Jennie's Story; Finding Strength, Joy, and Hope in Faith Through Life's Toughest Trials

When life throws its hardest punches, where do we find our strength? Jennie Moss joins us to share her touching journey through the valleys of mental illness and the soul-testing trial of a cancer diagnosis during her mission. Her narrative doesn't shy away from vulnerability; it embraces it, illustrating the profound ways in which faith and community support can light our darkest paths. Jennie's resilience in the face of losing her child is a beacon for anyone struggling to find joy in pain, reminding us that even in the depths of sorrow, there is hope to be had and growth to be gained.

Every family has its storms, and every storm has its eye where calm can be found. This episode is a testament to that truth, as we reflect on how, through our own experiences and by turning to Jesus Christ, we can encounter peace amidst tumult. We discuss the importance of cherishing the light of good times as a bulwark against the dark. Our dialogue opens a window into the influence of scriptures in finding solace, with personal stories highlighting the sustaining power of faith and the titles of the Savior during times of loss.

Finally, we wrap up with a reflection on the bigger picture that faith paints for us, underscoring the beauty in embracing the journey back to God's embrace. Through the lens of Jeremiah 29:11, we uncover the reassurance of divine plans and the significance of choice in seeking out light and hope. Jennie's testimony intertwines with our own, as we all affirm that, regardless of the trials we face, there are eternal truths and joyful reunions that await us. Join us as we traverse the landscape of life's challenges, discovering the stepping stones of hope and joy laid out before us.

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Follow Jennie on Instagram @thelatterdayladies 
or see her website, www.latterdayladies.com

The Inspiration by Keys of Moon | https://soundcloud.com/keysofmoon
Attribution 4.0 International (CC BY 4.0)
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Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:23

Hey everybody, welcome back to the Remember podcast. I'm your host, dalyne Butler, and this is a special episode. It's our first episode of the year. We're kind of getting a late start. It's been a little bit difficult to get our structures or our structures or schedules to line up, but we're finally here and we I'm here with Mikaela.

Speaker 2: 0:44

Hi. So we today we have Jenny Maas. We're so excited to have her on the podcast. She seems like a very inspirational woman. She runs her podcast. She has her own podcast and Instagram page, the Latter Day Ladies. Go check her out. She has such an amazing story that we can't wait to hear, and she also has an amazing testimony as well, and I hope that as we listen to her story, that we can all be touched and and learn something from today's discussion.

Speaker 3: 1:14

So, jenny, if you want to share your story, Okay, so I was thinking about my journey, coming to know who Jesus Christ was, and I feel like it all started when I was in college and I was studying music at BYU Idaho, and I had a testimony of the gospel, but it was very, very, very little, very just just a little seed. And as I came to experience some different trials, I started understanding that I had struggles with mental illness and I would read the scriptures and I would seek for people who also were struggling, maybe struggling and asking questions of themselves and of their own capabilities, and I came to find that so many people in the book of Mormon also struggled, questioning themselves. It came up in just story after story and my testimony started to grow because I could see myself in these wonderful, hardworking people who were trying to follow Christ and often fell short. But then I noticed a pattern with every single person who continually chose to come back to the Savior. They were able to find out who they truly were, and so I decided that that's how I kind of wanted to structure my life and there were so many ways in my college experiences, places where I fell short. But I found myself finding this like everybody has this genius in them and I found myself discovering that in myself as I was willing to come back to the Savior and invite him into my daily experiences. So whether that was in class a class that I was maybe struggling with and asking the Savior as I was walking to class, just saying a prayer and asking him to come with me and to help me understand what I was being taught, or I had a lot of anxiety as I was performing quite a bit in my major, I would pray all day long that the Savior would help me remember the things that I had practiced and help me find joy in what I was doing. And I found this thing that made me so anxious, which was doing music, became this thing the source of just pure joy and I was so grateful that the Savior could help me find that joy in that experience and it really laid the groundwork for so much of my life.

