13 Dogless and Dating (the Female Perspective) - Dogs & Dating Series Part Two

Part two of the Dogs & Dating series I get to talk with my sister Courtney, dog auntie extraordinaire. She is a single woman who does not own a dog and shares her stories, opinions and expectations when it comes to dating men with dogs. She has experience with my three dogs and how very different they were, and has been a huge part of their lives - she also understands so much about dog behaviour and reactivity because of it!

As dog owners there could be some things we can learn from a single & dogless person about what it's like from her perspective dating people with dogs. She doesn't speak for all women in her position (of course), but it is still interesting to hear about what she has gone through and what her thoughts are.

Stay tuned for further perspectives:

Dogless & Dating (the Male Perspective)
The Dog Mom Perspective
Breaking Up With Dogs
Successful Dogs & Dating Stories. 

Be sure to follow me on Instagram @spicydogmama and my girl Rey @mylittlepibble
You can also check out my blog spicydogmama.com

Transcript

Cassidy: 0:00

Hello and welcome back to the Spicy Dog Mama Podcast, a show all about the highs and lows of owning a dog, raising a puppy, rescuing dogs, dealing with reactivity, sharing our experiences, growing together, and creating a community. I am your host Cass. I am dog mom to Rey, a reactive, dog-selective bully mix who is my whole world. We've been on our journey together for three years, and before Rey I adopted Reese, a fear-aggressive bully mix, who taught me so much and I'm so thankful for everything that I've learned because of him, though I'm still no expert on dogs; I'm not a trainer. I am thankful for everything that he had taught me. Having been a single woman with a dog who was fearful of men made dating, which is complicated enough, a whole other kind of difficult. Last week, I had taken a step back from the series after only sharing part one and I shared details on that in last week's episode, which was just an unedited update on mine and Rey's life. And a reminder to take time for yourself, recognize when you may need a break, that on this journey with reactivity or simply just owning a dog, you still matter. Your mental health matters, please make sure you're taking care of yourself. But this week, we are back with part two of the dogs and dating series. Part one was the dog dad perspective, and this week is the other side of that relationship: dating dog dads. I got to chat with my sister Courtney (for a second time because of technical difficulties) about what it's like as a single non-dog-owner trying to date guys with dogs. Courtney has been an incredible Auntie to Reese, Riley and Rey. She herself has learned so much about dog behavior and training because of her exposure to my dogs. And she has so much patience and understanding when it comes to reactivity. She still has a few fun stories to tell and I think it's just interesting to hear the different ideas, expectations and opinions on dating with dogs and what we as dog owners may be able to take away from this. It's time for the dog-less and dating, female perspective. Hello. Why don't you introduce yourself?

Courtney: 2:00

My name is Courtney. I'm an amateur dog-knower-of-things, I'm a dog mama to none. I am however Reesey's and Rey's dog auntie.

Cassidy: 2:10

And a fantastic dog auntie.

Courtney: 2:12

I think so. Yea.

Cassidy: 2:13

Rey thinks so. Rey adores you, absolutely adores Lots of experience and exposure with dogs for sure. Again, I'm you. So you have some experience with dogs. Probably more than honestly a lot of people who have never owned a dog an amateur. considering the dogs that have been in your life. Yea, having There's so much to know. known Reese and Rey, and having not owned a dog yourself, aside

Courtney: 2:29

And every dog is so different. from as a child, you do have experience.

Cassidy: 2:44

Yeah, that's our dog knowledge. At this point in your life, would you yourself want to own a dog?

Courtney: 2:52

Right now? No, just where I am at in life. For starters, my building doesn't allow dogs. So that's like the biggest reason why. I would love to own a dog. But I'm so busy. I have two jobs. I have a full time job, part time job, and then I work one day a week at my gym. I just don't have time. I feel like it wouldn't be fair to a dog right now.

Cassidy: 3:17

There are huge commitment.

Courtney: 3:19

I'm just working so much. I like to be busy. I enjoy being busy. But right now it's work. So I just wouldn't have the time right now to own a dog in in a way that a person should?

Cassidy: 3:32

But you are a dog person. 100%. Are you on dating apps?

Courtney: 3:37

No, I gave up on those a little while ago. I do not enjoy dating apps anymore.

