JourneyTalks Podcast
Your favorite podcast to reconnect with gratitude and inspiration.
JourneyTalks Podcast
What If Gratitude Could Change Your Life? - A Conversation with Silvana Cisneros
What if the key to a more fulfilling life lies in practicing gratitude? In this inspiring episode of JourneyTalks Podcast, host Jorge Gonzalez sits down with Silvana Cisneros, a remarkable leader in well-being and mental health advocacy. Silvana takes us through her personal journey with gratitude, explaining how it has transformed her life during challenging periods of anxiety and uncertainty. With her deep understanding of neuroscience, she highlights the tangible benefits of making gratitude a regular part of our daily lives.
The conversation shifts toward parenting, where Silvana shares her philosophy of nurturing her four children by promoting individuality and honoring their unique paths. She offers powerful insights on fostering emotional growth, connecting over correction, and the vital mission she pursues for The Wellbeing Project. This initiative aims to support the mental health of changemakers impacting society, reinforcing the idea that to serve others effectively, one must prioritize self-care and holistic well-being.
Join us in exploring how small, intentional shifts can lead to profound changes in our lives, fostering a sense of shared humanity and purpose. Don’t forget to engage with us by subscribing and sharing your story of gratitude! #gratitude #jtpstories #neuroscience #anxiety
The Journey Talks Podcast, your favorite podcast to reconnect with gratitude and inspiration, hosted by Jorge Gonzalez. Trigger warning In this episode we discuss mental health topics, including anxiety, depression and other sensitive issues. Listener discretion is advised. If you find these subjects triggering or distressing, please call the NAMI helpline at 1-800-950-6264. Let's continue the journey together.
Speaker 1:Hello and welcome to Journey Talks podcast, your favorite podcast to reconnect with gratitude and inspiration. My name is Jorge Gonzalez and I am your host. I am so glad that you guys are here and connecting with this space where we're just trying to share stories of inspiration. I believe that behind every gratitude, there's a powerful story waiting to be told. Through this podcast, I aim to create a space where we can share these stories and inspire one another. As humans, we all share something fundamental the experience of being alive. We're all walking this journey together and along the way, we meet people and encounter situations that leave lasting marks on us. Some experiences are fleeting, while others stay with us and shape who we are. So who are the people and what are the moments in our lives that have opened doors for transformation and helped us become who we are today? Through this podcast, I'll be interviewing guests with stories of gratitude, and my hope is that, by reconnecting with these stories, we can celebrate our shared humanity and rediscover the unconditional love that is always within us.
Speaker 1:Today's guest is someone whose work I deeply admire Silvana Delfino Cisnero. She is currently the network's leader at the Wellbeing Project. She has over a decade of experience in network design and creation, with a particular focus on the social landscape in Latin America. With a background in management and finances, silvana's path took a beautiful turn towards health and well-being. After becoming a mother, she now merges her expertise in oriental medicines, happiness studies and the science of well-being to bring a more holistic approach to social change. Silvana is deeply passionate about the idea that individual and collective healing, fueled by compassion and kindness, can lead to healthier, more connected societies, and I am beyond thrilled to have her here with us. Silvana, thank you so much for accepting this invitation and for joining me today. How are you? What's been going on with your life lately?
Speaker 2:Well, thank you, it's such a pleasure to be here, just such a much needed space in today's society. I'm excited to share a little bit about my journey, a little bit about what I do and how I cope with a human being. Being human is just hard, I will lie. We all know about it. So thank you for opening up that conversation and just allowing for people to hear their stories and to share because, at the end of the day, we're all walking each other home.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we truly are, silvana. This podcast is all about sharing stories of gratitude, those moments of growth and transformation that leave us forever changed. I happen to believe that your story is truly powerful and what you do is really special, and I'll be so honored if you could open your heart and share some of your gratitude stories and your journey with me and our listeners. Are you up for it?
Speaker 2:Sure.
Speaker 1:All right. Well, let's go straight to it. Silvana, what does gratitude mean to you and what is your relationship with gratitude?
Speaker 2:That's a great question. I've been practicing gratitude my whole life, really without knowing it. Before it was popular and gratitude was a staple in most houses and popularized. So without knowing it, my parents always encouraged in me the sense of gratitude, just the little things you know having a meal at home or being with friends and whatnot. As I got older, I became aware of the importance of being grateful and the power it had, and nowadays I literally call it my magic pill, and people ask if you had one magic pill. I say gratitude because gratitude is so small and so easy to practice and it can turn any situation into something, um, something that we can grow out of. You can't have fear and have gratitude at the same time. They're not compatible. I see gratitude as an antidote to fear, as an antidote to anxiety, to grief. We can always find those sparks and those moments to be grateful, and that makes life worth living peel.
Speaker 1:I've never. This is the first one. It's the first one and I love it. Your magic peel, gratitude, is your magic peel. That's interesting because I also appreciate it when you said that it's such a small thing, and it's true because it feels so fleeting. Right when you think about gratitude, people feel like it's something that has no depth, but the truth is that it comes from a really grounded place within us. I love what you said about it changes any situation. I'm going to ask you about fear and anxiety here later. I'm so glad that you're starting off your definition and your understanding of gratitude as something that can switch that around for the better. So really looking forward to our conversation today. Thank you so much, silvana. I think it's normal to be grateful for life and for our families, and it's okay if that's your answer. But what are you most grateful for?
Speaker 2:I'm grateful for everything? And it's a very generic question and you're going to say, yes, that's an easy answer. You know everything. Yes, but I've been thinking about this quite in depth and sometimes you know, if you put yourself in other shoes, I suffer from guilt. I feel guilt Whenever I feel good. I feel guilt Whenever something good happens to me, I resort to guilt. So when I think about, when I say I'm grateful for everything, I say well, I have a lot of things going on for me that are great in my life, so I go straight to guilt. But then, if you think about it deeply, you understand that gratitude can be those small things I mean when you say you know, I have a sick child or I have a cancer diagnosis.