Speaker 3: 4:09

I had no idea when I was a college student that I was going to experience some really difficult things after I left which were like I started off after my mission. I had a lot of struggles because I had had cancer at the end of my mission and I remember being it was like my second to last transfer as a missionary, and my companion was so scared and everybody around me had all this fear and I asked the Lord where can I find joy in this experience? And I literally felt like Jesus Christ helped, starting to point out places that I could find joy Like. I found joy in just being in the hospital and talking to the nurses and just making small connections with people who I knew that the Savior loved. And by being able to connect with them and talk with them in a way that I probably wouldn't have been able to any other way, having so many one-on-one reactions with the same people, I was able to see joy in this experience of being so sick. And I found joy in these other missionaries who were able to take care of me for a couple of days, sisters that I would have never served with because they were speaking a different language. I found joy in my connection with them and it was almost like with each hard thing, the Savior showed me that with every piece of opposition that I would find, there would be an equal to joy, and so that was kind of the pattern in which I came to know the Savior. But I will say that this has. It's been a wonderful pattern. It's been a wonderful pattern, but it's also been an increasingly difficult experience because as you go throughout your life, there are more and more ways to expand and grow right. So there are more ways to experience joy, but there are also more ways to experience pain and discomfort and despair and all of the difficulties.

Speaker 3: 6:09

And I felt like I was in a pretty good place last fall. I was pregnant with my fifth baby and I was in just such a good spot even though I was so sick with this pregnancy and throwing up and just like extremely ill, while still trying to take care of my other four kids I felt so much joy as I was pregnant and it was unlike my other pregnancies. I felt like I was just really like living life to the fullest. And then one day, one day, I had this feeling like something was wrong and so I called my doctor and they told me to go into the emergency room and I was like you guys are being dramatic, but I went to the emergency room and I found out that my baby had died and I remember just sitting in this room and I was. It was like I was watching myself and my husband in this experience. It was almost like an out of body experience where I could see us both just falling and just so heartbroken. And I remember thinking where is the joy? And that was one of the very first times where it took a lot of digging to find and it was something that it was not immediate and it was not easy to find. But again the savior showed up and helped me find it.

Speaker 3: 7:34

So the next day I had to go in and, just like when you'd go in to have a baby, normally I had to go in and be induced and then have this baby, because she was a size that you had to go into the hospital and have a baby. And it was a pretty dismal experience. I came in and then everybody who came into the room was so somber and I realized that this was a very, very special experience for me. To actually testify of the things that I knew in my soul but maybe in that moment was truly testing if I knew it. And so one of the nurses came in and she was talking to me and she was saying how heartbreaking the situation was. And I said to her it is heartbreaking and my heart just feels like it's in pieces on the floor, but I know that it's going to be okay because I'm going to see my daughter again. And she looked at me with tears in her eyes and she was like I'm so happy that you know that. And she held my hand and we just held it tight for a minute and she walked out and I felt the savior kind of tap me on the shoulder and say you're finding the joy in it.

Speaker 3: 8:52

And we had so many experiences like that in the hospital and then afterwards, because you come home, you don't have the baby anymore and it's just the most bizarre experience because you've gone through all of this pain and all of this difficulty but you don't get to keep the sweet baby that you had. And I remember feeling so lost in this and I felt a prompting from the Lord, who share my sorrow, and I was like I don't want to share my sorrow. This is so sad. It's such an awful situation. I don't want to tell other people about this, like they probably have enough on their plate. But I kept getting this prompting over and over. You need to share this experience with other people.

Speaker 3: 9:42

And so I sat down and I started writing and writing how I felt and writing about you know just the heartbreak of coming home and not being able to bring our baby girl with us, and so the fact that I knew one day I would be able to see her again. And although I felt like it was not a hopeful message, I felt like it was very raw. I put it out onto Instagram and it was like wildfire. And I'm getting all of these messages from people, people who I hadn't connected with since, like high school or junior high, saying, oh my goodness, I had a miscarriage, like you spoke exactly to how I felt, but I never told anybody.

Speaker 3: 10:28

Or just all of these, all these women's experiences, people who have faith in Christ, people who may share different faiths. And we were able to come together because I was willing to share the pain of that experience, and we were able to mourn together, and one of the pieces of our covenants that we make at baptism is being willing to mourn with those that mourn. And I think before this experience I didn't quite know how exactly to do that, because I always wanted to go into situations and find some sort of solution to help heal their sorrow. But the Savior taught me a really good lesson during this and he basically said to me nobody else can heal this for you. You can't even heal this for you. I'm the only person who can bring you this piece, but right now you need to let these sisters and brothers mourn with you, because that is the first piece of healing. And so I just opened my arms and, for really the very first time in my life, allowed people to just come in and love me in this, and it was one of the most incredible things that I've ever experienced, because it was as if we were covered in this blanket of light, and my husband actually had to leave the day after we came home from the hospital to go to work in California for a week, so I was home by myself and the kids went to school and I just had my little boy with me.

