EP:67 - Entrepreneur Inspiration - Entrepreneurial Strategies for Musicians with Brett Miller

Brett Miller is a talented musician with roots in South Florida and extensive experience in the music industry. Brett's journey has taken him from local gigs in Florida to the bustling music scenes of New York and Nashville, showcasing his dedication to his craft and entrepreneurial spirit. He is known for his unique blend of performance and songwriting, and his ability to navigate the complex world of music business with a strategic mindset.

Brett shares his fascinating journey from starting out as a young musician in South Florida to performing in renowned venues across the U.S. He discusses the challenges and triumphs of balancing the artistic and business aspects of his career, particularly highlighting the importance of networking and leveraging social media for success. The conversation also covers his strategies for maintaining a sustainable music career while continuously evolving and adapting to industry changes.

If you are interested in music, entrepreneurship, and personal branding will find Brett’s insights highly valuable. He emphasizes the importance of effective networking, leveraging social media platforms like Spotify and Instagram, and maintaining professionalism in all business dealings. Key phrases such as "music industry success," "entrepreneurship in music," and "social media strategy for musicians" are central themes in this episode, providing practical advice for aspiring musicians and entrepreneurs alike.

Connect:
- Brett Miller’s music on Spotify, YouTube, and Apple Music
- Social media: Brett Miller Live

Listener Questions:
1. How can musicians effectively balance their artistic passions with the business side of the music industry?
2. What are the best strategies for leveraging social media platforms like Spotify and Instagram to grow a music career?
3. How important is networking for musicians, and what tips does Brett Miller offer for building valuable industry connections?

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Transcript

0:23

You still have to showcase that you do what you do well, and that you have some kind of unique style. And like that is for any art form. Hey guys, we are live on another episode on the OWL podcast. To my left is Brad Miller. We're going to learn all about the music business today. And of course, Danielle Santilli is my co host and she is in the music world as well. So I'm probably not going to talk that much today. Sorry. I know if you came here to listen to me, it's gonna be more of them two chatting. We'll keep you involved. You know, we we saw them in our hallway over here chatting, chatting about all these opportunities in South Florida, Nashville, of course, and other areas of the country. And we can even make it we can add a little craziness to it. You know, I know that he brought his guitar with him. Well, just in case. So if you guys I don't know how the sound will go on these mics. But if you want to even request a song or even just have him sing for you. If you're like, I need to pick me up today. I need to get through the day. I'm gonna pick me up today. Let's honestly think about, you know, Starbucks is meeting. Yeah. So that's an option to guys. We I don't think we've ever done this before. Had some live. Have we had live music on the pod? I was gonna ask one one one before I work here. You weren't the host. You weren't the host. You didn't you actually No, I don't think so. Have I? I don't know. Probably not. I was like, you song. Oh, maybe I guess and I made you sing for like seconds. It was like one line. I don't be bashful. You have to sing with me at that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. We'll get our duets going. It is. Um, oh, Brett. So as you guys know, I was in Nashville all of last month. And luckily, I met Brett there at a songwriters round. And he just happened to live in Fort Lauderdale. So it was super cool for me to meet a totally legit, amazing musician in Nashville, who also lives in Florida. So I mean, obviously, the music journey and your music journey, it's it's not like a straight, easy path, guys. It's ups and downs all over the place circles all around. So I guess just tell us a little bit about your journey and how you got started and kind of go from Yeah, I mean, I think you said it right, right there with like, it goes to so many peaks and valleys, if you will, of the whole thing. It's, you wish it was something that you can see from start to finish, and you just execute perfectly. But that's just not how it goes, especially when life happens. And you get, you know, we know, we all know what experience we all experienced a few years ago, that really, that really shook up. And it's been about pivoting and restructuring, restrategizing how you're going to do things. But my beginning is actually from South Florida. I'm from like, Palm Beach area. I'm from Martin County, just north of that shout out to people from like Stewart, and Jensen Beach, Palm City, that area. And very small little beach town, Hope Sound specifically, and growing up in high school and, and taking lessons on piano and incorporating singing and playing at the same time, right between like 11 to like 14. Until I was with the teacher that said, Well, notice that I was learning songs on my own, just printing out chord charts and learning, learning songs, I wish I knew how to play and all that and just building this repertoire of songs. And then my father getting me my first paid gig. And that kind of set me off underway and know that I can I can do music and get paid for it, for one thing, and then kind of also work on song writing and working on how to start the artist career off the way I'd like to. And that came later on after college, and then I moved to New York in 2014. And really got the artist career under underway after grad school and just meeting the right people. And a lot of magic took place, which is sort of also on that, on that, on that vibe of, you can't plan for things, you just kind of have to show up, be present, network, meet people, and then just kind of follow what comes your way with it. And, you know, I'm blessed for still doing it. And, and being acknowledged to, you know, with the know how that I've gained from the industry and being in it like that. And yeah, I'm, I'm in it to win it. And I love being able to find people like yourselves. When I saw you in Nashville, we connected through a mutual friend who's also local. And that's kind of what it's always been about, at least for me right now, because after the pandemic, I moved back to Florida. Surprisingly, I didn't plan for that. I did that as well. I was in an LA music city. And then I'm like, totally, I'm going to go back home for a little bit and regroup. Because what else do you do? Yeah, I really I didn't. I kind of when I was in New York, I said I wasn't going to come back to Florida. I love Florida, but I just felt like it wasn't going to be the next