Speaker 2:I think about those people and say, wow, how can they be grateful they just got this horrible news or they're going through this horrible space. But there's still that small space to say I still get to wake up in the morning and fight this fight. I still open my eyes and I can get out of bed so there's always something to be grateful for.
Speaker 2:Maybe I have a sick child, but I am able to have breakfast with it in the morning. So having those micro gratitude moments is very important and I try to add those to my daily life. When we talk about neuroplasticity and the brain's default mode, if you practice these habits of switching the fear or the grief for the gratitude, and you do it often enough, your brain starts to set gratitude as a default mode, so you go straight to gratitude. It takes time, of course, and it's hard when you're in the midst of a horrible challenge to see that. But if you practice it, you know every day, then it becomes part of your default mode and it's easier to practice and easier to have in your life and that in turn becomes a vicious virtual cycle of gratitude and you know well-being and it feeds into itself.
Speaker 1:Thank you, this is a great answer and I'm so glad you brought up neuroplasticity so quickly into our conversation, because one of the themes that have been coming constantly in the podcast is or at least my understanding of gratitude is that it's also a mindset. You bringing in that neurological component to the concept and the idea of mindset is precisely. I think they're connected. So this concept of us accessing the opportunity to switch the story or to switch my perspective in a moment's time is really crucial, right, and I love for us if we can just spend some moment, a little time here, because I think there's a big difference between intentionally understanding that we might be experiencing something that is not pleasant and we are switching the story into a positive thing.
Speaker 1:I think that's very different from denying, from pretending that it's not happening, and I'd be curious what are your thoughts on that? Because people can get confused with the idea of like okay, if I have a sick child, at least I am having breakfast with my sick child. That sounds, like you said, very elusive, or not, yeah, like it doesn't have depth to it, or like you're pretending that you're not recognizing the impact of what's really going on, but it's how, in that micro moment. We can live as much as we can with intentionality in life. What are your thoughts on that?
Speaker 2:I think we have to honor our process and understand, appreciate things are going to happen. Life is going to be life and we're going to have ups and downs, and we need to understand that we have the opportunity to either curl up and not deal with what is happening, or rise up to the occasion and say what am I going to learn? What is this trying to teach me? When you have a difficult child, you say what is this child trying to teach me? Every child I mean I have four kids Every one of my child has a lesson for me, and whenever they trigger me, where am I at my worst? I say what is this reflecting? What is this saying about me that I need to work on in order to become a better human?
Speaker 1:How crazy is it that we, like you said, our default mode goes into and I'm going to use an expression that I don't mean to offend anybody but we fall many times into victimization. Oh, this is happening to me, right, and in those moments it's really hard to snap out of the moment of pettiness for ourself or feeling sorry for yourself or moments of frustration, frustration. But clearly you're talking about this ability that I think it comes with practice and it comes with being exposed to tools that can help us access that, but it's the ability to switch the story, understanding that every single event in our life is providing our consciousness and experience to be the best version of ourselves. And we're not talking about being perfect. It's understanding that even the ups and downs of life are allowing us to discover the complexity and the fullness of who we are, as sentient beings, as egos, as stories that are developing and unfolding. I can only imagine how it must feel to have four kids and you're confronted with your humanity in the moment when you realize that it's too much to bear and you cannot be perfect mommy at the moment or say the perfect thing to de-escalate whatever is going on, and yet you have the self-love to say, oh my gosh, yes, I lost it. But let me come back to it.
Speaker 1:And it's interesting to see how all the studies are showing that, especially in parenting right, that if you lose your composer with your child at some point, it's going to happen. But the process of coming back to it and revisiting the conversation and bringing the event full circle, where you are modeling once again to your child what it is like to be human and what it is to come back from those moments when you lose control or your composer, like there's so much to it, because it reinforces that concept that, ultimately, every single circumstance that we go through is an opportunity to discover and to continue to work with this mystery that we are and that we're becoming. Thank you so much for sharing. That's so good. All right, can you think? Well, you kind of touched a little bit on it, but I'll be curious to hear more, if there's any particular thing behind this question. Can you think of a person, a situation that, looking back, you realize that this situation, this person, has helped you get to know yourself better?
Speaker 2:I'm going to say me.
Speaker 2:Nice I love it, and it might sound a little egocentric or self-centered, but it's the opposite. I'm going to touch a little bit about the victim mentality, and I used to have one. I used to blame the situation, my upbringing, my husband, my kids, you know everything. There was always somebody to blame and I was always the victim. I lived in this state for a very long time where I didn't have any agency. I took away my own agency because I was a victim.
Speaker 2:As I was doing my inner work, a dear friend and therapist pointed out. She's like you know, you're in a victim state and I was like what do you mean? Yes, this is not happening to you, this is just happening and you are taking it as it's happening to you. It's not, yes. And so as soon as that light was turned on in me, I understood and became aware of it. It gave me so much power. It gave me my power back. I understood that I was the master of my universe. In a sense, I could change the way I looked at things. I could change the way I responded to things. Instead of reacting, I now had a space to think about things and respond to them accordingly, and I had that power. I love one of my favorite books of all times it's Viktor Frankl and I think that every book comes to your life when you need them Crazy.
Speaker 1:You know, you have a friend, you're going through this and you have a friend and she's like oh, I just read this book.
Speaker 2:And you start reading and you're like, oh my God, I needed this book. In my life that happens to me all the time. I learned to smile at the universe and be like thank you for sending me this book or this person or this experience. But Victor Frankl was one of those where I was like, oh my God, I have the power, the freedom to choose how I respond to everything that happens in my life. That was a turning point for me.
