Tracy Subisak is a multi-talented children's book author and illustrator with a slimy secret! Her new book, Sorry, Snail, is an adorable take on how our actions appear to others as well as what it looks like to authentically apologize.
Plus, she reveals the REAL reason she wrote this book. You'll never guess!
Head to her website to learn more about this book and her many other projects at TracySubisak.com.
Find her on Instagram @tracysubisak
Or sign up for her amazing newsletter Subi Snacks (Any Scooby Doo fans??)
You can also purchase a kid-drawn penguin masterpiece here! All proceeds go directly to the Global Penguin Society and the Center for Ecosystem Sentinels. Thank you for supporting young activists!
Start your KindSchooling journey today! Head to www.teamkindhumans.com or follow me on Instagram @katie_doughty!
Tracy Subisak is a multi-talented children's book author and illustrator with a slimy secret! Her new book, Sorry, Snail, is an adorable take on how our actions appear to others as well as what it looks like to authentically apologize.
Plus, she reveals the REAL reason she wrote this book. You'll never guess!
Head to her website to learn more about this book and her many other projects at TracySubisak.com.
Find her on Instagram @tracysubisak
Or sign up for her amazing newsletter Subi Snacks (Any Scooby Doo fans??)
You can also purchase a kid-drawn penguin masterpiece here! All proceeds go directly to the Global Penguin Society and the Center for Ecosystem Sentinels. Thank you for supporting young activists!
Start your KindSchooling journey today! Head to www.teamkindhumans.com or follow me on Instagram @katie_doughty!
Hey everyone. Welcome to the raising kind humans podcast. I'm your host Katie Doty. If you're here, because you want to raise empathetic kids with the tools to make positive changes in this world, you're in the right place. I'm glad you're here. Hey, everyone, welcome back to the podcast. I'm glad you're here. Last week, I told you a little bit about my adventures in doing some assemblies and presentations with elementary school kiddos, and reading my book and teaching them about penguins and the needs of penguins. And then I was able to teach them how to draw their own Penguin, which then they decorated in their own unique way. And they turned out absolutely adorable. Well, those penguins are now available for purchase on my website. And all of the proceeds all of the money, everything that gets donated to this project goes directly to the global penguin society, as well as the Center for ecosystem sentinels, which helps penguins around the world, which is what the kids are trying to do. So if you would like to purchase a piece of Penguin art by an adorably kind human, they are up Tim kind humans.com. All you have to do is browse the selection. And then when you go to checkout, there's an Add note at the checkout spot, just put in the name and grade of the piece of art that you would like and then I will email it to you in a PDF. So you can print it at home and display it proudly knowing that you helped some kiddos help the penguins. So those are available, please spread the word share with friends. Let's support these kids, and their endeavor to help penguins around the world. Now to the episode today, I was able to sit down and chat with Tracy Sue BISAC. She is a children's book author and illustrator. Absolutely phenomenal human and has a new book out called sorry, snail. And I really love this conversation because we dive into the topic of apologizing, which can be tricky with kids, and how do we get them to genuinely apologize? And what does that look like? And what should the expectation be? So we dive into that conversation, as well as talking about where her idea came from. And she had me giggling about where her ID idea came from. So I can't wait for you to hear that part. You will not be disappointed. I think you will thoroughly enjoy this conversation. Her book. Sorry snail is out. Now it is out and available. So go get your copy and add it to your bookshelf. So without further ado, please welcome Tracy. Hello, Tracy, welcome to the podcast. Thanks for being here. Hello. Thanks for having me. I'm so excited to talk to you today. You have a new children's book coming out. But before we do that, I want you to take some time. Yes. Oh, you have copies. Yay. Oh, it's so cute. I got to get a preview of your new book. Sorry, snail. So I'm excited to dive in to that with you today. But first, would you please introduce yourself and tell us a little bit about how you got into this writing illustrating
Tracy Subisak:world. Oh, okay. Hello, my name is Tracy susac. I am an author and illustrator of picture books. My book, I forgot to ask when this will come out. But maybe it'll be that out.
