It turns out a bodybuilding rom-com thriller was the movie we’ve been waiting for. Yes, this week we’re talking about Love Lies Bleeding, Rose Glass’ follow-up to the incredible Saint Maud, starring Kristen Stewart in the role she was made the play.
References
Interview with Rose Glass, and stars Kristen Stewart and Katy O’Brian
‘Rose Glass talks ‘Love Lies Bleeding’, casting Kristen Stewart and working with a much bigger budget’ by Ellie Calnan for Screen Daily
Cannes Awards: Female-Centered Stories Win Big in Cannes, as Sean Baker’s ‘Anora’ Earns Palme d’Or by Peter Debruge for Variety
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Original music by James Brailsford
Logo design by Abby-Jo Sheldon
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It turns out a bodybuilding rom-com thriller was the movie we’ve been waiting for. Yes, this week we’re talking about Love Lies Bleeding, Rose Glass’ follow-up to the incredible Saint Maud, starring Kristen Stewart in the role she was made the play.
References
Interview with Rose Glass, and stars Kristen Stewart and Katy O’Brian
‘Rose Glass talks ‘Love Lies Bleeding’, casting Kristen Stewart and working with a much bigger budget’ by Ellie Calnan for Screen Daily
Cannes Awards: Female-Centered Stories Win Big in Cannes, as Sean Baker’s ‘Anora’ Earns Palme d’Or by Peter Debruge for Variety
-----------
If you love what we do, please like, subscribe and leave a review!
Original music by James Brailsford
Logo design by Abby-Jo Sheldon
Follow us
Email us
scariest kind of haircut you can ever imagine.
S4 E8 Love lies INTRO_LILY:Welcome to Groovy Movies. My name is Lily Austin.
James INTRO PICKUP ONLY:And my name's James Brailsford. Hello.
S4 E8 Love lies INTRO_LILY:How are you, James?
James INTRO PICKUP ONLY:I am not too bad at all. Thank you very much. Uh, how are you?
S4 E8 Love lies INTRO_LILY:I'm, I'm alright. I can feel a cold brewing, which
James INTRO PICKUP ONLY:Oh,
S4 E8 Love lies INTRO_LILY:concerned about, but I'm okay, it's fine, because it was the Cannes Film Festival last week and that always buoys my spirits. Was that a smooth segue? I'm not sure.
James INTRO PICKUP ONLY:I don't know, but I'll take it. I mean, it kind of crept up on me this year's, kind of, can it just, just, uh, I was suddenly like, oh shit, it's can I just somehow didn't get sucked into the book, I think it's because I've been off Instagram. So I don't get like a daily second by second immersion in what's coming up. Whereas. In the lead up to the end of last year, I was plugged into everything that was happening in the world of film. I felt really on it. Whereas I realized actually that was social media nudging me. I kind of let that one slip.
S4 E8 Love lies INTRO_LILY:Well, I mean, that's all right. Cause now we're here. We're talking about the highlights. the main thing was the fact that there was this female majority jury presided over by Greta Gerwig. and there was a bit of fuss about that because basically nice people who made good films won, which apparently is a, it must be down to all the women on the, on, on the panel.
James INTRO PICKUP ONLY:right. I see a bias towards good films made by nice people.
S4 E8 Love lies INTRO_LILY:I mean, that's all I can think. Okay, so the big winner was Sean Baker, who, I believe you're a fan of James, who made the
James INTRO PICKUP ONLY:Yo, yeah. Yeah, I, I rewatched Tangerine a couple of weeks ago actually, and put it up on the projector just cause, uh, you know, it, it was shot on the iPhone 5 and, uh, let's see, let's see what it looks like on the big screen. It held up great and, you know, it's a fun little film. I, you know, it's a good laugh.
S4 E8 Love lies INTRO_LILY:I feel like that's definitely on our list. We were thinking about doing an episode on films all shot over one day and when we get to that guys, that will definitely be on the list, I think. but yeah, but it sounds like great film there. So, so it was the film called Anura and it was described as a rowdy whirlwind romance between a sex worker and an obscenely rich son of a Russian oligarch.
James INTRO PICKUP ONLY:ha ha. It's like an odd couple.
S4 E8 Love lies INTRO_LILY:Yeah, I think antics ensue, I think it's exciting, so I can't wait to see that. And then the other big winner was kind of the second most important award is the Grand Prix, and that was won by Payal Kapadia, which, that was for a movie called All We Imagine As Light, which is the first Indian film to be selected into the competition in 30 years, and the first win for an Indian person at all. So.
James INTRO PICKUP ONLY:Very notable. Okay.
S4 E8 Love lies INTRO_LILY:so movie exciting moves. I want to see the other thing. I, I feel like we need to briefly discuss is the fact that Yorgos Lanthimos debuted another film
James INTRO PICKUP ONLY:Oh my
S4 E8 Love lies INTRO_LILY:a month after poor things comes out
James INTRO PICKUP ONLY:I need a rest, please.
S4 E8 Love lies INTRO_LILY:I'm excited. Do you think you would you because it's, you know what? It's not only was a debuted at Cannes, but it's already been picked up. It's coming out in the UK of June. We can see it next month.