Speaker 1:Thank you for being so honest and so brave and putting yourself as the person that has taught you the most. I resonate so much with what you're saying. I'm sure that we're not the only ones that have felt this experience of realizing that we live in a mindset of victimization. Being in a similar place like you, what dawned on me was how disconnected I was from the fact that I was in a victim mentality mindset, from the fact that I was in a victim mentality mindset Because I was so deeply in it. It came with my upbringing. I had no way of noticing that that was perpetrating and maintaining a system that kept me there. It's interesting because, like you, in therapy I remember telling my therapist I have for years kept my own suffering. My inability to look at myself in a new light and my condition to stay in my pain didn't help me get away from my pain and I didn't realize that it was my own doing. I didn't have emotional tools that could help me create some space, but I was blinded to the fact that there was a huge component of my own doing, my own mindset. The energy that I was keeping around, the situation and the circumstances belonged to me. It was the inability to look and create space in between the circumstances.
Speaker 1:You said something that is so true. Things happen. How much permission do we give ourselves to develop a story of meaning around those circumstances? It's a different story.
Speaker 1:I think it's important to recognize that many times we don't have the opportunity to consider those perspectives. Sometimes our circumstances keep us locked in. But I think the more of a reason for us to take the time to spend time with ourselves in silence and practices that can help you meditation, journaling, working out, talking to a friend, anything that can help you see yourself in that pattern right. And this is where I think having friends that can speak truth to us or circumstances that can put a mirror in front of us and speak that truth in such a way that we can pay attention to. I think the other component to it is, many times that truth is right in front of us and we keep hitting the same truth over and over again, and I think it's what is that saying? That's the lesson will continue to show up until you learn it. You know that's really mind blowing. Any remarks, any other feedback, as I share my perspective of what you said. Any thoughts on that?
Speaker 2:I mean you have to understand that when you come from that victim mentality, it becomes part of your identity. So that's who you are, you know.
Speaker 2:it's not who you are it's who you think you are, so you are not what happens to you. You are how you choose to respond. But when we're living in that victim mentality, we tend to say you know, I am this person, I am this person that suffered from abuse, I am this person that has been struggling with infidelity. This happened to you and you are who or what you choose to become from this. Now, when there's trauma and you have post-traumatic stress disorder or something even deeper, dan Siegel says too much, too fast, too soon, which is when something happens to you and you don't have the tools to cope with what happened to you.
Speaker 2:And then you go into that post-traumatic response. When life's challenges, you have the ability. If you have the ability to cope, then you can say I choose to not make this who I am, but I choose to grow from this. And that's where post-traumatic growth comes from. This is going to make me stronger. If I have this diagnosis. Well, I'm going to start a foundation. So that's how you process your trauma, in this example, by serving or by giving purpose to your traumatic event. I think that's, and there's a saying also pain is inevitable, but suffering is optional. There is pain, but suffering is a long-term effect of pain. And that is you. That is your mind.
Speaker 1:Yeah yeah, yeah, wow. I love your quote, your parallel to Dan Siegel too much, too fast, too soon. That's such a graceful way of presenting it. It continues to provide space for the individual right To understand that it is something that happened, but there is room to process it.
Speaker 1:I'm thinking now about spirituality and how we have language that helps us unpack, or parallel vocabulary and language that helps us unpack those stories, and I think spirituality, psychology, neuroscience are trying to talk about the same thing. I understand that for some people talking to a therapist or doing their inner work, they look at it from the perspective of. This is just my psychological approach to life and this is how I go about it. I happen to believe that it is a combination of you work with yourself when you're doing inner work, when you seek for mental health. That's part of your spirituality, because ultimately, in my experience, spirituality is this inner relationship that I have with myself and my surroundings.
Speaker 1:One of the beautiful things that I learned early on when I went to study theology is this principle that there's a particular dynamic between your mind and your heart, and so your mind is how you're processing things and the heart is how you're experiencing things, and that the space in between those where those two connect. There's something really powerful that happens there and I love that we're living in a moment in history that people have more access to tap into that process. Whatever helps you get to that space whatever practice, vocabulary, people that you're hearing, podcast, story book voices that can help you develop that space of connection and unpacking. What a beautiful gift, right? It helps us go through life and appreciate the beauty of life itself Because, besides defaulting into the negative way of seeing things or the victimization of seeing things, that practice, or whatever approach you have, helps you switch it around and to see the miracle of being alive in the moment. What do you say about that?
Speaker 2:In spirituality. I think we have to do a whole other section, that Spirituality. I think we have to do a whole other section. But I will say I consider myself a retired Catholic.
Speaker 2:As I was going through my own inner development process or inner discovery process, I started by rejecting everything I knew, because I was so angry at what I was feeling and how lonely I felt in my process and that I just rejected everything. Then I started slowly. I said well, I can't just reject anything. Let me ask, let me understand, with curiosity you know this curiosity just understand what works for me as I get to know myself, and how can I lead a meaningful, purposeful life with the tools that work for me? And, and, and I think it's become a beautiful journey. I don't have the answer and I don't have one set of beliefs, but I, I tend to go, or or you make use of of those tools that are available to me with with a lot of curiosity and love.
Speaker 2:As humans, we have a need to believe in something greater than us, to believe that we are not alone. I love understanding humanity and how we are in this together. That, for me, is a part of my spirituality, is understanding that I am here with my fellow journeyers, just life learning from one another. You know, trial and error, falling together and grabbing each other's hands and lifting each other up, and that, for me, has been a big part of my spiritual journey. And then the other part is just feeling that there's something out there. I don't know what I call it yet you can call it God, the universe but there's something out there that has my back and and in my work and in my life I try to prepare as much as I can, I try to put in the hard work, I try to do my part, and then I've learned to surrender, I've learned to trust that something, something somewhere out there, has my back.
Speaker 2:If you don't have that, it feels lonely and disempowering. So that need is filled with this internal knowing that there's somebody or something that has my back, and I also have three billion humans that are also fighting this battle with me. There's this internal knowledge that if I sit with myself long enough, the answer comes. There is that intuition that our guardian angels is within us, that we tend to forget. We're born within. Kids have this genuine intuition and drive and spiritual sense of who they are, and then you get society telling you what to do and what not to do, and what's right and what's wrong. It blurs out and we forget that we have all the answers. We are perfect. We're just the way we are, and the world needs Jorge, and the world needs Silvana, and we're all in this together.
