39. Embracing Midlife: Making Fulfillment a Lifelong Journey

Unlock the secrets to thriving in midlife with Bernie Borges, a digital creator, podcast host, and speaker committed to helping individuals over 40 excel in fitness, health, career, relationships, and legacy.
 Bernie shares his personal journey, blending decades of marketing expertise with a focus on personal growth to redefine what midlife can be. Discover how focusing on these five pillars can lead to a more enduring sense of fulfillment, and why midlife, often misunderstood, is actually the longest and potentially most rewarding phase of our lives.
Bernie delves into this powerful concept, exploring how understanding and addressing the five pillars can lead to a deeper sense of achievement. Through compelling stories and thought-provoking survey findings, learn why many prefer fulfillment over temporary happiness and how breaking life into manageable pieces—rather than "boiling the ocean"—can help align our actions with values.
 Bernie shares stories of significant career changes that highlight the pursuit of fulfillment. In this episode we gain ideas evaluating fulfillment across various life pillars and embrace the idea that achieving 80% fulfillment is more than commendable.

14:47 Chasing Fulfillment, Not Happiness
19:4 Exploring Self-Awareness for Fulfillment
33:11 Personal Growth Through Podcasting
38:42 Navigating Career and Fulfillment
48:27 Pursuing Fulfillment Through Career Changes
56:23 Embracing Fulfillment in Midlife

Website: https://midlifefulfilled.com
Sign up to get the research report: https://midlifefulfilled.com/midlife-

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Transcript

Speaker 1 0:01

Hello and welcome to today's episode. Our guest today is a remarkable individual who's on an incredible mission to help people over their 40s thrive in life. Bernie Borges focuses on these five key pillars. These are the pillars of fitness, health, career, relationships and legacy. He's not only a dedicated husband and father, but a digital creator, the host of the Midlife Fulfilled podcast, and he's a sought-after speaker. And how lucky we are that we get to have him here so we can pick his brain and learn from him.

Speaker 1 0:32

Bernie is here to share with us his knowledge and his ideas and his beliefs that midlife can in fact be the time where we live our most fulfilling lives, and he's here to give midlife a fresh rebrand and a fresh perspective. So let's dive in and learn from his wisdom, his ideas, his knowledge and his life experience. I love your topic. I never thought that I would be talking about midlife because we always see it as something far away and for other people. And here we are. We're in that bracket now, but you're going to define all of us. I'm so looking forward to learning from all your lessons and your experience and your wisdom.

Speaker 2 1:10

Well, thank you for having me, Desi. I'm really excited to be with you on your midweek insights podcast. I've listened to a few episodes myself and I love what you're doing, so thanks for having me.

Speaker 1 1:22

Oh, thank you so much. I'm glad to hear that. So, if you don't mind, if we start with a little bit of other background about you and what led you on this mission, your why behind what you do, really.

Speaker 2 1:33

Yeah, because it really is about my own journey. It's my journey that really got me to this mission that I'm on, and Desi. It is part vocational and part very personal. It's really sort of the meshing of the two, the marriage of the two. So I guess I'll start with the professional. I've really spent the bulk of my career in marketing. I've been a marketing professional for let's call it 30 years, right, just to age myself a little bit. And you know let's. Let's talk about what is marketing. Marketing is just communication. Marketing is just communicating a message to influence people that you want to buy your product or service, to influence them to have a behavior or an emotion or take some action. So that's my career, summed up in one sentence, right Marketing.

Speaker 2 2:27

And then my journey, my personal journey, is as I've been aging myself, going through these decades. I'm in my mid-60s now. A good 10 or 15 years ago I started thinking about the fact that, yeah, I'm in midlife. When I was in my 40s my kids were young and then I'm in my 50ifties and I didn't even want to talk about my age in my fifties and I was going through all these experiences both in my career and in my personal life. It kind of came together because, as I did research on midlife and I discovered, first and foremost, it's very misunderstood. Most people don't really understand what midlife is. Most people have some obscure definition of it.

Speaker 2 3:09

And I dug and dug and dug and did a lot of research and, really coming back to this whole meshing of my marketing profession and my own personal journey, I just decided that I would take my marketing experience, which is again summed up in communication. That's what marketing is is communication and I would communicate what midlife is what we all seek as humans, because there's a lot we have in common as human beings, a lot. It doesn't matter what country you're, from what language you speak, what political beliefs you are. None of that matters. And from the standpoint of core, foundational things that we all want as human beings, and so I dug into it, and that's really what got me to this mission that I'm on and my midlife fulfilled podcast that's amazing and I love that.

Speaker 1 3:57

You I find most people that are in this line of work they've brought some kind of previous work experience and another. It's almost like they've had two or three different lives and they've all brought it together for this new missions. I feel like that's part of what you do and all this marketing experience that you say is now helping you. It's not something separate from what you do, it's kind of meshed together, and I think that's what makes your work even more valuable, because you're bringing and drawing from so many different areas of life. It's not just onesided. So, if you don't mind defining midlife a little bit more, so that we know what it is and what it's not, because we might all have different interpretations of this word. So let's get clear with that before we.

Speaker 2 4:33

Absolutely. I love starting here. So midlife is several things. Number one it's the biggest span of decades in her life. Number one it's the biggest span of decades in her life. I really believe that we have three phases in life, and they are youth, midlife and end of life. And think of it as like a ruler where, like, the first inch is youth, midlife is about 10 or 11 inches and then end of life is and I know you're in Europe, so I'm speaking in inches as opposed to your metrics in Europe.

Speaker 1 5:10

I don't know if the dad can relate the metrics, but we can. Yeah, exactly, we do a little and a lot right In the middle, exactly so.

