The National - Album rankings and general notes Artwork

Pop Culture By Volume

A general, culturally (ir)relevant podcast featuring two know-it-all know-nothings. We drink, we talk, and we're thirsty for more.

Pop Culture By Volume

The National - Album rankings and general notes

June 04, 2023 • Zach and Daniel • Season 2 • Episode 8

Hello and welcome back!

Since we are deep diving into the National what better drink to get us there than bourbon. We started with Guadlupe from Garrison Brothers Distillery. This bourbon was aged four years in toasted and charred white American oak barrels and an additional two years in port casks imported from Portugal. This was a sweeter bourbon that is 107 proof and 53.5% abv.
Then we switched to the classic cocktail, Old Fashioned. We used Four Roses Bourbon (80 proof/40% abv), a bourbon we feel goes great in cocktails.

Enjoy our discussion ranking all The National studio albums and our general thoughts and notes on the band.

Ep - 33 The National

Hello and welcome to another episode of pop Culture by volume. Your source for booze, music and pop culture news. Last episode we teased. A ranking of the national albums.

Tucked in button.

In honor of the release of their latest album, first pages of Frankenstein. And we got a lot of requests from lovers and haters of the show to do this. So if we are, we are men of our.

We never had so much hate mail before.

Word and we. Deliver on our threats and promises. Right. Mostly threats, mostly threats. And so we're we're coming through on ranking. Of national albums.

And in in anticipation, a couple of things. I guess the first time ever I listened to. A whole catalog. Oh. Yeah, start to finish.

I think I've ever done that. Before I revisited album, but never ohh you still.

No, I still haven't ever.

You did it. I'm the only one who did.

It I've I've listened to the albums. If I didn't go. Over the course of the past week or. Hmm, I've listened to the albums, but I didn't just sit down and do all nine in a well.

In one city I also spent.

Like I didn't do anything. I took off work. I said no way, man. There's no kidding. Don't I listen to right studio versions, demos, rarities besides bootleg live?

Beside bootleg live albums, everything directors, directors, tracks or whatever.

The whole shebang.

No. So I did that and then I figured also, since this music lends itself to a darker alcohol, right, so we are drinking some first we start off with some Texas Bourbon Garrison brothers to to wet our whistles with some 107 proof.

It certainly does, yes. It it definitely showed, the 107 came through are real big.

Right. This was, yeah, they do it big in Texas. This is the Guadalupe this it was.

What was the name of the? The bottle or whatever, yeah.

Oh, they name each bottle from Mexican bottle.

Not each bottle. But I guess this line or yeah.

Oh, OK, yeah, yeah.

And then to continue the the the ball rolling, we switched over to some old fashioned. 4 Roses featuring the four roses. Roses, some luxardo dos. Some sugar, sugar, CNH and some.

Domino C&HOK. Yeah, Nah. Classic American.

Yeah, it's like the East Coast. Like C&H obviously. Why California and Hawaii? I think that's mostly in the western half of the country and then domino.

Ohh I see. East is that one of those monopoly type of deals like you get the East, you get the West, don't come into our territory.

Bounded by the mighty Mississippi, the dividing line between the sugar empires.

You control the sugar, you control the whatever Homer said.

Like Paul Rudd and Parks and Rec with the swedens.

Ohh that's right.

Whatever that company is.

I never did it.

Yeah, great reference. OK, so when when did you first get into the national? When did you hear about them? Was your entryway, what album?

I tried to remember, I think it was more not an album, but like it was. I want to say it was probably like Mr. November, but it was before like it was like using commercials and stuff. I just remember I used to like back in the day. This was what early. This was the age of like. It was an agent of innocence, but also an age where you could like. I guess it was. It was already downloadable music, but now had turned into also like curated downloaded music. So a lot of times you could find those like what they call it, like indie playlist or whatever and a bunch of these like unknown kind of bands lumped together you could. Download the the the files or whatever. So I think it. Was in one. Of those, OK, I think that was the only kind of standout that I remember from that one. So remember then going getting missed that one and then getting the album, whatever that was, alligator, right? And then listening to the other stuff and and I will go into each one, right. But I remember thinking, OK, they're all right. This they have this one really good songs. They have a couple. That was the whole thing. They had a couple of good songs sprinkled right, there was potential. But it wasn't till later, so it was around that time. So whatever that was, 2000, maybe 2000.

Two well alligator came out 2005.

OK, so I'm off on my. Timeline, we graduated, we graduated.

Somewhere between 5:00 and 7:00 because. Because it was used. I don't know if it was used, but it was written about John Kerry.

Right. But Obama used it, yes.

If John Kerry would have used it, maybe would have gotten the. The national bump? Maybe.

That's what was lacking. Yeah, I mean.

John Kerry spark the.

John Waters looking good.

This ain't right, Bauer looked.

Yeah, like that long face.

At and help at all.

When they had that.

Yeah, the Secretary of State.

It was very it was very like. It was very like a Funeral Home director. He was not gonna unseat Bush with that.

No, certainly not with this flipping and.

Yeah, he really got. Him with that nickname. Was never able to come back with a good. Counterpunch to their nickname, no. And the rest was history.

Just as well, I think it's a fine secretary. Of state, right?

I guess what do they really do?

Just fly around, pretend they're doing important meetings at summits.

Right. Have summits, have summits? Hang out with allies.

It's a lot of. You know, sitting in old buildings, shaking hands and. Like photo shoots.

Old buildings for old people.

With occasional diplomacy, right? Ben Franklin tell you that right?

Hanging out in. France, he knew.

How to handle himself with his prostitute, Sir, was he was a big with the ladies.

That was the way. He was big with the ladies. Yeah, he was the yeah, the most vivacious. 80 year old. Which we learn from the office, I think he. Had syphilis, was it?

You got all kinds of ****.

Vented the bifocals.

Call Andy Daly.

The better to see. Lucy women W. I wonder now though. Was he looking for lightning to get the old libido going?

Ohh, you know the spice of.

Who knows that ***** old statesman. Was that too? Long, balding main. Right. He's like those old rocker guys are like, just have that little bit of hair, but it's. Like really long in the back.

But that was like the style of the day. Yeah, like a lot of people had.

That look, it was duringer, man, those founding fathers.

Yeah, they knew how to do it. Their powdered wigs and. Such he didn't have to he.

Didn't have one.

No, no, he did not.

He stood tall and proud.

He said firm firm. That's how the ladies liked it.

Anyway, anyway, so wait real quick before we. Switch over to. Her guidance then? Yeah, just quick background.

These fools, right? New York band by Way of Cincinnati, formed apparently in 1999. A couple of brothers. Couple of friends got together, formed the band.