James INTRO PICKUP ONLY:My God, I just like, yeah, I, I'm glad that he is becoming very popular because it's good that an interesting director with a very unique vision and style, but it's just not my style. It's a bit too, it's just a bleakness that just somehow I can't quite fully lock into, and I need about three to four years gap between one dose and the other.
S4 E8 Love lies INTRO_LILY:it's, yeah, they're not easy watchers, these movies, that's for
James INTRO PICKUP ONLY:No, you know, it's not like your big burger that you can just have any time of day, picks you up. You know, this is like some, I don't know, like I imagine what caviar must be like. I've never had it, but it's just like,
S4 E8 Love lies INTRO_LILY:You've never had caviar?
James INTRO PICKUP ONLY:no, I'm from up north.
S4 E8 Love lies INTRO_LILY:I love it. Good for you staying true to your working class roots. I mean, the reality, you know, the middle classness that is true, the real, the real deal. But I love that when it comes to caviar, yeah,
James INTRO PICKUP ONLY:That's my limit. That's my limit.
S4 E8 Love lies INTRO_LILY:Okay, fair enough. Well, all that's to say the real, real fuss was about a movie by a little known director called Francis Ford Coppola, James.
James INTRO PICKUP ONLY:yes, his follow up to Twixt, which, uh, I'm sure you can, everyone can remember Twixt in the cinema. No,
S4 E8 Love lies INTRO_LILY:What?
James INTRO PICKUP ONLY:It, oh my God, his last film that he did in like 2009, 2010 was a, detective story starring Val Kilmer,
S4 E8 Love lies INTRO_LILY:Oh my god, I don't know anything about this. They must have done incredible work to bury it,
James INTRO PICKUP ONLY:if you want to have a, uh, like the most eclectic time with movies, I suggest just watching Francis Ford Coppola's Ouvre in order from beginning to end, because it is a riot.
S4 E8 Love lies INTRO_LILY:Okay. Maybe over like a few days we can do that at some point.
James INTRO PICKUP ONLY:I used to every Sunday, me and my friend used to work our way through each of his films, starting off with Dementia 13, his low budget horror that he shot for Roger Corman in six days in Ireland.
S4 E8 Love lies INTRO_LILY:Oh my god. Okay, wow, okay, yeah. No, that's a good way of doing it. One a week, one a week. Alright, okay.
James INTRO PICKUP ONLY:Anyway, sorry, sorry, that's a long thing to say. This is his latest and probably his last film.
S4 E8 Love lies INTRO_LILY:Do you think?
James INTRO PICKUP ONLY:There's two scenarios here. This becomes a runaway success, in which case I could be completely wrong and there'd be another film. I think the reality is this is going to struggle to make back 120 million. So I don't think he's going to want to hurry and self finance another film. And I'm not sure another studio is going to want to give him money for a film.
S4 E8 Love lies INTRO_LILY:Well, that's the thing, right? So he has self financed this movie. There's no studios involved. He did it totally himself, which is kind of the, the signature, the trademark Francis Ford Coppola move, right? Cause he did the same thing with Apocalypse Now.,
James INTRO PICKUP ONLY:He kind of goes all in or whatever the poker analogy is, but he puts all the chips on the table. He always gambles, he puts everything on red or whatever. You know, he takes a big risk. He always swings big. And like in the seventies, his big swings always hit. They all connected. but then, From literally 1980. It's almost the turn of the decade when he kind of went all in on one from the heart, to the tune of 26 million worth of loans that were in his name. Uh, and it was a massive flop. And so he spent the next 20 years digging himself out of debt.
S4 E8 Love lies INTRO_LILY:making movies for studios, right? Yeah.
James INTRO PICKUP ONLY:Yeah, he had to every year for 20 years, I think he had to come up with 2 million every October to make sure that he didn't get all his belongings and everything. He's in his estate, uh, kind of taken away from him. So yeah, it was a gun for hire just paying off his debt.
S4 E8 Love lies INTRO_LILY:Oh God. And you think he's gonna go back, go back into the same situation
James INTRO PICKUP ONLY:Well, I don't think he'll be in debt because you know, he's only sold like a hundred million. He's also sold 120 million of his estate, but he's still got some of it. So he's not, he's not gambled. He's not gambled everything.
S4 E8 Love lies INTRO_LILY:it wasn't debts. It was, he just got the money together.
James INTRO PICKUP ONLY:I think he's winery's total value is like 300 million and he sold like 150 or 200 million of it. I think is what's happened.
S4 E8 Love lies INTRO_LILY:Okay, love that for him. Very savvy. what do we think about mega Megaopolis Megaopolis?
James INTRO PICKUP ONLY:Megalopolis I'm going with.
S4 E8 Love lies INTRO_LILY:Is it Megalopolis? Oh yeah. Okay. Sorry. That was a typo on my part in our script. Megalopolis.
James INTRO PICKUP ONLY:You missed off a
S4 E8 Love lies INTRO_LILY:I messed up a lot. Yeah. Whatever. Yes. Yes. I mean, sounds completely mad. Adam Driver in a Roman epic fable of an imagined a modern America.