Speaker 2 5:15

The first part of our life is our youth and that's only about the first 30 years of our life, and then we have these multiple decades where that really is our midlife. I really define midlife as adulting. I really break it down to that simple definition. And because that youth period I remember when I was in my twenties I thought I was an adult and technically, legally, I was an adult. I can drink and all that you know over age 21 in the US. But from a maturity standpoint, it really didn't start to happen until my 30s, even though I bought my first home when I was 28 years old, I was gainfully employed in my 20s, I had my education and all that, but really maturity started to happen in my 30s and I don't think I'm unique. I don't think I'm unique at all. So midlife is these many decades in between, and the only thing after midlife is end of life. Now, end of life is just a natural part of life, and I'll share my own personal experience. My parents are both deceased. They both lived into their early to mid nineties and the last about three years of their life was an end of life season for them, where their health was declining and eventually they passed. And while it's sad, it's also just natural, right? Everyone eventually dies. The death rate is 100%. So so, just to sum it up again, it's youth to about age 30. And, yes, it's a little different for everybody. Then multiple decades and then end of life, and then I just break midlife into three simple stages early midlife, mid midlife and late midlife, right? So I'm kind of exiting, you know, mid midlife. I'm 66, almost 67, depending on when you publish this, I might be 67. So I'm kind of in between mid and late stage. Midlife, right, whether someone is even in their seventies, even if they're retired, as long as they're healthy and they're doing something with their life, whatever that might be and the definition of what they're doing with their life is unique to every single individual. No one should ever judge it. It doesn't matter if they're working or not working. As long as you are healthy at age 70, even 80, you're still in that late midlife stage.

Speaker 2 7:40

So now back to your introduction though, desi, because you said in my introduction that I serve people over the age of 40 in my podcast. The reason I say it that way, desi, is just for simplicity purposes, because it's hard to convince someone in their thirties that they're in midlife. I know at first hand because my daughter is in her mid thirties and she says absolutely no. But you know, I can reflect back on my thirties and I can remember when I was really kind of going through my own maturation. And now when I look back on that and go, okay, that was the beginning of my midlife stage. I didn't know it then. The word midlife was not even in my vocabulary when I was in my 30s. So anyway, a little long-winded sorry, but that's my definition of midlife.

Speaker 1 8:30

Why do you consider the 30s in there? Why are you choosing the 30s? Is that part of the middle part of the ruler as you described it? Because it falls into that middle part.

Speaker 2 8:40

Because I think that's when most of us begin adulting. I think for many of us this is very generalized. I'm not saying this is a one size fits all for every human being. I'm generalizing that for many of us we're still kind of happy, and we always want to be happy, but kind of carefree.

Speaker 2 9:00

28, when I bought my first home and I was gainfully employed and had, you know, I had responsibility, but for me the response and again I was only speaking for myself the responsibility was for myself In my thirties again speaking for me and my situation is when I got married, started a family and so my responsibility. So, even if someone is not married in their thirties, I'm not saying that you have to be married to equate, you know, being an adult. It's not what I'm saying. I'm not saying that you have to be married to equate being an adult. It's not what I'm saying. I'm just saying that usually by the time we're somewhere in our 30s, we have enough experience, we have enough responsibility. Even if you're single and your only responsibility is to yourself, you still have enough there to really characterize a level of maturity. For most people that is more than what it was in our 20s.

Speaker 1 9:48

So your rebrand is not just identifying, from what I understand, what it entails. But what else does that include? The rebranding of midlife as it is?

Speaker 2 9:59

So once we become self-aware not necessarily of the word midlife, because again I reflect back on my 30s the only thing that I would have admitted in my 30s was that I was a full-fledged adult, you know, with some level of maturity as an adult, was not in my vocabulary. But once we're in that stage of life, desi, we want purpose. That's what we want is purpose. So everyone, whether it's conscious or unconscious, wakes up every day and says what's my purpose? Okay, again, I'm not saying people literally wake up and say those words, but we think that way. What's my purpose? And it's unique for everybody.

Speaker 2 10:56

And this is what led me to the five pillars, because, as I was going through my own journey in the last 10 to 20 years, I realized that even though I have so many blessings in my life you know, been married for 36 years, almost 37. We have two adult children, they've given us three grandchildren, a fourth on the way. They're all gainfully employed, you know, and just living productive, happy and healthy lives. So many blessings. I've had a, you know, a good career. We have a nice home that we live in, I mean so many blessings, but yet, desi, I still felt unfulfilled. I felt unfulfilled, so that drove me to really come to understand well why. Why do I feel unfulfilled? And that really drove me to understand what is the meaning of fulfillment.

Speaker 1 11:42

I'm glad you said that things were going well and you still have all these great things. I think a lot of us think that being unfulfilled means you don't have these good things and you're always chasing something from a negative, missing place where things are missing. So I think that's an important distinction, because I think many of our listeners and myself included, we have these really good things to be grateful for, but there's something that we're looking for. Please take us through what fulfillment means for you.

Speaker 2 12:09

Absolutely so. Again, I always try to look at anything in life, on any topic, through the simplest lens that I can look at it through. Again, back to what is marketing is communication. So how do I communicate the meaning of fulfillment? So it's very simple.

Speaker 2 12:26

Fulfillment is something that you experience. That is an achievement. It's an achievement. It can be an achievement that you achieved yourself or was bestowed upon you. Let me draw that distinction.