big thing. You were kind of giving up the dream a little bit because that's what I was like, I kept my apartment in LA. And I was like, I will not move back home with the parents like I kept it. I was visiting for six months. And yeah, I keep in the dream alive. Yeah, I have to keep the dream alive. But knowing you have to like you have to take a step back to take two steps forward. Yeah. And I'm still like feeling slightly displaced, even though it's familiar. But Fort Lauderdale is new for me. Yeah, you know, Broward and Dayton, what's the exposure to Miami? And what's what are the offerings there that I'm not familiar with, but it's been pretty fruitful so far. It's just, and I'll dive into this more. But like this, I feel like there's two facets of music for me where there's the entertainment side, where I can really build a sort of a lucrative career out of it. And then there's also the artist project that takes a lot of investment, it takes a lot of time and networking, but I've always been kind of doing both simultaneously. And in South Florida, the entertainment scene is very strong, very, very strong. And, you know, it's been, it's been great and really fun to be in new venues and taking on new, you know, new clientele, both public and private. It's been really fun, but I still see it as a way to build a fan base in this local area, probably even easier than New York. Yeah, or Nashville, any of the saturated places. I have the same. I feel like, I mean, I wanted to have you on this podcast, because I could tell right away meeting you that you are business minded, and you are an entrepreneur. I mean, it sounds like from 14 years old, you've been like, in this game in terms of like, you can be a musician, so many people are musicians, like, for fun, or like they want to be artists. But being an earner as a musician is a totally different lifestyle. So and that's kind of what we're about on OWL. And this podcast is networking and entrepreneurship and making those connections to bring you to the next level. So, you know, I totally get where you're coming from with like trying to balance the passion side of it, and the money making gig circuit side of it. And yeah, just trying to find the right connections along the way. I think you said the buzzword to its entrepreneurship. Yeah, like, it, it really boils down to that, just like any art form or any kind of salesmanship, where you have a product, it's just that I'm the product, you're the product, you're offering yourself for the business of it. And it's the same practices of marketing and, and promotion and working with clients and knowing how to, you know, this is recent for me, but knowing how to use leverage, you know, if there's a demand for me or any musician, but particularly me, because they've seen what I can do, very specifically, and there's demand for that, well, then okay, well, you know, I play a different game than I was playing when I was a novice and still figuring things out. It's a different game. And I think maturity and just being in like more of a, of a business mind has been fruitful. So far. Yeah. So for anyone out there who like, I was just messaging with a friend who's like newer in the music industry. And I told him to get on owl because like, I've talked to Grammy winners and stuff on on there. And, you know, he's kind of trying to monetize, like, through YouTube videos, but like, in terms of booking gigs, do you have any advice for someone out there? You know, just do you book your own gigs? Do you go through agencies? Like, what is your gig booking process look like? The answer is all the above. Okay. The agency and the agency thing started when I was in New York, when I took on a and we talked about this, I threw the grapevine and through it was so funny. When I was in New York, I was bartending because I had some past history when I was in college. And by bartending, I ended up meeting a performer that worked at the place masters that we were talking about, you know, a really nice steakhouse that I never heard of prior to that. And this performer, you know, once we got talking, he invited me to come in and sit in on a little bit. And that just led to kind of now being listed as an irregular performer on that. And then you just kind of build on that you can talk that, hey, I got this gig over here, and it's a little bit easier to get the next gig. So it's sort of like, stay keep humble in the beginning, with go find something that you can call regular that you can invite people to and, and it kind of just gives you a little bit of that social proof legitimacy where you can build on that. And then that game of leverage comes a little bit later. But you know, you can certainly, you know, expose yourself well, with taking on games, and I'm thinking about South Florida, you know, a little bit more than New York and Nashville, where, you know, there's plenty of places like on the beaches, or, you know, at a bar, and I know that seems like, I don't want to, but you got to, oh, I was even here, I was asking when I first came here to like, you have to start somewhere you can't. Like, I remember my one of my like, exes was actually just like, I can't believe you're just like putting yourself out there and just like doing this on the street. And I was like, well, I'm new to Florida. I don't know anyone here. And I actually booked some gigs that way. I'm like, who cares? You know, I have no shame. Of course. But yeah, I mean, tons of musicians, I knew that were like, professionals playing at high end clubs in New York were like literally busking on the street during COVID. And I was like, Well, I'm on unemployment. So I don't want to get hired. So I need like cash. It was just a whole thing. That's true. Yeah, that's actually smart. And that's those are some of the things you do along the way that actually kind of helps you later on. You know, it's, it's, you can look at it like humbling yourself in order to accomplish a goal. But that's just smart, in my opinion. You know, if you're going to collect on employment on the pandemic and all that, don't stay away from it. But you can get cold hard cash. Yeah, I mean, we try. I'm here. I don't want to steal all the questions from the listeners. But so we talked about like the gig side. But in terms of the artist side, like I know you have, we like to have people with big followings on our podcast, and you have quite a big social media following. You know, with your artists stuff, and quite a lot of Spotify plays. So how did you? How did you build that following? Yeah, yeah. I mean, honestly, marketing was like paid marketing. So social media, was it organic fans? Everything? Yeah, it was everything. You know, Spotify is really awesome. And I can't speak on all the other ones. But Spotify is really good, because it has so much music discovery capabilities. Like people are finding new artists every single day. And there's, there's a lot of algorithmic playlists that introduce so much new music. So my marketing and