Cassidy: 3:43

When you were on the dating apps. If you saw a guy who had a dog, what would your first reaction be?

Courtney: 3:49

It first depends on what kind of dog it was, I love dogs, and I love meeting dogs. But usually if I saw that person on the dating app had a dog, I likely wouldn't have swiped right.

Cassidy: 4:02

You would generally swipe left if somebody had a dog.

Courtney: 4:06

It's complicated. Like because I know people's relationships with dogs. I know your relationship with Rey, she's very important to you, actually a huge part of your life. It's a priority. And I 100% respect that. But it's just not where I'm at in life. So if they have a dog, I feel like it would just complicate things for me right now. And yeah, I think I would just prefer to, you know, meet somebody and then talk about getting the dog together.

Cassidy: 4:33

Dating is hard enough and time consuming enough and your schedule, you understand that they have to put time into their dog.

Courtney: 4:40

And I do truly understand that, and I respect that but for me right now, it's just not it's not for me.

Cassidy: 4:46

So if you met somebody organically, because it does still happen. And you found that they had a dog. Is that enough of a deterrent?

Courtney: 4:56

You know, I have met people organically before who have a dog. That wasn't a deal breaker, I gave it a shot. It wasn't even the dog's fault that it never worked out.

Cassidy: 5:09

You're open to it, regardless of the dog, and you had mentioned that it depends on the breed. And I'm interested to know what your breed maybe, deal breakers are, we're not a page that discriminates against breeds but you are allowed to have an opinion.

Courtney: 5:25

I have an opinion. I know what I like. I know what I'm not exactly too fond of. One breed that comes to mind is a golden retriever just because of the energy levels and the fur! I'm a very, very clean, organized person. But anyway, that's just the first breed that comes to mind.

Cassidy: 5:44

You have a personal experience as well. You also know how much I cleaned with him. And we, you know, share the same DNA. We are very clean people.

Courtney: 5:54

And if I see the fur, if I see it, I have to get to it immediately. The thing though, is I love Golden Retrievers. I think they're beautiful. They're such a nice breed. They're lovely. I love most breeds. It's just they're not always all for me.

Cassidy: 6:08

Dating guys with dogs and dating guys without dogs. Obviously, there's differences. How big of a difference? Is it for you trying to date guys with or without dogs?

Courtney: 6:21

Huge. It's a huge difference. Yeah, unfortunately. And I don't know if it's because of the few guys that I have went out with who had dogs. Not all of them, but most of them their dog were... I couldn't tolerate them, and it's not like, I don't want to be with a guy and tolerate the dog. I want to actually enjoy the dog's presence. If I date a guy with a dog, that's that dog is likely going to be in my life for quite a few years.

Cassidy: 6:50

That's the thing, you're dating the guy, and the end goal is to be with them long term. So that dog will be with you long term. Do you have an experience?

Courtney: 7:00

I'll share the worst experience I've had with a dog. It's a little bulldog. He was adorable. But like not for me. The first time going over, barely even made it into the house. And this dog is on my leg, humping my leg. And he has such a hard grip on my leg that the next day, there were scratches down my leg. He bruised my leg. There were bruises. Worst part was, I mean, like obviously that's not enjoyable for me. But the worst part was the guy was just laughing. And like, okay, maybe you find that funny, but, I I'm coming over for the very first time.

Cassidy: 7:44

You don't necessarily feel comfortable to tell the dog to get off.

Courtney: 7:48

He did say "Oh, if you don't like it", why would I like that? He said "if you don't like it, just tell him to stop". Like with Rey, I know how to handle it because I'm comfortable with her, I'm comfortable with you.

Cassidy: 7:57

But for me, I'm makinh sure that my guests know coming in, it's okay for you to say something. But I'm going to say something.

Courtney: 8:04

The worst part is the guys laughing. Okay, I remember we were sitting there watching TV and we'd smell something and be like "What is that?" And he was like, "Oh, he probably just pooped". What? That's not the first time either that that's happened when I was there. I gave it a fair shot. I really tried. But it just, it wasn't even just the dog. It was, it did play a fair role in my decision, but it was also the guy just didn't work out.