James INTRO PICKUP ONLY:I was excited, but then I've been reading the reviews and I'm like, Oh God, I'm not sure I want to put Lily through this. It's not something I think I can, uh,
S4 E8 Love lies INTRO_LILY:love, I love Francis Ford Coppola. I think he's
James INTRO PICKUP ONLY:do I,
S4 E8 Love lies INTRO_LILY:Ever since we watched that, we watched the documentary about the making of Apocalypse Now. Hearts of Darkness, which was directed by his wife, who sadly died a few weeks ago. The film was like tributes to her. But like it made me love him so much. She's such a sweetheart, so I'm definitely going to see this film. And I love, but I love that the reviews are so, so mixed. Some are saying it's awful, some are saying it's amazing.
James INTRO PICKUP ONLY:I mean, I,
S4 E8 Love lies INTRO_LILY:but a good mess. No, no, it's just a mess. It's a bloated, oh no, he's a genius, it's gonna be like a Pockets now. People will hate it first, but then they'll understand. I'm, I'm in, I wanna see this.
James INTRO PICKUP ONLY:Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm definitely going to see it. I think it's going to be more, one from the heart than apocalypse now. That's my gut feeling. And, you know, one from the heart is still worth a watch, but it's not pleasant.
S4 E8 Love lies INTRO_LILY:Okay, well, I'm just hoping, I was a bit worried because of those mixed reviews that maybe it wouldn't get some kind of distribution deal, but it has in Europe, it's got a, it's got distribution deals in all major, regions was the phrase I saw bandied about. So I think that must include the UK right shortly.
James INTRO PICKUP ONLY:Yeah. And I hope it gets an IMAX release. I heard rumors that they were angling for an IMAX release. I thought that'd be great. So, you know,
S4 E8 Love lies INTRO_LILY:Alright guys, so stay tuned for that discussion of that film. But, shall we get to the main event?
James INTRO PICKUP ONLY:Absolutely.
Lily:So this week we are talking about a very interesting film. Love Lies Bleeding, Rose Glass's, sophomore movie. That's what, that's what the word right for your
James:yeah, yeah, difficult second movie, sophomore movie, the follow up movie, next one,
Lily:to St. Maud, I don't know if you guys have seen that movie, but it's excellent. Please go watch it.
James:I was going to ask, so you have seen it then, because, when it came out, uh, it looked very interesting, but in general, I don't watch horror, which I need to get over this, because I think horror is possibly the most interesting kind of genre that appeals to younger audiences, especially at film school, lots of the students watch horror, and I just think I need to get over myself, so yeah, what do you think of St. Maude? St. Maude.
Lily:okay, interesting you say that because, yes, as a teenager, I loved horror movies. My best friend and I used to, every Friday night, we'd watch horror movies together. We watched all the classics, you know, and then as I got older, I, I stopped enjoying them. I think because, and I thought about this a lot, I think what it is is that I think a lot of horror. The aim of the game is just to scare you, so they don't do a good, the storyline isn't very original or well thought out, and their characters don't, there isn't any real character development often, so it needs to be a very good horror film for me to like it, but St. Maud is absolutely that. I mean the first half of the film, there are no jump scares really in it, but it very much builds just the story of this woman, this nurse and the person that she cares for. That is fascinating. and then in the final kind of third, it really like ramps up and the movie, it's only like an hour and a half. This movie, I think even shorter than that. So it's it's as a bit. It's so clever. It's really, really excellent. It's an amazing movie. And I just love that she went on to do Love Lies Bleeding because you can definitely see some similarities in terms of the things that she's interested in, but it's a completely different movie,
James:oh, interesting. Okay. Yeah. When I, when I realized she'd done set mode, I was interested to know what, how it compared to
Lily:Yeah. Yeah. And it's cool because Rose Glass is British. St. Maude, it feels like a very British movie in lots of ways. And so I love that Love Lies Bleeding is this movie set in kind of the fantastical, New Mexico desert.
James:Yeah, and I, again, when I watched Love Like Bleeding, I didn't know that Rose Glass was English. Actually, it's only since doing my research afterwards. And, and maybe I wouldn't say I explained anything, but because the depiction of America, it's a very stylized, heightened, like Americana. And I was immediately comparing it to Bound, uh, just because of the, you know, because we have a romantic lesbian couple at the heart of what is like Crime thriller drama, but they're both very different takes on it. And both got very, they're both hyper stylized, but we're both very different types of stylization. so, so maybe it's just that slight outsider, that British perspective that the Wachowskis obviously being America themselves had a different take on the material. But I, you know, I'm not saying that's the only reason, but perhaps that explains this very like almost fairy story kind of atmosphere that Love Live Bleeding has.
Lily:Yes, totally. And the other film that I thought of when I was watching it is, Paris, Texas, because this is also set in a desert. There's just certain things about the landscape that really reminded me of it. And then actually, I read an interview with Rose Glasgow, she talked about the list of movies that she gave to the cast to watch as a reference and Paris, Texas was one of them. and Wim Wenders, who we talked about, the director of Perfect Days, you know, he's a German director. And so there is a similarity again of directors who aren't American, but being very much enamored with the, or making use of the fantastical idea of the American desert, you know.