Katie Doughty:Right? When is your when is it coming out? When's your book birthday?
Tracy Subisak:On the 16th of May. Oh, exciting.
Katie Doughty:Okay, it'll be around. We'll make it work. Yes.
Tracy Subisak:It will or it will not be out.
Katie Doughty:To be determined
Tracy Subisak:to be determined. But yes, it should be out. By the time you're listening to this podcast. It's called sorry, snail, about a it's a very funny read aloud, read aloud book about how an attempt or multiple attempts to resolve conflicts can get out of hands. My other author illustrated book is called Jenny Mae is sad about how to be a friend who to someone who is sad and it's also about the complexities of sadness. I have also illustrated and many a picture book. Including this book is not for you by Shannon Hale. are far away. Shout out to Taiwanese Heritage Week this week. Yes, by Margaret Cho Gradius Wood wire wings, Emma Lillian Todd invents an airplane by Kirsten Larson, Shine love sharks by Curtis manly and others. It's, yeah, it's stuck in it. I have been doing this for almost 10 years now I originally I was trained in industrial design, and I worked in that field before getting into children's literature. And I am also a plant lover. Yet a plant lover, a dog lover, and I've been very fortunate to have trained in yoga instruction in the new yoga. So I also do teach as well, and practice.
Katie Doughty:Fantastic and you're very well rounded.
Tracy Subisak:Yes. It is my personality.
Katie Doughty:I love that. I love that. So did you start with writing? Or did you start with illustrating or which one came first?
Tracy Subisak:I started with illustrating how that started was when I was working in industrial design. I usually in the industrial design is the design of products. So, for example, the field that I worked in was the tech industry, I did a lot of laptop and desktop computer designs. And oftentimes, we as designers need to share how that product is going to be used with people who are not designers, people who are managers and marketers and engineers. And we call those storyboards. So not storyboards in the sense of film storyboards, which are way more exciting. But I did look at film storyboards, and I ended up doing storyboards for our team, for the teams that surrounded me. And I did it so much that I asked my company if I could take a class in children's book illustration, to improve myself. And it turns out, that I enjoyed very much. My instructor was Victoria Jamison, who wrote the stars that scattered in the sky, I should double check the title, the stars is scattered the sky, please look it up, because it has those words. But she also wrote and illustrated roller girl. And she kind of pulled me aside when we were working on our portfolios. And she said, you know, you can do this, if you want to. And that planted the seed where I started to plan. My next adventure.
Katie Doughty:Oh, wow. Oh, I love that she took a minute to pull you aside and encourage you? Because do you think you would have followed that path? Had she not been like, Hey, you're pretty good at this. Maybe you could do this? Were you thinking that way already? Or were you not really leaning that way? I
Tracy Subisak:honestly did not know it was an option. Oh, yeah. You know, it was just like you get exposed to what you get exposed to as a kid as a young adults. And that is what you will do. So actually, I was really lucky to have that encouragement. I think I maybe would have eventually gotten here. But it definitely accelerated the program.
Katie Doughty:Yeah. Oh, it's such a good reminder to to call out people's skill set, like make notice of it compliment encourage because you're right, you are now on a totally different path than you were on before she had said something. So what a cool opportunity to give somebody that encouragement or that boost, or even just open their eyes to the possibility of something different.
Tracy Subisak:Yes, absolutely. It's it definitely was life changing.
Katie Doughty:Yeah. That's amazing. So then, okay, then I'm curious and then we could talk about your book, but I'm curious then how long did you stay in the design industry or industry design? Is that that backwards? Before you jumped ship and went full on children's literature?
Tracy Subisak:Hmm, I think it wasn't that long. I probably stayed for a year I took an Another class with her on just writing and creating a picture book in general. And I just found myself drawing at night after work every day and things just lined up. For me, I think, you know, the, the team that I was on went through a lot of shifts. And I hadn't gone through many managers in one year and it just seems like things. Things were pointing to you should go this way.
