Questions to Ask When Calling a Treatment Center

Catch our exciting announcement about the upcoming intervention and admissions training in Birmingham, Alabama this October!

Curious about the key questions to ask when seeking addiction treatment for a loved one? We discuss the importance of effective training and how families can better understand recovery and clinical modalities. Discover why being well-prepared and educated is crucial for making informed decisions, and the value of well-attended training sessions that leave participants not just satisfied but delighted.

Navigating the complexities of choosing the right treatment center can be overwhelming, especially with financial barriers in the way. We share insights on the crucial role of interventionists in crisis situations, the need for stabilizing individuals before making treatment decisions, and the frustrating lack of communication between treatment teams. Learn from our experiences as we highlight the necessity of clear roles and collaboration to ensure effective treatment outcomes.

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:03

Welcome to the Party Wreckers podcast, hosted by professional interventionists Matt Brown and Sam Davis. This is a podcast for families or individuals with loved ones who are struggling with addiction or alcoholism and are reluctant to get the help that they need. We hope to educate and entertain you while removing the fear from the conversation. Stay with us and we'll get you through it. Please welcome the Party Wreckers, matt Brown and Sam Davis.

Speaker 2: 0:40

Welcome back everybody. I'm Matt. This is Sam. We are the Party Wreckers and we're glad to have you here with us. Some of you may be watching us live right now on YouTube or Facebook. The others will be listening to this after the fact on our podcast channels. But thank you for being here, sam how you doing.

Speaker 3: 0:57

I'm doing, okay, a little excited to be live on YouTube and Facebook. I don't think we've done that before, have we? No, it's been a while We've gone live on.

Speaker 2: 1:06

TikTok, but I don't know that we've ever gone live on Facebook or YouTube.

Speaker 3: 1:09

Yeah, the pressure's on, isn't it A little bit Can't?

Speaker 2: 1:13

edit out the live.

Speaker 3: 1:15

You know, what we do is what they see, so we better be on point.

Speaker 2: 1:18

That's right. There's no editing this mess today, is there?

Speaker 3: 1:20

Yeah, I'm glad Lexi got me hooked up with and you were, you know, both of y'all got me hooked up with this new podcast equipment. Yeah, you sound good, you sound real good on your. Yeah, yeah, I'm, I'm liking it. You know, I just gonna, I'm gonna have to have her every time to like hook it up and all, because I don't know what I'm doing. I really don't. Ah, you'll figure it out. It's been a while since we've been live, we've been traveling, we both have been going in different directions. There were some equipment issues. I want to commit to everyone and to you that to do this every week at least podcast every right on. You know, maybe not always live, but at least do a podcast every week.

Speaker 2: 2:03

Absolutely. Now you talk about travel. How was?

Speaker 3: 2:06

Switzerland. Man, it was good. You know, the Europeans have a lot of things figured out that we don't have figured out. You know, one thing is traffic. They got their roundabouts. I mean, this is all of Europe. We were in Switzerland, Austria, Germany, roundabouts everywhere All those three countries. We probably went through four stoplights the whole time, or stop signs.

Speaker 2: 2:26

Now, when I first moved to my town here in Bend, I hated roundabouts. There's roundabouts everywhere here and I couldn't stand them. But now I'm a fan. After being here so long and seeing the purpose that they serve and how they keep things moving, I like them a lot. I think you're right, yeah, they work, they work, they definitely work.

Speaker 3: 2:46

Keep the flow moving. I like them a lot. I think you're right. Yeah, they work, they work. They definitely work. Keep the flow moving. I thoroughly enjoyed it. Another thing is the food is that their food is much more healthier than ours. We ate. I mean, we didn't balk at the food we ate and we didn't really have to seek out excellent restaurants. We would just look at one and say, oh, let's stop here and see if and it would be excellent food, and we ate, and ate. And had dessert after every dinner and lost weight when we got back.

Speaker 2: 3:15

Now, you guys were doing a fair amount of hiking, though, too, right.