Speaker 3: 12:03

And it was the most interesting experience because all of these people from different parts of our life were able to come and minister to us, whether it was virtually or in person. People sent flowers and food and letters, and I felt the Savior's power in a completely different way than I'd ever felt it before. I felt it through other people. I saw Jesus Christ through all of these hands that were reaching out to lift us up, and it was one of the most powerful things that I'd ever seen, because I felt this connection with my community and people who maybe I hadn't been friends with before started to reach out and check in on us and ask us how we were doing.

Speaker 3: 12:52

And one of the most powerful things I think that's happened from this whole experience is not only being able to share this understanding that I know that my daughter is not gone.

Speaker 3: 13:04

She's just in a different place.

Speaker 3: 13:06

She's hanging out with the Savior, he's taking really good care of her, and I know that and I can share that, but also I know that here and now I can receive bits and pieces of healing every single day through my connection with Christ, but also through the connections that other people have with their Savior, and I don't think I've ever been more grateful in my life for people who are close to the Spirit.

Speaker 3: 13:36

I've had friends who are just absolutely knowing exactly the time to come in and to fill a need. I've had times where I've thought in my head oh, my goodness, I don't think I can breathe for another minute, and then someone comes and rings the doorbell, drops us off cookies, and I think that before my connection with Jesus Christ was very individual, very we and wonderful, but in this experience it expanded my understanding of what the Savior was capable of and how he could literally bring the arms of our community around us and connect us all through Christ, and that is a testimony that I had not yet received and now is just. It's just opened my eyes to ways that I now want to show up for other people and ways where I want to see people in their hurt and in their suffering and I want to be able to mourn with them and comfort them and be the arms of the Savior for them, because it has just been honestly, a piece of the celestial kingdom. It really truly has been. So that's been my experience with the Savior recently.

Speaker 2: 14:58

Oh my gosh, I kind of unmute. That's okay, that was awesome. I've had so many like recently. I've been focusing on what peace looks like and you touched on that and feeling joy as well. In the circumstances I deal with a lot of stress, and so I'm trying this year to find more peace in my life and trusting in the Lord more, and I decided last year was the come fall and be like New Testament, focusing on that.

Speaker 2: 15:35

But I didn't really do so well, like studying and stuff, and so this year I'm like, well, you know what I am going to, along with studying the Book of Mormon, this year I also want to learn who Jesus Christ is, because in the Bible it talks a lot about who he really really is in his life. And I want to gain that personal relationship with God, with Jesus Christ and Heavenly Father, because I know that through them I can feel peace, especially in my circumstances. And in order to gain trust with someone, you need to, you know, put effort in that relationship as well. And so I'm trying to do that and learn how I can trust the Savior and put my worries on him, because you hear that saying like you know, cast your fears on the Savior and he'll take care of it. But I've never really understood that, like, how, like, how do you do that? And so I realized the first step is learning how to trust him and learning who he really is. So, yes, I love that you were able to find peace and his hand in your life through other people and in a different way. I think that's so wonderful. I've experienced that too multiple times in many different situations, when high school I went through a lot of health struggles and was so like no one knew what was going on and the amount of friends and family that reached out to me and it still continues today like, okay, what is going on? Because I still have episodes and stuff.

Speaker 2: 17:14

But knowing that the Savior is aware and through these people is what brings me peace, is because, at least in what I've known, is that the angels that we, that the Savior talks about, is like there's some in heaven but there also are some on earth and those are the people that we see and they will hold you by the hand through everything and they're the physical representation of God, like we're supposed to be his hands right, and so by doing that is gaining those attributes of God and sharing that with others. And I am recently in Matthew it's at the beginning of the New Testament and I love Matthew five and six like so much Matthew three, four, five and six because they are just like that big sermon that Jesus Christ first gives to everybody and he touches on so many wonderful things. And one of the things I want to kind of dive into Matthew five for a little bit and just like pick some verses that I really think that touches on your, your situation and how we can be more Christ like and being his hands and other people's lives who are struggling. And verse four says bless are they that mourn, for they shall be comforted.

