Unlock the often-hidden struggles of aging with Nicole Christina's expert guidance on eating disorders in later life. As a seasoned psychotherapist, Nicole illuminates the intricate ways in which major life changes like retirement or moving can intensify these battles, offering a beacon of understanding for those silently suffering. Our conversation traverses the deceptive allure of health in appearance-focused locations, the Mind diet's connection to the Mediterranean diet, and the indispensable role of a good night's sleep for mental acuity.
Join us for a poignant exploration of the dual nature of exercise: its power to ward off Alzheimer's and its potential to complicate disordered eating patterns. I share my discovery of the rebounder, an unexpectedly effective mood booster and ally against lymphedema, and stress the importance of investing in safe, quality fitness gear. Ending on a compassionate note, we discuss how to support loved ones facing these complex issues with dignity and care. This episode is a heartfelt intersection of fitness, nutrition, and the nuanced journey of aging.
Open Forum in The Villages, Florida is Produced & Directed by Mike Roth A new episode will be released most Fridays at 9 AM Direct all questions and comments to mike@rothvoice.com
If you know a Villager who should appear on the show, please contact us at: mike@rothvoice.com
Unlock the often-hidden struggles of aging with Nicole Christina's expert guidance on eating disorders in later life. As a seasoned psychotherapist, Nicole illuminates the intricate ways in which major life changes like retirement or moving can intensify these battles, offering a beacon of understanding for those silently suffering. Our conversation traverses the deceptive allure of health in appearance-focused locations, the Mind diet's connection to the Mediterranean diet, and the indispensable role of a good night's sleep for mental acuity.
Join us for a poignant exploration of the dual nature of exercise: its power to ward off Alzheimer's and its potential to complicate disordered eating patterns. I share my discovery of the rebounder, an unexpectedly effective mood booster and ally against lymphedema, and stress the importance of investing in safe, quality fitness gear. Ending on a compassionate note, we discuss how to support loved ones facing these complex issues with dignity and care. This episode is a heartfelt intersection of fitness, nutrition, and the nuanced journey of aging.
Open Forum in The Villages, Florida is Produced & Directed by Mike Roth A new episode will be released most Fridays at 9 AM Direct all questions and comments to mike@rothvoice.com
If you know a Villager who should appear on the show, please contact us at: mike@rothvoice.com
Emily:
Welcome to the Open Forum in the Villages Florida podcast. In this show we talk to leaders in the community, leaders of clubs and interesting folks who live here in the villages to give perspectives of what is happening here in the villages Florida. We hope to add a new episode most Fridays at 9am. We are a listener supported podcast. There will be shout outs for supporters in episodes. As a supporter you will get a direct email link to Mike. In season 5 we are making significant improvements and changes on an ongoing basis.
Mike Roth:
Now you can help me afford to keep making this podcast by becoming a supporter. First, a quick note about the podcast. It's available because I absolutely love doing it, despite the fact that it cost me probably more time than I can actually afford. Now I can't buy back my time, but there is one thing that you can do that would be really helpful, and that is help me to afford making this podcast. You can do that by going to the website openforuminthevillagescom and clicking on the supporter box. You are making a small donation of $3 to $10 a month and you can cancel at any time. Probably a small donation of $3 will still make a difference, and I'd really appreciate it.
Emily:
If you have a book that you would like to turn into an audio book, let us know via email to Mike at Rothvoicecom. Hope you enjoy today's show.
Mike Roth:
This is Mike Roth on open forum in the villages. Today, I'm joined by Nicole Christina, a psychotherapist with more than 30 years specializing in eating disorders in midlife and elder women. She's also the host of Zestful Aging, a multi-award winning podcast that considers many issues accompanying aging. She strives to bring optimism to aging and interviews guests from all over the world, and those people are thriving in later life. Nicole is also the author of the book Not Just Chatting how to Become a Master Podcast interviewer. Thanks for joining me today. So why, in later life, are people possibly going to develop eating disorders?
Nicole Christina:
More. And if we think about where eating disorders thrive, they thrive in places where people are having massive transitions and uncertainty in their lives. And if we think about adolescence, that is a place that certainly we see eating disorders. But then when we jump to later life, when we might be experiencing all kinds of changes retirement, empty nest, maybe we're moving to Florida, all kinds of you know maybe our partners are frail, maybe we're taking care of our parents. There's a lot of massive transition and adjustment and it can create a bit of a tailspin.
