Zach Stein, Cofounder of Carbon Collective, Vicki Benjamin, President and Co-founder of Karner Blue Capital and Jon Scott, Director of Corporate Relations and Legacy Gifts at Clean Water Action. Clean Water Action recently launched a new member benefit, a sustainable cash management solution that lets you earn more on your cash and do it in ways that are good for our water and our climate. Learn more at www.cleanwaterwallet.org.
Make a special gift to support our podcast today at www.cleanwater.org/donate
Whether you're currently an investor or looking to invest, learn how sustainable investing can help you fight climate change and protect clean water, while also earning you money. Today's podcast features a conversation with Zach Stein, Cofounder of Carbon Collective, Vicki Benjamin, President and Co-founder of Karner Blue Capital and Jon Scott, Director of Corporate Relations and Legacy Gifts at Clean Water Action. Clean Water Action recently launched a new member benefit, a sustainable cash management solution that lets you earn more on your cash and do it in ways that are good for our water and our climate. Learn more at www.cleanwaterwallet.org.
Make a special gift to support our podcast today at www.cleanwater.org/donate
Zach Stein (00:01):
The science is clear. We have to increase investments in, into climate solutions by 10 to 20 times over what we are doing today per year. At the same time, we have to stop investing in any new fossil fuel expansion and start winding down that industry to it being a fraction of its size today by 2050.
Jenny Vickers (00:28):
Hello, everyone. Welcome to we all live downstream clean water action podcast. In each episode, we will be interviewing leading environmental and clean water activists about their work in the field. We'll dive deep into topics from drinking water and climate change to environmental justice, plastic pollution, and toxic chemicals. I'm your host, Jenny Vickers. HBB the national communications manager for clean water action. Today. We have a very special podcast with some special guests. I'm excited to introduce you to we're talking about sustainable investments today. We'll get into what that is in a little bit clean water action recently launched a new member benefit, a sustainable cash management solution that lets you earn more on your cash and do it in ways that are good for our water and our climate. So joining us today to chat about sustainable investing, our Zach Stein co-founder of Carbon Collective, Vicky Benjamin, president and co-founder of Karner Blue Capital, and John Scott, director of corporate relations and legacy gifts here at clean interaction. Welcome to we all live downstream. So happy to have you all here today.
Jon Scott (01:37):
Great to be here.
Zach Stein (01:39):
Hey everyone.
Jenny Vickers (01:40):
So first off before we get started can you tell our listeners a little bit more about yourselves where you live, what you do
Zach Stein (01:47):
Happy to jump in first here. I live in the bay area near Berkeley. I'm the co-founder of carbon collective. My name is Zach Stein. 32, I have six month old. So life is very hectic and very full in a really nice way. Right now.
Vicki Benjamin (02:05):
I'm Vicki Benjamin. I live in Bethesda, Maryland. I was a big four partner for 10 years in investment management and then was the CFO of Calver investments. And then finally president of Calver investments before the sale of its asset after the sale of its asset state advance, at which point I co-founded with the general council of Karner Blue Capital, which is a S E C registered investment management firm centered round nature based investing through basically academic and financial research.
Jon Scott (02:42):
Great. And I'm John Scott. I just learned that I'm the longest serving clean water action employee. I'm based in New Hampshire, but I am a Washington DC native and I've worked for a clean water action for 41 years. And one reason I'm very excited to have this conversation is a lot of people don't know this clean water action is one of the first national environmental organizations to adopt a fossil fuel free investment policy for the organization itself to offer some fossil fuel free retirement options for its employees. And now we've launched a new product that we'll get to talk about later that helps people with sustainability and better returns on their cash.
Jenny Vickers (03:25):
Thank you so much. So let's get started before we get into all the details and tools that we are gonna talk about later on, I just wanna start with the basics. Tell me more, what is sustainable investing?