Speaker 2: 18:47

Blessed are the meek, for they shall inherit earth. Blessed are they who do hunger and thirst for righteousness, for they shall be filled. Blessed are the merciful, for they shall obtain mercy. Blessed are the pure in heart, for they shall see God. Blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called the children of God.

Speaker 2: 19:04

Blessed are they which are persecuted for righteousness sake. And there's the kingdom of heaven. And it just goes through all the Beatitudes and then when you scroll down to verse 14, it says you are the light of the world, a city that is set on the hill cannot be hid. Neither do men light a candle and put it under a bushel, but on a candle stick and give it light unto all those, unto all that are in the house. Let your light so shine before men that they may see your good works and glorify your father in heaven, and I think that's beautiful, because the Beatitudes are the things that Christ shows, and we need to gain those attributes, whether it's mourning with people who mourn, comforting people, being a peacemaker, being merciful, as Christ is merciful and forgiving, and also when you have a testimony, when you're going through sorrows, like you said, jenny, it is hard sometimes to share that with other people, and what I found through this podcast is people sharing that.

Speaker 2: 20:07

The hard things and being vulnerable was really, really hard, but through sharing, god can work wonders. Through sharing, like you experienced and I actually saw that post on my feed just randomly. I didn't know it was you and I was touched by it. I haven't experienced it, but I know many people who have experienced similar things and to know that you have been that has helped your healing process and God has been able to work through you by sharing your testimony and sharing your sorrow that he has been able to help in ways that you didn't even know. And, like it said that, sharing the light, sharing that light, like, why would you share, not share God's light? You know, like if you're going through struggles, if you have a testimony and you know sometimes even if you don't have a testimony of it yet sharing and being vulnerable.

Speaker 2: 21:05

Sometimes, on most cases, people can share their testimony and you can learn from them, and so why hide it under the bushel? Why be afraid and keep it to yourself? God knows your thoughts, god knows everything that's going on. But, like I said, in order to gain trust, in order to see those blessings, sometimes it requires effort and sometimes that means being vulnerable and to allow others to heal you and allow others to share and practice the beatitudes as well, like it's a whole circle. But I know if you do all these things, you will find peace and joy and, like you said, there's many different ways.

Speaker 2: 21:46

You can feel that, as well as pain and suffering. But it's how we can become closer to Heavenly Father by putting those things into action and really, really putting our desires and efforts that, like you said, it will come back and God will truly show you who you are if you continually try and seek Him. So that was my big thing. But I just got all these. I love it that you're sharing. I was like this is so awesome because this is exactly what I'm trying to learn this year. So, thank you, I love that.

Speaker 3: 22:21

I think it's powerful to recognize that when we put, If we share our light, sometimes we think that it has to be this perfect story. We think that for a lot of years I felt a lot of pressure that my children needed to be really, really behaved at church. We need to not be a distraction, we need to be All the kids need to be quiet, we need to be put together. But I cannot tell you how grateful I am for the moms who have come up to me and they're like your kids did so good today and they're wiggly and squirrely. And I realized that there is no story anywhere in the scriptures that includes a family that doesn't have different things happening in their lives, different dynamics, and we're learning that right now in the Book of Mormon, as we're reading, Like in Nephi's family there's so many different dynamics going and Soraya and Lehi they have to talk things through, and Laman and Lemuel they're having a lot of agitation and Nephi's probably agitated because they are. And I realized that Christ, it doesn't really matter what our situation looks like. He has the ability to come in and to help and that picture is going to look different for every single family. That picture is going to look different for me than it will for you, but that doesn't mean that each of us aren't coming to Christ in the way that we need to. And you talked about getting to know the Savior more and one of the best ways that I think I've ever been able to really identify where Christ is, because he's already a part of all of our lives. But one of the ways that we can come to see that is by studying his titles. The Prophet, a couple of years ago, encouraged us to study his titles because he had done the same and he said he was a changed man after he studied those titles. And I was like whoa the Prophet's a changed man. I need to do that. So I like became obsessed and went through and studied all of his titles and then after, while I was pregnant, after the baby actually had passed and we didn't know yet, we were not yet aware I had this inspiration one night that I needed to write 12 titles of the Savior and I needed to write a little study and scriptures associated and get paintings of Christ. That I did and put them on the front and make a little advent. And I did it in like two days. Like I got it done so fast, got it to print like it was ready and shipped.