Nicole Christina:
And the thing about eating disorders or disordered eating, which is sort of the lesser version, that it helps us contain our anxiety and it makes our life very manageable. So here's an example Instead of thinking about my mom, who may be experiencing some cognitive decline, I'm focusing on how many carbs I'm not eating or how many hours at the gym I'm spending, or I might be weighing my food, or I might be fixated on getting particular you know, supposedly clean ingredients. So it's a way of sort of distilling our lives that can be a wonderful distraction to some of the complications that happen as we age.
Mike Roth:
Particular names to the eating disorders that you see, prevalent in Elder adults eating disorders and some of them.
Nicole Christina:
I mean, it's all that like the different sides of the same coin. So it's using food and or Exercise in the way to really focus. So some people might restrict calories and that would lean more in the anorexic range. Some people may Binge, which means eating more than 2,000 calories at a given time and feeling quite out of control and then maybe compensating in different ways like vomiting or over exercising or taking laxatives. So there is a wide spectrum of ways to have an unhealthy relationship with food and our bodies. But that's a good question. I don't know if there are particular ways that older people might might fall prey to this.
Nicole Christina:
I do know that there's this idea of being healthy right and that when you're in Florida and people are not wearing that many clothes and upstate New York, you know we're always wearing sweatpants and sweatshirts, but if you're down in Florida playing pickleball, there's more of you exposed right and so oh yeah, we're getting more vitamin D here for sure.
Nicole Christina:
So you know, my thought would be that people would say I'm not going to eat this, I'm gonna skip this, I'm gonna not eat any fat or not in any carbs, with the idea that it's their bodies are quite open for Assessment from their peers and I know that it kind of can how shall I say it can be disguised as I'm eating healthy. And when I do an evaluation on someone and I ask them about Eating and I say you know, tell me about eating, and they say I eat very healthy, I know now to ask the follow-up question, which is what does that mean when they say I don't eat any fat or I Only eat 1200 calories?
Mike Roth:
and I know there's more to learn we do I a lot of work with With the prevention of Alzheimer's, and one of our major supporters is dr Craig Curtis and he's talked a lot about the Mind diet. Have you heard of that?
Nicole Christina:
I haven't. I mean, I I'm very familiar with a lot of the different you know preventing cognitive decline, but tell me more about the mind diet.
Mike Roth:
I'm gonna attempt to remember the way he described it, as a Diet which is based on the Mediterranean diet, but is, you know, a little bit stricter in that, you know, go on, eat meat once a month and Most of your, your protein is gonna come in from fish or plant-based materials.
Nicole Christina:
Yeah, there's a lot of controversy about that and the thing that's so interesting and I might get in trouble for saying this is that Eating is important, but not as important as sleeping.
Nicole Christina:
Well, and we all want to avoid Cognitive decline and it seems very tempting to say if I don't eat meat, you know. You know, we all want to do whatever we can and unfortunately becomes kind of a matter that could be an over controlled Right. It's like oh, I can't me, I can't go to a birthday party because I can't eat sugar, so I'm not gonna have. And so then the question becomes what's the trade-off here? Are you not doing social things because they're gonna have a cake or stuff that isn't on? You know what we call quote-unquote healthy diet. And we can get into trouble Restricting and being really rigid.
Nicole Christina:
I am one who I don't eat processed food. I mean, that is just. I just don't do it because we know that's just crap for you in many ways. And I think that if people are looking for good guidelines, they might. You know, I had a guest on and I loved how she distilled it. She said don't eat processed foods, decrease sugar and take a walk, and I thought, now that's a guideline that makes sense. That can, you know, be really helpful. What happens is if we get too stringent on some of these kinds of diets, then we are like oh my gosh, I ate a hamburger. And we worry and stress and obsess about the fact that I just had a hamburger and white flour which turns out to be worse than the actual hamburger. So we don't want to get into a situation. We're so fixated on being healthy there's actually a name for that that it backfires and that's my concern.
Mike Roth:
Yeah, I did a show with a ethologist who retired and he compared sugar to a Narcotic drug, where it's addictive. And we actually did an experiment inside the show where he brought us a solution, a Herb we put on our tongues and then we couldn't taste the sugar in candy, we only could taste the flavor it was. It was a very interesting experiment and One of the things that he convinced me to do in the show was to eat whole grain barley as a health food and, you know, have to buy it from Amazon.
Mike Roth:
You can't find it in your local supermarket and I really think it's helping.
Nicole Christina:
What is it helping?
Mike Roth:
Just I feel physically better.
Nicole Christina:
Okay, and is that something that's related to sugar absorption or just general good?