Zach Stein (03:41):
So sustainable investing is something that we have to do to solve our greatest problem to us at carbon collective. That greatest problem within sustainability is climate change. If we are not able to solve it and put us on path to reaching a zero carbon world within the next 30 years, it's going to make a lot of the other challenges that we're facing fairly moot. And we know what we have to do to solve climate change. It is a solvable problem and it comes through invest. The science is clear. We have to increase investments into climate solutions by 10 to 20 times over what we are doing today per year. At the same time, we have to stop investing in any new fossil fuel expansion and start winding down that industry to it being a fraction of its size today by 2050, if we are able to do that, we'll give ourselves a good shot as a planet at reaching a zero carbon world where we avoid catastrophic warming. If we don't, if we don't change how we invest, it's gonna make it very challenging to do that. It be very unlikely. So fundamentally to us, sustainable investing is investing that aligns with that reality, because it's gonna put us in a position as a species to operate sustainably, especially in the face of climate change.
Vick Benjamin (04:57):
Now, Jenny, I'll add on to that. I come from the world of socially responsible investing or a earlier Genesis of sustainable investing, but investing for the enhancement and the good of society. My perspective's a little bit different than Zach's in that I believe there is an underlying in order to have a successful investing thesis, you need to be able to provide returns to underlying investors. And I agree with Zach that we need to fix the ills of the planet, which are climate change and biodiverse plus. But I also believe that even in the, in the intermediate and longer term investing spectrum, that investors can reap better than market returns by investing in those companies. Those are leaders in climate change leaders in nature's impacts by investing in those companies. They actually can also invest in their future and their retirement by providing for themselves financially. And so by giving a compelling financial thesis to sustainable or socially responsible investing, which I think is there you can actually motivate and juggernaut investing and moving forward the capital markets towards the greater good.
Jon Scott (06:21):
And I, I'm just gonna jump on and add in, in addition to the specific issues that Vicky and Zach called out, the clean water issue is closely tied to the exact kind of solutions they're talking about as are many other social issues that folks who are listening to this may care about like racial justice, gender equity, LGBTQ issues and they're all tied together. And so an investment that's gonna do well on climate and water and biodiversity in nature. There's a very good chance those same companies will outperform or do well and do good on some of those other areas we care about too.
Jenny Vickers (07:01):
So we hear a lot about greenwashing. Can you, you know, talk about this a little bit more and explain what that is.
Zach Stein (07:08):
Sure. So I'll take this one. Zach from carbon collective. So greenwashing is a phenomenon when a company puts forth language that is really positive about what it's trying to do to solve some of these issues that we just talked about, but it's actions don't add up to that. And fundamentally you can boil it down to the phrase. Talk is cheap. It's much cheaper for an oil company to run an advertising campaign than to change its business model. With that, there's been some famous examples of greenwashing, for example BP British petroleum is getting sued right now for a series of ads that ran in 2019 in the UK showing all it was doing to be beyond petroleum. When in fact, 96% of its investments were still going right into perpetuating its use and long term investment into the fossil fuel industry. Only 4% were going into moving beyond petroleum. So that is just false and that is the falsehood of greenwashing. And it, and it is unfortunately the ecosystem that all of us as sustainable investors or investors who are trying to push this forward play in, because there's been so much of this in this space, again, that makes it really confusing to navigate.
Vicki Benjamin (08:27):
We also hear now in the news, especially about greenwashing being, not so much on a company level, but on investing strategies and that a lot of investors that invest in ESG strategies and we've seen actually two large S E C matters being resolved against BNP. Sorry about that Bank of New York Mellon. And recently I believe it was Deutsche Bank about greenwashing, their ESG strategies. And I'd like to peel back the onion a little bit on that. Basically what they're saying is by applying just an ESG filter, if you would so taking maybe it's sustain analytics or Ms or CS or ratings, and just applying that as a one filter on a portfolio doesn't necessarily make it sustainable or socially responsible, or even an ESG leader that you actually have to look at those factors and consider are those factors material to the underlying sector material to the underlying company. And is that company really better? Are they actually a leader? And so that's why I often say to folks, well, how do you eliminate greenwashing? And you've selected an ESG portfolio, how are you sure it's right. Investors have to do due diligence. They have to peel back the onion and look at the underlying managers they're investing in and see that those strategies are con they're values. Look at what the holdings are and look at the underlying factors they're evaluating their portfolios on it's really, the investor has to really perform some due diligence.