Cassidy: 8:30

Aside from like a humping experience, has there been other scenarios where you were dating somebody with a dog? That was just another red flag or something that you just didn't enjoy it with the dog?

Courtney: 8:46

Yeah, I met this guy. And he had a husky and he was beautiful. He was also young, I would say probably, I don't even think he had him for a year. So obviously another very high energy dog, but, I had two Huskies growing up, we love huskies. The dog was a huge part of his life, which I appreciated, he took them on all the adventures, he took them off leash to hikes and stuff. So he got a lot of exercise. But again, my first time going over, we went out to the back deck and the dog comes and jumps up on the deck. It decided to jump up on me and grab a chunk of my hair. And it wasn't doing it as an aggressive, he was playful. But it was like Okay, so I'm trying not to like fall off the, deck spill my drink, trying to get this huge dog off of me, it's like the size of me. I've never had a dog grab a chunk of my hair before. Not a lovely moment.

Cassidy: 9:48

You don't have the time for a dog right now. You don't have a puppy for specific reasons. That dog is very much a puppy who needs training a lot and I'm sure he's a great dog and he's getting training. But that doesn't mean that you want to have a puppy with that energy in your life right now. And that's okay.

Courtney: 10:04

First time meeting it like with the other one humping my leg. I'm like, Get off.

Cassidy: 10:08

You don't yet have a relationship with the person, you have no relationship with the dog. So it interferes more than anything. Yeah, guys just seem more laid back, which is... it's really annoying. And I wish I were as laid back as a guy, but also at the same time. I don't know. I think I'm okay with expecting more, or wanting my guests to be comfortable with my animal.

Courtney: 10:30

Yes, that's fair. Like my standards and expectations. I feel like are getting higher and higher.

Cassidy: 10:36

Do you think though, since you have dated guys with dogs and seeing how they behave with their dogs? Do you think it's also kind of good to kind of get that insight to how they are with their dogs?

Courtney: 10:47

Oh, yeah, yes. Like, I find if a guy owns a dog, he knows how to prioritize that dog and also loves the dog. I think that's, I think that's huge. I think it just shows the guy's character. I think that's honestly very attractive.

Cassidy: 11:04

I'm very obsessed with Rey.

Courtney: 11:06

Of course, yes, we all know that.

Cassidy: 11:08

If you met a guy who is as obsessed with their dog as I am, but wait, their dog was also not a humper or hair eater. It's a lot to be as obsessed with a dog as I am like, she's my everything, I put her in PJs, she gets cold. Anyways, I can also see how that might be a turnoff as much as it might be caring, what are your thoughts there on how obsessed they are?

Courtney: 11:33

Okay, I don't want to offend anybody here. But, if I met a guy who had more sweaters for their dog than I do in my closet, like Rey Rey does, which I think is adorable. I don't know, I don't know how I feel about that. And I think Rey has the greatest life ever. I think she's very happy.

Cassidy: 11:55

I get my sweaters for like five to 10 bucks apiece.

Courtney: 11:57

I want to buy her more! I think she needs more. I'm not saying that's a bad thing.

Cassidy: 12:03

Yeah, but like a guy who loves his dog puts everything into his dog, wants to be with his dog cares about his dog.

Courtney: 12:08

Honestly, I love that. And that wouldn't be a deal breaker for me. It would just be how I felt about, obviously the guy, but also the dog. And first interactions for me isn't everything. But it is a lot. And like that'll stick with me and then I'll remember it for the next time. And something with me is if I meet somebody, and it's not the greatest right off the bat, the next time we try and go to make plans. I'm like, you know not overly excited about it.

Cassidy: 12:37

Well also speaking as a dog owner, you meet a guy and then say, you go on a date, you meet the dog, it is the Husky or Bulldog experience. They send you a text, "you want to come for a walk with me and the dog?" or "want to come over for a drink" and you know the dog ss gonna be there... you're gonna be hesitant and you'd rather say"can we do something without the dog?" And you don't want to say that? That puts you in a really tough position, if you don't want to be with the dog,

Courtney: 13:03

I did meet a guy who had a dog and I think I met the dog the first day I met him. But I do remember, we did go for a walk and the dog was gonna be there and that was okay with me because I did like the dog. It definitely is like the first interactions for me though because like say one of the guys with the Bulldog or the Husky said like let's go for a walk. And the dogs gonna be there, a walk is a different kind of environment they're not going to be like jumping on me they're going to be focused on the walk and stuff.