Speaker 1:Thank you so much. Beautifully said, much beautifully said. I think this is a perfect segue to ask you more about your professional setting right now and the connection to your personal life, which is being a mother. Um, I'm curious about your journey into well-being how becoming a mother influenced your shift towards health and wellness and how are you merging your background, skills right, the network design and finances into this beautiful movement of this well-being awareness and the well-being projects agenda?
Speaker 2:I think I'm going to tell you a little story for how I got into the well-being project, or how I got to my awakened state, if you must call it something. My awakened state, if you must call it something. When I was young, in my early 30s, I was this ball of energy. I graduated university and I was working at a bank. I felt like I could conquer the world. Mental health that's not for me. I'm super strong People with anxiety through my own judgments they're weak or there's something wrong with them. So I had this mentality growing up and into my 20s where, you know, this is something that happens to some people a small percentage of people suffer from this.
Speaker 2:And then, as I got older, into my 30s and became a mom of four and had my last child, I realized that everyone gets their due. I started having symptoms of burnout in 2018, when I had my fourth child, sebastian, and I divided this stage of my life into stages. The first stage was denial. This is not anxiety. You know my constant tachycardia and my hyperactivity and my inability to concentrate. This is not anxiety. I have something physically wrong with me. So you know. Am I having a heart attack? I went to every cardiologist. Do I have an ulcer?
Speaker 2:And I went to every cardiologist, gastroenterologist, and I was trying to reason out all the possibilities of physical illnesses that I could have, because I was not having anxiety. That's not for me. Then came the second stage panic. I have cancer, I have a tumor in my amygdala and this is what's making my heart race. I had gone through medical, Chinese medicine school, so I had two years of pathology. So you can imagine me going through all the diagnosis and my brain just going. You know I'm dying. This is it.
Speaker 2:All the fear that comes with that my kids are not going to have a mother, all these several scenarios, all the fear. It was hard because it also came with sadness. I am not the great person that I used to be. There's something wrong with me. All those fears that you have, that I was brought up. My parents, the way they took care of me, was through fear. You know, don't climb a tree, You're going to fall and die. Don't, you know, lock the door of your apartment when you're in college because you're going to get murdered. Yeah, so there was a lot of fear in me because and I don't blame my parents that's how they love me, that's that they work from their level of consciousness and doesn't they were trying to keep me alive in their own place.
Speaker 2:But anyways, all those fears creeped up as part of my anxiety, um, my troubles with anxiety. So the the third stage was acceptance. So I'm like, okay, this sucks, I'm just going to live with anxiety. It's going to be a terrible life. I'm just going to fear everything. I won't drive on the highway because I have panic attacks when I get on the highway and I won't go to social events because I get social anxiety. And this acceptance of this is life. You know, I lived like that for maybe a year and then I was like, okay, this is life. You know, I lived like that for maybe a year and then I was like, okay, this is not the life I want. So that's when stage four comes in, which is action. So I'm like, okay, I'm gonna do this.
Speaker 2:I love reading and I love research. So I did all the research available. I read every book on anxiety nervous system and in every self-help book available, and I came up with this book that I love and I recommend that if you ever have suffered of anxiety or you know people that have anxiety. It's by Ellen Bora and it's called the anatomy of anxiety.
Speaker 2:She talks about false anxiety and true anxiety. False anxiety comes from external factors like lack of sleep, vitamin deficiency and eating junk food and whatnot. So you chip away. I started doing all the things, ticking the boxes. I eat healthy and I sleep well and I don't drink a lot of alcohol and all those things, but I still had anxiety like really bad anxiety and panic attacks and whatnot. So she talks about true anxiety and true anxiety is that anxiety that comes to us when we're not living in accordance to our values, when we are misaligned. So we're saying you know, I'm saying, for example, I love to, I love my children so much and I can't live without them, but I'm working 24 seven in an office in a cubicle, working 24-7 in an office in a cubicle. So you can see how your two values are not aligned.
Speaker 2:So either you're lying to yourself or you're not being able to live according to your values. So that's when this anxiety comes in, which is the true anxiety, which begs us to ask ourselves who are you? You need to get to know yourself and see. So I started peeling the onion and with a lot of compassion, because there's a lot of judgment when you start peeling your onion and started asking myself, for the first time in my life, what do I want? What do I need right now? What does Silvana want? Who is Silvana? You know? And that's where the real work came in. You know, because there's 35 years of making this person. That is not really me, it's just. You know, I was checking boxes and ticking boxes graduate from college, check, get married, check, get a job, check and then you blink and you're 35, you have four kids, you're and you're like wait, what happened? So that's when the real work came in and my relationship to anxiety changed, because now I see anxiety. And this is where the last stage comes in, which is hope.
Speaker 2:Now I see anxiety as my friend. It's an annoying, annoying friend. I hate her, but she's a friend. She's there, her, but she's a friend. She's there, my anxiety. I named her. Her name is Lucy. So Lucy comes to visit me every now and then now, but I'm not afraid of her. I invite her in. I ask her what am I missing? How am I diverging from my values? Am I doing something wrong? Do I need?
Speaker 1:to do a U-turn or learn my lesson.
Speaker 2:So me and Lucy have this great conversation, we negotiate and then I go on with my life. Now I'm not living with anxiety. I do get anxiety, like everyone else. It's a natural part of who we are, it's part of our survival mode. But now I see it as a friend, I see it as a hopeful friend that comes and reminds me, reminds me. I need to recalibrate in order to live a life worth living, a life filled with meaning and purpose.
Speaker 2:So just a reminder to be true to myself and as I was reemerging from, you know, or emerging from this long journey of anxiety and self-knowledge, I discovered I didn't discover. I rediscovered my purpose, which is to serve. It's where I feel the most alive, it's where I feel that my life has meaning and it's just serving. And how do I serve? I met again serendipitously with the founder of the Wellbeing Project and I decided that I would tell my story and I would help others find their journey, because everyone has their own journey. It's not you know, you don't have to do this, because this is what works for me. It's this worked for me. Maybe you can try a couple of things and go through your journey.