Jenny Vickers (10:16):
So you, you said ESG, can you explain to our listeners what that is?
Vicki Benjamin (10:21):
ESG came out in the early nineties, it was developed basically it came from socially responsible investing. It was in March, the socially responsible investing started with anti-apartheid strategies actually by my old firm Calvert. And folks realized that people needed more, better solutions, more than one theme. They wanted to look at overall metrics on companies. And so ESG G strategies and data came into Vogue, started to evolve in the 1990s. And now what it is, it's a set of criteria. There's over 800 vendors with environmental, social and governance ESG criteria that they evaluate companies on. And you can select any of these, these vendors. Some of them are, are very well known. Most of them are very well used. And they are applied to all of the 11 industry sectors to determine leaders on certain environmental governance and social factors. And just one more quick point governance was though that information was always available through S E C regulations, such as, you know, board diversity independence of board members, et cetera. So the governance factors were pretty much there. And then the environmental factors thank thankfully to Bloomberg and C DP, which was greenhouse gas emissions also became very public in the two thousands. And now we're moving on down the spectrum into more social issues, which John mentioned an even more deeper understanding of carbon issue. So it's an exciting time, but again, my overarching point is, you know, the investor needs to be where and needs to peel back the onion and do some due diligence on what they're investing in.
Jenny Vickers (12:10):
So why can it be hard to separate investment options that are genuinely focused on sustainability versus those that are greenwashing to fit in?
Zach Stein (12:19):
I think that this could be a very hard space to navigate and to understand look, especially for the average person who's saying, ah, I have my 401k, or I have my IRA there's, it can take a lot of time to try and pick up that decision and look at it and be like who to trust in this space who is greenwashed and, and who is actually doing things that are aligned with solving whatever their mission is. So there are some really good free tools out there to help you evaluate one that we use a lot and direct people to this is especially on climate change is from a group called as you. So they do proxy voting out of Berkeley and they have a tool called fossil free fuels.org, where you can enter the ticker of any mutual fund or ETF and see exactly the makeup in it of fossil fuels within it.
That can be re and it has a letter grade and all of that. It's not a perfect tool, but it can give you directionality of building those portfolios. Part of what is hard is that in, this is part of why carbon collective exists is that we see portfolios that are labeled as climate impact, for example, that have more fossil fuel companies in them than climate solution companies, companies that are building solutions to climate change. And that to us doesn't make that much sense. So unfortunately it's still a pretty hard space to navigate and find those places that you trust. Now, there are some groups like Vicky's former organization Calvert and proses and brown advisory, where it's gonna be a little bit more expensive, but that's what they did. That's what they got started in. So going to those, you could be fairly confident that you're gonna be getting something that's gonna remove a lot of the bad stuff out of there. But you are gonna pay a little bit more
Vicki Benjamin (14:10):
As you sow is a great source and they have a lot of not just carbon. They also have weapon screens, et cetera. So that, that is going back to the point of doing due diligence. Also most retail investors are in mutual funds that have fact sheets and also have to produce their holdings on a quarterly basis. So scan the annual report, scan the semi in report, see if the mutual fund isn't invested in and things that you believe in. I also have to say though that often it's not that easy. You can't always say that a comp it's binary, sometimes companies do things that are good behind the curtain that aren't as easily easy to discern. And, and so you, you might have to really do a little bit more D digging and research, but there are tools out there. And especially now there's a lot of availability on the internet of where to look for information.
Jon Scott (15:11):
I would also add, there are, there are a few nonprofits in addition to, as you so that that will help people. And that was one of our reasons behind offering the clean water wallet tool for, for our members and the public. You know, we're, we're not endorsing it, I guess, in a technical sense, but trusting, trusting a source, trusting a recommendation from someone, you know, that's a key part of sustainable investing and it's important to get started and recognize it's, it's a learning and evolving process. It's not get everything right on day one because our world is changing every day. So you have to get started.