Mike Roth:
Oh, it's the avoiding of sugar. You can't avoid it completely, but if you avoid eating that extra slice of chocolate cake, yes which I love. I find that it makes a lot better. Okay, and the other side of what you were talking about is sleep. Because Dr Curtis does talk about sleep, we will be putting a 30 second spot in here for Dr Curtis. How many hours of sleep do you as a psychotherapist?
Nicole Christina:
I know that sleep gets more difficult as we age and there's a whole body of of research out there, so I don't want to overstep what my expertise is, but it's not a luxury and we should do whatever we can to sleep well. The things that I know are to keep a cool room, and even in upstate New York I'll crack the window unless it's way below zero and it to be very, very dark.
Nicole Christina:
Those are the things that I'm familiar with, but there are people who are experts. So there's a woman I had on my show and her podcast is sleep is a skill and when we're not sleeping, I do know we're not cleaning out the garbage in our brain and people. You know that's a risk for all timers, but that's about all I can say on that.
Mike Roth:
We're going to take a break now and listen to Dr Craig Curtis. Dr Curtis, what is one thing that people can do to help?
Dr. Craig Curtis:
their brain. One of the best things they can do comes down to the choices every day getting lots of sleep, for example. Getting the proper amount of sleep, for example.
Emily:
And what does that mean Approximately hours?
Dr. Craig Curtis:
seven to nine hours of sleep per day is what's currently recommended Good.
Warren:
Thank you. With over 20 years of experience studying brain health, Dr Curtis's goal is to educate the village's community on how to livea longer, healthier life. To learn more, visit his website craigcurtismdcom, or call 352-500-5252 to attend a free seven.
Nicole Christina:
I'm much more in the know about eating disorders, disordered eating and people who you know. Nobody wakes up and says I want to have an eating disorder. I want to just think about food all day long. How much I've worked out, how much I haven't worked out what I ate, what I should eat, what I donate, what I want to eat.
Nicole Christina:
That is not a fun life. I mean, it really clouds our minds and it takes the joy out. So if you think about maybe some of your guests going to a birthday party, let's say for their grandchild, and it's hard for them to enjoy the festivities because they're thinking, oh my gosh, there's sugar in that cake, there's white flour in that cake Well, no one's asking you to have, you know, six pieces, but having a moderate slice or a reasonable slice, that is not what we're talking about. We're talking about the day in, day out, sugary drinks, processed food that's what's going to get you into big trouble. So these are more general guidelines and what I see in my practice are people like I have. I, my office is right near Syracuse University. I've really talented faculty, talented students, and they come and they say I can't focus because I had a doughnut today and that was six hours ago and that's all that they can think about. That is really rob us of our joy and our vitality.
Mike Roth:
Yeah, I understand that. Let me switch back to the exercise and get your opinion of this. What Dr Curtis said is to avoid Alzheimer's, one needs to do 25 minutes per week of moderate exercise, which will cause your brain to grow and therefore help mitigate the effects of amyloids in your brain. What do you think of that?
Nicole Christina:
Well, I don't. Again, I'm not a pathologist. I do know that exercise is. If there's a magic bullet, that's it. I'm a long-distance walker, I have a lot of rescue dogs and I live in upstate New York where we have lots of trails, and so that's part of my life. And you have to do some weight-bearing exercise, particularly for women who have osteoporosis or are at risk of osteoporosis. So movement is key. You know, if you don't move it, you lose it.
Nicole Christina:
One thing I want to make a plug on and this is going to sound kind of weird because it's a little, I think it's a little kind of esoteric but I love the rebounder, which is a mini-trampoline and it is wholly endorsed by NASA because they use it with their astronauts and I know that's kind of a local group for you. For people who are not terribly stable, you can get a stabilizer bar. So the thing that's so lovely about this is it's a mini-trampoline and you, every muscle gets exercised because it's a gravity thing. You jump up, there's no gravity, and then you come down and there's lots of gravity, and so your whole body is getting a workout. And if you look on the benefits, if you do a little Google search, the benefits of rebounding. It's astonishing.
Mike Roth:
Now, what is the name of the product?
Nicole Christina:
again, it's a rebounder I like. I mean, I have a particular kind. You don't want to get it cheapy, because what you don't want is to, you know, fall and have it break. It's really good for lymphedema, for women who have had breast cancer and mastectomies. What happens is a lot of scar tissue builds up right and so the lymph has no place to go and that's your garbage truck. That's the system of cleaning out the garbage. So you really, and people I know, don't want to look puffy, so when you're jumping on a rebounder it really clears that inflammation. I have something called a NEDAC which is sort of like the standard, good quality, one kind of like the Honda Accord, if you will.