Speaker 3: 3:18

Um, yeah, you know certainly more than we do here, but it really was the quality of the food and the lack of of crap crap that we have in our food over here. We came back, landed in Philly airport and starving to death, and we got some food at a Philly egg rolls or something like that, and she got a turkey wrap. It was just disgusting. It's just disgusting. Another thing is that we are loud people in this country. Every place has to have a bunch of TVs going with a bunch of games and a bunch of broadcasters. They're really overly excited about the game, talking about sports 24-7 up on the TVs and these bars. And we landed in Zurich, switzerland, and one thing that I immediately noticed is how quiet the airport was. No senseless babble. We got a lot of senseless babble in our country as a culture Too much babble. They don't have it over there.

Speaker 3: 4:23

Oh, that's interesting it really was, like you could tell it immediately when we landed. Another thing they've got figured out is rail travel. That's simple. Once you figure out this, the system it's very simple. It's very simple, it's comfortable, everything is just. It's a lot different than here in the States we are. You can tell coming back here that we were a bunch of rebels, and it's still very much so in our culture over here. It's a bunch of rebels.

Speaker 2: 5:01

Well, I'm glad you had a good time.

Speaker 3: 5:02

Yeah, it was great. It was great, but I'm glad to be back. I was really glad to have the opportunity to go. It's not every day that someone gets to do something like that, and to have the freedom to do that and the people in your life to do it with is pretty special, pretty special.

Speaker 3: 5:22

But, you know hell, man. 11 days is almost a third of a month. That's a long time to well, it's over a third of a month. It's a long time to be gone. Come back home and, you know, pick up the pick up the work again be a little difficult.

Speaker 2: 5:40

Well, speaking of picking up the work, um, while we're while we're talking about it, and before we jump into the topic today, I want to just put it out there to everybody that we are planning another intervention training intervention and admissions training in October in Birmingham, alabama not yet been decided. It's either going to be the second, the third or the fourth weekend. But if you're interested in training to become a certified interventionist, if you're interested in working in a more effective capacity with families, if you're working in treatment, by all means consider joining us in Birmingham this October.

Speaker 3: 6:20

Yeah, it's going to be fun, I'm looking forward to it. I've already had several people reach out on social media asking about being trained. I said look, it's going to be fun, I'm looking forward to it. I've already had several people reach out on social media asking about being trained. I said look it's coming. Know it's going to be in Birmingham. Know it's going to be in October. Just don't have the date yet. I would have liked to have done a couple of trainings so far this year, but it's just life gets in the way. You know family stuff, yeah.

Speaker 2: 6:40

And and you know I'd rather have fewer trainings with more people just to to to make sure that everybody gets the best experience possible. I think you know, of the three that we did last year, two of them were really, really well attended and I think the people that attended those trainings got way more out of it than the one that was had fewer people. And so I want to make sure that that when we do a training, we get as many people there, because I think that just the exchange of ideas some people were already working in the field and brought some things to our training, some ideas and some experiences that I felt like were valuable, and so I want to make sure that we get as many people there as possible.

Speaker 3: 7:17

Yeah, you know, man, I think what sets us apart is and I'm going to toot our own horn here is that we just don't want to satisfy our customers, people that are signing up to train I don't anyway, I want to delight them. I heard Warren Buffett say that look, don't wake up in the morning wanting to just satisfy your customer. Delight your customer, because if you can delight your customer, then you've got a sales force out there that you don't have to pay, that you don't have to. You don't even know they're there, but they're out there talking about you. And I think we've been able to do that on intervention on call with, I can say for certainty, every single one of our, of our families that have signed on with intervention on call have been delighted, not just satisfied, but been delighted. And I and I take that and I know you do as well, take it into our trainings, man. I go into these trainings. I want every single person leave there going wow, delighted, not just satisfied.

Speaker 2: 8:17

Yeah, and I think that we've. We've done that so far and it's only going to get better as we get more experience with this and learning how to give our experience to other people in the most effective way and fun way possible. I don't want these trainings to be boring either. I want them to be enjoyable and to some degree, you know, not just educational, but worthwhile.

Speaker 3: 8:37

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I know I'm not always delightful, I know I'm not always delighted and I know I'm not always delightful. I know I'm not always delighted and I know I'm not always delighting people, but that really hit with me what I heard Warren Buffett say about delighting people. Don't just satisfy them, delight them.

Speaker 2: 9:00

Well, for those who are interested, we hope to see you in October. What are we talking about today, Sam?