Chasing Fulfillment, Not Happiness

Speaker 2 12:48

So one of my achievements is the way that I completed my university degree. I completed most of it in the evening, while I was working full-time, because I wanted to go to a university that was private and it was relatively expensive and I knew that my parents were not able to pay the tuition. So I simply said then if I'm going to go there, I have to pay for it myself. How am I going to pay for it? I have to get a job. I got a job and I did it at night, and I did it across the span of seven years, at night, 12 months a year and at an early age. So when I completed that, that gave me a tremendous sense of fulfillment. I earned that. And here's the thing about fulfillment. And this is if, if you and your listener takes nothing else away from our conversation. This is the one point that I always try to really get across. Fulfillment is immutable, and what immutable means in case that's not a word that you're familiar with is that it's permanent. It cannot be taken away. So think back to my university degree, the way I achieved it and the fulfillment it gives me. Nothing can take that away, nothing so that I earned. I'll give you another example of fulfillment that's bestowed upon me, meaning I didn't earn it, but it nonetheless gives me fulfillment which is immutable. You can't take it away. I mentioned earlier my beautiful family. You know two adult kids. They have their own families. We have three grandchildren and a fourth on the way. Those grandchildren are an immense sense of fulfillment bestowed upon me, but nonetheless, fulfillment that nothing can take away. Now, all of that is different than happiness. Right now, I happen to be cheering for a sports team in a championship series that is not going well, and I'm not happy that they're not doing well. Right now.

Speaker 2 14:47

Happiness is an emotion and we all want it. I want to be happy, you want to be happy, but it's an emotion and that emotion is a little like a roller coaster it can go up, it can go down, and it can go up and down within the span of minutes, hours, days, weeks and again we all want to be happy, of minutes, hours, days, weeks and again. We all want to be happy. I want to be happy, you want to be happy, your listener wants to be happy and I have no criticism against happiness. Everyone wants to be happy, but it's understanding the difference between being happy and being fulfilled. Happiness is an emotion. Boil it down to that simple definition. It's an emotion. We all want it. Fulfillment is an immutable achievement, whether you earned it or it was bestowed upon you. That's the definition.

Speaker 1 15:31

That's amazing. I've never heard it put like that, actually. But happiness, basically, is not what we're chasing here, right, it's not about chasing this emotion of happiness. So how do we start taking little steps towards becoming more fulfilled? And you've got those pillars, which are quite important. So I guess it's different steps for different pillars, right? So is there a common thread of some things we can do across all pillars, or is it better just to break down those pillars for ourselves and say these are the steps I could take towards health, these are my fitness steps, these are my career steps? What are your thoughts on that?

Speaker 1 16:13

Okay, you realize you just asked me about five questions, so let me try to unpack them. I'm sorry. Take whatever you like from there.

Speaker 2 16:17

Okay, all right. So I think, inherent somewhere in the beginning of the question, desi was about chasing. What are we chasing? Are we chasing happiness or chasing fulfillment? And I suggest that we chase both. Again, we want to be happy. I want my sports team to win, I want to enjoy good conversation with friends, family and feel happy about that. So we should be chasing both happiness and fulfillment good conversation with friends, family and feel happy about that, right? So we should be chasing both happiness and fulfillment. Interestingly, I recently conducted a pretty significant survey and I'm producing a research report from the survey findings. I asked 43 questions and I'm working on the report right now, as you and I record this and one of the questions that I asked is, hypothetically speaking, if you could only be either happy or fulfilled, which one would you choose? Now, I'm not going to divulge the exact percentage, except that I will give a little hint, and that is more than 50%. A lot more than 50% chose fulfillment.

Speaker 1 17:26

Amazing yeah.

Speaker 2 17:28

So how do we do that across the five pillars? First of all, the reason that the five pillars exist and again, they are health, fitness, career relationships and legacy. The reason they exist is because when I was looking in my own journey, in my own personal journey, when I was looking at my life and I said, why do I not feel fulfilled? I realized that eventually this has not happened quickly. It took some time to come to this realization and a lot of reading, a lot of research I realized that I can't really ask that question why am I not fulfilled? It's the wrong question to ask, and I use a simple metaphor.

Speaker 2 18:08

We've all used this metaphor or we've heard this metaphor used before, and that's boiling the ocean. Have you heard that expression? Really Okay? So if you were working on a project and let's say you're on my team and you're working on a project and we're having a conversation and I think you're trying to do too much at you know, at once, I would say, desi, you're trying to boil the ocean, okay, break your project down into small pieces, right, and then manage each of those pieces, make sure they fit together, right? So instead of trying to boil the ocean, right, think of that metaphor. Like you can't boil the ocean right, do it, you know, break it up into manageable pieces, and then you can feel much more organized and feel good about what you're trying to do. And that's exactly what I did across the span of life and I came up with those five pillars health, fitness, career, relationships and legacy.

Speaker 2 19:00

So one of the questions you asked- in your last set of questions was how do we do this? Right Again, marketing, communicating, right. I just want to communicate as as simple as possible. Communicating, right. I just want to communicate as as simple as possible.

Speaker 2 19:20

The how is look at each of those five pillars and ask yourself am I fulfilled in my health pillar? Am I fulfilled in my fitness pillar? Am I fulfilled in my career pillar, in my relationship pillar, in my legacy pillar? And the re? And the way that you answer that question is you look at your values in each of those pillars.

Speaker 2 19:41

If, starting with health, you value spending time with family and not working too much, but you have some health issues that are controllable, because many of us can have health issues that are outside of our control for any number of reasons, right. So I want to be clear about that. I don't mean to suggest that there's a magic wand here, right, but it's simply a matter of and I say simply from a self-awareness standpoint, desi it's simple to think this way. It's not simple to tackle, it can be difficult to tackle, but I just say simply, meaning look at it through the lens of each of the pillars and ask yourself am I fulfilled in each pillar, one by one. And then, what are my values in each of those pillars and am I living to those values? Because maybe that's where there's a disconnect If your health is not where you want it to be, or things that you can control, and you're looking at your values and there's misalignment there, that might be a light bulb for you and say, well, okay, well, I'm not living my values and it's impacting my health. Same thing with each pillar. It's a simple way to look at it, but I'm not suggesting it's simple to address each one at a time.