Jenny Vickers (15:54):
Yeah. So you know, there might be people listening that may not think of themselves as investors. So whether you're an investor you're new to investing or thinking about investing, you've never invested. It's important to know that everyone is an investor, even if we don't realize it. Can you talk a little bit more about this?
Jon Scott (16:15):
Yeah, I, was gonna say first, I mean, anyone that does that receives a paycheck, does business with a bank borrows money <laugh> or has any kind of retirement savings. You are an investor. The question is really, are you passive? In other words, it's just something you're allowing to happen and you have no control over it, or are you in charge of it? And that's especially important today. I think with the issues we're talking about. And also when you take charge, you're in charge of not just making sure that your money is being used in ways that align with your values. You know, so if you, for example, if you wanna make sure your money is not being used to invest in flooding the marketplace with more guns, then you can take charge of that. But it's also the other aspect, which is when you take charge, you also take charge of the financial return you get from your investments, and that's available for really anybody starting with where and how you manage your cash and continuing to your retirement savings and other kinds of savings.
Jenny Vickers (17:22):
Does anyone else wanna add to that?
Zach Stein (17:25):
I think John is pretty comprehensive.
Jenny Vickers (17:28):
<Laugh> yeah. Thank you, John. So, you know, you were saying, we have the opportunity to have, you know, far greater control over investments, how we invest, how much we might earn our investments. What kinds of impacts, whether positive or negative as you've been talking about can flow from our investments, even our cash how much control we have over all of these questions. So we do have choices. So just talk a little bit more about the choices that we do have.
Vicki Benjamin (17:58):
So I guess I'll start that. Well, most of the time we, as John mentioned, investors start out investing in their 401k and their savings from work. So you see a lot of, when you go to invest in a 401k plan, it's comprised of mutual funds. So retail investors invest in a pool of, of securities. And like I, I said earlier, it's up to you to, to spend a bit of time because it is the most important investment you make other than your home is your retirement assets. So you should you owe it to yourself to look at the options your company has displayed for investing and asking for them to give more sustainable options. Like some of, of what we're, we we're both, all of us are talking about in the plans. Additionally, you also have options as far as your checking account and your cash.
And John was gonna talk a little bit about clean waters initiatives around cash saving programs. And then as you move along the age spectrum, there's more products that are available for larger investments. And those are traditionally called separately managed accounts where you actually have your own little mutual fund that you can toggle and invest in securities that you personally prefer. But what's wonderful. And I, I don't think SP mentioned, and especially in, in what, what we're, we're doing around biodiversity and climate change is often those initiatives were exclusive to high net worth individuals through venture. And now there's a lot of opportunities that through Zach Carter blue capital clean water for retail investors to get involved, and it's exciting.
Jon Scott (19:57):
And by retail investors, you mean sort of your regular person who, you know, may have a few hundred dollars or a few thousand dollars to invest, not necessarily hundreds of thousands or millions. Right?
Vicki Benjamin (20:08):
Exactly, exactly. Rather than high net worth investors or institutional investors. And I know that's gotta resonate with you and Zach, and I would say Zach probably sees a lot of interest in that space from, from traditional retail investors and especially millennials.
Zach Stein (20:26):
Yeah, I'll add onto that. Part of our theory of change at carbon collective is that we need to fundamentally redefine what sustainable investing means. If we are going to be able to solve climate change, and that doesn't happen when one rich person decides to change their mind, it is bottom up. It is headcount that matters in this. And so that's part of how we build our strategies is to enable anyone, whether we have people that have $10 that are with us, we have people that have millions of dollars that are with us to be able to invest in strategies that make sense financially, but have that clear theory of change, which for us is focused around climate.