Speaker 3: 9:05

You know, buddy, I think a lot about if I was a family and I got someone out here struggling with addiction and they're searching around for programs and how daunting that must be. And I know we've talked about it before. But really the questions that they ask when they call an admissions person, uh, is how much does it cost and do you take insurance? And if any of those questions answers to those questions fit their bill, that's where they go a lot of the time right?

Speaker 3: 9:40

yeah, most often that's that's how it happens and we're losing people at an alarming rate and the success rates coming out of treatment aren't that great and people are ending up in wrong levels of care and families don't know really what they're doing when their loved one goes. So I put out here to a bunch of professionals yesterday. I asked, I said what are three questions families should be asking an admissions specialist when inquiring about their program? And I got a lot of interesting responses. What would? I'm not trying to put you on the spot here, bob, but what do you think would be a question they need to ask?

Speaker 2: 10:14

I would. I think one of the things that I would want to find out about is what is their recovery modality? Is it 12-step? Is it you know other or or are there various avenues of recovery at the treatment program? Uh, because that's the number one reason people are going there most of the time is because of drug and alcohol addiction. If there are any underlying issues, you know what are the clinical modalities? Is there psychiatry? How many people are there? Is it gender specific? What are the groups composed of? Men or women or both? I mean, there's so many questions that could get asked. What are some of the things that people online said?

Speaker 3: 10:58

Well, I've got some top that I feel are top rated. That just blew my hair back. What little hair I've got left. But it just blew it right on back and I had one that just made me shake my head and just be like, oh yep, this is why we're in the mess we're in. It's a good, it's a good. Well, let's start with the top ones then Want to start with the top ones. Right, yeah, let's hear those.

Speaker 1: 11:20

Okay, all right, this guy and I'm not going to give any names, but this gentleman.

Speaker 3: 11:33

He said I would ask what causes addiction? Their answer will reveal what they are really treating.

Speaker 2: 11:44

That is a very insightful question. Yes, yes Now the family has to understand the answer to that question first before it gets asked. So it requires a certain level of understanding and education on the family's part. But that's a great question.

Speaker 3: 11:59

Simple, right? I mean, when I saw that he had texted that I immediately wanted to be his friend, like I want to hang out with this guy, because it's just really simple and yet very profound. But you're exactly right, the family has to know the language before they go into making calls. And that's where they mess up is. A lot of families do the old ready shoot and then aim. They don't do ready, aim fire. They ready shoot and then aim.

Speaker 2: 12:25

And in an effort to really give the best service to the families that are listening to this right now. In your opinion, what would be the worst answer a treatment center could give to that question?

Speaker 3: 12:35

Well, let's go through, because there's a part two to this answer. Okay, oh, yeah, let's do it. Yeah, all right, let's get to it. And he went on. Another guy jumped in there and said, or even related what is addiction, the answer to which might reveal if they are treating anything at all, which is, it's true, right, it's true, and you know, it took me to where you and I went out and were training a staff out there that had been in place for quite some time. All of them had their credentials, all of them were licensed, all of them had the requirements that they needed to hold a position that they had, and we went around the room and asked them, just very simply, what is addiction?

Speaker 2: 13:17

And the answers, just I was disgusted at the answers yeah, especially with the medical staff there we did a separate training just for the medical staff for a few hours and the ones that you would think from even from a medical perspective, would be able to answer that question with the most solid answer. I guess. Just from a medical standpoint, the number of just off-the-wall answers we got in that group was astounding.

Speaker 3: 13:46

Yeah, it was alarming. It was alarming so he said it gets a lot worse. What is addiction? What causes addiction? What ends addiction? What are the means to ending addiction that you guys use? Those are all great questions. Yeah, and you know what it'll do. Guarantee you 80% of the time. Guarantee you. They call any number of these programs around the country just these willingness random. You're going to get a lot of silence on the phone of the admissions. You're going to stump them because most of them have this little thing that they're supposed to say right or that they're used to saying. Then you get a family say all right. So what do you all believe addiction is? What do you do to treat that addiction? What are you going to do to stop that addiction? What is your modality and what is your belief? It'll be very I have a hard time getting my words out today revealing as to what's really going on in that program.