One of the designers was not on the first album.

Yeah, he was a he made a guest appearances on the album, but is not yet fully formed or fully formed fully member full.

It's not fully. Formed it's it's doing right absorbed.

He hadn't separated from his twin yet. He wasn't birthed from his brother yet.

It's a different.

But no, we got that right.

Science and enlightenment not reach the dozen her brothers.

But, but we gotta we gotta. Berninger. Yeah. Singer. Then we're talking about with Aaron and Bryce Dessner. Brothers Co guitarist. Scott and Brian. Holding down the rhythm section on bass and drums. Then we had some interlopers. Kind of right, who also tangentially blood related and marriage related. So he got his wife right, Karen, Karen, right?

It's Corinne, Corinne Spencer. Former poet editor at the.

New Yorker and say off off who's the erstwhile writer of songs and then his brother, Tom Berninger. Her brother and documenter of the band.

Slash Rody mistaken for strangers? Documentary that we.

Saw we did and then saw them perform at the shrine was a double feature.

Everyone applauded when Tom came out.

Right to hold the the mic, the mic line. But yeah, so it's a real.

It's a family affair with the with the burners and the Devon Dorfs and the designers Little German.

Family it really is. Oh, that is.

I don't know what burning areas.

That sounds no burning. Could be, I don't know, some kind of. Whatever one of that.

He's a tall white blonde man. I don't think he's Swedish. And maybe on his mom's side, but.

If we parked the weed. The Swedish we'll have to look that up for another time. Or if anybody knows, shoot us a line.

Call in one 800.

Apparently the name just came up, kind of like they're to come up with a name. That didn't mean anything. So that's where that came from, OK. But anyway, so just that's a. Quick, quick and dirty background story on them, I don't. Know do you know what they did? I think they've had different jobs, right? Some of them were involved in, like newyork.com boom.

Bust that works, that teacher and he worked for.

Now with a teacher for some time. A design company or something, right?

Yeah, like magazine, like graphic designer something.

Right. Which makes. Sense given how graphically designed their albums are? The album covers.

I don't know what everyone else was doing.

Yeah, I wish I knew.

They're a way to find.

Well, they seem kind of secretive.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

You know what I mean? Not too much out there about their personal lives.

But anyway, so quick re real quick. What you call it tangent onto. The history, yeah. How and why and where? Come upon the national.

What were you listening to on the night of? The 3rd, 2002. What were you doing?

Headphones speakers your pods with this on.

An iPod or the wattage?

You have a video iPod.

Did I did it well?

Yeah, as was the time.

Yeah, I don't. When did I get mine? I got my iPod. That was not your initial question. It was 2006. I think it was maybe the 4th generation.

Because you got. You got an. Oh, no, I think that might have been the time.

I got one. It was post the. Black and red. You 21 maybe around the same time, but I remember I could watch the movie trailers and host or put photos on it for.

Storage and use it that way.

Yeah, you know what? I take it back. I didn't have the video one I got when they first released the the the with the color screen. There's photo one.

OK. Yeah, I think mine.

One I had OK. Yeah.

Definitely have photos. I think I could watch.

Videos on it. Yeah, that was the next version.

But yeah, I didn't get into the national until boxer. Told me we're going.

To do this podcast I.

Was like what? You didn't listen to the the national.

What the National Register?

Is it the Marine Corps band?

Are you? What are you?

Talking about John Phillips, who's greatest hits, it was 2000 must have been 2007. I I saw. I think it was the. Old AV Club when there's still a reputable.

They're just pre Daws.

Is the greatest.

This is host. The dog is the greatest.

I think it was. It was still in like the First's cancer AIDS.

Ohh uh-huh of the comments section.

I think it was some time around there and they had. The best of albums of the year and Boxer was listed as as one of them and then I think sometime earlier a friend had maybe a mixtape with all the wine just from Alligator, and I think was on the.

Virginia EP, EP. So I think I had the mix. I'd first like that song. That was my first exposure to them, but didn't bother doing any more research after that. Like it's a cool song. That'll do just one. That's all I need. This will be my desert island playlist. Just listen to all the wine for all eternity. And then, yeah, I think it was a while later, after listening to Boxer, then going back into the other albums, like, oh, I know this song. Like, I didn't even realize it's the same. Band cause I'm slow.

Well, I mean. When you consider those early albums to boxers, there's. A I think. A market difference?

Or is there? Let's discuss.

OK. How do you want to do this? Just shoot back and. Forth, OK, so.

Yeah, yeah. We'll start at #9.

OK, say really quickly there are 9. We're only doing studio albums. We're leaving out EP's. We're leaving out live albums and whatever compilations or whatever. Yeah, I don't know they have.

A best I don't think so. I don't think so. I was surprised how many live albums they.

Yeah, yeah, I know. I know I owned or bought it in the time the live in Brussels.

I don't think I bought the last or I've even listened to the last one or whatever. But that Brussel 1. Was pretty good. OK, so #9 you go first, then I'll go and then we can switch off.

From there, OK, my #9 is sad. Songs for Dirty Lovers, which is their second album. Why did I put this one on #9? I think it was. Is more cohesive sonically than their debut, but I think the first one had a little more energy and. I like the way that it kind of jumped around to different things and it just felt more propulsive, like sad songs like the opener for sad songs for Dirty Lovers is. A very slow melancholy song and. Yeah. It's just. Even though more consistent, it just didn't quite have as much punch to me. So I put it at #9. What else do I have to say about this? I think was the first album when they started. Using strings which will come in into play later, it started having the some of the screaming vocals that they. Were known for come in their early period and some of the the lower registered vocals that became their signature later. The patterns for fairy tales that starts on on this album. That's that's my #9 #9. Sad sounds dirty lovers.

OK, I'm gonna. OK, so now I right, I don't. We didn't really think this. So we're just gonna riff or whatever. Because I'm trying to think. Now let me respond to you. Or add my. Notes to where you said about sad songs. Right. And then going to. My #9 so I I. Had I kind of felt the same way? I guess I just say it right, I I put sad songs for dirty lovers as my #7. I did put kind of some or some of the same things that you said moves in more focused direction, especially from the first album.

I think I felt a little Sammy to the first album. I think my favorite album song off this album was fashion coat. But I did also think they lyrically they were getting tighter. The sad sadness, I think felt a little bit more grounded than the first one and then yeah, but still exploring their sound added orchestration and electronics that the first one didn't have and then it sounded like some of the songs and that's what I mean, this is the album. The first album sounded very much like bands trying to find. They're groove or whatever, right? Yeah. So like this one I felt, especially given the time frame 2003. Like, some of the songs here, they were trying to fit into the more like rock indie.