Jon Scott (21:08):
And to that I would add and this is appropriate for a water organization. Cash is often referred to as a liquid asset and clean water action would say, it's our second most important liquid asset by liquid asset, we mean that you can get at it when you need it day to day <laugh> immediately. But our most important liquid asset is obviously clean water. And both of those are often neglected when it comes to investing. And we wanna change that. And by we, I mean, everyone on this call, everyone listening to that and for every investor, starting with your cash is a great way to get started on a more sustainable investing. And by that, I mean, the money that's sitting right now in a checking or savings account, just as one example, or even in a cash account of an investment company, it's almost true across the board.
Cash tends to be neglected in the world of sustainable investing. And when you have your money in a checking savings or money market account, that money's being used by the financial institution for whatever they want <laugh> and you're getting paid next to nothing on it. And in today's environment, that means you're probably losing money to inflation and that's not a good situation. And so when we talk a little bit later about the clean water wallet tool, we're setting out to change that and give people a chance to earn more and do good with our cash at the same time.
Jenny Vickers (22:36):
So many of us are living paycheck to paycheck and only have a little bit saved for retirement. So how are my choices going to matter?
Vicki Benjamin (22:47):
I can, I can start off on that. Well, we've gone through a lot of our investing options. We have the clean water wallet. We have Zach's RVO advisor and separately managed account center centered around climate change. We have blue capital's options, and you can see that by investing, using your dollars to invest, not only to invest for financial returns and financial stability, but you can also invest for change because you're moving capital towards good and taking it away from companies say an Exxon that are not doing good. And so I think that this is, you know, it's pivotal, it's pivotal, and it's also iterative and in a way for us to help sustain the planet.
Jon Scott (23:36):
I would also add, I mean, I count myself a small investor. <Laugh> my kids are small investors. There's a lot more of us than there are the investors and there's definitely strength in numbers. And so if every person listening to this was motivated to change their retirement plan or how their money is allocated in their retirement savings or move their checking and savings accounts to a place that gives 'em better return and, and pays attention to climate and clean water issues. We come out ahead that changes things dramatically, and we've seen that over and over again. Investors can actually change our economy, the practices of big companies. We are the, we are the powerful lever that moves the gigantic Boulder.
Zach Stein (24:25):
Yeah, this is one of the questions that we get a lot at carbon collective of saying, you know, these are all publicly traded stocks and bonds. What is making that change? How, how does that actually make tangible change in the world? And there's three ways with it. The first is the cost of capital for these companies, especially when we think about things like our retirement accounts, we often will hold a given company in that for many, many years, 30 years, that's effectively taking that stock out of the actively traded supply. So it reduces the supply of that stock that leads to that stock performing better, especially when we're doing that in mass, because it's just simple supply and demand. That's how stock prices are set. And when the price of a stock is higher, that company can get, they can borrow capital or they can sell more stock, more cheaply.
So it allows them to expand faster. So that that's number one is cost for capital. Number two is voting when you own a stock in a company, it, it is a weird form of democracy and you get to vote on core issues to the company. Management will have a position. Often activist investors might have a counter position to that, and you can vote to force a company to do something that doesn't wanna do. That's part of being publicly traded. And that is something, especially if you're just in a passively invested, let's say, you know, Vanguard retirement date fund, those votes are, you're just giving away those votes to be voted on by Vanguard. You don't have that control, and there's not a coalition around that. And then the third, this is really intangible. But it is maybe the most powerful, which is narrative.
And I think we're gonna touch on this a little bit more, but part of the publicly available information that influences stock prices and therefore influences the cost of capital is the narrative around different investment choices. And we all live in two narratives around sustainable investing right now that are unfortunately still ubiquitous. One is that fossil fuels are a necessary evil for investment performance. And two that sustainable investing is fundamentally an active charity that in doing so you are going to perform a little bit worse than you would overall in the market, given that those are narratives that are broadly held, they actually become self-fulfilling prophecies in the stock market, because all the changes there are just based upon what investors think in that. And so the narratives and changing that is a really key part of how we actually move this and move sustainable investing very much forward. And it's something that as sustainable investors, we should all be really focused on in changing.