Speaker 2: 14:47

Well, and that doesn't just apply to addiction treatment you know, you look at people coming out of you know for themselves, coming out of residential care, going into aftercare, going to see a therapist Like how do I know if my therapist understands addiction recovery? How do I know if my psychiatrist understands addiction recovery? Or my doctor understands addiction recovery? Or my interventionist that I'm about to hire to come out and get my loved one into treatment, how do I know that they understand addiction? Great questions to ask anybody in this space that you're considering bringing on to ask for help.

Speaker 3: 15:21

Yeah, but to be effective, you have to know yourself, right, what addiction is and what it isn't, and what the solution should be. Yeah, so why don't you? You want to hear the, the, the least favorite answer, yes, or the one that just had me shaking my head, please. Now this is from a professional that looks to be has been around a long, long time, professional professor, like all kinds of letters and experiences, and gray, you know, been doing this a long time. One of those right, highly educated. They should never begin with an admission specialist, never, then, went into SUD. Patients' rights right. So I get patients' rights. I understand that, but I feel that this is coming from a different angle. He's using a different angle To have an independent evaluation to an informed consent to choose treatment based on comparable outcomes.

Speaker 3: 16:20

To know the risks and benefits of all protocols and science they are based on. To know the qualifications and training of everyone providing care to be offered several. He's an educational consultant too, okay, so let me throw that out there. I figured, yeah, just listening to what they're saying, absolutely, starting off right there, because you need to hire him in order to understand all this. Right To know the qualifications of training everyone providing care and to be offered several levels of care, including MAT and harm reduction. To be offered several levels of care, to include MAT and harm reduction. That alarmed me, not about the MAT but the to be offered, and I'll get into why.

Speaker 3: 17:00

To not be charged for services that are free in the community, like AA step work. To have treatment options near their homes when available. To not have the communication with their community taken away. To have significant other family involvement from day one. To be offered ambulatory withdrawal management when clinically indicated. To be given an individual treatment plan based on their goals to which they agree. To have support in the community in which they live. To be informed as to what alternative care is also available. To know the average length of treatment and all calls to be offered the least restrictive treatment available. To be given complete information regarding diagnosis, treatment and prognosis. My issue with that is that I understand all that I get it, I get it and I don't disagree with everything you said.

Speaker 3: 17:48

No, I don't either. I really don't. It's not about you know they shouldn't have any rights. That's not where I'm going. But you're going to present all of this information. What it sounds like to me is hey, we're going to inform an individual, and as much education and background and experience as an individual like this has is they miss the simple fact that you're going to present all this information to an individual that is displaying signs of insanity and leave it all up to them of what they do and sit here and wonder why we're in the mess that we're in. You know what I mean? That's nonsense.

Speaker 2: 18:28

There's this buzzword out there that I think a lot of people buy into without understanding the implications, and that's client-centered care or client-centered treatment, where the client is the one dictating what's going to happen. There has to be choice. This doesn't work in a complete dictatorship, but at the same time, of course, someone who's twisted up drunk can't make the decision. I get that.

Speaker 3: 19:16

But I'm talking with nothing in their system, straight out of even out of detox. Nothing in their system. You know, people miss the fact that the most insane thing, the decision that they make, they make stone cold sober and that's to get more. In a stone cold, sober state of mind, they make a decision to get more, despite the flames and rubble in their life as a result of going to get more. In a sober state of mind, they make a decision to get more. And let's not even. Let's look at it like this If I'm walking down the street, if I wake up every day and four or five times a day I involuntarily just knock myself and I punch myself in the face, right, like four or five times a day.

Speaker 3: 20:00

I do that Just walk around and all of a sudden just punch myself in the face uncontrollably, involuntarily, and I don't want to do it uncontrollably, involuntarily and I don't want to do it.

Speaker 3: 20:13

It wouldn't take long for me to stop at nothing and do whatever is necessary to find out why I keep involuntarily punching myself in the face, even when I don't want to, and I'm trying everything I can not to, but I do it anyway. I wouldn't stop at nothing, I would follow directions, I would go to the greatest solution that I could find, but with an addicted individual, that doesn't work that way. We've got to have interventionists like us a lot of the times to get in there and say, hey man, look, your family's worried about you. This is what's happening and here's a way out. And they fight us on it tooth and nail for a long time, based on experiences, based on the actions, just like you say, not what the individual says, but what they do. Right, it's about watching a movie in a foreign film. Do you think? Are they displaying evidence that shows that they are in a place that they can weigh all of this information and make a good decision? Absolutely not, absolutely not.