James:interesting take. And you know, perhaps there's a, the cinematography, the kind of quite saturated color washes that are across people's faces and stuff, which reminds me a little bit, I mean, Love's Light bleeding is much grungier, I think looking much darker than perhaps. Yeah. Like a very very very Yeah, very, textured look to it. Kind of grainy, you know, not a good look, by the way. This isn't a criticism, but just, you know, it's, it's, whereas Paris, Texas is a little cleaner, a little, it's still a darker feel to it, but just a bit crisper and cleaner overall.
Lily:Do you think so? I think it's quite, sort of, grainy as well in a way, or maybe that's just because it was filmed on, made on film. Ha ha ha ha!
James:always got some texture, but I know, yeah, I know what you mean. Anyway, it definitely is clean. I mean, Love's Eye Bleeding, it feels like so clean. like you said, grungy, dirty, sweaty. It's visceral, right? Rose Glass really leans into kind of bodily functions a lot in the film. yeah, yeah,
Lily:But should we, we're kind of dived in without giving a plot summary
James:Oh, why didn't you give us a plot summary then, go on, tell us.
Lily:I actually gave one literally the night before last at a party explaining to people what this movie was about. So, I'm going to basically repeat what I said that night. Um, no spoilers guys, don't worry, we're going to be careful. but you should just go and see it, pause this, go right now to the cinema, and then come back. okay, so, Love Lies Bleeding. We meet Kristen Stewart. She plays Lou. She is a employee at a gym in 1989. The fall of the Berlin Wall is happening in the background of this movie. then a very sexy girl called Jackie walks in, played by Katie O'Brien. she has a very impressive muscular physique, very sexy, and starts working out and Kristen Stewart cannot take her eyes off her. Lou can't take her eyes off her. Before you know it, they're in a relationship. Katie O'Brien, Jackie I should say, is living with Lou. Because up until then she had been homeless and had just arrived in town, had gotten a job. We'll on Lou's dad's gun range. And he is played by Ed Harris, balding Ed Harris, but with long hair at the back, very good choice. And he is also called Lou Senior, which I think is important. Okay. Lou Senior, Ed Harris, Kristen Stewart is Lou Jr. and I should also say that Kristen Stewart, Lou, hates her dad. We're not quite sure why, but he does seem to be quite evil and crazy. He's very into insects. she also has a sister, Lou has a sister called Beth, who's played by Jenna Malone, who you might recognize from such brilliant films as Saved, uh, well, Donnie Darko, exactly. That was the other one that I was gonna Ha ha ha! Two ends of the spectrum in terms of Beth. Um, love to see her back and Dave Franco plays her abusive husband, JJ, who Kristen Stewart also hates. All of these things start to mix together, but at the center of the story, we have Lou and Jackie's relationship and the fact that Jackie wants to enter into a bodybuilding competition in Las Vegas in a few weeks time. So we're kind of watching Lou and Jackie's love relationship, they're together, they're completely in love and obsessed with each other, and they're working towards Jackie going to this bodybuilding contest, helped in part by Lou offering her steroids when they first meet, and that becoming quite an integral part of the story as well. But I'll say no more than that, I feel like I explained that very badly and there's a lot going on, but the, needless to say, it gets crazy and
James:I didn't really know much about this film going into it, which I quite like, you know, I tried to do this. It's, uh, you know, I still loved, uh, the, the experience of going to see the Florida project with knowing very little about it and Loves Life, bleeding in, leading. I knew at the time. But I just caught some interview or something, but I really didn't know much. So it was, it was quite interesting to go into because, um, The film seems to have a certain tone, a certain like, I would say it felt like gritty realism, but then as soon as, Jackie takes the steroids for the first time, we immediately get like, the, the, you hear the sound effects and you see the twitching of a body in a way that's absolutely not nothing like reality. Like, okay, so the film isn't that gritty. It's, this is like outside the realms of what could happen in the real world. You know, that, that was a, and it was interesting kind of like, Twist to where the film was going.
Lily:What I love about it is that on the one hand, I think the way it is filmed and yes, the, subplot, I suppose, with Jackie taking these steroids and what happens with that. All of that feels very fantastical. And like you said, there is something kind of fairytale about this setting and the kind of the world in which they live and the fact that there is this evil father in the background and we, and during the film you're not quite sure what he's doing, but you know he's scary and kind of controls everyone in the world that they live in and that they're kind of trapped in it. Lu won't, can't, doesn't feel she can leave. There is something fantastical about that, but then at the same time, I think the performances are so, you know, Grounded in reality, particularly Kristen Stewart's, well, I want to discuss her performance with you because I think it's pretty amazing. There is such reality to that. So I think that is actually what makes the film really work is that combination.