Trying out different things, different influences.

Seen so they have some songs that have more like that straight up drum beat and the clangy driven guitars. Even with the slightly distorted vocals that are kind of muddy in the mix a little bit, all interpool or strokes, yes.

Yeah, they were in Brooklyn at that time. They even had the story in. Meet me in the bathroom. Matt said that he was in the same studio or like they were just in the adjoining room.

So now the hot rooms.

Yeah, with, like, Interpol was recording. Their first album, about a light. Turn on the bright lights or something like that.

Yeah, I think so.

I I agree that those early albums really have a early 2000s indie Brooklyn feel to them and they. I'm quite mastered their own sound at this.

And there was some remnants of in sad songs that I felt was carried over from the first one where they were still kind of like even flirting a little bit with like all country. Rock country more, stronger and right another.

Yeah, I have. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Album but I feel like there's still some.

There's a little Americana.

Thread vintage is still there.

There's vestiges that are still infiltrating into sad songs for today lovers, but I I think I was a bit harsh with my #9 and I think I only did it partly because of what preceded it. And also some of I guess the slack I give the early album finding this sure.

Nine was their seventh album.

Sleep well, beast. Ohh, shots fired.

Oh, so which is so like? I remember not caring for it too much when it first came out. I even when I listened to it again, I felt the same like I found I found some more things to like about it, but over I still didn't like it, even though one best Grammy. For our best alternative album, 2018 had a great cover album to cover the cover of the album was really.

It did, yeah, yeah.

Cool, but again. This one, I think my notes were like it overall sounded slightly on inspired and less focused then especially things that preceded it. Especially, I felt like lyrically it was a bit more muddled. I put question Mark was this kind of a transitional album compared to the three that preceded it and what came after? It almost feels like that has a transitional vibe to it. I thought it dragged a bit and I noticed this one, and I tried to look back to see who was credited on writing songs. This one, his wife Corinne is credited in all the songs. Whereas I think other times I mean it's you. At least she's credited a lot in previous or at least in in some songs. But I think and I should have made a better note, if this was one where she was credited on every song.

OK or officially like I think it was known that she helped out on him and then she.

And I believe this one, she was. Or officially right? Some credit OK cuz from some of this quick research I did, I think she started actually writing or contributed to the lyrics. Starting with boxer, yeah, I think it kind of increased. From there, but yeah, with this one I don't know. I just did the thing I feel with the national, too, is like their albums live or die by Matt. It's kind of like even if the music is kind of engaging and or interest. Thing is like how much do you buy into what he's saying in the stick of or the persona of Matt Berninger on this album? And I don't think it sells as well on this album than.

In other ones it doesn't have a huge range. So I think the music has to fill in the things that his voice doesn't have.

Yeah, they have to be fired. On all cylinders, yeah. To make I think it's a success especially. Since the other terrain. Isn't very varied, so you know it's one of those things, right? Because like for food like a national album to be good has to be so like a a simple dish done with done perfectly with top ingredients. You know you can't cover it with this and that because it's very, very simple and I think that's where they they they misstepped.

The the right balance.

Sleep well, beast, but again, it's considering what preceded it and I didn't give them the the benefit of the doubt that I gave the the earlier albums because they were new band.

OK. So that's number nine for me and for both of us. OK, #8. I've put their debut album, the National. OK, look at that.

Look at that. We matched up alright.

Oh my God. No wonder we do this podcast together. I thought it had a lot of energy. It did have an eclectic sound. Like we said, some of the early 2000s indie Brooklyn Lofi type stuff some. R&B a little bit like a. RB soul. Balance ish. Like there's a. What album is it? It's I'm easy to find, I believe not in Kansas. I'm just talking about Roberta Flack on the whole drive home. Whole way home was entirely enlightened. So I felt like. Some of that was in in the earlier. There's just an indication of the music that Matt listened to and that influenced him. If I choose to read that as biographical, which I do, and so the IT seemed to match up with this R&B inflected songs from their first album, not sonically cohesive. As you said it was them trying to find. A path and A and a groove for themselves, and being mostly influenced by the music of the time and the scene that they're in. But it's still. A fun album to listen to. Return to it too often, but I think it's.

A decent debut.

Yeah, for sure. I kind of put something you. That didn't really set the themes out that, you know, they went on to explore deeper in their discography. So I think my favorite song of this, more American Mary in 29 years, which I believe 29 years, is what referenced lyrically in another song, like almost directly verbatim or something. I also made the same note. Yeah. Bryce was a guest contributor. You didn't join the band fully at the. And I think that the same thing that I kind of. Felt with for. Well, this one felt a little too loosey Goosey and Sandy sounding again. This one, I think even more so than the other one, flirts with more that alt country country twang sound. Right. And so says OK for, like, the the Bell national and sad songs for Dirty Lover they felt like. On both of those, Matt singing was too wannabe drunker, cooner, drunken kooner crooner. Trucking crooner it was too late. It was almost like 2-2 forced or whatever, right. Yeah, right. Not yet.

Didn't relax into it, yes.

Right. But yeah, that was, those are my notes for that and. That was 2. 1001.

OK. My #7 is sleep well beast which? Is their seventh album. Released in 2017 and I think this is the first album where they had the introduction of synths and drum programming and. And it really went in an electronic direction. Lots of strings. And I kind of compared it to a door by The Smashing Pumpkins. Where they they had an. Fairly well established sound, especially over the the previous three albums, starting with Boxer High Violet and Trouble will find me where it felt like. That was kind of their golden period and they were really getting. Creating their signature sound and and kind of challenging themselves to something new and I think. They they took a left turn, tried to do something new and and introduced. The sense, which I don't think we're entirely. Successful I think. I appreciate that they're they tried to do something new and tried to use sense to. Create a moodiness and kind of bring that in that emotion in through new instruments and sounds. Wasn't my favorite. It was probably the one that I listened to the least when it came out. Every album I'm usually pretty into at least up to that point, and then sleep well because I gave it a couple listens, had a few songs that. I liked, but I didn't find myself returning to it or feel like I could slip into the same emotional state as I could with their other albums. And then it was. There was a screamy vocal return to the old days on turtleneck, which is a Trump.

Song he is the. The titular turtleneck and. Yeah, it was. It was a. Little disappointment. It's a bit of a slump for me coming off of those those 3 ones, three strong albums. So put it at #7.

And I already talked about I'm gonna add like a little bit to where you said, yeah, the, the the added electronic, yeah. Orchestration or whatever it was kind of interesting, but it wasn't enough to to keep the album going. And that's what I forgot to add last time the the politics sort of angle of this album. It's like it's clearly the most political quote, you know, within parentheses album. But I almost felt like they also walked it back a bit. Because I think it clanged a little bit like that's not their repertoire or whatever, right. So it was a little, I don't know, ham fisted in the politics, but then I remember reading, I think it was a interview where Matt was kind of trying to walk it.

