HTM On The Line with BRYANT HAWKINS SR.
This Podcast is the place where we celebrate the hardworking professionals in the field of Healthcare Technology Management. It's going to be for HTM by HTM, and more importantly this podcast is going to be fun. This is where you will hear HTM professionals getting the exposure and credit they ALL deserve.
I also have a youtube channel, where you can see weekly motivational videos. Click the link and please subscribe to my channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCNQFL03ijsHjsLAKOX0uGOA
HTM On The Line with BRYANT HAWKINS SR.
Leading with Heart: Andrea Brainard's Journey Through Healthcare Technology Management
Catch the latest HTM On the Line episode featuring Andrea Brainard remarkable journey in healthcare technology management, a testament to resilience and dedication. Her insights serve as a example for leading with heart and intellect, shaping a legacy of empowerment and growth. Tune in for inspiration!
This podcast is sponsored by The College of Biomedical Equipment Technology. You can find out more information about this outstanding institution at CBET.EDU.
Welcome to HTM On the Line. I'm your host, Bryant Hawkins Sr. In this episode, we're joined by Andrea Brainard, Senior Director at Children's Health in Dallas, Texas, who brings over 25 years of expertise in the healthcare technology management industry, From her initial steps as a biomed tech to her influential role as a senior leader. Andrea embodies a leadership philosophy rooted in trust and empowerment, demonstrating its pivotal role in fostering team development and learning. Our conversation explores the challenges and triumphs within the HTM field, from enhancing team dynamics to addressing critical issues like cybersecurity and the ongoing technician shortage in healthcare technology management. Stay tuned for an insightful episode with Andrea Brainard. Andrea Brainard, how are you doing this evening? Glad to have you on.
Andrea Brainard:HTM Online. Thanks for having me, bryant, good to talk to you.
Bryant Hawkins Sr.:Yeah, finally we get to get on the podcast. We talk a lot, we see each other in person, but this is, to me, long overdue. I'm glad you've given me this chance. You've been on other people's shows. I won't say you know I gotta.
Andrea Brainard:I won't say no names, but well, thank you for having me. It's an honor, thank you right.
Bryant Hawkins Sr.:Yeah, we kind of both have something common. We both work for children's hospitals, so I think we can have a great conversation because we see the same same environment every day. But before we get going, why don't you introduce yourself to the ones that may not know who you are, but just give us a little background on you. You don't have to go into no deep 30-minute. I know you can go a long time you've been doing this a while but just give us a brief background of yourself.
Andrea Brainard:Yeah, all right. Andrea Brainerd, I'm the senior director at Children's Health in Dallas. I've been with the company for going on 21 years this year been in the HTM community oh geez, I'm going to date myself here. Almost 30 years now. It's all I've ever done since I graduated college as a wee little girl, and I've kind of worked my way up into the position I'm in now. I did field service for a couple of years prior to coming on with children's as a biomed tech too, but pretty much it. I mean that's all I've done. My whole life is just HTM, um, but pretty much it. I mean that's all I've done my whole life is just HTM.
Bryant Hawkins Sr.:How long have you been in their leadership role that you were in? I guess not in the role you were in now but how long have you been in a leadership position?
Andrea Brainard:Oh man, now I'm gonna have to put the way back on, way back machine on, cause you know COVID kind of took out a couple of years that you know we're all going to forget about Gosh. If I had to put a number to it, at least close to 10 years maybe. Okay, right, right so if not, if not, I'm gonna have to look on my LinkedIn profile, Cause that's where you know, that's where all the stats and dates are 10 years feels like 31 years. Right, it all runs together.
Bryant Hawkins Sr.:How would you define Andrea's leadership style if you had to put it into words?
Andrea Brainard:Oh, that's a tough one. I try to stay hands off for the most part. I don't hover, I don't micromanage. I want people to grow and learn, but I want to kind of do it. Not that I'm not engaged I am very engaged with my leaders but I don't like to hover. My leaders know when they come to me that I'm going to provide them with the guidance or whatever they need. But my approach from a day to day is you're in this position because you know what you're doing, so you run, you run your business and if you need me, I'm always here. So that's kind of high level my approach.
Bryant Hawkins Sr.:The towns we live in. Obviously, things have evolved in HTM so quickly. What do you think may have played a part in some of your hands-off leadership style with regards to the way things are evolving in HTM right now?