Speaker 2: 21:14

Some of it. Yes, and, like I said, I don't want to throw out the baby with the bathwater there. There was some valuable information, I think, in what he said and some good insight into what he said, but I also think that there was a lot in there that you know. I mean the first thing, like, don't start out by talking to an admission specialist. Well, not every family is going to have $7,000 or $8,000 to hire an educational consultant just to choose a treatment program and do all the assessment work and do all of that because they've got somebody with a fentanyl addiction, all the assessment work and do all of that because they've got somebody with a fentanyl addiction. And whether they can afford seven or $8,000 to hire the ed consultant or not and I'm ballparking that number, I don't know if that's the figure or not, it's in the thousands. I know that it's probably comparable to what we charge when we go out and do an intervention, but you got somebody who's got a severe fentanyl addiction, let's say at risk for overdose every single day. You want to make a good decision as a family on which treatment center you're going to choose, but do you have time to go through addiction or active methamphetamine addiction, with methamphetamine psychosis is is that going to be the best information to make that assessment with? Or does there need to be a period of stabilization before that happens? And and so like?

Speaker 2: 22:37

There's there's so many variables in in this that I I I don't want to entirely discount whoever this was, but at the same time, I think that there's a lack of understanding of what families are going through in that moment and the crisis that they're in. At the same time, I think, when you know when he, when he warns against talking to an admission specialist first, I think there are some predators out there that will take advantage of that crisis and and and get a family sold on something that may or may not work, just to get them into a treatment center. So I can see it both ways. But at the same time, I think there's a crisis here that just can't, sometimes that time can't be afforded to to, to, to be spent in that, that that work ahead of time sometimes. And and you know, again, I again I don't want to badmouth anybody, but I think there's a lack of insight there and a lack of understanding of what we're really dealing with.

Speaker 3: 23:36

Yeah, look, I'm not discounting all the stuff he says. Right, and in an ideal world, every family would go to a professional and get some guidance and understanding before they pick up the phone and just start willy-nilly calling treatment centers or Google them. Absolutely, I agree 100% in that. 100%, it's not going to happen. It's not going to happen. These families out here in crisis and in panic mode, just calling around the treatment centers when the shit hits the fan and going to which one takes the insurance and which one they can afford, or what have you, or which one's in whatever, in their hometown or whatever the case may be.

Speaker 3: 24:11

Look, I'm in full support of hey, educate yourself before you make decisions like this, because it's very important and these treatment centers are a dime a dozen. I'm not even bad-mouthing treatment centers, it's just a fact. There they are a dime a dozen. Out here there's thousands of them, thousands and thousands. Families need to be educated before they do it, but a large majority of them are not going to be All right. So to make it, to make some type of a dent, is like hey, what are three? Because they're going to call an admissions person. They're going to do that Like what are some. What are some questions that they should be asking that are that that are not. Hey, how much are you and do you take insurance, or will you take oh?

Speaker 2: 24:50

absolutely and listen. If you're an ed consultant and not this person but any ed consultant and you want to reach more people to provide these assessment services and be able to provide these recommendations to people, but families can't access you financially, get on intervention on call. Come on and do it an hour at a time with us and let's compare and see like are the outcomes there? And if they are, I'd love to change the way that I do. If there's better ways of doing things out there and we can see that the data supports that man, I'm all in. But when you say this is what needs to happen, we'll make that accessible, like we're doing on intervention on call to families that either can't afford or don't need an intervention, and let's make those tools available to everybody.

Speaker 3: 25:36

Yeah, and you know what. That's how you delight your customer, make it available to the masses.

Speaker 2: 25:44

What are some of the other answers to that question that you got?

Speaker 3: 25:47

Let me see, let's look here bud.

Speaker 2: 25:49

I shouldn't say that that gentleman was offering what he felt like was a great opinion, and I shouldn't say that it was bad. Thank you for answering the question. Thank you for sharing that.

Speaker 3: 25:59

Yeah, absolutely, yeah, definitely. I appreciate his input. Maybe I perceived it as a little sideways, but it just really didn't answer the question, didn't understand the assignment. That's all right.