It was sort of like it would be like a joke take on politics or propaganda. Of the time. I don't think it landed, but either way, yeah. I think yeah for all those reasons. I guess it was your 7. And my 9 damned. And actually for this. Did you go to? The tour for no. OK, I think we did because I remember the him singing the system only dreams in total darkness. And I also remember him singing, walking back, which were, I think, two of the singles off this album. I think we saw.

Them at the Palladium. OK. They started singing us. Some of those sleep well, beast. The trouble will find me tour because I. Remember, they played a couple.

At the Greek right. And that was like a second running of that tour, right.

I think so, yeah.

I think they ran that. Tour for a couple of years, yeah. OK. Moving on, moving on.

What's your #7? Oh, did you do your #7?

My seven was sad songs.

OK, I swear to God. Touch them, OK?

Touch upon that one.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. OK, yeah. My number six, you're #6.

I'll I'll do #6.

1st 2 pages of Frankenstein.

Alright, yeah, how about that?

It feels more. Chill and a little more laid back than their. Other albums, it sounds closer to me. To Matt Solo album Serpentine prison. And it's another one of those albums, complex sleep well beast whereas. They're trying something new I think ever since that album sleep well Beast in 2017 each one. After that seems to be. An experiment or pushing something new and something different? Kind of in this. Restless phase and I think after this is my guess after all the. The orchestration and to really tight songwriting of those three albums, maybe they're trying to go in different looser directions. And it has some more collaborative songwriting this time, Taylor Swift and Phoebe Bridgers both make. Appearances on this album and I think help write them, which is a continuation of what they've been doing. Since I'm easy to find, there's a few standout songs. Again, it's not one that I feel I can listen to. Top to bottom and just get lost. In it, yeah. It's it's solid. It's a good album, but maybe after I listen to it. Some more and and give it some time. It'll it'll grow and I find all of these grow on me after I listen to them. Even the ones that I don't like as much, but. Yeah, it's it's OK. Maybe like a.

Yeah, I think so. Strong B minus. So that first two. Page was my #5. I'll give my notes on it now. Yeah, I feel the same way when it first came out to now, it has grown more on me. I put in #5, so like right? Kind of in the middle. But yeah, so I read an interview a couple weeks ago before we had decided to do this podcast where old Mr. Matt was talking about. I guess this album was very hard to make. I think could potentially almost break up because he had this extreme writers blog he couldn't come. Up with lyrics or even met. These I guess he had fallen into like a deep depression, like one, like one he.

Had never known before.

Guess he even gave it weed and alcohol gave it completely and. I think it I. Have to agree with you. Like it is very like gentle sounding compared to everything else and even like when you think like the melodies or whatever, they're not as defined as before. And I think that tracks was sort of the way, I guess his album came to be, sort of unsure, you know and and not as confident as especially the last. Couple yeah, runs of of going. An album, but yeah, I saw the same thing. Right. You got old Mr. Surfing on Stevens guest guest on a couple.

Oh, yes, yes, yeah, yeah.

Since even way back in the day. But yeah, Bieber Bridges and Taylor Swift. I don't know. It almost felt like the the contribution of Bridgers wasn't inconsequential. She just harmonizes a little bit, I think, especially compared to some of the. I am easy to find that we're, I think a lot stronger but and then the Taylor Swift. I don't know. I I know she's friends with them now because of the dress designer connection, right? I don't think she adds much to this. If anything, she kind of like. Overpowers the song, so it kind of becomes more of like a Taylor Swift. Does the national.

At first I found it very distracting and it's like this is obviously Taylor Swift, right that took me. Out of the song. Yes, after I listened to it and I think I just. Have an immediate negative reaction when Taylor Swift has mentioned like this again.

Yes. Same. Yeah. Yeah, but.

Upon multiple listenings, I feel like it just becomes. Another vocalist and it's I don't have Taylor Swift in. My head it's.

I tried that but her voice like just her pure voice. I don't care for. Like there's this. Know what how to describe it? There's this like, I don't know, pitch or frequency to it. That hurts my ears. I can't describe it, but it hurts my ears.

But another great album cover. I thought it was a. Pretty good looking.

Oh yeah, the weird kid holding the head don't know what the story.

Uh-huh. Yeah, yeah.

Behind that one is.

Well, that was the whole thing too, I guess, right. The first two page of Frankenstein has no connection to the album lyrically, or content to contextually, whatever. Yeah, I thought it. Was a better return to form after sleep well beast, but it does lack some of the urgency and focus of like that trilogy era. Again, they tread familiar ground, which always do in most of their albums kind of. Just look at different corners. Maybe felt this one was more textural, again with more added sort of electronics orchestration.

Yeah, it's still still around.

Old Besser again, is credited on most of the songs, and it is just representing the album of the whole tracks as a reflection of whatever was going on internally as. A band and with with Matt. And here's the other thing that I put too that was kind of like. A side note, to even sleep well, beast is like the beginnings of the dulling of sort of the edge of the band, which happens, I think, with a lot of bands, especially as they get more famous. Right. Because I don't know. As you get more rich and more famous and you age. You're not going to have that same like he still has the same anxieties of everyday life, right or whatever and. Dignities and the narratives of our normal lives.

But it's like it's like.

Gold, because now you're older and more mature and now you got tons of money and you're in this your fancy house and everybody loves.

Yeah, I mean, you have to figure out what to do with like if their thing is melancholy and dissatisfaction and like existential dread.

In the light of mass fame.

That can still happen. It's like people who are successful are still depressed, like depression still.

It can, right? But it's a harder sell, but especially when that's your bread.

Well, it's just finding. How to express that? In those new circumstances and how to continually talk about those same things and have them sound fresh, and as you've changed your perspective on, it has changed and it's not just. I don't feel these things, or if you don't feel them. Mark that transition, talk about why that. You don't feel the same way and make that sound interesting, so you know, no matter what stage of life you're in and what you.

Yeah, I can see that, yeah.

Have talked about previously if you want to keep that same subject matter, I think you can do it it just. Takes more effort to understand where you are in relation to those events or those emotions and. Talk thoughtfully about seeing thoughtfully about. And I think they did pretty well. It's not, you know, number six for. Me and what? Was it for?

OK so yeah, similar rank.