Cassidy: 13:36

You might have quite liked the dog if that was your first...

Courtney: 13:38

If that was the first interaction that might have been different.

Cassidy: 13:40

Then maybe when you went over again the dog humped you it wouldn't have been as awful and honestly I have asked on my Instagram, in podcasts with men as well, if they use their dog as an icebreaker. I'll especially, meeting people in the app, so I don't know them, meeting in person can be so awkward. I've 100% said let's take my dog for a walk and that was our first date, if you even want to call it that. But maybe not even as an icebreaker, but like your first time meeting the dog should be in an environment where they're going to be on their best behaviour. A walk where they're very calm or they're more interested in everything else than the person. So I think that's something to keep in mind it honestly, if your dog is bananas at home, maybe don't make that your first introduction to the person.

Courtney: 14:23

That's where they're most comfortable, so of course they're going to be excited. And honestly, if a guy has a dog and our first date or whatever is a walk, that would honestly make it more comfortable because yes, the dog is their icebreaker but it's also my icebreaker. You have nothing to talk about it just it's one of those dates where it's like 'this is not going anywhere' but you still have to finish the walk. You can talk about their dog. The entire walk if you know it's not going anywhere at least there's something to talk about.

Cassidy: 14:54

Right? If you know in the first five minutes it's not going there, you can still talk about the dogs. So Hayden said in the first episode, the first part of the series, was like, No, he wouldn't like he'd rather get to know the person first, and I respect that. I totally get that. But like, from the woman's perspective, give us something to talk about it. Like silence. It's just awkward. It's just, I prefer the walk over coffee too, because, what you do when there's silence is you take a sip of your coffee, you can only drink so much at a time. I'm now staring at you and it's like, I really don't like coffee dates. So I personally love taking and plus where right is such a big part of my life. I do take her immediately whereas Hayden said, if the people just tolerate Koda that is loving Koda. So we just have different perspectives in general about our dogs. But I think it's totally fine, as a female especially as me having a dog. I've had the first dates as well with guys with dogs, with Rey our first meeting, I wouldn't call it a date, just our first meeting was taking the dogs out, because also having a dog who is selective and not knowing their dog. I want to know if they're compatible. But you want to know if you're compatible? So if they have something in their life as important as a dog, hopefully it is important to them. You don't want to wait too long to meet them. No, because that could be a deal breaker and it would really suck to really like the person first. Would you date a guy who went to cat? Cat dads are exceptional. When you see on the app, we'll go back to that. You see a guy posing with his dog. That's so cute, you see a guy posing with his cat?

Courtney: 16:31

I'm sorry, but if your first photo is a photo with a cat, I am not swiping right. And I am so honest with that. I'm sorry. But like I don't. I'm also not a cat person. I think they're adorable. I know people who love their cat. And like that's great. For them a cat is like, Rey, it's their pet, like their child. They love it. And that's great. They have something that they love. I had cats growing up and loved them. I don't have a cat anymore. And I'm not so much a cat person.

Cassidy: 17:12

You know, I personally would be happy to never own a cat.

Courtney: 17:16

Ever ever. Also, cat and dog personalities are completely different. A cat is not that excited to see you, maybe they are may be some are. But in my experience. Castle rattle.

Cassidy: 17:29

It all comes down to experience.

Courtney: 17:30

Yes, that's what it is.

Cassidy: 17:31

Right. We've been tarnished. We have our own experiences that weigh into it just like anything. You like a certain breed over another breed. And yeah, that's all it is. Sorry, cat dads.

Courtney: 17:43

You guys are great people. I'm so caring and loving, I'm sure. But no.

Cassidy: 17:47

We're dog people. And she doesn't even want to swipe right on a dog, dad. So don't feel bad.

Courtney: 17:52

It's not just you. It's not just you.

Cassidy: 17:55

So my podcast is just primarily women, and dog moms. But let's say there's a dog dad listening. Anything you want to say, advice or just your thoughts that you think would be a good takeaway for them?