Speaker 2: 26:13

But other than that. Let's move on to somebody that maybe did.

Speaker 3: 26:17

Guy said can I tour the property before I make a decision?

Speaker 2: 26:21

Why do you think that's important? I agree, but why do you think that's important if they can afford to take the time to do that?

Speaker 3: 26:26

Hey, you know some of these people you see on social media they got so many filters and diamond and gold and glitter and paint make you look like something that you ain't. Well, a treatment center can do the same thing through their admissions team and they can do it on their pictures on the website and in their descriptions. Nothing, nothing beats going and kicking the tires. You know, I've seen many vehicles online that look really good online and you go to them and they're not so many houses, everything right. So kick your feet. Meet the staff.

Speaker 3: 26:53

Feel the energy of the program is the main thing I know. For me, I can walk on site and feel the energy of what it is and what it isn't, almost immediately walking in the door. And I visited some programs where it was just the energy was just super dark, all just oozing out of the patients and just the lackadaisical staff. You know like you can feel it, you can see it, like you'll see it firsthand. You know and you can feel it firsthand. Meet the team, meet the staff, tour where they're going to be, what their day-to-day is, get a schedule. You know I'm all about touring, but you but most of our people go out of state, different state from where they originate from. So just going to tour can financially just not be or logistically just can't work, but I think I support that a hundred percent.

Speaker 2: 27:45

Well, and some facilities will either have a virtual tour on their website or, if you're talking to somebody and you can't get there ahead of time, you know hey, is there any way? Do you happen to have a virtual tour that you can send me, that I can see the property and maybe hear some of the staff? Or, you know, and for treatment centers that are out there that potentially could be hearing this? I'd love for people to start putting more of that together because of the, the, the ability to travel to other states that a lot of families have, you know, it's just a good way for them to put eyes on beforehand.

Speaker 3: 28:13

Yeah, yeah, I agree with that. What are the expectations for parent involvement if a minor or support person involved? If the client has an outside treatment team, how involved can they be when the client is admitted to the program? Will they be updated on goals, progress involved? How informed do you want to be, matt, when you're the professional and you've sent someone to treatment? How informed do you want to be kept in the loop with?

Speaker 2: 28:36

I'm struggling a little bit right now. I've got a husband and wife in treatment and I'm just trying to help the family out. They ended up going to treatment without an intervention. It was a family that I had worked with on intervention on call. The husband and wife both went to different treatment centers and I've tried to stay in the loop because the family wants some ongoing support, just in terms of planning aftercare, making sure that they're committed to aftercare, those kinds of things.

Speaker 2: 29:02

And when the family is reaching out to me going, hey, do you know what's going on over there and I haven't had an update, it's entirely frustrating because I cannot provide the family with the information that they're looking for.

Speaker 2: 29:17

They're not getting information from the treatment team and and it just feels like the the the client is out there on an Island and, hey, we'll let you know when we're done with them and we'll let you know what the plan is and that's usually within, you know, the last three or four days of the treatment experience and it's tough.

Speaker 2: 29:36

It's tough to plan effective aftercare when you don't have the kind of communication that you need and you know, when you talk about referring professionals or when you talk about treatment teams, whether the person had a therapist or a psychiatrist or you know, if there's a medical issue. You know they've got liver issues or pancreatic issues because of alcoholism and they've got, you know, a doctor that's been working with them. When the, when the team at the treatment center isn't willing to communicate with those outside professionals, I think they're doing themselves and the client a disservice. It takes more effort, it takes more energy, but I think that a lot of times there's this thought process of well, if that was working, they wouldn't come here, so we're not going to go back to systems that didn't work and so we're just going to provide the services that we provide here and then we'll figure it out, and I think that that's just the wrong approach to take.

Speaker 3: 30:26

Yeah, yeah, I don't you know. I don't want to be left in the dark, but I make it clear that as soon as they walk in the door, I'm taking a supportive role with the family and I'm here to support the team at the facility and anything that they need.

Speaker 1: 30:39

that I understand that that individual is in their care.