Mike Roth:
You can spend. Yeah, give our listeners an idea. What's the diameter of this rebounder?
Nicole Christina:
Ooh, boy, diameter Two feet three feet, four feet.
Nicole Christina:
Yeah, I'm going to, say, three and a half feet. But the thing that's lovely about it is I don't use a stabilizer bar, because I've been doing this for 20 years, but you can get a bar, so you're holding onto something and you're gently jumping. The thing that is so crazy about it is you literally can't be in a bad mood when you get off, because it's this sort of rather childlike exercise. Right, you're jumping and I put music on and it's like you're having your own little dance party. So all of this oxygenates our system, which, of course, affects our brain.
Nicole Christina:
And when we get off and this is I find this I recommend this for people who have low-grade depression. It really is helpful in making you feel like energized. To me, it's the closest thing to a magic system, and then I combine it with some light weights. Now the thing I found is there's tons of videos on YouTube for over 50 or over 60 using a rebounder. It's very gentle on our joints so we're not pounding if people are still running or even walking. This is your on. It's a trampoline, so your knees are super happy and they're not feeling like they're being smashed down on asphalt.
Mike Roth:
Is this something people could buy on Amazon?
Nicole Christina:
I'm sure they can. Again, I would really recommend you get one that is a good quality and by good quality we're talking about not under $200. I would check out. I don't have any financial stake, but there's a thing called NEDAC, which is very well-regarded N-E-E-D-A-K and once you go into Google you'll fall into a deep rabbit hole of the best. I mean, there's a Swiss one, I think, but they're over $500. If that's something you want, but you just don't want to go to Target and get one for $50 because it's noisy, it doesn't last that long and you don't want to mess around with potentially hurting yourself.
Mike Roth:
I've had some bad experience with buying cheap exercise equipment, where I actually fell.
Nicole Christina:
Oh, that's exactly what we want to avoid.
Mike Roth:
Right, right. So what do you do if you suspect one of your loved ones has an eating disorder?
Nicole Christina:
That's a biggie. So here's the thing People get into eating disorders because it's helping them in some way. I know that sounds sort of paradoxical. It's like how could that be helpful? But it really does provide a bit of a how shall I say like a safety net to dealing with things like. I don't want to think about illness, I don't want to think about my mortality. Let me focus on organic kale.
Nicole Christina:
You know so to confront someone head on is probably not going to go well, because it's a coping strategy and they don't. There's a reason. They need it, right. So you're not going to just go and say, hey, I noticed that you don't eat. Or when we go out to lunch, you never get messing on your salad, or you never. You know, I noticed that you leave half your plate or you're only drinking. Well, I've never seen you eat. Or you didn't have birthday cake at your grandson's, or this kind of thing doesn't really go well.
Nicole Christina:
But what you might do is say, hey, I'm just noticing, in a really neutral and kind way, like, is everything okay? You know, I've noticed that. You know you're not, you're not ordering when we go out. So you're not going to say I think you may have an eating disorder, because that is not going to go well. But I think just in a gentle way, say you know how's things going, what's what's happening? I noticed we used to go out and let a pastrami sandwich and now you're taking all the bread off and you're eating. You know what's?
Mike Roth:
going on right when I really gentle. When I was in business I had some client like that, that just unbelievably light eaters, and I thought they were anorexic looking, never mentioned it. I wanted to keep miss clients.
Nicole Christina:
Well my grandmother up to the day she died. You know I bring her deli and she wouldn't eat the rye bread. And I'm like this woman has been through, you know, the holocaust and everything and she doesn't want to eat rye bread. Something's wrong here, you know, to her dying day. So so there are books. One that I really like is when your loved one has an eating disorder. You can get that on Amazon. It's not a new book, but I really like it. And the other thing you can do is go online. There's an association that might be helpful called need me, the NEDA, which is the national eating disorder association. So you know, there are places, there are resources. Don't expect to be a hero. People do not like to be, shall I say, confronted with this rescue right yeah, so this, we see this really be someone's choice.
Mike Roth:
They call what are some of the best resources that you can go to in your particular area if you suspect that your loved one is suffering from an eating disorder well, the national one would be need a, which is the national eating disorder association.