Speaker 3: 24:58

The day that I lost that I went in and found out I lost my baby and this project was on the counter when I came home from the hospital and so I went through and I read these studies and I'm looking at these titles of the Savior that I had written and it was so amazing because I got to see Christ, who's the creator, and I was like he's going to create something beautiful out of this. Christ as the bread of life. Every day I'm going to need to come back for sustenance, especially through the situation. Christ as my Redeemer. He's going to redeem all of the injustice from this situation.

Speaker 3: 25:42

And it was one of the most amazing things ever because these titles I could see and really truly look how to identify where Christ was coming in my life every day after that and so when we can identify those pieces of truth, it can help us see. Oh yeah, he's all over the place in our story. His fingerprints are everywhere in my day. You know it's so powerful and amazing. So I love that you touched on that and thank you for sharing that.

Speaker 1: 26:16

I uh, it's gonna seem like I'm going off track a little bit, but I'll bring it back. I swear we love it. I hate the phrase oh, like you don't know anybody until you walk a mile and there she is. I hate it. I hate that phrase Because, even if you walk a mile, you have no idea like anything about that person. Like you went one mile. Like what about the rest of the however many years that they've been alive?

Speaker 1: 26:49

Because we're all, each and every one of us we are a product of these little, like tiny, decisions that we've made from the moment we were born to now and like like decisions that you wouldn't even think about, like that have shaped us. Like what do I eat for breakfast that morning? Like those little decisions shape us so much. And one of the reasons why I love doing this podcast is because I don't get to walk every step with you, but you let us take a couple steps with you and your story is truly, truly amazing and thank you so much for coming on and sharing it with us. But I also want to testify that our Savior walked every step with us and even when we can't walk ourselves, he carries us. It's like that poem of the man with Jesus walking on the beach, and I know we've shared that a couple of times, I think, on this podcast. But when the man sees one set of footprints in the sand, he gets mad, only to find out that that was when Jesus carried him. And so I know that Jesus is carrying you and me and Mikaela often.

Speaker 1: 28:10

And I love what you were talking about, about how you found joy in everything, and I think that's a. I wish I had that skill, especially like the last eight months. The last eight months have been very, very difficult for me, and I found the scripture, john 14, 27, and it just popped into my head as you were talking about how much you found joy in everything. And this is the Savior talking, and it says peace. I leave with you. My peace I give unto you, not as the world giveth, give I unto you. Let not your heart be troubled, neither let it be afraid.

Speaker 1: 29:00

And so I've lost my father. That's the closest thing I have to relating to your experience. He passed away when I was 14. So I was pretty young and the amount of impact that that had on my life is just astronomical, but also the impact that I've received or that it had from other people around me was just truly amazing, like people that I didn't even know very much, like it's always happens. They just like come and they come bearing gifts, and like we had so much food. Oh, my goodness, so it was good food too. Casseroles I love casseroles. That's the one like Utah culture, like we did with.

Speaker 1: 29:53

I love a good casserole and they're great comfort food stew, but I digress. That experience of losing my dad is the closest thing that I have to relating to you, and I remember sitting there the night I found out oh my goodness, I'm going to start crying the night we found out that he was gone because he passed away in a trucking accident. So it was very sudden, we had no idea. And he left that day or a couple of days before and I just, like you know, I said goodbye, like hey, well, I asked him if he could leave his laptop so I could play video games while he was gone, and then he was gone.

Speaker 1: 30:47

And I remember sitting on the grass in my backyard just looking up at the stars and just like just knowing it was going to be okay. And then, a couple months later, my mom Well, what happened was All the older siblings and my grandparents and my aunts and uncles. They decided they wanted to go and visit the crash site and pick up a few things that was scattered around to see if they could find anything, and like, look at the truck and look into all of that. And I remember my mom saying I was too young to go and that I like she wouldn't let me go. And that broke my heart because I wanted, I wanted to see that. And I remember running to my room and I just bawling harder than I cried up to that point in my entire life, and just bawling my eyes out on my bed, snots everywhere, like it was not a pretty scene as it as it never is, and I just I was absolutely devastated. And then it was like somebody flipped a switch and I stopped crying and I just sat up and I just like I knew my heavenly father was with me and I knew that my dad was with me and I really don't think about that experience enough. I kind of forgot about it, but it was such a profound experience for me.