kind of throwing stuff at the wall and seeing what sticks and seeing what's legitimate, what's not, I've, you know, I've been, you know, messed over many times. That's how that's the name of the game. But sometimes, after through your efforts, you know, you catch wind. And with Spotify, some of my songs grabbed on to the, to the automated playlists of Discover Weekly, and new music Fridays and release radar, huge, and that kind of snowballs things. And it's kept things pretty alive. But, you know, nothing is foolproof. Nothing is 100%. There's a lot of try and there's actually more failures and there are successes with it. But that's kind of what success is really anyway, right? You know, you keep trying, keep trying, and then all of a sudden, something, something sticks. And then that translated to Instagram, but it's still a work in progress. You know, I feel like I always have to kind of recreate and restructure how I how I put out my content and what performances and song choices and, you know, it's and then that's something actually, I'd like to get some help with or find expertise and within owl is like, what, how could I help me in my in my conquest? It's like social media strategizing and, and you know, the, the, the, the brand, you know, building the brand even more so on top of what I've done so far. So yeah, we're all like in a game where we're still asking questions, you know, the industry is like, changing so fast, like AI, like, I mean, every industry at this point, but like, especially us, I feel like every day, it's, it's something new that's coming out. And yeah, I already have a list of like people in my mind that I'm like, you need to call this person and this person who I still I'm like, need to call them like they're on my list that I think for us, like, one of the most powerful things you can do is building your text list, email subscription, and like to get an actual real following that's not like fake followers is so important. I've been quiet listening. Yeah, real. No, I wish it wasn't. If you ask, you know, what do they say? It's like 1000 people have 1000 fans and they each pay $100 or 1000 something like I'm bad at math. Depends who they is that you're talking about. Like, yeah, just people on your subs. If you say, Hey, like, would you fund my album? Like, if every single one of these people pays $100, which isn't that much to ask. And you have is it what I think it's 1000. Right? Yeah. 100,000. And then it'll get you 100k. Right? I mean, like that. I don't know. But like, no, it is possible. Like it. I've seen people do this. And so I'm like, Okay, I think I think that's the way to do it is like getting that. If you can get that. It was like superfan in your corner. But that and Spotify's helping us do that. They've recently kind of divided or, I guess, yeah, they've divided your audience and then into different categories recently. And then you have something that they call super listeners, which is such a new thing. And how do you how to use that information to? But you can you can and target and it's just the nonstop game, you know, and it's, it's equally as frustrating as it is invigorating, you know, and I do think that I could I could assist people along the way, especially in the beginning of it all, because I know how kind of intimidating it kind of is in the beginning. And it gets even more intimidating later on. But yeah, there's there's just so much to learn. Like you were saying, everything keeps evolving and changing since you know, AI and the pandemic really shook everything up. And you don't have to be in the big cities anymore to keep this going. So yeah, and then you throw in the word tick tock and it all just I thought you just pose and everyone comes I wish for them. Yeah, just sing pretty and they just show up. No, not quite. Yeah. Okay, I'm going to dive a little deeper into the entrepreneurship side. Most musicians are not putting entrepreneur on their profile and you have on our and I see you went to NYU I see you went to Rollins College, of course you you learned a lot of business skills through those universities, their top tier top 50. And you went to New York, you learned a lot with the typical grind. You know, I'm a New Yorker at heart. I got down here six years ago. And you're you're, you're touching a lot of subjects when it comes to communicating. And just, you know, putting yourself out there and meeting people. And you said a second ago, like tick tock, and then you dive into that platform, then it's Instagram, everyone's chasing followers and likes. But you seem to be doing it old school as well, just pure old connecting with people and making stuff happen, right started with you being a bartender, right? And then you met somebody and then maybe it was 510 years later, then you you built an opportunity from that relationship. So can we dive into like, that side of things, the entrepreneurship side, because so many musicians say, Well, I'm not really an entrepreneur. I'm like, No, that's bullshit. You are an entrepreneur, because you got to put yourself out there and make the opportunities happen. And me and Danielle speak about this all the time. I know a friend of hers. And I'm like, Yep, the friend never reaches out like we'll I personally have emailed one of her friends. And pretty much they don't respond. I'm like, I'm sitting there like here's an opportunity on a platter, but they don't have the business sense. Yeah, it's just not there. It's not really that they should check emails every day, text people back right away. This isn't a dating situation. This is like text somebody when an opportunity comes or they're never gonna want to work with you. Like I run a business, I want to work with people like you, right? Because people like you can respond quickly communicate easily, even the way you responded to our emails, like I'm the same way. I think it's because we were not privileged in a position where like, we just like have that nine to five and the leads are just coming to us like so if you're not that way, like you're just not going to be as successful. Like the fact that you were like, here's my bio and my picture. I'm like, do you know how many people I'm chasing down? Yeah, like side of entrepreneurship. Yeah, somebody sends me an email. Hey, you're going to be on my show tomorrow. I need a headshot in this. I get it back to him quickly because I know they need it to post together. Yeah. And that's promotion for me. Yeah. No, it's like it hurts me if I were to delay that right. And etiquette just the words. Thank you. So I see that as the missing issue with with so many musicians. So I want to jump into like how important that is. And, you know, and that's probably the reason why you have over 10 million Spotify views. It's not always just the music. Yes, there's that, that talent at the tippy top, like Eminem, who could, you know, wrap certain things that like no one possibly could do at times, right? Yeah, but then there's that whole other side where