James:absolutely. it's a very grounded performance from Kristen Stewart. I wasn't expecting it, I guess, is the thing, and I was quite delighted by it. Because I always like something that, because, I, I suspected when the, uh, the steroids were introduced, the film had seen up to that point. I just thought, Oh, this is going to be a much more, kitchen sink drama exploration of the dangers of steroids. And then when it wasn't, when it was like, you heard the sound effects of the muscles and the sinew, like stretching and twisting, like, okay, this is not going the direction I thought.
Lily:The film is completely unpredictable. It sets up these archetypes, I think, of like the American desert, the couple in love at the center with lots of fucked up people around them. And like, you know, there is this kind of crime element and this violent murder assassination element to it too. But actually nothing that happens you can predict. It just gets more and more chaotic. And I love, what I loved about that steroid thing was that Where you expect that to end up is not at all where it ends up. And I won't say anything, guys, watch the movie. But I found that very, very pleasing. It's, uh, it's lovely for something like that to not go where you think it's gonna go. But thank God, because The one downside about seeing movies at the cinema is that you see the trailers and I'm, I think the more, the more this is happening, the more I think I just, I need to make sure I time my entrance to the cinema carefully because I'd seen the trailer at least three times and was so excited. I knew, you know, the site said, yes, I'm going to absolutely love this movie and I did. I think it's my favorite film of the year so far. I absolutely love it. But. Huge spoiler for the end of the movie. The thing that happens at the very end that I won't spoil because it is, it's like amazing, brilliant scene, very satisfying ending. I was, I had it from the trailer in mind, I was waiting for that throughout the film. So that was really, really frustrating. I was so annoyed about that. Um, so yeah, I'm very jealous of you because it is a movie that really, I mean, there are so many surprises that it couldn't be fully spoiled, but that was a little bit frustrating.
James:Once I realized the whole film was kind of a bit stylized and, magical reality, let's say,
Lily:Yeah, I, yeah, I thought magical realism was definitely. a vibe.
James:some, yeah, I, I don't know. I don't know. I couldn't say I had much to say about it. I remember thinking, I was comparing it to bound'cause I guess in my head it was the only thing that I could think in any way was similar to, in something that I'd seen before. So, you know, they have a, I don't envy their relationship in, love's lives bleeding. It's not an aspirational relationship that I want to get into, I guess is what I could say. Um, where, where, where, where, where's inbound? I'm like, oh, I wouldn't mind being cocky, you know?
Lily:Yeah, no one ever, no one would mind, everyone would love to be corky. Uh, okay, yeah, but I think that's kind of what I loved about, about their relationship was watching a very, very dysfunctional relationship blossom and then And because it was done, well I should, we, I think we haven't really talked about is how funny this film is, this film is hilarious, like I've seen it described as a queer thriller, and it is that, but it's also a rom com, and like hilarious, and I mean, a very Dark exactly, a dark and twisted, fucked up, body building rom com, and I just think that is the like, the Venn diagram I want for my movies, you know,
James:that's what you're after. That's what you're in the business for.
Lily:Yes, because it's so, I love, I just, I don't know if there are that many movies actually which show the complete, besot, the crazy besottedness of when you meet someone and you both immediately like fall crazy in love with each other. um,
James:go for, and you go all in, even though you hardly know each other.
Lily:Yeah, I read Kristen Stewart actually describing it as the fever dream of falling in love and I think that is totally that when it's that kind of just instantly slightly toxic which I think is kind of summed up by the fact that the first thing Kristen Stewart does to try and ingratiate herself with Jackie, is offer her these steroids because she clearly, I mean my reading of that was like she clearly doesn't feel like she is enough just as herself, she needs to offer something else to make someone fall in love with her, even though it's clear from the minute Jackie sees her that she is very into her. But then equally, Jackie has her own insecurities, you know, she clearly knows that she has this really impressive body and she's She kind of owns that, but it's also, you can feel it slightly marred by insecurity, right, is that she's trying to, compensate for something that she feels she lacks. So this has been getting really into the god psychology of these characters.
James:I love it. This deep dive.
Lily:But James, let's pick up, let's see, this is what I'm into, and then we're going to move on to talking about the cinematography.
James:So it's, it's hitting both of our personal interests quite
Lily:Yeah, exactly. I think I, I'm just, I love seeing a relationship. I just felt like both those characters, I just kind of understood them, even though they're both so extreme, you know, because what was very interesting, I think, was the fact that on the face of it, Jackie is the, if we think about gendered stereotypes, Jackie is a bodybuilder, so she is physically stronger than Lou, and yet in their relationship, she is definitely the submissive one, you know, Lou is the one who's kind of in control and is always telling her what to do and, basically dictating the terms of their relationship. But in this way, that's quite, she has a gentle approach to it, you know, and I just found that that dynamic quite interesting And then the fact that. Jackie is like that, but then will suddenly flip and become quite violent,
James:God, yeah.
Lily:to say the least. but towards the end, when they kind of reconcile and that conversation that they have is just so amazingly messed up and toxic, but hilarious. and because of the way these characters have unfolded, You're completely rooting for them, even though they're both the most. Fucks up, messed up people. They've clearly both, you know, they do terrible things all the time. I think
James:Yeah.
Lily:them both as psychopaths.
James:I mean, I think, think, like textbook really, isn't it?