Katie Doughty:Yeah, bright arrows. This direction. Yeah. Well, another cool thing that's happening right now, which Thank goodness for zoom is that you live in Taiwan currently? Are you visiting or living?
Tracy Subisak:I am living here with my husband right now,
Katie Doughty:which is amazing that we can connect so easily. Right. It's morning time for you. It's evening time for me. But look at we can sit across the screen from each other. How cool is that?
Tracy Subisak:is so cool. I plan something I'm grateful here. When I especially as I work i i reach out to my creative friends in Portland a lot.
Katie Doughty:Okay, so are you originally from Portland? When When were you living in Portland versus now?
Tracy Subisak:I so I'm actually originally from Ohio. I was born and raised there, went to college there and then did a lot of worlds. And us living due to internships and the Adventure seeking life. And I did live in Taiwan, actually right after graduation. And I moved to Portland after that. So I lived in Portland for a decade, and then we moved to Taiwan. This past fall.
Katie Doughty:Okay, so you haven't been there that long? Well, a little while what brought you back to Taiwan.
Tracy Subisak:I am half Taiwanese. My mother is from Taiwan. And she is gone. She passed away six years ago. And it's partially partially just like this soul searching journey for me. I used to speak Chinese with her every day. And I just lost that practice. And the first few months we were back here, I was just like, Whoa, I forgot so much. But with great teachers and a great environment, I bounce back pretty quick, quickly. And so that's that's the first. The first and probably biggest reason. The other one is to have my husband immersed in the culture a little in a very deep way.
Katie Doughty:Yes. Yeah. So yeah. And you were telling me before he's learning Chinese right now, right?
Tracy Subisak:Yes, he is. And it is, it warms my heart.
Katie Doughty:That's amazing. That's really cool. Well, let's dive into sorry, snail, because I think I love the topic that you've chosen, because you can go into more detail about what the story is about, but I picked out apologizing with children is such an interesting topic to cover. Because with kids, I feel like we are constantly just saying, Say you're sorry, say you're sorry, say you're sorry. And it doesn't mean anything to them when they're like I'm sorry. And then they move on with whatever it was that they were doing. And so I appreciated this story, to kind of slow down and talk about this idea of what does it mean to apologize? And can you apologize without meaning it and does it matter if you mean it or not. So I'd love to hear the backstory of where this came from and why you chose
Tracy Subisak:this topic. All right. That is a that is a great question that you have. Because I actually just released the newsletter as substack about how I originally wrote this story, and it is quite snarky and quite the opposite of how it turned out. Thank you, elvina Ling for your guidance. elvina is my editor for saris was like maybe we should change.
Unknown:So
Tracy Subisak:yes, sorry snail is about what does it mean to apologize sincerely. And I think they The thing that we have both we have all been on both sides, there's our A the girl who takes her anger out on an innocent snail. And the snail who just wants to be validated. And to receive compassion for having received this anger without, you know, no one deserves to receive anger, even if they did something that makes someone angry. And so it's kind of this back and forth of how how events like this can just get really out of hand and then the ends, both people or snails can can just really need some validation and compassion. And it does take, you know, one person or animal to step forward and just be like,
Unknown:you know, I'm sorry,
Tracy Subisak:this was really out of hands, you didn't deserve this. And that can soften the whole conflict in an instant. So yeah, that is that is the the journey. Apologies,
Unknown:I think,
Katie Doughty:yeah. How would you do you have any recommendations or tips may be as you're reading with a child with this book about helping them find ways for themselves to recognize a sincere apology, or maybe even give them the courage to ask for a sincere apology. I'm just working through this as like, with my own children, because, you know, I see that with them, too, is sometimes somebody will say they're sorry, but you can tell they don't feel any better about the situation, you know, and so there's kind of that both ends of feeling validated and being the one to actually validate.