someone could be completely worse than Eminem, but really good at business and get bigger opportunities. So just dive in, how are you doing all those different things behind the scenes. So our audience really understands the entrepreneurship side of being a well, you call it entrepreneurship, but it's really networking, right? It's it's, it's a people's game. Everything is a people's game. And I know that it feels like it's a dying art, you know, like, but that's so that's so not true, especially when it comes to, like, more serious opportunities. You know, like, if you were to ask for funding, you know, you don't want to do that over text message, you want to be able to look people in the eye and shake hands and convince them that I'm, you know, we're all gonna, this is a fruitful venture for all, and all kinds of stuff. And I get it from my father, I get it from my mother, too. But my father is not in music at all. And he's, he's in the metals business. And, you know, I remember as a kid, he, he never really dumbed down the language for me. It was always like, you know, speaking high words that I'm like, what did he say, but I sort of got it. And then, you know, the whole emailing idea where you, you know, you show the etiquette, you ask you, you give what's requested, but you also, you know, just don't waste anyone's time, because that's, I wouldn't want anyone wasting my time as well. And, and it really is entrepreneurship, it always boils down to that denominator, no matter what you're selling or what you're offering. But you bring up so many good points. It's like, so often people are like, Oh, no, businesses change. Like, you could be like, doing slang on on an email. I'm like, No, keep keep it professional. Don't do it like a text. We still do our handwritten notes here. People appreciate that. Yeah. And it is a lost art because many people get sucked into the new society. So I know that's how it is. And that's how people are doing things. Now. I'm like, that's how your your group of people are doing it. You need con when you look at the people at the top, they're not doing it like that. They're keeping it old school. They're sending gifts to people. They're doing thank you cards. They're taking people's time into account that they don't miss meetings. Right? You know, how many people have like 10 meetings a week and blow through five, right? They know they know show them say they're running late, or or just don't communicate with the other individual. Right? It's so important to use those excuses catch back up to Yeah. It's also just like so important in the music industry to be a good hang because you're like in the studio for hours with people if you want to collaborate writing a song, like if your energy if you're not good energy and you're a diva, like people are, it doesn't matter how talented you are, people are not going to want to work with you. Got to keep your ego in check. Yeah, yeah, especially with songwriting. It's a delicate process. Yeah, definitely. Hello, Tanya. Give us one second. We're gonna we're gonna bring you up on the big screen. Okay. So you could ask our guests of the day any question that is on your mind. I do have a question. So my son is interested. He's very creative. He's interested in maybe beginning to produce music so that he can perform that this is not my forte. This is completely out of my league. So but I want to support him. Right? So what better way than to find an expert on al to learn about music? So what would you suggest to him? Is there a type of program that I can buy for him that I can get him started with? It's pretty user friendly for him to start laying tracks down and loops and things like that. Well, hi, Tanya. Thank you for calling in. Yeah. So I mean, if I don't know if you have Apple products, but any of the Apple products come with this app called garage band. And it's a precursor to some of the more legitimate digital workspaces as we call them. But that's where he can kind of generate his ideas inside of that. Even you can even connecting instrument instruments through just a USB cable, it's can be very simplified, even a microphone. Very simple, but it allows him to and same thing for us out of at a bigger scale. It's just the world is your oyster inside of a workspace that you can kind of maneuver within. So again, that one's called garage band. And it comes with any all of the Apple products by default. But the advanced or the same, the second, the more advanced version of that is called logic. And logic is what I use on a professional basis. But a lot of people like to use other ones. But at that point, it's just your choice, whatever you'd like to use. I mean, as long as you feel proficient, and you feel like you can get your ideas down, then it's it, there's no wrong answer with that. So that's certainly the beginning of an answer to your to your question. The other thing I'll just pop in real quick. I don't know if they still do this. But I know that Apple used to actually offer like, a class at the Apple Store, where they would like show people how to use garage band. I didn't even know that. And yeah, I that was like years ago. So I don't know if it's still a thing. But you should look into that. I remember going and I was like, I'm a musician, I want to buy this laptop that has a lot of space. So I could maybe like, do like live looping and performances. And they're like, Oh, we'll show you how to do that. We have a free workshop. So like, look into, there are like so many workshops. And as he's learning the technology to like, just YouTube, like all the best producers that I know, like, yeah, YouTube University. I mean, it goes without saying. Yeah. But I mean, it's it's when you start how you really utilize it is when you're in in the trenches of it. And you have a very specific question that is keeping you stuck. And that's what you asked YouTube and you find the video that explains exactly how to get out of the situation that you're in and get their desire. I'm doing that today. I mean, I may not be at the garage band level, but even logic when you are kind of just pushing the envelope with with what kind of sounds you're trying to get, you know, sometimes it is a question of where do I find the capability to do that? And I just ask it to YouTube and continue as I am and learn something new. And it's a it's a never ending process, even for some of the best producers out there. So or, or you get your son on owl, I don't know how old he is. And he's not old enough yet. Because we do have producers on owl with him. Come on. Yeah, like, we could do that. Yeah. Because there are like tons of if you if you go to the search button, for those of you that don't know, you can search and filter by industry. And you can look at the music industry. And we do have a lot of producers on owl, who I'm sure would be glad to take the revenue and walk you through. Because I'm personally, I hate when people tell me to use YouTube, even though I just gave that advice. I