Speaker 1:Wow, journey, wow, thank you. No, no, no, no. This is great. I love when you talked about befriending your anxiety. The one thing that has helped me as well in my life, in my spiritual journey, is befriending my shadow and developing that language, embracing that vocabulary of befriending my shadow.
Speaker 1:I think connecting with our shadow is crucial. You know, I agree with you. I think a lot of society puts that aside because we just want to show the good aspects of our personalities. But no, I mean now it's getting more normalized. You know talking about our areas of growth, and maybe that's another way of communicating the same thing our areas of growth, our shadow.
Speaker 1:But to befriend them, to look at them as aspects of our personality that do not necessarily control the wholeness of who we are, and if they show up, look at them with compassion, look at them with kindness, tell me what's going on, what caused you to come back again and show up, and then, in that space, work with the tools we develop along the way and give compassion to that wound, that fear, that anxiety, right, that you're talking about. And it's so interesting because I think it's so connected to our stories, like our childhood, our upbringing or any major event that happens in our lives, that leaves that footprint, that little mark there and it's going to jump right into it. Anything that triggers it, it leaves you back into that space, but having a different kind of relationship with it, it makes the world of a difference. I so appreciate you sharing that and I hope that our listeners can give themselves permission to explore what that looks like for them. I think it's fair to say it doesn't happen right away.
Speaker 1:I think it's fair to say that it takes time to befriend them, to develop a relationship with them of compassion, of kindness, and to also recognize that there are moments where they're going to take the best out of us, you know, and then we have to do our inner work and come back to a moment of homostasis. I love, silvana, if you could tell our listeners a little bit more about the Wellbeing Project, what you guys do, what is the mission of the Wellbeing Project? I mean, the things that you guys are doing are remarkable, the people that you're bringing together, it's so unique. So tell us about the Wellbeing Project.
Speaker 2:The Wellbeing Project started in around 2012. And it was under the realization that there was a problem or an issue that was affecting changemakers around the world and that, to be fair, is affecting everyone around the world. But we focus on changemakers. Changemakers are trying to solve society's most complex problems.
Speaker 2:Right, they're trying to solve poverty and human rights issues and climate change, and there are all these incredible I mean huge problems that are not easily solved. Obviously, they're society's most complex problem, but they're doing it without any support and these people are facing, you know, problems with anxiety, depression, substance abuse, and it's again, one of the reasons is because most of these change makers come to work in the social sector because they themselves have suffered an injustice or trauma or a family member, so they bring in this um trauma or or baggage or these psychological issues with them to their work. You know, without, without realizing, or realizing, in the hope that they can make the world a better place, but they have these things with them and then they're working day to day in a sector, in a world that is unforgiving and sometimes it's hard. Resources are limited, time is limited, the issues are complex, limited time is limited, the issues are complex, so they're getting re-traumatized and in by by this environment in which they're working and the culture is you go in as a martyr, you go in to give it your all and you don't. You know when you're dealing. You know I see it all the time. When you're dealing with human rights defenders or a nutritional issue in a third world country in Africa. You're like oh, my problems are nothing, you know. You set your problems aside, you don't prioritize yourself because again, you feel guilty or you feel like they're not as important. But what happens is that you end up giving your all and burning out. This is what's happened to the entire population of changemakers around the world. They're burning out because they don't have the support. There's a culture that says work, work, work. There's not enough resources and that's all they get.
Speaker 2:We decided to investigate how we could help these people that are so essential to the world, to healing the souls of society, to helping society come together, to having a better world Without social workers. You can imagine, when we say the term social changemakers, it's everyone with a vocation, so a teacher, a nurse, an NGO leader, a volunteer in a nonprofit. So it's all those people. It's a very big audience, but we want to provide support so they can do their job better. And we understood that if we don't address their inner wounds then we cannot help them.
Speaker 2:And that's where the slogan from the Wellbeing Project comes well-being inspires well-doing. When we take time to, you know, get to know ourselves, take care of ourselves, do the inner work to heal those wounds from childhood or from our lives in general. We are better humans. We are more creative, we're more innovative, we have more energy, we're more compassionate. So we created these journeys for one or two year, journeys for these change makers to come along with us and work on themselves and prioritize themselves and learn to prioritize themselves, and that gets translated into their work.
Speaker 1:Amazing, amazing. It's interesting that you help. Thank you for helping me understand the mission of the Wellbeing Project. I've been following you guys for a little bit now. I love about the summits that you guys do around the world. You bring excellent speakers. I never understood that.
Speaker 1:At its core, the purpose was to continue to equip social changers, activists, and that's crucial. I think it's incredible to realize that you cannot give what you don't have, realize that you cannot give what you don't have. And there's a point, there's a point in which we all ran out of battery and when society continues to push us to just show up without honoring that at times you do need a breather. You need a breather, you need to recharge because otherwise energy is felt. I mean, energy cannot be denied. When you're tired, you're tired, and when a nurse is tired, thank God for all the nurses, and if you're a nurse, thank you so much for everything you do. I've worked at a hospital. I know your work, I know how hard you work. But because I know how hard you work, I also know that it's crucial for you to be seen.
Speaker 1:I appreciate that, at its foundation, the Wellbeing Project is trying to create a culture and an awareness of how do we try our best to find a balance so we can recharge and continue to show up for each other, because it's connected to the idea of shared humanity. Shared humanity is not just the wonderful things that happen in our lives, it's precisely the whole complex approach to life that is what makes us human. We all share that, and we all share the fact that we have a story. We all share the fact that we have longings. We all share that we have dreams. We all share the fact that we have fears. It's so amazing, actually, that we are creating a culture that is honoring the fact that we need to allow time and space to recharge, and some people abuse of that. I think it's important to name it right. Do not abuse of the fact that there's an effort of really trying to strengthen who you are.