Tracy Subisak:Yes, um, I think that the best way is, by example. And I think that it kind of, you know, when, when your kids or the kids in your life need an apology, the best thing is to, you know, throw the ego aside, or exemplify, you know, that compassion that is necessary in an apology. I think that also, that is a great question two, encourage kids to, you know, express their needs, as it is very hard as an adult. Hard. And, yes, and I think that, you know, part of that is building up competence. You know, I deserve compassion. I am a small person. And I may have just been in this world for both a few years, but I deserve this, like, everyone deserves it, no matter your age, your experience. So, I think it is just setting up setting up a life where, you know, the kid has, has received compassion, then they know where the baseline is. I suppose practicing would be a good way to
Katie Doughty:Yeah, role playing, and practicing using your voice. Yeah, for sure. I know, when my daughter was little, super little, I was trying to practice these apologies with her and she had done something and and all I asked her, I said, that really hurt my feelings. You know, I would really love it if you could apologize for that. And, you know, she was probably three or four at the time, super stubborn. But we finally got to the point where we had compromised that she could write it down, because it was really hard for her to vocalize and use her voice at that moment to say she was sorry, but she felt it on the inside. So she ended up writing it down. And I think that's an important thing to keep in mind too, that sometimes, for kids, it's really hard for them to say something out loud if they're struggling internally or don't really know how to say it or they're embarrassed or something but they do genuinely feel, you know, remorse or whatever it is, and then maybe giving them options of okay, well, let's write him a card. What could we do you know, and giving them ways of how can we help this situation now this has happened? You're feeling bad about it. Now what can we do and I think you nailed it just like modeling for them, or giving them the tools that they need to be able to go forth and, and take care of some
Tracy Subisak:of those things. Totally. Yeah, that's awesome. I really liked the letter writing idea. Yeah. What does that mean? I also wanted to add on to that, you know, I don't have kids myself right now. But I have nieces and nephews. And I remember the first time that I really saw my niece identify her feelings. And she's just, she's, you could see, her body just tense up. Because she was receiving, you know, some some things from her siblings. And she just went, I'm frustrated. And that, just identifying the feeling really helps. The other people be like, Oh, you're frustrated, I get that I've been frustrated before. So you know, as you know, as a parent, you have to help your kid understand what feelings that is that are happening until they can start identifying it for themselves. But if you've ever heard of nonviolent communication, have you heard of that? This is an amazing practice where the, I think the formula is like,
Unknown:I feel this. And I need this.
Tracy Subisak:I feel this because this happened, and I need this. And it's just an amazing way to take any blame out of anything. Because I think what happens oftentimes, in our adults or children, life, whatever age is that there is a language that we have to undo, as adults, at least to to take those words out, that can put someone else in the defensive. And, you know, if you have a past where you get defensive, that's just gonna happen, and then just needs to be compassionate in these conversations.
Katie Doughty:Yes, for sure. And I love that you said that, because when I was in the classroom, we called them I statements. And so we would say, I feel an instead of you did, or when you Well, you say when you did it, but like, you hurt my feelings, or you did this because you're right, that immediately turns the other person to defense, and then they are going to then try to defend themselves or attack you because they don't want the blame put on them. But as soon as you say, I was really hurt, when you didn't ask me to play, then they're like, oh, you know, and helps them recognize how the other person is feeling just like you said, and I think it helps neutralize the conversation. So it doesn't escalate, right. And so that nonviolent communication that the I statements are so powerful in having those conversations, and having that is really hard, though, even for adults, and maybe more so for adults, because I'm not sure we really practice this growing up. But just having the ability to say how you're feeling when somebody else did something to you. And then I like how you added on the I need. So I felt really hurt when you didn't invite me to play, you know, I need a minute. And then maybe we can play again in, you know, next recess, or I need some time, or I need you to ask me to play sometimes when you have time. Like I don't know what it is. But I appreciate that I need part in there. Because then it's just that next step.
Unknown:Yes.
Tracy Subisak:And it takes time to understand what your needs are.