actually hate that I hate working that way. Whenever I feel like I look things up, it never gives me the right answer. And I always end up just calling a producer friend and be like, Can you just save me time and like, well, just show me how to do this, because I don't want to like sit on YouTube for hours. I mean, if you're just learning, it's one thing, but if you already know what you're doing, and then there's just like one thing that you're like, that's a complex, like, why is this glitch happening with the software? And like, the direct answer isn't really in there. I'm old school, I just like to talk, but generally speaking, it's generally speaking, it could be great. Because even I like, most of my music that I put out was actually produced by some other people have always outsourced because my concentration was through performance and through songwriting. But as of recently, I've, I've dived into taking on a more self sufficient way of making music, which is beneficial, because the power is in my hands. But it's still a it's still a tough process of like learning the the technicalities of things and, and how the systems operate. But like, for the most part, YouTube has saved me a lot of time waste, they're just trying to click around. But I do also have producer friends that could help me along the way, which is, you know, that's some of the best way. But if you fall in love with producing in a way that maybe I didn't, from the beginning, it's, you can do it, you know, it, you don't mind continuing. I'm like, not talking to my patients. Yeah, he that he edits videos, he will spend hours videos. Yeah, that's me. I don't I don't like to do the editing part. Yeah, me neither. He really likes that now he's kind of performance. Yeah, which is exciting. And whatever he wants to do, I want to support him. Of course. Yeah. But this is amazing to have you guys as a resource, Alice resource. And I'm so grateful that you are on now. It's so nice to be here. I'm glad I could ask him your production questions. Not me. I can dabble but no. Also Facebook groups. I mean, I know we use them for everything. But there was one that I was in like in LA was a make pop music group. And like, there's so many Facebook groups where people in like that live in like LA and Nashville who are like always were very professional but are always looking for employment, like could be a mentor to your son and maybe do like zoom classes and they would teach him one on one for a fee as well if you're looking for like a teacher like that. And you can look at their profile and see the music that they put out and vet them first. So that's an option too. And of course, there's I'm sorry, you can go ahead. No, no, no, you go. There's also curriculum that's being offered all over in different universities. Like my concentration was in production. But you know, when I was more performance based, like I was saying, but plenty of schools that are they're having very specific, you know, curriculum towards production, you know, the software is the how you sample how you generate ideas, and it kind of all bleeds together. But it sounds like you said your son, right? He's just turned 15. Oh, he's not that young. This is the pivotal age for me, you know, and when you fall in love with it, and that's the sweetest feeling in the world. And I think it's fantastic. You want to support him? I mean, obviously, right, but let him follow that love all the way, because it'll really define his passion. That's all I know that he's happy. That's all I'm jealous of it. Because you know, when you when you start getting the you know, you get a little cynical. Yeah. Oh my god. I'm always like, I'm the bitter old musician. But if you're in love with it, just stick with it. Right? It looks like our time is running out. Yeah. But call Brett later. If you have more questions. Nice talking to you. Yes. Thank you so much. Appreciate it. Thanks for calling. Sorry to take I can't help but we're in this together. Yeah. Um, yeah, see how fun this is. Just once you take your first 10 calls, then you can set your price. When in fact, you can't do it right away. You have to take the calls at $1 for the first 10. But after that, you can make some real money as a consultant, a music consultant. There's your profile. You're an expert. So that's what you look like. Wow. You're on the homepage because we put musicians on purpose. Perfect top so people could find you. I forgot. Right. So Tonya is going to go ahead and leave your review. So you're gonna get your first review by Tonya today. That's pretty cool. So yeah, it's awesome. Your first call and you'll never forget was on the owl podcast. And what a debut out there. It's never gonna removed off the internet. It's up in the cloud somewhere. Yeah. And I think I want to make sure that that the world knows or that the app, the community knows that it may seem like it's really targeted to just music, but it really sprouts out like I can relate to you on more of an entrepreneurial sense as we were talking about. And like, it's it's the same steps that we take no matter what it is that you're focusing on, especially in other art form, like acting or writing or any kind of it's we're all really of the same kin, you know, which I love you bringing up because so often so we'll see someone like Jen right here. It's real. So I'm like, well, I don't really need to talk to anyone about real estate. I'm like, well, it has nothing to do with real estate, you're going to talk to Jen, and you're going to talk about, you know, maybe client relationship solver, how she's communicating with clients like real estate professionals that are at the top are excellent communicators. Totally. Right. They know what they're doing. There's a reason why one's making 4 million a year, one's making $10,000 a year, right? It's the delivery, it's how they treat their customers and clients. And you'll never know, you know, by calling Jen, like what will come out of a conversation. Exactly. You're calling just because she lists that under expertise, but then whole different things like you're just talking about YouTube and Spotify, and non business, not non musician related items, of course, that relate more to entrepreneurship, which is for everyone out there at the end of the day. Totally, it's it's we're on a much more broad spectrum than we realize, where we're all kind of, you know, of the same denominator, where it's where it's a people's game, you know, all the stuff that doesn't bear repeating at this point, right? Okay, well, if you're listening out there, call in, we have a slot for one last person to call Brett, he's sitting there under musicians. So go ahead and give him a ring for you lose that opportunity to chat because in some way, he's going to raise his price. He's not gonna be $1 in the future. He's gonna jump it up to $20. If you guys have any Spotify song requests, you can switch it up. And I don't know if nobody calls, you might have to give us a little. Yeah, maybe