Speaker 1 21:03

So am I fulfilled and what are my values relating to this? So, if it's health, can we do like a solid example of, let's say, health or fitness?

Speaker 2 21:19

example of, let's say, health or fitness. So let me explain why I have health and fitness as two separate pillars, because they are very, very much connected to each other. There's no question about it. But I break them out as two separate pillars. One is because health is a humongous pillar and health is both physical and mental. So you can be physically healthy, physical and mental. So you can be physically healthy, right, you can have all the great biomarkers, meaning you get your blood work and the results come in and everything looks good. So you can have physical health and you might still have poor mental health or have struggles from a mental health standpoint. So that's why I suggest, in my approach to looking at this, that health is its own big standalone pillar.

Speaker 2 22:01

Now, as I mentioned, and we all know, fitness correlates to health. So fitness in our midlife seasons remember 30s, 40s, 50s, 60s I'm in my 60s Fitness is not about what it was when we were in our teens, in our 20s, when fitness was more about competition and looking good in a bathing suit and things like that. Right, fitness in our midlife is more about really being functional. It's being able to go to the grocery store and pick up packages and, you know, helping a neighbor pick up something, you know just, or going someplace with a group of people and going for a long walk, or taking a vacation and on vacation, you know you're spending time with loved ones and you get tired and winded because you're not fit. It's just about being functional.

Speaker 2 22:53

It's not about looking great in a bathing suit. It's not about winning a competition or a contest. It's about being functional. It's not about looking great in a bathing suit. It's not about winning a competition or a contest. It's about being functional. It's also about contributing to your longevity, because there's lots of research out there, lots and lots of research out there, that has proven that physical fitness contributes to longevity.

Speaker 1 23:12

When we're in our 40s and on, still trying to catch what we were in our thirties, and sometimes that becomes the goal and we forget that it should actually be about aging well, being able to be mobile and to move and stretch and not like have aches and pains and cracks every time we do so I think that that shift is a nice way to start looking at the season and I like that you call it seasons. So what is the biggest needle mover? So people have identified there's a disconnect between health, let's say, and values. Like I want to be healthy but I'm not doing the things that will bring me there, so I'm kind of going in different paths. What things can start to bring them closer to being aligned in this area?

Speaker 2 23:50

I think my answer to your question, desi, might surprise you, because it's probably not what you or your listener might expect in to your question. Desi might surprise you because it's probably not what you or your listener might expect in answering your question. The biggest needle mover is self-awareness, is beginning with just understanding where are you fulfilled, where are you not fulfilled? And again, instead of boiling the ocean and asking that question, why am I not fulfilled in my life? Ask that question in each pillar. So again you ask the question what's the biggest needle mover? It's self-awareness, asking yourself that question across each of the five pillars. And actually I have a scorecard for this. If someone goes to my website, midlifefulfilledcom, I have a scorecard for that. That actually is like a little tool to help you score yourself on your fulfillment. Once you have that self-awareness of where you are fulfilled and where you are lacking fulfillment, that gives you the insight to know where you might want to focus right. So one thing I'm not is I'm not a therapist. I'm not a psychologist or a therapist. So I'm not here to suggest that you know, if you get my scorecard, that that's going to fix whatever fulfillment you might need. No, it's going to help you become aware of where you might want to focus.

Speaker 2 25:15

So a common example that I used, desi, is you know, everybody knows that we spend most of our waking life working. So career is a huge pillar. So if we are let's say we're fulfilled in our career, let's say someone is going across those five pillars and they get to career and say, yes, I am fulfilled in my career. But then the next pillar after that is are you fulfilled in your relationships? Well, some people might say I'm very fulfilled in my career, I've accomplished what I've accomplished in my career.

Speaker 2 25:51

I'm not fulfilled in my relationships and that's very personal and in your own head you can think of where those relationships that lack fulfillment. Where they are, and it can be very painful for some people, but that's an example of self-awareness just knowing where you have fulfillment which, remember, is immutable and where you're lacking fulfillment. So that once you have that again self-awareness, then you can say, okay, let me go focus on the relationship pillar in this hypothetical example. And here's three people in my life that I know that I want to improve relationships. So it's just again, it's that self-awareness across the five pillars. So you know where to focus.

Speaker 1 26:40

So it's getting that awareness, and then I think that can also be overwhelming, like you said, overwhelming, scary at times, like a big shock sometimes. But then what happens after you've gained that self-awareness? Do you then think someone's done the work, they've done a quiz and they realize that they're quite low. At that point do you think it's best to seek out a coach to get an accountability partner? How would you take it from I'm aware to some kind of action, so that you're not stuck in the awareness and then feeling worse?

Speaker 2 27:07

Yeah. So it comes back to your values, knowing what your values are and then putting your own action plan in place. If that involves getting a coach or seeing a therapist, or just talking to a friend, just having a conversation with a friend, whatever that unique journey is, I don't have again, I'm not a therapist, so I don't have like an action plan that says you should do this, because every human being and every journey is unique to each of us, right. But that's why I say start with self-awareness, because if you don't begin there, if you skip that step and just start to think about addressing something but without really knowing what it is that you need to address, once you have that self-awareness, then you can say, okay, either I need to see, get professional help, or I just need to work on this. Like I know I've got this one broken relationship over here and I'm going to go work on that relationship. You know it. Just it's unique to each of us. Whatever that action step is, just think about what the options are and then take an action step.

Speaker 2 28:14

I'm a big believer and this is a pretty common thing, I'm sure everybody listening has heard this and that's having some accountability in life, right. So, whether that's a friend, a loved one, a spouse, whatever it may be, or a professional that you hire again, a therapist, whatever that is for you, get some accountability and focus in on the pillar and it may be more than one pillar, by the way. Right, for a lot of people it is fitness. A lot of people have said you know, I really have let my fitness go. You know. That's one example.