Katie Doughty:It dies, it for sure does. And I think it's hard for I think you just hit it perfectly with the modeling piece, right? Just doing that for your kids. And I forget this all the time because you're constantly trying to be the one that's right and doing everything because you're the mom and that's how it goes. And I need to step back sometimes and you know, admit if I did something wrong or or even use the I statements for them, you know, I felt really frustrated when you slammed your door because you were upset about something or and just modeling for them what that might look like. Yeah.
Tracy Subisak:I mean, I have no doubt but you're doing a great job. Oh, thank
Katie Doughty:you. Thanks. Yeah, I mean, it's a lot of work but I think the putting in the time to do this kind of stuff is so valuable for
Tracy Subisak:the adult self It is. Yeah. Um, did you have something else you wanted to add? No. Okay.
Katie Doughty:Well, let's talk about the illustrations then do you like what kind of program do you use? How do you like to do your art and your illustrating?
Tracy Subisak:Oh,
Katie Doughty:so ever since,
Tracy Subisak:ah, gosh, what books do I have? Okay, ever since ice after wood wired wings, I started usually using complete paper, paints, ink. And then I would just scan my work in and do just some little tweaks here and there. But before that I did partial traditional and partial digital painting. So I'm really enjoying the real paint world, I think. Perhaps it ties into our previous discussion, but showing imperfections is actually a delight. We are all imperfect. And it gives a lot of character. And I just find myself being really happy working on on treasured traditional paints and ink.
Katie Doughty:Yeah, well in it, isn't it funny too. And I don't know for you if you're more critical on yourself or not. But like when I looked at your illustrations, I see no flaws, right? Like it, they just look beautiful and amazing. And I'm always so impressed with that kind of work. And you're like, look at these imperfections. We do that to ourselves, right? Like we put we put these ideals that this should be this way or this should be this way. But really art is art and it shows up however the reader interprets it. So
Tracy Subisak:yes, I think that I am definitely. I was thinking about this yesterday, actually. When I was trying to finish up my newsletter, and I will noodle around forever. And I just thrive on deadlines. So when I have that deadline, I need to accept where I am. And be okay with it. And it's usually pretty good. It's okay. Sometimes it's not. And that's also okay. Probably we'll learn from it. So, yeah, it definitely is speaks to my character. Oh, that's nice.
Katie Doughty:Like that. And you're like, you know what, here we go. This is what I have, take it or leave it. That's nice. You can that's hard for some people to do to put the pen down and call it good. Right to be able to say it's finished, when really like you could keep tweaking forever and ever and ever. But that deadline is the deadline. You have to be done whether you want to be done or not.
Tracy Subisak:Yes. Well, I'm curious. Would you say it's nice to be done?
Katie Doughty:That is true. I tend to do that to where I will work work work until I see the deadline looming. I'm like, Oh, I really have to actually work now. That's just how I roll. I'm curious about you said that um, in your newsletter, you were talking about your ideas for sorry smell and they were more snarky than what they ended up being Do you want to share a little bit of what it originally was? And if you don't want to that's okay too. But you said snarky and now I'm super curious.
Tracy Subisak:Yes, if you whenever the listeners get a chance to read sorry, stale, you might find that it is quite cheeky. The dialogue and I hate snails. Why didn't you choose snails and slugs? I explained this in my newsletter, but I just they give me the heebie jeebies. Give me a spider any day. I'll make friends with it. We'll eat toast together. But slugs and snails, they just they pop out of nowhere. They just they're sneaky. And so, what I tried to depict in this in sorry, snail. But it was when I first started writing it it was my attempt to like make amends with with my utter Heebie Jeebies Enos than I feel with these creatures, and the ending just turned out to be quite a dismal ending. And if it wasn't, you know, graphic they're just there may or may not have been assault trucks fill and It may have just been a drawing of the curtain and let the reader assume what they may assume. So, you know, probably took my editor patting my back and saying they're there. Let's rethink. It's so
Katie Doughty:funny. I feel like you need an alternate ending version of this story. Do versions.