Lily:Yeah, I literally at the final scene, I was thinking James would call her a text, a textbook psychopath. And I would say she's just trying to try to support her girlfriend in very difficult conditions. But okay, So just to give you a couple of the other films that I had that Rose Glass suggested to, um, you. Thank you. Crash.
James:I've never seen that really now that makes it
Lily:Showgirls.
James:that makes a lot of sense. That really does make a lot of sense Yeah, yeah
Lily:Yeah. Okay, explain them. Why, why does that make a lot of sense?
James:Because showgirls is this kind of you can you either see it as like a Completely bad movie or you see it as something where it was deliberately meant to be this kind of strange Dark fairy tale. And again, this is what Love's Life is Bleeding is, is a strange, dark fairy tale set in America about women trying to, I don't know, make something of themselves, but in the, in the end they have to be part of this horrible world that they're in, you know? So yes, just, I mean, I hadn't thought about it until you just brought it up. So I'm just trying to figure that out now, but yeah, it makes sense. There is a connection between the two films.
Lily:Yeah, doesn't it feel like it's sort of an evolution of Showgirls where it's kind of ironed out a few of the kinks a little bit, maybe? Not that I want, not that I want Showgirls, Showgirls to me is perfection. I don't want any, any kinks ironed out, but because it's, I think it's equally as camp and big, right? But, but with Showgirls, The acting is very bad on the whole, I think we can agree. And I've just realized there's also a link now because of the cut between Bound, and Love Lies Bleeding, the connecting tissue is Showgirls because,, um, I've forgotten the actress's name, who plays Corky. Yeah, exactly, Gina Gershon. She's, she's our connector between, and she gets it. She gets her role in both those movies.
James:Yeah. She does. She nails it.
Lily:And then, and Kristen Stewart is almost her natural Child.
James:I guess, but I. I think the thing with Showgirls is that some people argue that it's just a bad film, badly made by people who didn't know what they were doing. And then, well, actually, maybe there's more to it than that. Or it's a mixture of both, you know, Joe Esterhouse's mad script, but then Paul Verhoeven, you know, he's not a bad director. You know, so there's a mix of, whereas I think with Love Lies Bleeding, it's ironed out those problems. I don't think you're asking those questions as much,
Lily:yeah, it definitely feels like it knows exactly what it's doing and it's, and it is achieving that. It feels very smart, whereas with Showgirls, it's very hard to, find the line where, where, where it feels deliberate or not. But I, yeah, and that's the fun of it, honestly, that is the fun of it. But I don't know what it is about this film, but everything just weaves together. Because I feel like if you were very consciously trying to do like a slightly camp, over the top, gritty, violent, comedic movie, it could all just not work and feel a bit try hard almost, but it just all feels so naturally.
James:yeah, It's basically what you described there is, you know, it's tonally consistent. You know, it doesn't feel like it's suddenly pivoting from something that's really funny to something that's really dark. It all feels darkly funny, twisted. Um, so yeah, Uh, you know, cause it's nice when you start watching a film and you think, oh yeah, I think this is a good film actually. you can usually tell in the first few minutes, but I just thought the sense of atmosphere is great. I also thought the sound mixing was really good. I just thought, yeah, this is. A very well told story that none of it, none of it's jarring. The use of music's really clever. It just, it all, it's all comes together. I didn't know anything about Rose Glass, but I just thought this is a clearly director who's kind of on top of their game already.
Lily:Yeah, I can't. I honestly, I'm so excited for her next movie. I think she's an absolute genius. it really has made me reevaluate my feelings about Christian Stewart. I have to say.
James:Oh, right. Well, what, what your thoughts? Cause I don't have much thoughts on Christian Stewart. I've not really seen her in that much stuff. I saw it.
Lily:watch Twilight.
James:I didn't watch Twilight. However, I did watch Spencer and I loved Spencer.
Lily:Spencer?
James:Yeah. I had a great time with it. Oh, I just thought it was a fun life. You take it as like a let's remix the Royal family as a Stanley Kubrick film. Far, you know, it was like as a fun riff. That's where I, I, when I got from it.
Lily:Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I wanted to think that. So I think my issue is, is that, I watched the first Twilight. I'm not across that world. I never read those books or anything. Um, I found it very, very strange movie, very awkward. it felt totally strange and I I found Kristen Stewart's Awkward Presence very difficult to watch. And I feel like that has helped me. Carried on in every film I've seen her in, not that I've seen her in, uh, in that many movies. Um, but probably more than I even can remember at this point, but I just, I always found her a bit awkward to watch. And it seemed to me she was always playing that she can only play herself. And I don't believe that that is a, Bad thing. I think that's how it is for many actors. You know, very few actors are, Oscar Isaacs and can completely change. Love that guy.