Speaker 3: 30:43

They're going there because they're trusted, and expect them to do a job and to let them do that job until maybe their actions, or lack of actions, require me to step in and take a more assertive role on behalf of the family to make sure that things are done the way they should be done. You know, just to stay in my lane though you know the lane that I'm supposed to be in. I don't try to overstep that lane.

Speaker 2: 31:08

One of the first treatment centers I worked at. It was the first treatment center that I worked at. It was in Arizona and we worked with a lot of referring professionals, whether it was at a consultants or interventionists, and and it was always frustrating, when we'd get a call from a professional, they'd refer us somebody, but then they would say, well, I want them with this therapist and I want them to see this therapist and I want them doing this, and it's like they're the ones mapping out the treatment plan and and it's like, wait a minute, you know we will work with you and we want to communicate with you and we want all this input, but but we've got a really good, good treatment program here and and you know, we will collaborate with you and we will work with you and we will be flexible, but please don't dictate to us what we do.

Speaker 3: 31:55

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 31:56

You know and, and in the same way that I, I would not want a treatment center referring me an intervention and then saying, okay, here's how the intervention should go. I'm open to any of that impact or any of that input, because it's going to make me better for that family if I have all that information. But please don't tell me how to do what I've spent the last 20 years learning how to do. I feel like I'm good at it, but I'll be better at it if you share it with me. But let me do what I do, yeah.

Speaker 3: 32:23

I had that experience last week. Family was leaning on a family friend that worked in the industry Wasn't an interventionist and there were two friends that are going to be a part of the intervention and I said, you know, when the check-in one of the check-ins throughout the day I was like are these friends going to be at the rehearsal on the?

Speaker 3: 32:43

night of the rehearsal it was like no, we've got him. They're going to stay with such and such to make sure that they don't drink. And I'm like, where'd that come from? And well, it was advised to us by such and such. You know they work at this program.

Speaker 3: 33:00

I'm like you know, the morning, the night before is never as important as the morning of you know, as far as, like, you know whether he drinks or not, you know, like, whether he drinks or doesn't drinks or doesn't drink is not an issue, unless he's gets on the road and is driving behind the wheel, then we've got to, you know, take preventive measures for that. But you know, the power of these friends being a part of this intervention and being a part of the rehearsal is way more important than whether this guy drinks or not.

Speaker 3: 33:32

My experience shows me that my training shows me that, common sense shows me that. So having another professional in there sticking, his beak in that doesn't have the experience to do with what we're doing, you know, causes a few problems. You know, maybe I'm throwing people under the bus today, man, I feel like right, I'm just like, but think about it.

Speaker 2: 33:55

Like, how many times have you done an intervention in the last decade where the person did use or drink the night before or you know the within the week before and that caused them to have an experience that was so negative that they may not have been open-minded to what you were going to say or the family was going to say up to that point, but maybe they did go out and drive and got arrested two days before the intervention or the night of the intervention. Maybe they got into an accident. It's like you know what, while I don't want know what, that well, while I don't want to wish that on anybody, that was the thing that caused someone to have an open mind and become a little bit more open to the idea of getting help. And and the more we try to control I, I think the more we're eliminating the spiritual component of this and and kind of cutting God out of the experience.

Speaker 3: 34:47

Yeah, that was my main thing to the family. It was listen. This is doing nothing to help you relinquish? Your delusion that you're in control of your loved one. That type of action is not helping that. Let him sit, let him be, get him to the rehearsal. That's more valuable than babysitting Buddy. I got to get to a wedding, charmaine's getting married today.

Speaker 2: 35:14

Really Well tell her I said hello and congratulations.

Speaker 3: 35:17

Isn't she genius getting married on a Thursday evening. Yeah, brilliant, brilliant. I love her for it. Love her for it.

Speaker 2: 35:25

Well, give her my best. You have a wonderful time at the wedding and we'll see you again on the next one, man.

Speaker 3: 35:30

Hey, appreciate you. Man Enjoyed this. Everyone be well.

Speaker 1: 35:37

Thanks again for listening to the party records. If you liked what you heard, please leave us a rating and a review. This helps us get the word out to more people, to learn more or to ask us a question we can answer in a future episode. Please visit us at PartyWreckerscom and remember don't enable addiction ever. On behalf of the Party Wreckers, matt Brown and Sam Davis. Let's talk again soon.