Speaker 2 28:49

And then another common one is relationships. Yeah, I've got some relationships that I, you know, I've been broken for a while and I really need to revisit those, you know, and it's that's a very common one. It's a painful one too, because it's kind of out there in the back of their head. They've got all these other things going on in their life that are good, but that relationship thing is gnawing at them in the back of their. So, whatever it is unique to any individual, start with self-awareness and then think about what's an action plan that I can put in place, whether it's professional help or some other path, and what do you think about the role of putting yourself in uncomfortable situations as part of the process of becoming more fulfilled?

Speaker 1 29:31

So trying things that are out of your comfort zone, does this add to gaining more fulfillment?

Speaker 2 29:35

is a way to grow, because we don't grow if we don't get outside our comfort zone. If we stay within our comfort zone, then there is no growth. So I love the question and it just depends on the pillar that it's about, right. I've just talked about relationship as an example. So maybe getting outside your comfort zone using that hypothetical scenario with a relationship over here that I've really just let go and it's bad and I've ignored it and I've taken no action getting outside my comfort zone may be reaching out, taking the action to be the one in the relationship to reach out and say, hey, I'd like to revisit this relationship. I'm not saying those are the words, but you get the idea that may be getting outside my comfort zone, because if one of us in the relationship doesn't do it, nothing's going to change. So for me and back to your question it would be getting outside my comfort zone.

Speaker 2 30:41

Another common one relationship is a painful one for a lot of us and a very common one. But the other common one is fitness. I see this all the time. A lot of people stop exercising In the US because I'm in the US. 60% of Americans do not do the minimum basic exercise 60% and then, of course, you can correlate that to the high degree of cardiac disease and other diseases that are happening in the US.

Speaker 2 31:15

So it's very common, very, very common, for people to look at their fitness pillar and they're 40 or 50 or 60 and they're going. You know, I really need to improve my fitness. So, getting outside your comfort zone might be saying, okay, I'm going to go on some kind of a program or I'm going to commit to routine, regular exercise three times a week. Maybe it's going to a gym, maybe it's getting with a buddy, where the buddy shares that same value and conviction that I share on fitness. Whatever the plan may be, but it may be getting outside your comfort zone. So it's a great question. I love the question because getting outside your comfort zone is the only way to grow and change something that you decide needs to change.

Speaker 1 31:59

Can I ask you when's the last time you did something that challenged your comfort zone? If you don't mind sharing that, do you still give yourself these little pushes that you can like? Continue growing.

Speaker 2 32:09

Yeah, yeah, I would have to say it would be in the relationship pillar. It's again that's why I say it's very personal and very difficult is just, you know, doing the, doing the outreach to somebody you know and just saying, hey, I feel compelled to reach out to you. And you know, and I'll be honest, you know, since you're asking me this question, there is someone in my life that used to be a good friend of mine and we haven't spoken in years. We had a little falling out and I have the intention but I haven't done it yet. I haven't done it yet. So it is a challenging thing to do, there's no question about it. So, again, I think the relationship pillar is probably maybe the hardest one of all to take that step to get outside your comfort zone.

Speaker 1 33:00

Can I offer myself as an accountability partner for you to reach out and do that?

Speaker 2 33:05

Absolutely. I need the accountability.

Personal Growth Through Podcasting

Speaker 1 33:08

I'll be checking up, I'll be sending a message to see if you've done it, okay. Okay so, also with the podcasting, because for me, reaching out of my comfort was this podcast right? I think I ruminated you know our common friend Aiki podcast together and for about two years I was thinking to do it, not to do it, and I wasn't even sure half the time what the intention is. And I knew I needed to do it as part of my journey to grow, because I was learning a lot of personal development and experience and wanted like an outlet for it and a creative project. So, first episode and then many times after that, subsequent episodes have pushed me out of my comfort zone in terms of topics.

Speaker 1 33:44

Reaching out to people and at times like the before is always much harder. And then, once it's happened, the fulfillment after having a conversation like this, after you've reached out to a complete stranger to come onto your podcast, have an amazing conversation, and then the feeling after each time I feel like I've grown just a little. So for me, this is one of those ways I feel I'm growing and pushing my own limits and still learning and allowing the path to take me different places. So what is your podcast journey been like for you, and has that added to your fulfillment as?

Speaker 2 34:19

well, and I want to answer that question. May I ask you, though, desi?

Speaker 1 34:28

Sure sure.

Speaker 2 34:33

What is your podcast doing for you across the pillars? Which of the pillars is your podcast touching?

Speaker 1 34:37

Let me have a quick look at the pillars again. I've written them down.

Speaker 2 34:41

Health fitness.

Speaker 1 34:43

Actually, yeah, career maybe possibly, but it's all volunteer stuff now, so there's no, let me think about that, maybe legacy a little bit.

Speaker 1 34:54

Okay, I was going to speculate that it might be legacy, because legacy is about having impact once you do that for yourself, then you can have impact on others, and so many of the topics have been led by my own curiosity but also with the goal of if it touches one person. So, yeah, it starts from a selfish reason, really, because you want to grow and you also challenge where you are at a certain stage in your life and then you start doing the work to see what else is there. But I think maybe a side effect of it will be that for the people that listen, or people that have reached out and said they've had this takeaway or it's opened their mind to this idea, I think from that side it's been a success, even if it's one, two, three people that listen and take away that that little bit of that, that thing that they need. Because I find every person will take something very different from the same episode and I love that because you never know and I've had some friends reach out, people that can directly contact me, and the things they've taken away has surprised me. I'm really enjoying that aspect. Yes, it's a lot of hard work and sometimes I question for how long can I keep up the pace and how long I want to do it for, but right now it's where I need to be and what I need to be doing as my little side passion, project and hobby. So it is giving me, I think, from that side, relationships as well, growing relationships, the people that are coming on the show, so it's filling that health.