Andrea Brainard:Yeah, honestly, I don't know that it has. You know it's an evolution. It's more of I've had leaders in the past that I didn't like their style. So as I continue to grow and educate myself and read all these leadership books and take leadership classes, my style kind of evolved from that. I try to be very, you know, I approach things as I want people to do things the way that I would want them taught to me. If that makes sense, so do as you're told or whatever you know.
Andrea Brainard:So I didn't want to go down the road of well, I don't like how I'm being treated by this leader, so I know this is not what I want to do. So that's kind of how my style has evolved over the years is just what would I like and what makes how do I think people learn best? And we have these conversations in our leadership huddles about you know, hey, what do you need, what kind of approach do you like? And most of the leaders that report to me they like the same thing. They're like you know you let me do my job and if I need something I come to you. So that has just kind of evolved over the years Because I don't like I've had leaders that hover and tell me how to do things, as opposed to letting me do it and potentially fail. They just tell me how to do it and I'm like well, I'm not learning anything from that, right, so it's, I don't like that approach, so I try not to take it, and I've tried not to be that way with my leaders.
Bryant Hawkins Sr.:Like you wouldn't ask anything of them. You probably wouldn't do yourself as a leader.
Andrea Brainard:Exactly, or that I probably haven't done, and that even goes to frontline staff. When I first went into leadership, it was a very hard transition for me personally to go from a technician to a manager Because again there were certain expectations of being a leader and one of those was well, you can't be at the bench every day. Like that's just not feasible. So it was very hard for me to let go of that little piece of me and it took me a long time. And back then there was a running joke that oh, if Andrea comes in and scrubs, watch out, she's gonna do circles around time. And back then there was a running joke that oh, if Andrea comes in and scrubs, watch out, she's going to do circles around somebody.
Andrea Brainard:And over the years you know, that has, just as I evolved into more late you know, growing in my leadership position that has kind of dwindled. But yet I've done everybody's job in the shop, like I know how to do it and I've been there and I've done that and I, as as people, have moved on, kind of. When I was a tech that knew me as a technician. Now the new people, they don't. They don't all they know me as as a leader, they don't know that I was once a biomed other than, yeah, I was once in your position. But I try to look at it from the lens of I'm not going to ask somebody to do something that is that I haven't either done myself or I know it can't can be done by you.
Bryant Hawkins Sr.:So what type of challenges would you say being a female leader, what type of challenges you think you've seen in the industry for female leaders?
Andrea Brainard:I believe in the principle of give it your best work and you're going to get rewarded for that work and I feel like that's that's why I'm in the position. I'm in the principle of give it your best work and you're going to get rewarded for that work and I feel like that's why I'm in the position I'm in. I have proven myself that I can do the job. So I was. You know, given those opportunities, I've had a couple of bad leaders here and there throughout the years, but I would say, since I've been in leadership, that I've had good leaders that support me and they've all been males. So I feel like I haven't had some of those challenges in my leadership position.
Andrea Brainard:Now, when I was a technician my very first job out of college yes, I definitely had challenges there. At the particular hospital I was working at, there was some older generation there that are probably fixing to retire. So you know you're talking 30 years ago somebody that was in their 50s or 60s and they were of the mindset still that women should be at home cooking and cleaning and they were very vocal about certain things. And they were vocal about my heritage and where I came from. So I had challenges being a female in that aspect very early on in my career. But I think, as I've progressed, those challenges to me seem to diminish, or I just didn't pay attention to them and I just I'm going to work my butt off and I'm going to. This is what I want to do and I'm going to keep proving myself. And my leaders as I grew up, so to speak, saw that and you know I was I was afforded the opportunities to progress in my career.
Bryant Hawkins Sr.:Awesome. I promise you I won't beat you up with female questions in the HTA industry, but you mentioned your culture and background. Now, diversity and inclusion is a huge thing today. Now how do you foster an inclusive culture within your team?
Andrea Brainard:I treat everybody equally. I mean everybody has a voice, everybody has a seat at the table. You know speaking, you know diversity and culture. You know A lot of companies, particularly mine. They're doing a lot of training around that and I think it's a good thing, because there's there is still a lot of biases out in the world today. I mean I think we're seeing it, you know, on the news daily, so it's it's tough. I get it. I feel like I have my eyes pretty open Again. I'm not from this country, originally Born and raised in Germany. Both of my parents are German. I've had diversity in my life. You know, back when I was born there was East and West Germany and not to get. I'm sorry if I'm getting into too many details, but I think that you know this kind of lends to my thinking. You know I grew up being called a Nazi because I was born and raised in.