James:it's like Christopher Walken, is it? You get Christopher Walken
Lily:Exactly. And that is an amazing, yeah. So I don't mind that at all in general, but I just didn't particularly enjoy that. but in this film, like it really, really clicked. Her character was Just, I thought really, I felt like she really did anchor the movie, and apparently Rose Glass had her in mind when she was writing the script. She always wanted Kristen Stewart to play this role in it, and you can tell because, yeah, like I was kind of saying before, there's this insanity to this movie. It keeps getting crazier and crazier, and it's very over the top, and I feel like Kristen Stewart's kind of subtle kind of confusion about what the hell is going on all the time. And also her comedic, the way she delivers some of those lines, you know, the whole thing with her trying not to smoke is like hilarious and genius and it just really, really works in that film. So it made me think, God, I need to really like re appraise her because I know a lot of people like, like I began watching that movie, um, Personal Shopper and there's another one, Cloud of Ills, Cloud of Ills, something, sorry guys, uh, this French movie and just in both I was like, this, these were chapters like her. Renaissance. Like, okay, now she's making the movie she wants to make. She's free of the Twilight world and, you know, she can do these kind of cool indie movies. And she's like, and I still was like, oh, I just don't get it. But now I'm like, maybe I was totally wrong. I need to get on board because she was really, really good in this.
James:Yeah, she was great. I, I, like I said, I was thinking I haven't seen her in much, but this is really good. Cause you're right. she navigates this thing of grounding it while also fitting into this heightened world, uh, which, which, yeah, I was watching it thinking that's great just to be able to pull that off.
Lily:Totally. And honestly, watching an interview with her about the movie, I've never seen her so animated and so passionate and funny about something. I feel like probably a lot of the time she's worked on movies that she doesn't really care about. She's not that proud of and it's like, let me, I just got to get through this press cycle and, and then I can, and then I can be done with it. But this one, she's clearly obsessed, proud of it. and it comes through in that performance for sure.
James:And Dave Franco in a small, but memorable role.
Lily:Such good casting in that movie. He, of all the actors I'm aware of, I hate him. I just think he, sorry, not personally, but he's very, very good at playing an absolute asshole.
James:Yeah.
Lily:And it was like, the minute I saw him I was like, oh my god, I hate this
James:Yeah, Same. And I, you know, don't want to give too much away, but I was expecting to have to have deal with this character for a lot longer than we end up doing. So, yeah.
Lily:Yes, yes, yes, I know. Such a relief, such a relief. and Ed Harris, I mean. Just so good at playing a scary freak, freaky guy.
James:I, I watched this film and I just thought, yeah, this is a good film. This is the kind of film that like you felt in the nineties, there was a lot of this kind of stuff, like a slightly more experimental American fare. I just hope it does well enough to kind of keep these kinds of things going.
Lily:Yeah, you know, of course, it's another A24 movie, no surprises there, a co production with Film 4, who also made St. Maud. In fact, guys, if you want to watch St. Maud, it's on, if you're in the UK, it's on Channel 4's, like, streaming
James:Ah, great. I might actually check that out
Lily:yeah, yeah, honestly, you're gonna, I think you will love it. but yeah, I was trying to find out what the budget was because I wanted to check if it was doing okay, but it's kind of weird because online it says three mil, but then I read an interview of Rose Glass where she talked about feeling quite overwhelmed at times by having a budget many times bigger than the St. More budget. And the St. More budget was 2. 5. So it
James:that does sound a bit odd. It looks like it probably cost a bit more than three
Lily:Right. It's expensive looking and there are some, like there are different sets, different locations.
James:Yeah, maybe not a lot more because obviously their most expensive film to date has been civil war at 50 Million or 54 or something. So it's not we're not there. Yeah,
Lily:mil.
James:I I just like 9 10. Yeah
Lily:Yeah. Okay. So that is because so far they've made 9. 3, but it's been out for a week when we're recording this. So I'm, I'm hoping,
James:Yeah,
Lily:I think the fact that it's got this like huge critical response ever. It's been, getting a lot of rave reviews. So hopefully.
James:Yeah, it just feels like, um, I, just to, sorry to bake us into being a bit topical, I've been, uh, just kind of looking around on the reviews for The Fall Guy, not a film I'm planning on going to see, but the kind of film that ordinarily does okay, and it's not doing particularly okay, you know, it's like, it's got, you know, it's a breezy comedy action adventure, it's Emily Blunt, it's Ryan Coogler, Gosling? Yeah, yeah. Um, and, you know, it's got all the ingredients for it. I just assumed, you know, it's not for me, but I'm sure it'll do okay. And it's not really doing okay, so. Who the fuck is wanting to see anything these days? What, what can we get people to go see? So, I'm hoping Love Lies Bleeding does okay. I hope it's got, um, gets a good word of mouth. It certainly seems like it's got a good word of mouth.
Lily:I mean, everyone I speak to, I'm telling to go see this movie. So I'm trying my hardest. Anyone listening, if you haven't seen it yet, go see it
James:Go see it. It's a good film.
Lily:We've got to spread the word. We've got to
James:And, and it's a good, and it's, to make it very clear, Lily, I think it's a good film to see at the cinema. And I saw it on a very big, very big screen. And the sound mix was great. Like, it was worth seeing at the cinema. You know, because you do get an extra experience. It looks good, sounds great.