Speaker 1:Use it with kindness. Use it with responsibility, but use it. Take the time to discover who you are. Use it with kindness. Use it with responsibility, but use it. Take the time to discover who you are. Get rid of the shame. Do not feel guilty about it. Give yourself the opportunity to discover your needs. Do not think that makes you less of an amazing human being. On the contrary, now you have a map, don't you think? When you realize your areas of growth, your shadow, what you need help with, the door has been opened. Enter it, you know. Enter it, spend time there, you know, get to know that aspect of yourself and get to understand what you need in order to come back to your whole self. And I think it's fascinating that the Wellbeing Project is just spending time, energy resources. Focus on equipping people in our society. Thank you so much for sharing that, silvana.
Speaker 2:No, no, super happy to be able to share the mission and shed light.
Speaker 1:Wonderful. We kind of touched on this a little bit, but I think there's power in telling stories, right, and so you talked about life now as meaning, because you have a sense of purpose and you want to serve others. What keeps you motivated to serve, what keeps you motivated to continue to do your work? And is gratitude somehow a part of that drive?
Speaker 2:Absolutely, as I said, gratitude is the magic pill and it's part of that drive. Absolutely, as I said, gratitude is the magic pill and it's part of my everyday. What motivates me the most is my strong belief that humans are wired to be kind. I have the joy, and I am very grateful, to meet wonderful people every day who are stepping out into the world and trying to make the world a little better. Whether it's with a little grain of sand or with a pile of sand, they get up and do their part, and seeing that every day is the biggest joy.
Speaker 2:Having conversations like this one with you today, having conversations about what we can do to improve the world, what can we do to help others, how can we show up to make the world a little bit better and it can be anything from, you know, kissing your little girl goodbye at school and giving her a hug and telling her to have a great day. That's great All the way to being in a protest for climate change. You know it. Really, it doesn't matter, it's just showing up to make the world better little by little.
Speaker 2:Nobody wakes up in the morning and says you know, I'm going to do a half job today. Nobody wakes up in the morning and says, oh, I'm going to be mediocre. No, you wake up with the energy and the desire and the tools that you have that morning and you want to be the best version of yourself. Whatever that is. If you wake up at 40% today and you give 40%, that is 100%, and we're all trying to do that every day. I love to give people the benefit of the doubt. I love to suspend judgment as much as I can. We're human and we judge because that's natural, but it's the brain's default mode. When somebody cuts me off in traffic, for most people's first reaction is oh, you know, I hate him. And then I honk the horn, you know, get really angry, insult the poor guy. I've tried over the past I would say five years or so to change that reaction into oh, I wonder what he's going through.
Speaker 2:Oh, I wonder if he has a sick child that he needs to get to, or if he had a really bad fight with her husband or his wife and he's having a bad day. That is my default mode. So now, when I'm in traffic and somebody cuts me off, I wish them well, I hope they find peace and I wish them well and I go. It's really, really hard, but it becomes a habit and it's something that you practice and you choose to practice every day and I think that agency that we have is really important. And I think that agency that we have is really important.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I want to go back at some point to the concept of practice, but before we do that, you're a mother of four children. I had the beautiful honor and blessing to get to know them, to work with them. It's been a few years now since the last time that I saw them, but I would love to spend some time understanding your journey as a parent, as a mother, understanding that you have four different souls with four complete different personalities that need from you at this stage in their lives, more than anything, guidance and the foundation so they themselves develop skills and tools early on. Can you tell me a little bit about it and what has helped you in terms of tools to pass on to them, because you have to customize them to who they are? I hope that our listeners who find themselves in a similar situation could benefit from your personal story and your insight.
Speaker 2:Being a parent has been one of the most humbling things I have ever done. I must say that I had this whole idea of how it was going to be, this picture of how I was going to rate them, and I even had like their personalities, like I was sure that they were going to come with this and this and this personality. And you know, I have one girl and three boys. And then, lo and behold, they were born and that was the end of my first scenario of what parenting was going to be like. It's been a beautiful, humbling, but beautiful journey.
Speaker 2:I realized quickly that none of what I had pictured was going to be what's going to happen. I quickly pivoted and I think pivoting is something that we can talk about a long time, because it's a great tool to have in your life just the ability to pivot. But I quickly pivoted to first understanding, asking myself again self-knowledge a little bit. What do I want for them? That is theirs, what is my most beautiful story for them? And the answer for me was that they are them, that they are themselves and they honor themselves, and they can have the confidence to be who they were brought on into this world to be. And so there's a difference and I always use this example between a sculptor parent and a gardener parent, and I chose to be the latter.
Speaker 2:I chose to be a gardener parent, which you know for kids, four different species of plants, if you want to look at it in the garden. So I have an orchid and I have an oak and I have poison ivy and I have, you know, roses, and they all. You know they all. They all need sunlight, love and water to grow, but then you have to let them be, then you have to let them flourish. You can't cut them and prune them every time, all in the same time of the year and in the same ways. They're not meant to do that. They're meant to flourish in their time, as they should be. So the sculptor parent is the opposite. You're like peeling away chopping parts. I very consciously try not to be. I try to be a guide to them.
Speaker 2:I'm here for them when they feel lost or have questions, and I usually try to answer their questions with more questions so that they can answer it themselves, because at the end of the day, the answers are within and I tell them all the time. But if you sit with yourself long enough, you'll find it. Everything is here. If it doesn't feel right, it's not. It's all in your gut. So trust that, because I had the misfortune of losing that for many years and now I feel like I'm getting it back. But I would love for them not to lose that, because that's their essence.
Speaker 2:The other thing that is part of my parenting journey and I try to do as much as possible and it becomes ever so more important when they become teenagers is connection over correction.
Speaker 2:When something you know, when my kids do something that I don't like or something, or you know they break rules, rules or whatever, I try to connect with them first, bring something that brings us together, whether it's a conversation or talk about something they enjoy or something. Connect with them and, if I can, offer my advice or find a way for them to understand how they did, what they did, the consequences, but always I choose connection. I feel like kids and I always told this to my husband they need to respect you and admire you. If they fear you, that fear, once they go into their teenage years or become older, that fear is going to go away. They're going to be double your size, double your strength. I mean, if they wanted to, my son Alex could punch my husband and sit him down with one punch. He's five, nine and built. So if you don't have that admiration and that respect, you don't have anything.