Right. As I say, they they haven't made what I would call a bad. Album is just. Yeah, some. Some they're able to do what they do better than others. But I'm I don't know. I guess after this one. I'm very interested where they go forward because I was thinking like after I wrote that note about the dealing of the of, you know based on age, wealth, whatever. Yeah, like they're not the only ones. Every sort of successful band or even artist has gone. Sort of that way. From rap and Rock, where I look at Jay-Z, like, everybody thinks he's all boring now. Because now he's just super rich. You rapping about Rolling Stones.

I don't think you isn't you retired.

If you retired now, well. There you go. If he retired. Because he has nothing to rap about. Because even like his last couple of albums were but just rapping about how rich you were. No wants to hear that.

Big pimp, he's not a.

He's not selling drugs out of his Nike Box or.

Yeah, the Nike shoe boxer.

Yeah, no, exactly.

Yeah, all the cash.

No more play. A golden crusted vault.

Even his vault is gold. Here's the gold.

Keep my gold. Exactly. Exactly.

This had a good chance you pretty good.

That wasn't good like.

A Muppet trying to.

Oh God oh man. Alright, alright, alright. Back to business. OK. My number six was. Alligator their third. Album came out in 2005. This is where I felt like they started. Starting to really form, yeah, coalesce. They're also here is where we're they're growing in critical claim and their fan base is getting bigger. I think this when they start making like best of year end album list, Alligators are getting all that critical claim. I think this one, especially of all the other ones, are starting to really solidify like their own musical landscape. Particularly on like the Rhythm drum section. Finally here, Matt Berninger's vocal. They're finally, like tightening up, dropping that drunken crooner. Of the first two albums.

And it just goes deep.

And then this is the album again with the breakthrough song Mr. November, which we already talked about at. The top of.

So I think we only have so many albums left and. They're going to be. Probably from that middle period. So it's just a matter of. Where they're going for each of our our rankings. But so my #5 is alligator.

OK, so we just switched.

Yeah, kind of same thoughts. It was it was where they started getting. Widespread notoriety, there's sound was coalescing. And this is their third and I think at this point. There's a Sonic cohesion. Everything felt of a peace and created something. Like all the songs added up to become an album and it felt as a a whole well thought out constructed top to bottom thing. Lyrically I think the. It's an improvement again, where there's cohesion, you get certain thematic elements, there's a loneliness, depression of failed relationships. I really like able just. To pick out some standout tracks. So it's like. A a good one, a little screaming action coming in that they kind of left behind for the most part in this album. I like that one. I like Karen and I like geese of Beverly Rd.

And those are probably my top three for. Alligator alligator coming in at number. 5 all right.

Alligator had some of his. I mean crazier lyrics. Yeah, as I mean, it's crazy he can get in. His sort of, I guess wheel barrel. House will house.

That old burning, her wheelbarrow.

But yeah, what is it? It that's one of the setlist favorite right here because all pumped.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Up when it's all. Yeah, right. Yeah. All right, so I guess. Since we already did that so. Now we're to #4. Yeah, cause I yeah, yeah. OK. Who goes first?

I did trouble will find me OK. Yes, I stopped writing down reasons at this point.

I didn't do it on.

One day, let me take a look at the set list here the song. Oh yeah, OK. So. I put this one at 4:00 because. It has some of the. The kind of orchestral and the strings and and everything from some of the other albums like. Boxer and high Violet. But it felt maybe a little too tight and a little too restrictive. And at this point had been the the end of their high trilogy. And so it's getting. A little a little tired of it and felt that. It was maybe a little too structured and I want a little more looseness. They were, it was. It was a progression. It was a step. Forward and I think it was. You know, moving in in the right direction, but didn't quite have as much cohesion as some of the other albums, but I still really like heaven, faced graceless, and I need my girl. Good guitar work.

Yes, by the brothers designer. Ohh twinkle figures designer.

They just, they just do good work.

I don't know. They do.

Yeah, it feels like. They're really responsible for a lot of all the extra Sonic textures that that come in and like the first albums were pretty spare.

Oh, for sure, yeah.

Like you said, it's just like four or five people playing instruments and it really feels like in these albums there's it's just full everywhere. There's there's something going on and. Yeah, I think. Definitely one of the the top albums, but not quite. Cracking the top three.

OK, so I put trouble with find me as my #2. And I think originally I had it at #3. That was my switch. I moved it up a notch from my notes. This one was this one. I think this was produced by the designer brothers and this one featured.

Marina's right. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah, add some. This one had a lot of people working on it or as as guests, right. They had Saint Vincent, some add-ons by Sharon Van Etten. And I have Richard Perry from Arcade Fire. Yeah, this is the one, yeah. Trouble. Fine. OK. Yeah, yeah. So this one. What did I have? I had already had at 3:00, but I had the same thing again. If it follows the another is another strong showing, confident album following high. Violet and boxer. And I put, you know, the trilogy. I thought the arrangements were interesting. The member, the melody, was pretty memorable. I thought it was, maybe even the more the most. Accessible album of their of all their catalog. Yeah, because it kind of continued with the lyric. I think thematically and lyrically with high Violet, but it knocked out sort of that aggression and super high anxiety that I think really. Infiltrated high violence. Because in reading about the production of these albums. Apparently they had a lot. They felt a lot of pressure during High Valley, which we talk about doing that, but during trouble will find me. Aaron Dessner had his first child. He felt more relaxed, and which I think reflected on the music cause then Matt Berninger talks about how like that, then affected his writing and made it a little bit more loose. So I think for all those things together. They did have a different feel, but still in their, you know, in their again musical palette or whatever. But yeah, and had some really good songs. I think you mentioned a few of them.

But pink rabbits is on. Yeah, a lot of.

Another lot, a lot of crowd favorites.

Yeah, I think that's probably the 3rd or 4th song that's about a drink some a cocktail of some kind, which is.

It's either a name or a.

Right. Right. It's very kind of narrative story oriented with their lyric. OK.

Number three. Wait, wait. My #4 my #4.

Oh yeah, you're #4 what?

Was I am easy to find. This was their eighth album. And this was a hard one, cause I really. Like that album.

Now I'm regretting it. No, I don't know. I really like that. I'll just. OK, that was my #4. I'll just give notes on it now. I guess I like this one too, just as a site as a whole. You had the short film by Mike Mills, which was very sad with the candor, who was also on the cover, another great cover.

I'll just see if the calendar, yeah. Yeah, they're all great.

Like if if. If if yeah. If the nationals did anything, we should have ranked the cover this would.

We should have ranked the covers.