Speaker 1 36:24

I'm reaching out to health experts, although it's not where I want it to be. That's giving me new ideas of starting, and I'm a believer of. To health experts, although it's not where I want it to be. That's giving me new ideas of starting and I'm a believer of. It's the little things, it's the little steps. It doesn't have to be these big, scary goals, but these little, tiny steps in any of these areas that can make a difference. So it's given me a lot more than I thought it would. It's been just over a year and learning and pushing myself and learning that I'm stronger than I thought I was in many aspects.

Speaker 2 36:51

So, yeah, Well, when you produce this podcast and publish this podcast, I encourage you to listen to what you just shared right there, because what I think it's going to do is it's going to increase your self-awareness by by answering the question that I asked you is how is your podcast touching the five pillars? Listen to your response and really think about it, like let it sink in, because it, to me, um, it was very thoughtful and, um, very meaningful to you. Yeah, you know so that self-awareness is powerful, very powerful. So you asked me how is the podcast, my Midlife Fulfilled podcast how is it impacting my fulfillment? So it's impacting several pillars, not unlike yours. I don't think it's impacting my health pillar, perhaps, except mental health, because I enjoy it. I do enjoy it and, by the way, I've been podcasting for 11 years, so this is not my first podcast. I've had other podcasts, so the podcast medium is something that I just enjoy. It just so happens that the Midlife Fulfilled podcast at the time that you and I recorded this, I published 187 episodes. I publish weekly, so this particular podcast show is on this topic midlife fulfillment.

Navigating Career and Fulfillment

Speaker 2 38:14

Previous shows have been on other topics, about marketing, because I've been in marketing for decades, so I enjoy podcasting. Well, let's see Fitness. Wise, I'd say there's really no impact on fitness, because, other than the fact that I talk about fitness and I walk the walk meaning I've been committed to fitness for 40 plus years I started working out in my 20s and I still work out five days a week, so fitness has always been important to me. Career that's an interesting one, desi, because at the time of this recording I have a full-time job, but I am working toward moving into doing this full-time, and when I say doing this, I don't mean podcasting per se, even though it'll be part of the business. I've already begun to get some interest on things that I want to do around teaching, workshops and keynote speaking. I've been a speaker throughout my marketing career, but on marketing topics, and I'm interested in getting on stages and talking about what we're talking about here today on stages at conferences as well as organizations that would want to bring me in.

Speaker 2 39:24

I mentioned earlier that I'm working on a research project. It's pretty significant. It's north of 150 pages long of really compelling research findings. So I'm offering not only licensing that content to organizations so that's a career fulfillment thing as well but also even offering doing private surveys for organizations, so that that again, that can sort of marry my passion for this entire topic we're discussing today, with vocation, with career, right, relationships, absolutely, just like you said, you know, meeting wonderful people like you and Aggie and others and having great conversations. That I learned from as well and I, you know, get fulfillment from, and I love that part of it Absolutely. And then, of course, exactly as you said, legacy I want to impact people, just like you're impacting people. So you and I share that exact same passion. So that's how it's. It's impacting me.

Speaker 1 40:21

That's amazing. What was the, the guest on your show that made you rethink the way you thought about something, or that really had an impact on you? That was really surprising, something that stood out the people you've connected with on your show.

Speaker 2 40:36

So there have been many. I think one that comes to mind is a woman that so many of the guests that I interview are people that I've already known and then many are not. They were introduced to me or I found them and I invited them on and I didn't know them previously. One guest was a woman that I knew and I wouldn't say I know her personally, but I I know her sort of within the industry that I work in and she's successful, she has her own business. She's kind of a. She's a powerful woman influencer within the sales industry. She runs a sales training company and she's run it for many years and she's very successful, she's very popular, she's very well-known, she's influential, she's a powerhouse. So when I got her on the podcast and I just asked her just a simple, open-ended question and that is what fulfills you I thought that she was going to tell me all about her amazing, successful career. She didn't. She didn't even mention it. She said that she always thought that she would become a mom someday and she's in her mid-50s and had only recently married for the first time because she had always been busy building her career and her business. And she said her sister has a little girl, and so she's an aunt. She pronounces his aunt, she's an aunt to her sister's little girl. She says you know, I've never become a mom, I'm past that stage, but as an aunt, that's enough. That's enough, so, like. So I'm summarizing. You know, a 30 minute conversation, but that was very powerful for you know, that conversation. I remember it so well because she didn't talk about all of her wonderful achievements in her career. She talked about the fact that she'd always wanted that fulfillment of being a mom. Never got it, but didn't really realize how much fulfillment she would have by being an aunt. And she loves it, and she loves being in her niece's life and being an influence in her niece's life, and so that was powerful. There was another one that comes to mind. I'll share it very quickly, I don't want to take too much time.

Speaker 2 43:03

A gentleman who, when he was in his youth he wanted to be a DJ. Who, when he was in his youth he wanted to be a DJ. Well, he ended up becoming a DJ in his 20s and gaining some fame and notoriety. Now he's here in the US, but he would even get booked to do DJ gigs in Europe and they'd fly him over from Atlanta, georgia, to different locations in Europe and then he'd fly back home. And then he decided to get a day job, because the DJ thing can be inconsistent and he decided at some point when he got married and started a family that the DJ life was not consistent with his value of being a family man, because DJs work till three, four in the morning and that was not consistent with again being at home with family during that time right In the evening and that kind of thing.