Speaker 1: 32:33

And that little experience when I was 14 years old, why? I guess not really little, but that experience has allowed me to carry so much light throughout my years. And I want to talk a little bit about how I've tried to share that light and and how we can all share that light, because I love what you said, jenny, about how we can all share that light. You don't have to be perfect to share. You don't have to be the this perfect image of what a good Christian is or what a good Christian family is, and in fact it's our imperfections that show the most of our heavenly father and his son, jesus Christ. And I think a lot of that has to do with, well, I'm doing what I can despite my imperfections, and the only way I can do that is through my Savior, jesus Christ. So it just like boom points straight to him. And how wonderful is that. And it's so amazing to be able to.

Speaker 1: 33:52

It really is. It's so amazing to be able to get pieces of that on this podcast and and to feel that light, even if, like, we're meeting over soon and I don't cry very often. Well, actually I've become more emotional over the years. I don't know how that happens, but I like to think I don't cry very often as I'm wiping away tears, you know, but it doesn't. I don't cry very often.

Speaker 1: 34:19

I feelVIP deeply melting in my heart as I'm trying my j reptile, because it melts your heart and I tell all my friends in the book it will be alright, Some way of 這個なかちょっと化せて this opportunity to hear and share our light with one another. It brings the spirit of God in such an intensity that it's hard to find anywhere else, and I'm so grateful to be a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and to have the knowledge that we have. Like you said, you know you will see your daughter again and I know I will see my father again, and such an amazing knowledge that is, I don't have to be afraid and I can find joy. Now, knowing those things, I kind of like to go on rants, so there's my rant.

Speaker 3: 35:14

I love that. I love rants. I rant all the time. You reminded me of my children's experience because it was really hard for them. They really struggled and they're still struggling.

Speaker 3: 35:31

But the week after my daughter passed, my husband was still in California for work and he was able to go to the temple that day by himself and we were able to swing it so that we could go to the temple. Our temple is about an hour and a half away. I mean, going with four kids by myself is a marathon. But a friend suggested as I was driving up. She had suggested to me that we should go to the temple because I told them we were going to go to the trip park and so I was like we'll go to the temple first.

Speaker 3: 36:07

And we walked around the temple grounds and my kids, who had been so upset all week, just crying angry, everything under the sun. My daughter was like mom, I feel the spirit, feel the fruits of the spirit, and my boys even my little two year old, they were all just so happy. So we went and we sat in the waiting room and my kids are all just the most lovely humans. They are energy too, they're 100% energy, just like their mom. And when we got into the waiting room, all that energy became complete peace and even my two year old came and sat in silence and my older two sat down. One of them grabbed the scriptures and my daughter just sat in bouter head and we all felt the power of the covenant that I had made with my husband 13 years prior and knew that we were together with her forever. That was never a question. We had been bound through priesthood power in a covenant we had made and they all felt it. Each one of them was like mom, I never want to leave here, I love it here in the temple, and it felt so powerful and all of that pain that they had experienced. They also received compensation in light and in peace. And even now, when they're struggling and they have nightmares and they come and crawl my bed at two o'clock in the morning, I'm like, remember how we felt when we were sitting in the temple. Oh, yeah, we're going to be with baby Maggie again. We're sealed. We're sealed with baby Maggie. I'm like, yeah, remember.

Speaker 3: 38:14

So I think that when we look back, especially when we've been through something so stark and difficult like losing a parent, you can see those moments of compensation in light, and sometimes they're more subtle than others, but the Lord has encouraged me during this experience to write everything down and so, on the difficult days, I can refer back to that, and I think that that's part of the talk that you talked about in the beginning by Henry B Eyring, where it's all about remembrance, and he talked about when he came home from work and he felt like he needed to write down where he saw God in his day and he wrote it in his journal and he felt like he needed to do that every day. I felt the exact same prompting and that talk came to my mind. I was like, okay, I've got to do the same thing and I've found that, as I've written where I've found God in my day, I found him more and more, and I don't think it's because he's showing up more. I think it's because I'm looking for it, and for a long time.