Bryant Hawkins Sr.:Germany.
Andrea Brainard:Yet I was born in West Germany, grew up there, I was there when the wall fell. So I have, I feel like personally and I could say this till I'm blue in the face and people might not believe me, but I don't I have a whole different outlook on people in general. I didn't see my first African American person until I came to the United States and to me it was like okay, I mean, they're a different color, but so what? Like I don't, I don't differentiate when it comes to certain things, and I think that's helped me keep my eyes open, so to speak, and and be more diverse and have a different outlook when it comes to diversity and inclusion.
Bryant Hawkins Sr.:I noticed one time before probably stalking your page a while ago, you had, um, and I think I teased you about your team y'all dressed up in was it sports jerseys? I think was it during htm week. I think something. Something's going on and I thought that was. I threw my dig and they're like where's? Where are the saints jerseys? So I think that's a pretty cool thing y'all did that week and dressing up in different team sports what other type of things in that aspect you do to make fun, things where you get everyone's coming together from different types of liking, whether it's sports or culture or music, whatever that you may do with your team.
Andrea Brainard:You know, definitely during HTM week we do a lot of things. Um, you know, this year or last year we had we had a lot of fun. One was, you know, dress up, flat throwback Thursday. So dress up. You know, I had people coming in in the seventies gear and sixties gear and a lot of eighties and things like that. So HTM week is always a fun week, cause I try to make it. You know, we try to have fun that week Throughout the year. I mean we do.
Andrea Brainard:We always do a traditional Thanksgiving potluck for the entire HTM team and we have 65 people now. So it's it's a large group, but we all I I pre-book a room early in the year and everybody brings a dish and we just chill out. And this year, you know, we played some games and people got prizes and I think everybody had a great time. And then, around you know, christmas holidays, we always do a gift exchange. Usually it's, you know, $20, $25 gift. You wrap it. It's a white elephant type of thing.
Andrea Brainard:Last we tried something different, where it was you have to bring a funny or weird mug like coffee mug and a bottle of your favorite, a mini like airplane bottle of your favorite liquor. Um, so that was fun and and instead of doing the white elephant, we read. We read the left right game. So you, you know, you come up with a story and I just pick them off the internet and every time you say left, it gets passed to the left, and every time you say right, it gets passed to the right in the story. So, uh, we did that and everybody, you know, I think everybody had fun and everybody walked away with a cool new bug. And then a little, you know, mini airplane bottle of liquor. But you know who't like liquor, especially on my team.
Bryant Hawkins Sr.:Me and you constantly run into each other at the trade shows and obviously the reason we go to the trade shows so we can stay with whatever the latest things happen in our industry. So just my answer to this question how do you stay ahead of this industry that's changing so much with regards to technology trends? How do you stay ahead of that with you and your team on the forefront.
Andrea Brainard:We're trying to get tools in our tool belt that helps our team to move forward, make sure our equipment is safe. You know I'm, I subscribe to. You know all the newsletters and all the blogs and everything that comes out and I just try to, you know, on my way home from work or if I don't have a meeting and I'm just doing emails. You know I turn on a podcast and just try to educate myself and then I usually share that with my team, especially if it's something important, not everything I, because then it's overload for them. It's like oh, why are you sending me this other thing? But there's always hot topics that come up and we talk about those.
Andrea Brainard:The HTM manager currently does weekly huddles and if there's something that is of note I communicate that to him and he communicates it to the team. You know, most recently I got a email forwarded to me from one of the biomed groups directors that I'm on for all the children's hospitals about a cybersecurity attack. Hey, just FYI, so-and-so got hacked. Just sharing, sharing is caring. And of course I send that to my cybersecurity guys and then I send it to my team to say, hey, you guys see anything weird or unusual. You need to make sure you let somebody in leadership know. So we can. We can escalate that to see if there's a true issue. But I try to. You know I try to forward emails that are pertinent to the team and if it needs, if it's noteworthy that we need to talk about it, you know we'll grab a quick huddle and chat as those things come up.
Bryant Hawkins Sr.:Yes, that's great. Now I hear you mentioning your huddles. It seemed like you meet with your managers very often, or at least once a week. Now I don't know if you can do this, but is there something you maybe can you share? A particular project in the past or right now that you guys was working on and it was very challenging, but then you successfully worked together to get over that challenge. Is there something you could share with us?