Speaker 1:Thank you for sharing. As you know, part of my professional journey has been working with youth, young adults, families and whatnot, and that's I resonate with what you're saying Like, ultimately, parenting. It's difficult, challenging, rewarding, yes, but in my personal experience, I think there's something so powerful to really developing a relationship of trust of trust because it is your job to push. They're going to be who they need to be and, as you just mentioned, chances are that they're not going to be necessarily the idea that you had in your mind. How do we deal with and how do we accept? That is one thing.
Speaker 1:But if you want that child who in his or her teenage years, they're going to push away, but if in those years you honor and you can be flexible, I can assure you in the future they're going to come back to you because they're going to feel safe to be vulnerable with you, which is very different from fear Right to be vulnerable with you, which is very different from fear right. To change that narrative is so hard. But if you build the trust of saying no, you can be disappointed at your kids and I think it's important to voice that disappointment, but you are doing it in a space where it is okay to work with one another and with their relationship, because life is going to work with one another and with their relationship, because life is going to continue to be hard and what we want is to build resilient human beings, right, autonomous, resilient human beings that can continue to do their best to go through life. But if, instead of parenting out of fear and because I say so you're actually shutting down an opportunity for the future for that young man or woman to continue to come back to you, a foundation for a relationship that can morph according to the stages that they are in their lives and even though I'm not a parent, I walk along with parents constantly, and from afar.
Speaker 1:The most beautiful gift I've seen is when there is space to do that, to offer that for each other. And that doesn't take away the fact that there's going to be ups and downs, disagreement and probably hurt each other's feelings. However, the space to come back to is there because the foundation is there. I think that, in return, allows for that future adult to continue to carry on those skills and abilities as they go in life and that's the future right. That's us helping each other now so we can have a brighter, more secure, healthier, stronger future. Thoughts on that, thoughts on the fact that now you're seeing your kids transitioning into becoming young adults here in a few years, but they're in high school now. How do you see that transition from the little children that spark, how that spark continues to be there and how it's morphing into a more defined version of who they are becoming?
Speaker 2:First of all, it's really hard for the parents out there. Even if you try, you feel you can't help. But feeling that the kids are yours and having them become their own person is like ripping apart your heart you know, and being happy about ripping apart your heart.
Speaker 2:It's this process, you know, because they're doing their process, but you're also, you know, doing your process. So it's a tandem, no, and having that you know, being able to separate and to understand that it's a healthy, natural part of their life to become their own person and for you to become your own person as well, it's important to be very conscious because it's not an easy process. We talk about the empty nest all the time and I heard somebody say a couple of weeks ago it's not an empty nest, it's a bird launcher. You know, if you are lucky enough, you're launching birds into the world and it's beautiful and they will come back if you do a good job.
Speaker 2:And again, it's not about you. But if everything goes into you know the universe helps you. They will come back and it's a beautiful, beautiful process. It's been an honor to watch my kids. We did the conscious decision of moving to Kansas City five years ago. I was. That was when I was going through my inner process and trying to escape the inner work and I thought moving cities was going to help me. And then I realized that wherever you go, there you are. So I started doing the work. But but we one of the reasons why we moved aside from my inner journey the job offering the kids.
Speaker 2:We thought that Miami, even though we owe a lot to that city and we love Miami in so many ways and I grew up there and I have friends and it's a beautiful city. It was a lot on teenagers they grow up very fast. So we made the conscious decision of moving to the Midwest and we slowed down the maturity process in a good way. I mean, they were kids. They were allowed to be kids longer. There are no fraction of cell phone People here did not give their kids cell phones until eighth grade and that was early. They ride their bikes to school. It worked for us.
Speaker 2:Again, it doesn't work for everyone. Not everyone can grab their kids and move to the opportunity to slow down. And as he slowed down he was able to understand who he was and honor the process of becoming a man. So now he's a sophomore in high school and I can really see his confidence shining through. He's okay being who he is and not hiding behind. You know, the material aspect or the personality of a tough cookie. He's still Alex with all his perks, but I love seeing him grow into the man that he is going to grow into.
Speaker 2:He still has a ways to go, but it's been a beautiful process.
Speaker 1:Wow, thank you for sharing. That's really special. I love what you said about giving them the opportunity to have a longer experience as children. Our world is too fast and we might sound like dinosaurs when we say that it's not that we're not embracing technology or the reality of the world that we live in. Because we understand precisely that life, ultimately, is too short, we should give ourselves the opportunity to learn how to be present as much as we can in every stage of our lives and to allow that to find meaning, just to be what it needs to be. And what a beautiful gift that you all have been able to offer that to the kids. That's amazing. Please send them my love. It's been a minute since I've seen them. Silvana, I would love for us to talk about practices. Do you do that? Help you connect? That helps you find alignment, recharge your batteries? I want to combine. How do you deal with fear and anxiety, and what practices do you maintain to help yourself continue to move forward in life?
Speaker 2:I think over the past decade or so, stress has been vilified. We see stress as the monster. Stress will make us sick. Stress leads to inflammation, and it is true, but it is chronic stress and stress is not all bad. We need stress. We need stress to perform, we need stress to act. Stress keeps us motivated.
Speaker 1:You want your surgeon to be a little stressed to perform your surgery you don't want them to be like ah.
Speaker 2:I got this, and that happens with all our areas. You need a little bit of stress to be motivated to prepare for a presentation or a test. That is normal and we should not discard it as something that is bad for us. The problem is chronic stress. The problem is living in a constant rat race where we don't stop, where our nervous system is always at its max, where we go from one meeting to the next and one activity to the other, and then we have to get the kids, and then we have to drive, and then traffic, and you know, like that, constant stress is what's keeping us, what's making us sick, us sick.
Speaker 2:So, because we're not going to get rid of stress and life is going to continue to be fast unless we put a stop to it. There are some things that we can do that are simple, that can make our life more balanced, if you want to call it sustainable. We're looking for sustainability here. Sometimes you say, oh, meditate, but meditation is not for everyone. For me, for example, I am very hyper, very active.