Speaker 3: 39:27

I can be honest, I was struggling with depression. It was really hard to see. So I want you to know that, even if you're in a hard time right now, there is so much hope for the future. Even if getting through a day feels really tough, I promise you I have also been there and it gets better. Keep walking with the Savior. He's going to help you, he's going to lead you to that light and there might be a couple dark days or years, but you just keep walking, don't stop.

Speaker 2: 40:04

Thank you, that's awesome. I have so many scriptures that are just like. I just write them down. When I come across one, I have like a whole list in my notes and it's just like words that I need to hear or whatever. It's just like stuff that like I need us to unpick me up from God. And one that I think is so beautiful that fits perfectly in what you're talking about. It's Jeremiah 29, verse 11. Okay, and it says for I know the plans I have for you, declares the Lord plans for welfare and not for evil, to give you a future and a hope.

Speaker 2: 40:49

But I think that fits perfectly in what we've been talking about how God has a plan and part of that plan is in our lives. Everyone's plans are so different but at the same time, they're all the same. In regards of that, he wants us all to return back to him, but everyone's life is different. Everyone's stories are different. I mean they can be similar in some ways, but that one big similarity is that he wants us back and he's provided us a way to return back to him. He provided the gospel, churches, people in our lives, covenants, the gospel, everything. And it's up to us if we want to take a hold of that. Right, we have the agency, the whole Adam and Eve thing. Like they were in the you know a perfect place, but they chose to eat the food. They had that agency and now we have so much. We have pain, joy, hope, suffering, temptation, everything, but because of that, god gave us these resources to return back to him, and one of those is the covenants made in the temple and being coming united as families forever. And that's such an important thing to fall back on, especially when we lose someone that we love. And it's significant because you know God has a plan for us and because of that we can reflect on oh okay, I know that I'm going to see this family member again and because of that I have hope. I have hope and I can trust in that throughout all of this, I know that if I try my best, I will be able to receive those blessings and go back to God. And it's like a like trial for faith, trial to trial, but there is hope and that God has a plan. And, to be honest, we shouldn't leave Like, we shouldn't turn away and be angry, and you know, and that's so easy to do sometimes and it's okay to, you know, feel those feelings, but we shouldn't have it overtake us and get us away from God, because he knows us and he knows it all. He knows everything we're supposed to go through, but he's provided us a way to feel that peace and hope again and to return back to Him and with our families, and so I think that scripture is so beautiful and this whole conversation.

Speaker 2: 43:27

I just love sitting and listening to you guys too. It's been awesome to hear your guys' testimonies and what you've experienced and it's given me like a sense of hope and, you know, growing my little testimony of that. You know I've made heaven as I'm married and you know, knowing that I can be with my husband if we choose to, you know, stick on the path, and knowing that if we both work together, that our future family can be together, and how like, how amazing that will be to have that, and so, anyways, thank you guys so much for sharing that hope that I know someone I know there's so many people that may be struggling with this and maybe be even struggling to find hope and trusting God. Like you know, I am in that moment and this has helped me. So thank you.

Speaker 3: 44:21

I'm so bad. I didn't recognize as a younger when I was like 18. I remember thinking hope was really hard to understand. It didn't make sense to me until I really truly did something, took a step to show my trust. I had to take an action to step forward and choose Jesus Christ, not just out of convenience, but actively choose Him.

Speaker 3: 44:58

And I found that, no matter what the opposition is because, as the Prophet said, we should expect miracles but also we need to expect the opposition will come with that. But understanding that just because there's opposition doesn't mean that you're moving in the wrong direction, that actually is the indication that life is an uphill battle, as President Eyring says. But understanding that those steps forward, they are not just blessing right now, but they are blessing you eternally and you are doing so much better than you think you are. That's something that Elder Holland said a long time ago, that I repeat myself all the time, because it's true. Heavenly Father put us in these places because he loves us and he's proud of us and he knows what we're capable of.

Speaker 1: 45:50

Absolutely. I think everybody needs to learn a little bit more about agency and about how much power they, like we, actually possess in our ability to choose right from wrong, good from evil, because that's literally the power of God Give it to us. Our Heavenly Father wants us to be like Him, and so that's why we go through these experiences. It's not so much as to learn to rely on Him, but learn to be like Him, learn to choose as he would choose to make decisions like he would make decisions, so that we can be God's one day ourselves. And I think it would be so easy for you and for me and for Makayla to win bad things like the things we've talked about today. When they happen.