Andrea Brainard:Yeah, so we actually just finished deploying, uh, all of our new Alaris infusion pumps literally last week, and I, you know, htm comprised. Where I work, htm comprised of 65 people, that is, you know, you've got the traditional biomed group. If you will, I also manage medical equipment, so they're the ones that distribute, centrally distribute, all medical devices, including the Alaris pumps. They clean it, maintain PARs on the floors, etc. Everybody came together to get it done in a week, as opposed to if it was just put on, you know, two or three people, we'd still be doing it. So my team, they do a really great job at hey, we've got a task and if we all get out there and do it, we'll get it done that much faster. So we just stop operations for a couple of days, knock it out and then get back to it.
Bryant Hawkins Sr.:What do you see the biggest challenges facing our industry in the next three to five years, not mentioning cybersecurity, because we know that's there. Other than cybersecurity, what do you see some other challenges facing us in the next three to five years?
Andrea Brainard:Not enough technicians. I mean, I think it's something we're already seeing. Covid kind of exasperated that, as everybody you know, the older generation decided, oh, I'm just going to go ahead and retire. But I think that's going to be a huge challenge. We don't have enough students coming out of some of these colleges. Technicians are getting harder to find. In larger metropolitan areas like DFW, where I'm at, everybody's vying for the same positions. So if somebody leaves it's probably because another hospital is paying them a little bit more, and I think that's a huge issue. We've got to get this industry out in the forefront. There's still people that have no clue what we do. Industry out in the forefront. There's still people that have no clue what we do. I was. I got an article the other day about the top 100 jobs.
Bryant Hawkins Sr.:You've never heard of, and medical equipment repair was number five. I saw that same article from you, right?
Andrea Brainard:And so I started digging into it and I was like, okay, so it's the top 100. And then there was another one top top 100. Now I can't remember I don't know if it was the best paid or jobs or something but on that list medical equipment repair was 26. You know, I do feel like we've always been underpaid in general. I won't say what I was making 30 years ago, it's crazy. But I mean the exponential increase in starting pay is ridiculous. It's crazy. You know, we're still underpaid compared to some of our IT counterparts when we've got compliance and regulatory requirements that we have to abide by, regulatory requirements that we have to abide by. But I mean, we're getting there. But the shortage of technicians and trying to figure out how do we get more people to know about this? Because it's not. I don't want to dismiss it, it's not a hard job, if you will. To me it's a very rewarding job and I can teach anybody how to fix medical equipment. To me it's a very rewarding job and I can teach anybody how to fix medical equipment.
Andrea Brainard:But I think you mentioned it in one of your podcasts that you know you're going to the high schools and talking to students and stuff and that's fantastic and we need more of that. But I almost feel like sometimes in some of the high schools, by the time they're you know, sophomores, juniors some of these kids already know what they want to do and they've got their mind made up. My kid's a freshman. He knows exactly what he wants to do when he graduates and I'm like that's fantastic because I can tell you, when I graduated high school, I had no clue what I wanted to do.
Bryant Hawkins Sr.:Yeah, they have resources and things, I think, to help them.
Bryant Hawkins Sr.:But I'm going to tell you this much what you mentioned is exactly true, and that's the reason I go to the high schools and for some of those kids, for the ones that know what they want to do I guess it depends on the high schools you go to, because I go to some high schools they'll tell me they know what they want to do. I'm like, oh, that's great. So I asked them the next question. I said well, how many credits do you need to obtain what you want to go do in college? I don't know what school teaches what you want to do, I don't know how much it's going to cost. So sometimes they'll say what they want to do, but then, you know, ask them a little deeper. Okay, so what school does what school presents that? And some people are telling me that's kind of a hard question to ask a kid Like nah, these kids are brilliant, they can go on that internet and find any and everything, so they can figure out that part too.
Bryant Hawkins Sr.:I said, and I just think with our industry, seniors are almost too late. You gotta catch them as freshmen, freshmen, I think, even in middle school by the time elementary, I mean, if you put it on their mind with elementary. We need to catch them. We need some older ones. We can't wait to. We can't start 15 years hopefully to get there. But if we catch them like night graders and they see you every year, that's what it's going to take Not just a few people, it's going to take all of us, because that's the only way we're going to have to invest in our industry, because it's a great industry. Like you said, it's not challenging. I mean it's challenging, but you have the tools.
Andrea Brainard:It has its challenges. Yeah, everybody's got the tools.