I'm maybe I'm full of it. Yeah, we could also call somebody else. We can mess around. Right? We could call Jen. She's $1. Right? This is what happens when you're doing Bluetooth issues with the phone. We'll switch it up. We'll call Jen. So for anyone listening, we're going to make your first outbound call. Okay. While we're bringing her up and talking about real estate might as well. And we'll see what comes from in the real estate game. That's the big thing is like so many people. Oh, she knows a lot of musicians too. Hi. Good afternoon, Jen. You're live on the owl podcast. How are you doing? So exciting. I'm great. How are you guys? We are doing great. We were just talking about entrepreneurship in general. And we were talking about just calling people that you normally would not speak to. Like if I saw real estate, you know, under your profile, I was like, I don't really know if I want to talk to someone in the real estate world. I'm like, but that's not what's going to happen after an hour call, you're going to call and things are gonna, you know, just open up and blossom. So you have Brett Miller. I've been watching you. Oh, perfect. So you kind of heard everything I just said. So I heard everything. Let's just swing it off. Let's ask Jen a question. Let's switch gears. So the specialization is real estate. I always have a hard time with this because I'm a total entrepreneur where I have an invention, a patent that's going through I mean, a million different businesses, if you will. But real estate is sort of my main hub, in the sense that I really love to teach women how to build wealth. Yeah. Well, can't well, I mean, now that I am, Brian, me and Brett out, we want to build wealth, we want to build wealth. Don't leave us high and dry. It's the same strategy for men and women usually, right? Yeah. Unless it's not, is it not? Oh, no. Save money, don't spend it all. Well, what was the first I mean, was that the first mission, if you will? That I am, you know, I got into real estate 2012 in Hawaii. And then I went to India in 2016. fateful trip that got me into coaching when I got back, I got out of real estate. And then after I bought my apartment complex, and merged to and started coaching and real estate. And so actually, Brian, Jason, you were talking earlier about, you know, a success story on owl. Yeah. Right. You're asking us to share. Sure. Well, Shirley Jones is a great example of somebody that, you know, I met on owl, she bought my money course, and she downloaded it. And I called her every day, because I knew that she was going through this. And it's really, it's pretty intense. And so the next day, I called her on the app. And she was totally depressed, as I suspected would happen. So I was like, got this girl, I've got you. And, you know, fast forward, three days later, she you know, she'd shared that she was$225,000 in debt. Well, we kept talking on the on the app. And fast forward, she just is in escrow in her house for $240,000. So she's wiping out the debt as soon as she closes, and she's moving to Africa. That's a big change. I am curious. So you kind of coached her to make this decision? So I coached her, she took my money course that I have online. Okay. And then so I checked in on her every day on the app. Yeah. And, and then come Monday, like four days later, she calls me and was like, I'm listening to my house on Monday. And next, you know, on Monday, she got two offers. And so she accepted one. Wow. It's probably like a week and a half in escrow. Like that. But yeah, this app has been amazing. It's like so many stories like that. We're meeting new people. And it's like, just, it's like, access to people whose networks are like insane. Yeah. And it's just the circles combined, you know, where it starts to form into a bigger circle. I'm sure that she's elated of the situation as well. So she's probably spreading word. And people are now meeting up. I think there was just an owl meetup in Canada, which we don't even like, have many Canadians on here. That was nuts. Out of all places for this woman that I talked to today, she was like, we just had an owl meetup. And like, it was like family. And we all got together and like helped each other with our businesses. And I'm like, wait, why don't I need to know about this? Oh, wow. Yeah. So we need to do one here. Yeah. In the US. South Dakota is our local. Last night, I advertised it. Come on by Delray Beach. Yeah, yeah. The Ave. I would have been there if I were in California. I know. Yeah, her. She's friends with a big band. What's that song? I forget their song, but I know it. What are the who are the brand new hours? Yeah. I don't know if you know the song. Brand new hours? Like 24. I forget. Yeah, I want to meet them. Anyway. She's friends with a lot of musicians to Janice. Are you in Los Angeles? I'm in slow but I lived in Hollywood for a minute. San Luis Obispo if you don't know what that is. No, I don't. It's one of the best places on earth. I love it so much. It's actually rated like one of the happiest places on earth. I think. Did you know that? Yeah. Yeah, it's beautiful. Let's have a reunion here. I've been I'm planning like January. I want to go. They're holding out like, where is this place? Where is it? It's like one of the happiest little city in America. But where is it? You guys are gotcha. Yeah. This the center coast, my friend's daughter went to college there. And there was never heard of that area. Is that Huntington Beach? Between San Francisco, Los Angeles, San Francisco, we say it's not the bay and it's not LA, but it's right in between. It's in between. When you said you lived there. I was like, all right, we have to be friends. Because that's like, I don't I don't like LA but like, slow. I was like, Oh, the energy here is amazing. So buy a house here. Yeah. What? I'll help you buy a house. Yeah. Oh my god. Can you I need to take your money course actually. I was thinking that I was like, Ooh, let me do that. Danielle's got West Coast vibes. I don't know about not East Coast. I'll steal Danielle from us. Great here at our HQ. No, I'll just I'll just I'll be back. I mean, I'm from Philly, but I'll be back and forth. You know, I'll be like the world. I'll be the owl traveler. Yeah, you'll be fine. And then Nashville quarter the dream is seasonal. Yeah, same me too. Yeah. And I'm gonna hold you to that. Actually, Danielle, I'm gonna have I'm gonna get on a call with you. And we're gonna like, watch this out. Yeah. A little minute. Yeah. Perfect. January is my California. You have now been kicked off the app. So that way, she cannot speak here. The last one he spoke to move to Africa. I'm concerned here. I don't know. I don't know. You're one for one with moves. So I know it's okay to be cautious. Florida. I do love it here, though. It's like, it's for women wealth. Remember, it has my heart for sure. But I can be in more than one place at once. Totally work. Um, well, guys, make sure you call Jen on the owl app if you want to up your money