Speaker 2 43:55

So he says that he had to let his DJ persona die and he used that metaphor to live. I tried to keep them both but I had to let that persona die. And then he came to the realization through our conversation that that persona still contributed greatly to who he is today, but in his mind he had to let it die. So and I can think of other conversations, because again, 180 plus episodes the conversation I had with Aggie was also very impactful. You know Aggie, you know he was a dentist by trade and but his fulfillment, his passion, is helping people. You know, and he's doing that now as a coach through personal development and helping them. People like you get a podcast off the ground and that sort of thing. So many, so many, so sorry there's probably more time than you needed.

Speaker 1 44:59

I love that because I think the common link here is the importance of relationships. In all those stories right, whether it's Aiki or your friend that was a DJ prioritizing relationships. I think even if we have everything else on a high, if our relationships are not in order, or at least where we feel that they're okay, I think everything else will fall apart. That's my belief, at least, and this is something we can all work on looking at what are the important ones for us and building on those and not just letting it happen automatically, but being conscious of those relationships right scheduling the time like we would for a podcast, actually scheduling that presence, uh, with a friend or with someone we we want to be wanting to reach out.

Speaker 1 45:42

For a long time I was actually thinking about that before we got on the show today. I was like I need to schedule more as the podcast, where you give them the undivided attention, where you're curious about what's new. And, yeah, I think relationships are key as well. So thank you for bringing those examples up, because it's reminded me of that as a really important pillar. So what would you like more people to ask you or ask you about? What's a question maybe that you wish?

Speaker 2 46:09

you were asked more.

Speaker 2 46:11

The question that you've really asked me is under one word at the beginning of our conversation, and that is why? Why midlife? Why fulfillment? There's a word that I use a lot and I'm surprised that we're this far into the conversation and I haven't used this word yet and that's thrive. It's in my messaging on the website.

Speaker 2 46:36

We all want to thrive, everybody wants to thrive, and if you don't want to thrive, then you're probably suffering from a mental health condition, meaning you might be depressed and need professional help, because every human being wants to thrive. Now, thrive looks different for everybody. The way you thrive and I thrive and other people thrive is going to be unique to everybody. But the question that I want to answer is why? Why think about this? Why is this important? And and I think the short answer is because we all want to thrive and we don't all know how to figure that out, like, especially as we go through these different seasons in life. The way I was thriving in my twenties is different the way I was thriving in my forties, and it's different than I'm thriving in my 60s. So it's just answering that question why?

Speaker 1 47:31

Yeah, and I like that you're redefining it at every stage because we think, by a certain age, we've got it figured out and this is what we need to focus on, but each phase brings different challenges and different levels of moving through. I think, so this is really really key. So I love the word thrive as well. So, yeah, we want to grow and thrive. A couple of before fulfillment and after fulfillment stories that you can share with us.

Pursuing Fulfillment Through Career Changes

Speaker 2 47:58

Yeah, so I mentioned Aggie. You know Aggie is a mutual friend of ours. He went to school to become a dentist. He became a dentist and he had a thriving dentist practice and then he realized, after he attended I think it was a Tony Robbins event, that he realized that he really wanted to help people thrive themselves and provide personal development. So that's a great story and he's pursuing that and he's doing that. Another one that comes to mind is a gentleman.

Speaker 2 48:27

This is actually one of the most popular episodes and it was episode, I think, 25. And again, at the time that you and I record this, I published episode 187. So not only was it way back in the beginning of the podcast, but very unlikely that anybody listening today listened that far back, because most people kind of turn over in podcast listening. If you didn't know that, and even as a listener myself, there are podcast shows that I've been listening to for a long time, but I haven't listened to every single episode. So anyway, so way back on episode 25, his name is Kurt.

Speaker 2 48:59

He had a successful career in sales and that included sales leadership roles with prestige, that sort of thing, and he reached a point. He's about my age, so he's in his 60s and he reached a point not long ago, about a year and a half ago, where he was searching for what he wanted to do, because he'd been doing sales leadership for decades. And when you're doing anything for decades, you're just kind of doing the same thing over and over again. Even though it may be different circumstances, different people, different whatever, you're still kind of doing the same thing over and over again if you're doing it for decades. And so he was in sales leadership for decades and this is out in California in the technology industry, which I come from. So I have a lot of empathy, I understand. And he was approached by somebody in his local community at the tourism bureau. And they asked him because he's a very personable guy, he's a likable guy. If you go to an event and he's there, he's noticeable, he's tall, he's handsome, he's just somebody that has presence right. And so he was asked by someone in the tourism bureau like hey, why don't you come to work for us? You know we need someone like you to just help market our community as a tourism community, which it is. It is a tourism. It's in Santa Rosa, california. It's a beautiful. It's a wine country, which it is, it is a tourism, it's Santa Rosa, california, it's a beautiful, it's a wine country.

Speaker 2 50:30

And so when he accepted that role, what he said was he had to. Kind of similar to the DJ story, little similarity here. He said that he had to put his ego aside because for decades he had prestigious roles, he had authority, he was, was a leader, that whole sort of achievement thing that was part of the ego. And he said he, he just had to. Again similar, not exactly the same. He didn't use the word die, kurt didn't use the word die.

Speaker 2 50:59

He said I had to just put my ego aside and and go into this new role, just focused on doing the role and having fun with it. But I had to put my ego aside to just give myself permission to do it. And he's been doing it and he loves it and, by the way, I think he has the best job in the world because it is a beautiful area. So his job is to market the area, which means he's out and about all the time, all these beautiful vacation venues and so on and so forth. I see all the photos and I'm like I want that job.

Speaker 1 51:32

You go aside and go for it.

Speaker 2 51:34

Right right.

Speaker 1 51:36

So that's amazing. I love that story. So you said there were two, so it was Kurt, and is there another one that you wanted to share?