Nicole Christina:
I'm in upstate New York, you're in Florida, so we would have different state associations. I would start there and don't expect it to be terribly pleasant. We see this in families all the time. When you know, if we have a young adult or even an adult in their 30s and the parents want to talk about their concerns, it can be very divisive and pretty not fun. So, like, for example, if you have a grandchild who you think might be getting into trouble, I would maybe talk to the parent and just do some gentle inquiry, like hey, you know we were going to go out for ice cream, but you're not. You know you're saying you don't want to do that because you don't want to get fat. You know what? Tell me about that, what are your concerns, what are your worries, and to see if you can, you know, be a support for that person and just gently try to understand what's behind their you know refusal to eat. You know something that we might consider like a luxury food.
Mike Roth:
Right. Well, here in the village is, one of the local jokes is that the men and the women always look like they're pregnant. Ah, and that's because people are overeating, in my opinion or be, there are a lot of cases of diabetes.
Warren:
And when the?
Mike Roth:
diabetes sets in, they grow heavier and that's a terrible disease.
Nicole Christina:
Yeah, and I mean I don't. This is maybe for a conversation for another day, but our food system is so broken and even if you really try to eat well, the soil's depleted right. So even if you're, you have the resources and the you know and you're buying organic veggies and organic meats and all this stuff. We live in a place where you can't even pump gas and they're yelling at you about buying Oreos on the little screen.
Nicole Christina:
Yeah, exactly, you cannot, literally you can't. You can't get away from it. And you had that great example about your guests coming on and how sugar is so pervasive, it is addictive. We are evolved to like things that are high sugar because back in the day that's what berries were ripe, those were safe to eat. So it's very difficult to live in a world. So we're really wired to want sweet, and the more sweet we eat, the more we want.
Nicole Christina:
And it is really tough. I mean it's you know everything the people who make these snack foods. The way they know how to put the ingredients together is they put people in scans and they watch their brains and they give them sugar and there's a bliss point. So your brain's like, yay, I love this. More sugar than is not what your brain wants. They find the exact right formula. And if you notice, I think we're about the same age, mike. Back in the day we used to eat ice cream and it was like do you want, you know when it like it? Howard Johnson's vanilla chocolate, strawberry coffee. Now it's like a ripple nut with mousse tracks and chips with pretzel pieces, because those layers to our taste buds and it it introduces this novelty where we want to eat more. So we're really, you know we're, we're up against it and it's a tough. It's really tough to avoid the pressures that are all around us to eat things that are addicting.
Mike Roth:
Right, and the sugars I personally believe are directly behind the cases of diabetes. I see a lot of that here in the villages.
Nicole Christina:
No, and cancer and heart. You know I mean there's it's a very deep rabbit hole. But you know it used to be fat and that was demonized and come to find out it really isn't fat, it's sugar and that's tough, I mean. And there's all these politics about. You know who runs the lobby, you know for fat and dairy and the cows and the ranchers Right.
Mike Roth:
So they've attacked. They've attacked our, their cholesterol intake, putting a great many older adults on statin drugs which have unintended side effects.
Nicole Christina:
Yes.
Mike Roth:
But in fact the cholesterol may not be all bad.
Nicole Christina:
That's right. So that's right. So that's why I love going back. I mean, it sounds like you have people who are giving, who are experts, who are giving this great advice, but if it becomes too restrictive and complicated, I would just say stay away from refined foods, decrease your sugar and, if you can take a walk and if you can't take a walk, consider getting a rebounder.
Mike Roth:
Okay. Well, I like that rebounder idea. I like the walk, and the thing that Dr Curtis made very clear is that it should be a moderate paced walk, not a slow stroll. That was that really help help your body get back into shape or change your body.
Nicole Christina:
But a slow stroll is better than nothing, and the problem is that most Americans do nothing, so I always get a little worried when we say hey, you know it better be moderate.
Nicole Christina:
Well, moderate is great, but slow is better than nothing. And if all you can do is go slow and you're with your people, that is adding years to your life for sure, because you're getting, you're getting the circulation and all this. So, yes, if you can do it. But look, you have arthritis or you've had hip replacement or all of these things just keep moving Great.
Mike Roth:
Thanks a lot for being with us today, Nicole.
Nicole Christina:
It's a pleasure. Thank you, Mike.
Emily:
Remember our next episode will be released next Friday at 9am. Should you want to become a major supporter of the show or have questions, please contact us at Mike at Rothvoice. com. This is a shout out for supporters Tweet Coleman, Ed Williams and major supporter Dr Craig Curtis at K2 in the villages. If you know someone who should be on the show, contact us at Mike at Rothvoice. com. We thank everyone for listening to the show. The content of the show is copyrighted by Rothvoice 2024, all Rights Reserved.