Be our second. Ohh boy yeah, this one I really love because of the addition of all the different female vocalists we had Lisa Hannigan, Sharon Vanetten. GAIL and Dorsey choir. But what I really liked about this one is because it's so kind of thematically the same, but now it introduces the female vocalist or gives it the female gaze. So a lot of the songs come out more conversational and you get this other version. Right. The other side of the story, right? And this was another one that I felt was, yeah, the the female vocal is at another layer, a layer of intimacy which where I think. With Matt's lyrics and stuff and the way he sings, I always feel like it's one of those. Like, what is that? What is that director that? Had the faces like ones looking like this and one is looking like that. You know, talk about was that what's his name? They even copied a lot of those. Calvin Klein commercials. And they're like.

That looks straight on and the other ones.

Yeah, it's like, uh-huh.

So this is a profile.

And one of them talking and. The other one talks back. That's like from a famous director. I can't remember his. Name but but like. Like, that's the visual Rep thing of like how I sometimes feel with the songs that has, like, this detached intimacy, yes. Where everything is very like everything he sings about is very like personal, whether it's real or not. It's like like real life daily things. It's not like these big giant.

But again with. But there's like a detachment from it where I feel like when you brought in the these female guest singers or whatever it like kind of removed a bit of that. Yeah, kind of really added like a true layer of intimacy. And this other album is another great texture, really. It has all the electronics and atmosphere. And this is where I felt too, where uh Matt schtick was the least where he's not the the. Focus of the album. He just he's in. He's part of the the the, the totality or whatever. And this is, I think, another album where I can listen to it, start to finish and not skip or nothing.

Similar thoughts, that is why it is my #3.

OK, so almost OK almost indirect.

I mean, I think I. Put it in a better ranking than you.

I wanted to. But those other ones, they just because they I don't know the the trilogy.

Yeah, I mean, you covered a lot of of why I loved it it to me. It was, I mean, coming after. Sleep well, beast.

Ohh especially after that right a true return.

You have this very. Detached electronic focused album. And then you get back to the kind of cryptic lyrics, Moody music, but in a much more. It felt like a a tone poem, almost like everything was ethereal, ethereal, and floating, and the the female vocalists, like you said, create a conversation between like if.

If Matt's vocals were like the protagonist first person, and then he's always telling the story. Then all of a sudden you have someone to reply to him, finally, and it does create an intimacy, and I really like that, and I really.

Right. It's even interesting when they sing the same line, but just the fact that it's the different singers.

Intonation in the words and emphasis on stuff.

Uh-huh. Yeah. Yeah, like. Give it a whole different meaning.

I like that not in Kansas is the kind of stream of consciousness. Thing going on there with a little bit of. Political messaging talking about. Just basically humanity destroying the world and nature will just quietly take over and grow over the cities and. FYI, if you if you don't know.

Five years, apparently.

Talk about a problem chime.

Who was that redhead kid?

Did you? Did you?

I don't think he ever did anything again. I think he. Became Martin Short, Clifford Clifford.

So yeah, I'm easy to find. It's late period at this point. National album and I think. A real a real standout after some some wobbling.

Some refinding of their.

Footing, but in in a new way. Sonic Textures Nuisance station.

They got a new attitude.

All right, now we're at three.

That's my 3:00.

Oh, that's right. 5th album came out in 2010. Second in the trilogy, it was another 1-2 punch after the after boxer. From this one reading the was. I guess he felt a lot of pressure following the success of boxer. I think it shows again. We kind of mentioned the. Lyrics, very anxiety ridden and aggressive. Standouts for me were terrible love, blood buzz, Ohio, two other like fan favorites, I guess and. I think it follows. Off of the. The self assurance and and and sort of improved singing and tighter musicality of off of boxer. It felt like a small expansion of their musical landscape. It's largely the same packaged a little bit different. This one I felt. As much as it was still personal, I think this is 1 where he did a little bit better job of making it relatable or you know brighten it up enough to add a layer of relatability that maybe the other one, maybe a little bit more too dense or whatever to to make them as accessible. And that's why it came in at my #3.

Boxer Ohh #2 is boxer. Whoa bold you put the.

#2 what? What? What did? You do sleep well these number, yeah.

It's right out of the gate.

Take that tight vested to Matt.

Bernier, right. Take that beast. Put you in the ground beef.

Dear boxer, great album. It was the one that I and it might be an emotional bias, the one that I listened to 1st and over and over and over again. And it is. The I think the first one were felt definitively top to bottom, a national album and they had established their sound like the one before. Alligator definitely had. Is much tighter than the 1st 2:00. Felt cohesive, but boxer was. Wall to wall bangers like another one that I could.

Yeah, it's not.

I could listen straight through and back. Oh my God. This song is so good.

Yeah, they're sad banger.

Man, I could drink.

To this one by myself all day.

Close the curtains. I need that darkness. Yeah, just a great album, I think. Really announced to the wider world, we are the national. I think Alligator is the underground hit and then they've really got. Widespread acclaim with boxer, so I think it's important in their their evolution, both in their own artistic development and. As as public figures and as a band, my top. Songs are fake Empire apartment story and start a war.

I already did my #2.

That was trouble. Will find me, yeah.

Can I I? There's not a lot of options left. I'm pretty sure we know each others. Number one, yeah. So you can just do your number one and then I'll do my #1. Which was your? #2. Yes. And then we can move. On to general thoughts and beliefs.

Thoughts and beliefs?

Live in Brussels.

Why did I choose hi Violet. That's a good question. I'm not even, I'm not. Even sure I can. Answer that it was. I think it was. The peak where they moved out of. Is the like the perfect balance of the energy and the kind of indie rock? Of their early career, but before they went. Yeah, tight and really restricted, I guess, anxiety, even though you said high violets, a very anxious album. It just felt like the right balance for me. And they're at their their. Most full and. Being overwrought and. And it's another one that I can listen to. Talk to bottom.

Yeah, for sure that the, again, the trilogy are very top to bottom listeners, yeah. My number one was again, your number two boxer fourth album in the in the. Catalog 2007 my notes on this one where it says breakthrough turning point. I think like the template that Mister November set, especially this one is coming out the gates for with fake empire. Yeah, you have now like the very tight drums like forefront in the mix and after. Yeah, coming off the the the the first three albums like this one is like you said is like this is we are now.

Hear us roar, we hear us roar.

Here, as do the national anthem. Yeah, they're most confident album up to that date. I really I again, I really love the drums album, tight drums, driving drums and at times even the drums seem to be sort of like a counterpoint to the lyrics because. They're so high up in the. Mix and here is really definitely where Matt. Really finds his voice vocally where he completely I feel like drops. That whole drunken crooner thing completely. I put his vocals where he finds a pair file. And yeah, again, the the lyrics I think are finally more focused or stronger. There's a better use of vengers baritone and better thinking use of his sort of turns of phrase and phrasing of his. Lyrics and just a yeah, a clear statement of the band's intensity and the documentation of their minor dramas. And another great album. Yeah, this was then performing at oops. The producers wedding or something?