Speaker 2:The idea of stress 10 years ago gave me anxiety, to be perfectly honest. I can't sit there for 20 minutes. I have stuff to do. I can't shut my mind off. I'm going to start thinking about to-do lists and grocery lists.
Speaker 2:So for me, what worked was creating micro moments, small mindful moments that are only one, two, maybe five minutes. If you have it can be going outside to the backyard and looking at the trees or doing a little dance party. You know, putting my favorite song in my office where nobody's watching, just shaking it all off, listening to my favorite song. So it's little micro moments that you can add into your life that will bring you back to baseline, that will ground you, so you're not at a constant hypervigilant state all day, because that's what creates inflammation, that's what creates sickness. That is key. We say always at the Wellbeing Project there are billions, literally as many humans as there are ways to come to well-being. I cannot tell you what your well-being toolbox should have. I can give you what works for me and you can take mine, and then you can talk to somebody else and take yours and do some research, you know from the research.
Speaker 2:What works for you, phil? Since we're born, we start adding to like a little well-being toolbox and we copy mechanisms and with this and with that, and unconsciously and then consciously and I invite people to again curiosity what works for you? Because it's not the same for you than it is for me. For you it might be running a couple of miles every day or playing with your dog. It's not my job to tell you what works for you. It's my job to say hey, stop and look inside your toolbox. What do you need? What can you add?
Speaker 1:And I think that's a big lesson that I learned, learned what's in my toolbox and how can I add to my toolbox, because at the end of the day, it's a journey. We're not gonna have.
Speaker 2:Okay, this is my toolbox. No, as we grow, as we learn, as we mature, we're gonna need different things and for different situations. So right, right be open to adding stuff to your toolbox. Be open hearted. You know it can be samba when you judge those samba dancers. It doesn't have to be. You know meditation, although meditation is wonderful.
Speaker 1:Right, you know, I love what you said about whatever tool works best for you, and that leads me to think about what's happening when the happening is happening, and what I'm hearing correct me if I'm wrong is you're having a moment when you are in the flow, when you are flowing with life, when you're connecting with energy force, when you are connecting with the mystery of being alive, of being you. Do we really allow time to honor that in our lives, to live a life without having those moments? We're missing so much when that happens right, when we don't give ourselves permission to do that. Honestly, you are perhaps one of the first people that talk about recharging by being active, and I love it. I've interviewed people that put physical activity as part of their practices. They understand that there's a neurological component too, because the more you work out, the better your brain functions. That's a rational way of understanding the importance of being physical, but I think what I'm getting out of your response is the honoring, like what you said, how many billions of ways of connecting Eight?
Speaker 2:billion, eight billion.
Speaker 1:That in itself is amazing, and understanding that, the fact that there's eight billion ways of connecting with life and finding meaning to this experience that in itself is a miracle. And to respect that, to honor that for yourself, to look at yourselves as the vehicle for that expression to manifest what a beautiful gift. What a beautiful gift, and I think it's important that we are cultivating that in each other, that we continue to create space to share these stories, because I'm learning something by you sharing your story with me, and I hope that the listeners out there get something out of giving themselves permission to explore what works for you, connect with the gift of being alive and allow yourself to learn from how other people connect with life. More importantly, let's give ourselves permission to do that, to honor that, to respect that in each other right.
Speaker 2:Absolutely.
Speaker 1:I want to honor our people's spans of attention. I like to ask this question in closing always, is there a special quote or figure that's been inspiring you lately in life? That's been inspiring you lately in life? What is a special quote or an individual that has been giving you a north?
Speaker 2:I've had the honor to meet a lot of people in my work, whether it's through a book or my many meetings in the Wellbeing Project. If I could find one that relates to this conversation that we had would be Victor Frankl, and I'll read it because I don't want to chop it off. Everything can be taken from a man, but one thing, the last of human freedoms to choose one's attitude in any given set of circumstances, to choose one's own way.
Speaker 1:Love it. We have the choice. We have the choice, and making the choice in itself is a gift.
Speaker 2:For sure.
Speaker 1:Making the choice in itself is a gift. You know what that reminds me of? Of self-love Making a choice is an act of self-love. What is his name, again?
Speaker 2:Viktor Frankl.
Speaker 1:I'm going to have to check him out. I think it's the first time I hear about him.
Speaker 2:His book is Man's Search for Meaning. Everyone should read it. It's short and it's wonderful.
Speaker 1:Listeners out there. You have a new book to consider. I have a new book to consider myself, silvana. I love asking my guests who they think should be a future guest on Journey Talks podcast, and so the question would be who do you think would make a great addition to the show?
Speaker 2:I would love to have you talk to Dr Richard Davidson. I don't know if you've known him. He's a neuroscientist from. University of Madison, Wisconsin.
Speaker 1:He would be a wonderful person.
Speaker 2:You would love conversing with him. I've never heard someone as intelligent and humble as he is. It would be fantastic.
Speaker 1:I would love to have that conversation. Well, universe, you're listening. Let's make it happen, right? Silvana? Thank you so much. This has been so meaningful and I love this conversation. It's been a pleasure speaking with you and reconnecting. Once again, I wish you continued blessings in everything that you do. Please send my love to the family. I look forward to having you again in the future, if we can make that happen and have you back on the podcast. I thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you, gracias. Abrazos, bendiciones, all those beautiful things, in whatever language there is. May all those that positive energy goes to you and you may share it with others as well. All right, Thank you.
Speaker 2:I'm deeply grateful and happy to be here, and I would love to be here again. Wonderful, just make it happen.
Speaker 1:Yes, and to our listeners. Thank you for joining us today and for another episode of Journey Talks Podcast, your favorite podcast to reconnect with gratitude and inspiration. Until next time, stay inspired and stay connected with yourself and the stories that matter. Thank you so much and have a great day. Thank you for watching. Make sure you like and subscribe to our channel, and have a great day.