Vicki Benjamin (27:06):
So I'd like to just jump in there a bit. I agree with everything Zach, Zach just said, but I'd also like to add most investors other than retirement asset investors, but most folks that are doing the trading in the market are short term investors. And, and by that, I mean a one year timeframe. So for if you're in and I, our our secure, our products are all fossil fuel free right now. If you're in the last six months, energy has very much outperformed. So short term investors because of the war in Ukraine, short term, investors have profit profited on that, but in my case, and I think I can speak for Zach. I believe that the intermediate term and the long term solutions that are powerful and, and, and react to, and, and a ameliorate the problem with climate change and those with biodiversity loss are gonna outperform for our investors. So, and you do not need to expect, and there should never be concessionary returns for investors. These philosophies and I investing strategies pay off. You may see short term blips because a lot of this is surrounding new technologies that the planet desperately needs. It creates a little bit earlier term volatility, but in the intermediate and long term, we're all gonna see these dividends paid. You know, we're all gonna see dividends in these strategies.
Jenny Vickers (28:38):
Yeah. You, you know, you've touched us, touched on this a little bit. But if there's someone's listening today what can they do to get started and take charge today? Like, is there a trade off between doing good or earning more in your money? If you invest sustainably, should you expect low returns and how can people get started?
Zach Stein (29:00):
So we get this question all the time. And the one thing that we cautioned to say at the beginning, this is on the point that Vicky touched on, which is if you are looking to be a short term investor over the next year, then everything I'm about to say is ignore it. But for us, we're really focused on long term investing. What are the 10, 20, 30 year time horizons things that we're looking towards retirement. And when we zoom out and look at that window we start to see some really clear trends. One of them, which is from the year I was born until today, if you had not included, if you had divested from fossil fuels in the S and P 500, you would've performed better over that entire time horizon. The era of fossil fuels being a necessary evil for long term performance seems to be over.
And then when we look ahead, we can see that that industry is being outcompeted in many areas in which it's had market dominance, take transportation, for example, 50% of the oil that we use in the us goes on our roadways. So our cars and trucks, we have a fundamentally better technology. Now it is faster, stronger, roomier, quieter, more convenient, because you can charge it at home. It, it costs a 10th as much to maintain because it has far fewer moving parts in it. And in the next five years, it'll cost as much upfront as a gas powered car, it's called an electric car. It, it is a fundamentally better driving experience, whether you're a greedy like me or not. And so we, that is a lot of oil's market share that is going away from it. And it's unclear where that's being replaced by same thing in the electricity sector with coal and natural gas, solar, wind, and batteries are generally the cheapest form of generating electricity around the world. And that is only becoming more so in many areas. So it's also being outcompeted there. So any time you deviate from the market, as Vicky was saying, you're gonna have deviating returns. That is just natural. That's gonna come with any solution you do that is doing any ethical focus with this. But over the long term, we believe that it is a much smarter way to invest with just the broad market trends. This is without any type of legislation or anything coming in, which would only further accelerate that
Vicki Benjamin (31:22):
I just wanted to add to something. Zach said an exception when he's talking about the returns for cash at least with the, the clean water wall product that clean water action is offering to our members in the public. You can actually expect better returns than on your cash sitting in a checking or savings account in the bank. And very simply put that's because this is a product that is offered by what's called a FinTech. It's a virtual financial institution, as opposed to a brick and mortar one. The overhead is very low. The carbon footprint is very low. And right now with market prices going up and down every day and scaring people people are paying more attention to their cash. They perceive it as being safer. And we'll do a separate podcast about the clean water wallet that goes into detail more on it, but basically it's an account that you open.