game. Did you end up asking her? I don't know if you had like, I just I wanted to get her you know, background before you know, what what inspired all of this, but I don't know. This is kind of putting you on the spot. But like, do you have a suggestion of how Brett and I can make more money? I know. It's like, go for it. Yeah. On the spot. Like as musicians, like, that's a good question. A tip for musicians of how to make more money. Like, I know it's super broad, but yeah, for sure. Um, so what I'll do for you guys is my website is Jen Naraghan calm, and with one end, and I'm going to give you guys a code for my workbook. I'm going to download the workbook. Oh, I love the code is money, but wait, they have to go in and update it. Is this for everybody listening? They can all download your workbook? Or just us? Um, so they can all download it only$25. But I'm gonna give you guys a special code. Cool. I don't know. Thanks. Yeah. I'll give two codes. I'll give one is money. That's for you guys. And then I'll give the users the code owl for discount. Whoo, guys. So everyone listening, make sure you go now who doesn't want more money? Like, let's be real. I've never heard anyone be like, Oh, I'm good on the money, you know? Right. Um, so make sure you go to Jen's website. Is it just your name? Jen Naraghan calm? I forget. Yep. Say it again. Okay. And a r r a g o n. Eat, pray, fuck, be broke. Oh, y'all are making this too easy. You get the code on owl. Come on. Yeah, actually, that's a better point. People. We want to effort, right? Should be the the ones warning, but those are the ones. How about you have to comment on this video, you have to comment on the LinkedIn video. And then, like, you have to comment. I don't know, Jen, or tag Jen in this post on LinkedIn. To get your code. Does that work? In all seriousness, people don't take things as seriously when they're free. Right? So what the people call her spend $1 to even speak to her, right? Because she changed the rate $1 $20 $30 at times. But when you speak to her, and then she gives the code, then they're going to take it a lot more serious. Yeah, all these free guys are out there. There's a gazillion free guys, you go to Fidelity, Charles Schwab, they're endless. There's YouTube videos there. There's so much stuff on money. There's so many books out. But when someone holds your hand, like Jen was doing with with her customer that she talked about earlier, it's like, that's what makes the impact. Totally. But I also think you have to give nowadays a little taste of something for free, so that people can just see what you're about, and then do the hard sell, in my opinion, which is owl. Yeah, a lot of calls, 10 minute consultations, and then you can take it off the app and do your thing. So thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Okay. So everyone listening to see the difference on the review screen. This one's a little longer. Because we called and paid her to chat, of course. So that was your your thoughts of the platform right there. Pretty cool. Very cool. I want to I don't know, is there a is there a chat? Not capability? Do you want to answer this question? You're the for sure, man. I am the developer. Yes, there is no messaging because everyone's already got like 25 million inboxes, right? So true. Your profile has the ability to list what you want on it. So here we have an example, this individual put their website, LinkedIn, Twitter and clubhouse, you might have Instagram and Tick Tock. So people could message you where you hang out. So that way, instead of having an internal message box, where it's an other one, where people are trying to communicate with you and try to get something for free, right? Try to get a free time on your schedule free meeting where the whole point of owl is, yeah, you know, they have to call you. It's genuine one on one conversation. We might add paid messages, but we paid, right? So if someone does have a question that they want to, you know, get answered, we will one day open that door up probably messaging. But what is coming a big announcement is in approximately six to eight weeks, you'll see a chat forum. So we were talking about Facebook groups earlier, where people post something and do you have a good barber? And then they'll be like, Oh, Jimmy's the best. Correct. Real forum, right? Yeah. You know, just like the first guest called in and said, you know, hey, I'm looking for my son to, you know, do this or that, right? Then she could post that. And then people will tag yourself, tag Danielle, and then you'll get a notification. But now you're not stuck in the DMS in Facebook, where people are connecting you as a friend, you're like, I'm not your friend. Like, that's where my my friends are at Facebook, and they're looking at your personal profile pics. And it gets a little awkward. We're like, what do I do with this now? Right? Someone pinged me and said that they we should speak, but you don't want to do free all the time, of course, but with owl, then the it just set up properly, the boundaries are set up 10 minute 20 minute calls. And you didn't see much of the extension, but we could have extended the calls where people could have spent 2030 minutes if we allowed it. Yeah. But but that's really the cool part about owl is is the boundaries. Yeah. And I like that, too, because a lot of times you don't have all the time in the world to just chat away. So and people it's it's understood, like it's an unspoken language, like, okay, well, like, time's about to end and they understand you're paying for this, this time. So they want to give you the answer in the most efficient manner possible. And they want you to leave them a good review and call them again. So, yeah, I'd say I'm more curious to connect with people, you know, in our age group, that, you know, because like I said, if it is entrepreneur, if it is more broad, and it doesn't really matter what art form or product or services you're offering, then it's really all about because like, for me personally, the ventures have extended over time, like I'm not in my 20s, I'm just entering my 30s. So all of a sudden, I'm playing a little bit more money, you know, and I can I can move things around and get into things like real estate, like I poked at and like, I do like investments. And, and, you know, I'm always looking for better ways, even outside of music, to continue building capital and keep the dream alive, you know, by proxy, but it's, it's, it really extends all the way out. And I think, I think all of us can relate to that, where it's like, maybe I started everything with gig money, and money that I saved up, but then you start throwing that's why I work it out. Yeah, I was doing music full time before this. And I was like, you know what, this is just like not cutting the mustard. Like I need something else that is too much booking. I was booking everything myself, no agencies. And I'm like, you know, yeah, it's taking the love out of Yeah, I know. You can get