Bryant Hawkins Sr.:Exactly, and I ain't talking about physical tools. We have all tools and right. There's a saying. I always say you give me the wheel, I'll teach him the skill, Cause that's the challenge.
Bryant Hawkins Sr.:That's the challenges I have is finding people that just have the passion like you and you're not going to find that all the time, but it's all about that leadership role you play and look like that's why you have a great team, because you were there and you know what they're going through, because you've been in their shoes and that's reflecting on your team. And as far as this um, this challenge with staffing, like you mentioned, these young kids could fix that so quick. We just got to get to them.
Andrea Brainard:Well, and I and I think a piece of that too is hitting some of the parents too. Jewel and I talked about this a while back. You know it's like let's think outside of the box. It's like we need to talk to the parents because and and the other one was the underserved community, right, the ones that can't afford to go to a four-year college. I paid. I think my degree cost me $8,000. I mean, that's nothing.
Andrea Brainard:You know some of the two-year colleges, biomed programs. You know they're less than they're less than 10 grand easily in today's world. And it's like well, what, what do we? We hit, we've got to hit those, try to hit those specialized pockets where it's like, hey, look, here's an affordable degree and here's what you get back on your investment day one out of college. Like we have those numbers. And you know, I get those parents to kind of help us push like, hey, here's this, here's this career field that is an excellent return on your investment. As soon as you get out and you're I mean in today's society like you're going to get a job. There's so many jobs open across the country.
Bryant Hawkins Sr.:I'm actually this one here just like a personal question. I'm actually this one here just like a personal question. Oh boy, if you had to reflect on your career, because it's been a couple of decades there I won't say triple, but we'll say a couple what are you? What are you most proud of?
Andrea Brainard:going back to school and finishing my bachelor's degree.
Bryant Hawkins Sr.:Awesome.
Andrea Brainard:I um, now I got my associate's degree, I started working. Um, I I had my kid a little later in life tried to go back to school when I had him. I couldn't do it. Um, everybody was thought you know everybody's like oh, you're, you're not gonna be able to do it. I'm like sure I can, I can have a baby and go to school, no problem. Well, that didn't work out.
Andrea Brainard:You know life happens, activities, you know school, et cetera. And then I was like you know what? I've got to put my foot down and finish this, if not for me to show my son that his mom is going to finish her degree and is going to get that. And I wanted to do it for me and my family, not for anybody else, not because I needed it for my position by any means. So I talked to my husband. I said, look, I'm gonna need you to to handle the night stuff so I can sit down and do my schoolwork every night. And I did it for about I only needed a couple more credits, so another. I think it was a year and a half, two years, and everybody was able to see me walk across that stage and that was awesome.
Bryant Hawkins Sr.:Now, no doubt for you to accomplish goals, someone had to bring you there. You know we can't do anything on our own. Do you have a mentor that maybe shaped your career or helped you get to where you are?
Andrea Brainard:you know I've had a lot of mentors over the years. I don't know that I can pick out any one particular person. I think as I've grown, the mentors that I've had in my life have shaped me to get to that next part, to get to that next, you know, if I'm going from a technician to a manager, manager to director, et cetera, I think each person has helped me at that time, kind of mentor me to get to that next phase of my career.
Bryant Hawkins Sr.:Okay, since you said that there's been multiple mentors that helped you. How do you approach mentorship then? As far as in the ACM industry, how do you go about now? Being all the experience you have, you are now in the position to be part of a mentorship for someone. So how do you approach that?
Andrea Brainard:Right, I mean I would love to be a mentor to others. You know, when I go to conferences, you know I say hey, if you, if you ever want to talk, if you ever have any questions, you know, whatever formal or informal, you know, always reach out. Some people do, some people don't. I'm part of Amy's mentorship program sorry and I've had two mentors through mentees, through that and that was fun. I just I get excited when I get to talk about biomed. I get excited about, you know, teaching the younger generation and and trying to figure out what you know. Do they want to go into a specialty, um, do they want to work for an ISO, oem, for the hospital? And try to try to help them think through that and not just automatically, oh, I'm going to work for a hospital. Well, now you have other choices. There's many other choices that you can do. So I like being a mentor and I try. I try to be open about it and sometimes I have people that reach out and sometimes I don't and I I mean that's okay.