Lily:Just be prepared for how visceral that is because there were many moments, my, one of my friends I went to sit with, there was literally a point where she went, no, no, no, in the cinema. And I had to be like, everyone around us was like laughing. It was amazing. Cause yeah, you will, you will, if you're an, it's all an expressive person, you're going to express yourself, but it's great. That's what it's all about. I think that just
James:Yeah.
Lily:tells you how great this movie is.
James:Yeah absolutely. Absolutely.
Lily:Alright, so shall we take a trip to the film pharmacy?
James:Absolutely. Yes, please.
Lily:Hi guys, I've got a friend who says she feels sad when she watches films, but tears never come. So what films would you recommend, sad or even happy ones, to make the tears flow?
James:I mean, this is, uh, this is something that I struggle with myself, actually. Is that, you know, I can feel upset watching films. Because, you know, as stoic as I am, I have a heart. It's not, it's not granite inside here that beats in my chest. but I can't, tears, I don't think I've ever had tears at a film. So, I'm not sure I can, I can offer much.
Lily:cried at a film?
James:I might have cried with laughter, maybe, uh, but as far as, like, the sads, I felt really upset, but I'm not sure I've quite squeezed a tear out.
Lily:Okay, well I love this because yet again we're fitting well into our gender norms because our gender roles I guess I should say, both things, because I, I mean I once cried watching Knocked Up.
James:okay, right,
Lily:And not from laughter, it's not that funny a film.
James:ha,
Lily:was really touched by what they were going through with this pregnancy. I just, if you hit me at the right time of the month, I'm gonna cry. I mean, I'm intrigued with this question as to whether His friend said to him, what's wrong with me? I, I, I should cry. Like, why don't I ever cry? Or if he was like, what's wrong with you? I want you to cry. Because maybe she's happy not crying. Like, I think it's fine. It doesn't, doesn't really mean anything. It's kind of random and arbitrary.
James:I'm, I'm okay with not crying, you know, I'm, I'm kind of okay with it, I don't need to, but, uh, I do wo I do often wonder what would it be that tips me over the edge, you know.
Lily:Okay, so we've got a, we need to do in. I don't know if you ever really watch Friends, but there was, there was a storyline with how Chandler doesn't cry. and they were, I think they gave him a kind of a diet of very emotional movies to try and get him like, I remember Bambi was one of the ones, which I don't think I actually cried out, even though it was very upsetting as a kid, but, um,
James:I remember I didn't even cry at E. T. dying when I went to see it at the cinema in 1982. And the cinema, I remember it was just wailing. Wails all around the cinema. But I'd read, uh, Wait! Dad! Yeah, all those other five year old children. Poof, you won't catch me doing that. Wimps. So, yeah, so, so, because I'd read the picture book the day before and I knew that he comes back to life. So there was no tears for me.
Lily:from a young age! Devastating. I actually remember I'd never seen my dad cry until I think I was about 15. And we watched, as a family, that movie, the lives of others. Do you remember that German movie? Fantastic movie. And at the very end, he cried kind of out of happiness. Like he was moved by the final thing that happens. And I don't really want to, it's basically, it's a man just smiling. Like, it's, it's touching, but I was, it was really sweet. I've never, I was just, I was, it was, it always stayed with me as a very, very sweet thing. But that was the thing that finally, yeah, got him going. The last film I really, really cried at was obviously Past Lives. That moved me so, so much and I cried a lot. So, that would be my recommendation, but it does really depend on what gets to you. if Lost Loves and the passing of time and the complexity of relationships moves you, then that would be my recommendation. But I understand that that is not for everyone. So I, I
James:you have a more general, do you have, what about a hardy perennial? Because Past Lives is a very recent film. Do you have like, is the one that you'd have to pinpoint like just a classic?
Lily:I don't,
James:the old, get the tears going.
Lily:I don't know. Cause I feel like any of those classics, they'll probably have tried, you know,
James:Oh, I see. Yeah, yeah.
Lily:do you know what I mean? But I mean, I don't, what? Oh, here's one. Steel Magnolias. Ha ha
James:again, I don't know nothing about Steve. But still my nose apart from it's a quote unquote weepy.
Lily:Yeah, it's a weepy. You could give that one a go. Um, if you want to try a classic, but it does feel, when it's so on the nose, you know, the sadness and devastation. Oh, watched Stepmom recently, another fine Ed Harris movie, and that, that got me going as well, actually. That's quite sad. So here, these are all quite femme. moving films. I don't know.
James:well, I mean, me being a stoic man with no, I I'm just, you know, I, like say films make me sad and I feel really sad and upset and they stay with me. But like to get those tears out, just, it's a bridge too far at the moment.
Lily:I want to see you cry, James. I want to see that emotion. Okay.
James:I mean, I tell you, if you, if you want, if you want to see me cry, buy me tickets and say, we're going to see interstellar at the BFI. We get there and it's a laser projection that then you might see tears.
Lily:Okay, great. Perfect. Perfect. Cool. I think that's a great note to end on. Thank you so much guys for listening to another episode of Groovy Movies.
James:Thank you very much. And if you could leave us a five star review, it all helps get us out to a larger audience. Thank you very much.
Lily:So we'll see you in two weeks time. Bye!
James:Bye.