Tracy Subisak:You know, I thought that working on this book would would really help me.
Katie Doughty:Change your view of us? No, no.
Tracy Subisak:You know, while I was working on this book, I was in the Pacific Northwest, which is like a soggy place and it's muggy.
Katie Doughty:Yes.
Tracy Subisak:They're huge. And what I found out is that in the winter, slugs will come into your house, or they were there was a slug living in my house, amongst my plants, and you know that it was like, tucked underneath a plant pot, just waiting for me to discover it. But every morning I would see the slime trails. And I was just like, No, who is taunting you? I can't. I can't go to this corner, like precious plants will be alone.
Katie Doughty:So sorry, I had no idea. I assume snails were one of your favorite things because you chose to write about them. But instead really, it was like a therapy session for you.
Tracy Subisak:Yes. Yes, it was.
Katie Doughty:Wait, so how long do you think this slug was living in your house?
Tracy Subisak:It was at least two months. Oh, yeah.
Katie Doughty:That's a long time. That's a whole different story. You could write about a key slug that like you while you're making breakfast. leaves you messages in slime?
Tracy Subisak:Well, yeah, I even looked up because of this. Experience this intrusion. I looked up like how long can they live because I wanted it to just you know, live nature's course. And they can live a very long time. So there was just I just had to literally I had to live with it.
Katie Doughty:Oh, my gosh. So funny.
Tracy Subisak:And terrible. Yes,
Unknown:yeah.
Katie Doughty:Oh my gosh, I don't know if there's like some immersion therapy for you or something that you can like keep one in a jar you know that you can control and then maybe it's in a plant outside and you visited or something.
Tracy Subisak:I mean, I think gardening I during the pandemic, I got very into gardening. To the point that my favorite pastime was laying on the floor and watching our long videos about how to best trellis for edamame a or you know, whatever plant I was trying to grow. And you just have to accept life with gastropods as a gardener. So I just like that's where my yoga.
Katie Doughty:Oh, your yoga. Then make sure,
Tracy Subisak:yes, except what comes your way. However slowly?
Katie Doughty:Oh, well, your story is that much better knowing the background of pure hatred for snails
Tracy Subisak:and slugs.
Katie Doughty:I'm so happy that you shared that. That is some really good information and insight as readers pick this book up. Yes, it was a sacrifice for you. This story. Oh my goodness. I love it. Well, are you doing anything to celebrate your book birthday? Is there any other launch parties or like what do you plan? Ah, yes,
Tracy Subisak:I actually, I have a little launch party with green bean books. It's a virtual launch party. And I am going to do a Instagram live on the day of launch, which will be a q&a slash possibly reading I need to double check with my publisher. And I will announce that on my Instagram And, yes, probably my website as well. So fantastic, or will come? Undoubtedly,
Katie Doughty:that is so exciting. So where can people find you then? Can you share your Instagram your website? Where to buy the book? All that good stuff? Yes,
Tracy Subisak:I have an Instagram that I'm fairly involved with it is at Tracy super sack. I also have a substack slash newsletter that you can sign up for and read it is very storytelling oriented. And that subset is called Scooby snacks. However, you can search my name.
Katie Doughty:Wait, hold on, it's subi snacks. Yes. So you said I love that so much. So cute.
Tracy Subisak:Super sack rhymes with Scooby snacks. It's perfect for the generation that knows Scooby Doo. Also, you can check out my website, Tracy superstack.com, which has all of my books and information about school visits and appearances and other things. Fine, wait,
Katie Doughty:let's talk about your school visit. So do you do you do in person and virtual or one or the other?
Tracy Subisak:Yes, I of course I prefer in person school visits. However, living in Taiwan, that might not be the easiest. So I'm offering virtual school visits at the moments and I have some programs with school visits. A lot of them have to do with sharing your own experience and, and putting yourself in your own book. Because I think that's something that kids can do. And want to see if you want to. Even if it's in a place on a different world, there's still your own experience that you can bring to that world. So that's something that is like my big mo as a creator is to incorporate representation and connection in every story. I love that. And
Katie Doughty:it's such a good piece of advice for young readers and writers because honestly, the best stuff comes from within, right we have those experiences and that knowledge to bring to the table. So put it on the page, it's going to be more powerful and more meaningful. So what a lesson for them.