Bryant Hawkins Sr.:That's awesome. And I would tell you something, andrea, you, you. You can be a mentor to someone without them even knowing. Just by you consistently doing what you're doing, I can tell you, you encourage me and I feed off your energy and when I see you in person, I get that same feeling from you and it's encouraging just to see you continuously doing what you're doing every day. That's a mentorship to someone. Believe me, trust me, because it motivates me. So keep doing a great job you're doing and I want you to give I don't want to say words of wisdom, because everybody uses that word what kind of advice could you give for everyone? I'm not going to say young or old, but just some general advice you can give to someone in the HTM industry that can go across the board, where it can help a young person in the industry, mid-level or just in it. What could you share? I?
Andrea Brainard:know you think I'd have some great wisdom. I don't. I mean, I always stick by do unto others as you would do unto them mentality, and it's okay to brag on yourself Again, do it appropriately. But if you did something like super outstanding, tell somebody, tell your leader.
Bryant Hawkins Sr.:Yeah.
Andrea Brainard:Bring it up on your peak. You have to toot your own horn, otherwise some people you know somebody nobody ever will.
Bryant Hawkins Sr.:That's great advice Because it's like you said, as long as you do it with a mind, with a humility in mind, you know you're not bragging you're just sharing accomplishments you have.
Bryant Hawkins Sr.:Yeah, exactly, that's great advice. You're not? You probably got plenty more in there too, if I pull it up. Like you said, you have to have humility also in this industry, because you're going to have some challenges, especially when we deal with the health care. But the one thing I could say that I mentioned earlier, we both work at children's hospitals, so it's like it's a different. I've recently started here two years ago. I've never worked in a hospital with just strictly children.
Bryant Hawkins Sr.:It's been nikki, of course but it's just something different about working in a children's hospital, watching those kids walk around with that IV pole. It just makes you feel so much better about what we do every day, because without that IV pole and pump she couldn't walk around and see anything of value because she had to be stuck in the room. So you come to work. You're excited about coming to work because children are all over the place and it's a. I don't know how your building look, but I'm more than sure it's painted with multiple colors and lighting and it's a beautiful place.
Andrea Brainard:Oh yeah, it's pretty, for sure. Yeah, and I think everybody comes to work with a different mindset because they are treating children and it's. It's a fun place to work in general, like we do a lot of. The organization does a lot of fun things throughout the year, so we try to carry that down into our department.
Bryant Hawkins Sr.:Yeah, One thing we're doing right now is a Taylor Swift. She's coming to New Orleans in the fall, so the hospital bought four tickets and they're doing a raffle. And right now they're doing like they're promoting it. They're walking around the hospital. They'll ask people, they'll sing a few lyrics from the song and then they ask you to finish and it's hilarious watching people sing the lyrics to Taylor Swift. And one of our leadership meetings the COO senior vice president and senior director they did a Taylor Swift performance and the COO had on a wig a skirt.
Bryant Hawkins Sr.:It's on my LinkedIn page. You gotta check it out, but it's hilarious.
Andrea Brainard:I love it. Yeah, but that's do. You don't see that type of energy at other organizations, at an you know, an adult facility. But yeah, there's there's some crazy things that happens and the crazy things you see leadership do. Um, but yeah, we love it, we, we love it, we do it for the children.
Bryant Hawkins Sr.:Andrea, I appreciate you coming on. We got to do it again, man, because I know we probably can go about three hours Right. I'm glad you came on and we got to do this again more frequently, because I think we can have an episode just talking about children's hospitals and challenges. That'd be a good thing we got to do.
Andrea Brainard:Might be good. Yeah, might be a good thing. No, I appreciate you having me on. Always good to talk to you and we'll connect soon.
Bryant Hawkins Sr.:And that wraps up another engaging episode of HTM on the Line. A heartfelt thank you to Andrea Raynard for sharing her profound insights and experiences with us, providing a valuable perspective on leadership, team dynamics and the critical issues facing the healthcare technology management industry today To our listeners. Thank you for tuning in. We hope today's discussion has inspired you, enriched your understanding and sparked curiosity about the impactful world of HTM. If you found value in our conversation, please consider sharing this episode on your social media platforms to spread the word and foster a wider discussion about the HTM industry. Don't forget to subscribe to our podcast on your favorite platform to stay updated with the latest conversations. Until next time, keep pushing boundaries, stay curious and remember the future of HTM is not just about the equipment. It's about the people who make it work. I'm Brian Hawkins senior. Thank you for joining us on HTM on the line. Stay safe and stay connected.