Yeah, I was looking through the album covers and trying to figure out how many of them are photos of the band in some way.

Even starting with the first one is the drummer, right?

Oh, that's well.

Or is it that the the one he's in? The pool. Oh, second.

Yeah, that's the second album. Ohh no, no, no.

That's that's the first one. Right when Devin dwarfed in the pool.

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Does alligators like squealy colored lines? Or with that sad songs.

That's. Hi, Violet.

Right. Well, that was the the graffiti looking one that was, they had another squiggly.

I thought, squiggly lined album.

Sad songs for Dirty Lovers house.

Sad song that's.

The one it's like an S or something.

Yeah, it's the colors that go across someones face.

Oh, that's a face, OK.

I think so. I always thought it. Was a face. I guess it does.

Look like a face. Yeah, I don't know.

But alligator, I think that's one of the the designers on there. Sleep well beast. It's the band in the one of the studios.

Ah, the the one. The one of the the desert studio. Yeah, where they filmed also that Taylor Swift making of documentary.

Boxer, that's them. And you know, one of the guys in the pool for their debut album. Outstanding. Of course, yeah. Even their EP's that we ignored.

Well, how many of those two, right, Virginia and Cherry? Tree are there more? No, the Karen Besser chronicles Karen.

Well, that wraps it up. I can't believe it. We went through nine albums in 5 minutes. You can't really burn through that. Thoughts, thoughts and beliefs?

What's in what's in store for?

The national what's in store? I don't know. I don't think anybody knows. Not even the designers themselves.

What do you think they're they're next album. They just released this one less than. A month ago. I think it'll. It'll go on that Radiohead route where it's all.

I did read a couple of in the past, I've read that some people compare them as like the American counterpoint to Radiohead, especially as they got more into the electronic orchestration. Well, I don't know if that's an accurate depiction or whatever, but yeah, but I could see them going.

More this route now and I. Think just based on. I don't see them going back to like yelling outside of maybe at the concert, right? Doing a live version of their songs or whatever. I don't see them doing it again in their albums. Unless something really, really drastic happens.

Probably not, yeah.

I think we get more of this soft, gentle orchestrations continuing, you know, wax, wax, poetic, waxing on the, the anxieties and daily depressions of.

Life that could.

Capture a little more. I'm easy to find.

I think, yeah. And hopefully now maybe that he has refound his footing or whatever the the next one gets a little UPS the ante a little bit, but yes, if they're going to go that route better, I am easy to find, then I'll old Frankie.

Probably going to be more on collaborations. They're going full.

That would be interesting to see them do a covers album. I I wonder what they would pick by just.

Hopefully they do smooth. Well, Matt, such a fan of Leonard and. I think that would be too obvious, too on the nose. You probably wouldn't want to do that.

All the suited bunch.

Yeah, but we'll see if they did a couple covers.

I album ohh like Bob. Dylan, I will.

I never want to hear that it's Christmas.

Time must be Santa. You can listen to that daily. What are you talking about?

Ohh that's a terrible. Ohh God ohh. Had a really intriguing question.

What about provoke people?

Not to know and.

What you trying to remember about people sort of criticisms of the band that they're too boring, too Sammy. I I I tend to agree with that they are, like we mentioned a couple of them are growers, you have to.

Really, the grow is not showers.

You have to listen and explore with the album. Very few we're going to get you on the. First, listen because. They're not that type of music or whatever. Except for maybe boxer. But yeah, even though they cover a lot of the same terrain, they look under.

Sure, and I think. It's like a band having the signature sound. It's like, well, what are you gonna do? Like, that's that's the way they do it. And if they can find a new way to approach the. Material where they're musically or lyrically. Then why not like? Yeah, there should be some consistency between. Because it's the same group of people doing it, it's going to sound. The same, yeah. To a certain extent, and if. Right, like the sophomore slump problem is always. That these were like the leftovers from the first album, like you had 18 songs used. 12 are your best ones. Right. Like you had a lifetime to write the first album. And a lot of the songs from the second album were just leftovers, so it doesn't sound as good. It's like, oh, this is kind of sounds like. Besides from the first album. But yeah, I don't. And if they do sound the same, I don't mind it because I like the sound. So yeah, give them. More of like.

Oh, this tastes so good. I don't want any more of it, though. It's like, no. You give me all you got.

Give me all your loving. Yeah, that's how I feel about all the naysayers. There is a level of sameness, but when you delve into it, you can see the differences. Especially now, having listened to the whole beginning to end, you really see a growth.

They are growers.

Thoughts and beliefs, yeah. I think like the covers.

They're going somewhere. I tell you.

These these young kids. I wish I could do a.

Casey Kasem, I can't even remember. Like, it sounds like.

That doesn't count.

It's still crazy case.

She's like, no.

Yes, it is. So he's known to do the voice. Yes, in his radio voice.

What's that world's youngest teenager?

I thought it was.

Ohh, that's right. But he's kind of like the proto him, right? Cases like the Proto de Clark.

I thought Dick Clark.

Came before. Ohh.

I don't know. They're both.

Old he was Dick Clark was.

But Dick Clark?

Outlived him, like in the USO.

Like I kicked for the.

Troops he was playing with Glenn Miller.

That's how he got American Bandstand because he was familiar with big band music.

Is that right? From this time in the? No way that the other guy's older than the other guy cause.

The other guy died first.

Casey Caton, it's true.

People can die at any age. That's always something.

Right. But generally the older people die first, and I believe Kasim.

Remember when he went missing?

Yes, but then he, then his wife, for whoever caretaker said he's not missing. Him the whole time. Because it was. One of those kind of.

He was hanging.

Layout with Simmons.

They're matching tank times, wasn't it? It was like another one of those famous like Family will dispute.

Yeah, yeah, like old man case.

Gonna wield around so it's.

So Casey Kasem was born 1932.

When old Dickie Clark was.

Because Dick Clark was. Still rocking new. Year's Eve on up until like five years ago.

What? No. Yeah, he looked.

It's been longer than that.

Not great, but he was. They trotted him out there.

It was a little weekend at Bernie's situated.

I was gonna say I was like. Ohh, like uncle Bernie.

Like Bernie Sanders?

I'm asking you once again.

To listen to wash the motor up with you. Dick Clark was born. Who would you?

Say was older, I say Kayson was older.

Dick Clark, 1929. Yeah, he died 2012.

When did Kasim die 2014? Ohh damn it, I was up for two. Years on both it's.

The old switcheroo.

It was, I guess, OK, so he's older, which is why he got the. Title of oldest teenager.

Well, because he was. He was doing the the new. Year's Eve forever.