Unknown:Yes. Yes, absolutely.
Katie Doughty:Yeah. So okay, so you do school visits? And then are you doing in person ones in Taiwan?
Tracy Subisak:I am Yes. I have. I have done a Chinese school visit which was pretty great. At however, to any schools in Taiwan who are listening. My My books are in English. So, you know I would recommend reading Jenny Mae is sad because of the language is is a little bit more simple to intake for for young English as a second language readers. Gotcha.
Katie Doughty:Gotcha. Okay, if you had to choose. And there are no hard feelings on any of the books, which one is your favorite that you have either written or illustrated?
Unknown:Off? I would say impossible.
Tracy Subisak:I'm gonna say to okay, I loved working on saris nail, it was a joyous time. It's just I don't know if you've ever seen any illustrator work. But what I do is I make the facial expressions while I'm drawing. And it's just, you know, with such a vibrant conversation that goes on through the story. I just was kind of chuckling to myself the whole time. Yeah, it was super fun. And then I gotta give a shout out to all ma far away. It is just a hard book. It's about a girl who visits Taiwan for the first time and spends time with her alma or her grandma. And so, I you know, having such a close connection to my matriarchs in Taiwan. That was really special but also I Taiwan is an awesome place I encourage everyone to visit is lush with greenery. It's full of delicious food really Really? What's the what's the English English word? Really the English words that I'm coming up with are probably not as tender and lovely as what I'm coming up with in Chinese but very loud and warm places like the night markets. But there's also quiet places. Like there's that that and Forest Park, which has like this. It's in the middle of the city and there's this bird sanctuary in the middle that's just littered with huge birds. And you can see these Bertus enthusiast just like with their, with their journalists cameras just waiting for the right moment. So it's, it's just a very cool and plentiful
Unknown:place.
Katie Doughty:It is now officially on my must travel to list. It sounds like it has. It has good energy.
Tracy Subisak:I like it does. It does?
Katie Doughty:Yeah, I will let you know I wouldn't. I just I want to see everything. So I love hearing about cool places. And how long do you think you'll are you living there indefinitely? Now? Are you coming back to Portland? Or do you have a plan?
Tracy Subisak:We're our plan is fluid. Our original plan is to stay a year. So we will see if that plan is how it is.
Katie Doughty:That's nice, though, to have that flexibility just to see where life takes you. You never know like your path to being an author or Illustrator. You know, you weren't. You weren't on that path until somebody kind of bumped you that way. So who knows where you'll be?
Tracy Subisak:I know. Yeah, I just gotta go with the flow sometimes. I like
Katie Doughty:your style. Tracy, you are super fun. This has been so fun. Thank you for chatting with me and sharing your adorable story about sorry, snail, and your pure hatred for snails because that just made it so much better. Knowing your background, your history, we slimy things. Um, yeah. And coming on and sharing your heart. I really appreciate it. Thank you so
Tracy Subisak:much has been a joy to chat with you and learn from you as well.
Katie Doughty:Well, thank you. Well, everyone that go buy her book because it will probably be out by the time this airs. I'm assuming it can be anywhere you buy books Barnes and Noble Amazon website. Is your local bookstore bookstore.
Tracy Subisak:Yeah, I can mortars my favorite. Yes, brick and mortar. I love walking in to a bookstore and touching the books
Katie Doughty:and selling them now that we can.
Tracy Subisak:And as always, if it's not in your budget to buy a book, I always recommend going through your library, you can request the book, it'll likely be at your library. So yes,
Katie Doughty:fantastic. Well, thank you again, good luck with your book launch and I look forward to watching all the wonderful things coming your way.
Tracy Subisak:Thank you. Thank you