cynical with it, too. So wearing all those different hats, where I do work with agents that make it somewhat easier at the day of the gig, but then also booking independently, where you make more money, because there's no middleman. Yeah, you know, but also leveraging what you've done on social media, and you leverage, you know, your network of people locally and abroad. Like, that's why I keep going to Nashville's because it's been every time I go there, the network builds a little bit more. And, you know, that's the dream of the seasonal activity where you just kind of bounce around, you know, depending on what time of year it is really. Well, I'm going to close this episode out with some tips for everybody here, because we're just talking about money. And of course, I am a financial advisor behind the scenes and running multiple businesses at once. So I do want to, you know, really touch on this subject, because it kind of relates back to the original question when I stepped in about entrepreneurship. And it's really just about being laser focused and executing and and being on top of those deals that you have coming in too often, people are opening up too many deals, and they're not just, you know, sticking with one at a time, and making sure that, you know, you're, you're, if you're giving value, it's like price it correctly, right? So if you're charging a gig $500, right, and the next person over, you know, is the same talent, but they're charging 1000, but they're getting it, right? It's that closing skill saying, well, this is my price, and you're not budging from it. And you're just like, you have a good offer. It's a one page sheet, like no one wants to read 20 pages anymore. PowerPoint is like, this is my price to come in and do an act. But then it's the little touches going back to that again. It's like you were on time. Right? And literally happened today. And, and, and everything. I was like, are you reading my mind? You are accountable, right? Because when, when you have people like myself who hire a plumber, as an example, like I will use the most expensive plumber, you know, all the time, because they always show up and they always do good service. And I want to deal with like trying to find a cheaper plumber at that point. So like, why does Erica's plumbing, that's an example in town, like, they do so phenomenal, right? It's, you know, part excellent marketing, but reputation, just the reputation, the services, like all the Googlers, everything matches up. Right. So when you're looking at your, your industry, whatever industry anyone listening is in, it's just like being consistent. And just executing too often, people are always like thinking it's about the likes and the followers, but, but it's not I know, so many people are guests on the shrimp tank today, had like 200 followers on their Instagram account, like 1000, you know, on their LinkedIn account and ready for this gonna blow you guys your mind. 150 employees. Yeah, right. And one was 30 and was 40. I made the most work with dentists. That's it. They're just like, they realized that the niche was dented. So too often people, you know, don't rely on their dentist niche, the niches are out there and, and go after, you know, those niches where people can write checks. Right. So if it is dentists, if it's doctors, or if it's business owners, like me, who run events all the time, and those, those, those business owners could write $5,000 checks versus $500 checks, that makes a big difference. Yeah. And and that's where you'll see a big difference of like, how people are able to elevate their business, you know, over over the course of time, it takes time to learn those lessons. And eventually, you get there, you know, you know, over time, maybe you didn't get there when you're 25. But it takes consistent effort and staying focused on that end goal. Mm hmm. I'd say the power in a profession like that, and you said it was a dentist, right? Who cares about your following at that point? It's like, that's not going to show you credibility for how good you are a dentist. But if you are able to, you know, leverage social media advertising, where you can showcase, you know, the reviews of in person, like, this is the best he fixed, whatever, you know, you're showing your it doesn't matter, but you're following matters about finding your, your your people, you know, and it's like your clientele that's local, that, you know, maybe you're going for a demographic that's specific, you know, maybe more older crowd, well, you can target people like that and make content that they see just casually scrolling through their feeds, that, oh, my gosh, I need a new checkup, you can offer that free cleaning, you know, and then insight and incite people to come through. And that's the game you want to play with social media. That's the power, not not the the vanity metrics, right? And I feel like time is money. Like thinking back, like when I was living in LA, and like waitressing, I would spend so much time making videos for social media. And then once I moved here, I was digging so much that I didn't have time. So then I was like, wait, I'm just gonna take videos while I'm performing live, and making money at the same time, like, cut out the whole spending time making the videos, I can do it while I'm working productive, right. So it's like finding those little ways to like, just save your time and be efficient and make money like just just looking at what you're doing and seeing like, how can I maximize right? Music obviously is a little bit different. It's not like dentistry. Yeah, we kind of do need to have unfortunately, there's a lot of vanity metrics that come into play. But there is you still have to showcase that you do what you do well, and that you have some kind of unique style unique in like, that is for any art form with social media. So it's a mix of that. But at the same time, I'm trying to find and you're trying to find your target audience that's going to like your music that relate to it, you know, because they they know that you're the same age, or you're going through the same stuff where, you know, demographics, gender, you know, you can narrow things down, it's very powerful. So that that aspect of social media is, is very powerful, very sophisticated, I'd say. Well, Brett, thank you for joining us on the owl podcast today. And of course, there's Brett's profile, take them up on the opportunity to chat with him and try to have them at your your next event, of course. Awesome musician listen to some of his, his music. Where can we find you online? So everything's under Brett Miller, when it comes to Spotify, YouTube, Apple Music, and then social media is Brett Miller live. Surprised there's not another Brett Miller. There are but I want I want the rights. Oh, good. Okay, I staked my claim like I'm gonna you know, I'm taking the name to the to the highest point. Take care everybody. Post production for the owl podcast is done with care by Ocean Tree Creative.