And ever, right?

And even his. Radio Top 40s or whatever, every weekend.

American Music Awards Dick Clark Productions produce that.

Oh, that's right, yeah. Is is the production company still?

Around I think so.

You got bought out by Desi Lou.

Yeah, used to be by the Acapulco and Burbank.

Was he known to frequent there for some margaritas?

Probably happy hour. Yeah, that's.

Why don't you? Why he was there.

This song from 1967.

He was getting.

Use guest DJ. Do you believe?

That he's a what?

Yes, him. Casey kasem.

They've inhabited the body of. Ryan Seacrest? Yes. There's a freaky Friday situation. Ryan Seacrest has been dead for. Since 2012 and Dick Clark. Is living inside, yeah.

I think right secret would be more interesting if that happened.

Absolutely yes, I believe.

But they say, do you believe that he, I know they try to peg him as such. But do you believe he's the neck like the air?

The clerks into Pagan.

I have no idea what that dudes into or was into. Maybe I don't know.

No one was paying, that's what. You just said.

You know, I said that every pigs rest as you let me finish my sentence. They peg him as then the the the heir to the throne of Dick Clark. Right. They tried to cause they make them like now do the he does the New York Rock and he's. Get out there secrets unless you want to go back to 98.7.

This hurts me more than it does.

You know, it's funny. The thing the first time I remember Ryan Seacrest, he was on that dating show. Where they would have the talking bubbles.

Do you remember that show was a?

Blind date blind date he was on blind date.

This was when he was still he was still in LA.

As a contestant.

Yeah, radio DJ on whatever was *. 98.7 yeah. But he showed up as a contestant. Ohh on blind date. It was funny. It was way before anybody knew. Him. Yeah, yeah.

I was gonna say he doesn't have the the, the, well, the cultural cachet, but American Idol, so big. And then he was on Kelly and Ryan. He took over.

Up until recently.

And then he came back and was like. Crawling around like.

Yeah, he came back as a guest, like a week after he left. He tried to.

Jay Leno, the show people were like.

Wait, I didn't. Know who he was crawling in on the floor.

So hopped up. Yeah, cause like. Oh, did you get into, like, animals or trees or something? It was about like, different. He's like, oh, I have so much free time now, huh? He, like, got into a couple of different hobbies and like, oh, well, what were you learning about, like, most recently? And it was between like animals and something else. Like, well, I'll give you a clue. And then he started, like, crawling around.

Oh my God. I never thought it was.

It's like his Tom Cruise on the couch. Someone saying him like?

Switch that guy.

Hit something always seemed wrong about him.

The back of the head.

Yeah, missing a fuse or something. Maybe too many fuses, I don't know.

He's a good broadcaster, he's.

OK, he, like, that's he lacks personality of a Clark or a case. And that other guy, Chico.

The one with the. Mail. Yeah, Prince.

Wasn't one of them on the radio? It was. It was. No. Ohh yeah.

I was checking on the man. With with the Prince and senior before he killed himself.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's right.

Tragically, but I just want to say. He doesn't have that.

And and Grandpa Joe.

From Willy Wonka.

Wasn't he, man?

Oh, I don't know. You mean like, biblically, when God made man?

No, he was he was the man.

Right. I have no idea.

Something Albert Prince. Fat Albert.

Don't bring up.

Fat Albert and the man. Yeah, I get what you're saying. Yeah, you're right. When you think about it, he did have the cachet like his American Idol could be the the the equivalent of a bandstand.

I didn't know José Feliciano did the theme song for chicken on the.

A diverse time.

Norman Lear production.

What a diverse time those 70s.

I need the cast, you idiots.

Who was the man?

You're the man, Miss Mullins.

Thank you. Jack Albertson.

Is that him? Is that Uncle Joe? Yeah, grandpa Joe. I mean, grandpa, they want to make everybody an. Uncle these days.

Oh, there he is, yeah.

He was the man.

Did he look the same?

Yeah, I think so.

So he was always an old guy trying. To take advantage. Of a younger person.

I think he was. He was also the the Monsters on Maple Street.

Was that the predecessor to the Munsters?

Or the rip off.

That's a Rod Serling, like twilight zone. Kind of like a war of the worlds. Oh, there's aliens and he was like one of the. He's like something's going on here.

Now that you mentioned that I can see the black and. White. Yeah, yeah. I don't know. If I ever saw the whole thing, but I now I know you're talking about cause I can see him.

Let me remember Jack Albertson.

Oh, is the voice of. Either Fox or hound.

In that Disney cartoon, Fox and the Hound? But they all had youthful voices.

Just because you're old doesn't mean you can't have a youthful voice.

That doesn't mean you.

That's that's ages.

Cannot, but he. Definitely did not because he didn't sound youthful in Charlie and that cartoon was.

Because I'm supposed to. Be an old man. Yeah, but that.

Cartoon with like 30.

He's on Gunsmoke. What a legendary career.

They don't have careers like that anymore. Such varied cream. Grandpa Joe RIP.

Yeah. No, he's.

Still no, he's not. You know, it's impossible.

It's highly unlike it, yeah.

There's no way here.

No, it didn't. There's no way. What was he? 1000 years old 80.

All right, close. He's born in 1907.

What? No. What? What's?

That math doesn't math out.

Born in 19/07/1981 definitively takes place after 1907.

What year did you die?

Ohh 81 My mistake 1990.

Yeah, but what?

One, I was like what? That does not track.

Let's still would have. It would have been just. 84 It still would.

Have worked from 81 to 91. No, that's ten years later.

I mean, he he would still have been born in 1907. Then he just died 10 years later than you thought.

So then he would have only still been eight. Yeah. So he would in 84, he would have died at 84. He was 74 years old when he died.

Been 10 years later. Ohh 74 OK I got it completely. Mixed up I think. Said 84.

We're not good with numbers over here.

We barely got through counting.

Down from 9. Ohh my.

I I was asking. Although it was a dumb question given that we were so close to the end was I was just trying to think of when other shows do rankings.

Right, right. Countdown. Yeah.

If they just let you do and then you do. But I don't think so, right. They always did like. If you're if.

You're 9 my dad.

Was. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Ohh well, they're saying, but don't think sometimes also do like, oh, that that was your name. But this was my four. And then you give thoughts so yeah. So they match up for the listener. Because if not, you're like. Going back and forth. Back and forth. And we just a late late. In the stage question.

We do things our own way now that we're at the last entry.

How she structure?

This episode we keep. It loose here, there's always entity.

Talking over each other all. The time separate tracks.

Ohh alright on that. Notes on those notes the national. We salute you.

They're not just a national they're a national treasure. Goodnight and good luck.