Speaker 2 51:42

From a BF to AF a fulfillment story.

Speaker 1 51:46

If there was one more before we part.

Speaker 2 51:47

Yeah, I mean, there's so many.

Speaker 2 51:48

So one comes to mind where a woman who is Australian always wanted to study I forget what kind of history it was, but a specific kind of history and she wanted to study it at Oxford University in Britain, study it at Oxford University in Britain. And so she and her husband put a plan in place to relocate from Australia to the UK so she could pursue her master's degree in some kind of specific history discipline. And it was a gigantic life decision for the two of them. This is what she wanted to achieve from a fulfillment standpoint and her husband complied and cooperated and they put a plan together and it was an elaborate plan, so I'm simplifying it here in this conversation, but it was a very elaborate plan that took a huge commitment and they did. They relocated from Australia to the UK and she went and she got her master's degree at Oxford University in some kind of historical studies and achieved that immutable fulfillment of that graduate degree at Oxford University. But it was a humongous plan to first plan and then execute to make that happen.

Speaker 1 53:04

And it comes back to Desi.

Speaker 2 53:05

It comes back to what are your values? Earlier I said it's simple, right. What's simple is just knowing what you need to do. Doing it can be very hard, but in her case she knew what her value was and then she and her husband put the plan in place to make it happen.

Speaker 1 53:24

You have to be clear on your values.

Speaker 2 53:25

To make a decision like that Like what am I doing here? Yeah?

Speaker 1 53:28

And that's probably going to keep her through the hard times right when she's remembering. This is the anchor. So I know you're doing some research affiliated with, is it Udemy?

Speaker 2 53:38

Right.

Speaker 1 53:39

Can you tell us a little bit about that before you share your parting thoughts?

Speaker 2 53:42

Sure, yeah, thank you. So I partnered with Udemy. For those that may not know, udemy, it's spelled U-D-E-M-Y, udemycom. They are the leader in online education. Anybody, an individual, you and I can go up and take courses on just a bunch of different topics. They also sell to businesses, so they sell licenses to businesses. So, again, the leader in online education. And so we partnered.

Speaker 2 54:04

We put a survey out. That was out in the month of May, surveys closed. Now. We got 530 responses and so, right now that we've drafted a report, at the time that you and I are recording this again, I don't know when you're publishing this, but at the time we're recording this, we're going through the drafting process, the review process, and our timeline is to publish that report in the August to September timeframe of 2024. So anybody's listening, you know, beyond that timeframe, go check it out at the website, at midlifefulfilledcom, but anybody listening before that it's coming.

Speaker 2 54:38

Then, amazing findings in the research that we did. I gave you a little glimpse earlier about how a significant percentage over 50% selected fulfillment over happiness, if they could only have both. We also asked questions about relationships to younger people and then, of course, we asked how fulfilled are you? In each pillar, so pillar by pillar, and then we're correlating those insights together and providing some thoughts on ways to take some action, both at the individual level as well as at the organizational level. Because, desi, a lot of organizations are struggling with this. They've got multiple generations in their workplace and they're struggling with how do we provide fulfillment opportunities for our entire workforce, including those in their 40s or 50s, or 60s and even 70s.

Speaker 1 55:27

I'm glad that you're starting to ask the question and starting to address and acknowledge it, because it is completely different generations and completely different needs. So the fact that they're starting to look at meeting those needs, I think is definitely a step forward for how employers treat employees and corporations treat people. So I like that a lot. Employers treat employees and corporations treat people. So I like that a lot. So I wanted to ask you if you have a favorite quote and what would you like your legacy to be Okay.

Embracing Fulfillment in Midlife

Speaker 2 55:55

So my favorite quote is and it's actually from Henry Ford. I didn't even know this for a lot of years. I was sharing the quote, didn't even know it was from Henry Ford, but it is if you believe you can't, you're right, and if you believe you can, you're right. It's all about your mindset. If you believe you can't, you're right, you can't, but if you believe you can, you're also right because you believe it. So that's my favorite quote. Uh, and I'm sorry, your second question is your legacy.

Speaker 1 56:26

What legacy would you like to leave behind with everything that you're doing?

Speaker 2 56:30

Yeah, it's about the self-awareness that midlife whatever you want to call it, if you don't want to call it midlife is the longest span of your life and chasing fulfillment is something that you should consciously do, because we all want to thrive, and do it across the five pillars. Instead of trying to boil the ocean and trying to chase fulfillment in your entire spectrum of life, break it down into those five pillars. And I also say and I say this at the end of every episode on the Midlife Fulfilled podcast I say if you're 80% fulfilled, you're doing great. Don't beat yourself up if you're not 100% fulfilled, because you're in good company. I personally think very, very few people and my research bears this out very few people are 100% fulfilled.

Speaker 1 57:27

That makes it also okay that things are not 100% all the time and they're never always going to be right. You're going to fluctuate, so I like that you keep 20% for fluctuation and for variability, and I just wanted to thank you for taking the time again to be here with me online. I'm very grateful for all the insights you've shared. I'm going to go back and listen again and again, because there's a lot here that I need to listen back to and, yeah, your presence and your knowledge has been very valuable. Thank you.

Speaker 2 57:58

Well. Thank you, desi. I love what you're doing with Midweek Insights podcast. I commend you for taking the step to actually do it. That alone is a significant achievement and it sounds to me like you're getting great fulfillment from it. And my advice to you is as long as you're getting fulfillment, keep doing it, but if you're not getting fulfillment from it, give it some second thoughts, because you've got to get fulfillment from it. So, thank you, desi, appreciate that.

Speaker 1 58:24

Thanks a lot. Lovely to meet you. You too Likewise Desi Appreciate that Thanks a lot Lovely to meet you.

Speaker 2 58:27

You too Likewise Desi.