You, you move cash into it from an existing checking or savings account, or you have your direct pay deposit in it. And, and you allocate your money between an F D I C insured account that will pay currently it's paying about five times what you can get on a traditional checking or savings account, possibly higher than that. And there are some other investment options. There are bond funds, relatively stable compared to stocks. Bond fund returns are going up right now, cuz interest rates are going up. So you can actually do quite well with short term savings of cash using the clean water wallet. That's not a guarantee and none of this stuff we're talking about, I should just put in this disclaimer, none of this stuff we're talking about is guaranteed investments inherently involve some risk and trade off. You need to be aware of that. And you also need to be aware that we're not giving you advice. We're telling you we're sharing from our personal and professional experience. And but there's a lot of good stuff to, to work with. And, and our goal is to help you get started.
Jenny Vickers (33:37):
So we love to end our podcast with a call to action. So if you wanna lead the audience with one thing and one action they can take, what would that be?
Vicki Benjamin (33:48):
I guess I'll start. I would say that we all have control over our financial future and that we owe it to ourselves and the generations that come to invest with our values. And that requires a little bit of work on our, our, our side. Folks should learn where their retirement dollars are being spent and to evaluate options if they're not in accordance with their, their values.
Zach Stein (34:11):
Yeah. I would echo that when we at carbon collective, we get the question. A lot of climate change is huge. I'm one person, what should I do? This is really overwhelming. And where we like to point people to is start with the big things. Because the nice thing about the big things is you pick up the decision and it's hard. It is like what Vicky said. It is not a simple decision to make of, you're gonna change your retirement safe act. That's a really important pool of money to you. But once you do that research and do it, then you get to move on. You're, it's done. You get to live your life. It's not, you choose walking down the grocery store aisle being like, oh, am I gonna be a pescatarian or a vegetarian this week? The decision fatigue is really not there. So looking at the parts of your life, whether this is where's your retirement account, where are you banking? Where is your cash kept? How do you get the electricity for your home? How do you transport yourself? These aren't one big, but one time decisions that you could make. And it could be some of the most impactful ones that you can have. So focus on the big stuff.
Jon Scott (35:18):
And my, my call to action is quite simple. Just go to clean water, wallet.org, exactly. Like it sounds like, and sign up, move some of your cash, see what it's like to earn more and do good on your cash and support clean water action at the same time.
Jenny Vickers (35:36):
Well, thank so much Zach Vicky and John for joining us today. If you want to actually quickly add your website links in for folks that wanna visit you, I'm sure they could do a Google search, but if you wanted to include your website links too.
Zach Stein (35:51):
So we're at carbon collective.co. We build comprehensive portfolios that can give you a similar level of risk and reward as what you'd get in a generic us based index fund, but that are fully divested from fossil fuels, reinvesting that portion into the company's building solutions to climate change, and then holding the rest of the economy, because these are the companies who, whose core business can exist in a zero carbon world to pressure them, to get there as quickly as possible. So it's carbon collective.com and thank you so much for having me.
Jenny Vickers (36:22):
Hmm. Thank you, Vicky. Can you include your link?
Vicki Benjamin (36:26):
Yes. It's www.karnerbluecapital.com. We are an SEC registered investment advisor that offers 10 separately managed accounts and a mutual fund all centered about around leaders in nature solutions. And we are women owned and led.
Jon Scott (36:44):
And I'm gonna repeat the clean water information as well. That's www.cleanwaterwallet.org.
Jenny Vickers (36:54):
Awesome. Thank you. Thanks to all of our listeners for, for joining us today as well, and go check out those websites. Learn more about the work of clean water action, too. Visit cleanwater.org. We are celebrating our 50th birthday this year. It's the 50th anniversary of the clean water act. It couldn't be a better time to start investing in sustainable ways to protect clean water, fight, climate change and do good in the world. We encourage you to become a member too. So we can continue our work for another 50 years. You can visit our website and click on the donate button to become a member of our organization. We are a nonprofit, your donations, keep our engines running and allow us to continue to fight for healthier communities for all. Be sure to subscribe, to clean water actions, podcast. We all live downstream available on Spotify, iTunes, Google play, and all of your favorite podcast streaming apps. Thank you so much, Zach Vicky and John. Bye everyone.
Jon Scott (37:51):
Thanks, bye.
Zach Stein (37:52):
Thank you.