Speaker 1: 46:52

It'd be so easy to lock ourselves in our bedrooms and be miserable and hate the world and hate others and just become like a black hole. And try to think of the opposite of a beacon of light, this hole that just absorbs light and just crushes it and doesn't share. Don't be a black hole. Choose to be a beacon, choose to be a star, choose to share your light and choose to see the light. I think I love the quote from President Nelson. Joy has little to do with the circumstances of our lives and everything to do with the focus of our lives, and that focus is a decision, an exercise of agency. And it brings me back to one of our previous episodes with Makayla's friend who wrote the book Misunderstood. I forget her name, doesn't, but yeah, her name is Natalie.

Speaker 1: 48:06

Natalie, exactly, thank you. And I remember saying at the end of that episode Natalie was kind of mad at me, I think, but because we talked a lot about depression and I think she was saying that you don't choose to be depressed. But at the end I was like just choose to be happy and like I think that's where the contention came from. But really you do choose to be happy because you choose to do the things that bring happiness, and part of that is choosing to be close to your Heavenly Father and choosing to see the joy.

Speaker 3: 48:51

And also recognizing that depression may come in.

Speaker 3: 48:57

That may be the opposition, but like you said I mean I feel like I can say this because I've had depression for years there are specific things that I can choose as an agent unto myself to move myself in the direction of light I have found, and it's that you play with it as you experience life.

Speaker 3: 49:20

But I know, I know that if I am feeling depressed, if I get up, put my shoes on, get my athletic clothes on, take my dog for a walk, drink my water, I know that that's going to help me and I get that forward momentum.

Speaker 3: 49:36

And I feel like President Nelson said that in the talk you quoted Joy and Spiritual Survival that talk was huge and helpful, really, really helpful for me in a time where I made some really big life changes, and that it was a journey in understanding that. And it takes time to understand and see what the life hacks are for you to be able to find the joy in the journey, right. But I think you're exactly right that we are agents unto ourselves and we choose what we do with our bodies and we can choose to find that light and that might not happen in a day and it might not happen in a week, but we can continue in that journey to find it, because it exists and that's the hope, right? The hope is, it's there. Yeah, we have to choose to put it in the work.

Speaker 1: 50:29

I also ramped.

Speaker 3: 50:31

so yes, we have to choose. What in the work Exactly?

Speaker 1: 50:37

Well, I think we're getting a little bit long, but it has been absolutely amazing to have you on our podcast, jenny, so thank you so much for joining us. Thank you, thank you, you guys are amazing. Makayla, do you have any final thoughts before we close that?

Speaker 2: 50:55

Yeah, just choose to. Our lives can be crazy sometimes, we all know that. But choosing to do the little things every day can definitely help us get that forward momentum, like Jenny was saying. And doing those little things and seeking the light and the peace and hope that and we're seeing that Jesus Christ offers us can definitely help us overcome the struggles that we go through day to day or in certain moments of our lives and getting into that habit Like I'm trying to get into that habit, so I know that through that getting that habit, that we can definitely have that strength and confidence when those things get thrown at us, when affliction gets thrown at us.

Speaker 2: 51:49

That having that foundation and trust in the Lord that it will go smoother and as well, knowing and those circumstances like Jenny said, she wants to help those who are struggling as well and being a better hand of the Lord in other people's lives. I think we should all strive to do that because that can also help us in our struggles serving and helping others. Having that love of Jesus Christ in our lives can bring love into our own hearts and heal us as well. So let's just keep going and choosing joy and choosing to follow our Savior and being everyday missionaries.

Speaker 1: 52:35

Absolutely so. Thank you so much, jenny. Thank you Makayla. Thank you.

Speaker 1: 52:40

This has been an absolutely amazing episode, so I wouldn't have picked a better episode to start the year. So thank you so much, and thank you so much to our amazing listeners for sticking to us, even though we're not as consistent as we might would like to be, but we're a bunch of poor college students, so bear with us. If you haven't checked out our Instagram, it's at rememberpodcast, and feel free to check out any of our merchandise. You can find the link on our Instagram as well. And choose to change your focus, choose to trust, choose to remember Him.