Courtney: 18:12

Yes, I first of all, make sure that the first introduction with whoever male or female is meeting your dog. Make sure they're comfortable. It's so terrible to feel uncomfortable. Because your dog is doing something like humping their leg or taking a chunk of their hair. Even if your dog is still young, and it's hyper and whenever it's just really excited to see people. Just make sure they're comfortable.

Cassidy: 18:43

You're not necessarily comfortable with the person.

Courtney: 18:45

Exactly. Yeah, it's your first time. Like, who knows if it's their first time. For me in those two instances, it was my first time meeting the guy.

Cassidy: 18:52

But even if it's your third, fourth, fifth, it's still new.

Courtney: 18:55

Like, just make sure that even though you're telling them it's okay to push the dog off or tell them no, just do it. Just say just tell your dog.

Cassidy: 19:03

Maybe raise your standards of your dog's behavior a little bit for that person.

Courtney: 19:08

Totally. Yeah, totally as I would say, like make sure your dog's in training but I'm sure you're all working on that. So like good for you.

Cassidy: 19:15

And dogs have good days and bad days.

Courtney: 19:17

Exactly, and I get that. But in my experience, I have been made very uncomfortable.

Cassidy: 19:23

And you're gonna remember those moments.

Courtney: 19:28

It's literally the first thing that comes to my mind when you ask me my bad experience.

Cassidy: 19:32

If I just asked you about an experience dating with dogs all of the good ones are out the window. Your first thought is the bad experiences no matter how many good experiences you've had. You're gonna remember those first.

Courtney: 19:44

Yeah, so just I think in my experience, just make sure the person is comfortable. It's easy as that. I don't know if it's actually that easy, but.

Cassidy: 19:55

You could... just the effort is nice. You weren't comfortable. If you could see that they were trying. Because they weren't. If you felt like they were at least trying their best to make you comfortable with the dog.

Courtney: 20:07

And honestly, most of the times when I meet people with dogs and their dogs are being a little bit too much they will take the initiative and like calm their dog down or get it off of me or whatever. But it's just unfortunate that in the one where the dog is on my leg like he's just laughing, and I'm like, I don't, I'm not enjoying this. Who would enjoy that? So just I don't know, not saying your dog jumps up on people's legs, but just make sure that if they look like they're uncomfortable, and you're telling them if you feel like you have to tell the person, it's okay to tell them to get off. Just they probably need to be told to probably just tell your dog to get off or do it yourself. Yeah.

Cassidy: 20:47

Thank you again, Courtney, for sharing your experiences on the dogs and dating series as a single woman who does not own a dog, trying to date, and what you've been through and expect when or if you're dating a guy with a dog. Not all dog dads are the same. She's had both good and bad experiences. And unfortunately, the bad ones are just a lot quicker to come to mind. Courtney and I are both very similar being sisters. And we were raised with certain expectations of dogs, we have similar values and opinions and we certainly are not speaking for all women, dog mamas or dog-less when it comes to dating guys with or without dogs. We do have upcoming the dog mom perspective where I've gathered many, many different dog mamas out there to get their thoughts, feelings and opinions. So stay tuned for that in a few weeks. Next week, I get a similar dog-less perspective. I speak with my friend Tyler on what it's like as a guy trying to date us crazy, obsessed dog moms. We had a fantastic time recording and he had some very interesting stories to tell as well. I loved hearing his thoughts and I think you should all be very eager to hear what he has to say. Especially if you maybe are a single and dating dog mom. I hope you are enjoying this series. Still, there's so much we can learn from this, dating aside, when we share these kinds of stories. Let me know what you think. Please, if you haven't done so already, make sure you're subscribed to the show, like, rate, review, share with your friends. I have made so many wonderful connections and have had so many amazing conversations with people that I did not know before starting this podcast. I would love to continue to grow and meet people so that I can learn from you guys. You can find me on Instagram @spicydogmama. Feel free to reach out if you want to chat. I love getting all your messages. You can also email me at spicydogmama@gmail.com, I also have a website where you can read the episodes inblog format. There are additional blog posts there and you can read some more of our story. That is spicydogmama.com In the coming weeks I also should have some very exciting news aboutt a project I've been working on for almost a year. I cannot wait to show you all thank you for listening I so appreciate each and every one of you. I hope that you have a great week. You're doing amazing.